Transcripts For MSNBCW Morning Joe 20201110

Back that up, i cant in good countenance continue showing you this. Fox news abruptly cutting away from Kayleigh Mcenanys News Conference yesterday when she tried to make explosive Election Fraud claims backed by no evidence, none at all. Yeah. You know, willie, remember the morning after the election we were telling everybody to take a deep breath. I think its time to do that again, like a week later, because i was i was we sort we dont watch a lot of cable news or any news after we get off the show in the morning. I think three hours is gracious, plenty for anybody. But i was walking through the living room and i saw Mitch Mcconnell. I thought oh, my lord, im going to be getting texts. And without turning up the sound i knew what he was going to do. He was going to do just like he tweeted, we have a right to count all the votes and then present any legal challenges that we have. And so i knew he was going to say that. Then i knew hed Say Something like, the democrats smell so bad, they got horse flies around their faces. He didnt say that. He didnt say that exactly but i knew hed provoke the press. He would provoke the democrats and i would be getting texts throughout the day. So its really important Everybody Needs to take a deep breath because you can put what youre hearing in two buckets. The first bucket is what youre hearing from most except in georgia, where youre hearing it from most republicans. Elected leaders and most are saying the same thing. Lindsey graham, Mitch Mcconnell, others who are provoking a lot of people. One, theyre saying the president has a right to count all the votes. You know what . You can say that about every election thats ever been held in American History and, two, the president has a right to present any legal challenges that he may have to the counting of those votes. Thats been said. You can say that about any election thats ever been. So thats what most republican elected officials are saying. And is it irritating that at the same time theyre declaring victory yes, its irritating. But theyre stating what is obvious. Then youve got the trump propagandists who are lying and cheating not cheating but lying and talking about cheating and Holding Press Conferences at lawn care centers outside of sex shops and also in the white house. Also in the white house. Guess what, theyre lying and that will be sorted out by the courts. There was a judge in michigan yesterday who heard one of the challenges that said, hey, you know what, you havent presented several things including any evidence of wrongdoing. You know, i was there for 5 for 38 days in florida in the recounts. I was there every day. And what we were doing as republicans, we were looking at votes. 537 votes. So if 14 votes changed in a county, that was really significant because theres 67 counties in florida. So it really was that recount was chaotic, but were talking about dozens of votes here and there. This morning, joe biden is ahead by 14,000 votes in georgia. Hes ahead by 45,000 votes in pennsylvania. More than donald trump beat Hillary Clinton by four years ago. Hes ahead by, i dont know, 17,000, 18,000 votes in arizona. Hes easily gotten his 270. There are no Court Challenges that are going to change that outcome. And Everybody Knows it. Now, its disturbing whats happening in georgia but that should be more disturbing to georgia republicans, because the fate of the United States senate and the entire government of the United States of america rests on those two seats and the two people running are i think stand apart as being extraordinarily reckless. Saying things that are total lies and theyre attacking, wait for it, wait for it, a fellow republican. Yep. Who laughed at the attacks and said theyre just theyre mad because trump lost and theyre afraid theyre going to lose their seats too. Its so important to remember, the rules of all of these elections were put together by republicans in wisconsin, in michigan, in pennsylvania, in georgia, in florida, in texas and in arizona. Every swing state republican legislatures put together the rules. And theyre being run in georgia, in arizona, in philadelphia, by republicans. So im just saying i know its maddening. I know we want this to all be over. But its obvious where this is going to end. No, donald trump is not going to steal any elections. Hes throwing a tantrum right now and republicans are trying to give him space. Should they give him space, no, they should put their ycountry ahead of the party, and theyre not going to do it. The courts will do it. The law firms like jones day should be ashamed of themselves if they continue this charade. Several law firms that have respected clients, but anybody that carries out this facade and does it for money when they know there are no unless they have a legitimate challenge. If they have legitimate challenges bring it up. But if youre acting for a shield for a president trying to undermine democracy and our elections, its time to slowly step away and tell the president goodbye. I was getting the same texts you were yesterday, joe, which i wouldnt call them panicked. I would say the concern was a little elevated. Is this really happening was the theme. Are we going to lose this thing . Joe biden remains the president elect of the United States. He just is. Theres a lot of noise out there. Theres a lot going on. As you say, the courts already have held up so theyll continue to hold up in the face of the challenges because theres not evidence being put forward. Even for the two georgian senators who asked the secretary of state to step down, he said im not stepping down thats a fantasy, didnt provide any evidence. They threw it out into the atmosphere and the argument as kasie hunt will tell us in a minute when she joins us is that Mitch Mcconnell is so focused on the two senate seats he is trying to fire up the base so he can keep the majority in the senate. Well, at what cost is he doing that . Hes firing up the base to hold on two seats at the cost of creating the confusion and the doubt about the electoral process. The margins are so much bigger this time than in 2000 when it was 537 votes. It is not comparable, but there are a lot of republicans, there is an attorney general, who are indulging this tantrum. I dont think three of us or any parent watching this show would allow the tantrum to go on like this or allow the toddler to scream at the top of their lungs and say, what more can i get for you . Its the way that Mitch Mcconnell is doing it, its the way that some republican senators are doing it. Its the way the gsa, the office that ensures a smooth transition is handling it. Its the way that President Trump is handling it by firing the secretary of defense. Its on us to stay focused and know the truth and tell the truth about whats happening in a fair electoral process as republican secretary of states and electoral boards have told us again and again and again, there is nothing shady here. In fact, this was a smooth election that joe biden won. The sound and fury signifying nothing. The only thing i will say, yes, Mitch Mcconnell will whatever he has to do to remain the majority in the United States senate but right now what hes seeing in the state of georgia where democrats and independents are going to be united to actually put democrats in charge of the senate, and to run Mitch Mcconnell out of the majority speaker majority leaders office, what hes allowing to happen right now is a civil war. Happening in georgia. The people of georgia elected the republican secretary of state and they know him very well. And, you know, hes run a Fair Election. Yeah. And its obvious because the there were no specific charges against him at all. It has been a clean race. And what so lets say, for instance, this republican civil war where republicans are attacking republicans, which is just so idiotic. Lets say it peels off 5 of the vote. Well, youve got senator ossoff if thats the case. Lets say it peels off a little more than that. Well, maybe. Just maybe you have democrats in charge of the United States senate. It sure seemed like a long like a long shot on election day when we found out about these runoffs. But if the republicans are going to be fighting republicans in the state of georgia leading up to this election, then suddenly anything is possible including Mitch Mcconnell losing the majority. Yeah. And joe, you mentioned jones day. Thats not the only, you know, law firm thats dealing with these things. But some of the senior lawyers there are expressing concerns. Theyre pretty embarrassed actually that their firm they have taken on a lot of controversial cases. Theres a piece in the New York Times that reached out to these law firms. Theres another one Porter Wright Morrison Arthur one lawyer has quit in protest. Theyre so embarrassed. Even the firms that have such an incredible reputation and law firms, you know, often, you know, relish taking on controversial clients and really exploring the limits of the law to make sure that due process is there, theyre looking at this and just saying, please, are you kidding me . Youre going to take this . Whats happening now is this is what totalitarian regimes do and stay with me. Take a deep breath and stay with me. Your hair is not on fire. What totalitarian regimes do, they the side what the legal result wants to be. Then they work back from that and try to find evidence. Try to make up evidence to lead to that conclusion. Thats the phone line, you know what i mean . So thats whats happening here. So again, let me say it again. Every republican, every democrat, every person that runs for office has the right as Mitch Mcconnell said to have all the votes counted and to present my legal challenges they may have. But here we are, six days into this. And theres not been one credible claim put forward by one republican. You have Rudy Giuliani in front of sex shops and lawn scape places, just blabbering, talking generalities. You have generalities coming from the white house. Again, Nothing Specific at all. Its really embarrassing. The few people that make up specific things, i wont even say their names because they dont deserve to have their names mentioned on this show, they present no evidence of it. Its all just allegations and theyre just looking again, theyve got their conclusion and now theyre desperately searching for any evidence that will lead to that conclusion and its not there. So the only thing i would say to law firms, the only thing i would say to elected officials is if you have the evidence, bring it forward. If you dont have the evidence, stand down and let this country move forward. Yeah. Youre only hurting yourself. Youre not hurting joe biden for gods sake. Theyre choosing a cabinet right now in delaware. Youre not hurting them, youre hurting yourself. The only kind of freakout area is here i mean, this is dead serious that we just the country does not need more of this. It needs less of this. We do need to do some better at some point and let me finish. Not following transition traditions is bad for the country. But we knew this was going to happen. Thats true. Theyre probably not even going to cooperate to the bitter end. No, theyre not. Trumps not. And if republicans dont, theyll ultimately pay the price. Lets not be shocked by what we knew was going to happen. Instead, look at the data. Yeah. Look at the votes. Let me say it again. Right now, donald trump is losing pennsylvania by more votes than Hillary Clinton lost it by. Donald trump is losing michigan by more votes by a good number of more votes than Hillary Clinton lost it by. Right now, joe biden is up by 14,000 votes. Over 14,000 votes in the state of georgia. Correct. Thats not going to be overturned by any recount. Wisconsin, scott walker said it, its not going to be overturned by any recount. What is concerning is the lack of respect for the transition and for example, the news were about to get to. The firing of mark esper and other things that could hurt the United States and the coronavirus, which again, is running rampant and this president is sitting here, you know, curled up in a chair trying to figure out how to win an election he lost. Well, listen, is it terrible that the Trump Administrations doing this . Is it terrible that donald trump himself tried to get his attorney general to arrest joe biden two weeks yes, it is. Is it terrible that donald trump spent four years saying that article 2 gave him yes, its terrible. Lets not be shocked. We knew this was going to happen. So lets call the republicans bluff. Go ahead. Take it to court. Youre gonna lose. Thats lets get to real news now, because again, thats all smoke. A lot of smoke. We have the host of way too early, kasie hunt. Associate editor from the Washington Post, david ignatius. In a moment well be talking to david about the president s move yesterday to fire the secretary of defense fired via twitter. While the nation is in transition what it means for National Security. This is where you look for concern about what is happening here. But first, the coronavirus and the United States reporting yet another record high for daily cases yesterday. According to an nbc news tally, there were nearly 134,000 new infections and the first its the first time that cases have crossed 130,000 in one day. And it marked the sixth day in a row that the u. S. Recorded more than 100,000 in a day. The country also reported 729 deaths yesterday. Willie . Meanwhile, the Donald Trump Administration is trying to take credit for pfizers success in vaccine trials and mike pence tweeted yesterday, claiming it was thanks to the Public Private partnership, but pfizer made clear they did not take money from the operation warp speed. Pfizer has agreed to sell the United States 100,000 doses and waiting until after the election to announce the vaccine news for political purposes. Here is reaction to that from dr. Anthony fauci. What the company will be doing, its putting in soon within the next week and a half or so, for an emergency use authorization and for ultimate approval of the vaccine. If that goes along smoothly that we may have doses that were able to give to people by the end of november, the beginning of december. Probably well into december. Now, again, you have to go through the hoops of making sure all of the is are dotted and the ts are crossed, but we would be giving vaccine to people very likely before the end of the year. That is good news. Lets bring in dr. Vin gupta, a pulmonologist and nbc news medical contributor. Great to see you. So lets start with the headline, the big news about the pfizer vaccine. 