Transcripts For MSNBCW Morning Joe 20200409

Closes in on 15,000. The nations epicenter, new york state, also recorded its highest number of deaths in a single day, 779. At 151,000 confirmed cases, new york state alone now has more cases than any other country, except, of course, the United States. There is, however, a glimmer of hope. The number of hospitalizations in the state continues to decline. Governor andrew cuomo says it is a sign that the social distancing measures are working. We are flattening the curve by what we are doing. If we stop what we are doing, you will see that curve change. That curve is purely a function of what we do day in and day out. Its not a time to get complacent. Its not a time to do anything different than we have been doing. We know now, for sure, that the mitigation that we have been doing is having a positive effect. But you dont see it until weeks later. Remember, this past weekend, all of us got up in front of this podium and mentioned that this was going to be a really bad week. At the same time, we were saying we would hope wed start to see a little bit of a change in the daily hospitalizations, intensive care, and intubations. We need to keep mitigating. We know that this is something that is a strain on the american public, but it is just something that we have. Not only the only tool, but its the best tool. If you go back to listen to dr. Fauci throughout the entire process, hes been predicting what was going to happen. He predicted this would be a bad week, bad couple of weeks, but we might possibly start bending the curve. Still, if we could put up that chart again that shows 431,000 cases in the United States right now. Of course, you talk to any Health Care Providers from the beginning of this crisis, they certainly have been telling me and other email offline, you can usually multiply whatever numbers you see by seven, eight, nine, even tenfold. So if we have 431,000 cases in america, actually, were, i think every scientist, every medical expert that has been studying will tell you were over a million cases easily, probably in the 2, 3, 4 million case range. That said, you cant look at those numbers, you cant look at the deaths, you cant look at where we are and not go back to donald trump saying that, you know, back in january that january 22nd, oh, we only have one case from china, and weve taken care of it. Its under control. Later saying, there are 11 cases. The end of february saying, we have 15 cases. Soon, itll be down to zero. I dont think a federal government, i dont think a white house has ever been as wrong as this president and this white house has been. Its not really fair to say this white house. Because we have found out over the past week, whether it was peter navarro, whether it was deputy nsa, there were people warnings came from all over. Harsh warnings. The cdc started getting information together last year on december 31st. But here we are. Yesterday, of course, the absolute worst day when it came to deaths, but some signs, as dr. Fauci said, some signs of hope that at least this first wave, we may be flattening the curve in this first wave. Yeah. You can add in the intelligence agencies of this country, which warned the white house and warned Public Officials that this was happening in china and it was coming to the United States. Of course, those warnings largely ignored by the white house, unfortunately. The good news that we hear from dr. Fauci is that the National Death toll number, he believes, will be lower than they initially expected. When they came out, he and dr. Birx said it could be between 100,000 to 240,000 americans dead from coronavirus. It stopped us in our tracks. He said because of social distancing, and now because were doing things we should have been earlier, the number could be lower. Same in new york city. The number of hospitalizations is down. The death number is, again, staggering. 779 yesterday. If, the governor says, we continue on this path. Of course, the danger is people see the numbers and see hospitalizations down, its getting better. If they stop behaving the way weve been behaving the last couple weeks, which is responsively and distancing socially, that it does work. Thats the bottom line. Any doctor you ask says this does work. Jonathan lemire, we talked a little yesterday about places the president has looked to assign blame. Governors, they should have been ready with their own ventilators. The World Health Organization now. He has a sense that this is bad and worse than he said it was going to be, and hes looking for people to blame. Thats right, willie. It is a deliberate strategy. We see this from this president. It is accepting no responsibility and giving no inch. We saw its a playbook hes used before. Most notably, of course, with around the events that led to his impeachment. The phone call with the ukrainian leader in which he pressured that Foreign Government to investigate a political rival, joe biden, a call that made other republicans queasy at the time. The president , of course, referred to it, and always has, as a perfect call. Were seeing the same thing here. We wrote i wrote on this for today. He has cycled furiously through scapegoats, places to assign blame. Democratic governors, most notably. Of course, after biting his time about china for quite some time, because he didnt want to offend xi jinping as they hammer out a trade deal, he turned his broadsides toward beijing, accusing them of holding back information. He accused the Obama Administration for not keeping the cupboard full, which was not factually correct. He attacked joe biden as being part of the effort. The last couple days, hes going after the World Health Organization. It is a deliberate strategy for trump and trump allies. These have been fanned out to the rnc, influential republicans, to allies on the hill and, of course, to some members of the conservative media, happily picking that up. We now have a white house that is restaffed. Chief of staff mark meadows has moved in. He has changed the communications division. On a quit note, the new press secretary, kayleigh mcenany, saying she was a fox contributor, she was actually just a frequent fox news guest. Were seeing an onslaught from the president. It all stems from the podium. This is where he turned the james s. Brady Briefing Room into a rallying stage. Could be ohio, could be like he is in pennsylvania, like he is in north carolina, where he is spinning, not trading with facts, sparring with reporters, and he is disseminating untruths. But, you see, the thing s its not working. You can look at any series of polls that have come out. Those briefings are actually hurting him. Because when people go to a trump rally, they make that decision themselves. They understand hes not going to be telling the truth. They understand theyre going into an arena, and theyre going to be having their own special little thing, where he plays the greatest hits, they cheer. They say, make America Great again, and everybody goes home happy. Here, he is speaking to a general audience. He is lying. He is revealing himself every day to be incompetent. Hes got too many quotes. Hes got too many actions. Hes got too many things, mika, that hes done over the past two or three months that reveal him. I was just laughing when jonathan talked about his lackeys in the media, online, who are trying to defend him. Theres nothing to defend. Theres just nothing to defend. There are too many quotes. There are too many lies. There are too many obvious mistruths. I said it a long time ago. The pandemic doesnt understand the art of the deal. You cant b. S. A pandemic. You cant negotiate with a pandemic. You cant bully a pandemic. You cant sort of skirt the edges of the truth with a pandemic. It is what it is. It aint what it aint. And it is not, it is not susceptible to spinning from either donald trump or his legions of lackeys. You cant negotiate, and you cant spin death. You just cant do it. New signs from the west coast give hope that new infections may be leveling off. Several states announced this week that they are sending ventilators to new york, since their need is now less urgent. A little over 1,000 ventilators will be dispatched from california, oregon, and Washington State. According to several reports, a Field Hospital in seattle is being dismantled and will soon be returned to fema so it can be deployed to another state with more significant coronavirus needs. Washington was one of the earliest and hardest hit states by the pandemic, seeing over 9,000 confirmed covid19 cases, and nearly 400 deaths. Willie, were going to be talking about how these expert projections are going to go down. About a week ago, i tweeted out, looking at the death rate in california, looking at the infection rate in california, specifically San Francisco. From the beginning, i thought new york and San Francisco were going to be the hardest hit. I think most people believed that. But the numbers just werent coming out of california. I said, wait, are we really getting to 240,000 or 100,000 cases . One of the reasons i questioned that was because of what an incredible job the governor of california has done from the very beginning. The mayor of San Francisco, governor jay inslee. They all acted quickly. Thats why i think, in large part, one of the reasons, if we dont get to 100,000, 240,000 by august and, again, i must say this, in the first wave. The pandemic of 1918 had two waves. In the first wave, in large part, it is because of the great leadership of those west coast governors and west coast mayors. I was texting with an emergency room doctor from seattle last night. Funny you mentioned that. He said, our leaders is to be applauded. He has no political skin in the game. He is literally running in and out of the e. R. Every day. Washington state was the canary in the coal mine for the United States. The one nursing home in kirkland, washington, 37 people died. You said, wait a minute, what is going on with coronavirus . From that moment forward, Washington State took this very seriously. They now, as you pointed out, are shipping their ventilators to other states. Theyre taking down a Field Hospital, much the way that new york is building a Field Hospital in central park. Seattle had built one near the football and baseball complex, where the seahawks and mariners play. Theyre taking it down because they dont think theyll need it. Thats because they took the early steps. One thing to look at, today, well see this jobless number. Every thursday, weve been getting this jawdropping number. Its going to be worse than last week. Remember, we saw 10 million over the last two weeks, unemployment claims. This week is going to be worse. Why do i bring that up . As Jonathan Lemire and others pointed out, the president is entertaining the idea of opening up portions of the economy again. What that means exactly, we dont know yet. We know he wants to do that. If he sees another massive unemployment number, which he is going to see, theres going to be increased pressure from people around him to say, hey, weve got to get the economy started again. Were cratering here. He may feel that pressure. Thats the danger, if he decides he does want to open parts of the economy. We could see this outbreak all over again. Willie, they have to be so careful. You were talking about seattle. We could talk again about jay inslee in Washington State. We could talk about gavin newsom taking early steps. But you read the New York Times today, and read about these genome studies that have been done by hospitals in new york city, and they, once again, indicate the importance of moving early, of acting early. Because most of the cases in new york, in an awful lot of the cases, studies are showing, came from europe and didnt come from china. You had the Deputy National security adviser, pottinger, begging the administration in late january to cut off travel coming in from europe. Steve mnuchin and donald trump, as we learned in the Washington Post article this past weekend, refused to do that. They refused to do that because they thought it would hurt the economy and it would hurt the stock market. Well, now we know. Those were an extra two, three i think it might have been a month. I have to check the exact dates. But because they didnt listen to the Deputy National security adviser and continued having the flighting coming in from italy and the rest of europe, you know, so much of what new york is dealing with now has to do with those european travelers. Yeah. That was an interesting bit of research that was in the New York Times. We think so much about china, but a lot of this came from europe. Youre right about that. The good news is, as doctors and Public Health officials will tell you, is theres still time for these parts of the country that havent been hit if they adhere to social distancing and all these things that dr. Fauci and dr. Birx told us yesterday are working and will bring down the death toll in this country. You need the president to lead from the top on that and say, hey, this is working. Were going to continue this for a while. Its painful, but in the long run, itll be better than the alternative. Jonathan, id ask you what kind of pressure the president is feeling about opening the economy. We know it is his instinct. He wanted it open by easter, backed off of that. Who around him is saying, hey, mr. President , this jobs number today is going to be bad. Its time to get this economy cranked up again . I know he feels the pressure, and he probably feels it in his own gut. No question. In fact, i think its been almost underreported, how close he was to reopening the economy at that easter target day. Hes played it down, claiming it was more of an aspirational date. He had really fallen for the symbolism of an American Economic rebirth on easter sunday, which is, of course, this coming sunday. Wanted to pull the trigger on it until he was talked out of it after being shown in a dramatic Oval Office Meeting by dr. Fauci and dr. Birx, spreading maps across the resolute desk, saying how bad the death toll could be. Thats even with the social distancing guidelines in place for most of the country. This is something thats still with a significant debate within the west wing. The president is pushing for a reopening of the economy. In part, because connected to what we talked about a few minutes ago, his efforts to spin this, deflect blame, have not worked. The trump playbook of shifting, of denying and deflecting and blaming others has not played out. Its being reflected in the polls. There is a push to change things. Obviously, they have one eye toward november, toward reelection. If the economy continues to falter, and theyre watching the numbers carefully, there is going to be renewed push from the president to try to push forward. As i will say as a final point, were already seeing chatter in the conservative media that may 1st, may 1st should be the day where most of the nation goes back to job. Even though a lot of the Health Experts suggested that is still far too soon. Well, of course impossible. Where you want to get your information is from the protrump media. Because they have been so spot on. Deadly accurate from the beginning of this process. Why listen to medical advisers . Please, please, get your health advise from the protrump media. And watch another 200,000 americans die. No. We dont listen to the protrump media because they listen to his lies, recirculate his lies, and the numbers are tragic. I was checking the numbers on the european travel. This is important. The two studies that have been made by mt. Sinai and nyu school of medicine have remarkably similar conclusions. When the coronavirus started circulating around in february, most of the genomes point back to europe and not china. This is why thats important for future leaders, to understand the importance in pandemics or epidemics of moving quickly. The end of january, as i said, Deputy National security adviser pottinger asked all european travel be closed down. End of january. Donald trump wasted a month. Actually, up to five, six weeks. Actually, because he was worried about the stock market, kept, kept open travel from italy, travel from europe, until march the 11th. Thats when the european ban finally came into play. During all of that time. Weve been asking all along, why was new york disproportionately hit . Again, we thought San Francisco, los angeles, seattle, which had more commercial ties with china, lets say, than the east coast. Youd think because of travel. It was actually europe that hit hardest, according to these two new studies that are out. It hit hardest when it started circulating in midfebruary. In large part, probably because, once again, the advice of somebody inside the white house, in january, was ignored. So Jonathan Lemire has been writing about the blame game and how this president has constantly, every day, tried to every day shift the game on