Transcripts For MSNBCW Morning Joe 20200330

Cant handle the bodies. Theres so many of them. This is, essentially in my community, queens, new york. Ive seen things ive never seen before. Over the bridge from queens, there is now an emergency Field Hospital being built in central park to help deal with the overflow of those sickened by the coronavirus. This is the new grim reality on this monday morning. Streets lined up with refrigerated trucks, acting as makeshift morgues, while hospital staff and First Responders struggle to keep their heads above the dizzying death toll. Good morning and welcome to morning joe. It is monday, march 30th. We begin with the many fastmoving developments on the coronavirus. The Trump Administration is now extending its guidelines on social distancing. Instead of the president s goal of easter, the guidelines will now extend by more than two weeks, to april 30th. The death toll is increasing rapidly, now at nearly 2,500. It took a month for the u. S. To go from 1 to 1,000 deaths. According to the nbc news counter, the number of deaths from thursday to yesterday increased by more than 1 rksz,2. Dr. Anthony fauci issued this new projection on the numbers of deaths and cases here in the u. S. Looking at what were seeing now, i would say between 100,000 and 200,000 cases. I dont want to be held to that because its excuse me deaths. Were going to have millions of cases. The number i gave out is based on modeling. I think it is entirely conceivable that if we do not mitigate to the extent were trying to do, that you could reach that number. Yeah, yeah. Its possible. I mean, you could make a big sound bite about it, but the fact is, its possible. When i heard the number today, first time ive heard that number because ive been asking the same question some people have been asking i felt even better about what we did last week, with the 2. 2 trillion. Because youre talking about a potential of up to 2. 2 million, and some said it could be higher than that. Youre talking about 2. 2 million deaths. 2. 2 Million People from this. So if we can hold that down, as were saying, to 100,000, it is a horrible number, maybe even less, but to 100,000, so we have between 100,000 and 200,000, we all together have done a very good job. Was floating easter a mistake, you think . No. Tell us why. It was just an aspiration. We actually will be hitting, potentially this was with our meeting before. Easter could be a peak period. That could be the peak, sadly to say. That could be the peak number of deaths before it starts coming down. No, that was aspirational. We had an aspiration of easter, but when you hear these kind of numbers, and you hear the potential travesty, we dont want to do anything where, you know we dont want to spike up. We dont want to do it soon, then all of a sudden, youre coming down, and then you start going up again. We discussed that could happen. We dont want that to happen. Weve gone through too much. So that was an aspirational number. I didnt say easter. I said, itd be a great thing if we could do it by easter. We know much more now than we knew two, three weeks ago. Jeyou said on the air, and i our household, easter deadline was a marker. It wasnt something he was completely going to hold to, but it was showing different assets, different faucets of what is impacting this country, including the economy. Some guidance that could be moved. It has been moved. You know, there were a lot of distracting traits in the News Conference that came out yesterday that can be very, you know, deflecting from whats going on. Overall, you could see that science and the scientists have moved this president to can the 15 days to slow the spread and start to spread it out to the june 1 date that you were talking about all along. Well, of course, the president listened. This is the headline. There was a lot of ground noise, a lot of things that i know a lot of people found disturbing, like how he treated our friend yamiche, attacking cnn. Talking about his ratings. Ratings. Guess what . Thats what he does. Thats the ground noise and, yes, we all have a right to be deeply disturbed by that. But you look at the signal, which is that the president listened to dr. Fauci and dr. Billio birx, instead of listening to larry kudlow. Larry has been a friend of mine for a very long time, but i wouldnt get medical advice from larry kudlow, and i probably wouldnt get stock advice from dr. Fauci. The president listened to who he needed to, and for good reason. As dr. Fauci and dr. Birx really leaned in and started talking about those numbers that the Imperial College was suggesting, up to 2. 2 Million People could die, if we do nothing. If we do nothing. As dr. Fauci said, the American People are doing a lot more than nothing right now. Because of that, because of social distancing, dr. Fauci is talking about 100,000 to 200,000 people dying. Lets hope that the curve is bent unfortunately, deaths, it continues to go straight up. New infections slowly, slowly, were starting to see a bend in that curve. Instead of infections doubling every two days, it is moving towards doubling every three days. We still have a long way to go. Just the numbers though. For people that said this is the flu, or people that mocked reporters and scientists for listening to the Imperial College study, dr. Birx said yesterday, every single study they looked at, every model said itd be between 1. 6 and 2. 2 million americans dead if they didnt take dramatic actions. Of course, thats more numbers, more americans dying than in every war since 1776. Now, just to let you know some of the grim milestones the president was looking at, you know. By the end of the day likely, more americans will have died from this pandemic than died on september 11th. Already, more americans have died from this pandemic, that a lot of people tried to dismiss as a hoax on tv, than died in our 18year war, our 19year war in afghanistan. Just in a month, more americans have died of this pandemic than died in afghanistan over the course of two decades. By the end of this week, more americans will have died from this pandemic than died in iraq, in the iraq war. You could also talk about vietnam. Chances are very good by this time next week, if the numbers keep going the way theyre going, more americans will die than died in our decadelong war in vietnam. Think about that. That is not the flu. That is a pandemic, where the deaths just keep doubling. Of course, if dr. Faucis numbers are right, and he i know he hopes theyre not going to be right, that were going to do make dramatic actions to bend that curve downward, but if it is between 100,000 and 200,000, if the trend lines go the way they look like theyre going, dr. Fauci suggests more people could die from this pandemic in america than died in world war i. So the president had a lot of good reasons to do what he did yesterday. I will remind everybody, again, theres a lot of distractions on these press conferences. And like that admiral told me, mika, long time ago, son, dont listen to the ground noise. Focus on the signal. The signal is, mika, science. The president followed science yesterday and not his economic advisers. That gives us a chance to bend that curve. That gives us a chance to save lives. Weve got a number of cities that are becoming hot spots beyond new york city. By the i with a, w way, we have the New York Times, ed. Dr. Scott godley points to several cities experiencing a rapidly increasing spread, as the coronavirus emerges in these cities, making them multiple epicenters of the u. S. Outbreak. In particular, the city of chicago now accounts for more than 2,000 cases. Almost half of those confirmed in the entire state of of californias over 6,000 cases. In addition to new orleans and detroit, another city to watch is miami. Miamidade county accounts for almost 800 of floridas nearly 5,000 confirmed cases of the coronavirus. Joe, another thing i noticed with trump yesterday is there are people close to him who are getting it. He talked about a friend who had it, and it was suffering. I cant imagine the news about Boris Johnson and several of the folks high up in his administration, in his government, i should say, have it, as well. Right. Its getting close to home for trump and people like trump. Well, when the president said he called Boris Johnson, as somebody who has been an ally of his, and someone who also expressed spe eed scepticism ea is he said the first thing Boris Johnson said, not hello, but we need ventilators. It paints it in stark release. He spoke yesterday of a friend of his who went to the hospital, and the next day was in a coma. Well, thats happening more and more often. It is not just older people. We keep hearing stories of people in their 30s and 40s who are getting infections, some dying very quickly, some very healthy with no preexisting conditions whatsoever. So this is a deadly pandemic. The weight of that pandemic is seeming to finally really, really the president finally seemed to feel the weight of that on his shoulders, at least by the decisions he was making. Lets go to ed. Thank you so much for being with us. I unfortunately start my early mornings with a bit of a grim, grim tradition now. That is, i go to the Financial Times, and i look at the countrys rates of infections, deaths, the cities. I look at the trend lines. Some of the trend lines are starting to bend, but in the United States, certainly on deaths, we continue to go straight up. It seems like the president got the message yesterday, and at least for that press conference yesterday, it was the scientists who won the day. Yeah. Ncouraging. As you say, if you screen out trumps sparring with journalists and needling with journalists, the ultimate message from yesterday was good. He is listening to the scientists. I think where the real concern is, while new york, while Governor Cuomo continues to show it, what it is like to have a strong, singleminded chief executive in charge, there are other states, like florida youre getting disturbing signs in miami and texas that arent taking this as seriously as they could take it. Lessons from other countries is that youve got to have quite disciplined nationwide social distancing if you want to flatten that curve. Britain, you just mentioned, which has a higher increasing death rate, doubling every two days, britain hasnt been observing that until recently. It is beginning to pay the price. The fact that the Prime Minister, his chief adviser, cummings, the heir to the throne, prince charles, michael hancock, minister of death, and the medical chief officer all have coronavirus is, i think, a demonstration effect like no other to ordinary people. This virus is indiscriminate. We all need to socially distance. You know, the thing is, and you bring up a very good point about how those in britain didnt take this seriously until recently, there is a two or threeweek lag. So the United States has started to take this a bit more seriously. The white house is taking this more seriously. That doesnt mean, david ignatius, over the next two weeks, we arent going to continue to have bad news. The next two weeks, i think, the president said, and also dr. Fauci said, the next two weeks may even be even if were doing everything right, even if were moving in the right direction on masks, on ventilators, on tests, on social distancing, were going to be paying for what we did three weeks ago. Bluntly, ive seen a lot of people where i am who still dont seem to get it. Joe, the numbers that dr. Fauci and dr. Birx used yesterday were pretty stark. Up to 200,000 deaths is a lot of people. President trump was touting that as a success. We can only have 100,000 to 200,000 deaths. Well regard that as serious. Your point that so much of this is still unknown, the rates of increase in some states, floridflorida seems to be particularly worrying to those who look at the numbers. Other potential hot spots means we cant yet make firm predictions. But i think everybody felt happy that President Trump listened in this case to his medical experts. He backed off from his earlier almost defiant assertion that wed be roaring and ready to go on april 12th, easter day, and has something more realistic. Well have to watch carefully. Theres some hopeful signs. In the seattle area, in washington, after real social distancing measures, that the rate of increase in cases is going down. Much as youd predict from the evidence that weve seen from asia, from china, south korea. Still, im struck, mika, by how much we dont know about the disease and how it passes and just how many cases there are in the country. And jonathan lemire, it seems to be taking on different characteristics than it even took on in china or europe. Younger people are dying in the United States. Thats something that dr. Birx and dr. Fauci are still trying to figure out. Still cant exactly figure out transmission exactly how its done. There are though some positive signs. New york times reported yesterday about all the shipments that were coming in, going to start coming in from china and around the world, medical supplies. You had this weekend the head of emergency at columbia in new york saying that they look like they may be starting, at least in that hospital, to turn the corner when it comes to masks and gloves and gowns. Just one week after the New York Post showed pictures of people wearing trash bags. You had, again, the president listening to science, following science yesterday, instead of those economic advisers that were saying, open the country back up. Can you tell us we started to see a suggestion of this on friday in his press conference, when he said he was going to be talking to his doctors over the weekend. They were going to make the decision. He said he was going to defer to them on friday, and thats exactly what this president did yesterday. Can you walk us through the weekend, and what was it, from what your reporting suggests, that turned the president and got him more narrowly focused to shut things down, possibly until june the 1st, which is the date ive been hearing for a long time is the date that most Scientists Say, doctors say, we need to wait until we really reopen the economy in june. What got him there . The president eventually got to the right place, the date the Health Experts and scientists believe he should. It was a winding path to do so. A scatter shot weekend. Lets recall that on friday, youre right, he did hint that he would be willing to extend the easter deadline, if you will, the target date, on saturday, for seven hours, he floated out there the idea of a quarantine of new york city, of parts of new jersey, parts of connecticut. An idea that, first of all, there is real belief the federal government didnt have the authority to do. There was no consultation with the governors of those states. Andrew cuomo was asked in real time at a News Conference how the discussion had gone with President Trump about a quarantine. Cuomo said it was the first he was hearing about it. Our reporting, the president floated the idea after consulting with Governor Desantis of florida. You pointed out hes been slow to enforce restrictions. Horrible. There were some beaches still open this weekend in florida. He had been sounding the alarm that he didnt want new yorkers to come down to that state. The president decided to move on that, to float the idea in part as a political calculation. New york, new jersey, connecticut, blue states. To signal to florida and other parts of the country, perhaps where more of his supporters are, look, im taking care of the issue. Science won out though. Dr. Birx and dr. Fauci have been working on him subtly in public interviews and behind closed doors, in the west wing, saying easter was too soon. Showed him a lot of data the last few days. Imperial College Study for one, and others, as well, showing what a disastrous effect it could be if the country reopened too soon and things went in a worstcase scenario to the 2. 