90 successful at least in this trial. What are the implications of that and are you as optimistic as dr. Fauci is about the possibility of getting some doses it to the public before the end of the year . Good morning, willie. Great to see you. You know, i think just to clarify something for the American Public because i think its you know, again, disinformation is never helpful for trust, especially when it comes to the vaccine. Pfizer just published via a press release data one week after administration of a second dose of this vaccine. So they didnt even have the data before election day. Their enrollees received the first dose the day before the election day and the big criticism was wow, this is really early data on just 94 people. If you had to find a criticism here. So this notion theres any politics here, its wrong, its not true. And especially with vaccine and trust, we cant be talking like this. I want the naysayers out there to stop that. I will say, if this bears itself out this is exceptionally early data in a press release. If it bears itself out to be true over the long term, give it 28 days, end of this month, early december, and we still see efficacy of the vaccine in the high 70s, high 80 percentile range, this is along the lines of a measle vaccine, that would be great. We know we have a pathway to hopefully end this pandemic once theres broad distribution. That brings up the distribution. We know this requires a fridge that reaches minus 100 degrees fahrenheit and theres not enough of them across the country. And Anthony Fauci is talking about the high risk individuals, over 65 cohort and 20 million maybe by the end of the year. A long way to get to two for every american doses. The lead in the Washington Post frames where were at right now. Quote president elect joe biden sought to protect the authority of an incoming president monday as he dealt with matters domestic and international. Even as the defeated incumbent continued to balk at turning over the reins. One of bidens first courses of action was the announcement of his Coronavirus Task force. Biden addressed the nation from the headquarters in wilmington, explaining how to task force plans to deal with the pandemic. Theres a need for bold task to fight this pandemic. Were still facing a very dark winter. This group will advise on detailed plans, build on a bedrock of science. And to keep compassion, empathy and care for every american at its core. Making Rapid Testing widely available. More widely available, much more widely available. And building a core of contact tracers who will track and curb this disease while we prioritize getting vaccines first to the most at risk populations. The bottom line, i will spare no effort to turn this pandemic around once were sworn in on january 20th. To get our kids back to school safely, our businesses growing and our economy running at full speed again. And to get an approved vaccine manufactured and distributed as quickly as possible to as Many Americans to as Many Americans as possible, free of charge. Well follow the science. Well follow the science. Let me say that again. I wont be president until january 20th. But my message today is to everyone is this. It doesnt matter who you voted for. Whether you stood where you stood before election day. It doesnt matter your party, your point of view. We can save tens of thousands of lives if everyone would just wear a mask for the next few months. Not democrat or republican lives. American lives. So david ignatius, first, what did you think of president elect bidens remarks and secondly, what are your thoughts on the collective instant put forward by the president s response to the coronavirus or lack thereof and the firing of esper . Mika, i thought the president elects tone was reassuring as it has been since saturday. Each statement hes made has been i think trying to calm people, give them a sense of clarity about policy moving forward. Establishing his own Coronavirus Task force with firstrate people. And the idea that were going to is have science, clear policy, provision of the necessary protective gear, organizations so that states arent left on their own to compete for resources, i think all of that should be reassuring the public. I must say biden is lucky that two days into his president elect status, he has this announcement from pfizer should cheer everyone. If it holds up its extraordinary and we can begin to see a pathway to ending the pandemic. I think the one thing that gives me pause, i think you and joe are right to reassure viewers theres not a lot that donald trump really can do to upset the verdict of the public in this election, but the firing yesterday of mark esper was disturbing because it could simply be president ial pique. It could be trump trying to get the headlines again for a day and showing how mad he is. But it could be something more substantive and let me note two of the things i heard people at the pentagon talking about yesterday. First, its possible that the new acting secretary of defense, Christopher Miller, not experienced in this area, coming over from the National Counterterrorism center is coming with guidance from the white house to accelerate the withdrawal of american troops from afghanistan, from iraq and from syria. And that accelerated withdrawal would be against the military advice that trump has been getting from general mark milley, his chairman of the joint chiefs of staff, all of the commanders are concerned and want to make sure that withdrawals are conditions based. Thats the first thing to be concerned about. Is he coming with that agenda . Second key point, the reason that mark esper got on the bad side of donald trump, he had been a pretty cooperative secretary of defense. He came in after jim mattis who was much more friendly to the white house. The reason he got in trouble was when President Trump back in june wanted to use the insurrection act to call out active duty military to help suppress the demonstrations across the country. They accompanied President Trump in Lafayette Park where he held up that bible. Secretary esper said its not appropriate to use the active military to do this and since that day in june, esper really has been a marked man. And has been telling people that he felt he was on a short leash with the white house. This was a shock to esper and to everybody else at the senior level at the pentagon yesterday. They did not see it coming. So well have to see. I like to take the hopeful view, this is all Going Forward the but this is a wild card. Were going to come back to mark esper in a moment. We have nbc news reporting about how that happened, more in a second. Dr. Gupta, i want to go back to you. The nbc news tally showed yesterday nearly 134,000 new cases of covid19 in this country yesterday. Thats a new daily record. We seem to be setting a new record every day. So as we plunge farther toward thanksgiving and then into the holidays and winter is ahead of us, we played the remarks from joe biden yesterday. He said theres a dark winter ahead, what is your assessment of where we are and where were headed here. You know, willie, the biggest concern here is every model has been correct. The university of washingtons model has estimated about 22,000 deaths at the start of the calendar, because of the colder, drier air and the realities across icus across the country but particularly in south dakota, utah, where theyre having Surge Capacity issues. So this is going to play itself out like it as in the last nine months and the models will be correct. We have the president we have for the next 72 days. This president because of the lack of engagement on transition, thats having devastating consequences for pandemic response. Let me just say hhs for example is not sharing data, has not been sharing data on hospital level capacity locally or regionally. So one hospital in one part of the town doesnt know whats happening with the hospital on the other end of the town that matters when youre trying to figure out where a patient should go for resource allocation. We dont understand what theyre doing when it comes to therapeutics. Why theyre clearing remdesivir and plasma doesnt pan out. What about aligning on messaging for the nation when it comes to thanksgiving travel, especially all of the student out there that are on campuses that want to go home and see mom and dad. We need a strategy in place, guidance for these College Campuses about whether they should be doing that or not. Because some people feel strongly that they should be staying in place. But without any sort of engagement with the transition, we just we dont have a unified response. And thats going to be dangerous. Kasie, thats a concern shared by a lot of Public Health officials and yes, joe biden has been elected. Hes the president elect, he did put forth a team yesterday that was very impressive, but hes not in office for more than two months and this is exactly the time when experts expect this to accelerate and we are already seeing that with new records every day. Yeah. This period of time could be unfortunately our most challenging yet in time when we need our Public Health apparatus to be at its absolute strongest. I mean, thats my question for you, dr. Gupta. The cdc in particular i mean, there have been so many questions raised over the last year about the role theyre playing. I mean, they always had been the world leader, frankly, in Public Health. What do you think needs to happen there in the course of this transition and what are the impacts if the trump team doesnt let the biden team start to focus in the way on that in the way they should be allowed to in the transition period . You know, kasie, the from my colleagues at the cdc, there are exceptional career scientist there is who continue to do their work. Theyre demoralized. So my expectation is that once we get new clinical appointees into the cdc, morale will improve, especially if its a bipartisan approach which by every indication thats what president elect biden will be doing across the agencies including health. I think things will improve, public trust will improve. So that will absolutely change. But i mean, kasie, to your point, without engagement or without understanding, without ascertainment and then the gsa allowing Agency Landing teams to see what was the rationale behind clearing remdesivir, for example, why do that when the w. H. O. Just published a large trial saying it doesnt do anything in terms of mortality or getting people out of the hospital more quickly do we need we need to understand that and the transition folks needs to understand the decision and the devil is in the details. Thank you, vin gupta. Back now to the firing offense of defense secretary esper. Lets bring in courtney kube. Esper had seen the writing on the wall since the pentagon chief and President Trump have been at odds over several issues, but explain to us what next comes next. Yeah, its a great question, mika. One of the things that were looking at we know that the president has wanted to fire not just mark esper, but other top officials on his National Security team. Gina haspel is seen as somebody who the president can fire in the coming days. Christopher wray, the fbi director is another person that the president has told his aides he wanted to fire and one of the things that we were looking at after we reported last week that esper had crafted this Resignation Letter is whether or not the president would make the move in the uncertain time. At the time, the Election Results were not clear, then they became clear but the president is still not conceding. Mark esper thought he was safe during that time. He did not expect this. He got a brief heads up right before the president s tweet yesterday at 12 54 in the afternoon. Now the president has shown hes willing to take these steps and that he could fire anyone he wants to in the next nine weeks. The question is why, what his intentions are and theres a number of concerns being raised among officials in the pentagon about whether the president is doing this just out of spite because hes long had tensions with esper. Hes been frustrated with him on a number of issues and one of the things that the president learned from our reporting over the last week was that mark esper was trying to take steps to work with congress as one of the final acts before he left to change the names of military bases that were named after confederate generals. This is something that he disagreed with the president on. So he was trying to do that and now the question is, is the president doing this because he wanted to get rid of him or because hes doing this because he has policies he wants to enact in the coming days and weeks that maybe esper would have stood in the way of and now he has an acting pentagon chief he might be able to get those things moved more quickly. Specifically on troop withdrawals in afghanistan and in iraq and then you have this issue of the president threatening in the past to invoke the insurrection act, is that something seen as necessary in the coming weeks that the new acting director would not push back on, whereas esper did. The red line with mark esper he wanted to help change the name of the names of the military bases changed from the confederate generals thats where he holds the line. You started to answer the question, about why, if hes look for a yes man what does he want that man to say yes to. So who is Christopher Miller . Does he strike you, does he strike people in the National Security circles as someone who might be a yes man for donald trump . Look, you hear hes someone who worked hes head of the National Counterterrorism center. He worked at the nsc doing counterterrorism issues. Prior to that hes a former special forces officer in the army so hes somebody people respect. The problem or the concern that people have is not so much whether he would stand up to the president just given his background, but that hes put in this position as acting secretary with just weeks to go and he doesnt really have the clout. So the question is whether even if he wanted to push back on things and his character might encourage him to push back on things, that given the position that hes in at this point in time that hes not necessarily equipped or set up to push back on things that the president would want. Most people e tketo think that he would not initiate follow through with anything thats illegal, but its not illegal for the president to say he wants all troops out of afghanistan or iraq and those are things people are concerned. Nbcs carol lee, thank you. Still ahead on morning joe, despite scant evidence attorney general bill barr authorizing an investigation into voting irregularities and the dojs top investigate is quitting in protest. Cnbcs Brian Sullivan will weigh in on wall street. Youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. Ht back. We are hoping things will pick up by q3. Yeah. Uh. Doug . [ding] never settle with power e trade. It has easytouse tools and some of the lowest prices. Dont get mad. Get e trade and start trading today. Inflammation in your eye might be to blame. Ck, looks like a great day for achy, burning eyes overthecounter eye drops typically work by lubricating your eyes and may provide temporary relief. Ha these drops probably wont touch me. 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Come into your local xfinity store to make the most of your mobile experience. You can shop the latest phones, bring your own device, or trade in for extra savings. Thats simple, easy, awesome. Visit your local xfinity store today to ask, shop, discover the latest on xfinity mobile. Welcome back to morning joe. Beautiful live picture looking downtown from the top of our building here at rockefeller center. Wall street saw a major surge yesterday as markets reacted to pfizers promising Covid Vaccine results and the news of a president elect biden. The Dow Jones Industrial endedty day up more than 830 points. The s p got the second highest close ever. Travel stocks soared on the news of a vaccine with american airlines, delta and united all jumping over 15 while carnival, norwegian and Royal Caribbean rose over 25 . The nasdaq composite, however, did lose some ground as investors began to drop popular athome options for stocks. Such as zoom and netflix. For more, lets bring in cnbcs Brian Sullivan. How are the markets looking today and walk us through what exactly happened yesterday despite those markets. Willie, good to be what didnt happen yesterday . All right. I joke, we by the way, we had emergency authorization of the fda for eli lillys treatment, you have the vaccine which you wont get it, the treatment means if you get it youll get better. You had the firing of esper. November 9, 2020 is going to have a large this day in history entry. That said, the markets soared yesterday, most of the markets, not all. Up 830 points and you had a lot of things that are occurring. The vaccines are wonderful. This isnt going to solve the problems and im not going tock walking the halls and giving you a hug like id like to, but we are getting out of it and plus you have the biden win. The markets want two things. They want the outcome to be what they thought it would be and they want stability and i think that we got both of those things yesterday. So, brian, how much of this what we have seen over the last couple of days is about a president elect biden . He represents to the markets more stability than perhaps President Trump. Does the market like the idea of President Joe Biden . For the most part, look at jpmorgan, goldman sachs, basically they want to know what theyre going to get. Thats the key to the stock market understanding what the economy will do and what a president elect joe biden likely means is not midnight tweets that may be changing policies or announcing firings out of the blue. Wall streets, economy, business owners, from a deli on the corner on sixth avenue to the giant corporation, they want to understand the Regulatory Environment theyre in. They want to understand where the policymakers may go. And i think that what wall street was expecting was this Biden Victory and maybe a normalization of relationships with china. Maybe not a complete ending of the trade war, willie, but a pullback on the trade war as well. Perhaps investments in green energy, wind and solar energies. So the markets liked what it had. The vaccine news was that cherry on top. Got the 800 point gain. You had Airline Stocks up 40 , 50 . We wont get on a plane everybody tomorrow, but it is coming. You can kind of feel the good news. Yeah. You can feel some hope yesterday. Brian sullivan, great