Transcripts For MSNBCW Morning Joe 20201125

Past 24 hours. Its a sacred number. More than 1,800 more lives in just the last day. Never been broken that number. A death reported every minute in this country. Nobody thought they would see it. 14 Straight Days of record hospitalizations. We have broken records during the Trump Administration. More than 85,000 patients in hospitals across this country. Which is the highest in history. Millions waiting for hours for tests, some waiting five hours or more today. Thank you very much, everybody. President trump focused on the numbers, just the wrong numbers in a really weird, short news conference. Good morning. You know he didnt answer questions. I dont know what you call it. It was strange. If you want to see what happens after the president leaves the office amazing. Sign of the times. Some george w. Bush type expressions in there. What the heck. That was weird. You know, i was talking to somebody last night. We were going over the election. You know, earlier right after the Election Results were coming in, i think a lot of people were shocked by how close it was, especially if you looked at the polls from the midwest. I made the comment, hey, we had all said that, oh, how could hilla hillary only way donald trump won is Hillary Clinton ran the Worst Campaign ever. Turns out she didnt run the Worst Campaign ever that donald trump actually has a pull on millions and millions of americans. He has an appeal to a lot more americans. It wasnt a oneoff. Hillary couldnt have gone to wisconsin two more times. He is a populist force that, you know, were all going to have to reckon with on what happened not just in 2016 but in 2020. But that said, my friends and i were also saying last night that if donald trump had just focused the last ten days for instance, if you had not had those press conferences, those Coronavirus Press conferences. If he had not focused exclusively on the stock market and focused more on covid, and done some basic things from the very beginning, if he had not been preaching bizarre medicine and science. If he didnt have such a horrible ifs, if he focused on covid not just the stock market, he may not only still could have won, he probably would have won. Its all very astounding that and that press conference, i guess that press conference yesterday just shows how clueless donald trump remains about the 250,000 plus people who died and how he could have won if he would have just focused on the health and the wellbeing of americans instead of just always looking at the bottom line from the Dow Jones Industrial. Its amazing you referenced the george w. Bush quote from the inauguration almost four years ago. Its amazing how well that held up from day one. This administration to the end. I mean, for him to come out right now on the eve effectively of thanksgiving and not have some kind of a message about where the country is in terms of its health, safety, what we should and shouldnt be doing, to konl ocome out touting for 6 seconds the dow crossing 30,000, thats where the urgency came. We have not seen that kind of urgency around coronavirus, around this pandemic. But he was so excited by dow 30,000 that he had to rush out to the briefing room. A lot of people on wall street say a great part of that push past 30,000 is because of the stability from the incoming Biden Administration, perhaps a return to normal. Less uncertainty under donald trump. For him to come out and talk about dow 30,000, not talk about coronavirus, but do so as joe biden is coming into office and pushing that dow up to 30,000, theres irony there as well. It might have been also he was looking for some reason to show his face and appear to be in the middle of normalcy, which he very much is not because losing is not something he does well or nicely. At all. But at least the transition is happening. Boy, what a day yesterday. Some incredible moments as we heard from some of president elect joe bidens cabinet picks. Along with joe, willie and me, we have host of way too early casey hunt and professor at Princeton University and author of the book begin again eddie glaude junior. President trump is running out of options and his last ditch effort to cling to power as key states move to certify their Election Results, officially confirming joe biden as the president elect. Pennsylvania and nevada are the latest states to officially certify that biden defeated trump in both states elections. This comes a day after michigan certified that he won the election there. And in arizona, republican governor doug ducey said he acknowledged that biden carried his state. In georgia, a machine recount of the roughly 5 million votes yesterday. Just a few days ago they completed a hand tally that confirmed bidens lead of roughly 12,000 votes. Nonetheless the president ial transition is officially under way. A biden official tells nbc news that by mid afternoon yesterday answer that signals te that Transition Teams made contact with all federal agencies including the white house. The president elect said he has not received the Daily Briefing from u. S. Officials but that it could happen today. Heres the incoming president in his sitdown interview with lester holt. Bidens first since winning the election. Immediately we have gotten outreach from the National Security. We are working out meeting with the covid team in the white house. I think were going to not be so far behind the curve as we thought we might be in the past. And theres a lot of immediate discussion and i must say the outreach has been sincere. Have you had any conversations with President Trump postelection about paving the way for this transition to happen . No, i have not heard anything from President Trump. Well, joe, we have a lot more on the transition ahead and some incredible moments and some incredible people that have chosen to be a part of this cabinet. But when you look at these states and every day we deliver the news about recounts or how close different state official, county officials are to certifying the vote. Somebody close to trump, if they knew him, if they understood him, if they could talk to him, they would explain to him hes retraumatizing himself every time he loses again. He loses each state now once, twice, three times. Right. And all that does is churn him up and has him tweeting terrible things, trying to think of how he can make this pain stop. Im not trying to be funny. Im just saying when you know trumps psychology, you know this traumatizes him and causes him to act out. Its time for somebody to tell him to let it go and get it behind him for his own good. He keeps losing these states over and over again. You remember when i asked him four years ago, five years ago, i guess five years ago now, i said after he had said something outrageous, and i said who do you have to talk to . Who is the one person that you can talk to to pass things through . We talked about harry truman changing the world because he had five or six of the best and brightest people in washington and in america around him at all times helping him out. Donald trump said you wont like this answer, he said i just listen to myself. I said youre right, i dont like that answer. Thats a sure fire to end up the exact way this president ended up. What donald trump needs to understand, the point that he needs to get to is that he has set himself up to lose now every day. He lost the one election. He, of course, if he had the dispalestinidi discipline he should have lost that one election, gone quiet. Gone away. But youre right, he has been picking fights. And this is something i was saying somebody close to donald trump a week ago which was i said when you talk to him, tell him that hes going to lose every single legal challenge. Hes going to lose every recount challenge. So everything hes doing every day is setting himself up to lose over and over and over again. And the only way to get out of that cycle is to pull yourself off of that battlefield. Yeah. He wont concede. But just go away and let this run its own course, if you want to come back later, come back later, but this is like ali deciding when he was 43 years old, after he had lost, you know, hey, im going to go out and im going to fight a heavyweight fight against a 25yearold every day. Im not saying that joe biden is a 25yearold, but ali would have as much of a chance at 43 of beating a 25yearold as donald trump has winning any of these court challenges. Its time to move on and stop setting himself up as someone who is losing over and over and over again. Its terrible. Its a terrible show. Pull away, get away from the scene. If you want to run again in 2024, set yourself up on that battlefield. I think its someone from the Entertainment Industry who could speak to him. Donald trump likes a show. Lights. Even the white house events, the rnc event, the didnt event he he holds at the white house are a show. His plane landing at the rallies. Theres a set. These shows are terrible with Rudy Giuliani and sweating all over the place and people getting fired the minute after they speak during these press conferences with these quack, quack, totally crazy allegations. Nobody knows more than donald trump that this is not fun to watch. This is not a good show. Hes gone from supermodels to Rudy Giuliani. Nobody thinks this is a good show, not even donald trump. And, you know, i think someone from the Entertainment Industry, willie, would perhaps let him know that the next act will be a lot better if he really elegantly turns the page on this one. Thats not going to happen. No, its not going to happen. We know him better than that. But the strange thing is for a guy who has, as you laid out, understood optics so well, understood the performance and the event so well, its arguably why hes in the white house, for him to borough into this hole you mentioned Rudy Giuliani. Today donald trump will go to gettysburg, pennsylvania to join Rudy Giuliani in a hearing its not a hearing, its a meeting of republicans in pennsylvania at a hotel in gettysburg, pennsylvania to talk about irregularities in the vote in that state. The president of the United States will make the trip to gettysburg to hang out with Rudy Giuliani, last seen as you said sweating with hair dye down his cheeks. The president of the United States will attach himself to that again today. I dont know if hell be seen with Rudy Giuliani publicly, but hes going. Thats where he is. Yes, the transition process now is moving along. Thats the good news. The president continues to chase down these rabbit holes with giuliani. Again, this is not nobody here is shocked or stunned or deeply saddened by whats going on. Its just at some point even for donald trump, even for Donald Trumps followers, it makes no sense. The election is over. Donald trump lost. Stop standing in the ring after you have like after you have been beaten up. If you want to leave the ring, if you want to go off and train again, thats fine. But stop whining about something that even your closest allies are saying you lost. Its time to move on. Again, for the sake of the country of course first of all, but also for the sake of this president and for the sake of his supporters. For your reality show is not good. President elect joe biden officially introduced his first cabinet picks yesterday. Filled with career National Security and Foreign Policy professionals. As expected, Antony Blinken will be secretary of state. He will serve as secretary of state. Alejandro mayorkas will be the first latino and immigrant to head Homeland Security. Avril haines will be the director of intelligence. The fact that shes the first woman in dni is one of the least interesting things about her. Also announced, Jake Sullivan will be National Security adviser. Linda thomasgreenfield will be named ambassador to the u. N. And john kerry will be the climate envoy. Its a team that will keep our country and our people safe and secure. Its a team that reflects the fact that america is back. Ready to lead the world, not retreat from it. Once again, sit at the head of the table. Ready to confront our adversaries and not reject our allies. Ready to stand up for our values. Theyll tell me what i need to know, what i want to know. What i need to know. Now we have to proceed with equal measures of humility and confidence. Humility because as the president elect said, we cant solve all of the worlds problems alone. The department of Homeland Security has a Noble Mission to help keep us safe and to advance our proud history as a country of welcome. President joe biden will trust in god and he will also trust in science to guide our work on earth. America is back. Multilateralism is back. Diplomacy is back. And joe and willie, its jesting that john kerry as the special envoy there, he is being put in a category where when were looking at climate and were looking at the environment, its a National Security issue, its an economy issue. And it gives you a sense of how joe biden is looking at things as he moves forward. Heres more from president elect joe bidens nominee for secretary of state, tony blinken. He talked about his stepfather surviving the holocaust as a way to illustrate what america represents to the world. Take a listen. For my family, as for so many generations of americans, america has literally been the last best hope on earth. My late stepfather, he was one of 900 children in his school in poland, but the only one who survive the holocaust after four years in concentration camps. At the end of the war he made a break from a death march into the woods. From his hiding place he heard a deep rumbling sound. It was a tank but instead of the iron cross, he saw painted on its side a fivepointed white star. He ran to the tank. The hatch opened. An africanamerican gi looked down at him. He got down on his knees and said the only three words that he knew in english that his mother taught him before the war. God bless america. Thats who we are. Thats what america represents to the world, however imperfectly. Now we have to proceed with equal measures of humility and confidence. Humility because as the mrek president elect said we cant solve all of the worlds problems alone. We need to be working with other countries. We need their cooperation. We need their partnership. But also confidence because america at its best still has a greater able than any other country on earth to bring others together to meet the challenges of our time. Eddie glaude, what a remarkable statement especially coming after the last four years of angst, fear, and loathing. Contempt for the rest of the world. In many respects contempt for our democratic alliances and our proud history of liberating, of freeing and feeding more people than any other country in the history of the world. But that line that was so moving after telling the story about his stepfather was only one of 900 children from this polish school to survive the holocaust. The little boy getting down on his knees, the stepfather getting down on his knees saying the only three words he knew, god bless america. And then, tony following that up with this is who we are. Its certainly who we try to be. Its certainly who we should try to be. What an extraordinary moment yesterday that really did show a changing of the guards. Right. Especially in terms of the juxtaposition of the opening segment with trump coming out timeo touting the dow, the debt. Especially thinking about people and folks in their cars trying to get food. What was striking for me was we saw on full display a return of competen competence. A return to seriousness. We might have our disagreements, the idea is that we have some kind of stability and