2 million number, which stuck with the president. Yesterday, as a final point, joe, the reporting shows there were two things that really struck the president. There was that number, the 2. 2 million. Even 100,000 is a huge number of deaths but, as we heard him say, itd be an improvement over that. It was also some of the images coming from his hometown in new york. It was the construction of the makeshift hospital beds in central park. It was the sight of a what was it refrigerated delivery truck being loaded with bodies at a hospital here that went around social media yesterday and made its way to the cable newscasts. Yes, in particular, the scenes at elmhurst hospital, not far from where the president grew up in queens. It was striking to him and seemed to hit home the scene thats happening in his homet n hometown, which could be created across the nation. That sort of fueled this decision to at least slow down the reopening, to push back well beyond easter, extend lent, if you will, toward the end of april. These images will be coming out of new york city at least for the next ten days to possibly two weeks. The worst, actually, is still ahead for new york. Lets hope that that curve starts to be bending a little bit to the right. Mika, just again, when we listen to the president , im not saying it makes it right, and im not saying this is what he should do, but when the president says, im going to open the economy by easter, and you know thats not possible, that millions would die if he did that, if you listened to the study, chances are good hes sending a signal. In that case, he was sending a signal to the markets and Small Business people, hey, im on your side. Im going to fight for you. Were going to actually have a balance between the health of the nation and the health of your Small Business, and also for a lot of people who are out of work now. You know, the same thing this weekend when the president talked about possibly just shutting down new york and the tristate area. Well, immediately, he cant do that. Constitutionally, he cant do that. If hes saying that, hes saying that for a reason. Hes sending, again, a political messa message. Again, doesnt make it right. That just makes it the reality. Its been ive been saying for years, separate the ground noise from the signal. Ill end is segment again saying the signal is the president yesterday listened to his scientists. If he stays on this course, and if we continue to push hard for ventilators and expand testing rapidly, because were still testing more people but were still, per capita, one of the lowest countries in the world, but if we do that, we will see that curve start to bend, and we will avoid seeing 1 million, 2 million americans dead from this pandemic. Still ahead on morning joe, the republican governor of ohio, mike dewine, is our guest. Plus, from hardhit new york city, congresswoman grace meng joins the conversation. Her queens district includes the inundated elmhurst hospital. Plus, as joe mentioned, it is not just Older Americans at risk from coronavirus. Were going to talk to amy breslow, whose husband, a youth football coach, is fighting for his life against the illness. Also, what if 2 trillion isnt enough . Well talk to the Washington Post bob costa about the next steps on capitol hill. Plus, yamiche, who put on a master class in journalism yesterday, will join us. Youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. Ighthouse, has stood strong through every dark hour and bright dawn our country has endured. It has seen the break in the clouds before anyone else. For the past 168 years, weve also stood by you, helping you weather storms like this one, to protect your loved ones. And well do it for 168 more. Helping you weather storms this piece is talking yeah . So what do you see . I see an unbelievable opportunity. I see bestinclass platforms and education. I see awardwinning service, and a trade desk full of experts, available to answer your toughest questions. And i see it with zero commissions on online trades. I like what youre seeing. Its beautiful, isnt it . Yeah. Td ameritrade now offers zero commissions on online trades. Did you know prilosec otc can stobefore it begins . Urn heartburn happens when stomach acid refluxes into the esophagus. Prilosec otc uses a unique delayedrelease formula that helps it pass through the tough stomach acid. It then works to turn down acid production, blocking heartburn at the source. With just one pill a day, you get 24hour heartburn protection. Prilosec otc. One pill a day, 24 hours, zero heartburn. 28 past the hour, as new york City Hospitals continue to be slammed with an excess of coronavirus patients. A 68bed emergency Field Hospital is being built in central park to help with the overflow. The Triage Center, organized by the Christian Organization, samaritans purse, and located across the street from mt. Sinai hospital, will include a respiratory care unit with icu capability. It is expected to be up and running by tomorrow morning. While the ongoing call for at least 30,000 respirators in new york remains, experts say the next unknown is who is going to operate them. There are only a total of nearly 8,000 respiratory licensed specialists in the state, plus an unknown number of doctors and nurses trained to use the breathing machines. Meanwhile, the navys u. S. N. S. Comfort is expected to dock in new york city today to help hospitals care for 1,000 noncovid19 patients aboard. Joe, this is one of the frightening things for Health Care Workers, that theyre on the front lines. Theyre exposed. There have been doctors and nurses flying into the new york city area over the past week to try and help. There are a lot of parallels you could make with september 11th. You saw fire trucks from alabama and tennessee and West Virginia and across the country driving in to new york city after 9 11 to do whatever they could to help out. You saw the same with police officers. Thats happening now. The people on the front lines now are nurses and doctors and Health Care Providers who are coming into new york city and will soon be going to places like chicago and across the country, to try to bring relief to the Health Care Workers who are absolutely being pushed to their limits right now. Some of them are scared, for good reason. Theyre separated from their families and, yet, they keep going in every day. To try to save lives. Sort of a sobering reminder, ed luse, we talk about we need more ris prate respirators and venti, and there is a shortage in new york city and across the country. Ed luse is working on his camera situation. There we go. Go ahead, ed. Yeah, im sorry. Me trying to be my own tv producer. The concern i have with Peter Navarro in charge of the decisions from a National Stockpile is you have no real layer between Donald Trumps aides, if you like, and the decisions to which states get priority. Youve seen governorflorida, ge everything hes asked for in terms of ventilators, masks, et cetera. A Gretchen Whitmore of michigan, who has been publicly critical of the president , has been shortchanged. Peter navarro is not going to curb that. I think he is going to magnify that. Myself and many other journalists received a lot of criticism from conservatives during this epidemic. That you should all pull together in a crisis, that you should back the president , the commander in chief, and this is no time for criticizing. I think this is precisely the time for criticizing. You saw with yesterdays press conference, when President Trump is shown the science, when the argument is pressed home, he can real time change bad decisions to good ones. You look at the height of the second world war, you know. Even when the blitz was at its peak, churchill was taking criticism in the house of commons and from the media, as was fdr during the war. The idea that we should be holding off on our criticisms of the president has been belied by the president changing his mind, for good reasons. Having listened to good arguments in the last 24 hours. This is precisely the time where criticism should be focused. The one big concern ive got right now there are several but the biggest is the system of allocating resources to where it is most needed. There is heavily president ial reward punishment system there for people who were nice to him vo s versus people who arent. Going to the point you made about criticism, dr. Fauci, and also the Imperial College study, came under blistering criticism over the past week. Talking about those sion who Imperial College numbers also attacked by trumpists who were blindly loyal in the media to the president. I even heard people on television and im just shocked still suggesting this epid dedemic will only hit new city and not Middle America. Thats malpracticement tha. S thats grounds for a lawsuit. People delivering the news are supposed to be giving facts, not fiction. The viewers are there to trust them. If they get poor information, or theyre misled to believe they cant get sick, and they get sick, exactly how is that not grounds for some sort of situation to arise . This is clear. Well, the fact that if anyone is trying to push against it, they are committing malpractice. The fact that misinformation continues, and continues to be spouted when you have middle American Cities in louisiana, in michigan, in florida, just across the country, in georgia, in tennessee, in texas. Again, the misinformation continues, so there is a responsibility to be critical when bad decisions are being made. I also would suggest for the media, it is very important also, separate the ground noise from the signal. When science is put to the front, and when the president s decisions are based on science, as they were yesterday, that needs to be reported, as well. Literally, thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of lives depend on the decisions being made. David ignatius, i will not reveal the esteemed leader who told me before the Trump Presidency that Donald Trumps leadership style, in a sense, reminded him of fdr. This person, by the way, is one of the most respected people in washington by both sides. He said he likes playing people off of each other, and fdr used that to good effect during the depression in world war ii. The president does this publicly. A lot of people are scared in the process and pingpong back and forth. Im curious, when you look at recent president to rship george w. Bush, barack obama . Barack obama was krcerebral. He listened. He was often maddening in he wouldnt say what he was thinking. Clinton was me cu mercurial. He loved to wade into a crowd, whether it was supporters or advisers. He was disorganized. I can remember his chief of staff talking as if he was pulling his hair out about how difficult it was to control this president. This president is seeming to Pay Attention to the last person he spoke to. In this case, it seemed over the weekend, we should all be very happy, i think, that in the end, he listened to science. Good, prudent judgment won out over what trump had as an aspiration, to reopen the country on easter day. Good science prevailed, so thats a good mika, about comparison of other president s, obviously, we think with a Great National tragedy, our generation of 9 11. George w. Bush didnt cause 9 11 any more than donald trump caused the coronavirus pandemic were living through. In each case, we learned that inadequate preparations were made. That the warning signs that were there, that were flashing red through the summer of 2001, through january and february of 2020, were telling leaders, if they really had paid attention, that it was time to do something. That issue of our lack of preparation, to what extent the president and his aides are responsible for the consequences is, i think, going to be at the center of our president ial campaign. We dont have to litigate it every day. Thats joe bidens job if he is the nominee. Whoever the democratic nominee is. Im struck by the similarity. This is a catastrophe. The warning signs were there. They were flashing red. Not enough was done. Its not trumps fault, but he is responsible for how the government dealt with that information. Of course, the issue thats important now to listemillions americans, actually, 320 million, 330 million americans, is what the president does now, what the administration does now, what congress does now, and what their leaders do now to move us past those grim milestones. Of course, it is up to americans also to socially distance and continue to be responsible. Jonathan lemire, we heard the president yesterday, heard him talking about following the guidance of his doctors and scientists on friday. What do we expect today from this president . What do we expect this week . I know theyre ramping up the factories. The tests are ramping up, as well. Were trying to catch up with the rest of the world on per capita testing. Were still far behind there, but it seems some progress is being made there. A lot of shipments coming in. Whats the next goal for this white house . Today, i believe, was going to be the end of the originally 15 days to stop the spread, yet, instead where we are, is this white house going for the long haul. We saw the president yesterday, of course, extend the National Guidelines well beyond easter, to the end of april, and suggesting the nation really wouldnt be up and running until june 1st. Were expecting another Daily Coronavirus Task Force Briefing at 5 00. The president hinted there will be more instructions, guidelines, and data released by tomorrow s what he said to this point. Certainly, the medical professionals, scientists, won out. Remember how mercurial this president can be and how quickly he can change his mind. There has been intense lobbying in his ear from some within his own administration. Governors across the country, republicans mostly from states who have not been that impacted by the virus yet, urging him to try to reopen the economy again. You have the president , for now, delaying that. Will pressure mount again, particularly if the markets continue to slide, particularly if his poll numbers, which have gone up in the few polls weve seen since the crisis begun. If they begin to glide again, if he gets antsy and thinks about reelection chances, this is a momentbymoment presidency. Certainly, things can change again. Youll see, i think, this week, a focus on trying to get more testing out, to get more supplies out. He did finally invoke the defense production act, pushing gm to make more ventilators. Gm said they agreed to it anyway. Youll see the president mobilize further, continuing with the tone from yesterday, at least for the time being. Yeah. The news itself, the actual news, the numbers coming out are going to guide this presidency and force him. Theyre going to force his hand. 100 people in new york city dying in a matter of seven hours. Thats not a number you can argue with and open up the country. This is going to continue. I cant say this enough, well be faced with the news the next couple weeks. Not because of what the president did yesterday, but because of what we all have been doing over the past several weeks. So those death rates are going to continue to go up. There wasnt the social distancing as early as there should have been. Theres no testing. The testing is ramping up now, and we certainly hope abbott labs and a lot of others get those tests out. Let me, very quickly, and with you, ed luse, i know we have to go to break, but, ed, the situation also dire in great britain. The death rate exploding upward. Yeah. Its on a very disturbing route. As we mentioned before, the british and the americans well, trump and Boris Johnson in deni denial, complacency, to some extent