to see you, my friend. Rain check holds on the hug, well get there eventually. Mika . One more story making headlines this morning. The Supreme Court will hear arguments today in the challenge to the Affordable Care act with a solid 63 conservative majority on the court, proponents of obamacare fear 20 Million People could be stripped of their health care coverage. At issue is whether the statute can stand without the individual mandate that required citizens who chose to go without coverage to pay a penalty. The mandate was effectively repealed when congress reduced the penalty to zero under the current administration. The president elect is scheduled to give an address on the Affordable Care act today. Coming up the attorney general keeps the president s hopes of overturning the election alive with a policy change that let a Top Justice Department official to resign. Well explain all that next on morning joe. Well explain all that next on orning joe. For over 30 years, lexus has been celebrating driveway moments. Heres to one more, the lexus december to remember sales event. Get 0 financing on all new 2020 and 2021 lexus models. Experience amazing at your lexus dealer. Get 0 financing on all new 2020 and 2021 lexus models. Unlike ordinary memory want supplementster . Neuriva has clinically proven ingredients that fuel 5 indicators of brain performance. Memory, focus, accuracy, learning, and concentration. Try our new gummies for 30 days and see the difference. Laso you can enjoy it even ifst youre sensitive. Se. Yet some say it isnt real milk. I guess those cows must actually be big dogs. Sit i said sit americans from both parties. Turned out to vote in numbers like we havent seen in a hundred years. And Election Officials counted those votes carefully, transparently and in accordance with the law. So, no matter who you voted for, if you cast a ballot, or counted them. Thank you for showing the world that even in times like these, america is still going strong. Attorney general bill barr has written a memo authorizing federal prosecutors to investigate any credible allegations of voter fraud before Election Results are certified. In his memo to u. S. Attorneys, barr explains why hell forego the general practice of the Justice Departments Election Crimes Branch which is to wait until after Election Results are certified to investigate fraud claims. He claims, quote, such a passive and delayed enforcement approach can result in situations in which election misconduct cannot realistically be rectified. Then he writes this, i authorize you to pursue substantial allegations of voting and vote tabulation irregularities prior to the certification of elections in your jurisdictions as i have done in specific instances. Such inquiries and reviews may be connect conducted if there are clear and credible allegations of irregularities that if true could affect the outcome of a federal election in the state. Then he added, specious or farfetched claims should not be a basis for initiating federal inquiries. The justice official who oversees the Election Crimes Branch quit his post. In his Resignation Letter, Richard Pilger wrote in part, having familiarized myself with the new policy and the ramification, i must regretly resign from my role as director of the Election Crimes Branch. I have enjoyed very much working with you for over a decade to aggressively and diligently enforce federal criminal election law and policy and practice without partisan fear or favor. Joining us now, nbc news correspondent covering National Security and intelligence, ken dilanian. And from stanford law school, nate persly. Ken, start with just laying out the basics here as to why that resignation happened and what attorney general barr is trying to do that perhaps is a little bit of outside of norm. Good morning, mika. Absolutely. The resignation happened because what barr was did was seen so far outside the norm because the Justice Department had a long standing written policy of not taking the policies that can impact the election. It is really important, it says that any criminal investigation by the Department Must be conducted in a way that minimizes the likelihood that the investigation itself may become a factor in the election. The mere fact its being conducted may impact on the contest in state court. So what it says is you shouldnt conduct an open criminal investigation, take overt steps that the public would notice until the election is certified. Certified. So this election hasnt been certified. So what this allows u. S. Attorneys to do now is to issue subpoenas to interview voters, to take action that would create the impression of an election and we may not know the results for months but it will further cloud the minds of those who are believing the baseless claims that President Trump is making that this election was stolen from there. The New York Times and the Washington Post are reporting that the Justice Department is looking into the claim in nevada that ineligible people voted and a claim in erie where some guy said that in a post office they were back dating ballots. None of this, by the way, has the potential to impact the outcome of the election. And in the lawsuits that the Trump Campaign has filed, none are getting traction. Even if its true to change the outcome. But here you have the attorney general of the United States throwing up dust essentially allowing prosecutors to do something that is only going to prolong this National Agony that were going through. Where millions of people dont believe the results of an election. So professor, whats your read on whats going on here exactly . As ken says this has the look of attorney general barr humoring the president and throwing out the idea of some investigation. But if you read the full statement as mika just did, there are a lot of buts and howevers in there. Then he says that specious, fanciful, farfetched claims should not be investigated which is what we have so far out of the Trump Campaign. How much weight are you giving this statement from attorney general barr . Well, i think its just one more form in which these allegations are being made. So were seeing it across many states right now. We are seeing it in the department of justice, seeing it on social media. In each forum youre having the Campaign Making an argument the campaign or the administration make an argument that there was fraud in this election. But realize how high the hill is that they have to climb. Right . They are basically alleging a multistate conspiracy involving tens of thousands of votes administered by both democratic and republican Election Officials. Its never been proved before and never been alleged before at this scale. So lets look into some of the claims. Theres a new one, filing a federal lawsuit to block pennsylvania from certifying the states Election Results. The Trump Campaign alleges allegheny and Philadelphia County processed more than 682,000 mailin ballots without review by both a views of both democrat and republicans. Governor wolf said there are observers throughout the process and any insinuation is a lie. And hes right about that. And also alleging that those who are heavily democratic provided the mail in voters to cure process. According to the Philadelphia Inquirer matt morgan revealed in a News Conference in washington the ultimate goal is to invalidate enough votes to shrink the margin to half a percentage point and trigger a recount. The lawsuit again offers no evidence of widespread fraud in the state of pennsylvania. So professor, i just walk through that to give you the opportunity to analyze it. Do you see anything in this latest lawsuit from President Trump and his campaign . Well, i dont see any evidence in there, but really turning to the last page of the complaint thats where you things get interesting because theyre asking for an injunction to prevent the acertification. So there are several strategies here. One is to as you were saying before, create a cloud of uncertainty around the election itself. The other is to delay the actual certification to prevent the possibility that either the Supreme Court of pennsylvania or the governor would certify what the electoral votes are and then tee it up for the state legislature to get involved. Yeah. Ken dilanian before you go, youre writing about the firing of the secretary of defense, mark esper. Donald trump has a history, a pattern, of deflecting. What are the possibilities here and the potential ramifications of this what appears to be the beginning of maybe perhaps another house cleaning, one that probably our department of defense and intelligence agencies do not need at this time. Thats right, mika. My National Security sources are extremely rattled by this move and they are worried that the cia director gina haspel and fbi director Christopher Wray are next on the chopping block. Look, president ial transitions are a dangerous time anyway. Its a time when adversaries can take advantage of power vacuums of uncertainty, of people focused on other things. When you take away the experienced hands away from the National Government and replace them with in the place of espers position, with someone who hasnt been in the building for a while, it creates a vacuum of leadership that adversaries can take advantage of it. It sends a message to the world that nobodys in charge and theres further worry about what this president can do over the next 75 days. As we all know, president s of the United States have awesome power. They can wage nuclear war, they can deploy troops, do all sorts of things and they can declassify information and theres a real worry that John Ratcliffe will start putting out further information designed to discredit the russian investigation. He has already done that and some cia officials and others believe that has compromised sources and methods. So were in for a bumpy ride over the next ten weeks. I dont disagree. Nbcs ken dilanian and professor of law, thank you. David ignatius, if you could expound upon that. Just throwing in here, randomly, the 25th amendment i believe still applies, but whos going to be left in there and what are the potentials that something rash and erratic and extremely dangerous to our country could be put into play by a president seeking desperately to deflect . Mika, i think thats what all people who are concerned with National Security are wondering today. After saturdays sigh of relief, we had an election outcome. The numbers appeared strong. Biden gave a very generous speech as president elect. Kamala harris as Vice President elect. And now were seeing tactics that seem like scorched earth tactics. Yeah. Theyre going to burn so much of the landscape in the National Security area that theyre going to cause real damage as they retreat. One of the things that people are beginning to worry about is could this new inexperienced secretary of defense be encouraged by trump and his white house to do something rash on iran. Iran has been the area where trump from the beginning has been the closest to using military force. Is there a chance of that . Thats something im going to be looking at hard over the next several days. But what were seeing is the increasing resistance to transition from different agencies of the Trump Administration and it worries people and it should. All right. David ignatius, we are officially worried. Thank you very, very much. It is just past the top of the hour now. Lets get back to the other major headline this morning, the coronavirus and the United States reporting another record high for daily cases yesterday. According to an nbc news tally, there were nearly 134,000 new infections. It is the first time cases have crossed the 130,000 mark in one day and it marked the sixth day in a row that the u. S. Recorded more than 100,000 in a day. The country also reported 729 deaths yesterday. Meanwhile the Trump Administration is trying to take credit for pfizers success in vaccine trials. Vice president mike pence, there he is, tweeted yesterday, claiming it was thanks to a Public Private partnership forged by President Trump. But pfizer made it clear it did not receive funding from the Trump Administrations Operation Warp Speed Program, thats helped other pharmaceutical companies with research and development. Pfizer has, however, agreed to sell the u. S. Government 100 million doses. The president accused the company of waiting until after the election to announce the vaccine news for political purposes. Willie . Pfizers ceo yesterday said in an interview he learned about these new results just on sunday. Joining us now director of the center for Infectious Disease and a professor in the medical school at the university of minnesota, dr. Michael osterholm. He has been named as a member of president elect bidens coronavirus Advisory Board. Good to have you with us this morning. You are on the Advisory Board named early yesterday morning. What kind of work are you all doing right now and what can be done in the time between now and Inauguration Day which feels like an awful long time. What can you do to help tamp down this problem . Well, first of all, its very early obviously in this activity, so its hard for me to say that what were going to do. Were still working to determine that. But im optimistic that the topic areas whether it be vaccines, whether it be what we can do to limit transmission today, by encouraging better Public Health coordination, all those things are on the table. And were obviously going to be learning a lot more over the next several days as we move forward with the agenda for the task force. Dr. Osterholm, whats your reaction to the news out of pfizer in this trial anyway, 90 effective. How much promise do you see in that and do you share as i asked dr. Gupta in the last hour, dr. Faucis optimism that people who need it the most may be able to get the vaccine by the end of the year . Well, you know, first of all, i think its very encouraging news. Im obviously very pleased to see that. We have now evidence that this vaccine approach can work. I think the challenge that we have yet where id be very cautious what does that 90 mean . Do we prevent 90 of fever, coughs or chills or hospitalizations and deaths . We dont know that yet. We know, for example, in patients who have severe outcomes are the people least likely to respond well to the vaccine. So, you know, we really need to get that information. Another piece of information we need which we just cant get yet because of time is in fact how long this vaccine will work. And thats going to be something well learn over the days and months ahead. So not putting aside this news, which is very good for a moment, but its also something were looking down the road at, id like to ask you about the coronavirus and it is raging on right now. What are we in for the next few weeks and what are your biggest concerns in terms of pockets of the country that are seeing surges our increase in deaths . Well, kind of all of the above, mika. Let me just say on labor day we had 32,000 cases a day in this country reported. At that time, you know, i was already saying that this is going to be the darkest months ahead in terms of the pandemic because of the combination of pandemic fatigue. People who believe the pandemic is real but just are tired of trying to limit their activities to reduce their risk. You know, then we have pandemic anger that part of the population that believes that this is still a hoax and nothing theyre going to do is going to be consistent with Public Health recommendations and then you bring us indoors with indoor air and we have one to two air exchanges an hour as compared to 12 say in the hospital. When you add those up its the perfect storm. Im not surprised right now and i have said wed be hitting 100 to 150,000 cases in the very time period. What i have been saying for months is get ready, well be hitting 200,000 or more cases a day and we have to get prepared in our hospitals for the very issue. Well, well followup on in that a moment, but it to bring in professor walter isaacson. I understand you participated in the pfizer trials . Yeah. I mean, 44,000 people across this country that signed up. It was down in new orleans where its kind of easy to get into the Clinical Trials and it was important for me because you want to sort of bring this home. You want to understand what so it makes people think about a virus and makes you feel civically engaged. And this is a particularly interesting vaccine to me because its a type of vaccine we have never seen before. It is based on rna, just going in and chopping up detecting this virus. And creating the ability of your