the w. H. O. , or this or that, or the liberal media. Theres some basic problems this time in terms of this scandal versus all other trump scandals. Number one, if your child or your spouse or your parent is ill, doctors become your lifeline for information. Matter. You want so much for that person to get better. This scandal, this botched prep for this pandemic, this one has called for all americans participation. Everybodys life has been uprooted. Children are not in school. People cant leave their homes. It has called for our participation. In some respects, some of the numbers are going down because of what americans have done for themselves. So, unlike any other trump scandal, because everybody is so invested in this, and everybody is so involved, you know, making the moves to stop the spread, people are compelled to read about it. People are compelled to talk to their doctors. People are compelled to understand what happened here. When they look at the facts, the facts are not good for the way this white house did not prepare. Really, truly, just trump, and maybe his soninlaw and a few other trump inner circle members. There were people desperately trying to tell this president that this was coming. And it is clear when you look at the facts, and when you look at what americans are doing to save themselves. Why didnt they start earlier . Thats what theyre going to ask. Right. Thats the information thats never, ever going to be branded away by this president. Kasie hunt let me just say, first of all, this isnt just its not a trump scandal. Its a national it is an international scandal. It is a national tragedy. This is a national tragedy. Again, we have to be more careful in our language and stop talking about the white house and blaming the entire white house. Youre right. Again, you had youre right. Last year, you had hhs secretary azar saying what kept him up at night was the fear of a pandemic. Trying to get through to trump. Global pandemic. You had the cdc, on december 31st of last year, starting to assemble information about this growing crisis coming out of china. You had azar, the hhs secretary, on january the 3rd, getting the information about it. You had, actually, the intel agency starting to warn the president in his daily president ial briefings in early january about the coming crisis. You could go through the month of january. Look, on the 18th of january, you have the hhs secretary finally be allowed to talk to the president about the coming pandemic. The president actually didnt like azar, so azar had trouble getting through to him. Instead of listening about the possibility of this coming pandemic, he, instead, was upset with azar and wanted to know when flavored vaping materials would be available again in the public. Then you go bow eyond that, a w later, is when we get the harsh warning, ten days later, really harsh warning from navarro, talking about how 500,000 americans could die. Yeah. The white house was illprepared and illsuited for this crisis and they better get moving. The president was still saying, nothing to see here. Only one person. Only 11 people. Even late into february, only 15 people with this disease. Itll magically go away. And of late, the president , you know, having a ship captain removed for trying to save the sailors. Sailors with coronavirus on the uss roosevelt right now. He has the person removed. Well he erupts when reporters ask about the timeline. It is hard to watch because its like the emperors clothes fall off every day during the briefings. The ship captain, again, donald trump was able to shift blame. The assistant secretary of the navy was relieved, resigned, which should have been. Its a mess. There are all these issues circulating around, kasie hunt. Again, so many of them, if the president would just put his head down and do his job and stop trying to turn medical press briefings into political rallies, stop worrying about his ratings and start worrying about how Many Americans are dying every day, then this would all be taken care of during the election. He just cant do it. Now, we get a clearer focus of what that election, what the political showdown is going to be. Bernie sanders, yesterday, decided to get out of the race. It certainly makes joe biden the Presumptive Democratic nominee. Tell us how that came about and what we should expect. Sure. So, i mean, i think the pandemic is driving a lot of this. Bernie sanders acknowledged when he talked to supporters yesterday that, you know, this is a desperate moment for our country. This is a time where democrats do all need to be on the same page. I think theyve got some work to do to get there, on to the same page. This was really out of character, i actually think, for Bernie Sanders. It speaks to the gravity of the situation that weve just been spending the last half an hour discussing. I think thats whats really driving this here. He is an incredibly stubborn politician who did not get out last time. I think he has a good relationship, better relationship with joe biden than he did with hillary clinton. That could also help them going forward. But, you know, joe biden still has a long way to go. Theres a lot of challenges associated with running a campaign in this pandemic. But i was talking a couple days ago to a really smart republican who pointed out to me that the president is going to be judged at the end of the day on how this comes out. Not necessarily how it started. How it started is going to be a huge part of that, but only because it is driving the end result. That means that the president s decisions day in and day out, about whether to open the economy, for example, still stand to be the most important and critical decisions that he is making in the context of whether he is going to win reelection. I think one of the things that swayed the president , and it was in that Washington Post story that you mentioned, joe, and i read through the memo from the republican pollster, and it literally said that people were believing what this president was saying about the coronavirus, to the point that the president s supporters were not taking steps to protect themselves. For the president s base, denial was actually not going to be a strategy for survival. It was that intense. I think thats the debate that this president is going to continue to have to have. Because if you listen to doctors birx and if ffauci, were not oe other side, where we can open the economy. The president is putting the lives of his own supporters, more than anyone else in the country, on the line if he makes the wrong decisions here. Thats exactly what gop pollster Neil Newhouse said. He actually said that he said it a little more subtly than this, but the president s lies, the president s presentation of alternative facts, this gop pollster who has been around a long time, widely respected in the Republican Party and certainly on capitol hill. He said that trump supporters, if they believed what the president was saying, were actually putting themselves and their loved ones health and lives literally in danger. That was a feeling, by the way, on capitol hill across republican members of the house and senate, as well. Neil newhouses memo to the republicans certainly, i think, had an impact. A lot of them were already there, mika. They understood this was a pandemic. They understood what the president was saying was disconnected from reality. Like a lot of americans, they were listening, instead, to what dr. Fauci and what dr. Birx were saying. Well, and what the top scientists are saying, and it is being echoed by other scientists whose life it is to understand the facts here, is were 18 months away, potentially, 18 months away from having a robust way of containing the virus with a vaccine, antibody testing. That could move up, but it is not may 1st. Still ahead on morning joe, from two of the hardest hit states, senator Kiersten Gillibrand of new york. And governor murphy joins the conversation. Plus, our interview with addy lady gaga about the celebrity effort to help with the pandemic. Plus, well talk to an american journalist in china on what is being done to prevent another wave of cases. Youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. Boston light, americas oldest lighthouse, has stood strong through every dark hour and bright dawn our country has endured. It has seen the break in the clouds before anyone else. For the past 168 years, weve also stood by you, helping you weather storms like this one, to protect your loved ones. And well do it for 168 more. Helping you weather storms like this one, there are times when our need to connect really matters. To keep customers and employees in the know. To keep business moving. Comcast business is prepared for times like these. Powered by the nations largest gigspeed network. To help give you the speed, reliability, and security you need. Tools to manage your business from any device, anywhere. And a team of experts here for you 24 7. Weve always believed in the power of working together. Thats why, when every connection counts. You can count on us. 10 downing street says Prime Minister Boris Johnson is, quote, improving after spending a third night in intensive care for coronavirus complications. The countrys foreign minister says johnson is thousand snow s and n in bed and, quote, engaging with the team at the hospital. The city of 11 million, wuh wuhan, where the coronavirus first emerged is reopening. There are now concerns of a resurgence of infections as thousands leave the city. China announced new measures to contain asymptomatic carriers of the virus. Hospitals must report these patients within two hours of discovering a case. Local authorities must identify all known contacts within 24 hours. These asymptomatic carriers will be quarantined together then for 14 days, as will their close contacts be quarantined. According to local media, around 65,000 people have left wuhan on trains and planes within hours of that lockdown ending. Joining us now, anchor for China Global Television network, jonathan betts. He is based inside beijing. Good morning. Good to have you with us today. What can you tell us about the impact of that lockdown being lifted, the place, of course, where the World Health Organization, on december 31st of last year, first learned there was an outbreak of coronavirus . It is good news, ive got to tell you, here in china. We are slowly seeing things return to normal. A bit of good news after a very long, hard time for people in china. Things arent back to normal. In beijing, a lot of restrictions remain in place. A lot of bars are still closed, gyms, movie theaters, many restaurants. The places that have reopened, there are a lot of rules in place. Like social distancing guidelines. We have to wear a mask everywhere, temperature checks everywhere. To this day, i cannot travel freely around the country. We can roam around beijing, but a lot of the travel restrictions remain in place. The fight is not over. It definitely continues here in china, trying to contain this covid19. Jonathan, we in the United States have looked to china as a precursor of what may come here to the United States with stops along the way in europe and iran and other places like that. But what has it looked like to have this lockdown lifted . In other words, what were the circumstances under which the Chinese Government said, okay, we can slowly begin to get back to life the way it was before this outbreak started . Basically, theyre looking at the deaths and looking at the number of locally transmitted infections. Those pretty much dropped off. China has that under control, it seems. The big concern right now is people that are asymptomatic and people that could bring the infection from another country. So china is very concerned about that. It has moved mountains, without question, to try to bring this virus under control. Its worried some of the work might be erased if people travel into the country or even within the country and reinfect pockets of the country. So that is a huge concern right now. They are really tightening the restrictions when it comes to travel, to try to make sure that people who do test positive are put into quarantine. Even those who are not testing positive, just anybody that arrives into beijing, that flies into beijing, they are put into a twoweek quarantine at a government hotel. That is pretty tightly enforced. These are very, very severe restrictions, and it shows, i think, how seriously china is taking this, and how badly it wants to bring the virus number down to zero. Jonathan betts with China Global Television network. American journalist who worked across the United States, as well. Great to have you with us. Well check back in with you as this goes on. Thank you. Joe, obviously, as we said a million times on this show, there is not a grain of salt big number to take with the numbers out of china. When they reported a couple days ago, no new deaths, i dont think anyone believed that. But you can look at the impact of their actions. When they end a lockdown in wuhan, for example, and you see all these people flooding out of the city, are they taking that to other places with them . Yes, we can look to china, but we have to be weary of the data that comes out of china. You have to be weary of the data. You have to be very weary of the numbers. You cant trust any of the numbers out of china. Again, youre right, you can look at the macro view of whats happened there. How long they were locked down and when they start to open up the restrictions, whats happening beyond there. Mika, it points to something youve been talking about for a few days now. That is, when this first wave is over, actually, the real challenge of leadership then comes. Its one thing for a president or a governor or a mayor to say, were shutting everything down. Its another to try to figure out, after the first wave is over, and lets hope it will be over by june, but after that first wave is over, then were going to find ourselves in a position that china is in. Where the first big wave is over. They flattened the curve. Now, theyve got to figure out how to get people back to work, how to get the economy started again, even in small measures. Right. You look at singapore. They have a second wave coming. South korea talking about concerns about a second wave coming. China, obviously, when they open up their economy again, they will see that second wave coming. So the real challenge, as we move forward over the next six months to a year, to possibly a year to 18 months, when we finally get that vaccine that makes this concern a little less immedia immediate. That will be amazing. The question is, how do we live with coronavirus, day in and day out . Thats where the real challenge in leadership comes in the coming six months to a year. There have been challenges along the way. Again, the president says he closed off china. He closed off europe. He didnt. Unfortunately, the American People can see with their eyes and their losses that it is here. With 14,000 people dead so far. So if you dont read and see that actually people still came in after his the moves he says he made, you can see that it is here. The problem is, again, weve been talking about europe and how the president didnt listen to his own National Security advisers. Yeah. When they asked him to shut down travel from europe at the end of january. He didnt do it. Again, because he was worried about the stock market. He was worried about the economy. That allowed a lot of people from europe to come over and infect, especially a lot of new yorkers, according to these two latest studies that the New York Times reporting on the day. Incredible. But, again, even when he brags that he shut down china, he didnt. There were so many exceptions. 40,000 people, even after the socalled ban it was a toothless ban 40,000 people still came over from china after that socalled ban. 430,000 came over from the time that the coronavirus epidemic first started to now. So we havent shut down travel. Its caused an awful lot of problems. For those liberals that were saying that its whatever they were saying. It was like racist or xenophobic to shut down travel. No, thats science. I know theres a debate. Dr. Fauci and others were saying, no, maybe we should, maybe we shouldnt. Come on, it makes sense. If youre going to slow down the rate of infection, then you need to shut down the borders. You need to shut down travel. Those are some issues, also, that we have to keep thinking about as we move forward. Yeah. Coming up, its a common factor across china, italy, and the United States. Far more men are being hospitalized for coronavirus than women. Well talk to our chief medical correspondent about that. Also, some new numbers on deaths of younger americans from the virus. Morning joe is coming right back. More than ever, your home is your sanctuary. Thats why lincoln offers you the ability to purchase a new vehicle remotely with participating dealers. 