negligence. Were only one week into the National Lockdown in britain. The kind of behavior youve been seeing in new york for three weeks or so, and other parts of the west and east coast, and parts of the middle, youve only been seeing in britain for a week. I think its beginning to catch up with italy and spain, and were going to see some really dire hospital scenes from the National Health service in britain over the coming days. I hope im wrong, but thats what the numbers are pointing to. David ignatius, weve been talking about chinas numbers for some time. Ive said for some time we cant trust those numbers. It seems were getting more information out of there. Some firsthand accounts. When you look at chinas trend line, you really cant judge it from the information theyre sending in. Because they actually may have far more deaths than were ever reported. They certainly may have far more cases. The province by province numbers in china are notoriously unreliable. The chiefs dont want to positioffend party bosses by sending the wrong message at the wrong time. I should say, weve been aided, american epidemiologists, trying to understand this, by good numbers out of china. Looking at what happened in wuhan, hubei province. So i think we need to be honest and say thank you to china for giving us some data to begin to think about, what is this strange, new coronavirus disease . But, as you say, joe, statistics in china, whether theyre about Economic Growth or just how many cases of covid19 there are, are just not reliable. Yeah. We are attached, mika, at the hip to china right now. Mmhmm. We have to be. Because we sent supplies to them in february. Theyre sending supplies to us now. The New York Times reported last night, the white house is reporting that were getting cargo plane after cargo plane of personal protective gear thats coming into the United States. Ventilators. We can learn a lot from china because, obviously, they went through this before we did. But there is going to be im sure theres going to be a lot of tough talk and a lot of reassessments after this pandemic is over. Right now, when were in this pandemic, there is no doubt, better to have china as our partner than have them as an enemy, whether it is with trade or just war of words. Jonathan lemire, david ignatius, and ed luse, thank you all for being on this morning. A Field Hospital in central park, emergency tents packed with 68 beds, are now standing in the manhattan landmark. Well talk to the top doctor coordinating that effort straight ahead on morning joe. We make ideas grow. From an everyday solution. To one that can take on a bigger challenge. From packaging tape. To tape that can bond materials to buildings. And planes. One idea can unlock a breadth of solutions. At 3m, we are solving problems that improve lives. Onkiller attitude. K a nevor hydration. S. Neutrogena® hydro boost. Yaluronic acid moisturizer delivers 2x the hydration for supple, bouncy skin. Neutrogena®. Tthe bad news . Our so will this recital. Day. Depend® fitflex underwear offers your best comfort and protection guaranteed. Because, perfect or not, lifes better when youre in it. Be there with depend®. Who stood up. Who stood strong. Who demanded to be seen. To be heard. To be counted. Learning about their courage and grit. Inspires us to pass it on. To the women who are next. Find your familys connection to this moment in history. At ancestry. vo theyre adapting to supporto their communities. S. But many need our help. If youre a Small Business in need, or want to help a local business, go to quickbooks. Com smallbusinesshelp intuit quickbooks. Were welcome back to morning joe. Joining us from the mt. Sinai Health System, dr. Brenden carr. The hospital, with the health of a Christian Organization, is currently being building a Triage Center in new york citys central park. It is expected to open tomorrow. Doctor, thanks for joining us. What will the Field Hospital will used for, and how are the mt. Sinai Hospital Systems right now handling the deluge of coronavirus cases . Good morning. Thanks for having me. The hospital, there are two faces of this crisis, and i appreciate it very much, the distinction about the signal noise conversation earlier. The two faces are a logistics piece and humanitarian case. Its the front line of the doctors facing, and then the logistics of the personal equipment, staffing, and the equipment and room to put people. So this hospital, like you said, there are general beds and icu beds. Itll be used to build capacity for our Health System and the Greater New York health care market, to be sure as people come in, they can have a chase they can be cared for. Dr. Carr, let me ask how youre fairing, how your nurses and doctors are fairing when it comes to masks, gloves, gowns, this sort of equipment thats necessary for them to do their jobs without fear of getting the infection and taking it home, getting the virus. We had heard the head of one emergency room in new york city say that he sensed that they were beginning to turn the corner of some of these shortages. Maybe in the next few weeks, things may be okay. How are you all fairing when it comes to the personal protection . Yeah, you know, again, id almost make the same distinction between what we know to be the facts, whats in the warehouse, what the supply chains look like, and what it feels like at times on the front line. We are okay, for now. There is a constant trade off always between the demand and the supply. It doesnt always feel okay on the front line, and it is important for us to, as leaders, make sure we have a conversation with folks to make clear what we have available. That we are conserving and being judicious with our use of ppe because we dont know what the future holds. We dont know exactly how many are coming. We dont know exactly how long this is going to last. We dont know exact lly whats going to happen with the supply chain. Anything we can do to safely conserve is a decision that we have asked our staff to work with us on. And hospitals sorry. When it comes to ventilators, have you reached full capacity yet . Are you close to full capacity . How are you all doing in that respect . You know, we have not reached full capacity yet. We are a big system, and the privilege of being a big system is we can move materials, move patients, move staff around to try to address the places where we are in surge and where were having a hard time keep up, to places that are still able to manage the patients that they have. You know, as i think about our system though, i think about some of our hospitals being overwhelmed and having to off load patients to some of our other hospitals. It really makes me think about the narrative being broader across the u. S. And across the globe. How many hot spots we can manage at a time is a different thing than how many hot spots there are at a time. Borrowing nurses, docs, respiratory specialists to help in new york, addressing the supply chain issues is a different conversation if there are dozens of places as hot as we are right now. Doctor, do you have any numbers on medical workers who are exposed, who have tested positive, who are out of work . How are you doing with staffing and keeping the shifts straight, so medical workers can keep up with the demand . You know, i dont have numbers, in part, because we dont test people who are mild or moderately ill if theyre not getting admitted to the hospital. In the early days, we were. Now, our tests are reserved primarily for people being admitted to the hospital, so we can put them in a unit that is distinct from a unit where people are not infected. But, that said, of course, people are getting sick. Theyre getting sick, and it is impacting our staffing. We have done a lot to do that, as i said, sharing across our system, but also bringing in new staff that are volunteering or offering to come and work with us. How will your job be made easier in the coming weeks, as we start to see this spread of testing, even abbott labs talking about a fiveminute test, fda approved last week a 45minute test, also. If you had the ability to test your Health Care Workers, how much of a difference would that make with the choices youre having to make right now, moving forward logistically . Less than i think people would think. For us, if youre going home, your treatment isnt changing. If youre well enough to be home, do all the things we know you need to do to be safe at home. For us, the biggest distinction is getting tested early and quickly if youre in the hospital, so we can be sure to put you somewhere where you wont infect people without covid. Thats a have you please, go ahead. Sorry. Go ahead. I was i was going to say ill be quiet. You go. It is a different narrative than weve come to hear, you know. There are two reasons to test. One is to understand the epidemiolo epidemiology, understand how many cases there are, understand how predominant this is in the community. The other is to test because it changes what we do in the hospital. Still no treatment. A lot of things on the horizon, exciting things. Antiviral medicine, all kinds of things on the horizon. Right now, it is mostly about supportive care. Final question, if you could, youre in charge of a lot of doctors, a lot of nurses, a lot of medical techs that are going through hell right now. Weve likened it to 9 11. This week, more people, more americans will be dead because of the coronavirus than were killed on september 11th. Instead of firefighters and nypd cops, weve got nurses and doctors and medical techs on the front line. Can you put a human face to what theyre going through and what they need right now . Yeah. I can try. They are working brutal hours. They are faced with brutal decisions. They are scared for their own health and for their the health of their loved ones. Lots of people are living in donated apartments or in hotel rooms that have been given to us or purchased by the Health System so they can be safe and away from others. It is a really hard time, and were only a few weeks into it. The question will be where we will be weeks and months from now if the pace keeps up or if the pace gets worse. I think, you know, it is important to remember them and to remember the face of them as they challenge this and work really hard on the front line. And i think it is important to support them. One of the things and this is a hard piece to talk about one of the things that would support them, as everybody is asking us when we are going to allocate when we will be forced to allocate, or people use the word ration, care and ventilators. Id ask the public to be thoughtful and strategic about the decisions they would make or would want made for them at the end of their life. Putting us in the situation of sorting that out when you show up in distress is very different than being thoughtful with your family about what it is you would want, should you become critically ill. All right. Chair of emergency medicine at the icon school of medicine at mt. Sinai, and the mt. Sinai Health System, dr. Brendan carr, thank you very much for joining us. This programming note. On tomorrows show, House Speaker nancy pelosi is our guest. Well be right back with much more this morning with dr. Dave campbell, after a break. 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Because youre talking about a potential of up to 2. 2 million. Some people said it could be higher than that. Youre talking about 2. 2 million deaths. 2. 2 Million People from this. So if we can hold that down, as were saying, to 100,000 its a horrible number maybe even less, but to 100,000, so we have between 100,000 and 200,000, we all together have done a very good job. I grew up in queens, new york. Right next to a place called elmhurst, queens. They have a hospital thats a very good hospital, elmhurst hospital, right . Ive known it. Ive known where it is. I can tell you the color on the outside, the size of the windows. I mean, i know it very well, right . It was near my community where i lived. Ive been watching that for the last week on television. Body bags all over in hallways. Ive been watching them bring in trailer trucks, freezer trucks. Freezer trucks because they cant handle the bodies. Theres so many of them. This is essentially in my community, queens, new york. Ive seen things ive never seen before. Hes seen things hes never seen before. The people of new york are seeing things theyve never seen before. Unfortunately, if you look at the numbers that are starting to show up in louisiana, in florida, in michigan, in california, americans are going to see things theyve never seen before. There is no doubt, mika, as we talked about the first hour, again, the need to separate the ground noise from the signal. The signal yesterday is the president listened to his medical advisers, to his doctors, to his scientists, and he made the decisions that, i think, every medical professional would applaud. Yes. You know the saying, that mike pence was pushing 15 days to slow the spread. You can add another 30 days on to that. The Trump Administration is now extending its guidelines on social distancing. Instead of the president s goal of easter, the guidelines will now extend by more than two weeks to april 30th. The death toll is increasing rapidly. Now at nearly 2,500. It took a month for the u. S. To go from 1 to 1,000 deaths. According to the nbc news count, the number of deaths from thursday to yesterday increased by more than 1,200. You had 100 die in new york city alone in a sevenhour span of time. By the way, mika, people have been talking about how this is the flu. Thats why this isnt the flu. Its not the flu. Again, it take one month. Its not a hoax. Get up to 1,000 deaths. That doubles in a couple days. Why is this pandemic a crisis, so much more than the flu . Because the flu is spread out. It doesnt suppress our mtress systems. You go in, get a flu shot. A doctor can figure out you have a flu test. You write it out at home. Maybe if its really bad, you go to the hospital. Its spread out over the course of selfmonth of several months. It is a pandemic. Dr. Fauci and the medical experts have been saying the same thing. We have to flatten that curve. When you flatten the curve, it allows Health Care Providers to take care of you and your parents and grandparents and your children when they get sick. Lets bring in chief medical correspondent dr. Dave campbell. Dr. Dave, it really appears that not only trump is listening to his scientists, but to the numbers. There are hot spot s around the country. The numbers, theres no way you can reopen the country by easter. It is basic fact at this point. Thats true. Scientists are driven by data. The data that we will have in increasing fashion will come from the testing thats been approved over the last couple of weeks. Eight days. Then yesterday. Well see an explosion of testing for the virus itself that will tell us who is actively infected, so those individuals can be sheltered in place, hidden away, quarantined, put in their own home. The problem, mika, is it is a contagious virus. Put i putting a perso expose other me of the house to the individual. The disease tends to spread within households, as well. Thats one problem. The testing that we are going to be short on is the Antibody Testing. We can tell over the next few weeks who has the disease, take them out of the front line, Health Care Workers, police officers, paramedics. Well need to back fill the workers as time rolls on and the pandemic shortens. We have a shortage of testing. Shortage for the testing of the virus, which is now. We are behind on the Antibody Testing. The antibodies develop in notho who had the disease, survive it, and come out the other end. Im hopeful well see over the next few weeks. Yeah. I want to just break that down for people at home. Of course, we