own body cells to create the spike proteins that will kick in your immune system. So one of the things thats happening during this covid crisis and i think people are becoming a lot more interested in molecular biology for good reason. Well, we appreciate you taking part. Walter, dr. Osterholm, for the people who have at this point, we are looking at though what, about a year until we have a vaccine that is widely used because there would be partial use at first, correct . I think were going to see some vaccine possibly available even by at the end of the year for the Health Care Workers. Then it will roll out to the population. One of the challenges we have is delivering the vaccine. You were in one if our Health Care Workers are the prime target area which we at this point have identified, if these hospitals are on fire with covid cases, its going to be very hard to do both. Vaccinate large numbers of Health Care Workers while theyre spending every precious moment trying to save lives. The second thing is its a vaccine that requires to be kept at a tell temperature of minus 94 degrees. I can tell you from my 45 years in Public Health at the state level trying to deliver vaccines, this is going to be a hell of a challenge. And we have to understand that. And so its not going to be simple to get this vaccine out either. But nonetheless, because the challenge is great, but the problem is even greater, well get it done. But its not going to be simple. Thats interesting. Dr. Gupta made the same point about the refrigeration and how hard that will be logistically. I know you were just named to the Advisory Panel and you havent had a chance to meet and get through your ideas and what it will look like under the Biden Administration, but youre one of the leading voices on this. You have been warning us about accurately for months about where its headed. Can you see a scenario around the corner in in winter where thats a form of a national lockdown. Like one were seeing in europe, where the schools stay open or some form of a lockdown if this gets bad enough . Well, first of all, if you interview 50 people you can get 75 different definitions of what a lockdown is, so lets be clear. I dont think anybody know what theyre talking about. When i talk about a lockdown, myself included. The president of the Minneapolis Federal reserve bank and i wrote an oped in the New York Times and we said we need to lock down to drive this infection level to the to a place where we can actually control it with testing and tracing and followup that way. Just like the Asian Countries have done and im talking about everything from australia to new zealand, all the way up through china, japan, all of those countries have done it already. To really deal with the pain and suffering economically is what we basically proposed was because the savings rate in this country has gone out of the roof, since the pandemic. We have gone from 8 to over 22 , we can borrow the money from ourselves and we can pay people to lose their job, we can pay Small Business and take care of city, state and county governments. If were elected to do that. If washington could make that happen, that would be a very different kind of lockdown where people wouldnt suffer and we can get this virus under control. Anybody and the media did this after the election, when they had polling data, did you vote for the coronavirus for vote for the economy theyre not different. If were a raging house on fire with coronavirus in this country, our economy is not going to do well. So we have to understand we have a way to do it. We have elected not to do it yet to basically what i call pay to prevail. All right. Dr. Michael osterholm, thank you so much, once again, for being on with us. And giving us context to all of to. Another person trying to bring context to this situation and drive us forward in a more organized fashion is president elect joe biden who spoke yesterday. He announced a task force and he named the people who will be on it, who will be addressing this in a way that i think we havent seen before. Heres part of what joe biden had to say. I wont be president until january 20th. But my message today is to everyone is this. It doesnt matter who you voted for. Whether you stood where you stood before election day. It doesnt matter your party, your point of view. We can save tens of thousands of lives if everyone would just wear a mask for the next few months. Not democrat or republican lives, american lives. Maybe wed save the life of a person who stocks the shelf at your local grocery store. Maybe saves the life of a member of your place of worship. Maybe it saves the lives of one of your childrens teachers. Maybe it saves your life. So please, i implore you, wear a mask. Do it for yourself. Do it for your neighbor. A mask is not a political statement. But it is a good way to start pulling the country together. I want to very clear. The goal of mask wearing is not to make your life less comfortable. Its to take something or take something away from you. Its to give Something Back to all of us. A normal life. A peek into the future really with president elect joe biden whos trying to help this country even give it some guidance before he takes office as it pertains to the coronavirus. We have with us this hour, Pulitzer Prize winning columnist and msnbc news political analyst Eugene Robinson and peter baker and host of way too early, kasie hunt is still with us as well. Peter, ill start with you. Joe biden probably is not surprised if he has to completely start from scratch. Theres word that traditional transition measures will not be respected by the Trump Administration. Well, i think thats right. I think that they knew that coming in. I think they understood that this is not going to be an ordinary transition under any circumstance, that this is a president whos made very clear that hes not willing to accept defeat and therefore, you know, will do everything he can to gum up the works. So youre seeing the Biden Campaign now mulling the idea of whether they should sue the federal government, sue the Trump Administration for failing to provide the Transition Resources that the law calls for, in terms of office space and money and so forth so they can begin building a government. The law has a very, very specific, you know, set of rules for how a new administration coming in should be handled and the Trump Administration so far has not recognized bidens you know, win, and therefore is not providing the resources it is supposed to. I think, again, the biden team knew that. Understood that. This is a team of veterans. Many of them were in government four years ago. They understand how it works, they understand what theyre getting in to so they have an advantage over many administrations coming in, i think. But youre in for a 70 day wild ride in which youre going to see a lot of norms broken, a lot of barriers shattered and a lot of nervousness on the part of the americans and wondering whats going on and a president clearly using his power to express his unhappiness with the fact he lost. Kasie hunt, as the noise machine gets cranked up one last time, extra loud in the last days of the election, joe in the last hour was warning people not to get overly worked up because the claims are so baseless and the courts will hold up against them. What feels different than say 24 hours ago beyond President Trump just having a tantrum, you have the republicans indulging the tantrum. Mitch mcconnell is saying let it play out in the courts. You have the two senators in georgia calling for the resignation of the secretary of state in georgia. Hes a republican, he says he will not step down. He will not listen to that. So there is more and i guess it goes in to keeping with the last four years indulgence of the president today by republicans than there was yesterday. Willie, my sense is theyre basically just trying not to the poke the bear on the way out. This is a strategy they have employed with President Trump the entire time and are the consequences going to be higher this this period than they would be otherwise. This does not surprise me in terms of how theyre handling it. When i was talking to republicans before the election, they suggested that they were fully expecting President Trump to lose the election, lets be clear about that. They had thought about this in advance. They had thought about, okay, the president is telegraphing we know how hes likely to handle this. What are we going to do . And what i heard from republicans then was they were going to say exactly what they have said. He has every right and he does. He has every right to go to the courts, show evidence if he has it and has those adjudicated through the normal process. I do think i have heard from my sources that they will ultimately accept the results of the election when that is at its conclusion. There is i dont think theres any delusion among republicans the outcome of this is going to be different. Now, again, the challenge of what were talking about and joe outlined we know that joe biden is going to be president , we dont need to get too spun up about that and i think its fair. The question is what is President Trump doing to spin up his supporters and what does that have in the long run . We are seeing trust plummet in the trump base and really its the loyalty of those supporters and the way that theyre willing to believe whatever he says thats gotten us to this point. Republicans lost control of their own party. They had how many candidates running against donald trump, trump beat them one after another. It was a marked switch when we saw john mccain rebuking voters who believed false things about barack obama to now this president indulging all of it and this is a continuation of the reality. Continuing to say to the trump supporter theres legitimacy here. Theyre lending kind of that sheen of legitimacy to him. I think thats a real question about what the consequences of that are going to be over the course of the next month and a half. You know, willie, obviously this has a lot to do with the runoffs in georgia. I mean that incentivizes republicans to lean into this further because frankly, they need President Trumps supporters in georgia to show up. This is in their view the way to do it. Mika, just for some perspective it was four years ago today that president obama welcomed president elect donald trump to the oval office to congratulate him. It was 12 years ago today that george w. Bush welcomed president elect barack obama to the oval office to congratulate him on his victory as well. Kasie makes the key point, the republicans dont want to poke the bear, they have handled the president this way, in the interim here the next what 2 1 2 months, it sows doubt in the country about the electoral process and 70 Million People who voted for President Trump, climbing to 71 Million People and they believe that the process is rigged and the more time and space this gets the bigger the flames become. Just to put into context joes comments from earlier, just dont be shocked but we can be worried. Its worth it. Theres some pressure on the government to begin the formal transfer of power from President Trump to president elect joe biden. The General Services administration, the agency that approves the beginning stages of the transfer of power has failed to certify bidens win. The head of the agency, emily murphy, a trump appointee, must issue a letter of ascertainment. Without that letter, bidens team cant gain access to federal agencies including secure facilities where they can discuss classified information. Now according to bloomberg, republican senators rubio and romney have both added their voices to the growing calls for the agency to ascertain biden as president elect. Warning the delay could put americas National Security at risk. Rubio said yesterday that the agencys determination wouldnt undermine President Trumps legal challenges to the election, saying quote, we need to have that contingency in place. Walter, any precedent for this . I mean, this is really this is really where things can get extremely dangerous from my perspective, knowing what it takes for a transition to take place, for information to be passed on, for our relationships around the world and our dangers around the world to be kept in check. Well, whenever youre talking about donald trump you have to just say theres no precedent for this. This should not be happening. None. And youre right, the real thing for which there is some precedence that were hoping that it will change, is that the republicans have been on this and so many other things the republican senators, other than people like romney and rubio, are just totally craven. At some point, Mitch Mcconnell should say we should have this transition starting. Sure. You can go to court and challenge the votes. But lets not endanger National Security. So you have to look at a Mitch Mcconnell who knows joe biden well, whos worked with him over the years, and is somebody who cares or used to care about institutions. So what shocks me is not that trump is doing this, nothing trump does could shock me, but what shocks me is Mitch Mcconnell is not trying to guide this process a little bit more steadily. So gene robinson, you have a good barometer for this stuff. Whats your sense of where we are right now . We are one week after election day. Joe biden was named president elect on saturday. So were a couple of days clear of that and yet, you have the space filled with all of this noise and these lawsuits, most of them being slapped down. You have secretaries of state, both democratic and republican in the case of georgia saying theres no fraud. Im not resigning my office. Well fight these claims and adjudicate these claims as they come in. But how concerned are you about what youre seeing not just from the white house and the Trump Campaign, but from republicans on capitol hill . I think its appalling and alarming, willie, i really do. And i think, you know, we shouldnt be we shouldnt all be, you know, boiled frogs in this. Were so used to donald trump not behaving in ways that other president s behave that we sort of discount that. This is not the way its supposed to work. You know . The day after the election four years ago, the whole nation congratulated him as president elect and as you said, he was a couple days later, you know, invited to the white house to meet with president obama. Thats what happens. There is no theory of voter fraud or irregularities, you know, in covering multiple states and literally hundreds of thousands of votes thats going to overturn the result of this election. Its impossible. Every one of these republican politicians knows it. They know how elections works and how recounts work. They know that recounts change votes in the hundreds, not in the tens of thousands. It doesnt happen. They know that, you know that the republican governor and republican secretary of state in georgia did not, you know, tilt the book tilt the votes in favor of joe biden. They just know all of this. And they you know, theres no crying in politics, right . I mean, you dont get to be indulged when you lose an election just because it hurts your fragile ego. And we shouldnt go along with this. One thing we know about donald trump is that its not you know, he plays for today. He plays to win them the morning, to win this 17 minute news cycle. And we have to continue to stand up to that on that basis. So its just not okay on any level. Gene, thank you. Peter baker, based on your reporting so far, how do you see this playing out . Well, look, you know, you have a little bit of an indicator in the paper today, my colleague Maggie Haberman reported that the president is forming a leadership pac to raise money which he can then use to distribute to other republican candidates and influence it Going Forward. I think it indicates hes already beginning to plan for his own post white house, you know, life. I think its an indication that the president understands himself of course hes not going to win the battles, he wont hold on to power after january 20th. And what hes going through is what gene talked, salving the wounded pride and allows him to say, i didnt lose, i got robbed. We didnt get repudiated, we got stolen. I think he understands his time is short, he has 70 days left in office and he can do an awful lot in the 70 days. What kasie and everybody is saying is right. You know, in that process, on the way out the door, you can go damage to the democracy. Its about faith in the system, about faith in the elections that are freely and fairly won. If hes sowing doubt that this was a fair and