confidence in the folks who will be running the country, who in some ways will be presenting america to the world. And in doing so we would have in some ways the kind of stable parameters to have an argument about the direction of our democracy. And that to me was the takeaway from yesterday. That we saw the value of stability and competence, and now we can have the confidence that we at least have the preconditions to address at least in a serious way, joe, the enormous challenges that we face as a nation not only domestically but also abroad. You know, again, missing from what we saw from the president elect and tony blinken was the contemptuousness that weve seen over the past four years. The feeling that by exporting our values that somehow america is always being used and that were the suckers when we created a postwar world that actually allowed the american sentry to flourish and our values to grow exponentially not only here but across the globe. Mika, i fear old habits will die hard with republicans. I was distressed yesterday not because people are not allowed to criticize others, but i was distressed by the shrillness of a couple of the republicans attacks who actually are Holding Important positions who should know much better than this what theyre doing one day in. And, again, thinking that if they sound like donald trump that somehow that is going to pave a way their way into maybe being first in line in the 2024 sweepstakes for the Republican Party. When, in fact, its just not going to. And saying stupid things and making yourself look stupid like donald trump made himself look stupid time and time again. Im thinking of marco rubio attacking ivy leaguers . Oh, my god. When donald trump all hed ever say was so and so is great, he went to harvard. So and so is great he went to yale. Thats all he talked about. For my republican friends and for people in the Republican Party that maybe not consider me your friends, ill give you advice that a friend will give you, which is dont try to be donald trump. You cant be donald trump. Actually try something new. Try showing a little graciousness. Fight like hell against the Democratic Administration, thats fine. You did it with barack obama, of course democrats did it with donald trump. But try to show a little bit of graciousness, a little bit of humanity. A little bit of those traits that you showed before donald trump came into washington, d. C. Because trumpism is going to leave with donald trump. If you want to ever be president of the United States, if you ever want to represent this entire country, let me tell you going the donald trump way didnt work for donald trump this time and it certainly wont work for you, whoever you are next time. Heres what marco rubio, hes a florida senator and acting chair of the Intel Committee tweeted. Bidens cabinet picks went to ively league schools, have strong resumes, attend all the right conferences and will be polite and orderly caretakers of americas decline. I support american greatness. I have no interest to returning to the normal that left us dependent on china. As was noted on twitter, the Trump Administration is not exactly a stranger to the ivy league. Trump brags about some sort of time he spent at upen. Pompeo, harvard law. Mnuchin yale. Esp esper, harvard. Azar dartmouth and yale law. Carson yale. Chao, harvard. Navarro harvard. First of all, donald trump bragged his entire life about going to penn. Wharton. The wharton school, whatever. Hes always bragged about all the ivy leaguers that he kept around him. So marcos tweet was ridiculous on that front. On the other front it was ridiculous about americas decli decline . Tony blinken is the wall street editorial page said itself, tony blinken and Jake Sullivan are more hawkish than most of the main stays in the obama administration. In fact, it was tony blinken who said of barack obama drawing the red line and then backing down, superpowers dont bluff. Yes, he can be critical and thats his right. Partisanship will continue, but that tweet is so false, so misleading, so ridiculous that it really for anybody thats been in washington for more than 15 minutes, and i know you can explain this to our viewers better than i can, the chairman of the senate Intel Committee has always traditionally kept himself or herself above the fray because theyre in possession of the most important classified information and they have to stay above the fray. And to see the chairman of the Intel Committee doing this is distressing. To see the chairman of the Judiciary Committee running around spreading lies about legal challenges, about a rigged election, so distressing. And anybody that knows me they can go back and look at 17 years of clips on this network, im an equal opportunity attacker when people when people do really stupid and destructive things. Thats exactly what marco rubios tweet was yesterday. Well, its pretty telling about what he wants, right . I actually had a question about was he going to try to step more broadly into that Intelligence Committee chairman role, its something that he has worked on and focused on, but as you point out, that is something where, sure, theyll run their own race but they typically dont necessarily handle it this way. This tells me hes focused on potentially a future president ial run. And its clear he is embracing and he has had other tweets about how the politics and the Republican Party are changing and becoming more poppopulist, to your point theres a lot of people who tried to be trumpian. A lot of republicans tried to be trumpian. Even rubio himself, when he was running in 2016, he tried to throw trumplike insults back at donald trump. In the end he had to sort of backtrack and apologize because so many donors thought it was so embarrassing. It doesnt work for a politician like him. People should try their best to do what they do best and that is to be themselves. And when marco rubio tries to be donald trump, it always ends badly. But he obviously hes a senator, he is free to do what he wants to do, but hes also probably going to be the chairman of the Intel Committee. It wasnt just people on the trumpian right complaining. We heard some complains about the incoming dni chairwoman, ra take laos complaints. We heard complaints about others who from from people on the far left attacking others for being deficit hawks, oh, my god. I have a feeling theres going to be a lot of progressives and a lot of trum centers trumsterr side of the ideological spectrum who will be disappointed that joe biden is going to pick mainstream candidates that both republicans and democrats in the rational middle, in the sane middle will support. Hes never signaled anything other than that. Through the course of his campaign, even when he won in the last couple of weeks, we knew where this would go. There was some speculation that Elizabeth Warren would be named treasury secretary. The Biden Campaign was never seriously considering that. Thats some of the criticism that you heard about janet yellen. There are progressives that want him to be more progressive, maybe he will be once hes in there working with progressives in the congress. In terms of the people he put out so far, they are centrists. They are more conventional. And they spent the entire campaign doing what they called ignoring twitter. That meant ignoring some of the extremes as well. Theyve shown thats what theyll do there. It was couched yesterday by Vice President biden in his interview with lester holt as saying i dont want to pull Bernie Sanders or Elizabeth Warren out of the senate. So i may not put them into positions like the ones being suggested. Of course theres going to be criticism from both sides. The Biden Campaign will move forward as advertised. Meanwhile, were learning much more about the pressure the president faced to allow this transition to go forward. The New York Times first reported about a meeting on monday in which white house chief of staff mark meadows, the white House Counsel and trumps personal attorney urged the president to get things moving along. Nbc news since learned that ivanka trump, Jared Kushner and hope hicks also made that case to the president. The argument was rather than continued to take the massive pr hit, suck it up, dont formally concede but allow the transition to proceed. The goal was to quell the protests within the gop according to our reporting. Lets bring in the lead reporter on that story, nbc news correspondent carol lee. We heard these stories often from the last four years where jared and ivanka went in and saved the republic. How much influence did they have at the end to let President Trump say i wont concede but lets hand over the keys to the transition to the biden team. I think it was just a Broader Group of people who looked at this moment where republicans were coming out and saying that the president should let a transition proceed where you have business leaders, people the president considers allies saying its time. Joe biden is clearly president elect. And the thing that they really pressed upon the president was that this was a bad pr look for him. And he needed to protect his brand. In order to do that the argument that they made was let the transition go and have that moving on its own track. The president can still stay on the track that hes on where hes not admitting that joe biden has won the election and he can continue with his lawsuits and his unfounded allegations with fraud. He can do all of that. Let this go. One of the reasons they said that would be useful to him is because it would allow joe biden not to blame President Trump if for some reason something fell through the cracks and something went wrong after he took office whether its on coronavirus or a National Security issue. They cast this to him in terms of how its best in the president s interest to do this and he agreed at least for now to let this transition move forward even though we know that hes continuing to say that there was fraud and hes going to continue to fight this battle and raise money and all these other things. Thats what i was going to ask you about. Is that the twotrack process here through the inauguration on january 20th . On the one hand well let the transition go ahead, the agencies will talk to each other, talk to the Transition Team but he will continue to go out fighting in a public way and say that there were irregularities, claiming widespread fraud where there wasnt and still claiming he won the election up to the inauguration . Yeah. What weve been told, aids to the president have been saying this for several weeks now, is that hes never going to formally concede. They dont even use that word. They use the word conclusion. The conclusion they might try to get him to is say that acknowledge that joe biden will be moving into the white house, but not admit that he won fair and square, which he did. And its all about sort of positioning the president to still, as one of his allies put it, remain the center of attention. Thats the goal. He wants to make money. He wants to stay in the media spotlight and remain vrelevant and potentially run in 2024. There is expectation that he will announce that he will do that. A lot of people think hell run again in 2024. Thats a little ways away. Its all a way of positioning the president to have an exit where he can save a little bit of face and not look like as one of his aides told us a loser. Carol, one of the other apparent agenda items for President Trump is pardons, axios has two sources reporting this morning that donald trump will pardon Michael Flynn, who, of course, pled guilty to lying to the fbi. You covered the Michael Flynn story for a long time. I guess we shouldnt be terribly surprised by this . Not terribly surprised. Michael flynn has been the top of the president s list for a pardon for some time. Michael flynn, it will be three years ago on tuesday, first pled guilty to lying to the fbi that case has been through a saga all over the place. Now its still sort of in limbo in court and whats interesting about this is before President Trump lost the election, Michael Flynn and his lawyers said they didnt want a pardon. Michael flynn said he wanted to clear his name. He wanted the process to play out in court. The Justice Department intervened to say the case should be thrown out. They wanted this to proceed. Now that President Trump has lost and he might not have that backstop in the coming months after the president leaves office, it looks like hell be okay with the pardon. All right. Carol lee outside the white house this morning, thank you very much. Michael flynn could be one of a number of pardons that donald trump may issue before he leaves office. Right. He pardoned a turkey yesterday, new meaning. Still ahead on morning joe, u. S. Covid hospitalizations hit a record high as we learn that a vaccine could come sooner than expected. Well have the latest reporting on that. Later, former secretary of state Madeleine Albright will be our guest. Youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. Still your best friend. And now your copilot. Still a father. But now a friend. Still an electric car. Just more electrifying. Still a night out. But everything fits in. Still hard work. Just a little easier. Still a legend. Just more legendary. Chevrolet. Making lifes journey, just better. We made usaa insurance for veterans like martin. When a hailstorm hit, he needed his insurance to get it done right, right away. Usaa. What youre made of, were made for. Usaa new aveeno® restorative skin therapy. With our highest concentration of prebiotic oat intensely moisturizes over time to improve skins resilience. Aveeno® healthy. Its our nature™. When panhe doesnt justs to imprommake a pizza. Lience. He uses fresh, clean ingredients to make a masterpiece. Taste our delicious new flatbread pizzas today. Panera. With the ninja foodito intelligesmart xl grill. Ing just pick your protein, select your doneness, and let the grill monitor your food. It also turns into an air fryer. Bring outdoor grilling flavors indoors with the grill that grills for you. Welcome back. Hospitalizations from the coronavirus reached a new high yesterday shattering a previous record set only a day before. Over 88,000 people are currently hospitalized from covid19 according to the covid tracking project. The u. S. Yesterday reported its highest daily death toll in six months with nearly 2,100 fatalities. Meanwhile we are learning that a Covid Vaccine may be coming sooner than expected. According to the New York Times, around middecember, 6. 