Transcripts For MSNBCW Morning Joe 20180620

Sharing a picture of a champagne celebration last night at trump hotel in washington. How about heartless . Heres the president s former campaign manager, cory lewandoski, about hearing of a child with Downs Syndrome being separated from her parents. Read about a 10 grld girl with Downs Syndrome who was taken from her mother and put in a cage. Wahwah. How dare you. How dare you illegally here are the children. Torn from their families, caged by the american government. Babies, sent to shelters, mothers, begging to keep their kids. Heres capitol hill where members of congress are talking. And debating signing letters, some fighting to end this heinous policy. Others, defending it. And heres the president of the United States. Again claiming he is somehow not personally responsible for this policy, that is representing families apart. As a result of democratssupported loopholes in our federal laws, most illegal immigrant families and minors from Central America, who arrive unlawfully at the border, cannot be detained together or removed together, only released. These are crippling loopholes that cause family separation. Which we dont want. With us we have msnbc contributor mike barn kill. Republican strategist and msnbc political analyst, susan del pursio. Are you at all thinking of walking away from the party . Still holding on there are still people in my party who are willing to stand up for whats right. And morning joe economic analyst Steve Rattner, nbc news capitol hill correspondent and host of kasie d. C. , kasie hunt and pulitzer prizewinning historian, and author of the soul of america the battle for our better angels. Jon meachum. Well enjoy joe coming back together and hearing his voice on this. In a moment well get to President Trumps meeting with House Republicans on capitol hill. First we think its important to update you on the scene at the southern border. A report overnight from the Associated Press attempts to answer a question that the Trump Administration has dodged for the last few days. Where are the girls . And where are the young toddlers among Migrant Children separated from their families at the border . The a. P. Reports that babies and other very Young Children are being sent to at least three tenderage shelters in south texas. Thats what theyre called according to the a. P. , lawyers and medical providers who have visited the rio grande shelters described playrooms of crying preschoolage children in crisis. The report unconfirmed by msnbc says the government also plans to open a fourth shelter to house hundreds of young Migrant Children in houston. According to numbers from u. S. Customs and border protection, 2,235 families have been apprehended at the border between may 5, when the zero tolerance policy put out by the attorney general and the Trump Administration was put in place. And june 9th, among more than 4500 family members, were 2,342 children, who were designated as unaccompanied. Yesterday the former head of u. S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement told nbcs Andrea Mitchell that some migrant family separations will end up being permanent. How are these families supposed to get back together . Dont forget that just two weeks ago, they revealed they lost track of 15 00 kids. Now you have to keep track of kids and the parents, i can tell you from experience its more difficult than it sounds. You end up with parents on one track, the child ends up on another track. In they dont reunite these kids with their parents right away, the kids will be stuck here in the United States for years and the parents will be down in honduras or guatemala with no idea where their child is and no way to reunite. The politics of this on capitol hill. I dont think anybody reporting on this i dont know whats going on at fox. But its hard, i cant even, i couldnt even read the script, i was beginning to cry. Im note sure how anybody can defend this without feeling a pit in their stomach. You ask susan dell pursio if she was thinking about leaving the party. Steve schmidt who ran john mccains 2008 president ial campaign at 2 41 a. M. Tweeted that hes leaving the Republican Party. That was overnight. Steve schmidt. Not just any republican, a leader in the party has renounced his membership in the Republican Party. Thats where some people are. I think the reality of it is you listen to President Trump well say it again, every time he says its a democratic loophole, the president can end it with a phone call, a stroke of a pen, full stop, period, end of sentence. The question i guess is kasie hunt what to do with the energy and outrage . Whats the productive way to change this . How do you fix this . Theyre trying on capitol hill and the house, theyre trying in the senate to some extent, Chuck Schumer says it has to be done through the president and not legislation. The reality again, is that the president could change this by picking up the phone. This was an administrative policy change, now could congress in theory do something about it . Yes, but theres really no clear path forward. Democrats are arguing that essentially the president is holding these kids hostage and this is a repeat of what he did with dreamers, created a crisis, created a vulnerable population, and then used that as political leverage to turn around and try to push through the other immigration policies that he championed on the campaign trail. That is whats going on in the house. The two bills are much more sweeping. Theyre not narrow, they dont just deal with this question, there is language that would potentially address the family separation that is included in those bills. But they also sharply curtail legal immigration. They change the rules for asking for asylum. It makes it much more difficult to do that. In the senate, the path is potentially a little bit different. But there are so many competing proposals, democrats are saying look, its a snakepits with what one aide said to me about