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Dont forget, looking at cases im not going to insult anybody or any country. But im looking at countries that are showing less cases than us. Thats testing. Were testing more than anybody. You saw exponentially more than anybody, by far. Our testing has become i think itll end up being a big strength. In fact, other countries the media talked about are now calling us for what are we doing and how are we doing it so quickly and where are we getting these tests . Our tests are really good now. Theyve been proven to be very accurate. Saying, literally this is not a literally nobody in the world is asking that question. Competition. What theyre asking, and you see it from one leader after another, theyre asking how the United States of america could be so far behind in testing. How did we screw it up . He attacked the World Health Organization yesterday, by the way. The World Health Organization, i think in early february, sent out 250,000 tests. 250,000 tests. The same time the cdc sent out 90 tests across the country. Those didnt work. Donald Trumps Administration did such a bad job with testing that by the end of february, the fda had said to the cdc, if you were a private organization, we would shut you down. We still dont the fda then had to open up testing to private industry. Because the Trump Administration had failed so badly. The president also lies heres the deal. If youre stupid, please dont admit it on twitter, okay . Dont know if you know that or not, but when you tweet at me or somebody else, showing your stupidi stupidity, we can all see it. Its in the public. And, you know, so when you say that weve tested more than anybody else. How can you be putting this information out, fake news media, joe. You see, we have 320 Million People in this country. If you look at how were doing per capita, per person, which really is what matters, because you really even if you are stupid, you dont compare numbers for what california is doing. Maybe you are stupid, judging by the tweets you send. But you look per person, per patient, per capita. We have been lagging on testing from the beginning. The administration has admitted it. The fda has admitted it. Dr. Fauci has admitted it. It would have been nice. It would have made a huge difference. This was a 1 trillion mistake on Donald Trumps part, to not get in front of this like they did in south korea. We both had our first patient infected from the same day. The South Koreans moved on it quickly. Within a week, they had a test that worked. We continued bungling it, while the president continued saying, in late january and february, nothing to see here. Its all magically going to go away. Dr. Birx yesterday talked about how, what, like 80 alex, is that right . 80 of some of these testing machines arent even being used, arent working. Is that right, alex . Yeah, okay. Two yeses from alex. It must be true. Anyway, so our testing is a mess. The president keeps lying about it, like those lies are going to make it do away. No. These are facts. These are numbers. More importantly than that, americans, like mika was saying, they can see from their own personal experience. Theyre living this. They cant get the test. Theyre living through this. Theyre suffering through this. Palm beach county, where, basically, the president s home county. He spent so much time in maralago. The test rates are absolutely horrific for one of the largest counties in the state of florida. With one of the oldest populations in the state of florida. People still cant get tests down here. It is why america is stuck right now. Stuck in their homes. Children cant go to school. Theres no map. There is no way out of this without robust, mass, uniform testing. Something that hasnt happened. Weve been saying that, and a lot of people have been saying that, for a very long time. Lets do sh. Hey, if you want to get back to work, to your life, you ought to call the white house today and talk about testing. Willie, everybody that knows anything about this said from the beginning, you want to get the economy started, do robust testing. The president thinks he can get up at a press conference and lie, and itll somehow change the fact were still miserable when it comes to testing, when you talk about per patient, per person, per american. One indication of how bad it is, joe, is that the governors here in the tristate area of new york, new jersey, and connecticut, have somewhat quietly, because they want to be diplomatic in dealing with the president. They need the help of the federal government. Theyre moving past him on the questions of testing. After a month or two, they said, were not getting the testing help we need from the federal government. Theyre looking locally. How do we, as governors of these three states, very hard hit by coronavirus, how do we push testing forward . You have governors in states, and it is not just here in the tristate area, who are looking at the numbers in their own state and saying, were not anywhere near where we need to be on testing. We have to take over this process. Again, they want to work with the federal government where they can, because they need the help, but theyre looking past the president on testing. Remember when barack obama said, if you want to keep your doctor, you can keep your doctor, and republicans rightly called him out on that . The president s big lie on testing was, i think it was march 6th, early march, where the president goes to the cdc. Hes got his stupid hat on. Stupid because the president of the United States, in the middle of a pandemic, shouldnt be wearing a campaign hat. He goes in there and talks about what a great medical mind he has. Then he lies and says, if you want a test, any american that wants a test can get a test. And says theyre perfect tests, great tests. They werent perfect tests, werent great tests. Here we are, a month later, and Americans Still cant get a test. Lets bring in morning joe chief medical correspondent dr. Dave campbell. Dave, were still having a problem with testing. At the briefing, dr. Birx said that theres still not enough testing being performed because, in some of the labs, the machines werent running. What did she mean by that . Joe, were not having the testing problem. Were having a testing abomination. It is unbelievably horrible, the lack of testing availability across the country. Im in palm beach county. You can forget about it if you think youre going to drivethrough a driveby Urgent Care Center or a tent and be tested. It is not going to happen. Testing and physical distancing, those two things are connected. Because if you are tested, and you know whether or not you have the virus in you, that will help you determine what you are going to do that day. So what im hearing about testing isnt registering with me. It is not available. You have to be sick, in a hospital, to be tested. How many times, kasie, have we heard the story that you dont get tested people that dont get tested, they stay at home. Theyre not able to get the test until it is too late. Then they go into the hospital when they have really extreme symptoms, and then are finally tested. Some people actually stay at home and die and never get tested. I mean, the reality, joe, is, i think, i certainly know people who are having symptoms and who cant go to the hospital and get tested, are being told to stay home. Are being told the tests arent available. I have a feeling that most americans probably know people, and by the time this epidemic is over, well know people who struggled getting the tests. Until this problem is fixed, were not going to be able to fix the broader problem of the economy. Antibody testing is an important piece of that in the long run, but when were dealing with a potential resurge of this epidemic in the fall, where we dont know where this disease is, until we can know and aggressively trace every single contact of every Single Person who tests positive, were not going to be able to really put this behind us. This wasnt this was an incredible failure. I thought about the comparison you made, with what obama said. If you have the plan, you can keep it. Were n if you have a test, you can get a test. You still cant get a test in november . Itll underscore, so intensely, the failures of our government, of this administration to deal with this on the front end. Its horrific to watch the stupidity, when the president talks abts th s about this incr accomplishment that no other country achieved with all these tests. Americans watching o listening to him, who cant get tests, say what are you thinking . Youre lying. Its its not just us saying it because, for some reason, we like facts. Americans who are worried about their lives, their childrens lives, parents lives, trying to figure out whether or not they have the virus, they care about the facts, too. They know when someone is lying to them. You know, this this is basic. This isnt like robert mueller. Say what you want about mueller. Ukraine, whatever. They dont know about robert mueller, ukraine. They know about their childrens health. They know about their parents health. They know whether they can get a test. Whether they can get a test for their loved ones or themselves. They cant. Most americans cant right now. Theres no need for the president to go out and lie. It only hurts him. Now, another issue, the number of Young Americans lives being lost to the coronavirus continues to rise. According to state data analyzed by the Washington Post, 759 people under the age of 50 have died. For people under the age of 20, death is extremely rare. Dave, those numbers keep going up. Can you give us some insight as to why it seems that, unlike in europe, and from what we heard at least in china, but unlike in europe, and especially italy, we heard when this pandemic was coming to the United States that it was just a disease for Senior Citizens and not young eer americans. Thats not actually how its playing out here. Any insights . I have a few. One of them is that it is, indeed, still decade by decade more likely to cause death and more serious illness. The older you are, the more preexisting problems or heart or lung problems you have, thats worse. If youre obese, thats worse. Black americans have a higher death rate. But what i have not heard anything about is the incidents of vaping. One in four High School Students right now are vaping. I dont know, but i will bet you more are doing that, now that theyre out of school and home. Vaping creates a lung injury. It creates inflammation. Smoking does the same thing. What i would suggest is that we consider vaping and smoking as one of those chronic, preexisting conditions. If we do that, and look at that data through that lens, we may find an explanation, in part, for why younger people are having the illness and even dying. For some genetic issues that are at play that people are investigating, to see are there different genetics in younger people. Vaping is staring at us right now in the face, joe. Big time. What about its scary. Why do men seem to fair worse with the coronavirus than women . It may be there are social factors. The smoking rates across the world are higher in men. The potential that there are some je n we know there are genetic differences between men and women. They havent figured out why. They just know men are already likely to die of the coronavirus than women. Just as black americans, africanamericans and hispanics have a tougher time with it, also. All right. Dr. Dave, thank you very much. Heres what dr. Deborah birx said at the briefing about the continued lag in testing. You said something about not enough tests being performed because some of the labs, the machines arent running. Did you want to clarify that . What did you mean by 80 werent running . So i have a call with them at 8 00 p. M. Tonight. Every single one of the 120 laboratories. I think 87 of the Laboratory Directors have confirmed that call. It has to do with a machine called an abbott m2000. It is a high throughput machine. We have a million tests out there. I made a big push, and abbott was extraordinary about getting those out to the labs. I mean, this is not sitting in a warehouse. These are physically in these laboratories, sitting there right now. Machines arent running . Theyre not running. Weve only run 88,000 tests in three weeks off of those machines with a million test kits. As someone who has worked in a lot of laboratories, to have a machine that is needed, because we could have screened every health care worker, these machines are every place in the country. So they could have screened, in these last three weeks, 100 of the Health Care Workers across the country that needed these tests to be done. They have high throughput. I have a call with them at 8 00 to really talk about for all that to happen, can an order be given . Well, i asked the Vice President to give me a chance to talk to my colleagues first. We have a call with the ceos of those hospitals tomorrow. Oh, my gosh. First of all, i dont know why mike pence looks like han solo looked at the end of the Empire Strikes back, when he was frozen. Im not exactly sure why he was so stiff. Maybe it was because the truth was being told. Willie, the truth that was rough. Completely undercuts the lie that donald trump said about how were doing so great at testing. Everybody in the world is going to look at it. Listen to these numbers. 88,000 tests have been taken. I guess on these machines this past week. There are a million tests that were sent out there. 80 of the testing machines are not being used. As dr. Birx said, if they had, then we could have tested every medical worker in america. Again, why are they not doing it . I dont know. You dont know. The president doesnt know. Dr. Birx, maybe she knows now because she called last night. Because this is so disorganized. Because this has been so chaotic from the very beginning. Because the president is constantly trying to pass the buck off to the media or democratic governors or to somebody else, to mayors. Anybody but himself. We dont know the answer to those questions. That was another week lost in testing. Theres no excuse for it at all. Those numbers, willie, very sobering. Yeah, that was breathtaking, to hear dr. Birx say that. By the way, thats the truth the country needs to hear. When dr. Birx and dr. Fauci stand up there, even if mike pence, as you point up, was frozen in carbonite because he was frozen in truth. Thats what we need to hear at the press conferences. Cut out the selfpity, Everything Else we get from the president in there. Basically, you have a bunch of governors at this point asking for the kindness of friends, family, and strangers, that they get donations in new york from, say, apple giving a million face masks, or Governor Cuomo calling china to try to get ventilators in. Its this patchwork of testing, of ventilators, of ppe, just trying to survive the day and the week. Its not a concerted federal plan because thats not how the president views this. Hes said many times, the states should have been ready. Its not our job to do this. They should have been ready. Well try to help out where we can. Thats how he views this. Again, not my problem. Governors should have been ready for this, and they werent. Thats just not the way its supposed to work. Now, you have governors across the country, from gavin newsom and jay inslee on the west coast, to governor murphy from new jersey, who will be on with us in a few minutes, and Governor Cuomo from new york, having to scramble to get through the day and the week. The problem is, again, the facts just undermine the president every single day. We saw the president say early this week, its not the federal governments job to do testing. Its not the federal governments job to do testing. Actually, mr. President , it is. Its just that your government, your federal government, your cdc failed so miserably in making these tests, getting these tests out, that the fda came in at the end of february, after four, five weeks of failure, and said to the cdc, your cdc, if you were a private entity, we would shut you down. Then on the 29th of february, then, and only then, did the fda finally throw their arms up in the air, give up, and say, okay, well let private industry go ahead and try to do what the Trump Administration has failed so miserably to do. Then theres this. The federal stockpile of personal protective equipment is nearly empty amid desperate pleas from front line workers treating kroef p ining coronavi asking for more. The Associated Press was told theyre in the process of distributing the remaining n95 respirators, surgical masks, face shields, gowns, and other medical supplies to state and local governments. The statement confirms, documents released wednesday by the House Oversight and reform committee, showing that 90 of the stockpile has been distributed. The Trump Administration placed two bulk orders of n95 masks in midmarch, but those orders are not expected to arrive until the end of april, after the white house predicts the peak of the pandemic in the u. S. You wonder now, mika, why the Trump Administration sent tons of that equipment to china in december. Yeah. On msnbc last night, democratic congresswoman katie porter of california discussed what shes found, in terms of the administrations allocation of medical resources. With my terrific staff, we located public data that shows that during those critical months of january and february, when our country needed to be increasing its supply of masks, of ventilators, of gowns, in fact, our exports went up by over 1,000 , of masks during that period. Our imports of things like Hand Sanitizer and masks and ventilators fell by 11 . We also looked at the Government Contracting data. We all have a lot of questions about where is the supply . Where is the equipment . What we learned is that the governments contracts for this ppe will not arrive until september or october, long after were hopefully through the worst of this. Along with Jonathan Lemire, katie hunt, theyre still with us, lets bring in former u. S. Senator, now an nbc news and msnbc political analyst, claire mccaskill. And White House Correspondent for pbs news hour, yamiche al si alcindor. Good to have you guys this hour. The u. S. Suffered another record day of deaths from coronavirus yesterday. 