4 million doses of pfizers Covid Vaccine will be shipped out across the u. S. In an initial push after it receives an expected emergency authorization. Officials said on a call with reporters on tuesday. The first doses of the vaccine are expected to go to Health Care Workers and potentially a few other vulnerable groups. The vaccine will be allocated to all 50 states and eight territories as well as six major metropolitan areas. The quantities will be based on how many adults live in each jurisdiction. After the initial doses, state governors and local leaders will decide where the shipments go. Joining us now Infectious Disease physician and medical director of the special pathogen unit at Boston University school of boston, dr. Nahid badillia. Also with us, dr. Dave campbell. Thank you both. Im talking to i talk to a good bit of my friends and other people looking at how quickly these vaccines are coming online and theyre expressing shock. But i do remember over the past couple of months having people like dr. Scott gottlieb coming on and saying we might have a vaccine by the end of the year. I think what the real surprise has been is we found out that pfizer is saying there might be a 95 effective rate, which is just absolutely surprising. Now were finding out its coming online very quickly as well. This is extraordinary news, is it not . It, joe. Good morning. It is one of those rare moments in science where you see something, an expectation of an effectiveness of a vaccine which is might higher than expected. The fda said they expected efficacy of 50 and they would authorize the vaccine. The great news for me is not just that pfizer has this vaccine but all the major vaccines that are part of operation warp speed target the same part of the virus, the spike protein. Moderna, Similar Technology showed great efficacy. We got news that astrazeneca, another vaccine pfrom oxford ma have good efficacy. It bodes well on saying not only is pfizer going to be successful in getting these potentially out but the fact that the other candidates were looking at down the line may also have good efficacy. We dont know how long protection from vaccines will last. Thats one of the big things. And we dont know if once we have the vaccine, how long the logistics of it will take as well as the peoples acceptance of the vaccine will take for us to reach a population, vaccinelevel herd immunity. Dr. Campbell, not only this news program, but just about every other documented in great detail the repeated failures of donald trump on just about every aspect of this pandemic. But the president , if these numbers end up playing out the way its looking, if theres a 90 , 95 effective rate and we have millions of americans by the end of this year being able to take a safe vaccine that makes them immune from the coronavirus, thats one legacy that donald trump will take with him out of the white house, and that is that operation warp speed will be considered an unqualified success. Well, that is true, joe. What is also true is that we have months to go before we can expect to see that widespread distribution of the vaccines. We hopefully will see pfizer start to ship and inject their vaccine in the middle of december. Operation warp speed chief adviser said perhaps december 11th or 12th. But right now today, we have surging death rates as you pointed out. We have surging hospitalizations. We have had 1 million cases registered in the last seven days, joe. So between now and then, whenever then is, theres going to be a lot more people infected. The case fatality rate is running around 1. 5 , 2 . Thats the number of people expected to die from the total number of people infected. Thats stable. Thats not getting better. It was worse in the spring, but it has not gotten any better since the summer. We only have right now, today, about a 10 of the United States may have some immunity with antibodies showing up in some studies. We have a large gap right now between thanksgiving, which is being concerning for a superspreader event of national proportions, and when we start the vaccines. The monoclonal antibodies and other therapeutics are great, great hope on the horizon, but we have to have as many people as possible survive this Holiday Season and with the death rates going up, the number of people infected going up, the virus is everywhere. Its not that this is not chicken little and the sky is falling, its truly right now that were in the thick of it. Everybody has to Pay Attention today, tomorrow, dont travel if at all possible. If you do travel, and if you do have people over, you have to be on absolute hyper height bened alert to not let those people who are especially at risk become infected because of thanksgiving, joe and mika. By the way, everything the doctor just said, listen to him. I love having doctors on here. Mika will tell you when were having conversations, the lawyer in me always pops up. I said hold on a second. Get it in writing. Hold on a second, youre assuming too much. So i was talking about the great news from this vaccine, what were hearing about the vaccine, but as dr. Dave points out, were in the thick of it right now. Were breaking records every day. So the great challenge is getting from where we are to where we want to be, where more americans can get that vaccine distributed. I will tell you just selfish also im excited about the possibility of that vaccine coming online because of a son of mine who is a diabetic, because another son of mine who has asthma and upper respiratory issues, both are extremely healthy other than that. But theyre in the high risk. Of course mikas mom, too. So theres much to be hopeful for, especially these numbers. We were hearing a couple months ago there may be a 50 effective rate. But 90 , 95 , that really will be a game changer for those with underlying conditions and then for the rest of the population, we can reopen. This country i said before, if its the lawyer in me, if, in fact, this plays out the way the pharmaceutical companies are saying it will play out, i will say again, mika, Donald Trumps legacy on operation warp speed will be a very positive one. Yeah. But the issue right now is thanksgiving. I understand that. There is no vaccine right now. I understand that. I sometimes think these headlines get people were so hungry for normal life again, im just talking about my own kids and the kids that i take care of, they are dying for things to get better, and if you talk too much about the vaccine on the horizon, i think they sometimes think thats the reality now. The reality now, is that were two days before thanksgiving one day before thanksgiving, right . And people are going to gather. And i even think people who are living in bubbles should wear masks at whatever dinner theyre having. Eddie glaude, professor at princeton, you deal with students, you have kids coming home. You can take a question to the doctors, but i wonder how how youre planning to do things and what concerns you have. Well, you know, we Just Announced yesterday at princeton that were inviting our students back, all of our students back back, all of our students back to campus in the spring. Im deeply concerned about it. Deeply worried about it, although there are protocols in place, anticipation of a vaccine coming. We understand thats going to happen in the context of this extraordinary spike that were experiencing now. I wanted to ask dr. Bedalia this question. I know we dont want to rush to the vaccine, but it seems to me we need to be having a conversation about the logistics of its distribution and im thinking about poor communities in urban areas and the like, how should we begin to have that conversation about the logistics of getting this vaccine to these very vulnerable communities that have been in some ways decimated by covid19 . Great question, professor. Some of this has actually been talked about and others, the Distribution Plan is so state dependent that were going to have to wait and see what happens. I know that once this pfizer is the first to go, so in some ways this is going to be an experiment of how this plays out. After the Public Committee hearing with the fda, the plan is for operation warp speed to start sending out materials for vaccinations to Administration Sites that the states have themselves reck thognized and s those details to operation warp speed. Pfizer is planning to send these liquid nitrogen to those sites. What the Cdcs Advisory Committee for immunization practices has said is what theyre planning to do is work with the Administration Sites with the states, and also then introduce new types of places where people can access that vaccine, you know, and so if you live far away from one of these Administration Sites, it doesnt help you, and so the kind of things that have been talked about are introducing pharmacies, walgreens, cvs as sites, having mobile vaccination vans that are able to get to the communities. The tough part for me is one part is logistics, the other is vaccine hesitancy. There was a survey earlier this week that showed one in five African Americans and 40 of black participants expressed distrust in vaccine safety or had, rather trust in vaccine safety and efficacy. Those are big numbers that come from, as you know, historic scars with the experience that minorities have had with research and trust such as events with tuskegee research that our government did on our population. What exists is structural violence, and our health care system, Structural Racism that manifests in everything from infant mortality to outcomes for heart attacks. To me the important part of the work is investing in our communities to find those bar y bar yriers to overcome, working with the communities and stake holders, religious leaders, Community Leaders to ensure that we meet their needs and exceed them. Dr. Bhadalia, we have been talking about joe bidens Foreign Policy team he introduced yesterday, and how that might make the world look differently at us and how our Foreign Policy may be different. On the coronavirus front, on january 20th, what will be different in terms of the way the government approaches this . Theres a lot of distance between now and then where the federal government has abdicated its role and put it to the states. What do you believe will be different on day one, how soon can the Biden Campaign, the Biden Administration now turn this ship around . Willie, ill just continue the conversation we were just having, you know, about diversity, and sort of getting beyond the barriers that we see in our health care system. Look at the covid, you know, Transition Team that president elect biden has put together, one of the best things i heard in my career is from david, a fire Surgeon General who said its not just where youre on the table but what you bring to it, when you see that diversity, not just experience but background on the covid team that gives me a lot of hope that representation of concerns of different types of communities are being brought to the table. Thats one good thing. The other, we hear that the white house is planning parties throughout the next month, you know, holiday parties, while telling americans to stay home. Thats a perfect example of how leadership has hurt our fight ge against the pandemic, where we Say Something in the world of Public Health and the white house does the exact opposite. Im hoping day one of the next administration that our leaders will hold up in their actions what theyre saying in words and that is going to go a long way. That alone is going to go a long way in bringing everybody to the same table on this fight. The last bit of this is being proactive, putting in the defense production act to make sure that we meet all the needs if the needs go up for personal protective equipment and medications and others. Doctors nahid bhadalia and dave campbell, thank you once again and have a happy thanksgiving. Joe biden pushes back that his administration will be a third obama term. We will ask former policy adviser jim messina about that. Morning joe is coming right back. T that morning joe is comg inright back my nunormal fewer asthma attacks. Less oral steroids. Taking my treatment at home. Nucala is a oncemonthly addon injection for severe eosinophilic asthma. Not for sudden breathing problems. Allergic reactions can occur. Get help right away for swelling of face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing. Infections that can cause shingles have occurred. Dont stop steroids unless told by your doctor. Tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. May cause headache, injection site reactions, back pain, and fatigue. Ask your doctor about nucala at home. Find your nunormal with nucala. Aunlike ordinary memory awant supplementster . Neuriva has clinically proven ingredients that fuel 5 indicators of brain performance. Memory, focus, accuracy, learning, and concentration. Try our new gummies for 30 days and see the difference. No uh uh, no way come on, no no nnnnono only discover has no annual fee on any card. [announcer] forget about vacuuming for up to a month. Shark iq robot deep cleans and empties itself into a base you empty as little as once a month. And unlike standard robots that bounce around it cleans row by row. If its not a shark, its just a robot. Its still warm. Thanks, alice says hi. For some of us, our daily journey is a short one. Save 50 when you pay per mile with allstate. Pay less, when you drive less. Youve never been in better hands. Allstate. Click or call for a quote today. children laughing music swells music fades exhales experience the power of sanctuary at the lincoln wish list sales event. Sign and drive off in a new lincoln with zero down, zero due at signing, and a complimentary first months payment. Everybody. Thank you. Mr. President. Sir, why not concede for the good of the country, sir . Okay. Theres our w commentary that was bleeped out. That was some weird stuff. What was that . Everybody was just like, what did he just do, 64 seconds of what . What was that, willie . He came out to tout 30,000 dow, which as i said last hour was pushed, many experts believe, by the fact that joe biden is bringing some stability and a kabcabinet of people who l not go around the world creating havoc. Interesting thing to bring out on the eve of thanksgiving, not talk about thanksgiving or the crisis of coronavirus, dow 30,000, for 64 seconds and turn and walk away without answering a question. Weird. Speaking of weird, did you guys see this Washington Post story on the jeb bush and room raider. People dont get him. They dont understand jeb. Theyre saying that jeb bush, why arent you more shocked about nuclear war than room raider. Jeb bush. Hey, guys. Like jeb bush. Shock opera is over. Jeb bush has the driest sense of humor. This is what jeb wrote, is it possible now that the election is over to rate rooms on a nonpartisan basis. Are you a room rater or a hyperpartisan, that is the problem. We need less hyperpartisanship on backgrounds. Just read that line right there. We need less hyper partisanship on backgrounds at this moment in our countrys history. And people actually took jeb seriously, and now the Washington Post, its a cute article, i like the article. Just like i love room rater. Its a great diversion, but this is you remember when jeb said please clip, everybodys like, oh, thats pathetic. I started dying laughing because i know jeb bush. That was him just kind of poking fun at himself. Hes so droll and his sense of humor is so dry, but i read this article this morning, and i thought oh, my god. I mean, people are making a controversy off of a joke. Yeah, youve been around jeb bush a lot in the state of florida. You get his delivery a little better. I had the same thought about the moment in february in new hampshire, saying please clap, which people thought was a sad commentary on the state of his campaign. Actually was him being jeb bush, and laying something out when he didnt get the response. You read the last line, its not even that dry, its so obvious hes making a joke. We have bigger problems in the world than worrying about jeb bush and room rater, its funny that people took it seriously. Headline writers, youre going to have to do meditation as the end of the Trump Presidency comes upon us. We dont need to be shocked by everything. Not everything is shocking. Were actually just going to cover things as they are, and you can stop being shocked, and i think it takes getting used to because were used to being shocked every day, we just assume its shocking. Maybe in all the great news organizations across america and the world they can do yoga in the middle of the day and have mindfulness sessions. Here i am being droll, i guess im going to get in trouble. Were going to do three minutes of