negotiating with republicans on immigration. The congress hasnt been able to do anything about this in literally decades. They could add something very narrow to a mustpass defense spending bill thats on the floor this week. That seems to me to be the likeliest scenario. Where we get something small and narrow to deal with this. And to put an end to it. But you know the reality is, they are not acting right now on this. The political will, i will say much different. What mika said at the top of the show, everybody being on the same page for like the first time in quite frankly from what i can remember, the entirety of the Trump Administration to date, i mean people dont like this. They dont want this. Across the board. Republicans, democrats, the problem is, that its not clear they can get their act together and actually stop it. There were Standing Ovations and backslapping on capitol hill last night when President Trump went up there late yesterday, meeting with House Republicans for 45 minutes. Speaker paul ryan began the closeddoor session by discussing the gops compromise immigration bill that had just been filed. President trump spoke briefly about immigration and reportedly ran through a number of topics, including what he called the hoax russia investigation. North korea, the cost of jet fighters, trade, and mocking recently defeated congressman mark sanford, who was not in the room, before the president returned to immigration. Sources in the room say trump said he is 1,000 with them to pass a sprawling immigration bill. And he told them the burden for getting citizenship would be significant and that it would be linked to the construction of the border wall. He said quote, you have to work work work, then after 10, 12, maybe 13 years, you have to chance to become a citizen, trump went on. So youre talking 12, 13 years out and then you dont even get a green card until the wall is built so this is an incentive to get the wall built faster. People in the republicansonly capitol hill meeting also said the president addressed his controversial policy on Migrant Children. Reportedly saying quote, we got to take care of separation, its too nasty. Will he could take care of it. And members say trump said that he had talked with his daughter, ivanka, about the images of children in cages and she asked him to find a way to put a stop to it. Shes not said that publicly. But in his public remarks yesterday, the president continued to insist that the responsibility rests with democrats, he tweeted this, democrats are the problem. They dont care about crime and want Illegal Immigrants no matter how bad they may be to pour into and infest our country like ms13. They cant win on their terrible policies so they view them as potential voters. President said this at an event in washington as a result of democratssupported loopholes in our federal laws, most illegal immigrant families and minors from Central America who arrive unlawfully at the border cannot be detained together, or removed together. Only released. These are crippling loopholes that cause family separation. Which we dont want. I want to read Steve Schmidts tweet actually. He says 29 years and nine months ago i registered to vote and became a member of the Republican Party. Which was founded in 1854 to oppose slavery, and stand for the dignity of human life. Today i renounce my membership in the Republican Party. It is fully the party of trump. And i do, ill just take my knowledge of how donald trump thinks and what i know about him, and i think there may have been some sort of strange backplan in his head where maybe he would blame it on the democrats and sign this away and be the hero to change it. Its too late, its yours, youve done it and there are babies who are hurting right now and that wont end. And that trauma is permanent. This is a massive pr fail. And as far as his daughter saying something to him . Ivanka trump has counseled to the president , you need to step up, i know you wont. You need to step up and speak for yourself. But the way trump works with people close to him, like ivanka and other who is work for him, is those people dont have to step up and take questions, theyre too feckless, too stupid or smart enough not to actually put themselves out there. They get protected by the inner circle. Which is very small around this president. People like secretary nielson, Sarah Huckabee sanders, sean spicer at one point, theyre forced out there to make fools of themselves. Because they have no choice, they think. You do have a choice. And we need more people to step up. We are seeing more republicans, susan del persio, theres a list and its a sign of hope at a time where it really is very difficult to report on a story like this without shaking. And you have republican senators, some who are up for reelection, you have rick scott who is seeking the senate in florida. Who again came out against this. And you even have two republican governors, both up for reelection from massachusetts and maryland, who withdraw the National Guard troops they had sent. Republicans are stepping up. What this is starting to seem like is a lot will charlottesville. An issue that has racial overtones, dividing the nation. The difference is last time they had steve bannon to resign, that kind of blew over and let people kind of go forward. I think donald trump is digging in. And what hes missing is this is bad politics, bad policy and what concerns him the most is bad tv. Thats all that comes through for him. You know, mika, this is well beyond politics. It is. I mean the soul, the character, and the definition of the america we know, the america that we grew up with, the america that the world became familiar with, is now been called into question by the actions of a single man. Donald trump. And his associates. There are 286 members of the Republican Party serving in both the house and the senate. They were elected by individual citizens in their districts and in their states. Where are they . Susan, with all due respect, you say theyre starting to step up and say theyre muted, theyre muted. Whats worse is this is a value decision this is who we are as a valuebased decision. We saw the president , with the g7 and now to even just yesterday, saying it cost too much. This is not a financial issue. This is who we are as a nation. And i have, i stand by that 1,000 . This shows who donald trump is. It goes back to when he said he didnt want people from shole countries and he only wanted people from norway. Youre right this is a time where americans especially republicans, if they want to hold on to any sense of dignity, have to speak out. And i think were going to see what happens in the mid term elections and thats going to change a lot of peoples opinions. Steve rattner and take it to meachum. You said youre starting to see republicans speak out. The question is whether they can get themselves together. This mass of people on capitol hill that kasie was talking about, can actually come together and troy to accomplish something. Whats i think to me one of the more sickening aspects of this is that what trump effectively doing is using these children as pawns. Hes using them as pawns to try as a deterrent to try to get other families from coming here and hes using them from pawns on capitol hill to try to force the passage of some immigration bill that he likes as opposed to what we very simple, a very simple bill that simply said, you dont no longer have to separate parents from children, if you choose to detain them. Which is the source of all this problem. So its really, its heartbreaking to see this happening. But its even more heartbreaking to see our president using Young Children as pawns in a political struggle. And i dont want to get into the weeds, because i truly believe this is larger than just politics, you have three republican members of the senate announce donald, no more federal judges, were shutting you down. Were not going to vote for your reappointees, but anyway, jon meachum, back to the central theme of what i think might be going on, beneath the surface of the politics is the soul of america. The fight for the soul of america. And i cant recall in my memory, which is fading, actually as i get older, but even, even my sense of history, since the mccarthy, in the early 50s, has there been such a dark moment in the soul of this countrys politics . Well one of the things i think we have to confront is when we say this isnt america, in fact, it is. Its the worst part of america. Its the darker instincts, but theyve been with us from the very beginning. And theyre with us now. And what so many of us hoped is that we believed in a kind of idea and reality of progress. And that in fact, you could move forward. And what President Trump represents, i think, is the fullest and most vivid and frankly the scariest manife manifestation of these dark impulses in the countrys soul. And the battle is always for every given era, the battle is account reagan view of im going to keep quoting this until people yank me off when he said, in his farewell address, that part of being the shining city on the hill this is ronald reagan, okay, is to greet all the lost pilgrims from all the lost places hurtling through the darkness towards home. Now if youre hurtling through the darkness toward home, well separate you from your children. I would urge republicans to think about how do you want to be viewed by history . Because i promise, the fox cycle, the breitbart cycle is very quick. History is forever. And if i, if i had three minutes with President Trump, i would say we know you care about success. We know you care about ratings. Why dont you do what other great president s have done, reach beyond your base, talk, surprise us. Whats the one thing we all say about Richard Nixon . He went to china. Trump has the capacity here, and its in his selfinterest. Im not asking him to do the right thing, because i dont think hes capable of that in a moral sense. But i shouldnt say that, we shouldnt cast the first stone, but why not. Why not do the right thing. Why not talk about hope instead of fear . Surprise us and reap the benefits. I dont think that day is going to come. But i want to rephrase mikes question, taking part of your answer, jon meachum. You say that is part of america. There is a part of america that has these elements and i would, i would agree. We have a long way to go, still. When it comes to race. But have we ever seen anything in recent memory that parallels having sexism, racism, white supremacy, thuggery, bigotry, along with complicit men and women within the administration at the top . No, not at the top. Complicity in congress. Weve never seen this. Weve never seen someone with these attributes at the top. Can you tell me that im incorrect in saying that the president of the United States has displayed these attributes in his voice in his words, and in his policies . You are correct. And this is as if George Wallace had won in 1968, thats where we are. If we had been talking 50 years ago today, the level of violence in the country would have been incredibly high, we would have just buried senator kennedy. Just buried dr. King, heading into the Chicago Democratic National convention, you had an immense amount of violence, both on the left and on the right. George wallace carried five states, 13. 