1,900 lives, the total number of deaths closes in on 15,900, one 24hour period. The epicenter, new york state, recorded its highest number of deaths in a single day, 779. At 151,000 confirmed cases, new york state alone now has more cases than any other country, except, of course, the United States. There is, however, a glimmer of hope. The number of hospitalizations in the state continues to decline. Claire, a president from your state, from independence, had a saying on his desk, the buck stops here. Jonathan lemire wrote a story this morning for the Associated Press that talks about a president who says, the buck stops everywhere but here. For a president who has been doing everything he can to avoid responsibility for this crisis, trying to push it to dove knorr governors, claiming things that have long been the federal governments responsibility are somebody elses responsibility. We see the chaos of that in testing. We see the chaos of that in ppes. We see the chaos of that in just about every dimension of this pandemic. Yeah. You know, my guy, harry truman, made his bones on going out and exposing war profiteering in world war ii. I think when the history is written over this crisis, there will be a large volume of material on war profiteering in the context of this crisis. The failure of this president to control the supply chain in a crisis like this results in not just the chaos and potentially thousands of lost lives, but billions of tax dollars going towards profiteering, of this commerce that has been allowed to exist willynilly with states outbidding each other, orders pulled, states favored over other state s based on their politics. Exporting to make more money other places. You have a story of an illinois official racing to a mcdonalds parking lot with millions of dollars to try to secure masks for Health Care Workers. They were worried if they didnt deliver the money in this mcdonalds parking lot, theyd lose the order to someone else. This is nuts. Its just totally nuts. And the idea that a president that loves power has failed to step into the breach and control the supply chain, and establish order and costs is just outrageous. Yamiche, on the economic side of this, weve been talking this morning about the gut instinct the president has to open the economy. Remember he wanted to open the economy by easter, which would have been this weekend. He pushed thad back, as some people got to him and said thatd be a bad idea. But were going to get about an hour and a half now, another unemployment number that is going to be too much to take. 10 million over the last couple weeks, unemployment claims. That number is going to go way up again this week. You had people like sean hannity last night, and i invoke his name only because we know the president listens to him so closely, saying its time to open parts of the country. Geographic openings, i think he said, are a nobrainer. That was his line last night. Will the president , when he sees that number hes hinted at it again the last couple days seriously consider and go about reopening parts of the American Economy . Well, we know that the president is very, very eager to return things to normal and to ease these guidelines on social distancing. Yesterday, he didnt want to give a date about when he might actually want to reopen the government. Thats only because he already put a date out there, and that date failed which, of course, was easter sunday. He was already saying, well, i want to see the country maybe go back to normal on easter, or i want to see the country maybe start looking at ways for things to get better. I think the president here is just he so sees the economy and state of things as tied to his political future, that he is leaning towards reopening at least parts of the government. The president said he is looking at a twotrack plan. One track to ease all guidelines around td cowhe country, and an to say by state, well ease the guidelines. My sources say hell probably lead toward the latter, he might open some parts of the country back up. He realizes this is going to be the biggest decision he makes. When can things go back to normal . If he reopens too early, he tells people to do things, then people get sick and die, that is a political failure he might not recover from, from the general election. Kasie hunt, i would think that members of congress would be able to do that math and hear the science here. Weve got a lot of top experts talking about really an 18month process. To get where we really need to be, to be able to put this behind us. What is congress doing . What are they trying to do to shore up the economy and help the American People direuring t time . Well, it seems like were about to see a bit of a partisan food fight on the senate floor today. Republicans are trying to force through an additional 250 billion for the Small Business fund. Democrats say they havent negotiated with them at all. They want to put some more guardrails on that money and add additional money for hospitals and state and local governments. But, you know, the reality is, all of these people are going to need more help. The real challenge is whether this is going to become so bad that we really cant even wrap our heads around what theyre going to need to do. I think there are real questions about whether what theyve already been able to do is helping yet. I mean, we know these loans are in incredibly high demand. They are going to need more money in the Small Business program. Theyve barely been able to get them out the door. Most Americans Still have not seen, you know were looking for reports of people having received those relief checks that the irs said are coming. Send me a note on twitter if youve gotten one. Were having trouble tracking them down. They should be going out, we expect, next week. This situation is just so dire. Right now, members are at home in their districts, and each person is unbelievable Horror Stories about hospitals, First Respond er responders, nurses not being able to get masks and gowns. Were still in a basic phase of this. The failure is just so stunning. Until we get through that, you know, congress can try and have these conversations about getting the economy back to where it needs to be, but we still havent solved the first problem. Speaking of basics, lets bring in dr. Ed roft, chief medical officer for Global Medical response. A leading provider of air and ground medical transportation services. And the prime Emergency Medical Services contractor for fema. Doctor, if you could give us an assessment as to whats the light at the end of the tunnel, when it comes to getting supplies where they need to go so these doctors arent living daytoday in crisis, especially in hot spots . Good morning, mika. This is one of those scenarios that ems, Emergency Medical Services, has always prided itself on being ready. We can manage anything. We can manage hurricanes, earthquakes. The protective equipment helps us manage things just like this. The masks, the gloves, the gowns. We slowly are getting equipment in various areas, but it changes over time, as you know. For example, right now, there is a demand for surgical masks on the west coast and a demand for n95 masks on the east coast. One of the Biggest Challenges today is, while there may be a little light in the tunnel, we dont know exactly where the end of the tunnel is, which creates a supply chain challenge for us down the road to manage this patient population. Dr. Racht, it is willie geist. Appreciate you being on this morning. Morning, willie. As we look ahead as where this might go from here, i think you and other doctors said were sort of at the beginning of this. As we understand the president to be looking around the country, considering places he might be able to reopen the economy because there arent large incidents of covid19, what would you say to the president , what would you say to the country about what comes next in terms of rural areas, and whether or not they are, in fact, insulated from this . So the rural areas are a unique environment, as you know. The population density is much lower, but the Service Levels are much lower, as well. Given the nature of the environment. I think one of the concerns of Emergency Medical Services is a significant amount of virus or illness in a Rural Community will overstress those emergency medical and hospital resources very, very rapidly. So they depend on the suburb and the urban environment to move those patients to, so that that patient can get the appropriate level of care. So the added challenge in a rural environment is getting patients to the right level of care, or getting the right level of care to the patient population. Getting it to the medical isl d island. We know the last decade or so, rural hospitals have been closing in great numbers, making the problem all the worse. Doctor, what would you say about testing . Weve been talking a lot about that this morning. The president has touted that we do more testing than anywhere else in the world. As a raw number, it is true, of course, but not as a per capita number. Why is testing so important . Its a cliche almost, testing, testing, but why is it so critical . Testing for us in medicine gives us two important components. This is going to sound captain obvious. It lets us know when illness is present and when illness is absent. Those are important to the Health Care Providers, to the workers, the hospitals and, obviously, to the patient. One of the things from our perspective, Emergency Medical Services, we want to make sure that, as ems providers, were safe as we take care of patients around the country. We also want to make sure were safe around each other. So absence of illness is very important to the ems world. Testing can help identify that, in particular. Weve reached the point, i think, in Emergency Medical Services, where we assume that everyone is covid positive. We do that because it gives us the opportunity it actually moves us into a personal protective equipment environment that says, i cant predict. I dont know that you have covid or you dont, but im going to assume you do. Im going to treat you as such so that i protect myself, so that we protect the Health Care System along the lines of your journey. So testing will become extraordinarily important as we start to emerge from this illness environment. To start to identify when workers, when patients, when family members are safe to go back into a community environment, so that we continue what we will accomplish with this physical and social dist s distan distancing, to burn the virus out. We think of testing as being the ultimate. All right. Chief medical officer for Global Medical response, dr. Ed racht, thank you very, very much. A leading forecast model the white house uses to chart the progression of the coronavirus has adjusted its projections downward in dramatic fashion. The Washington Post reported wednesday the institute for health, mets rirics, and evalua at the university of washington, puts the peak of the u. S. Covid19 resource use at just two days away. On april 11th, after which the need for hospital beds and ventilators will be on the decline. The ihme now says the icu bed shortage nationwide is just over 9,000. And the projected number of deaths by august 4th is just over 60,400, a drop of more than 20,000 from the institutes previous estimate over the weekend. Some hope there. Some jurisdictions, the post reports, are concerned the ihme estimates are too optimistic. Local officials in washington, d. C. , for example, prefer the university of pennsylvanias alternate model of time, or covid19 hospital impact model for epidemics. Goff kno governors fear the optimistic outlook may curve the sending of the ventilators and medical kwirm equipment. So many people are on them. We had the initial studies the white house was concerned about. The president talked about a week or two ago, where the range was between 1. 6 million and 2. 2 million if nothing was done. Obviously, this country, the American People have taken radical steps. Some governors have stepped in. In fact, most governors have stepped in. Some mayors have stepped in to really enforce social distancing. Even last week, we heard numbers ranging from 100,000 to 240,000. Even with social distancing. But, again, i think the American People have done an extraordinary job. Have gone above and beyond in many respects. So lets hope that number is 60,000. I know that this organization out of the university of washington had it at 82,000 before. Going down to 60,000 still is i wont say an outlier, because i think theyve been more accurate than most other models. Yeah. But it is positive. Yamiche, again, this is all dependent on the American People remaining vigilant and keeping social distancing up. Lets just be blunt, not doing what many of the president s most fervent supporters are wanting to do, which is to open up the economy before were through this first wave. Thats right. When you think about where we are in the bestcase scenario, were not doing what the bestcase scenario assumes we would be doing. Not all 50 states have stayathome orders. The president , of course, said he does not want to recommend st stayathome orders because he doesnt want to tell the states what to do. The states have been saying, we need recommendations from the federal government. You have the best data. Tell us what to do. The president said, no, thats not a role im willing to play here. We have people outside, people still gathering in some states, people still assuming its okay to do things like possibly visit their relatives. I think were still in, as kasie said, were in so much the basic moments of this, wondering how many of these people are going to get sick, and whether or not people are going to take this as seriously as they need to take it. Were not sure whether or not the bestcase scenario is going to be what were going to get. Our president has decided that he doesnt want to take some of the steps that states badly want him to take. Of course, willie, the problem is that there are people who will follow what the president says. If he decides to ignore his science advisers, his medical advisers, then thats bad news not only for these families, but for the nations health. Weve seen it in poll after poll. When the president was just not telling the truth, you actually saw that an overwhelming number of republicans believed him and believed that the pandemic was not going to be that much of a challenge. The numbers go up and down based on what the president says for his most fervent supporters. Thats why it is so incredible important he keeps listening to his medical advisers, keeps listening to his doctors, he keeps listening to dr. Fauci and dr. Birx. Remember last week, when we were con serb certacerned the g florida, desantis, was keeping the state open. We implored the president , with all the power he has over governors and his supporters, to make it happen. The president picked up the phone, called ron desantis, and the state was closed. After that, georgia and mississippi closed. Thats the power of his voice. It works the other way. If he says, were good, time to open things up, thatll happen in a heart beat. The reason we were talking to dr. Racht about the rural areas, is i think theres a sense from President Trump and some others in the media that support donald trump that there are parts of this country that are immune from this. This is a big city where people are clustered in new york, San Francisco, seattle, all the places weve seen it. This is a long