free election, a lot of people would believe him, and hes going to go out of office having left the democracy of our country in worst shape than he found it. Yeah. Peter baker and walter isaacson, thank you both. Walter, thanks for taking part in the vaccine trials. Still ahead on morning joe, the president takes to twitter to announce the firing of defense secretary mark esper. Admiral james will join us. Plus, adam smith will join us. Youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. Orning joe. Well be right back. How about no no uh uh, no way come on, no no nnnnono only discover has no annual fee on any card. Ithe first full prescriptionis pstrengthnnnnono nonsteroidal antiinflammatory gel. Available over the counter. Voltaren is powerful arthritis pain relief in a gel. Voltaren. The joy of movement. Are you managing. Using fingersticks . With the new freestyle libre 2 system, a continuous glucose monitor, you can check your glucose with a painless, onesecond scan. And now with optional alarms, you can choose to be notified if you go too high or too low. And for those who qualify, the freestyle libre 2 system is now covered by medicare. Ask your doctor for a prescription. You can do it without fingersticks. Learn more at freestyle libre 2 dot u. S. Americans from both parties. Turned out to vote in numbers like we havent seen in a hundred years. And Election Officials counted those votes carefully, transparently and in accordance with the law. So, no matter who you voted for, if you cast a ballot, or counted them. Thank you for showing the world that even in times like these, america is still going strong. Thank you for showing the world that even in times like these, visibly fades the dark spots away. New neutrogena® rapid tone repair 20 percent pure vitamin c. A serum so powerful dark spots dont stand a chance. See what i mean . Neutrogena® President Trump fired his defense secretary mark esper on social media yesterday. Nbc news reported last week that esper had already prepared a formal Resignation Letter since they had been at odds over several issues. For instance, esper was working with congress to rename military bases named after confederate soldiers, a move the president opposes. And over the summer, esper pushed back on sending active duty troops to put down protests and also distanced himself from trumps photoop at st. Johns church. John kelly, the former chief of staff, said thats per quote, made the decision to stay loyal to the law and the constitution and paid the price. Speaking to the military times last week, esper said quote, whos going to come in behind me, a real yes man and then god help us. Joining us now, chairman of the House Armed Services committee, adam smith of washington. He was reelected last tuesday to represent washingtons 9th congressional district. Also with us former nato supreme allied commander, retired admiral steve stavridis. He is chief international and diplomacy analyst for nbc news and msnbc. Admiral stavridis, god help us. Is that is that over the top . Is that or are we in unknown territory . I personally i feel the president is at risk of doing something incredibly destructive to the United States in the next month or two. Am i being overly hysterical . Well, no. Youre not being overly hysterical, but we all ought to be concerned. I spent two years as the senior military assistant as a three star to the secretary of defense under don rumsfeld. Ill give you three reasons we ought to be worried. One is tactical. The secretary of defense receives an orders book and hes the one who makes the decisions to deploy units overseas. Those are highly technical decisions. You cant just jump into the middle of it without doing damage to how we deploy our troops. Number two, operationally at the level of theater, this is where the secretary of defense thinks about, well, should that Aircraft Carrier battle group go to the arabian gulf or to the south china sea. Then finally, strategically. There are some pretty obvious concerns here starting with and not to get at the really dark end of the spectrum, but the nuclear codes. This is not trivial. It is complicated. You dont want to just throw somebody in to it and ill close by saying the sec def appointee has a decent record as a colonel. He served in a couple of low level posts in the pentagon. To pull him up to be the secretary of defense on a moments notice would be like a Baseball Team not going to the bullpen. It would be like going down to the High School Ball team and saying, hey, send that pitcher up here to the major leagues. So yeah, we ought to be pretty concerned about it. Chairman smith, you head up the Armed Services committee in the house. It appears that the crime of defense secretary esper was not being 100 loyal at all times to donald trump which is what he requires. What are your concerns from your position and also should we be thinking as some have reported about fbi director wray, even cia director haspel and the security of their jobs . Well, i think admiral stavridis is correct, this is a destructive act by the president. Theres no major policy changes if hes unhappy with secretary esper thats one thing. If hes going to be continuing his term, but hes not, we need continuity within the job. To remove secretary esper at this point, number one, gives all the concerns that admiral stavridis just laid out. Now, i will say that acting secretary miller i spoke to him yesterday. Hes not bad guy. Admiral stavridis is also correct hes not qualified for the position but sounds like hell do his best and hes working with chairman millie, but it places uncertainty at dod at a way thats very dangerous and the second point what mika is alluding to, whats next . What else is President Trump going to do thats going to place our country in jeopardy . Lets be 100 clear on this. There is no question of the outcome of this election. I have been through a lot of elections, i have seen very close elections. We all have. They happen. Theres no question of the outcome here. What President Trump and Mitch Mcconnell and the republicans are doing here is unbelievably destructive to this country and completely wrong. Theres no legitimate challenge to this election so youre beginning to see in the firing of mark esper the damage that President Trump can do if the republicans continue to support these destructive efforts. So its a big problem and its worrisome to think about what else could happen. You have good relationships with republicans in the house, probably in the senate as well. What are they telling you . Do they actually believe that theres something nefarious going on with the elections in the state of georgia and the state of pennsylvania as the Trump Campaign lawsuits have stated or doing what kasie laid out for us, staying out of the way and letting the process play out no matter what happens in this country during that time. Well, most of them fall into that camp certainly. You described it perfectly as we have seen it play out the course of five years now from when trump decided to run for president. Some are scared of him. Theyre scared of his supporters they want to keep their head down and not say anything that will contradict the president. And this is why this is incredibly important that we take this seriously. You can say, come on. Theres no legitimate challenge, joe biden is going to become president. It will all be fine. We have to push back on the messaging more because what i have seen is a number of my colleagues drinking the koolaid, how ever you want to describe it. At a certain point, they seem to start to believe some of this nonsense. I mean, you go back to the ukraine thing and when we heard about crowdstrike and the server, look at that, this is ridiculous. But then a certain number of republicans they start to believe it and some do. Now, the overwhelming majority dont, to be sure. But its really important that we fight this message war. That we just dont shrug and go, oh, gosh, this is crazy. No one is going to believe that. No, we have to push back on just how destructive and wrong what is happening here is. Increasing number of republicans you know get sucked into the void, if you will. We have to push back on that. Sadly. I mean, you wouldnt think logically you would have to. But this is a big deal for the future of our country. A lot of people believe exactly what the president said and as we have learned again this week. 70 million, 71 Million People believe what he says and continues to believe what he has to say. Kasie hunt has a question for you. Picking up on the defense secretary and the potential implications, one of the things that we here at nbc news had reported over the last week is that this question of renaming military bases that are named for confederate generals, as well as other military assets, was part of what was going on with mr. Esper. Obviously not as serious as the question about american troops in the streets. But im interested to know where that stands since its something that takes place inside congress and the bill that authorizes funding. Is that going to happen here . Are there other issues like that oar things that are that have to happen between now and the inauguration that you are worried about that may not be on the radar . Yeah. Complicated question and ill try to be quick. First of all, i have spoken to secretary esper and he was not going to simply rename the bases over the objection of the president. That was a misreported story. He does not think thats his responsibility under and yet the president has made his position clear, the president doesnt want to do it. So you have the executive track and the president under the law could decide to rename the bases absent legislative action. Hes not going to do that. Secretary esper wouldnt just do it and contradict the commander in chief. Thats not going to happen. Legislatively, the National Defense authorizing act, the bill we passed out of my committee and the Senate Committee is being negotiated in conference right now. We have a provision in our bill and the senate actually has a provision as well to require those bases to be renamed. Senator imhoff said despite what was in his bill hes not going to do it which is interesting and we could require that in our legislation. And President Biden and he is going to be president could do it on his own, so were deciding what is the best way to get there. Theres no question it should happen. We should not have bases named after people for the purpose of celebrating White Supremacy which is what that is, by the way. Other issues its hard to say. Nothing theres a lot of things were working on right now, but secretary esper has tried, you know, to be, you know, a loyal secretary of defense. Not loyal. President trumps the commander in chief. The secretary of defense works for him. Hes tried his best to protect the pentagon and make sure as admiral stavridis said its an important job being secretary of defense. You have huge responsibilities to protect this country and to make sure that men and women who served in the military had the leadership they need to do their jobs. To do that with this president who cares only about one thing, how big a sycophant are you to him. Its funny, i have heard not confirmed but i have seen this reported that it all started going south for esper at the Reagan Defense forum last year. And i was there and they asked him, one of the questions that brett baer asked him, what kind of boss is the president . We all smiled, he said, look, hes a good boss, he gave a straightforward answer and the president didnt like that, because the only answer is hes the greatest boss, hes a genius, you cant believe and pierce didnt give that answer. And trump said hes insufficiently loyal. Think of all the decisions and all the things that have hand in the last year and we had a secretary of defense who didnt have the confidence of the commander of the chief because he didnt kiss up to him and thats dangerous. Yeah. Congressman adam smith, thank you. Admiral stavridis, on that note, id like to ask you if youd look at if you look at the track record of the president s actions and the purpose behind it, personnel choices included, chances are you would not check the box Country First for those. Or for most of them. Perhaps im wrong, but you can look into it. Im going to go with the contention that he doesnt think of Country First. He thinks of what exactly what the chairman was saying, loyalty to him and sort of a ridiculous sense of inflated sense of self. What checks are in place to prevent bedlam, to prevent an act or a decision or even a Nuclear Strike . I mean, i dont want to push things over the edge here with hysteria, but im asking what prevents the president from doing something extremely destructive to the United States of america in anger . You know, let me tell you two more things to worry about we havent mentioned but ill close on something thats good. One is the turbulence here. We are on the fourth National Security adviser. This will be the fifth secretary of defense. These positions are changing constantly and that in and of itself is very concerning and when i look at the team that president elect biden is assembling hes going to bring in people and keep them in stable positions. Second thing to worry about, we havent even touched on, how does this look to beijing . How does this look to moscow and in tehran . How does this look in caracas, pyongyang . It looks great, theyre loving it, high fives all around. Those are the two additional concerning i have particularly in this period of transition. Let me close on something, you asked what are the checks in place. First and foremost, its the uniformed military and yesterday you saw civilian control of the military. The new acting secretary of defense showed up, chairman millie got them all together and in the tank. The word went forth, we have a new boss, but those uniformed officers will continue to guard the republic, forward deployed. Even more importantly than the brass, if you will, its the young men and women, volunteers all, marching through the streets of kandahar. They are a check because theyre professional, because they are a political and ill close completely by saying chairman adam smith who worked endlessly with Ranking Member max thornberry, senator imhoff, senator reid, were lucky that the military committees in the congress have their heads screwed on right, by and large are bipartisan and theyll help us work through this. But mika, its a challenging time. Yeah. Retired admiral james stavridis, thank you. Up next, conspiracies are not legitimate. That is the take from some staunch conservatives even as the Trump Campaign tries to pretend otherwise. Morning joes coming right back. Herwise. Morning joes coming right back typical vacuum has bristles that can leave cleaning gaps and wrap hair. So shark replaced them with flexible power fins to directly engage floors and dig deep into carpets. Pick up more on every pass with no hair wrap. Shark vertex with duoclean power fins. We made usaa insurance for veterans like martin. When a hailstorm hit, he needed his insurance to get it done right, right away. Usaa. What youre made of, were made for. Usaa usaa. What youre made of, were made for. But you can work out anything wowith comcast business. W. Get fast, reliable, and secure internet on the nations largest gig speed network. Flexible tools like wifi you control. Voice solutions that connect you from anywhere. And expert advice here, here, or even here. Be fast. Be flexible. Bounce forward with comcast business. Get started with a powerful internet and voice solution for just 64. 