5 of the vote in november 68, but he didnt win. And the one throughline here from charlottesville to this issue, is to use your phrase, a return to the most disturbing elements of white supremacy. White male supremacy, to be precise. In the national character. And what we have to do, and its these kinds of conversations that, that are essential, is there are about five elements that having to rowing some number of these elements have to be rowing in the right direction. The presidency, the congress, the courts, the press and the people. And right now the presidency and the congress are not rowing in the right direction. We have to have the other elements and we have to just keep pushing as exhausting as it is, as tiring as it is, as unpleasant as the other side is, you just keep fighting. Despite all this, we all should remember the president actually isnt terribly conflicted about this. He believes he told senior aides that he looks strong. Hes acting on promises he made during the campaign. That immigration was the initial hook he set on june 16, 2015. He thinks its why he got elected. He believes these pictures were seeing of families separated, children being taken from their parents are strength. To him thats an image of strength. Its a message being sent. Kasie hunt im going to read awe quote from steve bannon to the Associated Press. Quote i think this is one of his best moments, i think this is a profile in courage. This is why america elected him. This is not doubling down, it is tripling down. That tells you everything you need to know about the view from inside the trump family. Inside the trump white house. It really does, and our reporting lines up with that. That this policy is really coming from the president. I just want to make one, what i think is an important point about the congress here. Were down in the weeds about what theyre actually doing day to day. The big picture here is that if Congress Wants to stop this, yes, the president could do it with a phone call. Congress, though, could stop this. If they wanted to. If both Republican Leaders on both sides stepped up and crafted something, they could push this through, i think that there would likely be a vetoproof majority for ending this policy. Simply based on the number of conversations that i have had. They could do that. But it would require standing up to the president of the United States and taking a political risk. Going out on a limb and doing it. They could. The constitution has crafted, in fact crafted the congress to be more powerful than the presidency. Theyve cedeed a lot of that power to the president in recent years, but if the congress wanted to do this, to end this and nothing else, they could and all the back and forth about the negotiations and the democrats this and the broader bill that, its all dissembling. If they wanted to, they could. This is a moment in history where everybody has an opportunity to do whats right. The Washington Post phil rutgers reporting that President Trump was angry because he felt the media was cherrypicking pictures, like focusing on only the negative. And thereforetrying to make the story look worse. Let me remind you, mr. President , and also the dhs secretary might want to know this as well, that these pictures are being actually disseminated and handed out by the government. So we would also like to follow up on the question as to where the girls are and you know, more pictures of toddlers and babies, we want to see them. We want to know what their status is, where are the girls . Where are they being housed . And why didnt, im confused as to why we cant actually see that part. These are your pictures. And your little pr stunt. Trying to look strong, its failing miserably. It is so cruel to see what is happening in your pictures. That you gave to the press, about what is happening at the border. Gosh if we could take our own pictures and we could walk in there a little more freely like it is america, and really see whats going on maybe we would see more babies, maybe we would see more girls, maybe we would see more toddlers, maybe its worse, but it looks pretty damn bad. It looks as bad as it gets. And i just think you might want to think about just pulling the rip cord on this and ending it. It hasnt gone well. Its not working. Still ahead on morning joe, live reporting from the border, and as we go to break, activists heckled Homeland Security secretary kirstjen nielsen. She made the very tonedeaf ivankalike decision to dine at a Mexican Restaurant last night. Dhs put out a statement saying the protesters share her concern with our current immigration laws that have created a crisis on the southern border. Again, its not a law. Its the president s policy. Well be right back. Shame, shame, shame hi. 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Mariana, youve been talking all week with mothers who have been trying to come to the u. S. What have you been hearing today . Willie, these mothers are desperate. Not for themselves, but for their children. The levels of violence that theyre fleeing in Central America have forced them here to the other side of the hidalgo bridge where im standing. I spoke to half a dozen mothers in reynosa, mexico, theyre waiting to see if theyre going to cross to the u. S. Border or not. Now with the risk that their children, they get prosecuted, will be taken from them. Theyre waiting out this decision in one of the most dangerous cities in mexico, where i spoke to patricia, a young mother from honduras, who has her sevenyearold child there. This is the kind of violence that she told me she was fleeing from. Lets play a little of my conversation with her in spanish from mexico yesterday. Tell me about where youre fleeing from in our country. I want to understand what you guys are going through. Im fleeing violence, im fleeing the gangs. There is no future for our children. And you were telling me before, if your country was safe you would have stayed there. My country would be okay, i would be there happily with my child. I would not try to cross. Everything that we have gone through to even be here. Theres a lot of mothers like me who are afraid to speak about this, about what they endure on this journey just even coming here. It took her three months to even make it to the u. S. Border. She said it, she wouldnt be putting her son through that, if she didnt think that it would mean his life if they stayed in Central America. And now when you think about, guys, just the decision that these mothers are faced with. You know having their tenderage children as we saw potentially put in shelters, separated