road. That is not my opinion. It is doctors. You heard it from dr. Racht. This will find its way, over time, to those places. If you open those places, you make it easier for coronavirus and quicker for coronavirus to find its way there. Right. Actually, if you look at the data, there are now stories that actually the pandemic has found its way to middle america. Certainly not as extreme as other places. Two great challenges for middle america, especially in a lot of the rural areas. If you just look at the demographics, there are it skews older. I think most concerns to me and others who have been following Rural Health Care for a really long time, theyre very concerned that their rural hospitals who have been gutted over the past five years by medicaid cuts, these rural hospitals are the least equipped. Theyll say that, theyre the least equipped to handle a pandemic breakdown, especially in Rural Communities where the average age usually tends to skew older. It is just so critical for people in middle america, in rural america, to socially distance, especially if youre older. Take care of yourself. Take care of your loved ones. Take care of your children that have underlying conditions. Please keep listening to the doctors. Please keep listening to the scientists. Dont listen to politicians on the left or the right. Listen to the medical experts. Take care of yourself. Take care of your family. Take care of your parents and grandparents and your loved ones. Yamiche alcindor, thank you so much for being on this morning. Still ahead, leadership in turbulent times. President ial historian doris currens goodwin on leaders who rise to the occasion and those who do not. Plus, the pandemic playbook prepared by the Obama Administration, they tried to make it simple for the Trump Administration. Former National Security adviser susan rice will join us to weigh in on that. First, senator Kirsten Gillibrand is standing by. Well get her take on the new phase and the president ial race. Youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. All the brs that i can get. At liberty butchumal cut. Liberty biberty cut. Well dub it. Liberty mutual customizes your Car Insurance so you only pay for what you need. Only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. There will be parties and family gatherings. There will be parades and sporting events and concerts. To help our communities when they come back together, respond to the 2020 census now. Spend a few minutes online today to impact the next 10 years of healthcare, infrastructure and education. Go to 2020census. Gov and respond today to make americas tomorrow brighter. Its time to shape our future. Its got all my favorite shows turn oright there. Boom, i wish my Trading Platform worked like that. Well have you tried thinkorswim . This is totally customizable, so you focus only on what you want. Okay, its got screeners and watchlists. And you can even see how your predictions might affect the value of the stocks youre interested in. Now this is what im talking about. Yeah, itll free up more time for your. Uh, true crime shows . British baking competitions. Hm. Didnt peg you for a crumpet guy. Focus on what matters to you with thinkorswim. My grandparents that i never knew. Ch about im a lawyer now, but i had no idea that my grandfather was a federal judge in guatemala. My grandfather used his legal degree and his knowledge to help people that were voiceless in his country. That put a fire in my heart. It made me realize where i got my passion for social justice. Bring your Family History to life like never before. Get started for free at ancestry. Com aand were here for you ry day fespecially now,rs. Doing Everything Possible to keep you connected. Through the resilience of our network and people. We can keep learning, keep sharing, keep watching, and most of all, keep together. Its the job weve always done. It is the job we will always do. A lot of people want it. What if voting doesnt work out well for the republicans . Well, it hasnt is it your concern it hasnt. But if youre a senior citizen, and if youre somebody that needs it, im all for it. They have to be very careful. You know the things with bundling and all of the things that are happening with votes by mail. Thousands of votes are gathered, and im not going to say which party does it, but thousands of votes are gathered. They come in, and theyre dumped in a location. All of a sudden, you lose elections you think youre going to win. I wont stand for it. What is he talking about . Just making it up. It is a remarkable thing to see. Hes just making it up. Because he admitted last week that if you had more americans voting by mail, that republicans would never win elections. Its just like, you know, youre not supposed to say these things out loud, right . You lie about them, the way you do, and then you but youve already said it out loud. Youve already given up the game. Youve said that, actually, we dont want more americans to vote. We dont want americans to vote by mail. If more americans voted by mail, republicans would never get elected again. Thats exactly what the speaker of the house for the state of georgia said. The problem is, what you just said, mr. President , that we just played, its not supported by any data whatsoever. Oregon has been doing this for years. Colorado has been doing this. States have been doing this. There is a great piece out. Bad news for you. You got busted. You actually vote by mail yourself. By the way, willie, an era is coming to an end. Whats that . If this is shocking, its been part of our lives for so long. Yeah. Uhoh. I dont know how were going to get by without all the support from the federal government. But reports now from npr that the federal government is ending funding for drivethrough coronavirus testing this friday. In places like montgomery county, pennsylvania. They say theyre disappointed. My god, that is a program that has spanned at least a month and has given us memories that will last a lunchtime. I didnt even know they were funding it, to be honest with you. Can you believe, actually, according to this . I want to make sure this is right. It is an npr piece. Theyre closing down the testing sites. Coronavirus testing sites closed friday. In a few places, theyll close as a result of philly suburbs. 250 people a day tested since march 21st. Successful site. Can you believe that . I mean, i dont how do you even process that . Here we are. Testing has been an abysmal failure. Theyre cutting off what little funding they did in places like po montgomery county, suburbs of philadelphia. You know, i was chuckling not because of that odd news, but because ive never been in the split before only with the top of your head as you read the news there. Its something, right . Magnificent head of hair there, joe, the whole country saw. Thank you. It is stunning, obviously. Id like to know more about why. I mean, theyre doing it at a local level, if you go to Community Colleges around the country. Theyre doing their best to do some drivethrough testing. The idea that theyre shutting down testing on the federal level is perplexing, when the entire point of this exercise, as we heard from a number of doctors just this morning, is to get as many people tested as possible before we can begin to get our arms around this and eventually open the country back up. It is almost, mika, a cynic would suggest, and i certainly never would. Yeah. Im not cynical. I have a heart thats as big as a montana skies. But a cynic would suggest okay, birthday boy. A cynic would suggest that theres somebody in the federal government that doesnt want americans to know exactly how many people have this pandemic. You have to wonder. Heres a hint. Its more than 15. Yeah. Okay. Its what he said in february, i think. Honestly, i have to wonder sometimes what he wants to have happen here, given how badly this is going. Back to the sound bite that we opened this block with. According to the New York Times, President Trump and his republican allies are reportedly launching a strategy to fight mailin ballots. A new efforts clearly aimed at the president s reelection prospects, as well as other down ballot republicans. The context of that is that more and more states are postponing their primaries or extending vote by mail deadlines due to the coronavirus. After what we saw happen in wisconsin, where the Republicanled Legislature and conservative majority courts forced the state to hold inperson voting this past tuesday, endangering the lives of thousands of people. Last night, new York Governor Andrew Cuomo announced on twitter that all new yorkers will be able to send an absentee vote, and emphasized that new yorkers shouldnt have to choose between their health and their civic duty. Joining us now, senator Kirsten Gillibrand of new york. Great to see you. Thanks. There is a big effort that would need to be undertaken to get ready for november. Why wouldnt we shore up mailin voting, absentee voting, the postal service, in light of this pandemic . We absolutely should. Because no one should have to choose between keeping themselves and their family safe and actually being able to perform a constitutional right to vote. It is really important that we secure our Voting Rights for this next election for many reasons. First of all, we dont know where we will be with regard to covid19. We need to be able to have mailin voting, curbside voting. We need to be able to have early voting. Election day should be a day off. We know that if you give more flexibility to when and how you vote, more people are able to vote. That should be something we all share. Unfortunately, President Trump has been exceedingly political and cynical in this regard. Unfortunately, hes trying to undermine peoples basic constitutional rights. Claire mccaskill has a question for you. Good morning. Good to see you. Good morning, claire. Why dont you go through the fact that i dont think people realize how many states currently have mailin voting. Maybe hit on the most important point, that our military all vote by mail. It is interesting that the president is trying to intimate that mailin voting equals fraud but, yet, the men and women that serve in uniform obviously, unless were going to disenfranchise them, theyve been able to vote by mail for many, many years. Which, of course, you would think the president would use as an example, of how mailin voting works, not to make up stories about fraud. Well, President Trump himself just mailed in his own ballot to vote in florida. So the truth is, it is something that is routinely used in most states, to have absentee ballots when there are issues and someone cannot vote inperson. Weve had accommodations in voting for the disabled community, for seniors. We need to make those accommodations available for everyone now because of covid19. Again, as you said, claire, to somehow impugn the integrity of the u. S. Military, by saying mailin ballots is fraudulent, is outrageous. We want to make sure that voting is available in all these forms, so that everyones vote can be counted. This is an election that people have been concerned about. Congress has been trying to appropriate money and support to the states so they can quarentine quarentingaruaran and fair election, free of action by russia or other countries. Covid19 will most likely still be among us and a deep concern for families. Jonathan lemire has a question. Jonathan . Senator, good morning. Wanted to shift gears slightly and talk about the situation in your home state when it comes to battling covid19. The death toll in new york city has certainly been very tragic to see the last few days, but there is a sense that hospitalizations have leveled off a little bit. Can you give us an update, in the state which has been the epicenter to this point of this pandemic, where things are now and where things are going . Is it possible that as dark as things are right now, new york may be on the verge of turning the corner . Well, we dont know if were turning a corner. We dont know if were even at a plateau. What we do know is that people are still terrified. People on the front lines, whether theyre Grocery Store workers or someone working at a pharmacy or any of our critical workers, they still dont have personal protective equipment. Ppe continually is in short supply. President trump has been unable to effectively use the defense production act to make sure that people have masks and gowns in our hospitals, to make sure we have the ventilators that we need. People are still dying all across new york. As i talked to stakeholders, whether it is notforprofits, trying to provide shelter for those domestically abused, or trying to provide resources like food through food banks for people stuck at home and cant feed themselves because they dont have an income. People are on the front lines trying to deal with this crisis. What we do know is that every state is going to reach a peak at some point. Unfortunately, we have not been able to federalize the medical supply chain effectively, with the right level of oversight and accountability to know where the supplies are going. All we know is that fema makes judgments on a whim and doesnt show where the supplies are going, even if theyve been ordered by a hospital. Fema takes them and redistributes them where they want. Sometimes giving more supplies to states, perhaps ones that are favorable to the president. We dont know. We need oversight and accountability on where supplies are going, what criteria are being used to send it. Our hospitals arent getting the supplies they need. Senator Kirsten Gillibrand, our best to you and your family. Thank you so much for coming on. Stay safe. Stay healthy. Thanks. Be do. Coming up, cuomo, whitner, murphy, newsom, states in crisis. Governors are filling the vacuum in washington. A historian has been looking at that, and she joins us next. Going to break, a look at the latest issue of time magazine. There are five covers for this issue, each one featuring someone battling the coronavirus on the front lines of the crisis. There are stories from doctors, nurses, delivery drivers, and more, all risking their own health to help others. Youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. This is an athlete, twenty reps deep, sprinting past every leak in our softest, smoothest fabric. Shes confident, protected, her strength respected. Depend. The only thing stronger than us, is you. And i like to question your im yoevery move. N law. Like this left turn. Its the next one. 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A majority of americans believe their governors are doing a better job handling the coronavirus pandemic than President Trump. According to a new Monmouth University poll, 72 of americans say their states governor is doing a good job handling the outbreak. 46 said the same about President Trump. 43 of americans said they trust their governor more than the president to provide them information about the outbreak. 15 trust trump more. 29 trust both equally. Joining us now, pulitzer prizewinning author and president ial historian doris currens goodwin, author of leadership in turbulent times. There are governors standing out in what appears to be a massive void in leadership at the top. Tell us who they are. Well, when you think about it right now, the governors, whether its the governor of california, the governor of new york, governors of washington, theyre on the ground. Theyve had to deal with this crisis hourly. When events are ordinary, people dont necessarily look to their leaders for their everyday lives. Now, hourly, clearly, we are looking to the leaders in our states. They are our voice. Most but clearly we are looking to the leaders in our state. They are filling the vacuum that the federal government has left behind. It is so interesting mika, because the same thing happened during the depression. Fdr was the governor of new york between the stock market crash and the depression and his becoming president , and the reason he became the president ial nominee was he made new york the first state in the nation to take action because the federal government was failing. The republicans and hoover thought it was a local responsibility, and the states were overwhelmed so he said up his own public jobs in new york. He set up his own Unemployment Insurance, the first state in the nation with comprehensive relief. He then becomes the nominee of the presidency. You know, it used to be that governors were who we looked for. There was competence, they were managing things. 