breathing. Along with joe, willie, and me, we have msnbc contributor, mike barnicle, editor at large for the nonprofit newsroom the 19th, and msnbc contributor, erin haynes and political reporter for the Washington Post and msnbc political analyst, robert costa, moderator of Washington Week on pbs. And bob, youve got a great Washington Week coming up this week. Tell us about it real quick. Weve got faried zaccaria. After thanksgiving, weve got to sit down and dig in on whats next. So bob, whats next in the Trump White House . What are you i know were moving into thanksgiving weekend. But what are you looking at . What are you going to be reporting . What are you going to be checking checki checking your phone on even while youre with your family eating the turkey . Im going to be sitting in the garage, not going inside, still trying to visit my family, but sit inside. Once you interview dr. Fauci like i did on monday, you learn, follow the guidelines, do it the right way. This is what im hearing, they say hes closer to Rudy Giuliani than ever, and they say theyre not exaggerating when they tell me that. He wants to go to gettysburg, pennsylvania, today to meet with Pennsylvania Republicans in the state legislature. He knows, im told privately, that the path to any kind of block of a certification is nearly impossible at this point but hes going to fight this until the Electoral College convenes in december. For them right now its as much about the political theater, preserving his brand as a fighter with his core voters as it is anything else. Well, the president ial transition is now officially underway. A biden official tells nbc news that by mid afternoon yesterday, Transition Teams had made contact with all federal agencies including the white house. The president elect says he has not yet received the president ial Daily Briefing from u. S. Intelligence officials but that it could happen today. Joe biden officially also introduced his first cabinet picks yesterday. Filled with career National Security and Foreign Policy professionals. As expected tony blinken will serve as secretary of state, Alejandro Mayorkas will head Homeland Security. Avril haines will be director of national intelligence. Jake sullivan will become National Security adviser. Linda thomasgreenfield will be named u. S. Ambassador to the un, and form secretary of state john kerry will be the climate envoy. It is a team that will keep our country and our people safe and secure. Its a team that reflects the fact that america is back, ready to lead the world, not retreat from it. Once again, sit at the head of the table. Ready to confront our adversaries and not reject our allies, ready to stand up for our values. And they will tell me what i need to know, not what i want to know. What i need to know. Now, we have to proceed with equal measures of humility and confidence. Humility because as the president elect said we cant solve all of the worlds problems alone. The department of Homeland Security has a Noble Mission to help keep us safe and to advance our proud history as a country of welcome. President joe biden will trust in god, and he will also trust in science to guide our work on earth. America is back. Multilateralism is back. Diplomacy is back. You know what else is back is the view that america is the indispensable player on the world stage, that we actually have a responsibility to promote American Values. To be humble. Not just promote trade and not just to make billions and trillions of dollars, but also that the most valuable thing we can export are our values. Its something that tony blinken brought home yesterday in the most moving of ways. For my family, as for so many generations of americans, america has literally been the last best hope on earth. My late stepfather, samuel pizar, he was one of 900 children in his school in poland, but the only one to survive the holocaust after four years in concentration camps. At the end of the war, he made a break from a death march into the woods in ba var varia, from hiding place, he heard a deep rumbling sound, it was a tank. But instead of the iron cross, he saw painted on its side a five pointed white star. He ran to the tank. The hatch opened. An africanamerican gi looked down at him. He got down on his knees and said the only three words he knew in english that his mother taught him before the war. God bless america. Thats who we are. Thats what america represents to the world. However imperfectly. Now we have to proceed with equal measures of humility and confidence. Humility because as the president elect said, we cant solve all of the worlds problems alone, we need to be working with other countries. We need their cooperation. We need their partnership. But also confidence because america at its best still has a greater ability than any other country on earth to bring others together to meet the challenges of our time. Mike barnicle, so beautiful. America at its best. This is who we are. Imperfect at times, but always striving to be better and listening to tony blinken yesterday and the president elect of the United States of america. Ive just got to say as somebody thats been an unapologetic believer that america is the indispensable power on the world stage, man it was nice hearing those leaders talk yesterday. That was quite a moment, joe, quite a moment for anybody watching and for everybody in the country to think about. God bless america. And youre right, it signified a different role for the United States around the world beginning right now. You dont have to wait until january 20th. And its not just tony blinken, its the entire cast of National Security people who are on that stage yellsterday with the president elect biden. Its competence, experience, insight, humility as tony blinken pointed out, and its long past time for the United States of america to display the strength, the vigor, the insight and the experience that the United States has had in shaping the world again. To bring it back again. You know, over the weekend, over the past few days in reading your book, i was struck by the similarities between the crises that harry truman faced from 1945 to 1948, and how they dealt with the marshal plan, nato, and the crisis today that the United States is involved in, having to do with very similar issues. The near destruction of nato because of our withdrawal, the crisis that we have selfinflicted upon ourselves from withdrawing from so many issues and problems around the world, only to see the insertion of china into these issues and these problems taking a predominant role, rather than the United States. But yesterday gave us great relief, i think, as a people because of the competence of the people assembled on that stage, and the direction that they pointed to in going forward. So i mean, youre absolutely right. It was a terrific day for everyone whos been worried. Well, and youre so right about so many of the parallels that harry truman and joe biden faced. Harry truman coming out of world war ii was facing a bipolar world, like joe biden is facing a bipolar world that he needs to manage against china, but also the Natural Inclination of this country for the first 150 years, until harry truman became president was retreat. Since George Washingtons farewell address, and it was harry truman that had to convince republican isolationists and had to convince a war weary nation that when we help our allies, when we engage in the world, we only end up helping ourselves and he actually, willie called in, talked about how he called in Herbert Hoover, 31st president of the United States, a president who had been treated with contempt by democrats because he knew hoover was an extraordinary engineer. There was a refugee crisis in europe, the greatest refugee crisis in World History and there were europeans starving which made them vulnerable to communism. So together, Herbert Hoover and harry truman worked to alleviate that suffering in europe. As Herbert Hoover said, a hungry european is a european more vulnerable to communism. And if you read one of my Favorite Books, the president s club, Michael Duffy and nancy gibbs write in the president s club that together those two president s saved more people at that time than anybody else and as they both noted, yes, it was humanitarian, but also it was deeply strategic. And thats something that i think has escaped donald trump and his insiders for a very long time. Yeah, and we heard echoes of that yesterday from almost emp w everyone who stepped up to the microphone, a reengagement of the world, a step up of alliances which have been viewed as business. Were getting ripped off by country x, nato, we want money, we want you to put more money in. Not an understanding that theyre much more than Financial Transactions and erin haynes, as you watch not just the event yesterday but joe bidens interview with lester holt afterward, he continued this idea of sort of turning down the temperature, even when hes asked about, you know, the slow transition and the Trump Administrations unwillingness to engage with the Transition Team. No, weve started now, and its been sincere, and i expect it to be sincere going forward. It hasnt been begrudging at all. Obviously it hasnt been. From the beginning it now is, now they are engaging on the transition, but its been frustrating but joe biden himself and his team yesterday, and again, just superficially trying to project calm and that were going to dial things back, and we are in fact going to turn down the temperature in the country. Well, yes, willie, and i think what you saw was an extension of the message that joe biden had during his campaign about restoring the soul of this country. And i think that part of that for him also includes, you know, the healing and the unity that has to happen on the world stage, and you saw several of the nominees that were speaking yesterday reinforcing that. Im thinking particularly about Linda Thomasgreenfield whos going to be, you know, the un ambassador if she is confirmed. You know, talking about the idea that multilateralism is back, the idea that diplomacy is backment it just really, the whole display yesterday, it just gives, i think, the American People a sense of how very different leadership is going to look in this country just 56 days from now, and i think, you know, with, you know, this gsa ascertainment, with joe biden starting to get these briefings, the transition, really beginning to happen in earnest and these nominations continuing to roll out, the country is beginning to kind of turn towards that, even as you have the Current Administration continuing to focus on these futile fights around voting and the election that have the potential to continue to erode and corrode our democracy. You have the Incoming Administration focused on the future and what leadership could look like going forward. And as i heard bidens team talk yesterday, incoming president s team talking yesterday, there were a lot of notes they struck that sounded like could have come from a traditional republican administration. Of course from, whether it would be, you know, reagans administration or george h. W. Bushs administration or george w. Bushs administration. It was a very traditional sort of view of the world that the United States is, in fact, a critical player on the world stage and that we need to partner with our allies to promote American Values and protect american interests across the globe. Ive just got to believe despite a couple of embarrassing tweets that came out yesterday, sort of reflexive embarrassing tweets that came out yesterday from some key republican senators, i cant believe thats not the Foreign Policy that mainstream republicans, lets say people like rob portman are not going to support wholeheartedly. Its an important point, joe, and in a round of calls yesterday, i discovered from democrats close to biden a new truth is that this was an ideological statement made by the president elect but more importantly, they said, this was a statement of political reality. He knows that the senate is going to be narrowly divided. He wants to have a presidency after watching president obama and president clinton and other democratic president s over his long career struggle in year one. He wants to have a presidency that begins with a stimulus package, collect kif actiive ac abroad. What you saw was not a return to nationalism but a veteran political presence in leader in president elect biden saying to republicans in the senate, this is going to be an easily confirmable slate. Lets get this moving. Lets not have a fire fight over nominations in 2021. And willie, can you walk bob costa through what its like having thanksgiving and christmas dinner in your garage. You and i, i know after we came back from turkey for a few years, our family didnt want us anywhere near the kids, and i was actually out back in the wood shed. You guys are used to distancing. Yeah, we are. We have been social distancing, long before the rest of america was stings, but can you teocial you tell, bob, what are some of the dos and donts when they make you eat thanksgiving in the garage. In fairness, ours is more of a question as house arrest, and we only go as far as the ankle bracelet would let us go. You were in the shed, and i was in the garage. I think hes kidding, but might not be, bob costa, while the family is enjoying the thanksgiving feast, in the kitchen furiously texting members of the Coronavirus Task force. When you migrate from the kids table to the garage, its actually a success in my book, so. There you go. Thats true. And mika, why dont you give us all your familys favorite thanksgiving memory when the turkey ended up on the lawn. No, it didnt. In the middle the turkey, your brothers in the middle of the iraq war. They dont like it when i talk about it. No, because sometimes families clash a little bit. So we wont talk about it here. Why . So anyway, ian worked for don rumsfeld in the middle of the iraq war, and mark and d drdr. Dr. Brazinski, mika said it was like the boys, father, the turkey, it was all out. It was a politically divided household at the table together. You know, of course, its funny, we used to have the sort of fights in our family, but it was whether we were going to stay up to watchmanics or waltons. There werent as many debates in our family as yours. Lets not talk politics any of us over thanksgiving dinner. Ill give you the advice i gave jimmy fallon, dont gather, dont talk and have a wonderful time. Was jimmy fallon in our house last night. No, we did a socially distanced, we were on a show. One other thing, willie. Yesterday afternoon, not to hold everybody here. But you guys join in. This is like our thanksgiving predinner. You know, willie, and i want some advice from other people on how i should have responded to this. So i knew yesterday morning it was mika and my anniversary, and she said nothing and about 5 00 in the afternoon, i walked in and i said is today a special day for you, she goes. Yeah, i guess. Yeah, whatever. Stop it. This is too personal. I said, you know, it is our anniversary. And she goes. I knew it was something. She knew it was something. She still thinks my birthday is in august, willie. Its just unbelievable to me. So anybody, any advice here . Do i put signs up in the house to remind her . I think just pop something into her outlook calendar is the best way for next year, its our anniversary. You sound like Molly Ringwold in 16 candles, hoping someone will remember your big day. Its really sad. Erin, what do you think, i have enough of a selfesteem problem as it is. Yeah, i noticed that. You know, i would suggest google calendar, that is the gift that keeps on giving, and you know, the key to a continued happy union. So yes, just go ahead and put the reminder down for next year. You can be proactive, too, about the anniversary. There you go. There you go. Its not like you showed up with a present. Mike barnicle, i have a feeling you remind ann about your anniversary every year. Dont even go there. Thank god for my visa card on my anniversary, i find out about it a day later. Joe, this is a crushing blow to you, joe, in terms of ego, the impact of you and your marriage, to realize youre a low impact player on your very own marriage. Okay. Here we go. Way way over the line here. Robert costa, thank you very much, still ahead on morning joe. Bob, good luck in the garage, by the way. Former white house policy adviser to president obama, jim messina joins us. Also joining us, from the Washington Post, Eugene Robertson with a guide to understanding biden voters. Y youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. I think the next president needs to be a lot quieter but send a signal were prepared to act in the National Security interests of this country, to get back in the business of creating a more peaceful world. Please clap. Ease clap. Opportunities are all about timing. So now that medicare annual enrollment is here, its time for a plan that gives you more for your medicare dollar an aarp Medicare Advantage plan from unitedhealthcare. Call unitedhealthcare today to get 0 copays for all primary care doctor visits, 0 copays on preventive dental, and 0 copays on hundreds of prescriptions. Last year members saved an average of 7,200. Youll even get free annual eye exams, and designer frames. Nows the time to get more from your medicare plan. Dont miss your shot. The opportunity comes once a year. Enrollment ends december 7th, so nows the time to call and learn about our choice of plans, including ppo options. 