from them. If they get prosecuted or having to go back to that its an impossible decision to make for them. Mariana, where in the process is that young mother that we just heard from . Is she at risk of being separated from her child . Shes on the other side, willie. Weighing the decision of whether or not to cross over to the u. S. She says she still hasnt made up her mind. Because this issue of family separation is something that she wasnt expecting when she left her native country. She does not know what to do. But what she knows for sure is that if she goes back to Central America, her boy, which is seven years old, you know they start recruiting them at nine, ten years old. So thats why theyre making the dangerous journey over here. Thats why theyre even considering getting prosecuted by this administration, having their kids taken away. Because it will mean these kids life if they go back. And just on a final note. Ive also been to places like the Syrian Border and spoken to mothers there and its hard not to make the parallelisms and to look at these mothers and children as refugees who you know i ask them, what is your message to the Trump Administration . And that mother said, we need help. Please help us. Mariana, after while she sits on the other side of the border, waiting to make a decision whether to try and get into the United States, how does she how does she exist . How does she feed herself and her child . How does she live daily on the other side of the border . Shes been waiting out there for two weeks. Watching this Immigration Crisis play out. And shes in a shelter run by this priest where theres of 60 people going through that. Just to give you guys some context, we needed five people in our security detail just to even make it to that shelter. Theyre waiting this out in an incredibly dangerous city, theres a turf war being fought there by two cartels, these are the same cartels that practice this Human Trafficking along the border, and prey on these people. So the kind of violence that theyre fleeing from, is the kind of violence that they are exposed to. As theyre waiting and watching what this administration is doing and making this very difficult decision. Mariana, atencio doing a great job for us at the border, thank you. Mika, in a way this makes Jeff Sessions and Donald Trumps case, that this is a quote tough deterrent. If that woman is sitting at the border, worried that shes going to lose her child and perhaps not cross into the United States. Thats what the Trump Administration wants to hear from this policy. I dont know if we could put her picture up again. This brave mother, who has been traveling a dangerous journey for three months. Mothers like this and their daughters along the way they risk rape. They risk torture. They endure hardship that is indescribable. To try and come here, and if we could see her face again, because this is the face of success for Trump Supporters and donald trump himself. And his family who works for him, ivanka trump, for his administration, for the secretary of Homeland Security, she feels that she and donald trump feels that he, are actually, theyre being successful. With this policy. Because a woman like this who is trying to come here to save her children, may not decide to make the journey into the United States. And seek asylum. This is success right here for them. This is what Trump Supporters say, is exactly what they want is for people to be too afraid to come here. Even though they are enduring murder, rape, torture, and they are fleeing what we thought was something worse. It also, mika, makes the case for if we had a president of the United States who was knowledgeable enough and skillful enough to create and keep alliances with other countries, like mexico, like honduras, el salvador, guatemala, we have enormous numbers of troops in afghanistan and iraq still today and on the Syrian Border. We have drug cartels preventing this woman from crossing over to the border. We have three governments, honduras, gauatemala and el salvador, your daily life, youre terrorized, and we can do nothing about it because we dont have very good relationships with i dont think any country in the world now. Something that mariana said, can you put this in a broader context, which is what should our policy be toward refugees from these terrible, terrible places like honduras or like syria. And the Trump Administrations policy is essentially zero tolerance. We dont want any of them. Theyve cut off refugees from syria. You could show pictures from syria that look just like those pictures we saw from the border, were not letting those people in. And were not letting these people in. This is a broader part of the trump policy. We dont want anybody here. Thats right. That is the policy. Coming up, with the administration throwing around numbers about border crossings, Steve Rattner has some charts to drill down on the facts. Is it a solution in search of a problem . Thats next on morning joe. Yeah, you . [ roaring ] [ screaming ] nope. Rated pg13. These are the specialists were proud to call our own. Experts from all over the world, working closely together to deliver truly personalized cancer care. Expert medicine works here. Learn more at cancercenter. Com if yor crohns symptoms are holding you back, and your Current Treatment hasnt worked well enough, it may be time for a change. Ask your doctor about entyvio, the only biologic developed and approved just for uc and crohns. 