have the testing. Weve been talking about it an awful lot. The United States is ramping up the testing. A chart shows, per capita, were far behind the rest of the countries, the other major countries in the world per capita. I think youre going to see that gap actually tightened in the coming weeks. We are starting to ramp up with tests. There you see. It shows how countries are doing. South korea, spain, germany, italy are at the top of testing rates per million. Japan, the United States, france, at the bottom. Again, expect those numbers to change in the coming weeks. Dave, those are the tests that show who has the virus. Youre talking about, and i hear many people talking about the importance of the antibody tests. If you can have the antibody tests administered to the population, and you find out who developed the immunity, well, that person can go on, start living their lives. They can go back to work. They can start going to restaur. They can go out. Their body has developed the immunity. How long do you think itll be before we can deliver those tests to see who have the antibodies and who can get back into the economy, start living again outside of their ho restaurants . Joe, the tests can be scaled up as rapidly as it. Theyre available in china. Theyre available in south korea. Theres a company on long island that said they can scale up to a million tests. Its just a matter of getting a couple weeks ahead, forward thinking, and realizing that we can either open up the economy, backfill Health Care Workers and Public Safety workers, by guessing and being in the blind, or we can do it with objective data that tells us who was infected and is no longer, and who has antibodies. Those are, to put it in a funny way, theyre the supermen and the superwomen who can backfill those that become sickened, taken off the front line. Ill give you a good example. He made this public to the company, so i can say it right here. Jeff shell, the head of nbc universal, our company, got the coronavirus, fought through it, had a rough fun at it, and he is doing better now. When he gets on the other side of it, hell help do things millions of us cant right now because he is going to have the antibodies. You start multiplying. Were sure hundreds of thousands of people already had the coronavirus, didnt even know about it. One of my best friends actually had a connection with wuhan, china. People that worked in his building had gone to a show, met up with people that were from wow han, china, a trade show. Came back. My friend didnt have a lot of conditions. He lost his sense of taste and smell for a couple weeks before knowing that was it. He kept working through it. Hes got the antibodies now. Maybe, if we knew. Maybe. I just wanted to explain to everybody, thats why that testing, dave, is so important. Yeah. It is not just getting back to restaurants. Im concerned about it. Its getting reinforcements from the doctors and nurses who are giving their lives to make people healthy again. It is predicted that up to 10 of the population has been exposed and survived. Remember, iceland, 50 of those exposed in iceland, they were tested and had been asymptomatic. There can be a gigantic pool of americans who can go out and volunteer and go into the homes of older people who need food. Knowing theyre not going to infect the older person and theyre not going to contract the disease because they alread. It is a change. Dr. Dave campbell, thank you for coming on. Im so glad you wanted to talk about this this morning. I was talking about someone who had been talking to the president of the United States. Were starting to make progress. This person was dead on and predicted what was going to happen for weeks. He said testing is the gamechanger. It gets people working again and back helping, doctors and nurses. As dave said, that gets people helping seniors that may be isolated right now, that may not be able to get groceries or other things. If the government rach ramps u is a gamechanger. Political recorder for the Washington Post and political analyst robert costa. Hes the moderator of Washington Week on pbs. Msnbc contributor and author of how the right lost its mind, charlie sykes. At the white house, White House Correspondent for pbs news hour, yamiche alcindor. Im not feeling threatened by yamiche, are you . Yamiche, tell us what you learned yesterday from the press conference. What i learned is that the president , who had been leaning in on his political instincts and really sharing all sorts of misleading information, is continuing to do that in some way. Also, as you noted, hes listening to the scientists, saying we cant have churches packed by easter sunday, as he said. No, this isnt going to be a miracle where coronavirus cases are going to disappear. In fact, he is saying, im moved by the images on the television, which is what we know President Trump has been like, saying i have to take this seriously. He said that june is when we might be able to get back to some normalcy. The other thing i learned is as the president was lashing out at me and other journalists, is he feels upset about the fact he has to backtrack on some of the misleading claims hes been making. For instance, i was talking to him about the fact that he said clearly, i dont believe 30,000 or 40,000 ventilators are needed in some places. New york Governor Cuomo has been clear his state needs 30,000 ventilators. When i quoted it back to the president and he was angry, it was a man who was upset at himself for putting out the misleading information and questioning what governors across the country need to help their states stay safe. It seems, yamiche, like it is getting real for this president. I know he was going after you, accusing you of being threatening. He has this little issue with you. But when you heard the things he was saying, you can hear the facts closing in on him. You cant deny the facts. You cant deny the video and the pictures that back up these facts. There was a moment when he was talking about whether or not he would give michigan or other states resources. He was being pressed on the way he was treating the governors. He seemed to say that they wouldnt get his attention, but they would still get supplies and relief, if necessary. How did he handle that . Because he was confronted with the way he behaves, not just with reporters, but how hes been treating the nations governors. Thats right. He said, yes, im upset there are governors i feel arent being nice to me. I probably wont be calling them. I know Vice President mike pence will be calling them. By the way, theyll still be getting the resources they need. Well have to continue to press this administration on exactly how the president s thoughts, feelings, and instincts are impacting the way he is giving resources to different states. The president was very clear that he thinks some people are making up their numbers. He also said yesterday in a very kind of confusing way that mass might be going missing at hospitals because there might be some sort of behavior there that is questionable, that people would be looking into. What we know is hospitals are in dire shortage of things like masks and gowns. This is a president who has invoked the production act for one company, for one item, ventilators, general motors. He hasnt used the full force of the federal government to give hospitals what they need. Joe, you know, there was a lot of talk about some of the other ground noise versus the signal, and thats the president talking about his ratings. You know, yesterday was important, because he totally went back on his muchtouted easter timeline, which most of us knew was imossablpossible. Looking at the science, the facts, it was clear he wasnt making that deadline. When you have to go back on major pronouncements again and again, when it pertains to a pandemic that is slowly creeping across the nation, and impacts almost everybody at some point, you wonder if, you know, his ratings and stuff like that gets impacted. Because you lose credibility if youre saying things that then you have to go back upon again and again. Maybe you missed that during the campaign. Maybe you let it go by when it is about things that dont impact you. When it impacts your day to day life, and youre looking at 15 days of selfisolation, keeping your kids inside, worrying about your spouse who is a health care worker, and whether or not he or she is going to live and die, all of a sudden, adding 30 more days, that means a lot. That is a lot. There was a lot of skepticism toward this disease, whether the media was blowing it out of proportion, whether this was yet another issue that many Trump Supporters believe the media was blowing out of proportion. There were some people delivering the news on television who were trying to debunk this. They were. But what is important for us to keep in perfespective is the president of the United States, members of congress, every leader in washington, d. C. , they had a balancing act. That balancing act was between keeping americans healthy and taking no chances on the spread of a deadly pandemic that, as the president said, could kill 2. 2 million americans. Also on the other side of the ledger, well use that expression because it is appropriate here, how do you get people back to work . People are going to lose their jobs. Theyre losing their jobs. Unemployment is going to explode. Small businesses, people that had a restaurant, a Small Business in their family for generations have seen it destroyed in a months time. Larger corporations that employ tens of thousands of people have seen their company destroyed in a short amount of time. Peoples 401 k s, retirement plan, is a balancing act. You see television, seeing the president talking about the country has to be shut down. The prime min ser hister has to down the country, do this. Easy to say that. There are a lot of people at home who have lost their jobs. A lot of businesses destroyed. So that is a constant balancing act, not just for this president but for Prime Ministers, for governors. The president chose to listen to the scientists, and a lot of americans are safer because of it. Weve been harshly critical of this president. I have to say, in a pandemic, as in a war, if the president makes the right decision, we need to underline that decision and encourage him to continue listening to doctors and scientists. Talking about this balancing act, and were really glad we have Governor Mike Dewine with us from ohio. He joins us by phone. Governor, you know about this balancing act as well as anybody. You have a bigger, more successful state in the nation. From the beginning, you actually have taken a pretty firm line on choosing the health of your citizens, especially your Senior Citizens first, even when you knew it would cause pain to the economy. Tell us about that process that you have to go through every day. You know, im fortunate. I have a great director of health in amy acton. I listen to her. I listen to the panel. Were listening to them. The decisions were certainly not easy decisions because you know youre inflicting pain on people and Small Businesses, as you pointed out. So these are real people. Restaurants are closing. Theyre real people who worked at bars. Yeah, its tough, but we made the decision, we have to first keep everybody alive. We have to first do everything we can to lessen the damage. It doesnt, frankly, do anything if your Health Care System blows up. Were struggling to do that now. In ohio and other states, were in a race. That is, we have to build our hospitals up. We think we have to increase our capacity two to maybe three times. Were in the process of doing that. The same time, were trying to hold this thing back a little bit and slow it down. Spread it out so that we dont overwhelm the Health Care System like were seeing in, you know, new york. We certainly saw it in italy. Thats my greatest fear every single day when i wake up. Theres a sense of urgency. We have to build out but, at the same time, we have to keep people apart so we slow this thing down. Well, so you agree then with dr. Fauci and dr. Birx and the president s decision to wait until the end of april, but also, probably, perhaps, we may have to wait until june 1st to see our first Cincinnati Reds or Cleveland Indians game. Well, yes. You know, im not even sure when thats going to be. Yeah. My son, our son runs a Minor League Baseball team in asheville, north carolina. He said, when are we playing . I said, if we are playing by july, well be lucky. Yeah. Could open before then. We have to do what we have to do to get through this. One of the things i told people on st. Patricks day when we closed the bars, everything, i said, look, we all want to be around for the next st. Patricks day and the next one. We want to be able to, you know, see our families grow up. These are things, tradeoffs, but we have to error on the side of keeping people alive. Will you send a message to people in your state, people in the part of the country i grew up in, central time zone. Theyre still hearing people on television and radio saying, this is a new york city thing. Middle america, you dont with a to worry about it. It is being over hyped and overblown. It is like when they said it is an italy or china thing. Can you just warn the good people in ohio, and ive got a lot of relatives there, and across the country, that this is coming . It may not be as intense as new york city, but everybody has to batten down the hatches and prepare. All the Scientific Evidence that we see, all the modeling that we see indicates that it is here. It is expanding. You know, one model shows this doubling every three or four days, the number of people who are infected. We dont have the testing we need. Most states dont have the testing, so youre not getting the real numbers. We know it is growing. It just keeps growing faster and faster and faster. So thats its coming right at us. So what we do, what we do in our lives every day, staying away from other people, doing all the things that we keep hearing o tv, we have to keep doing. Weve got to keep doing if were going to all make it through this thing. Governor, ohio Governor Mike Dewine, thank you so much for being on the show. We greatly appreciate it. No ground noise there. Hope to talk to you again. Great to be with you. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. Jack and my boys will be very sad to hear that baseball, woel be lucky to start baseball season in july. I think the governor is right there. Well be lucky if we start it up by july. That was straight talk. Yeah, straight talk. Its certainly refreshing. Would much rather not have to be translating for the president of the United States. He said a lot of things that can give us some encouragement, that scientists are are leading the decision making. But there is a lot of distracting ground noise that is pretty disturbing to many, especially to those who just need information as to how theyre supposed to live their lives to get through this safely. The governor of ohio just gave, you know, the people of his state and the rest of the country a sense that this goes on possibly until july. It is coming right at us. That the numbers are expanding. Theyre not going down. We were not even at the peak of this, which the president did say yesterday, the peace might peak might be easter. It might be, might not be. We have two, three weeks before we reach the peak of this, even in new york city. Charlie sykes, i want to bring you in. It sounds like, if you listen to the president s press conference yesterday, he certainly d lly h the warnings of his scientists and doctors. We heard the governor of ohio, mike dewine, being extraordinarily responsible, talking about, hey, sorry were missing st. Patricks day, but lets be our best to be alive nextconfounded by the fact that people on television, people on radio, people with a big following on twitter, you know, on friday, mocking the Imperial College study, which the president basically repeated. Other people still on television, at a network where somebody was fired about spreading misinformation about the coming coronavirus, saying people in Middle America arent going to be impacted. It is a media hoax. The media is overhyping it. Im astounded by it. It is as if these people dont have families, grandparents, and parents that theyre worried about themselves. It is misinformation that people continue to spread. You know, youre right. Im glad the president made the decision he made yesterday. But can we put this in context . A lot of the people youre talking about took their signals from donald trump. A month ago, the president of the United States was saying there was only 15 cases and it was soon going to be absolutely zero, right . The idea of reopening the country on easter was absolutely reckless. Hes walked that back. Donald trump wants to be the arsonist who is credited for being the fireman here. Right. What people should not underestimate is the damage that he has done by spreading this message, and the way that, in this National Crisis that ought to bring us together, we are as polarized and divided as ever. This is playing out in places like wisconsin differently than new york because there are people who think that it is overblown, that it is overhyped. So you are seeing a patchwork of responses. I think this is the dangerous moment that we have here, whether were going to continue to divide among blue and red, employers that are loyal to the president or institutions like liberty university, run by Jerry Falwell jr. , saying, you know, were going to bring these kids back. Were not going to take this seriously. I think thats going to be a real Public Health problem going forward. Quite frankly, despite the president s momentary pivot yesterday, he has a great deal of responsibility for underplaying the severity of this and sort of sending out that bat signal to much of the trumpfriendly media to down play this and attack the media opposed to mobilizing the country. Let us hope that the trumpfriendly media will follow the president s lead from yesterday and start talking, mika, about just how deadly the virus could be if they dont start to take it seriously. If you look at charlie mentioned liberty university. This is incredible, that Jerry Falwell jr. , a staunch ally of President Trump, and sort of an influential voice, i guess, still in the evangelical world, he reopened the university. He brought the students back. I believe he even said, you know, it might be good for them to come back. I dont know how this doesnt get into the legal realm sometime soon. We have a dozen students now sick with symptoms that look like covid19. Throe three are in the hospital for testing. Eight were told to selfisolate. That number is going to go up. I think it is safe to say, when you have a whole bunch of students back at college, every other college that have high numbers, theyve shut down their campuses. Yeah. It is a real tragedy. The fact is, some of those students are quietly telling reporters that theyre not allowed to speak out, that they have to be there. They fear for their health and lives. Bob costa, we have been talking about the balancing act between the economy and medicine. Medicine appears to have won out for now. Science appeared to have won out for now. The balancing act continues. Ive got to believe that that 2 trillion bailout is going to increase over the next month. Behind the scenes, over the weekend, President Trump was hearing about the new health data. He was hearing from dr. Fauci and dr. Birx. He was also hearing from his top advisers, including the treasury secretary, about the economy. He was being told that if he moves forward and does not reopen the economy by easter, and he listens to his health advisers, the economy is going to need another jolt on top of the 4 trillion from the federal reserve, on top of the 2 trillion already from capitol hill. When the president was speaking yesterday in the rose garden, i was on my phone talking to sources. Those on capitol hill in both parties are already speaking privately about outlining a, quote, phase four piece of stimulus legislation. Something that would continue to add loan capability to the Treasury Department and other provisions, including an extension of direct payments to american citizens. Its been discussed now because theres a lot of economic pain on the horizon, beyond the health pain. Thats bipartisan, id guess. Chuck schumer as well as donald trump, nancy pelosi, all talking about what the next phase of this is going to look like . Despite the president not having a strong relationship at all with speaker pelosi, you do have leaders in congress who have been through crisis moments before. Speaker pelosi and leader mcconnell were both congressional leaders in 2008 during the last financial recession and crisis moment. Theyve been here before. Many of their confidants tell me. Pandemic, but in terms of understanding the need in a divided washington to come together on stimulus legislation at certain moments in american history. Bob sykes charlie sykes. Sorry about that. Let me ask you what your thoughts are as we move toward another stimulus. Obviously, you and i both Small Business conservatives our entire life, while a lot of the followers of donald trump probably dont know what small government conservatism is. You see a 2 trillion stimulus package. Yes, it horrifies me. Im sure it horrifies you. At the same time, this has never happened before. Our economy as stopped dead in its tracks. First time in the history of this country. I guess, how do you approach this as a small Government Conservative . When is enough enough . How far do we need to go to stop a Great Depression from taking this entire economy down . Yeah, this is a queasy moment for the handful of people still fiscal conservatives. Look, it is not a stimulus plan when you think about it. It really is a rescue plan. It is a backstop to prevent the country from going into a Great Depression, which i think you probably have to do. On the other hand, people need to keep in mind, we are borrowing every nickel of this. We are talking about adding trillions of dollars to the National Debt. Were going to be stuck with this. A good reminder of why it was a bad idea to run up the National Debt and the deficits during a time of prosperity. Youre going to need that at some point, when you have a crisis. This will not be the last crisis. I also worry that once people get into the habit of thinking that the government can spend an infinite amount of money when it needs it, that this will set a precedent in the future. Right now, i think we have an emergency. We have people who are out of jobs. The damage to the economy is going to be incredibly dramatic. What i would hope though is that theres a little bit more skepticism about some of the special dealing, you know. Some of the special deals, whats being loaded in there, some of the wish list that is the lobbyists are jamming in. Because, generally, when you legislate in panic, and you legislate in secret, bad things happen to the american taxpayer. Time and time again. And, yamiche, just over all in the press conference yesterday, were there any signals that you saw that looked like this would go beyond april 30th, and that maybe opening the door for a second stimulus . Yeah. I think the president saying that maybe by june 1st, we might see some sense of normalcy, i think, was a message to everyone in america that were in this for the long haul. When you have the president saying that having 100,000 and is starting to sink in for him how bad this could really get. Ive been talking to congressional leaders, as well, and aides on capitol hill, who tell me, as well, that theyre looking at a phase four bill. Theyre looking at the idea there are going to be americans all over this country who are losing their jobs. The president , not at the press conference but earlier last week, said he was expecting 6 to 7 Million People to file unemployment claims, though the record was 3. 3 million filing unemployment claims. Ive talked to a number of people who have already lost their jobs. Friends, family members, who are wondering, what is a 1,200 check doing for me . People are appreciative of the government help, but theyre saying if it goes to june, ill need more than 1,200 to keep me afloat. No doubt about that. For sure. Thats why, bob costa, the talk of the next stimulus bill that you were talking about, and charlie called the backstop, which is a great way to put it, has to come if this countrys economy is closed down until june. Let me ask about what youre working on today. What are you going to be what stories are you going to be following . So in recent days, ive spent time talking to people like governor dewine of ohio and Governor Whitmer of michigan. The point to watch this week is not just whats going to happen in the phase four legislation on capitol hill. It is going to be the defense production act. As ventilators continue to be an issue in states like new york, but also states like louisiana, which have a crisis in new orleans, what will President Trump do to formally Push Companies to produce new materials . He tapped peter that vnavarro, trade adviser. The challenge navarro is facing, im told, is many companies, willing to help the federal government, dont have the capability to manufacture in the United States quickly, and many of their workers, encouraged by unions, are being told it is not safe to go back to work in this environment. You cant start making ventilators at this moment, when the virus is spreading throughout many cities and towns. So the challenge for President Trump is how does he activate the private community at this critical juncture . Youre right. When so many people would be afraid to go back to work. Charlie sykes, i guess when all of this is over, and we do the postmortem, my god, were going to have to ask ourselves how we got so dependent on china. This is not me being a protectionist. This is me being an american. Right. Im hearing numbers in Something Like 90 of our pharmaceutical items are made in china. Overwh ov overwhelming number of masks and protective gear. Weve got to figure out a way to stop industries from shipping everything over there to save a dime here and a dime there. Weve got to be able to have the production capabilities this this country, as well. No, obviously, thats true. Let me give you the flip side of this, as well. This is also a moment where you realize that were all globalists when it comes to dealing with this problem. Theres no way that we, as americans, can handle this particular pandemic without accord ra cooperating with the rest of the world, and understand what we have in common here. Im extremely spectacle of the chinese. Yes, they ought to be held accountable for the way they handled all of this. Im very skeptical of the numbers theyre putting out right now. It is a bizarre moment when you have an air lift of supplies coming from the chinese to this country. Thats an indication things have gotten badly out of whack. Charlie sykes, robert costa, and yamiche alcindor, thank you all for being on this hour. Tomorrows show, House Speaker nancy pelosi will be our guest. As we go to break, new york city is filled with the screams of sirens. Last night, a different sound filled the air. A neighborhood wide ovation in honor of the Health Care Workers on the front lines, as captured by one of our producers. Morning joe is back in a moment. Attention guardians of the grass, navigators of the turf and keepers of the green. To the rural ramblers, back to the landers, head turners and stripe burners. Run with us on a john deere mower. Beuse this is more head turners than just grass. Ers. Its home. 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The only thing. Im struggling with this. Some providers you have to manually download updates to each device. Comcast business securityedge updates every 10 minutes to help keep your connected devices protected against new ransomware, malware and phishing threats. Every 10 minutes feels pretty good. Get secure, reliable internet and voice for an amazing price. Call today. Comcast business. Beyond fast. Up next, there is the spread of the virus through vast populations. Theres the spread of the virus through a single body. Our next guest tackles the question, how does the coronavirus behave inside a patient . As we go to break, artists and bands are finding creative ways to play for their fans during this pandemic. Renown rocker joan jet and the black hearts recorded this version of the light of day, with each member separated in their own homes. Heres morning joe exclusive, first look. 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By empowering employees to manage their own tasks, paycom frees you to focus on the business of business. To learn more, visit paycom. Com this. Whole world. Of people. Adventurous people. And survivors. It was interesting to think about their lives. Their successes. And. Their hardships. I think thats part of what i want my kids to know. They come from people who. Were brave. And took risks. Big risks. No pressure. [short laugh] bring your Family History to life, like never before. Get started for free at ancestry. Com lets bring in emergency physician and Public Health professor at George Washington university, dr. Lena wen. She was previously baltimores health commissioner. She discusses the issues pregnant women are facing during this pandemic. She is pregnant herself, due right now. As well as the need to start planning ahead to beat the coronavirus. Also with us, pulitzer prizewinning author and staff writer for the new yorker. He is a cancer physician, researcher, whose new piece for the new yorker tackles the question, how does the coronavirus behave inside a patient . Lena, i want to start with you. Actually, a piece you wrote for time, about how we are in sort of constantly behind the curve on this. What would it take, in terms of the types of testing and other things we need out there, to finally be ahead of the curve . Thats right, mika. So far, all along, along, we have been reacting to whats already happened instead of anticipating for whats ahead. And the disappointing thing is that we actually know what we need. We know we have this threeprong strategy. One is that we have to stabilize our healthcare system. We just cant have a situation where medical workers dont have some protective equipment, where we are running out of ventilators. Where we know what supplies we need. We into toneed to ramp up produ and second is we need testing. Otherwise, we will be looking at number, we dont know if theyre close to act rat if were not doing surveillance testing in our communities. We cant predict where the next outbreak is. The third is we need aggressive social distancing. That is the one thing each and every one of us can do while the government is mobilizing everything that the government should be doing. Each individual citizen can be practicing good hand and face hygiene. We can be doing social distancing so we stop the transition of covid19. Thats simple. There is a threeprong strategy. We should be implementing that now and pulling out all the stops, or else we will going to look back in time and think about every day thats lost because its valuable time thats gentleman to cost lives. Doctor, you are looking at the virus and how it spreads in the body. It seems there is so much mystery as to whats happening with this virus as it attacks one person versus another. They can have so many different symptoms. What are you learning . We are learning many things. We are learning several