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Joining us now, ceo of the messina group, jim messina. He served as white house chief of staff to president obama, and ran his 2012 reelection campaign. Also with us, Pulitzer Prize winning jim robertson. Good to see you this morning. I want to start with something i said off the top of the show. Joe biden has won over 306 electoral votes, going to end up winning by over 6 million votes in the popular vote overall, but hes having the discussion last night with a friend, and we were talking about how close this race was, how surprisingly close it still was after four years of behavior that i considered abhorrent from donald trump, and i think a lot of americans did. But you know, we have been telling ourselves for four years, i have been telling myself at least, that you know, maybe putin interfered in the election as far as wikileaks goes, and maybe that impacted some people. The comey letter made the big difference. Hillary clinton didnt go into wisconsin, if only she had gone into wisconsin, and more. If only she had run a better campaign, and it ended up we, ill just say i, was wrong, thinking this would never happen again, with all the advantages joe biden had. But, i mean, here we are three weeks later. Georgia was remarkably close, that could have gone either way. Arizona remarkably close, that could have gone either way. Wisconsin remarkably close. That could have gone either way, and you start looking back going, you know, if donald trump had had a better first debate, if he had controlled himself the last ten days of this Campaign Like the last ten days of 2016 campaign, he could have won this thing. In fact, i would say he probably would have won this thing, so what does it tell you looking back on how close this race ended up being . A couple of things, joe. First, as you said, this was a close election, but joe biden got over 80 million votes. He won by over 4 points, and he won electorally a fairly good win. On the other hand, you had donald trump getting over 70 million votes, and a lot of democratic friends want to pretend that didnt happen. Republicans picked up seats in the house. They kept control of the senate. And what this is is the American Public saying to both sides cant you please for gosh darn sakes Work Together and get things done. I was on a show last night, and someone said, oh, jim, you know, biden shouldnt appoint any republicans, no republicans in the cabinet, theyre never going to work with him. Get to reality. The country just decided and said very clearly we want people to Work Together, and if you look at cabinet that biden is assembling and these great picks, i know every one of them as friends and colleagues, theres two things about this, number one, theyre all going to get confirmed by a republican senate. Theyre competent and are going to Work Together to get things done in a very, kind of calm manner that is what the American Public wants after four years of craziness. Gene robertson, youre writing about understanding the biden voter. What did you find . Well, you know, this has been working on me for the past four years since the 2016 election because many of us did not expect donald trump to win and so immediately the media and academics started this deep sociological exploration of the trump voter, who was the trump voter, and i think we went to speaking, just my news organization, i think we must have gone to every diner in the United States looking for, interviewing as many trump voters as we could find to figure out what made them tick. We kind of forgot, Hillary Clinton did have 3 million more voters than donald trump did, and while that wasnt a surprise, that was the fact. And but now, but this time, joe biden has 6 million more voters than donald trump, and so lets recognize that, yes, we are a divided country, but there are a lot of people who kind of think basically the way i think about donald trump, about the way government should work, about what the country should be, should aspire to be. And in a sense, you know, we have become the forgotten majority in this country, and i just wanted to point that out. So jim messina, we should point out that donald trump got 10 million more votes than he did in 2016, just for perspective, but we played that sound bite from joe biden talking to lester holt, of course this will be different than the last four years, but dont expect a third obama term. Why do you think he put it that way, and what did you take that to mean . I think the pandemic and the coronavirus has changed everything. If you look around the world, were going to need to reimagine a Health System post coronavirus. Were going to reimagine a new Economic System and start to deal with some of these problems. I think we are going to look back in 100 years and say this was the Tipping Point where everything changed. And we just arent in the same situation that we were during the obama presidency, and i think joe biden is exactly the right person for this moment because hes going to be able to lower the temperature a bit, and look at some of these things and say how do we competently deal with all of the things were going to have to do. Let me give you an example, willie, were going to have to figure out how to get a vaccine to billions of people around the world, and start to think about how you reimagined transportation, how you reimagined health care, reimagined National Security in a post pandemic world and i think joe biden is just the right guy to say lets put the politics down a little bit. Doesnt mean were not going to have them. Lets just see if we can competently deal with some of these things. I have a client whos a world leader who texted me after the Biden Press Conference and said welcome back, america, we miss you, and thats exactly where the world is. Erin haynes has the next question. Erin . Yeah, i just wanted to go back to eugenes column about the biden voter. I do think he makes a really good point about just the idea that joe biden did win a Record Number of voters and i wonder, ew what your an threxperiment taug about this coalition of biden was able to assemble, what does this mean for democrats who are looking to expand the electorate and are frankly probably already looking to 2022. Number one, i think it means for democrats that the voters are there. Look at what happened in your state, in georgia, i mean, it is i did not think, you know, if you had asked me five years ago would democrats carry georgia in this election, albeit narrowly, would they carry it, could they possibly carry it by a single vote. I would have said no, georgias not going to tip that way. But the voters are there. Stacey abrams showed us that the voters are there. And she helped, and i think democrats across the country should, and really anybody interested in politics should study that state and see how it was sort of moved from the red column to the blue for this election. And its not just it wasnt just donald trump. It was also appealing to, you know, voters who shared that philosophy. And i think thats something we ought to keep in mind. Let me say one other thing, slightly different subject, but joe, you are you have good timing. You have a book about harry truman coming out this week because this could be a truman moment. You know, i think of the marshal plan, and i think of the rebuilding of the western the building of the western alliance. The rebuilding of the western world, and i think of the rebuilding that joe biden is necessarily going to have to do and rethinking of our relationships, hes going to have to be what is our relationship going to be with china, you know, how do we move forward at this point with our western allies, what does the post pandemic, post trump world look like, and this is that sort of moment. And jim, messina, just to touch on that, with joes book on president truman, there are some opportunities here for truman like moments but things didnt come easily for harry truman. People made fun of him. He had a low approval rating, but he changed the course of history. Its really true. You know, part of my experience in the white house is hard things are hard. And you really see in the moments that matter leadership really matter. Leaders coming together to say, look at this moment were going to do not the easy thing, not the politically easy thing, but were going to do the right thing, and thats what harry truman did. Thats the kind of leadership i think youre going to see joe biden saying lets put aside the politics, i know theyre brutal, and lets do this. I remember barack obama saying to an entire White House Oval Office room of people who didnt want him to do health care because they knew how difficult it was going to be politically, look, its not the easy thing, and i know youre all right that its going to be really difficult but its the right thing and weve got to do it, and thats what great leaders like truman have doneme. Thats what obama did, and thats the kind of moment joe biden is going to find himself in as he grapples with a post pandemic world. Jim messina, thank you so much. And Eugene Robinson thank you as well. Well be reading your new column in the Washington Post. Coming up, a member of the house leadership moving up in rank. Congresswoman Katherine Clark joins us after being elected assistant speaker by house democrats. Morning joe is coming right back. Democrats. Morning joe is coming right back [announcer] welcome to intelligent indoor grilling with the ninja foodi smart xl grill. Just pick your protein, select your doneness, and let the grill monitor your food. It also turns into an air fryer. Bring outdoor grilling flavors indoors with the grill that grills for you. You power through chronic migraine 15 or more headache days a month,. Each lasting 4 hours or more. Botox® prevents headaches in adults with chronic migraine. So, if you havent tried botox® for your chronic migraine,. Check with your doctor if botox® is right for you, and if samples are available. Effects of botox® may spread hours to weeks after injection. Causing serious symptoms. Alert your doctor right away, as difficulty swallowing,. 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Only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. With the ninja foodito intelligesmart xl grill. Ing just pick your protein, select your doneness, and let the grill monitor your food. It also turns into an air fryer. Bring outdoor grilling flavors indoors with the grill that grills for you. Congress might not get around to passing another covid relief bill to help the millions still struggling, but they are likely to avoid a government shut down. That could have had serious impact on their long holiday recess. House and senate appropriator reached a deal on a 1. 4 trillion spending package. Once they return from their thanksgiving break, theyll have just two weeks to work out all the details to avoid a december 11th shut down ch joining. Joining us now is a member of the appropriations committee, congresswoman Katherine Clark of massachusetts. She was also just elected to be the next assistant speaker of the house, making her the second highest ranking democratic woman in history. Congratulations. Lets start there. Id love to get your thoughts. Congratulations, though. Id love to get your thoughts on the biden Transition Team because it appears the concept of being a woman in charge is almost going to be normal finally. Well, lets hope we have arrived at that long overdue moment. And representation matters. We know it. We know that when women are in leadership positions, the priorities change. And we hear all the issues that women deal with, whether its how to care for our families, what is their place in the work force. How do we make sure that the devastation were seeing to women in this post pandemic economy ends, and that we value the work that women do, their contribution. Onethird of our essential workers are women. But we are seeing one out of four women be driven out of the work force. And we know what these issues are. This pandemic has just brought them into stark relief. So i look forward to working with the Biden Administration, and with our incredible Democratic Caucus in the house to put these issues on the front burner and make sure that we are addressing them and meeting this moment of racial, gender and economic injustice with Real Solutions for the American People. Well, congresswoman, i bring you the man whos married to one of the most powerful women in business and also one of your constituents, mike barnicle. Mike. Good morning, congresswoman, im sitting in your district as you probably have figured out. Things look okay from here, but congratulations on the assumption of your new post in the house. Youve got a shrinking democratic membership there, lost a couple of seats that i think people were surprised at losing, perhaps you were too. But my question to you is going forward, growing the party, donald trump got more than 70 million votes, he got 10 million more votes this time out than he did in 2016. What is the magic that the Democratic Party is going to come up with to reach not the cultish trump voters but the trump voters who voted for him for various reasons but not the cultlike trump voters, growing the party, whats the plan . You know, what i think we saw on november 3rd was that 80 Million People voted for change, to restore trust, integrity, science, unity, and we are unified in our purpose of making sure that our focus is directly on those challenges that americans are facing. Just here in massachusetts, we are seeing Food Insecurity growing. Childhood hunger has raised 150 with this pandemic. Those are the issues that we have to focus on. How do we crush this pandemic, make sure a vaccine is distributed equally and equitably, and that