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But theres also a history of people pushing for justice. When we think about fighting the injustice that is this president , i think we should take pride in trying to be part of that tradition. We have a president that has lied over and over again. You know, donald trump is not a lawabiding citizen. President trump has made an abomination of the office. Weve been asking the question, where are the girls and where are the babies. Apparently one has been located. The Houston Bureau chief for the New York Times just caption this toddler is about 12 months old. She was separated from her relatives as part of the Trump Administrations family separation policy. She is being held at a brownsville shelter. I did not take the photo. It was supplied to me. It looks like maybe somebody used a phone to snap a picture. So you see a child like that, kasie hunt. Alone in a shelter, around other toddlers, are they allowed to pick up this child . Weve heard reports about exactly how much comfort these children can get when being held. But a child as young as 12 months old separated from their family. How exactly do politicians find a way around this . Because every moment that goes by their views or lack of views on this is reported in history. Its incredibly its so hard to see this picture. I mean you can see theres the feet of an adult there to the left that are, theyre clothed and what you might see in a hospital. Clearly theres concern about the health and safety of the child and people that ive spoken to about that policy argue that its in place because they want these children to be protected, they want to prevent abuse. But for children that are this young, the idea that you couldnt comfort them is absolutely heartbreaking. I have retweeted that picture and somebody wrote back to me with a statement from the state of michigan from june 19, ive lost track of what the date is. But michigan is a place that historically has taken in a lot of refugees. There are a lot of refugee communities. So they have played a significant role in helping with unaccompanied minors. In their foster care system. And they say the executive director of the Michigan Department of civil rights, says this week ive been in touch with various agencies and organizations working with these vulnerable children. We have received reports and are very concerned that the children arriving here are much younger than those who have been transported here in the past. Some of the children are infants. As young as three months of age. And they are completely unable to advocate for themselves. I am take very seriously our responsibility to see to the civil rights of every person in this state. He says theyre going to monitor the situation, but while the a. P. Has reported on these shelters, it sounds as though this is occurring perhaps across the country. As we report all of this out. The problem, manufactured for the base it appears some would say. That that child is one of the first toddlers weve seen and well keep asking the question where are the girls. Where are the toddlers. Why is this happening. Well be right back. They appear out of nowhere. My secret visitors. Appearing next to me in plain sight. Hallucinations and delusions. These are the unknown parts of living with parkinsons disease. What stories they tell. But for my ears only. What plots they unfold. But only in my mind. Over 50 of people with parkinsons will experience hallucinations or delusions during the course of their disease. And these can worsen over time, making things even more challenging. But there are advances that have led to Treatment Options that can help. If someone you love has parkinsons and is experiencing hallucinations or delusions, talk to your parkinsons specialist. Because theres more to parkinsons. My visitors should be the ones i want to see. Learn more at moretoparkinsons. Com i want to see. At bp, everyone on an offshore rig depends on one another. Thats why entire teams train together in simulators, to know exactly what to do before they have to do it. Because safety is never being satisfied. And always working to be better. This is a story about mail and packages. And its also a story about people. People who rely on us every day to deliver their dreams theyre handing us more than mail theyre handing us their business and while we make more ecommerce deliveries to homes than anyone else in the country, we never forget. That your business is our business the United States postal service. Priority you. The Washington Post recently highlighted a study that says charts change hearts and minds, better than words do. Easier to read than say. So Steve Rattner, go ahead. Change our hearts and minds and tell us about the border crossing. Im not sure i can change our hearts and minds better than some of those pictures did, which were so incredibly wrenching. So look, lets try to dissect some of what trump is saying, as usual its filled with a number of falsehoods, starting with his claim that the number of people crossing the border has exploded. What you can see what hes talking about is hes comparing whats happening this year in terms of Border Apprehensions to what happened last year. In 2017. But what hes ignoring is the fact that in three other previous years the rate of apprehensions is roughly same as it is now. If you take out last year as an aberration, theres no particular change in the number of people trying to cross the border. In fact this is also kind of a seasonal high. And generally this declines as the year wears on. So that sort of lie number one that we can put to rest. The second question is, where does it stand relative to history. And if you go back in history. You can see that the number of border crossings in the last several years has been at the lowest level its been since 1971. If you go back to the year 2000, it was up over 1. 