17 out of our 45 president s were governors, yet in this race the four governors were out before the end because we were looking at how they spoke in debates, how much money they could raise, things that the dnc put on that made it harder for governors. Maybe we will go back to realizing they are at the linchpin of this crisis and they have executive management, which is so much what we need. So, doris, it seems so well, just surprising that it is an under statemestatement th have a president pushing responsibility away from himself and his office. There have been complaints of imperial president growing for the past half century and this president claims that article two gives him the power do whatever he wants to do, yet time and time again he is not stepping up. He is not taking responsibility. Have we seen that from any other president since Herbert Hoover . Well, i dont think so. I mean Herbert Hoover had ideological reason that he felt that the federal system would be unbalanced if the federal government took too much responsibility. But it is a psychological thing. It is what leadership is made of. It was said of fdr in february of 1933 when he had several weeks away from the inauguration and it was rock bottom in the country at that point, you couldnt get your money out of the banks, a quarter of the people were unemployed. He was craving the responsibility. He couldnt wait to get in there and take the burden. In the fist inaugural address he says to the people, it is not your failure that has happened, it is a failure of leadership. I have been given leadership by your vote and i intend to do it. He said, if Congress Wont do what i want, i will take executive power and make sure we are moving forward like a trained army. You will now be fine because i will be with you. Thats the responsibility, the taking the burden, the shouldering the blame, admitting when you have error, the humility to know that, collaborating with a team. Shows are the qualities we need in leadership and they show up in a crisis mother than ever before. Doris, weve been talking a lot about fdr and crisis communication and leadership through crisis. We have been talking about Winston Churchill as well. Many people remember the famous speeches and they remember the idea of the fireside chat. Could you speak to a little bit about the reality of those leaders, special president roosevelt presented to the country . It wasnt always warm and fuzzy. He was guiding through the depression and leading the country into a world war. How did he speak to the country and what might President Trump learn from that now . I think theres two things. One, that he wasnt on the air every day talking to the country. He prepared his fireside chats very carefully. They would go through three, four, five drafts because they wanted to get just the right mixture between telling people the brutal facts in the early days of the depression or the brutal facts in the early days of world war ii when we were losing in the pacific at pearl harbor yet provide hope and reassurance because of tellic people everything that was happening. He would explain what was happening, why was the banking crisis happening, why were we losing in the pacific, why did we need rationing, why did we need sacrifice. Each fireside chat, only 31 in 12 years. He said, if i do too many they will lose their effectiveness. Always he was on the line of telling the brutal facts and making it clear that people understood how difficult things were. But if we came together, if business started mobilizing, if they produced the supplies, it is incredible what we did in world war ii, a plane in four minutes, a ship every single day. Once we were mobilized we could supply our soldiers and all of our allies in the world. Once we get going nothing can stop us, but were not going in that direction. Doris doris, claire mccaskill. Hi, claire. Hi, doris. It is hard to imagine that fdr was able to mobilize what he did in world war ii and we cant get masks to our Health Care Workers. It is quite a stark comparison. You know, im curious if you have given thought whether or not the governors are entering into a scary phase here because one of the most important things about the recovery will be Unemployment Insurance. As you certainly understand, executing thats why it is called the executive branch. Executing laws get tricky. Obviously this is an unprecedented number of claims. What im hearing on the ground here in missouri is people cant get through. They cant get through on the phones. They cant get through on websites, that this unemployment money is not reaching people on the street, similar to the federal money for the Small Businesses. Can you talk a little bit about the challenges now the governors face as Unemployment Insurance and the distribution of that is now firmly in their laps . Oh, it is a heartbreaking thought because it just may overwhelm the systems. I mean they can get as many retired people coming back as possible. They can be ramping up now to know that this is coming, the next phase, just as they needed more people working in the hospitals. But how much they can do, they just may be limited. I mean thats certainly what happened during the depression. You finally had to have the federal government take over the task of providing public jobs for people in every state because, of course, people would prefer the jobs to the Unemployment Insurance, but you have the gap right now. What are they going to do about food . You had soup kitchens running out of supplies during the depression. We are in that serious of a situation. But, again, it has to be a National Strategy as well as the states. They cannot be left with this burden alone. The country has to be doing this together and the federal government has to step in more than it has so far. Doris kerns, thank you very much. The federal government is us. It is us. I just wish someone knew that. Still ahead, we will talk to Governor Phil Murphy of new jersey. His state just saw another record oneday increase in reported deaths from the coronavirus. Well also be joined by former National Security adviser susan rice. Plus wall street is bracing for new Economic Data due out in just a short time from now. We will have the latest jobless claims as soon as they cross. Steve ratner will join us for that. Morning joe is back in a moment. Ning joe is back in a moment i thought i had my moderate to Severe Ulcerative Colitis under control. Turns out, it was controlling me. Seemed like my symptoms were taking over our time together. I knew i needed to talk to my doctor. Think hell make it . Thats when i learned humira can help get and keep uc under control when other medications havent worked well enough. And it helps people achieve control that lasts. So you can experience few or no symptoms. Humira can lower your ability to fight infections. Serious and sometimes fatal infections, including tuberculosis, and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened, as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. Tell your doctor if youve been to areas where certain fungal infections are common, and if youve had tb, hepatitis b, are prone to infections, or have flulike symptoms or sores. Dont start humira if you have an infection. Be there for you, and them. Ask your gastroenterologist about humira. With humira, control is possible. In nearly 100 years serving the military community, weve seen you go through tough times and every time, youve shown us, youre much tougher your heart, courage and commitment has always inspired us and now its no different so, were here with financial strength, stability and experience you can depend on and the online tools you need because you have always set the highest standard and reaching that standard is what were made for the tragic melody. A young mans salute to veterans at new jersey veterans home. So many of their Service Members lost to covid19. Im hoping it will start to get hope that things will get better and that theyre not forgotten. That was a 13yearold boy scouts tribute to 37 veterans who are believe to have died from coronavirus at a new jersey veterans home. Welcome back to morning joe. Really quickly, and weve talked about this before, but, you know, we know people, mika, obviously who work in veterans homes. This has been a concern from the very beginning. Willie, it it is happening at the end of a lot of these vets lives who have given their all to this country, but theyre in veterans homes and two, three, four vets get it and pretty soon, because theres not adequate spacing, it can sweep through an entire home. Yes, these spaces where you have a lot of people and many Vulnerable People living together like a nursing home, were seeing stories coming out of centers and homes for people with disabilities as well where this is taking hold. What a beautiful moment for that boy scout, that young guy. I know exactly where he was standing, paramus, new jersey. Good for him, but how sad we have to have boy scouts playing taps outside of homes where our american heroes are living and dying. The governor of new jersey will be our guest in a moment but first the news here. The u. S. Suffered another record day of deaths from coronavirus yesterday, more than 1,900 lives. As the total number of deaths now closes in on 15,000, the nations epicenter new york state recorded its highest number of deaths in a single day, 779. At 151,000 confirmed cases, new york state alone now has more cases than any other country other than the United States. There is, however, a glimmer of hope. The number of hospitalizations in the state continues to decline. Governor andrew cuomo says it is a sign that the social distancing measures are working. We are flattening the curve by what we are doing. If we stop what we are doing, you will see that curve change. That curve is purely a function of what we do day in and day out. It is not a time to get complacent. It is not a time to do anything different than we have been doing. Joining us now, the governor of new jersey, phil murphy. Governor, thank you so much for joining us. Is new jersey at any point where the peak might have been met . How are your numbers . Good to be with you and god bless the veterans. Our numbers, the curve on positive tests does look like it is beginning and i say beginning to flatten. It looks like we are a couple of beats behind new york, but i want to echo what Governor Cuomo said. This is no time to sit back and relax. We have about as aggressive a set of policies in place for social distancing as any american state. In fact, we tightened it even further this week, and i would just beg people if theyre watching from jersey, stay home. Please stay home and stay away from others. Again, a glimmer of hope but it is way too early to declare any sort of victory here. So, governor, tell us Joe Scarborough here. Tell us, what do you need right now other than all of americas thoughts and prayers . What do you need . What do those medical heroes on the front lines, the doctors and the nurses, need . What do patients, what do seniors need as you still face down this crisis . Yeah. I mean, joe, longterm care facilities as you all discussed a minute ago continues to be a very high area of focus for us. Veterans homes, of which we have three, Nursing Homes up and down the state, about 375. But as a general matter this is a war with two fronts, and ive been quoting churchill a lot lately. Never have some few done so much for so many. It is actually both ways right now. The many, the 9 million of us need to stay home and stay away from each other. That flattens the curve and allows a much more manageable amount of cases, hospitalizations, et cetera. The few led by our heroic Health Care Workers, First Responders and others were building out over here bed capacity, ventilators, personal protective equipment, calling the bullpen for more Health Care Workers. So it is a twofront war and were trying to get the lines to cross at a manageable level. Thats the name of the game every minute of every day. So do those health care heroes, do those nurses and doctors have the gloves they need, the masks they need, the ventilators they need to carry hospitals and carry communities and carry your state through this crisis . Joe, i mean honestly we are fighting every single day, never mind every hour of every day, to stay ahead of that. The bed capacity is expanding dramatically. Thats due to a lot of creativity by our hospitals. The army corps has been huge. Were sourcing ppe literally around the world. I spend most of my time talking to folks outside the United States for ppe. Ventilators, weve gotten a bunch out of the federal strategic stockpile. We need more. We put a call to arms out for our website for health care volunteers. Happily thousands have answered that, but these folks are heroes and theyre going into battle every minute of every day. We have to make sure theyve got what they need to win. Governor murphy, it is willie geist. Thanks for coming on and talking to us this morning. I want to ask about something you and Governor Cuomo talked about yesterday separately, which is this regional approach you have undertaken working with Governor Cuomo, governor wolff in pennsylvania, governor lamont in connecticut. These hardhit states, particularly yours and the state of new york, what does it look like . Is that because you are not getting what you need from the federal government, and how do you work with the other governors . Willie, good to have blunt in the house. It is an acknowledgement were as densely packed region. New jersey is the densely packed region. So when we shut government or things down, you dont want anomalies like theres one set of rules on one side of the hudson for bars and restaurants thats different from the other. So Governor Cuomo, governor lamont, governor wolff and to a certain extent Governor Carney in delaware, we coordinated in bringing our societies, our states to a shutdown. We acknowledged that whatever it is i wish it were tomorrow or next week but it isnt, but whenever it is we can begin to open unresponsibly, we need a similar approach as a region. So obviously you have heard, you have a business background, so you have a particularly good point of view on this. You have heard the president starting to whisper about we need to open up parts of the economy. Im sure you hear it from residents of our state of new jersey. They say, hey, the summer is coming up pretty soon here, governor, i have bar down at the shore in seaside that i want to open, if it is not open im dead. You hear it up and down new jersey. What do i say to the Small Business owners who are very concerned about losing their livelihoods and costing the livelihoods of all of their employees about when it might be safe to open and why youre not opening sooner . They say, murphy, im particularly acceptable to the pleas from the bars, but here is what we have to do. We have to do it in the right order, we have to break the back of the virus, no question about that. Not only do we have to plateau which we have not yet, we have to come down a big distance on the backside. Only then can we begin to safely reopen. My fear is if we get the order tr transposed or we begin to open too early we could throw gasoline on the fire. I would say to the folks who are unemployed, of which we have too many. The Small Businesses that have been crushed. Hang in there. This is enormous pain right now but it is akin to ripping the bandaid off now in exchange for what would have been a deeper and economic longterm misery. We have to be really careful how we go about this. Governor johnson, lamire w, the Associated Press has a question for you. John. Good morning, governor. I believe it was yesterday you postponed your states primary election until july, saying you didnt want a wisconsin. We all saw the images there of voters standing certainly not six feet apart at just a few polling sites, trying to cast their ballots in that states primary, which was held as scheduled. Tell us a little bit about your reasoning behind the move, but moreover we heard the president talk yesterday about and denigrate the idea of mailin voting and absentee voting. Is that something you want to see your state do something more of in november when potentially the virus could be coming back . Yeah, jonathan, i would say on the vote by mail it is too early to tell. We did have elections, local elections in march and april which we postponed to may 12th when we had another set of elections. For all of those again, these are local boards of ed, municipal elections, theyre completely vote by mail. That will be a good chance for us to take it around the track a few times and see how it goes. We have not made any decision on that front as it relates to our primary which you rightfully pointed out we postponed from june 2nd to july 7th. We cant have people weighing their right to vote against personal health, we cant have that. We will not make a decision in terms of what it looks like. The good news is we have a number of weeks to deal with that. In an ideal world i would like polling places to be responsibly open with social distancing and we can physically get to the polls, but we have to keep all options on the table. Governor phil murphy, thank you very much. Wish you the best. We will talk to you soon. Thank you for your leadership. Thank you. We are thinking about you and praying for you and the people in new jersey. Absolutely. Thanks for having me, folks. Thank you, sir. Last year our next guest wrote that a pandemic was and remains among her biggest fears. Former National Security adviser susan rice joins the conversation straight ahead. As weve been giving you the numbers we want to tell you more of the stories of the families who have lost loved ones to the coronavirus. A 34yearold hospital clerk and mother of 8yearold twin boys in new york died after contracting the coronavirus. This as her mother is in intensive care and her father at home are both fighting to overcome the deadly disease. In chicago, a 77yearold man died of the coronavirus just a week after being taken to a local hospital. The mans wife told the local paper that after 56 years of marriage her husband spent his final days alone after she was told by ambulance workers she could not follow him into the hospital. And in california, a 76yearold nurse passed away after contracting the coronavirus at a funeral for a coworker, as did another 14 people. Her family mourned from their cars on wednesday as they watched her casket brought to her grave site. We will be right back. Be right. Managing type 2 diabetes . Dimitris on it. Eating right. And getting those steps in . On it dimitri thinks hes doing all he can to manage his type 2 diabetes and heart disease, but is his treatment doing enough to lower his heart risk . Maybe not jardiance can reduce the risk of cardiovascular death for adults who also have known heart disease. So it could help save your life from a heart attack or stroke. And it lowers a1c jardiance can cause serious side effects including dehydration, genital yeast or urinary tract infections, and sudden kidney problems. Ketoacidosis is a serious side effect that may be fatal. A rare, but lifethreatening bacterial infection. In the skin of the perineum could occur. Stop taking jardiance and call your doctor right away if you have symptoms of this bacterial infection,. Ketoacidosis, or an allergic reaction and dont take it if youre on dialysis or have. Severe kidney problems. Taking jardiance with a sulfonylurea or insulin may cause low blood sugar. Lower a1c. And lower risk of a fatal heart attack . 