we are then looking at the economic underpinnings, investing in our infrastructure, making sure that we stabilize the child care industry. We dont want to just return to the status quo, but we are going to work with the Biden Harris Administration to build a better, more inclusive economy where that American Dream comes back into reach for too many people who have been shut out. And thats what gives me apt mitche optimism and hope as we go into this 117th session of congress. Congresswoman, its willie geist. I am sure you are hearing back in your district from your constituents, Small Business owners, perhaps, people who work at the businesses saying we need help here. Its been too long since we have gotten the ppe, too long since the checks have gone out to families. And if you want to create a Public Health environment thats safe, which means in some cases closes businesses or limiting hours, they need a backstop to be able to do that. So i know that you are frustrated with your republican colleagues in the senate. I know you are frustrated that the c. A. R. E. S. Act has been sitting there unsigned for so long. What do you say to those constituents, besides blaming republicans, when they ask for help . You know, willie, this is, these are the calls that i am getting. How am i going to keep my restaurant going now that we are having cold weather set in in the northeast . How am i going to be able to find a job, nevermind go to a job when schools are closed and i cant access child care. These are the issues people are grappling with and this is what we have been fighting for in congress. We passed the h. E. R. O. E. S. Act back in may. We came back in july and stabilized child care and made investments in our post office. In october, we came back with another offer, another reduction in the funding we needed, but what we cant do is say who do we leave behind. You know, we are flexible on amounts, but we are facing some real deadlines in portions of the c. A. R. E. S. Act that expire at the end of the year. And what is that going to mean to people who are struggling to put it together . We are seeing terrifying statistics about latino and black and native American Families and the disproportionate impact this has had on them financially. We have to recognize that from the words of their own Federal Reserve head, we cannot invest enough in the American People at this time. We cannot overspend in helping them to recovery. It is not just the loss of life and livelihood, but it is how we are going to set a course for the future. We must respond and to see Mitch Mcconnell continue to ignore, we are not in a negotiation here over a used car or a house. We are talking about lives. We have a president who wont acknowledge that 260,000 deaths in this country to the pandemic, and we have to get this relief out. So we are going to continue to be at that table, to be the voice for the American People. We have a powerful new alley in the Biden Administration to get this done and deliver solutions. As you know, congresswoman, republicans would say to that, you came up with this bloated bill that has a bunch of stuff in it thats not related to covid, whether its cannabis businesses or farming or immigration, and they would say we put forward a targeted bill that addresses the problem in front of us. How do you answer that criticism . Sforz. I would would say, take one example, Food Insecurity and hunger. With tomorrow being thanksgiving, we are seeing that rising around the country. And as we have continued to reduce the size of our package, we cant make choices about who is going to succeed and who isnt. We need to be able to feed hungry people in this country, and we have heard from the republicans that thats a nonstarter. We need to invest in our state and local governments so they can keep critical workers on the payroll. They have said thats a nonstarter. But what they are willing to do and continue to create slush funds, pad the corporate payroll at the expense of the suffering of the American People. This isnt about dollar amounts. This is about the core values of how will we come to the aid of the American People in this time of crisis. All right. Congresswoman Katherine Clark, who will be the next assistant speaker of the house. Thank you very much for being on this morning. And errin haines, before we go, final thoughts from you as we head into thanksgiving mid amid a raging pandemic . What are you following . Its interesting. I have to stop meeting with congresswoman clark like this. My q a with her is actually going up later this morning on the 19th. Thinking about thanksgiving, we are going to see, thankfully, more women, to your point, in leadership roles headed into this new administration and this new congress. And representation matters. The priorities that women have on their minds going into this Holiday Season, going into the surge in this pandemic absolutely matter, and keeping those priorities front and center i think we are going to see that continue to translate into policy and going to see what those women bring to the table as this Biden Administration continues to take shape. All right. Errin haines, thank you very much. Have a wonderful holiday. And still ahead, the tale of the president and the president elect. Joe biden is set to deliver a prethanksgiving address to the nation today. While President Trump will reportedly join Rudy Giuliani for a socalled hearing on voter fraud. Fraud. Morning joe is coming right back. 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Tget an iphone 12 with 5g on us on every single plan. Switch now and save 20 on your bill vs. The other guys. Thats right. Iphone 12 on us. Its time to holiday on with t mobile. See yourself. Welcome back to the mirror. And know youre not alone because this. Come on jessie one more. Is the reflection of an Unstoppable Community in the mirror. The stock market, Dow Jones Industrial average just hit 170,000 new cases in the past 24 hours. The stock markets just broken more than 259,000 lives lost now. Thats a sacred number. 18 more lives in the last day. Never been broken that number. A death reported every minute in this country. Nobody thought theyd ever see it. 14 Straight Days of record hospitalizations. We have broken records in, during the Trump Administration. More than 85,000 patients in hospitals across this country. Which is the highest in history. Millions waiting for hours for test, some five hours or more. Thank you very much, everybody. Thank you. President trump focused on the numbers. Just the wrong numbers in a really weird, short news conference. Good morning. He didnt answer questions. I dont know what you call it. Very strange, the recount. If you want to see what happens after the president gets in office its amazing. Sign of the times. Some george w. Bush type what the heck was that . That was some weird but, you know, willie, i was talking to somebody last night and we were going over the election. You know, earlier right after the Election Results were coming in, i think a lot of you were shocked by how close it was, especially if you looked at the polls in the upper midwest. I made the comment that, hey, we had all said, oh, how could hillary, the only way donald trump won was Hillary Clinton ran the Worst Campaign ever. And it ends up, no, she actually didnt run the Worst Campaign ever, that donald trump actually has a pull on millions of americans. He has an appeal to a lot more americans. It wasnt a oneoff. Hillary couldnt just have gone to wisconsin two more times, done this or that. Like he is a populist force that, you know, were all going to have to reckon with on what happened, not just in 2016, but in 2020. But that said, my friend and i are also saying last night that if donald trump had just focused the last ten days and if he had you know, there were just like, for instance, if he havent have had those press conferences, those Coronavirus Press conferences, if he hadnt focused exclusively on the stock market and focused more on covid and done some basic things from the very beginning, if he had not been preaching bizarre he didnt get steroids into the debate. Yeah, if he didnt have such a horrible first debate, you could go down the list of all of the ifs. That guy, especially if he had focused on covid and not just the stock market, he may not only still could have won, he probably would have won. And its all very astounding that, i mean, and that press conference, i guess that press conference yesterday just shows how clueless donald trump remains about the 250,000 plus people who died. And how he could have won if he would have just focused on the health and the well being of americans instead of just always looking at the bottom line from the Dow Jones Industrial. Yeah, first of all, its amazing. You referenced the george w. Bush quote from the inaugural four years ago. That was weird stuff. Amazing how well thats held up from day one literally. This administration right here to the end. But, yeah, i mean, for him to come out right now on the eve effectively of thanksgiving and not have some kind of a message about where the country is in terms of its health, the safety and what we should and shouldnt be doing and to come out touting for 64 seconds, the cow crossing 30,000, thats where the urgency came. We havent seen that kind of urgency around coronavirus around this pandemic, but he was so excited by dow 30,000 that he had to rush out into the briefing room. Its also worth pointing out a lot of people on wall street say a great part of that push past 30,000 was because of the stability that we have seen from the incoming Biden Administration. Perhaps a return to normal, less uncertainty like we have seen under donald trump. So for him to come out and taught dow 30,000, not talk about coronavirus but to do so as joe biden is coming into office and perhaps pushing that c dow up to 30,000, there is some irony there as well. It might have been also he was looking ing for a reason to show his face and appear to be in the middle of normalcy which he very much is not because losing is not something he does well or nicely. At all. But at least the transition is happening and, boy, what a day yesterday. Some incredible moments as we heard from some of president elect joe bidens picks. We have got nbc news capitol hill correspondent and host of way too early kasie hunt. And professor at Princeton University and author of the book begin again eddie glaude jr. President trump is running out of efforts in his lastditch effort to cling to power as key states move to certify Election Results officially confirming joe biden as the president elect. Pennsylvania and nevada are the latest states to officially certify that biden defeated trump in both states elections. This comes a day after michigan certified he won the election there. And in Arizona Republican governor doug ducey said he acknowledges that biden carried his state. In georgia, county workers across the state began a machinery count of the roughly 5 million votes yesterday, just a few days ago they completed a hand tally that confirmed bidens lead of roughly 12,000 votes. Nonetheless, the president ial transition is now officially underway. Biden official tells nbc news that by midafternoon yesterday Transition Teams had made contact with all federal agencies, including the white house. The president elect says he has not yet received the president ial Daily Briefing from u. S. Intelligence officials, but that it could happen today. Here is the incoming president in his sitdown interview with nbcs lester holt. Bidens first since winning the election. Immediately we have gotten outreach from the National Security shop. We are already working now, meeting with the covid team in the white house. I think we are going to not be so far behind the curve as we thought we might be in the past. And there is a lot of immediate discussion and i must say the outreach has been sincere. Have you had any conversations with President Trump postelection about paving the way for this transition to happen . No, i have not heard anything from President Trump. Well, and, joe, we have got a lot more on the transition ahead and some incredible moments and incredible people that have been chosen to be a part of this cabinet. But when you look at these states and every day we deliver the news about recounts or how close different state official, county officials are certifying the vote, somebody close to trump, if they knew him, if they understood him and could talk to him, they would explain to him he is retraumatizing himself every time he loses again. He loses each state now once, twice, three times, and all that does is churn him up and has him tweeting terrible things and trying to think of how he can make this pain stop. I am not trying to be funny. I am saying when you know trumps psychology, you know this traumatizes him and causes him to act out. Its time for somebody to tell him to let it go and get it behind him for his own good. He keeps losing these states d over and over again. You remember when i asked him, what was it, four years ago, five years ago, i guess fiveye five years ago now, i said after he said something outrageous. I said, who do you have to talk to . Who is the one person that you can talk to to pass things through . We talk about harry truman changing the world because he had five, six of the best, brightest people in washington and in america around him at all times helping him out. Donald trump said you wont like this answer, i just listen to myself. That is a surefire way to end up exactly the way this president has ended up. But what donald trump, i think, needs to understand, the point that he needs to get to, is that he has set himself up to lose now every day. He lost the one election. He, of course, if he had the discipline, he should have lost that one election and then gone quiet, gone away. But youre right. Hes been picking fights, and this is something i was saying, something close to somebody close to donald trump a week ago, which was when you talk to him, tell him that hes going to lose every single legal challenge. He is going to lose every recou recount challenge. Everything he is doing every day is setting himself up to lose over and over and over again. And the only way to get out of that cycle is to pull yourself off of that battlefield. Yeah. And wont concede. But just go away and let this run its own course. Then if you want to come back later, come back like. This would be like muhammad ali deciding when he was 43 years old after he had lost, you know, that, hey, i am going to go out and i am going to fight a heavyweight fight against a 25yearold every day. I am not saying that joe biden is a 25yearold, but muhammad ali would have as much of a chance at 43 of beating a 25yearold as donald trump has winning any of these court challenges. Its time to move on. And stop setting himself up as someone who is losing over and over again. Its a terrible show. Pull away. Get away from the scene. And if you want to run again in 2024, then set yourself up. Still ahead we will hear from the man set to represent america on the world stage. Tony blinken is tapped to serve as joe bidens secretary of state and made quite an opening impression yesterday. Thats next on morning joe. Ex. For over 30 years, lexus has been celebrating driveway moments. Heres to one more, the lexus december to remember sales event. Get 0 financing on all new 2020 and 2021 lexus models. Experience amazing at your lexus dealer. Plus have high Blood Pressure. They may not be able to take just anything for pain. Thats why doctors recommend tylenol®. It wont raise Blood Pressure the way that