90 a month. Plus, for a limited time, ask how to get a 300 prepaid card. Call or go online today. There were tsunamis fourtin the world. And once they happened, we were in a major hurry to get to those regions to provide aid and support. It was very humbling to be able to help out all those people. Its my dream now to go into clean energy and whatever the next new fuel source is, thats where i want to be. I want to be on the front lines of implementation. I want to particularly congratulate president elect trump. I think we all agree this was a stunning election. And clearly an indication that the American People would like to try something new and i know the speaker shares my view wed like to see the country go in a different direction and intend to work with him to change courses, to change the course for america. Our institutions are actually built for this. We have the system in place to consider concerns and President Trump is 100 within his rights to look into allegations of irregularities and weigh his legal options. If the democrats feel confident they have not occurred, they should have no reason to fear any extra scrutiny. That is correct. Senate majority leader Mitch Mcconnell stopping short of acknowledging joe bidens election win as compared to 2016 when he had president elect before states certified Election Results. Joining us now Senior Editor at the dispatch, a columnist for time, david french. He is out with a book entitled divided we fall, americas succession threat and how to restore our nation. Also msnbc political analyst and publisher of the newsletter dot, inc. , biden cant be f. D. R. He could still be l. B. J. We will get to what the biden model is going to look like in a moment. David, what Mitch Mcconnell said i think a lot of people on twitter and we have screaming, oh my gosh, but it actually was true. You can do what the president is doing and democrats are waiting until Something Like evidence is actually brought forward. None is seen. None is expected. But he has a right to do what he is doing. He has a right to do what he is doing, but what has to be made very clear to the American People is that will not upset the Election Results. I have looked at the lawsuits. I have looked at the video viral conspiracy theories. There is an exercise in futility. So whats happening is this is being actively, and mainly in conservative media, mainly not from the senators, but mainly conservative media this fever is spreading that this is illegitimate, its been taken away and they hear lawsuits and they think a judge is going to intervene and change the results. Until you read these lawsuits and realize they are not even hail mary passes. They are insults to hail mary passes because a hail mary pass can be completed. Its frivolous litigation. There are viral conspiracy theories without any real evidence online. This election has ended. There is nothing that has been brought forward yet that comes close to upsetting the results of this election, and tens of millions of americans are being told otherwise. They are being lied to. They are being deceived. We are hearing republicans, including the majority leader, bending over backwards to say we have to wait until states certify the results before we can acknowledge a president elect. We have got to look through all this. We played a clip of him hours after donald trump was given the presidency by the media the day after election day congratulating president elect trump. They are within their rights. They are saying what they think they need to say, still even though he is on his way out, to not incur the wrath of donald trump. What would you hope to hear from principal republicans in this moment . What we have heard, for example, mitt romney, who congratulated president elect joe biden on his obvious victory. No senator can block any citizens access to the courts. No senator can block the Trump Campaigns access to the courts. They have access to the courts. They will use that, and these lawsuits will work their way through the system and they are going to fail to stop president elect biden. You are allowed to do that. You are allowed to make that assessment as a senator. But i dont think you can over emphasize, its not just the president that these senators dont want to make angry. It is a conservative media echo system that right now, with some notable exceptions, but right now is losing its mind. It is essentially whipping up a frenzy within the American Public to the point where a recent poll showed about 70 of republicans dont believe the election was free or fair, which is absurd. Actually, the election was a tribute to the american electoral process that this many people voted safely in the middle of a horrible pandemic. Gene robinson, you have the next question. Yeah. Just a question to am under. Your peace in the times looked ahead to the Biden Administration and what that potentially would be like. And you say not fdr but maybe lbj. How do you see it playing out . Well, first of all, to take a step back in a way because of yesterdays news, i think we have to realize how serious it is what Mitch Mcconnell is doing. I think o. J. Has a right to look for the real killers and people on reddit have a right to find out what really happened with the moon landing and donald trump has a right to find the real Election Results. But that doesnt make it right. And actually when you are president of the United States, being a conspiracy theorizer is not a personal preference. It has institutional consequences. And so when Mitch Mcconnell then gets up and refuses to acknowledge reality, the reality that the admiral was pointing out, the military is already recognizing, its actually incredibly, incredibly dangerous moment in this countrys life. We are going to have to get through that. I think its important to make the point, pivoting to the biden future, biden has talked about the restoration of normalcy, working across the aisle, but you dont pursue unity with your abuser. You dont pursue unity with people trying to sabotage your democracy live right now. You dont reach out your hand to people whose hands are themselves busy rigging democracy to throw out all of the votes of the entire state of pennsylvania. A court filing from yesterday. In terms of the future, we are going to get through this, we are going to get a biden presidency in january. I think the important opportunity in this moment is for joe biden to reflect on whether the kind of normal that we had in 2016, the kind of normal that got donald trump elected, is any kind of place to go back to. And there are already indications among the democrats i talk to, including most prominently Chuck Schumer, the minority leader who wants to be the majority leader in january, that the old ways of the old democratic party, the caution, the institutionalism, the reticence to make bold, big change is dangerous. As Chuck Schumer told me, that kind of approach that democrats have pursued for the last 20 years under his tenure partly is going to get us another donald trump in the future and maybe this time a donald trump who can read and write and get things done. So its going to be incredibly important when joe biden takes the oath of office to actually not go back to normal and to actually think about whether he has the senate doing bold things in response to the emergency and using that opportunity to deal with the emergency to do bigger things, or if he doesnt have the senate, to do whatever he can through executives orders and things that the Obama Administration didnt do as well in terms of building the down ballot party and other things like that, building consensus for democratic reforms down the road he may not be able to get done in the next two years. But normal is no place to go back to. Thank you so much. We will be reading your new peace in the New York Times. And david french, we will be read yurg posts for the dispatch. Thank you both very much for being on this morning. Up next, the Trump Administration tries to take credit for pfizers vaccine success as the u. S. Sets a new record for covid cases. Well talk to dr. Vin gupta. Morning joe is coming right back. Right back here . Nah. Introducing the all new chevy trailblazer. Here . Nope. Here. When the middle of nowhere, is somewhere. The all new chevy trailblazer. Making lifes journey, just better. You are welcoming fraud and you are welcoming illegal voting. Our position is clear. We want to protect the franchise of the American People. We want an honest, accurate, lawful count. We want maximum sunlight. We want maximum transparency. We want every legal vote to be counted and we want every illegal vote to i think we have to be very clear. She is charging, welcoming fraud and welcoming illegal voting. Unless she has more details to back that up, i cant in good countenance continue showing you this. Fox news abruptly cutting away from White House Press secretary Kayleigh Mcenanys News Conference yesterday when she tried to make explosive Election Fraud claims backed by no evidence. None at all. Yeah. You know, willie, remember the morning after the election, we were telling everybody to take a deep breath . I think its time to do that again, like a week later, because i was we dont watch a lot of cable news or any news after we get off the show in the morning. I think three hours is plenty for anybody. But i was walking through our living room yesterday and i saw Mitch Mcconnell. I thought, oh, my lord, i am going to be getting texts. And without turning up the sound, i knew what he was going to do. He was going to say, just like he tweeted, we have a right to count all the votes and then present any legal challenges that we have. And i knew he was going to say that. Then i knew hed Say Something like the democrats smell so bad they got horse flies around their faces. He didnt say that. He didnt say that exactly, but i knew he was going to provoke the press and provoke the democrats, and i was going to be getting texted throughout the day. So its really important, Everybody Needs to take a deep breath because you can put what you are hearing in two buckets. The first bucket is what you are hearing from most, except in georgia. Where you hear from most republicans, the elected leaders, and most are saying the same thing. Lindsey graham, Mitch Mcconnell, others who are provoking a lot of people. One, they are saying the president has a right to count all the votes. You know what. You can say that about every election ever held in American History. And, two, the president has a right to present any legal challenges that he may have to the counting of those votes. That has been said. You can say that about any election thats ever been. So thats what most republican elected officials are saying. And is it irritating that at the same time they are declaring victory . Yes, its irritating. But they are stating what is obvious. Then youve got the trump propagandists who are lying and cheating, not cheating but lying and talking about cheating and Holding Press Conferences at lawn care centers outside of sex shops and also the white house and the White House Briefing theyre lying. Guess what . Thats obvious. And thats going to be sorted out by the courts. There was a judge in michigan yesterday who heard one of these challenges and said, hey, you know what . You havent presented several things, including any evidence of wrongdoing. And, you know, i was there for 500 or for 38 days in florida in the recounts. I was there every day. And what we were doing as republicans, we were looking at votes. 537 votes. So if 14 votes changed ain a county, that was significant because there are 67 counties in florida. So it really was. That recount was chaotic. We are talking about dozens of votes here, dozens of votes there. This morning joe biden is ahead by 14,000 votes in georgia. He is ahead by 45,000 votes in pennsylvania. More than donald trump beat Hillary Clinton by four years ago. He is ahead by, i dont know, 17, 18,000 votes in arizona. He has easily gotten his 270. There are going to be no Court Challenges that goiare going to change that outcome and Everybody Knows it. Its disturbing whats happening in georgia. Is th that should be more disturbing to georgia republicans because the fate of the United States senate and the entire government of the United States of america rests on those two seats, and the two people running are, i think, stand apart as being extraordinarily reckless, saying things that are total lies. And they are attacking, wait for it, wait for it, a fellow republican who laughed at the attacks and said they are just they are mad because trump lost and they are afraid they are going to lose their seats, to. Willie, its important to remember the rules of all of these elections were put together by republicans in wisconsin, in michigan, in pennsylvania, in georgia, in florida, in texas, and in arizona. Every swing state, republican legislators put together the rules. And theyre being run in georgia, in arizona, in philadelphia by republicans. So im just saying i know its maddening. I know we want this to all be over, but its obvious where this is going to end. No, donald trump is not going to steal any elections. He is throwing a tantrum right now and republicans are trying to give him his space. Should they give him space . No. They should put their country ahead of their party. They are not going to do it, so dont suffer twice. Theyre not going to do it. But the courts are. They are going to follow the law, and nobody has brought up i have to say, the only other thing i will say, some law firms should be ashamed of themselves if they continue this charades. Several law firms are respected law firms that have respected clients, but anybody that carries out this facade and does it for money when they know there are no unless they have legitimate challenges. If they are legitimate challenges, bring it up. But if you are acting for a shield for a president trying to undermine democracy and our elections, its time to slowly step away and tell the president goodbye. I was getting the same texts you were yesterday, joe. I wouldnt call them panic. The concern was a little elevated. Is this really happening . That seemed to be the theme. Joe biden remains today what he was on saturday at 11 thirds in the morning. The president elect of the United States. There is a lot of noise out there. There is a lot going on. As you say, the courts already have held up. They will continue to hold up in the face of cheese challengthes because there is no evidence being put forward. The two georgia senators who asked the secretary of state to step down, he said i am not stepping down. Thats a fantasy. Didnt provide any evidence. They just threw it out not atmosphere. The argument is that Mitch Mcconnell is so focused on those two Georgia Senate seats, he is doing this to fire up the base and get people out so he can keep the majority in the senate. Well, at what cost is he doing that . He is firing up the base to hold on to two seats, which he should hold anyway at the cost of creating this confusion and this doubt about our electoral process where there isnt any. As you say, the margins are so much bigger this time than they were in 2000 when it was only 537 votes. Its not comparable. But there are a lot of republicans, there is an attorney general who are indulging this tantrum. I dont think any three of us or any parent watching this show would allow the tantrum to go on like this or to allow the, you know, the toddler to continue to scream at the top of the lungs and go into the room and say, what more can i get for you . Thats not how you are supposed to do it. The its the way Mitch Mcconnell is doing it. The way the gsa, the office that assures is smooth transition is handling. Its the way President Trump is handling it by firing his secretary of defense. Create chaos and doubt. Its on us to stay focused and know the truth and tell the truth about whats happening in a fair electoral process as republican secretaries of state and republicans on electoral boards have told us again and again and again. There is nothing shady here. In fact, this was a smooth election that joe biden won. Sound and fury signifying nothing. The only thing i will say, yes, Mitch Mcconnell will do whatever he has to do to retain the majority in the United States senate, but right now what he is seeing in the state of georgia are democrats and independents, going to be united, to actually put democrats in charge of the senate and to run Mitch Mcconnell out of the majority speakers office, majority leaders office, what he is allowing to happen right now is a civil war happening in georgia. The people of georgia elected their republican secretary of state and they know him very well, and he has run a Fair Election much and its obvious because the there were no specific charges against him at all. It has been a clean race. And so lets say, for instance, this republican civil war where republicans are attacking republicans, which is just so idiotic, lets say it peels off 5 of the vote. Well, you have got senator osoff if thats the case. Lets say it peels off a little more than that. Well, maybe, just maybe, you have democrats in charge of the United States senate. It sure seemed like a long shot on election day when we found out about these runoffs. But if the republicans are going to be fighting republicans in the state of georgia leading up to this election, then suddenly anything is possible, including Mitch Mcconnell losing the majority. Still ahead, back in february President Trump said coronavirus cases were going to go down to zero in a couple of days. Yesterday alone nearly 134,000 