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As i see the crisis gripping the nation, exacerbated by a president unwilling or unable to provide any kind of credible leadership and the work that needs to be done to protect people in this most desperate hour, i cannot in good conscience continue to mount a campaign that cannot win and which would interfere with the important work required of all of us in this difficult hour. On a practical note let me also say this. I will stay on the ballot in all remain instates and continue to gather delegates. While Vice President biden will be the nominee, we must continue working to assemble as many delegates as possible at the Democratic Convention where we will be able to exert significant influence over the Party Platform and other functions. Stay in this fight with me. Let us go forward together, the struggle continues. It is no great secret that joe bidens politics are different than mine. What i would say to people is that joe is a very decent human being. I know his wife jill as well, is a wonderful person, and that i hope to be able to work with joe to move him in a more progressive direction. I think joe is a good politician. I listened to your announcement today online. Was i know that you said the same thing about Vice President biden essentially today. Is that an endorsement . Is that a fullthroated endorsement of joe biden . Well, that were going to be talking to joe, and we are. We are talking to his team of advisers, but what i have said, i can tell you this, steven. What i said from the first day that i announced my intention to run for president , i will do everything that i can to make sure that donald trump is not reelected. All right. Senator Bernie Sanders announcing yesterday just before noon that he was ending his bid to be the nominee for the 2020 president ial election, but holding on to his delegates and holding on to a big piece of the conversation. Joe. And it certainly is understandable. This has been a remarkably difficult time for this country. Also, politically for Bernie Sanders, he found himself in a position he could have never expected himself to be in. By getting out of the race but still remaining on the ballot, he does feel like he can continue fighting for the things that he believes in, can continue to take that fight to the Democratic Convention, whether thats going to be an inperson convention or whether it is going to be, you know, a virtual convention. But, willie, that said, i thought Bernie Sanders was gracious yesterday. Nobody is expecting fullthroated endorsement of joe biden right now and it is not something im sure that joe biden even expected. Theyre going to talk through things. Bernie sanders wants to see Vice President biden move more in his direction, and certainly the last several weeks have changed the political debate in this country, if not forever certainly for the next decade or so. Yes, and you note yesterday how different the tone is than it was in 2016 where Bernie Sanders campaign and Hillary Clintons campaign genuinely didnt like each other, didnt get along. That animosity isnt there. Of course, there are people who support Bernie Sanders and even some people working on his campaign yesterday on social media who were not happy about this, who say joe biden is too moderate. But thats not where Bernie Sanders is. In fact, since super tuesday these two campaigns have been talking. This is not something that happened overnight. When you look back on it, it is extraordinary to think where we were just before the South Carolina primary when everyone said, okay, it is going to be Bernie Sanders and donald trump to be president of the United States. Jim clyburn makes the endorsement, everything changes in South Carolina, and then just over one month ago with super tuesday as joe biden swept through those states and everything was flipped on its head. So this race moved quickly. It is an incredible comeback. In talking to people around the Sanders Campaign and the biden campaign, they have much more confidence in 2020 than they did in 2016 that they can bring the Party Together because they do, again, this president as an existential threat to the country. And we certainly are rightly our attention is rightly focused on this pandemic and not politics. But when we move beyond this, there is no doubt that political scientists and historians in the years to couple look at what joe biden did in South Carolina and super tuesday as one of the great political turnarounds in american history. It was incredible. It happened overnight. Somebody who was Whose Campaign was cast aside and forgotten, and now he is the presumptive nominee of the democratic party. So in the wake of the ebola Virus Outbreak in 2014, president obama warned the American People that another disease of that nature was possible and emphasized the response of preparing for the next deadly disease to yeereache u. S. There may and likely will come a time in which we have both an airborne disease that is deadly. And in order for us to deal with that effectively we have to put in place an infrastructure, not just here at home but globally that allows us to see it quickly, isolate it quickly, respond to it quickly. So that if and when a new strain of flulike the spanish flu crops up five years from now or a decade from now, weve made the investment and were further along to be able to catch it. It is a smart investment for us to make. Mika, listen to those words. Yeah. Where we can see it quickly, isolate it quickly, respond to it quickly. Our government has fail on all three points. Joining us now, former u. S. Ambassador to the United Nations and former National Security adviser to president obama, susan rice. She has a new piece in the New York Times this week entitled trump is the wartime president we have, not the one we need. Susan, it is great to see you. Thank you for coming on. I mean there are so many Different Things we will talk about, including the preparation that the ohm white house gave to the trump white house. You met with the National Security adviser. Of course, that was several National Security advisers ago. One example of how americans are paying the price for the instability and chaos inside the white house. Well, thats exactly right, mika, but it is more than instability and chaos. I did spend 12 hours over four sessions briefing general michael flynn, my successor, about the various threats we face. Of course, prominent among them was the risk of a Global Pandemic. We understood this risk to be real as you heard president obama say in 2014. We had been through the 2009 h1n1 flu pandemic, we had been through ebola and zika. The Bush Administration before us dealt with h5n1, a devastating flu that thankfully didnt spread as far as fast as it could have. But we have known because of our expertise in Global Health and our Intelligence Community and the like that we were overdue a Global Pandemic, that it wasnt just something that we could predict. It was inevitable. The only question was when. Thats why during the transition we spent time trying to prepare our successor. We provided a 69page playbook, in effect a war plan for the Incoming Administration to take off the shelf. Wow. I dont think they ever took it off the shelf. They probably put it in the trash can given how much regard they had for anything we passed off. We established an office under my leadership in the National Security Council Called the Global Health security and biodefense office with senior experts whose singular role was to scan the glob for these types of potential outbreaks, to flag them early and enable us along with others to get on top of them so they did not become epidemics much less pandemics. Unfortunately, all of that has been discarded to our great detriment. Wow. Lets talk about one of the things that the president says at just about every press conference which is just a flatout lie, and thats when he says that nobody could have seen this coming. Well, we saw the clip of president obama in 2014 predicting this. Go back to 2005, george w. Bush was talking about it. Bill gates in 2015. Even hhs secretary azar in 2019 said a pandemic was what kept him up at night. Then the president was even getting warning in early january from the cdc, from his National Security council, from the Intel Community in his Daily Briefings. Susan, this was something the alarms were going off for this president for a long time, were they not . Absolutely. I mean you just catalogued in good shorthand the many, many warning he received and the early warning. Lets talk about warning. Warning is both strategic, a major threat that we know is coming, and it can be tactical, which in this case it was. It is coming now and it is coming from china. Thats what he was told in his president ial Daily Briefing in early january. So there is literally no excuse for this administrations lack of preparedness, two full months were absolutely squandered. You know, the white house was notified in early january, first from the head of the cdc and fda, they had heard that from china. The white house at senior levels at that moment should have been on this like the crisis we knew it had the potential to be and started very quickly and urgently in the first instance to try to create and produce and distribute the testing that is absolutely essential to getting on top of Something Like this. Weve heard, you know, ad nauseam how important testing is. We had the capacity to create and distribute a workable test. We failed that mission. We didnt look to others quickly enough, the private sector, universities, foreign sources including the germans, the w. H. O. , and so we were behind the curve. The other thing we should have done very early on in the beginning of the year in early january was to act on the recognition that we are all fully aware of, anybody who has worked on this, that our medical system our Health System in the United States on a normal day is in no way, shape or form configured to deal with a crisis of this magnitude. We dont have the beds. We dont have the ventilators. We dont have the personal protective equipment like masks, but we have the capacity to surge to get them. Those two months in which we didnt move with anything like the speed or the efficacy that was required set us back in an extraordinary way. It wasnt until march when we started scrambling for these materials. We should have done that from the getgo. Had we done it from the outset we would have been far better prepared. We wouldnt have put our Health Workers and our frontline First Responders in such great danger. And the number of americans who would contract the disease and die from the disease would be far fewer. Ambassador rice, it is willie geist. Youre right to point to the failures leading up to this point but here we are. With someone who has had her hands on the levers of government and power and knows how to move things around, what can we be doing as a country this morning . What can the federal government be doing this morning to at least slow what is happening right now and hope it doesnt spread to some of the areas that have not yet seen coronavirus . Where should we be as a federal government . Where should we be as a country right now . Willie, thats exactly the right question for today because weve lost this time but what we do going forward, of course, Still Matters enormously. The first thing is that everybody, each of yourself as individuals, each of us as localities and states and nationwide, we have to continue and intensify our efforts at social distancing. There is no other better remedy than for all of us to take this as serious as it is. It is dead serious literally, and we need to have the fortitude and the patience, as painful as this is particularly economically, to stick with it as long as is needed not only to bend the curve but to put us in a place where we can safely and sustainably reopen. It will be if done properly a gradual process. The next thing is, willie, we need to run this war around it is a war with the National Unity and the coordination of effort that any war requires. We dont fight a world war with each of the 50 states doing their own thing, working against each other, competing for the same ammunition and materials, but yet thats the kind of jungle chaos that President Trump has fomented. Rather than lead. Rather than step up and say, im the commander in chief, had is a war, lets get it done, he is attacking opponents, reporters and governors and denigrating people. Most importantly, he is putting the responsibility on the governors to do it by themselves rather than coordinate the supply effort, the procurement effort, the distribution effort in an apolitical way, he is playing political games and posturing the federal government, to use his own words, as a backup to the states. Now, when in what war is the federal government a backup . The federal government needs to lead and coordinate and that is his job, and he is failing it utterly. All right. Thank you so much, susan rice. Wow. We greatly appreciate you being here. Greatly appreciate you sharing your insight it with us and our viewers. It is so important. It has to be so frustrating for her. Thank you. Thank you. Youre welcome. Willie, breaking news, 6. 6 million americans applied for Unemployment Benefits last year as a pain of the shutdown obviously from the coronavirus continues. Now unemployment sitting at about 10 of the workforce. Wow. A real challenge for this country to balance, of course, the economic pain that so Many Americans are feeling right now with, of course, a pandemic that could actually kill so many more americans if we dont strike this balance correctly. Yes. 6. 6 million, breaking news new weekly unemployment claims, in line with number last week. We are to about 16. 