people who have no symptoms who can be shedding the virus. That why its very important for everyone, not just the sick, but everyone to practice social distancing. It may come to the fact that we probably need to be you know social distanting for several weeks if not months from now. The second thing that we are learning is that the amount of virus exposure that you go ahead, the load of virus exposure you get for most viruses or respiratory viruss is related to you getting or not. So that of course, one reason, the largest of social distancing. But also the fact that we arent using, even tr public isnt using hand hygiene and masks appropriately enough. If we need essential workers to get back to work. We need even the simple surgical masks and we need clear instructions from the cdc about how to decon tam nate these masks. In other words, once, if the outside of the mask gets droplets that we need simple instructions about how to decon tam nate those masks. We need that information now. So that essential workers can go back while we maintain the hospitals and as lena said and dr. Wef said, ramp up production and keep our healthcare workers safe. Dr. Lena wen, we are seeing more cities that are looking toward the coming hot spot, chicago, los angeles from detroit, probably more will perkle up on the graph of the map of the country as this virus spreads. Do you think that the president s new deadline is realistic scientifically . Im glad that there is a new deadline. Because otherwise, we would have faced even more confusion so at least we have until the end of april as per what he said yesterday. But i am very concerned. I mean, we have new york as clearly this epicenter now of covid19 and other cities are fought far behind. Were looking at louisiana and michigan and others. But the key is that we dont actually know what the next hot spots are going to be because we lack those data. We just dont know because of lack of testing about what other areas are just on the cusp and what, how we can bolt to capacity. We as a country are prepared to tackle hot spots one at a time. But we have to remember this is not a hurricane. This is not a onetime situation. We have to mobilize for the long run and governors and mayors are saying all over the country, heres what we feed, not just for right now, but in two weeks time and four weeks time. We really have to look at these local leaders as well it is the projections of public researchers about the resources we need for the long term. If its not now to pull out all the stops and get these resources, i dont know what that time is. Yeah, doctor, also as we talked about the long run, there are, obviously, many models that show that this may go away in the spring and early summer but could return in the fall. Right. And so, how do you believe thats a possibility, a good possibly . And if, so, how does that instruct to us plan moving forward . Well, i think there is a good possibility it will come back in the fall and one of the things that we should be doing and instituting again agreeing with dr. Wef, doing communitybased testing. In other words, not doing testing on people who have symptoms. Because thats biased sample. If you are sick, you will want to be tested. What you want to do is go and randomly test, specifically test communities up front be on the front of the ball rather than be behind the ball. And thats not been stud yet. I want to figure out how many people are affected in geographical hot spots, whether they have already become immune or not. We need to do that in a random way. Not in if you get sick, etc. If we can do that, whats probably going to happen. My prediction is that by the fall we will start seeing hot spots rise again. But in that case we will be up front on the ball. We will know what to do before those hot spots really become you know flaring fires as they did in new york city. And thats, obviously, the scenario that we are all hoping for. Doctors, thank you so much. We greatly appreciate you being there and being here and mika, it is so important that we do, as the doctor said, we have widespread testing, eastern random testing that will help us out and also we talked about earlier this morning, we can get the Antibody Testing to see who has the virus. If it is true that maybe 60 70 of people get this virus and may be atim symptomatic asymptomatic, mild conditions, if they have those antibodies, then this fall they can go back to school, they can go back into the work force. They can be active and not worry about spreading the pan dem you can. Right now we are flying blind. Dr. Lena wen was the first one on our show to say this isnt a spring break, a snow day. Physical distancing has to happen indefinitely and has to be taken seriously. She has a piece in the Washington Post. Its a scary time to be pregnant, but i am grateful. She is due any day and has a lot to offer in terms of insight as life is like not as just a healthcare advocate but soon to be new mother again in the age of covid19. And we really appreciate her being on the show along with all of our other guests during this difficult time. Much more ahead. We are back in just two minutes. O minutes. vo quickbooks salutes those who work for themselves. Theyre adapting to support their communities. But many need our help. If youre a Small Business in need, or want to help a local business, go to quickbooks. Com smallbusinesshelp intuit quickbooks. This is my body of proof. Proof i can fight moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis. Proof i can fight psoriatic arthritis. With humira. Proof of less joint pain. And clearer skin in psa. Humira targets and blocks a source of inflammation that contributes to joint pain and irreversible damage. 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While the leading competitor does nothing to kill the bacteria, pepto® diarrhea gets to the source, killing the bad bacteria. So, try pepto® diarrhea, and remember to have it on hand every time you travel. Also try pepto®bismol liquicaps for onthego relief. I grew up in greens, new york, right next to a place called elmhurst queens. They have a hospital, its a very good hospital, elmhurst hospital. Right. Ive known it. I know where it is. I can tell you the color of the outside, the size of the windows. I mean i know it very well, right. It was near my community where i lived and i have been watching that for the last week on television, body bags all over in hallways. I have been watching them bring if trailer trucks, freezer trucks. Theyre freezer trucks because they cant handle the bodies, there are so many of them. This is in my essentially in my community in queens, new york. Ive seen things i have never seen before. And just over the bridge from queens, there is now an emergency Field Hospital being built in central park to help deal with the overflow of those sickened by the coronavirus. This is the new grim reality on this monday morning, streets lined up with refridge rated trucks acting as makeshift mrgs, while firmrgs morgues, while healthcare staff try to wrap their heads around the dizzying day. The Trump Administration is now extending its guidelines on social distancing instead of the president s goal of easter. The guidelines will now extend by more than two weeks to april 30th. The death toll is increasing rapidly now at nearly 2500. It took a month for the u. S. To go from 1 to 1,000 deaths. According to nbc news count, the number of deaths from thursday to yesterday increased by more than 1,200. Dr. Anthony fauci issued this new projection on the numbers of deaths and cases here in the u. S. We are looking at what we are seeing now, i would say around 1 100,000 to 200,000 cases, i dont want to be held to that, excuse me deaths. We will have millions of cases. Yeah, the number i gave out is based on modeling and i think its entirely conceivable that if we do not mitigate to the extent that were trying to, that you could reach that number. Yeah. Yeah. Its possible. You could make a big sound byte about it. But the fact is, its possible. When i heard the number today, the first time ive heard that number, because i have been asking the same question that some people have been asking, i felt even better about what we did last week with the 2. 2 trillion. Because you are talking about a potential of up to 2. 2 million. Some said it can be higher than that. So you are talking about 2. 2 million deaths. 2. 2 Million People from this. And so, if we can hold that down as were saying to 100,000, its a horrible number, manitoba even less, but to 100,000 so we have between 100 and 200,000, we altogether have done a very good job. Is floating easter a mistake, do you think . No. Could you tell us why . It was just an aspiration. We actually will be hitting potentially, this was with our meeting before, on easter, we probably, that could be a peak. That could be a peak period. That could be the peak, sadly to say that could be the peak number of deaths before it starts coming down. No, that was aspirational. We had an aspiration of easter. But when you hear these kind of numbers and you hear the potential travesty, we dont want to do anything where you know we dont want to have a spike up, we dont want to do it soon and all of a sudden you are coming down and you start coming up again. Because we discussed that can happen. We dont want that to happen. Weve gone through too much. I didnt say easter. I said it would be a great thing if we can do it by easter. We know much more now than we knew two, three weeks ago. So you said on the air a couple weeks ago and definitely in our household that the president s easter deadline was sort of a marker. That it wasnt something he was completely going to hold to, but it was showing different assets, different facets of whats impacting this country, including the economy. Some guidance that then could be moved. It has now been moved and you know there were a lot of distracting traits in the News Conference that came out yesterday that can be very you know deflecting from whats going on. But, overall, you could see that science and the scientist versus moved this president to can the 15 days to slow the spread and really start to spread it out to that june 1 date that you were talking about all along. Well, and, of course, the president listened. And this is the headline. There was a lot of ground noise. A lot of things that i know. A lot of people found disturbing, how he treated our friend yameesh. Attacking cnn. Ratings. Guess what, thats what he does. Thats the ground noise and, yes, we all have a right to be deeply disturbed by that, but you look at the signal, which is, is that the president listened to dr. Fauci and dr. Birx instead of listening to larry kudlow. Larry has been a friend of mine for a very long time, but i wouldnt get medical advice from larry kudlow or stocked a viets from dr. Fauci stock advice from dr. Fauci. So the president listened to who he needed to listen, with good reason. As dr. Fauci and dr. Birx really leaned in and started talking about those numbers that the Imperial College was suggesting up to 2. 2 Million People could die if we do nothing. If we do nothing. As dr. Fauci said, the American People are doing a lot more than nothing right now and because of that, because of the social distancing, dr. Fauci is now talking about 100 to 200,000 people dying. Lets hope that the curve is bent unfortunately deaths, it continues to go straight up. New infections slowly, slowly were starting to see a bend in that curve. Instead of infections doubling every two days. Its now moving towards doubling every three days. We still have a long way to go. Just the numbers, though, listen. I mean, for people that have said this is the flu, or people that mocked reporters and scientists for listening to the Imperial College study, dr. Birx said yesterday, every single study they looked at, every model said it would be between 1. 6 and 2. 2 million americans dead if they didnt take traumatic actions. Of course, thats more than, more numbers. More americans dying than in every war since 1776. Now, just to let you know some of the grim milestones, where the president is looking at, you know, by the end of the day, likely, more americans who have died from this pandemic than died on september 11th. Already, more american versus died from this pandemic that a lot of people tried to dismiss as a hoax on tv than died in our 18year war, our 19year war in afghanistan. Just in a month, more american versus died of this pandemic than died in afghanistan over the course of two decades. By the end of this week, more americans will have died from this pandemic than died in iraq. In the iraq war. You could also talk about vietnam. Chances are very good by this time next week, if the numbers keep going the way theyre going, more americans will die than died in our decadelong war in vietnam. Think about that. That is not the flu. That is a pandemic where the deaths just keep doubling. And, of course, if dr. Faucis numbers are right and he i know he hopes theyre not going to be right, that were going to do, make dramatic actions to bend that curve downward, but if it is between 100 and 200,000, if the trend lines go the way they look like theyre going, then dr. Fauci suggests more people could die from this pandemic in america than died in world war i. So the president had a lot of good reasons to do what he did yesterday. I will remind everybody again, there is a lot of distraction on these press conferences and like that had mirl told me, mika, a long time ago, son, dont listen to the ground noise, focus on the signal. The signal is, mika, science. The president followed science yesterday and not his economic advisers and that gives us a chance to bend that curve, that gives us a chance to save lives. Weve got a number of cities that are becoming hot spots beyond new york city, by the way, with us, we have u. S. National editor at the Financial Times ed luce, former fda commissioner dr. Scott goodly points to several cities with a rapidly increasing spread as the coronavirus emerges in these cities making them multiple epicenters of the u. S. Outbreak. In particular, the city of chicago nowt acounts for half o illinois. Los angeles county acounts for 2,000 in california. Over 6,000 cases. In addition to new orleans and detroit, another city to watch is miami. As Miamidade County acounts for almost 800 of floridas nearly 5,000 confirmed cases of the coronavirus and, joe, another thing i noticed with trump yesterday is that there are people close to him who are getting it. He talked about a friend who had it he was really suffering. I cant imagine the news about Boris Johnson and several of the folks high up in his administration in his government i should say have it as well. Right. Its getting close to home for trump and people like trump. Well, when the president said he called Boris Johnson, somebody who has been an ally of his and also expressed skepticism early on with the coronavirus and the first thing he said Boris Johnson told him was not hello, thank you for calling, was we need ventilators. That paints it in stark. He spoke yesterday of a friend of his who went to the hospital and the next day was in a coma. Well, thats happening more and more often. Its not just older people. We keep hearing stories of people in their 30s and 40s who are getting infections, some dying very quickly. Some very healthy, with no preexisting conditions whatsoever. So this is a deadly pandemic. Lets go right now to ed luce. Ed, thank you so much for being with us. I, unfortunately, start my early morning, with a bit of a grim, grim tradition now and that is i go to the Financial Times and i look at the countries, the rates of infections, deaths, the cities and i look at the trend lines, some of the trend lines are starting to bend, but the United States, certainly