americans tested positive. Dr. Vin gupta joins the conversation straight ahead. Conversation straight ahead. An air force veteran made of doing whats right, not whats easy. So when a hailstorm hit, usaa reached out before he could even inspect the damage. Thats how you do it right. Usaa insurance is made just the way martins family needs it with hasslefree claims, he got paid before his neighbor even got started. Because doing right by our members, thats whats right. Usaa. What youre made of, were made for. Usaa were made for. [announcer] forget about vacuuming for up to a month. Shark iq robot deep cleans and empties itself into a base you empty as little as once a month. And unlike standard robots that bounce around it cleans row by row. If its not a shark, its just a robot. Keeping your oysters growing while keeping your business growing has you swamped. you need to hire i need indeed indeed you do. The moment you sponsor a job on indeed you get a shortlist of quality candidates from a resume data base so you can start hiring right away. Claim your seventyfivedollar credit when you post your first job at indeed. Com promo welcome back. We want to turn now to the coronavirus and the United States reporting another record high for daily cases yesterday. According to an nbc news tally, there were nearly 134,000 new infections. Its the first time cases have crossed 130,000 in one day. And it marked the sixth day in a row that the u. S. Recorded more than one thun thousand in a day. The country also reported 729 deaths yesterday. Willie. The Trump Administration trying to take credit for pfizers success in vaccine trials. Vice president mike pence tweeting yesterday claiming it was thanks to a Public Private partnership forged by President Trump. But pfizer made clear it did not receive funding from the Trump Administrations Operation Warp Speed Program thats helped other pharmaceutical companies with research and development. Pfizer has, however, agreed to sell the United States government 100 million doses, striking a deal there. The president also accused the company of waiting until after the election to announce the vaccine news for political purposes. Heres reaction to that from dr. Anthony fauci. What the company will do very likely, in fact im certain they will be doing it, is putting in soon, within the next week and a half or so, for an emergency use authorization and ultimately for ultimate approval of the vaccine, which means if that goes along smoothly that wie ma have doses we are able to give to people by the end of november, the beginning of december, probably well into december. Now, again, you have to go through the hoops of making sure all the is are dotted and the ts are crossed about the safety and regulatory aspects of it, but we would be giving vaccines to people very likely before the end of this year. That is good news. Lets bring in dr. Vin gupta, a pulmonologist and nbc news medical contributor who has been treating Covid Patients for many months now. Great to see you. Start with the headline, the big news about the pfizer vaccine, 90 successful at least in this trial. What are the implications of that and are you as optimistic as dr. Fauci about the possibility of getting some doses out to the public before the end of the year . Good morning, willie. Great to see you. I think just to clarify something for the American Public, because i think, again, its disinformation, its never helpful for trust especially when it comes to a vaccine, pfizer just publish vided a pre release data one week after administration of the second dose of this vaccine. They didnt even have the data before election day. Their enrollees received the first dose the day before election day. The big criticism from the press release was, wow, this is really early data on just 94 people. If you had to find a criticism here. This notion that there is any politics here, its wrong. Its not true, and especially with vaccine and trust, we cant be talking about like this. I want the naysayers to stop there. I will see that if this bears itself out, i mean, this is exceptionally early data in a press release. Its not published data. If it bears itself out to be true over the long term, give it 28 days, end of this month early december, and we still eefficacy of the vaccine in the high 70s, 80 percentile range, this was 90 , which is extraordinary, along the lines of the measles vaccine, that would be great. Then we know we have a pathway to hopefully end this pandemic once there is broad distribution. That brings up the question of distribution. We know this requires a fridge that reaches negative 100 degrees fahrenheit. There are not enough of those across the country. There are logistical issues here. And then to your question, dr. Fauci is probably estimating 20 million doses in highrisk individuals. So the over 65 cohort, 20 million maybe the end of the year. Long way to go to get to 660 million doses, two for every american. Dr. Vin gupta, thank you very much. And coming up, Nbcs Tom Brokaw reflects on the president ial election. What weve lost over the past four years and how to bring it back. Thats next on morning joe. [narrator] with the ninja foodi power pitcher, you can crush ice, make smoothies, and do even more. Chop salsas, spoon thick smoothie bowls, even power through dough, and never stall. The ninja foodi power pitcher. Rethink what a blender can do. We live in the mountains so i like to walk. Im really busy in my life; im always doing something. Im not a person thats going to sit too long. In the morning, i wake up and the first thing i do is go to my art studio. A couple came up and handed me a brochure on prevagen. Ive been taking prevagen for about four years. I feel a little bit brighter and my mind just feels sharper. I would recommend it to anyone. It absolutely works. Prevagen. Healthier brain. Better life. Its still warm. Thanks, alice says hi. For some of us, our daily journey is a short one. Save 50 when you pay per mile with allstate. Pay less, when you drive less. Youve never been in better hands. Allstate. Click or call for a quote today. Welcome back. In just a moment we are going to tackle this question. What would the nations founders have thought of todays United States . Tom ricks joins us with his new book on americas First Principles and what drives the country today. But first, a turbulent election day may finally be behind us, but the road ahead appears to be still quite bumpy. Nbc news Senior Correspondent tom brokaw looks forward at the challenges this country faces while offering up a unique solution of his own. Its a new day in america, but joe biden still faces a lot of the old problems. Yes, he is the president elect, but his own party, many parts of it, are at war with each other. We also have to be dealing with covid virus, which is rapidly expanding once again. We are in a new season for it and all the experts say its going to get worse before it gets better. What do we do about that . I suppose what troubles me most is that neither side in this great contest is willing to give an inch at this point. President trump has lost this election, but he wont acknowledge that. And at the same time, people like Rush Limbaugh will be on the radio all day, every day, attacking the new president , and what he hopes to do. So how do we get out of all of this . One of the ways i have been thinking about it is i think about Abraham Lincoln and what he went through and were comparable to that. Maybe president obama and president bush could form a committee of the best of america and all the parts, the sciences, the religion, education, the cando crowd that has created the greatest nation on earth, and find a way to pull us together, not to separate us. That would be a step in the right direction. There are people waiting to be asked to serve. Think about all of those people in the hospitals across america risking their lives morning and noon and night to take care of the victims of covid. Do you think that they say to each other, are you a republican . Or a democrat . Because i only work with a republican or maybe a democrat. Of course not. They are americans on duty and ready for the call, and we have to find a way to give them that opportunity. By the way, that mountain chain behind me, they are called the crazies, going back to the 19th century. What we dont want is for that mountain chain to be representative of this country during one of the greatest challenges in the history of mankind. Commentary from Nbcs Tom Brokaw. Coming up, one of our next guests says whether trump or biden, its not over. Writer Caroline Randall williams explains what she means by that straight ahead on morning joe. [announcer] welcome to intelligent indoor grilling with the ninja foodi smart xl grill. Just pick your protein, select your doneness, and let the grill monitor your food. It also turns into an air fryer. Bring outdoor grilling flavors indoors with the grill that grills for you. Whareally matters. Mily so do i want to give them ordinary eggs. Or the best . 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Also, were honored to have with us bestselling author and historian ron chern our. We are talking about George Washington today. Ron wrote an extraordinary biography of George Washington. Tom, you are studying our founders and actually how they studied. We have James Madison deciding to break tradition and going to the radical university of new jersey princeton. And then jefferson, of course, william mary, and what he learned in paris and adams at harvard. But George Washington, he had a degree from fort necessity, and the frefrm and indian war. Explain how his challenges in the french and indian war may have been his greatest education. You know, its a spot in america to have a morning tv show and discuss the french and indian war. One of my favorite wars that nobody ever talks about. The french and indian war, colonial fight, the americans are fighting with the british against the french and indians kind of over who is going to take over north america. Washington goes in, helps start the war, actually, and then gets his butt kicked. He surrenders for the only time in his life, a place called fort necessity. And he winds up then in another big battle, braddocks defeat, biggest military encounter on north american soil to that point, in which the indians fought really intelligently, having gone and reconnaissanced the americans in the british coming in for weeks. The first people since the i refer to them, the first peoples fighters really understood warfare in a different way, and i think washington learned there is more than one way to fight a war, as he saw the british suffer this terrible defeat. That really helped him 20 years later in the american revolution. He had seen people born in america defeat a european army. He had seen that you could fight different ways, that you should listen to dissenting voices, and advance reconnaissance, getting scouts out, understanding the people in the terrain is essential. These are all things. He eventually learned to use them during the revolution. I have to say, he didnt start the revolution well. He spent his first couple of years in the war as a pretty conventional thinker. The difference was the british stayed conventional and he began to adjust and change. Well, of course, we seldom talk about it today, but he was harshly criticized by john adams during the war. He was harshly criticized by his own military secretary. He was harshly criticized time and time again. But what you your wonderful biography of washington shows us the human side and what you and tom both touch upon is and i wrote the quote down here. That washington was a man capable of constant selfimprovement. And tom shows that as well in his book, how he started on the offensive in 1775, 1776. Then he decided to do a war of post and then that failed and then he learned to fight like the indians this fought against him in the french and indian war. You know, there were probably, joe, other generals who were greater in terms of military strategy or tactics, but they got sidetracked in terms of personal feuds and jockeying for power. Washington had an inspired simplicity. He kept his eye on his ultimate goal. Some of the other founders, we see their brilliance in the moment. George washington, carries these enormous casts over the eight years of the revolutionary war and the eight years of his presidency. And he was not only hashlly criticized during the war, but we hjust had a president ial campaign in which there was a lot of discussion about conspiracy. Theories. At first he was a political untouchable. But then that wore off, and he was accused of everything from plotting to restore the british monarchy to having been a british double agent throughout the revolutionary war. At first he decide td he wouldn dignify these crack pot ideas with a response. In his second term he wrote an interesting letter in which he realized he said if you drip water on a stove long enough it will leave a mark, and if a lie is repeated often enough people will begin to believe it and he began to respond to his critics. Abo before that point he tried to stay above the partisan fray. Tom, one of the things i love the most about washingtons generalship in first principals by the way, there should be management classes taught about washingtons generalship for years to come. But, tom, you talk about his utter contempt for militia members at the beginning of the war. He didnt discipline them. He couldnt gem them to fight traditional battles. But you describe how the war went on. He decided to use his troops as they could best be used, and you said and washington eventually said, okay, let them fight in their towns. Let them fight their villages. Let them fight. Go out, harass the british, and then bleed back into their villages and towns and that may be the best effective way to actually frustrate the british. In fact, he was right, wasnt he . He was. And youre right. He comes into boston having been told create this american army, and he has never been up there. He is kind of stunned how dirty and unruly the new englanders are. They are not differential to wealth and power in a way he had grown to expect in living in virginia. And he also wants the militiamen to fight like conventional regular forces. Thats not a good idea. They are not trained, they are not prepared to face these terrifying bayonet charges by british regulars. But eventually he realizes, and this is kind of the axiom of the hammer and the saw, if youre trying to hammer using a saw, is it the instruments fault, the tools fault, or is it your fault . He learns use them for what they are good for. And as you say, militiamen were good if they fought in areas they knew, woods they were familiar with, people they knew who they could trust where they could get intelligence, and then let them occasionally drift back to their farms to take care of the farms and maybe do some political work back home, keeping the locals in support of the revolution. This is important because battles only occur occasionally, but armies need to eat every day. After the british kicked washington out of new york and into new jersey, they chased him around new jersey for a long time. They chased americans militia around new jersey for a long time. During the six months after new york, the british army around new york declined in size by half. Illness, desertion, woundings, and captures. And these mainly, almost all, occurred when the foraging parties were out looking for food. The one thing i love is a militia in new jersey knowing the british were looking for food, and especially for meat, put out a herd of cows as a decoy. Then when the british tried to capture the herd of cows, they ambushed the british. And the british were quite shocked. One guy writes home to his father in scotland, he said six months ago we were laughing at these troops. We are not laughing anymore. The americans have turned quite ferocious. Ron, in so many ways donald trump has an an abrigs in the presidency. Filling out a cabinet, in terms of his behavior and negotiating style, which you write about in your book, which is you have to give a little to get a little. Something donald trump does not believe in. What should we expect from a president elect joe biden in terms of some kind of a return to that style of presidency . Well, i was watching joe bidens speech on saturday night, and it had the civility and dignity and grace that we have always associated with president ial addresses since the time of George Washington. George washington established the style and rhetoric of president ial behavior. Because