5 million unemployment claims in the last three weeks alone. As weve been talking about all morning, it will be very interesting to see what impact these numbers have on the president s thinking and whether or not he believe he does have to open parts of the economy and get people back to work. Lets turn to former treasury official and economic analyst steve ratner. Steve, good morning. What do you see in the new number . Look, pretty much what you guys have been saying. It is really terrible news. It is at or above the upper end of what people were expecting. I think economists have routinely underestimated. I dont fault them for it because the magnitude of this is so enormous, greater than what many people had said. As you pointed out now there are 16 Million People that applied for Unemployment Insurance in the past three weeks. Just to put that in context, in the month of february the total number of people unemployed not new people, not anything else, just total number in the economy were 6 million from he had more than twice as many people go jobless in the last three weeks than all of the people unemployed back in february. I think the implications of this are what you guys have been talking about all morning, which is the tradeoff between Public Health, which obviously has to be the number one priority, the thing we care most about and devote our effort to, and the Economic Cost to that. We have essentially put in place a bunch of stimulus programs that are aimed at bridging two, three, maybe a fourmonth economic slowdown, shutdown, things of that magnitude. After that theres nothing yet in the hopper. People are talking about a fourth stimulus package of maybe 600 billion or Something Like that, but it is still very much a work in progress. The Federal Reserve this morning announced another 2 trillion of programs to try to provide liquidity to the economy, but were dealing with an order of magnitude of an economic slowdown that we have never seen in our lifetime. It has never been seen at least since the great depression. We are certainly well into double digit unemployment at the moment, and all of the rest of the numbers are just as bad. There was a Small Business optimism number a few days ago, record drop. Half of all Small Businesses based on another number that came out the other day dont believe they can continue to operate for more than two months. The news is about as bad as you could imagine. Yes, and the pain that americans are enduring with those numbers, Jonathan Lemire, are great. Yet we are still in the middle of a Public Health crisis that could claim so many more lives if we rush back too early. All of the doctors, all of the Health Care Experts around the president are telling him to stay the course. Of course though, a lot of those tv and radio talk show hosts that kept telling him that there was nothing to see with this crisis and kept trying to undersell the crisis in the early stages are now pushing the president to go back, to reopen parts of the economy. May 1st. As quickly as possible. What do you expect to hear from the president today . Well, joe, you identified the great tension now and the decision that is looming in front of this in front of this president because the clamoring has already begin from certain quarters within the white house and outside trump advisers and, yes, in the conservative media to start reopening the economy, to say that enough is enough, to point to somewhat encouraging signs in these models, to point to perhaps a plateau in some of the hot spots suggesting that maybe the worst will soon be upon us. Of course, it flies in the face of what a lot of Public Health experts who are saying, even if they are pointing out encouraging signs, theres a long way to go. We could easily back slide if these distance measures were suddenly removed. But this is what the president wants. We have seen it from him in the last few briefings, in our reporting. It is behind the scenes as well. He is going to be pushing sooner than later to reopen the economy. Numbers like this, a jobless number so astronomical and painful for so Many Americans will be behind this and we shouldnt overlook this too. The other thing that happened yesterday was for all intents and purposes the general election has begin. Bernie sanders has dropped out. Joe biden is the Presumptive Democratic nominee and this president will be making decisions with an eye towards november. If he believes that he needs to try to revive the economy in order to take on joe biden, if thats his way to do it, you will see him push forward and it will be up to the Public Health officials to try to preach some caution, to try to slow him down. Steve, a big part of the mitigation of this economic crisis was ppp, the Paycheck Protection Program that gets money out to Small Businesses so they can stay afloat through this and keep people on the payrolls. Obviously it has been a little bit of a stumble to get out of the gate on this, that money is not getting where it needs to go quickly at this point. Do you see that helping weather some of the numbers we are seeing every week . A bright spot in this very, very dark cloud is that we are applying a lot of the lessons we learned in 2008, 2009 to a series of policy decisions which is essentially to do more rather than less, to do it faster rather than slower, to not let the enemy of the good. Ppp is being implemented in a fairly chaotic way because of the rush to get it done, but it is going to put 350 billion in the hands of Small Business to try to keep them going. No one thinks thats enough. We all believe it has to be at least a trillion dollars. In the package the democrats are proposing for the next round of stimulus they would put another 250 billion into it. These are all life support measures for lack of a better expression. Theyre designed to keep the economy on life support in this kind of coma that it is in economically until we can get people back to work. But just to go back to what jonathan was talking about, the tension here is not just letting them go back too soon, but even if they go back once the numbers come down, once the infections come down, who do we know someone wont get in the mix and reinfect a bunch of people and start it all over again. It is hard for any of us to see how the movie ends in a good way. I will say lastly on the political side, it is almost certain donald trump will be looking at 10 plus Unemployment Rate on election day. You can obviously see why he is pushing to reopen the economy. I dont think anything he does will make it lower than that. There will be an economic debate between him and joe biden over whether all of the economic calamity was necessary if we had moved faster, more aggressively and gotten this behind us sooner. All right. Steve ratner, thank you very much. Still ahead on morning joe, shes already raised 35 million and shes not finished yet. Our conversation with lady gaga about her efforts in the fight against the coronavirus. Keep it right here on morning joe. You and i you and i i tomorrow. Its a day filled with promise and new beginnings, challenges and opportunities. At Ameriprise Financial we cant predict what tomorrow will bring. But our comprehensive approach to Financial Planning can help make sure youre prepared for whats expected and even whats not. And that kind of Financial Confidence can help you sleep better at night. With the right Financial Advisor life can be brilliant. I often see them have teeth sensitivity as well as gum issues. Does it worry me . Absolutely. They are both very much hand in hand. So you should really be focusing on both and definitely at the same time. The new sensodyne sensitivity gum gives us the dual action effect that really takes care of both our teeth sensitivity as well as our gum issues. By brushing with sensodyne sensitivity gum at home its giving you the relief that you need and the control that you need to take care of your oral health. And it creates a healthier environment. Theres no question its something that i would recommend. Up next, lady gaga. Our interview with the music superstar on the onceinalifetime concert she is involved with to help with this Global Pandemic. Morning joe is coming right back. You and i you, you and i you, you and i at papa johns, we want you to know that from our 450degree oven, to box, to you, its our policy that your pizza is never touched once it comes out of the oven. And were taking extra steps, like no contact delivery, to ensure it. Well, this is fun. We have an incredible conversation that were about to have with three amazing people. Joining us now in the middle you see kirk tanner, the ceo of pepsico beverages north american. You see jenny remetti, executive chairman of ibm. Yes, it is true, you see lady gaga, who is the curator of one world, together at home. She is an 11time grammy winning artists and my daughters will both talk to me after this interview for sure. It is great to have you all with us. We are so appreciative during this very, very difficult challenging time that were coming together to talk about something that we can do that is productive and helpful. I want to talk about the concert. I want to talk about the technology challenge, everything thats going on. But, lady gaga, obviously your heart is in new york city. Talk about what this time has meant to you and especially what it has meant to see new yorkers, especially on the front lines, the nurses, the doctors, the entire Health Care Community rising to this challenge. Well, first of all i would like to say thank you so much to mika and joe and kirk for all joining me today. I am very happy to be on this call with you. What i would say is, not just in new york, but that is my home, of course, and my family is actually there, but around the world, i feel were witnessing an absolute triumph of bravery and courage that is unprecedented during a Global Pandemic and that the medical community should be celebrated and also theres a whole other story here of helpers to the helpers. Also the Mental Health professionals that are providing volunteer work to be there for medical workers so that when they get off their shifts they have someone to talk to because theyre working under such catastrophic conditions. I really i beyond give them a standing ovation. I want to the best way that i can, with the special thats called one world together at home, i want this to be our love letter to the world. You actually had a call with 68 Corporate Leaders last week. You called it your corporate kindness list and youre getting them to step up. Tell us about that. Well, you know, the truth is a lot of companies, a lot of the philanthropists have stood up for this and ginny and kirk already know that. But i thought, what if we just get everyone together and we talk about in the spirit of kindness, how can we all give . And then also, ive been doing other calls outside of this phone call that i had with those 68 ceos to continue fundraising. Because what i realized is not everybody is kind but some people that have a lot in the world that know theyre blessed and are very selfaware about the fact that they have somewhere nice to live, that they can take care of their children, that they have sanitary food and a sanitary life, they are willing to give and are willing to step up and help. Its been a real privilege to meet with people, you know, even just in this way with this Technology Like ginny and kirk who are willing to give. Im very grateful to them and so is everyone at the World Health Organization for the covid19 solidarity response fund. This money will go towards International Effort to help medical workers as well as patients, and it will also go towards Scientific Research that goes everywhere from vaccines to information. And kirk, you and i, were ill just say this. Were the only guys old enough to remember liveaid. I think it was in 85. It was an extraordinary dont admit that. In 85. And i never thought wed see a collection of stars like that. But this concert coming up from Billie Eilish to elton john to lizzo, Paul Mccartney you name it. What an important lineup for an incredible cause. Tell us about it. Yeah, look, this is first, were grateful at pepsi to be partners with lady gaga and Global Citizen. I mean, i can tell you how humbled we are. You know, we think this is a wonderful opportunity to bring people together to do some real good. And lady gaga just talked about it. The front line heroes are the medical professionals and we think, as pepsico, what is it we can do to lean in . Brands like pepsi have always been part of culture and music and really the team came to me three to four weeks ago looking for something genuinely to do good. And how do we leverage the things and the Resources Companies like pepsico have to do something really positive for the community and the Front Line Health Care professionals. And this is one opportunity that came up and were incredibly grateful to be a part of it. And ginny, i want to know more about the collaboration here because theres also the 2020 ibm call for code global challenge. This is looking for inovation, for solution. It looks like you guys are putting it all on the table. Call for code san initiative for the almost 20 million Application Developers out there who are coding, and we have put 25 million behind that for them to put their efforts towards solutions and what do you do in disasters like this to build solutions around that . So doing two things. One is our employee campaign, almost a popup campaign and the other is around call for code. And i should say, a third after, again, lady gaga had all my colleagues on the phone. I said i could take all my Digital Assets and im offering them to all my colleagues running other companies around the world and letting them use it to pop up their own charitable campaign. I can tell from the first early hours im already seeing the results. I mean, the kindness is incredible. I love it. Yeah, so, lady gaug alets talk about you teaming up with Global Citizen and World Health Organization. We, of course, have known a lot of people in Global Citizen for some time and their obsession on taking care of people across the globe on hunger and poverty. This looks like a National Extension for them and the same with the World Health Organization. Talk about the partnership and what you really hope at the end of all of this to accomplish. Well, first of all, i have to shout out to hugh evans at Global Citizen who is just wonderful to work with. Hes been a wonderful partner and fundraising and putting the show together. And i have to say dr. Tedros is extremely inspiring. He called me to curate this event. I decided to extend my fundraising events and they said lets all do this together and we have. And what i will tell you is that what really has spoken to me is the level of kindness thats occurring here and what dr. Tedros wants to do is help the most underresources communities in the world who are having the most trouble because, you know, we keep saying were all in this together, right . But the truth is that we all want this to be over together. And we all want to help each other. And i know distinctly that the position that im in, in my home environment, is very different from somebody thats living in an unsanitary environment where its very dense. Where they cant get clean food. Where they dont have a job or theyre losing their job. They cant feed their children. They cant feed themselves. Or maybe theyre in a situation where theres Domestic Abuse in the household. So what drew me to this is how can we create a twohour special that during a time of crisis highlights the singular kind Global Community thats emerging and also highlights that this is not just an historical moment but this is the cultural moment and theres an opportunity during this cultural moment to harness kindness and harness it in a way we say, look, theres financial currency and also Brilliant Ideas that both ginny and kirk have to offer as well as both of you. But theres also kindness currency. And kindness currency absolutely free and anyone can give it. And if we start to channel that as an artistic community, while partnering with ceos and Tech Companies and philanthropists, we can make this into a much bigger coalition that is about being kind. And the third thing i want to do during this special is i want to celebrate and encourage the power of the human spirit to be brave and to be courageous and that is why im so grateful to everyone thats been a part of this and helping us fundraise because the truth is before this even airs, on the screen, its going to say put your wallets away. Were not asking you for money. This is not a fundraiser. Weve already raised the money. Just sit back and enjoy the show, because i also do believe that entertainers and artists have a unique ability to make people smile. And i also would like to give those who want to, id like to give them permission to smile during this time and to laugh when they can. No matter how hard it gets. I want to remind them that there are artists that really love them. Boy, do we need that. Lady gaga, thank you very much. Kirk tanner, ceo of pepsico beverages north america and ginny rameti, executive chairman of ibm. What a great team. Thank you. And that does it for us this morning. Stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. Hi there. Im stephanie ruhle. Its thursday, april 9th. Heres whats happening. Nearly 2,000 americans died yesterday from the coronavirus. The worst day so far in this fight against the devastating virus. As we speak, nearly 15,000 americans have now lost their lives to the pandemic. The number of reported cases is over 431,000. At least a dozen states have close to 10,000 cases or more. Michigan is over 20,000. New jersey, close to 50,000. And new york over 150,000. But for some areas, this could be the worst of