on deaths we continue to go straight up. It seems like the president got the message yesterday and at least for that press conference yesterday, it was the scientists who won the day. Yeah, it was very encouraging. As you say. You screen out trumps and needling are journalists, then the ultimate message from yesterday was good, he was listening to the scientists. I think the real concern is while new york, while Governor Cuomo continued to shoit, one of his likes to have a very strong single minded chief executive in charge, there are other states like florida you are getting some disturbing signs in miami and texas that arent taking this as seriously as they could take it. The lessons from other countries is that youve got to have quite disciplined nationwide social distancing if you want to flatten that curve. Britain, which you just mentioned, has a higher increasing death rate, doubling every two days. Britain hasnt been observing that until very recently and its beginning to pay the price. The fact that the Prime Minister, his chief adviser, domenic cummings, the heir to the throne of prince charles, the minister of hancock and the nations chief medical officer all now have coronavirus is i think a demonstration of that like no other to ordinary people that this virus is indiscriminate. We all need to socially distance. You know, the thing, you bring up a good point those in britain didnt take this seriously until recently, there is a two or threeweek lack. So the United States has started to take this a bit more seriously. The white house is taking this more seriously. That doesnt mean David Ignacious, over the next two weeks, we arent going to continue to have bad news. The next two squeeksweeks i thi president said, also dr. Fauci said the next two weeks may even be even if we are doing everything right, even if we are moving in the right direction on masks, on ventilators, on tests, on social distancing, were still going to be paying for what we did three weeks ago and bluntly ive seen a lot of people where i am, ive seen a lot of people who still dont seem to get it. Reporter . Joe, the numbers that dr. Fauci and dr. Bricks used yesterday were pretty stark, up to 200,000 deaths is a lot of people. President trump was touting that as a success. We can only have success with 1 or 200,000 deaths we will regard that as serious. Your point that so much of this is still unknown, of rates of increase in some states. Florida seems to be particularly worrying to those who look at the numbers. Other potential hot spots means that we cant yet make firm predictions. But i think everybody felt happy that President Trump listened in this case to his medical experts. He backed off from his earlier almost defiant assertion that wed be ready to go on april 12th, easter day, and has something more realistic. And were just going to have to watch carefully. There is some helpful signs in the seattle area in washington after real social distancing measures that the rate of increase of the cases is going down, much as youd predict from the evidence that weve seen from information from china and south korea, still, i am struck, by how much we dont know about the disease and how it passes, just how many cases there are in the country. Still ahead on morning joe, before President Trump was talking about elmhurst hospital, our next guest was sounding the alarm. From queens, new york, congresswoman jagrace ming join the conversation. We are back in just a moment. The conversation we are back in just a moment so you should really be focusing on both and definitely at the same time. 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Get fast and easy answers with personalized help 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. Change your wifi password to a phrase thats easy to remember. Even troubleshoot your services on your own. Were working to make things a little easier for everyone. Download the xfinity my account app today. Welcome back to morning joe. You know, we have been talking about President Trump listening to the scientists this week when he had to make decisions dealing with the pandemic and how he takes it forward with this administration in this country. Lets get more information on that by bringing in jonathan le mere, he is, of course, an ap reporter at the white house. Can you walk us through the weekend . What was it from what your reporting suggests that turned the president and got him more narrowly focused to shut things down, possibly until june the 1st, which actually is the date that i have been hearing for a long time is the date that most Scientists Say doctors say we need to wait until we really reopen the economy in june. What got him there . Well, the president eventually got to the right place with the Health Experts and scientists believe he should. It was quite a learning path to do so and a scattershot weekend. Lets recall that though on friday you are right, he did hint that he would be willing to extend the easter deadline if you will, target date. On saturday, for about seven hours, he had floated out there the idea of a quarantine of new york city, of parts of new jersey, parts of connecticut. An idea that, first of all, there is a real belief the federal government didnt have the authority to do. There was no consultation with the governors of those states, andrew cuomo asked in a real time in a News Conference how the discussion had gone with President Trump in a quarantine. Cuomo said this is the first time he was hearing about it. We are reporting it was the president who floated the idea of Governor Desantis of california time and again it was slow to enforce restriction. It was horrible. There were some beaches that were still opened this weekend in florida. But he had been sounding the alarm he didnt want new yorkers to come down to that state and the president decided to move on that, to at least float the idea and calculation, new york, new jersey, connecticut, those are blue states. To signal to florida and other parts of the country, where props his supporters are in the states he can win this november. Look, i am taking care of the issue here. Yesterday, scientists went out, dr. Birx and dr. Fauci have been working on him. Suddenly if public interviews, more directly behind closed doors in the west wing saying easter was simply too soon and showed am lot of data. The Imperial College for one. Others showing him what a disastrous effect it can be if things went down a certain path and the country opened too soon and went down a worst case scenario. Which stuck with the president. Yesterday as a final point here, joe, the reporting shows there are two things that really struck the president. There is that number the 2. 2 million, the idea of even 100,000 is a huge number of deaths. Certainly as we heard him say, it will be a far great improvement over that. Also some of the images coming from his hometown in new york. It was the construction of makeshift hospital beds in central park. It was the site of a deliberate, what was it, a refrigerated delivery truck being loaded with bodies at hospitals here, that went around social media and made its way on the newscasts. Yes, the particular scenes in emhurts hospital. They were so striking to him. And seeing to deliver to hit home, a scene happening in his hometown that could be created across the nation. That sort of fueled this decision when we slow down the reopening to push back well beyond easter, extend lent, if you will, towards the end of april. Well, you know, these images will be coming out of new york city at least for the next ten days to possibly two weeks. The worst actually is still ahead for new york. Lets hope that that curve starts to be bending a little bit to the right. And, mika, just again, when we listen to the president. Im not shay saying that it makes it right. Im not saying this is what he should do. When the president says, im going to open the economy by easter and you know thats not possible, that millions would die if he did that, if you listen to the study. Chances are good. Hes sending a signal. In that case, he was sending a signal to the markets. The Small Business people, hey, im on your side, im going to fight for you and were going to actually have a balance between the health of the nation and the health of your Small Business and also for a lot of people who are out of work now, but you know the same thing, this weekend when the president talked about possibly just shutting down new york and the tristate area, well, you do immediately, you cant do that constitutionally you cant do that so if he is saying that, he is saying that for a reason. She sending a political message. Again, it doesnt make it right. That just makes it the reality. Its what i have been saying for years, youve got to separate the ground noise from the signal. Let me end this segment again saying, the signal is, the president yesterday listened to his scientists. If he stays on this course, and if we continue to push hard for ventilators and expand testing rapidly, because were still, were testing a lot more people. But were still per capita one of the lowest countries in the world. But if we do that, we will see that curve start to bend and we will avoid seeing 1 million, 2 million americans dead from this pandemic. Coming up on morning joe, David Ignacious asks, who can lead postcoronavirus america . We will talk about that next on morning joe. Ill talk about th morning joe. When i get my teeth cleaned, my hygienist doesnt use Something Like this. She cleans with Something Like this. Its got a round head. And its got power. Go pro with oralb. Power one on for oralbs best clean ever. Inspired by dentists. Oralbs round brush head surrounds each tooth to remove more plaque along the gum line. For cleaner teeth and healthier gums. Ill only use the one thats round. Oralb. Brush like a pro. To helcoronavirus intod your xfinity voice remote say to access Important Information and special reports from around the world. And to keep your kids learning at home, say education to discover learning collections for all ages from our partners at common sense media, curiosity stream, history vault, reading corner and many others. For more information on how you can stay connected, visit xfinity. Com prepare. As new york City Hospitals continue to be slammed with an excess of coronavirus patients, a 68bed emergency Field Hospital is being built in central park to help with the overflow. The Triage Center organized by the Christian Organization samaritans first and located across the street from mt. Sinai hospital will include a respiratory care unit with icu capability. It is expected to be up and running by tomorrow morning. With the ongoing call for at least 30,000 respirators in new york remains, experts say the next unknown is, who is going to operate them . There are only a total of nearly 8,000 respiratory licensed specialists in the state, plus an unknown number of doctors and nurses trained to use the briefing machines. Meanwhile, the navys usns comfort is expected to dock in new york city today to help hospitals care for 1,000 noncovid19 patients aboard. One of the frightening things for healthcare workers is theyre on the front lines. Theyre exposed. There have been doctors and nurses flying into the new york city area over the past week to try and help. There are a lot of parallels you can make with september 11th if you saw fire trucks from alabama and tennessee and West Virginia and across the country driving into new york city after 9 11 to do whatever they could to help out. You saw the saying with police officers, well, thats happening now. The people on the front lines now are nurses and doctors and Healthcare Providers who are coming into new york city and will soon be going to places like chicago and across the country to try to bring relief to these healthcare workers, who are absolutely being pushed to their limits right now. Some of them are scared for good reason. Theyre separated from their families and, yet, they keep going in every day to try to save lives. And sort of a sobering reminder ed luce, we keep talking about we need more respirators, more ventilators. We need people to operate them. There certainly is a shortage. Not just in new york city but across the country. The concern i have is that with Peter Navarro in charge of the production act, from the National Stockpile, that youve got no really aer between Donald Trumps if you like and the decisions to which states get priority. You have seen Governor Desantis, pro trump in florida, getting pretty much everything hes asked for in terms of the ventilators, masks, et cetera, whereas Gretchen Whitmer of michigan who has been publicly critical of the president has been short changed, Peter Navarro is not going to curb that, he is going to i think magnify that. The myself and many other journalist versus received a lot of criticism from conservatives during this epidemic that you should all pull together in a crisis, but you should back the president , the commanderinchief. This is no time for criticizing. I think this is precisely can time for criticizing. You saw with the yesterdays press conference, when President Trump has shown the science, when he is, the argument is pressed home, he can real time change bad decisions to good once. You look at the height of the second world war, you know even when the blitz was at its peak, church hymn was taking criminal in the house of common sense and the media as was fdr during the war. So the idea that we should be holding off on our criticisms of the president , its been belied by the president changing his mind for good reasons, having listened to good arguments in the last 24 hours. This is precisely the time where criticism should be focused. The one big concern ive got right now, there are several. The biggest is the furthest in the system of allocation resources to where its most needed. There is heavy president ial reward punishment system there for people who are nice to him versus people who arent. Well, you know, going to the point that you made about criticism. Dr. Fauci and also Imperial College study came under blistering criticism over the past week, those of us on television who had been talking about those Imperial College numbers also attacked by trumpists who were blindly loyal in the media to the president. I even heard people on television that i am just shocked, still suggesting that this epidemic will only hit new york city and will not hit Middle America. So i mean thats malpractice. Thats grounds for a lawsuit. People who deliver the news are supposed to be giving facts, not fiction, and the viewers are there to trust them. If they get poor information or they are misled to believe they cant get sick and they get sick, exactly how is that not grounds for some sort of situation to arise. This is clear. Well, the fact that if anyone is trying to push against it, they are committing malpractice. Well, the fact that misinformation continues and continues to be spouted when you have middle American Cities in louisiana and michigan in florida, just across the country, in georgia, in tennessee, in texas, again the misinformation continues so there is a responsibility to be critical when bad decisions are being made. But i also would suggest for the media, there is very important also separate the ground noise and the signal and when science is put to the front and within the president s decisions are based on science as they were yesterday, that needs to be reported as well, because literally thousands, if not tens of thousands, possibly hundreds of thousands of lives depend on those decisions being made. Coming up on morning joe, well hear from one woman on her very personal fight against the coronavirus. Her husband is in really bad shape right now. But she says there may be a potential treatment if she can cut the red tape. Morning joe is back in a moment. 