advil® aleve or motrin® sometimes can. For trusted relief, trust tylenol®. That advil® aleve or motrin® sometimes can. With the ninja foodito intelligesmart xl grill. Ing just pick your protein, select your doneness, and let the grill monitor your food. It also turns into an air fryer. Bring outdoor grilling flavors indoors with the grill that grills for you. President elect joe biden officially introduced his first cabinet picks yesterday filled with career National Security and Foreign Policy professionals. As expected, tony blinken will serve as secretary of state. Heres part of what the longtime diplomat shared about his Family History yesterday as a way to illustrate what america represents to the world. Take a listen. For my family, as for so many generations of americans, america has literally been the last best hope on earth. In my late stepfather, he was one of 900 children in his school in poland, but the only one to survive the holocaust after four years in concentration camps. At the end of the war he made a break from a death march into the woods in bavaria. From his hiding place he heard a deep rumbling sound. It was a tank. Instead of the iron cross, he saw painted on its side a fivepointed white star. He ran to the tank. The hatch opened. An African American gi looked down at him. He got down on his knees and said the only three words that he knew in english that his mother taught him before the war. God bless america. Thats who we are. Thats what america represents to the world, however imperfectly. Now we have to proceed with equal measures of humility and confidence. Humility because, as the president elect said, we cant solve all of the worlds problems alone. We need to be working with other countries. We need their cooperation. We need their partnership. But also confidence because america at its best still has a greater ability than any other country on earth to bring others together to meet the challenges of our time. What a remarkable statement, especially coming after the last four years of angst, fear, and loathing, contempt for the rest of the world. In many respects, contempt for our democratic alliances and proud history of liberating, of freeing and feeding more people than any other country and the history of this world. But that line that was so moving after telling the story about his stepfather was only one of 900 children from this polish school to survive the holocaust. The little boy getting down on his knees and saying the only three words he knew, god bless america, and then tony following that up with this is who we are. It certainly is who we try to be. It certainly is who we should try to be. But what an extraordinary moment yesterday that really did show a changing of the guards. Right, and especially in terms of the juxtaposition of the opening segment with donald trump coming out and touting the dow and the listing of our debt and thinking about all of those long lines in dallas and miamidade county, folks if their cars trying to get food. What was so striking about yesterday for me is that we saw on full display a return of competence. A kind of return to seriousness. We might have our disagreements, but the idea is that we have some kind of stability and confidence in the folks who will be running the country, who in some ways will be presenting america to the world, and in doing so we would have in some ways the kind of stable parameters to have an argument about the direction of our democracy. And that to me was the takeaway from yesterday, right, that we saw the value of stability and competence and now we can have the confidence that we at least have the preconditions to address at least in a serious way, joe, the enormous challenges we face as a nation not only domestically, but also abroad. Still ahead, former secretary of state Madeleine Albright joins two of the best historians around. Michael beschloss and Doris Kearns Goodwin are part of our panel on the presidency from harry truman to today. But first, as he has throughout the runup to the election, Nbcs Tom Brokaw offered some commentary on the state of the nation. [announcer] welcome to intelligent indoor grilling with the ninja foodi smart xl grill. Just pick your protein, select your doneness, and let the grill monitor your food. It also turns into an air fryer. Bring outdoor grilling flavors indoors with the grill that grills for you. Still ahead, former secretary of state Madeleine Albright joins two of the best historians around. Michael beschloss and Doris Kearns Goodwin. All three are part of our panel on the presidency from harry truman to today. But first, as he has throughout the runup to the election, Nbcs Tom Brokaw offered some commentary of the state of the nation. Im tom brokaw, and like so many families, we were looking forward to a joyful thanksgiving reunion but then reality set in and we realized we cannot do that. So maybe we can all get together on zoom. In the meantime, i am in montana which has a spike in covid despite mandatory masks. North dakota and iowa recently have gone mandatory masks as well for the same reason despite earlier resistance from their governors. But in my home state of south dakota, governor christie nome refuses to wear a mask or to recommend them even though covid is rising fast in her state. Earlier, she cheered on the giant stirjis motorcycle rally which became a petri dish for covid. However, noem remains so popular that nurses say a lot of people arrive at the hospital with covid but because they have been listening to the governor they dont think they are in grave danger until they become very sick. South dakota was different. In the early 1918 killer flu epidemic, a republican governor sat down the entire state, including the Business Districts of the two largest cities, and he is credited with saving many lives. Governor noem refuses to get so involved. She is counting on an early delivery of the vaccine, but thats many weeks off. Meanwhile, covid is a scourge in south dakota for the small towns, for the farms, for the ranches, for the larger cities as well, for the educational institutions. Worse than any tornado or any blizzard that ever hit that state, and they have had some deadly ones in their long history rit. So we can only hope that the vaccine arrives sooner rather than later and that there will be better days ahead. In the meantime, i know this is a difficult thanksgiving, but join hands and remind each other were all in this together. I am tom brokaw. Commentary from Nbcs Tom Brokaw. Up next, former secretary of state Madeleine Albright reacts to president elect joe bidens cabinet picks. Morning joe is back in a moment. Orning joe is back in a moment eep. Amber crood, think you could spend your tomorrow with me . [ gasps ] i do. Eep would never leave us. Come on man. Just chill. No, you come on man [ gasps ] change isnt the end of the world. The pack is stronger together. Thats my girl. Boom boomzies . Boomzies. Dun, dun ,dun . We made usaa insurance for veterans like martin. When a hailstorm hit, he needed his insurance to get it done right, right away. Usaa. What youre made of, were made for. Usaa less oral steroids. Taking my treatment at home. Nucala is a oncemonthly addon injection for severe eosinophilic asthma. Not for sudden breathing problems. Allergic reactions can occur. Get help right away for swelling of face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing. Infections that can cause shingles have occurred. Dont stop steroids unless told by your doctor. Tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. May cause headache, injection site reactions, back pain, and fatigue. Ask your doctor about nucala at home. Find your nunormal with nucala. And now your copilot. Still a father. But now a friend. Still an electric car. Just more electrifying. Still a night out. But everything fits in. Still hard work. Just a little easier. Still a legend. Just more legendary. Chevrolet. Making lifes journey, just better. Thats a little bit of a song from 1974 about harry truman by chicago. It came, by the way, mika, came from chicago 8, by the way, if you were asked. I know you probably were. But it came after the resignation of richard nixon. It was a pretty big hit. Yeah, as a tribute to a straighttalking president , people could trust. And given the current state of the white house and the country, it might feel to some a bit like 1974. All week weve been discussing joes new book saving freedom truman, the cold war, and the fight for western civilization. And joining us now author and nbc news president ial historian Michael Beschloss. Pulitzer prizewinning author and president ial historian Doris Kearns Goodwin and former secretary of state Madeleine Albright. They are joining us this morning. What an honor to have an incredible panel. Secretary albright with us this morning. So great. And secretary albright, i just wanted to get your thoughts as i heard tony blinken yesterday talking about his stepfather escaping the holocaust and falling to his knees in front of an american tank, an African American soldier coming out of it, and tony said he said, god bless america, the only three words he knew. And i thought about you and your family escaping hitlers grasp. I thought about dr. Brzezinski. I thought about mrs. Brzezinski. I know it would have been such a moving moment for your dear friend. I am curious what your thoughts were yesterday as you saw tony repeat that remarkable story. Well, i was deeply moved because tonys story and his familys story is so remarkable and it makes him appreciate even more the incredible job that he is about to step into. My thoughts were, how grateful i am to america because we came in november 1948, and harry truman was my First American president. And i also still remember being a little girl in london all during world war ii, and when the americans came, what a difference it was to see the yanks walking through london and knowing what had happened in terms of america helping to save europe from the horrors of fascism. Could you talk about what this moment means to you, seeing america once again getting engaged on the world stage . When you were secretary of state and throughout your entire life, you have been such a champion, just like dr. Brzezinski was. You were such a champion for the promotion of American Values across the globe, and standing up to autocrats, standing up to tyrants, believing that america was the indispensable power. What does it mean for us to be back to where we have been since 1947 . I think it is so important, joe and mika, because we know what a difference it makes when america is not just present, but partners with other countries who have similar values in order to make the world a better place for all those people who want to live in freedom. And so it means an incredible amount to see that we are back and that we are back with a team of people that truly understand what americas position in the world needs to be. We have been awol, and its been terrible. And we need to restore our standing and our reputation and understanding what america means in terms of values and working with others. So i am very hopeful for this administration. They have a very difficult job ahead of them because the last four years have been a disaster and it means rebuilding in a very different kind of situation, but i think they are a Terrific Team being led by president elect biden whom i know very well and has a very much disposed way of dealing with people as partners and listening and not bossing everybody around. And Doris Kearns Goodwin, as we speak with hope about the Incoming Administration, it is so important to remind our viewers that the words that we heard yesterday could have come from the lips of a secretary of state who worked for any republican or Democratic Administration between harry truman and barack obama. But you just look, one of the things that was so inspiring about Harry Trumans leadership in the cold war is that he built an architecture, sort of this international construct that every president that followed him through Ronald Reagan and george h. W. Bush, they followed and there was this seamless passing of the torch between one administration to another, between one group of diplomats to another group of diplomats who understood what americas role was in the world. And we are actually, it seems that we are once again reconnecting with that proud heritage. You know, it also seemed that we are once again reconnecting with a team thats going to be strong minded people who are willing to speak their mind, question assumptions and argue. And thats whats so great about the harry truman team, as you portray in your book. General marshall, when he was a young general he was in fdrs office and fdr is presenting a pet project and everyone is going along. He says to marshall, you are not nodding your head . He said i dont agree with you at all, mr. President. Everybody thought, uhoh, here is the end of your career. He lifts him up 25 notches to become the chief of staff. Thats what he wanted. I think thats what we saw in bidens team yesterday. Its what we saw in Harry Trumans team. I want to ask you, joe, what fun it must have been to live with this man. I choose the people i want to write about because i want to live with them. Harry truman, god, i would love to live with him. I went to his house not long ago. He was sitting reading, he was always reading. Who cares if he went to college because he was a always reading. Somebody knocks on the door, needs help, his car is broken down. He liets him in to use the phone. As he is leaving he said its amazing you look like that s. O. B. Harry truman. What does truman say . I am it that s. O. B. Harry truman. Thats what you need a guy with a selfdeprecating humor. You talk, rightly, about how many misestimated him to errors to truman, right . Where did he get his confidence from . That is the mystery and the most key i think to a leader. What do you think . Well, there was an understanding in Harry Trumans mind of what was right and what was wrong. I was talking to Claire Mccaskill a few days ago. He had had this inner confidence that if you look at the failures of his early life, look at the fact that his father was a failed businessman, that he came back from the war a failed businessman in his 30s, not knowing what he was going to do, constantly derided by all those around him. There is no reason why this man should have been as confident as he was, but he had a really strong sense of self. And when he came to washington, he was mocked and derided by the New York Times as a rube, and youre right. Regardless of whatever attacks came his way, he did what he believed was right and as claire mchas said, he always said he slept best after a tough decision and a controversial decision that he knew was right. And one of the things that i loved about trumans leadership was he surrounded himself with the best and brightest. The thing i love about the George Marshall story when fdr said you agree with me, dont you, george . Marshall said, no, mr. President , i dont agree with you at all. That, yes, fdr elevated him after that, but never called him by his first name again. He was always general after that. But i think it speaks oh, youre right. Yeah. I think it speaks to fdrs leadership that he would promote a man who crossed him in front of so many others, but also harry truman, who had marshall and who had acheson and who had kennon and who had avril harimann, the best and the brightest, and he would defer to them. He would ask their opinion. They would give it. He would defer fairly quickly it to them. Sometimes on issues like israel, George Marshall, who he respected more