6 million. And so it is possible if you look at the little extrapolation we did here, that the number of border crossings could be slightly high they are year than it was last year. But were bumping along on the bottom for a variety of reasons, the financial crisis caused a lot of people from mexico to decide the u. S. Wasnt actually such a great place to come after all. Things in mexico notwithstanding. But in the broader mexican economy have gotten better. More jobs, more things for people to do the number of people trying to cross the border has generally been trending down. Does any of that tie to policy . In other words president obama, who President Trumpobama, who p trump accused of being weak on immigration and weak at the border, it is the economy, yes, but is there something president obama did to bring about that precipitous drop during his two te terms . Yes. The number of Border Patrol agents being assigned has gone up sharply. Yes, weve done a lot more to enforce the border. Obama did consider policies like what trump is doing, but rejected the idea of separating families. He did step up the enforcement at the border of people trying to cross illegally. Lastly, lets deal with the question of whether people who come here are rapist, murderers and carrying drugs. What you can see here is that Illegal Immigrants actually are incarcerated at half the rate of native born americans, and legal immigrants are actually incarcerated at an even lower rate than that. This whole notion were bringing in gang members, bringing in people who are going to rape murder and pillage our country is not bringing out the facts. The u. S. Government says it seeks to promote, quote, humane, International Migration policies. When asked if the trump separation policy was humane, the acting director of i. C. E. Couldnt bring himself to say the word. Well talk to the attorney general of new mexico and a former u. S. Attorney lending their voices to the cause. Well be right back. Hello. The new united explorer card hooks me up. Getting more for getting away. Rewarded going new places and tasting new flavors. Rewarded traveling lighter. Rewarded haha getting settled. Rewarded learn more at theexplorercard. Com and get. Rewarded come fly with me, lets fly, lets fly away. And get. Woman it felt great not having hepatitis c. Its like a load off my shoulders. I was just excited for it to be over. 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So you can be less concerned about your retirement savings. Talk with your advisor about shield annuities from Brighthouse Financial established by metlife. Am i willing to pay the price for loving you . Youll make my morning, but ruin my day. Complicated relationship with milk . Pour on the lactaid. Its delicious 100 real milk, just without that annoying lactose. Mmm, thats good. Lactaid. The real milk that doesnt mess with you. And try calcium enriched lactaid. 100 real milk with 20 more calcium. Still no lactose. The administration offers few, if any, answers where the government is holding the children taken from their families along the u. S. Border. There is new reporting this morning from new york 1. It includes video of what the station is calling an exclusive, quote, children from the southern border are being brought to new york city. After being separated from their families overnight. Their reporter captured video of unusual activity at a Foster Agency in east harlem. Also this morning the Houston Bureau chief for the New York Times tweeted this image with a caption this toddler is about 12 months old. She was separated from relatives as part of the Trump Administrations family separation policy. Shes being held at a brownsville shelter. I did not take the photo. It was supplied to me. Just a few minutes before the top of the hour. Still with us we have msnbc mike barnicle, a contributor. And steve ratner, an analyst. And kasie hunt. And the author of the soul of america, jon meacham. Good to have you all with us. As we follow this story im finding it hard to believe what were seeing. We havent confirmed that new york one reporter yet. Hes a really good reporter, josh is. But if you think about what hes reporting, its that they were separated from their families at the border and then put on a plane, flown to new york city. Without their parents . And taken to a Foster Center in east harlem, new york. Is that possible . Were going to continue to report on it. The other thing s bottom of,y impression and understanding of the policy, children under 4 should not be separated from their parents. Apparently thats happening. That will be interesting reporting to come. Im going to continue with this because its staggering. We do have to make sure were really, really cool on the facts. And i want to follow up on that new york one report. A report overnight from the Associated Press, attempts to answer a question that the Trump Administration has dodged for the last few days. Where are the girls . Where are the young toddlers among Migrant Children separated from their families at the border . The ap reports that babies and other Young Children are being sent to at least three tender age shelters in south texas. Thats what theyre calling them. According to the ap, lawyers and medical providers who have visited the rio grand valley shelters described playrooms of crying preschool age children in crisis. The report says the government also plans to open a shelter to house hundreds of young Migrant Children in houston. According to nurls from u. S. Customs and border protection, 2,235 families have been apprehended at the border between may 5th when zero tolerance policy was in place and june 9th. Among more than 4,500 family members were 2,342 children who were then designated as unaccompanied. And here is the current acting director of i. C. E. , thomas homen, seeming to take a noticeable pause when Cnns Wolf Blitzer asked him if the administrations current actions are a humane policy. Is this new zero tolerance policy that the president has supported that the attorney general announced, is it humane . I think i think its the law. As the law it may be the law, its the policy. But is it humane . I think its the law, and im a Law Enforcement, and i must follow the law. Its not humane. Its not humane to separate children from their mothers, to separate families. Its not humane to take toddlers away from their mothers. Its cruel. Its abusive. Its proven by doctors to have longstanding implications for these families. And there are some reports that in very small cases, but existing numbers, you might not even be able to bring