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Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahus office says he will enter self quarantine after an aide tested positive for coronavirus. The office says netanyahu has undergone a test and will remain in quarantine until he under goes tests by his doctor. His close advisers are isolating. We areles learning more about spec people stricken by the coronavirus. Country singer joe diffie who had chart topping ballads like honky tonk has died. He tested positive for coronavirus. He was 61. He announced he contracted it, becoming the first country star to go public with such a diagnosis. His publicist said the singer died sunday in nashville due to complications from the virus. Meanwhile, legendary singer songwriter john prine had been hospitalized. The family says the 73yearold prine a twotime cancer survive was intubated on saturday and continues to receive care, but his situation is critical. This news comes on the heels of prines wife and manager fiona announcing she had the coronavirus a few weeks earlier. And back now to new york, where the stories are getting more disturbing by the day. A video might be difficult to watch. This is the new grim reality at a brooklyn hospital. This video appears to show a forklift placing bodies on to a refrigerated truck being used as a makeshift morgue. It is a similar scene if you look at the citys fiveboros which has shaken First Responders to their cores, describing this experience with the overflow scene of bodies, one registered nurse in manhattan who declined to be identified, cold buzzfeed, the two may be related to the holocaust, never seen anything like it. A 26year veteran paramedic who responded to the 9 11 terrorist attacks and later served in the iraq war told the New York Times, quote, im terrified. I honestly dont know if im going to survive. And last week, emhurts hospital elmhurst hospital reported 13 deaths in a single day. Congresswoman grace mann who represents the district wrote this harrowing account on twitter, quote, my hands are shaking. I cant type a nurls at my elmhurst nurse at my elmhurst hospital who i dont know just called me crying, she said they need vents and more so need doctors and also doctors who are icu trained. They cry every day because they know theyre going to die. Theyre begging, please. And congresswoman meng joins us now. You are hearing us inside the hospital, the pictures we are seeing are horrific. I believe new york lost 100 people in a 7hour span. The numbers appear to be spiking. What more are you hearing from your district . Sure. Thank you, joe and mika for having me on today. You know we here in queens and new york city are really right now at the epicenter of this Coronavirus Crisis in our country. We are hearing constantly from nurses, doctors, staff who are working within our area hospitals about how tough and dire the conditions are. I am very thankful to Governor Cuomo and the leadership he has taken. We are in Constant Contact with his office and mayor deblasio about the situation and they are doing all they can, but, quite frankly, we need help from the Trump Administration and we needed it three weeks ago. So what do you need . What is the what is the main need right now for the doctors and nurse was are on the front lines and also for the americans who are being stricken by this disease . Well, weve asked for a while now, but we needed more, what everyone is calling ppe. So from the proper masks, from the gowns, to, obviously, the ventilators, i am told we have enough in some of our queens hospitals for maybe the next week. But after that, who knows . And we are still waiting on the majority of help from the federal government. We are constantly hearing that doctors in the er, for example, are not able to have proper mask usage and even those who are might have to use it for days or a week on end. And how are your constituents handling this crisis right now . Do you find for the most part they are social distancing, they are remaining in their homes, they are adequately following the guidelines from city officials, state officials and also healthcare advisers . People are trying. You know, the city has been very clear on the importance of staying home. However in queens, we have a large population. We have People Living together who might be roommates, families living with extended families and they might not be able to separate as adequately as they should be. What about the trend lines in the hospital . When you talk to the hospitals across your district. Do those trend lines continue to spike straight up for them . Has there been a bit of a respite in the number of new cases being reported, or are the trend lines still bleak . You know, we get updates from the city and the state every few hours and every time i check my email, the numbers go up by a few hundred. And thats something. Its not even a daily update. These are updates that are happening every few hours. So the numbers are increasing at a very quick pace. And a lot of these also all right im sorry, go ahead. Sorry. Our front line workers need help and thats just contributing to the situation. All right. Congresswoman, thank you very much. We appreciate your coming on. We want to show you now President Trump on fox news just moments ago, on the issue of new york state and ventilators. A ventilator, thats like an automobile. Its a very complicated machinery. Its complicated. It can cost airplane from 5,000 to 30,000. You have some extremely complicated and sophisticated. Have you others that are simpler, you talk about 5 to 30,000. Its very expensive and very complex and we delivered 4,000 ventilators to new york to their warehouse, which happens to be located, which is interesting in edison, new jersey, it was signed off. They were delivered and they werent used. And we said, a number of days later, why arent you using these ventilators . I dont know what happened. But we delivered thousands of them. We delivered them to a lot of people. You know, there is a whom question about that i think new york should be fine based on the numbers we see, they should have more than enough. Yeah, well, they may have enough, but they obviously if you look at the trend lines, theyre going straight up. The number of deaths, those trend lines, it doesnt take a mathematician to understand they are going to be at full capacity this week most likely. That entire interview from certainly the excerpts that i have read about is distressing to say the least. Again, i talk about ground noise, there is a whole heck of a lot of ground noise there attacking nancy pelosi, calling her a sick puppy. Also, repeating the story. He keeps repeating this warehouse story. Ive heard this five times over the weekend, either from the president or people inside the white house. We get it. That was fridays story. Lets move on now to what were going to do moving forward, lets be productive. Lets understand that this is not static. These trend lines are exploding. Infections in new york city exploding. Deaths in new york city doubling, practically every day, every other day. So, we need leadership, we needless ground noise, more signal and, boy this morning unfortunately, was just a whole lot of nothing by politico infighting at a time where this president , himself, said we all need to come together. Lets bring in amy brownslow, whose husband, brett, fighting for his life againstamy, i know for people to help. Id like you to walk us through this. You told i believe alex witt on the 28th that you wanted to bring your husband to the doctor. You brought him to the e. R. Ultimately but at first you thought that only much older people could get this . Well, hello. Thank you for having me. Yes, so everything that we had been reading or hearing on the news is that the elderly and people who were had multiple medical problems were more at risk for serious complications from the virus so, you know, we didnt think that he was so serious that he was as ill as he was. The last time you saw him, he walked into the e. R. Alone. Tell us what happened. We had contacted our doctor that evening around 9 00 who advised that he go into the emergency room as he had been having some shortness of breath and had been coughing. And that had really only started the day before, and we did not think it was that serious. So i took him over to cooper hospital in camden, new jersey. They would not allow me to come into the hospital because they were on lockdown due to the virus. It was very hard for me to watch him walk in by himself, and i theres a window there. I was watching through the window as they checked him in and put him in a wheelchair and took him back into the emergency room area. I went back out to my car, and i texted him that thats where i was and to please update me. Let me know what was happening. He texted me back. He told me they wheeled him to a room. That i should go home and that he loved me. And that was the last time that i had communication from him. What is his condition now, and what are you hoping people can do that will perhaps help your husband . His condition today, we got some encouraging news this morning that some of his numbers are improving. So hes fighting the virus. Hes still in critical condition, and hes on a ventilator and on kidney dialysis. So its very much moment to moment, but were praying and all of our friends and family are praying for him to continue to fight. We are attempting to get plasma donation for him. We are working with the red cross, who is, in turn, working with cooper hospital, as well as our new jersey officials, our governor and our state senators and representatives to get a site open here in southern new jersey. I am hopeful we will be able to make an announcement either later today or maybe tomorrow with details of who can donate and where can you go and how can you schedule an appointment . I think that has been, you know, one of my big pushes right now to not only help my husband but there are at least two other people at cooper hospital who are critical as well and need this plasma donation that ive been told they are eligible for it. So its thats the message i want to get out. All right, amy. Thank you so much. We are getting that message out with you right now. We want to thank you so much for being on this morning and know that were praying for your husband. Were praying for your husband and you and your family and everyone else that has been so impacted by this pandemic. Thank you so much. And our thoughts and prayers are with you. Thank you for having me. So, mika, weve been hearing now, and we talked about it this morning. I believe the president talked about it yesterday. Talked about it with dr. Dave about antibodies. You saw the atlantic article we put up on the screen that there is, right now, people believe a need for plasma, for from covid19 survivors for those antibodies. Lets bring in right now the governor of new york, Governor Cuomo. Thank you so much for being with us. Lets just throw it open to you and tell us what does new york state need . What does new york city need right now . And any new numbers you might have. Yeah, well, thank you, joe and mika. Thank you for your coverage. Its really great and its important to get straight information to the people of this country now. You are doing that extraordinarily well. We dont have the numbers from last night yet. Were putting them together, but theyre going to be up, the number of deaths. It will be over 1,000. New york is youre going to see this moving across the country. Anyone who wants to say this is new york alone, thats a political, partisan, divisive view and its exactly wrong. And i hope the president gets i heard your clip about the 4,000 ventilators. What they still dont get is how to run a government, how to plan an operation. This virus has been ahead of us from day one. Weve been playing catchup from day one. Still two, three, four weeks away depending on whose projection model you use. Prepare for the apex. Have the materials for the apex. Thats when the system is going to collapse. They sent 4,000 ventilators. Im not using them today because i dont need them today. I need to assemble them in a stockpi stockpile. A stockpile, by definition, is to be used at the high point. Of course, governor, were not speculating when we say youre going to need those ventilators and many more. And, believe me, i live in a state other than new york, so i dont want new york to get all the ventilators, but guess what . You can look at the numbers. You can look at the data and see that you all are going to need more ventilators. Youre going to need more equipment. So what plea do you what plea do you have for this president and also those around that keep telling this warehouse story over and over again . When they could go to dr. Fauci and say, oh, its going to get a hell of a lot worse in new york city and new york state over the next couple of weeks. What plea do you have for President Trump . Joe, my plea is, and pardon me if im a little emotional, but im living with this 24 hours a day and seeing people die all around me. The science people, the government professionals have to stand up and look the president in the eye and say, this is not a political exercise. This is not press relations. Its not optics. The tsunami is coming. We know it is. Now is the time to gather supplies, do the preparations because its too late the day before. If you have not done the work before the storm hits, its too late to do it once the storm hits. And the storm is coming. Stop the politics. Listen to the scientists and the pros and plan because otherwise, joe, mika, people will die who dont need to die. Thats the bottom line. And there is mika, theres a biblical parallel here that the president s supporters, a lot of evangelicals read this story of joseph and the pharaoh. They planned for seven years of famine. Well, that famine, that medical crisis is over the next 7 to 14 days. Governor, did you get hope from the president s setting a new timeline and no longer talking about easter being this big reopening day . I dont know. Easter was never real. So many things he says that are not real that, frankly, i dont have the luxury of trying to decipher every message, right . Im living day by day. I see the storm coming. I can see the forecast. I follow projections. I follow science. I follow data. I dont have instinct or gut. Its not about emotion. The storm hits the storm hits in two weeks, three weeks, this is what im going to need. If you dont want to see a total collapse. And lets focus on getting that. Everything else is i cant decipher the daily mumblings of the president. So governor, i lived in upstate new york for five years. I know the state very well. And its interesting. I still have friends that live in upstate new york that still have a trace of skepticism in their voices. Theyre big supporters of President Trump. And theyre still a bit skeptical. I dont know how theyll be this morning after hearing his press conference yesterday and hearing 2. 2 million. But do you have the same problem with disconnect with people in upstate new york or do you think even conservatives in upstate new york who support donald trump now understand the science is daunting, not just for the city but for them as well . You know, some people want to hold on to their ideological beliefs and theyre going to cling on to their misperceptions as long as possible. But the march of science and data is irrefutable. And the numbers will increase, and the numbers are spreading every day. Its more and more clear. And at one point, you cant disbelief the forecaster, and its going to rain when youre drenched. And people will be drenched, joe. Well, governor, we want to thank you on behalf of people