than anybody else in washington, d. C. , marshall disagreed with him strongly about recognizing israel as a state. In fact, marshall went home at night after he knew that truman was going to move forward with the recognition of israel in 1948 and said, if i voted, and marshall didnt believe he should vote because he was in the military, if i voted for president and truman ran again, i might vote against him. That talked about how strongly he disagreed. Truman kept his head down, did what he believed was the right thing to do, and carried forward with the recognition of israel. And you know, joe, lbj used to tell me he envied trumans decisionmaking ability. He would make a decision and go to sleep at night without walking the carpet. You listen to people. You heard their points of view. But you are the one, you have to take responsibility. He was take to take a responsibility. Lbj, my god, i wish i had been able to do that. Thats a very great quality that old harry had. Sometimes we call him old harry just because you feel intimate towards him. Of course. What an incredible story. We remember the story, Michael Beschloss, the morning after the 1948 election where somebody gives him a copy that he holds up that says dewey defeats truman, but we dont hear as much about what truman did the night before along to doris point. Harry truman was being told by all of the experts, by all of the pundits that he had lost the race, that dewey was going to win. What did harry truman do . He got a sandwich, poured him a glass of milk, had his sandwich, drank his milk, went to sleep. And when he woke up they were like, mr. President , you won. And he had just pulled off the greatest upset in the history of american politics, but as doris said, the guy went to sleep thinking, you know what . I did my best. If i win, i win, if i lose, i lose. Thats an incredible quality for any president to have. It is, joe. And i love the book. Thank you, its a grift right now. We are watching freedom being saved for our eyes right now. So this could not be a better moment for you to give us this great gift. And, yeah, another thing that truman had was, forgive me for saying this, i dont think doris will disagree, he a sense of history. Never had a college education. Family couldnt afford it. Truman was probably better read in president ial history than almost any other president. Truman used to say he couldnt imagine how anyone could be president of the United States without being interested in history. Can you imagine if he came back during the trump years and saw a president who could care less . Truman said, not every reader will be a leader, but every leader has to be a reader. And he said, you know, this is my paraphrasing, i dont know how i could have gone through things like the threat of the soviets in 1947 or what to do about at only bomb or firing mccarter if i had not read books and histories that dealt with general jackson, abraham lynnen. His Favorite Book was a gift from his mother, published in 1895, it was called i apologize for this title, great men and famous women. 1895. The author thought only women could be famous, not great. And the subtitle was neb can henezzer to burn heart. It covered a wide swath of human decisions. He said i would think back to what lincoln or jackson or others did, and it was never an exact parallel, but it would give me an idea how to operate as president when i had to make tough decisions with fragmentary information, sometimes ten Big Decisions at once, sometimes i was tired. He said the only users manual youve got is to know what worked in history. Joes book is about shaping a new world after world war ii. Thats what truman started. In some ways, as you pointed to earlier, joe bidens job now is to restore that world. So as someone who has been secretary of state, who has been in all of those rooms with all of those World Leaders and krois cross crisscrossed the globe, where do you begin day one in terms of strengthening alliances again and showing americas commitment to the world . How do you start . I really do think we begin by understanding that we have to dig out of a time when we didnt respect our allies and friends, and i think that its going to be very important to deliver the right messages that we want to work with them on solving the problems of the 21st century world and to really look at what Public Service is about and how we are going to work with everybody, and i think that message is going to be delivered, and it is going to be delivered by making also Foreign Policy less foreign by focusing on the covid tragedies that have gone on and then working on issues together on making the world healthier and the Climate Change and understanding that we operate within a very different world. And i think harry truman did understand. By the way, im very proud of the fact that we renamed the state Department Building the harry s. Truman building in order to recognize what he had done. And so all those people will be operating out of a building in honor of harry truman, and following some of the things that he did in terms of establishing the things you write about, joe, in terms of how the truman doctrine came together, the establishment of nato, understanding that we have to operate with other countries as partners. And i think i was very proud, frankly, that i was able to do the first succession to nato at the Truman Library signing on a desk of Harry Trumans because so much of what he did is something that has to be revived in terms of how one treats ones allies and friends and tells it like it is and develops functioning relationships abroad, but also respects the people who work for him. And filling that building at the pentagon and the white house and all, all of them to Michael Beschlosss point, we will have Doris Kearns Goodwin, great men and great women, because joe biden is certainly not afraid of putting people around him who challenge him, people from different points of view, and different experiences. Exactly. Thats what you want. You want to bring a different set of understandings of the world, different perspective. One of the things that Teddy Roosevelt would are eid about is democracy would be threatened if people began reviewing each other, thinking of each other as the other. So the more you have people around you who bring different experiences right within you, just like lincoln did, it wasnt just his team of rivals. People had different factiones in the north, some radical, some moderate, some conservative and you fight within there and become a family team when you project yourself on the outside world and you know that the president is getting the best advice. Its a very comforting thing. Its never the leader alone. That combination of humility and confidence matters. Humility to understand you may make mistakes, but confidence to know when you make the discussion you have will listened to the people and you are making the best decision in the least possible time you can make it. Its exciting. Its exciting to see a new world order forming and to go back to old harry truman and see that old order that was built up step by step as you describe in the book. Doris, can you explain, try to help me explain, to help me understand something. So, harry truman graduated from spaulding Commercial College in kansas city, and he went on to be, i think, the most significant Foreign Policy leader on the world stage in the postwar era. Joe biden, of course, was offended with the suggestion that only Ivy League Grads should be president of the United States throughout the campaign and he talked about that. Hes going to be the first nonivy League President since Ronald Reagan, who, of course, went to Eureka College and knew his way around the global stage as well. And the domestic stage. But lbj, a man obviously that you knew a great deal about, and wrote eloquently about. Another man who wasnt a harvard or a yale man. He went to southwest texas teachers college. Can you have you thought what it was about these men with modest educations, what it was about them that made them so much more effective with lbj it was working congress. Same thing with harry truman and Ronald Reagan. What was it about these men with modest educations . Modest educations that were so effective, and those three gentlemen probably three of the most effective president s of the last 75 years. Its a great question, joe. I mean, i think in some ways you take lincoln and then take harry truman. Never having had that college education, they were lifelong learners, which meant theyre reading, thinking, learning the entire time. Not as if the clock strikes 12 00 when you graduate a place lie harvard or yale. With lbj, his father said youll brush up against the grindstone of life and thats more important than any college experience. Lbj learned from people. In congressmen to his Senate Building and then to the mansion night after night after night. Theyd have dinner with him. Hed learn from them, listen to them. The answer is you dont think youre suddenly educatesed because you went to an ivy legal school. Im going to keep doing this and those people will catch way up. Teddy roosevelt was reading Abraham Lincoln in the middle of the coal strike, just as you said before, he wanted to know how did lincoln handle a difficult situation . This is for michael, too, from history. You learn from your parents and grandparents. Why would you not learn from the other president s who went through try uiumph through trag and situations like your own. Lifelong learning is the most important thing. Youve chosen a great guy to write about. I would have loved to live hi women for a period of years. Would have been fun. So youve done it for me. Yes, he has. Michael beschloss, to bring things up to current day, where are we right now . Its a huge question, but you look at the sort of continuum of history, the countrys so rattled, turned upsidedown in many ways under donald trump. How do we stabilize again . Too much to ask one man, president elect biden to do that . Willie, as you know, weve got a system that very much depends on president ial leadership. Look at everything thats happened in the last four years just because of the deficiencies and foibles of one person, donald trump. You know, life would have been different during the last four years had it been otherwise. So president ial leadership helps, but im of the view that we have just been through a terribly close call. We are being untied from the railroad tracks. Donald trump had been reelected i think talking this morning about the danger that next year, we wont be living in something that resembles a democracy that we recognize. And our children would be in danger. Newspapers might be in jeopardy of being closed down and a president surrounded by even more yes men than before living in a world of greater and greater delusion. Dangerous for all of us. In a position not only is joe biden delivering us from four years of donald trump, but this is someone who has 50 years of experience, you know, in working in democracy. It all comes naturally to him. He knowing all of those people we saw on the stage yesterday. He loves to see them play with one another. He knows that the founders wanted advisers or members of congress to fight with one another because they knew the result is the best policies. Thats the way you do it. Not to be surrounded by yes people. All right. This is great conversation. Former secretary of state Madeleine Albright and president ial historians Michael Beschloss and doris kearns good goodwin. Thank you. Happy thanksgiving and stay safe. Again, the book saving Truman Truman the cold war and the fight for western civilization and a nice book review in the New York Times. Why harry truman matters today. Good job, joe, and joes book tour continues today. He and i will be on the view, and hes got great Virtual Events coming up as well. You could be involved. Get tickets for all of them at our website, joe. Msnbc. Com for all the information there. And up next giving thanks. Were back in a moment. Our adversaries arent waiting. The coronavirus isnt waiting. The economy isnt waiting. America shouldnt have to wait, either. The American People have spoken. The result is clear. Its time to move forward. And get to work. Mola smo all right. Before we go today, i just wanted to mention a member of our family katty kay lost her mother over the past week. She tweeted, my mum, the indomitable shirley kay died friday. Curious and generous to the end and in this difficult time we were fortunate that she died at home Holding Hands with her husband of 64 years, and that picture was taken just a week ago. And we talked on text and she said her mom was a code breaker, an arabist, archeologist and author and lived a full life and couldnt have gotten through this without tom, who was there every step of the way. So our best to katty and tom, your entire family. We you love you. Alsos member of our extended feel, aaliyah and husband josh and baby daughter billie born just five weeks ago. Theyve been through quite you thought 2020 was bad. These five weeks have been tough. Billie is fine. Aaliyah had to have exploratory surgery at sloankettering up in new york. Our thanks to Rachel Campbell for getting her through all of that. Theyre back home finally, and just been a tough time and we wanted to give thanks to those two, three now, very special people in our extended scarborough family. Oh, there is aaliyah right there and the baby, and i was with them, what . Two days, one day after she was were born. Thats little billie. Thankful for them and for so many other people. Thankful for all of you for waging. It means the world to us and willie, also so thankful for everybody. By the way, also, sloankettering and also the mark hotel jennifer got them through this. Thank them as well. And willie, our team makes us actually, makes you and me, actually, not look any dumber than, well, i look, anyway. True, yeah. And so grateful to them for all they do. This is what they look like on our zoom meetings. Were just so honored and blessed to be able to be on their team. We are. Its three hours of tv every single morning. Its three hours of live tv and that hasnt changed despite the fact we cant gather and be in the same place and the fact that our Incredible Team gets together most of them get up at about midnight every day to put on this show and theyve been doing it from their homes and somehow making it work. Were just the end product of all of that work that you see every day. So i want to give our big thanks to our staff and, of course, as we know, the situations getting dire again in hospitals sending our love and our big thanks to doctors, nurses, medical professionals, first responders, driving those ambulances. They are carrying the country right now and were so grateful. Yeah. Its really very well said. We thank you all. Please, have a happy and safe possibly socially distanced thanksgiving. That does it for us this morning. Chris jansing picks up the coverage right now. Hello there. I am Chris Jansing in for stephanie ruhle. It is wednesday november 25th. Whats happened. Today president elect biden set to give a thanksgiving address that his aides say will focus on skyrocketing covid cases and the shared sacrifices americans are making dur ting t holidays. After the Trump Administration finally approved the formal transition, learning from dr. Fauci hes been in contact with incoming biden chief of staff ron klain. The president elect could also get his first president ial Daily Briefing as soon as today, and in that nbc news be exclusive with lester holt, he says team trump has been cooperating with the transition so far