the president has so much power its incumbent on the president to weigh his words carefully. You know, George Washington was once asked to sum up his executive style as president and he said that much was to be gained by prudence, much by conciliation, much by firmness. And i think that so far in this very difficult transitional period joe biden has exercised prudence, he has sewn conciliation, but we may be approaching also have to show firmness. But it listening to the speech on saturday night, i have to say there was it feeling, oh my god, these are the way our president s used to sound and we hope will sound again under joe biden. So, lets go to gene robinson. Willie, you and i, if you see a picture of us five, could we put us up at the same time . You may say which ones do not belong here. Willie, it would be you and me because we are surrounded by Pulitzer Prize winners. So we just heard from a Pulitzer Prize winner. Now lets go to another Pulitzer Prize winner to ask another Pulitzer Prize winner a question. Its lonean here being uneducat. Gene. You do okay, joe. Look, and by the way you write a pretty good column, which you shouldnt be allowed to do because that should be reserved for us guys. Anyhow, i digress. Thank you. Its an honor to be on with two of my very favorite writers. But i got to bring us a little forward from George Washington. I got to ask tom ricks, who knows the pentagon as well as anybody, you know, President Trump just fired his defense secretary. We are going into this 70day period that will be like no other, apparently. What are you hearing in terms of the potential impact on National Security inside the pentagon . How bad could this be . I dont think it will be that bad for the reason that the military are professionals. They know the rules of their profession. And the military lawyers, the jags, are double professionals. They have the ethics of the military plus the ethics of lawyers, which was one reason that the military jags were the first line of defense when the Bush Administration decided to torture prisoners 20 years ago. So i think they will hunker down. They will say we are going it play by the rules. We are going to be double careful about everything we do and we are not just going to jump because somebody in the white house tells us, you know, to jump. I think they will be very, very careful. I think we will get through it. Remember also the office of the secretary of defense may appear powerful from the outside, but at the pentagon its like a little Hilltop Village of a couple hundred people with millions of soldiers and sailors and marines whooping and hollering around them and not paying attention to the office of the secretary of defense. I want to say one thing about biden, what ron just said, because it made me think of a connection between washington and biden. I first met joe biden, i think, about 45 years ago. We had dinner together with a small group when i was in college. My impression then was he could not shut up. 20 years later, i went up to interview him on capitol hill. I asked him one question and he yakked away for 45 minutes and didnt say a lot. He couldnt shut up. I said this is a waste of time as a reporter. I was so impressed by him during the campaign and the last week especially. This is a guy who thinks and talks differently than he did during a very long career on capitol hill. Someone probably getting within himself has taught this guy to operate to think differently, and its good to see. Yeah, he was always considered, when you had to do Public Events with him, the easiest interviews because you only had to come up with one question. Joe would take care of the rest of it for you. What i find interesting, tom, about the situation that we find ourselves in right now and we have over the past four years is that the presidency really reflects, what you say was George Washingtons view of what the presidency should be, and that is an institution that is guided by a man, he would think just a man, with public virtue. And you talk about at the end of your book the generation gap between washington and madison and hamilton, and of course you bring up that it was madison who said, if men were angels, government would not be necessary. Washington believed that angels were only capable of filling the white house. To seat the white house. I wonder if we are paying for George Washingtons naivete right now . Well, washington also established these norms, most notably the twoterm presidency, stepping down and retiring from public life as the way we expect president s to act. I think madison and hamilton abo become so much more important. I would love to see ron write a book on madison, sort of to complete his review of those people. I loved your hamilton book. As i read it, i said somebody should make an opera out of this, and then i realized they already did. I loved your washington book. But washington is very conscious that they are making it up as they go along. He says in his farewell address, he refers to the american experiment. And there is not a lot of memorable phrases from washington, but that is one. The american experiment. He knew that we were figuring this out, that we were sometimes on thin ice, and this thing could blow up, and it did with the civil war, and it could again. So i think we have to be conscious of his warning that this is an experiment and we can still blow it. All right. Ron, go ahead. Final thought. Final thought. Wonderful moment to remember George Washington because he was someone who celebrated not only for exercising power, but surrendering power when he surrendered his commission at the end of the revolutionary war, king george iii said if he gives up his commission he will be the greatest man in the world. And then there was no 22nd amendment. He could have had a third term as president if he wanted to. When he attended the inauguration of president adams in 1787, he walked over like a private scitizen. Adam says washington would be mortallized by posterity. As they were waiting for washington to lead first, and washington stepped aside. He insisted this president adams and Vice President jefferson leave the hall first. Amazing. The book is first principals what americas founders learned from the greeks and romans and how it shaped our country. It is out today. Buy it. You will absolutely love it. Thank you so much for being with us, tom and ron. Thank you, as always. We greatly appreciate it. Tomorrow we are going to take a closer look at the impact of john adams. Still ahead, our next guest is asking america to turn toward the light. Author, winning poet, and awardwinning poet and author carolyn Randall Williams joins us with her loving chastise. For america. Keep it right here on morning joe. Mbers like martin. An air force veteran made of doing whats right, not whats easy. So when a hailstorm hit, usaa reached out before he could even inspect the damage. Thats how you do it right. Usaa insurance is made just the way martins family needs it with hasslefree claims, he got paid before his neighbor even got started. Because doing right by our members, thats whats right. Usaa. What youre made of, were made for. Usaa were made for. With the ninja foodito intelligesmart xl grill. Ing just pick your protein, select your doneness, and let the grill monitor your food. It also turns into an air fryer. Bring outdoor grilling flavors indoors with the grill that grills for you. Lift it press it downward dog it splash it walk it with one of the largest medicare gym networks, renew active gives you so many ways to be healthy. Get medicare with more. Im proud the coalition we put and most Diverse Coalition in the history. Democrats, republicans, independents, progressives, moderates, conservatives, young, old, urban, suburban, rural, gay, straight, transgender, white, latino, asian, native american. I mean it. Especially in those moments, and especially those moments where this campaign was at its lowest ebb. The Africanamerican Community stood up again for me. Youve always had my back, and ill have yours. Thats president elect joe biden on saturday night in wilmington, delaware. Gene, your latest piece for the Washington Post is titled black lives matter and so do black votes. Biden there directly referring to your home state, gene, of South Carolina. If you want to go back to late february when he was at his low point, fourth place in iowa, fifth place in New Hampshire, here come black voters in South Carolina to save his campaign, and now hes the president elect. Thats absolutely right. He was his campaign was dead in the water. You know, we saw him in New Hampshire that morning when he appeared on morning joe. We were all there at the restaurant in New Hampshire and he was his campaign was over. It seemed to be over. Then everybody went to he went to South Carolina, actually took off for South Carolina before, you know, before the results were in from New Hampshire because he knew he wouldnt do well. He went to South Carolina and on the 26th of february, he was endorsed by jim clyburn, the most powerful and influential africanamerican politician certainly in South Carolina arguably in the country given his status as majority whip. And his passionate endorsement rocketed biden to a landslide victory in the South Carolina primary. And that just propelled him on to the nomination and the consensus nominee. And throughout, he had the overwhelming support of africanamericans and the same thing hand in the general election when africanamericans won him back the blue wall of wisconsin, michigan, pennsylvania. They certainly did. And i joked at the time that twitter and a lot of progressive columnists had buried joe biden bul politically. And then black voters in South Carolina said, hold my beer. We havent had a chance to vote yet. And changed the direction of that election. And sure enough, like you said, gene, joe biden was losing in wisconsin. And then what happened . Milwaukee county came in. Black voters won wisconsin for him. He was losing in michigan. And then wayne county came in. Black voters won that state for him. It happened in pennsylvania when black voters in philly came in. Same thing with georgia. So lets bring in right now the author, poet and writer at vanderbilt university. This is a vandy conspiracy also. Caroline randal williams. Caroline, lets read from your piece called a loving chastisement for america. Joe biden has won, but it doesnt feel like its over. Those who voted for the republican, a staggering 70 million as of friday evening, will find a more conventional ambassador next time. The 45th president was an aberration only insofar of his corruption and it was brazen instead of subtle. His appearance clownish instead of slick. But the people who voted for him are plenteous, and they have been conditioned for this big tree, not just by the last four years but by centuries. Im on americas side, but as my grandfather said, love involves chastisement. I love the idea of an america that is free and equal, but we are not there yet. And caroline, i especially love this line, and i read it yesterday. Its why i wanted so much for you to be on the show. Its beautiful. Thanks to my father, whom i loved very much, i am an unabashed, fairly oldfashioned patriot. That surprises people. But why cant i speak out against americas ills and then, with unreserved good faith, contemplate its promise. Joe, im so grateful to you for having me on the show, first of all, this morning. And second of all, for hearing the right spirit behind peace and then third for picking out that line because to me, it really speaks to the necessity that we need to have to return to embracing the fact that two things can be true at once. And i think about just the last segment. Where you all talked about how washington established norms for the presidency. And i thought to myself, though, norms are not laws. You know, the question of the way we expect an american president to act, he did establish some norms but he also had some norms that we thank god have abandoned. We dont expect it to be a norm any longer that president s own slaves or deny women the right to vote. Its really important to me that we maintain a practice of continuing to relentlessly put things into context and frame and reframe them so that we can really push this experiment to live up to like the capacity of our dream for it. Its willie geist. Im a part of this vanderbilt conspiracy so its great to see you. Proudly so. Its an amazing piece. I hope everybody reads it because you tell your own story so well and so deeply and how far it goes back to your grandfather being one of the first black men elected since reconstruction in the state of tennessee. Your father being a conservative republican who worked for george w. Bush in the United States army. So when you sat down to write this, youre looking at these Election Results coming in. Okay, joe biden won. For you, thats the good news. For a lot of people in the country, thats good news. Now were looking at 71 Million People who voted again for donald trump. Many, many more than voted for him in 2016. So what did that tell you, and how did that compel you to write this piece . I think it told me an old, hard truth which is that people are prepared to vote either for economics above equity, which is inherently a position of privilege that is, as best, ignorant and at worst racist. And it also told me that lee atwater was really smart and that whatever he planted in the seeds of the white house and in the minds of americans abides and is terrifying. And i really think that it called me to call to account the republicans that havent yet followed joes model and Nicolle Wallaces model and Michael Steeles model of really coming to reproach their party because i think that what the party needs to reckon with is this question of, what do you do with the fact that, at the moment, the conservative ideological set is not and i dont know if it ever will again be the popular will of the American People if you actually excise the bigots. Is it a form of oldfashioned conservativism that can be applied to american politics when you take into account human error and by that i mean implicit bias and social and political structures that currently count on the decency of the people with the power in order for equity to be ensured in terms of the application of the law. And then if there is a form of oldfashioned conservatism that can be applied, what does that look like . Because for black people in this country, theres no separating of cultural issues from practical political issues because the practical truth of my life is that it matters, right . And if the policies on the other side dont reinforce that, i dont know how i can come to the table. Gene robinson . So for chastisement to work, the person being chastised has to, in fact, feel chastised. How do you induce that feeling, that knowledge . Well, you know, i think its we have to figure that out because i think, you know, joe talked about a cultural civil war thats happening. I think economics are the first one. Its why i lived in mississippi for fives years and loved it, and it was costing them noun have that flag on their flag. So they changed it. And i think that maybe we have to try a different tactic and that may be part of it. Caroline, im so thankful youre on today. You said what ive caught myself saying more and more. Its almost like im a dbt counselor. Two things even be true at the same time. There can be truths in 1619 and 1776 and we need to figure out how to bring those two truths together. Thank you so much for being with us today. I hope you come back. Yeah, i would love to. Thank you so much for having me. All right. Thank you. That does it for us this morning. Chris jansing picks up the coverage right now. Hi there. Im Chris Jansing in for stephanie ruhle. Its tuesday, november 10th. Weve got a ton of breaking news were watching. On the fight against the coronavirus, the u. S. Setting yet another daily record on monday with nearly 134,000 new cases marking the sixth day in a row the nation surpassed 100,000 cases. On the health care front, today the Supreme Court is set to hear arguments in a case that could mean the end of the Affordable Care act. That would mean no more health care for more than 20 million americans. At the Justice Department, the top prosecutor who cracks down on election crimes resigned in protest overnight after ag bill barr directed federal prosecutors to investigate voter fraud before Election Results are even certified. Also this morning, well get our first chance to question Senate Republicans since the election. And that is all against the backdrop of