these families back together willie . I want to point out one thing. The u. S. Catholic bishop conference has condemned this. The pope was asked about it a moment ago. He said simply i am on the side of the bishops conference, agreeing with their view that it is immoral. Amid the growing outrage of the Trump Administrations policy of separating Migrant Children from parents a group of Democratic State attorneys general sent two letters to attorney general Jeff Sessions yesterday calling on him to reverse the policy. Joining the conversation, the attorney general of new mexico, Hector Balderas who led that letter, and a former u. S. Attorney and msnbc contributor Barbara Mcquaid who added her name to the prosecutors letter. General balderas, let me start with you, what do you believe is the quickest and best course of action to stop this policy right now . Is it convincing the president of the United States to make the phone call that could end it, or is it pushing congress to move quicker than the president could . I believe the president should take executive action. He should do the right thing. I disagree with that Law Enforcement officer fundamentally, you can enforce a law and be tough on crime. We as border ags understand we should be going after human traffickers, drug smugglers and gun runners. The president wants to be tough on crime. We should be focused on hardened criminals and enforce border security. But we should not be violating the rights of children and breaking up families. Thats the fundamental debate here were missing when we offend the conscience of our country is the rule of law. We can be tough on crime. We just have to be smart. We can do both, and we should not be violating the constitution of the United States and the greatest democracy and the greatest rule of law by offending our conscience as well by breaking up families. And thats what the president could do. Then the congress should take action. And of course in the end the goal of any institution international, state or federal, is to do justice. So were offending families. And our immigration, whether its an immigration system or a criminal Justice System, we are breaking up families, especially children that are innocent under the recaule of law, then we neeo step in as americans. This is a policy that was implemented and articulated by the attorney general of the United States about five or six weeks ago. Thats when the uptick started occurring of breaking up families. Youre the attorney general of the state of new mexico. If the Albuquerque Police department in investigating a domestic call at a home scooped the children out of the house, would it be against the law of new mexico for them to do that . Well, they would work in conjunction with social workers in that, in Family Protection units at that point if the other family members were somehow violating the law. But there would be compassion and some sense of discretion by Law Enforcement. They wouldnt just be fundamentally saying i haveo enforce the rule of law, i have to break up the family and scoop up the children and then blindly put them in a cage or in some kind of a cold jail setting and then also fundamentally denying due process on both sides and keeping everyone in the dark. Thats just a backwards system. Jeff sessions is playing kind of a word game here. And thats why im talking to americans today. We can absolutely be tough on crime and absolutely be tough on exploitation. We should be focused on human traffickers, gun runners, drug smugglers. Im at the border. You want to talk concrete and building walls, lets talk about that. But when youre talking about children crying and then youre playing games with information and withholding information, thats something that our greatest criminal Justice System, our immigration system right now doesnt pass the smell test. And thats why were getting involved as ags. But thats where were starting the debate, being tough on the border, tough on crime. Were not even in the conversation. Right now you are terrorizing children. And were in the business of fighting terrorism, not terrorizing children. And youre misleading the general public and trying to hold up the Law Enforcement badge. Thats another way to put it. Theyre being traumatized and terrorized. Theres no question about it. Jon meacham . Im wondering if theres a judicial remedy here in the checks and balances system, if the other two branches fail. One question is whether there is something that the courts could step in and do. Well, i think on a microlevel, frequently the judges sentence these defendants to time served. You know, these are misdemeanor offenses. And so we could see a remedy at the administrative level. They were handled through that way. At a macrolevel, there has been a challenge by the aclu, and there could be other challenges to take this to a higher level to get an order that says the department of justice cannot act in this way. I dont know that that kind of an attack would be successful because as we said this is not a legal decision. This is a policy decision. People are entering the border illegally. But what has changed and what is the radical departure from the past is this idea of a zero tolerance policy. Every Single Person who commits that misdemeanor offense of illegal entry is being prosecuted. And because children cannot be detained or jailed awaiting trial with their parents they are necessarily being separated. What has happened in the past is allowing prosecutors to use discretion to make that common sense decision about prioritization. If someone here that has committed that misdemeanor offense of illegal entry to decline prosecution, handle it administratively and instead focus the prosecutorial things that are changes. Every hour and every day that a prosecutor spends handling an illegal entry case is an hour a day the prosecutor spends not dealing with serious crimes. Kasie hunt, you said last hour there is a solution, that congress could act in a sweeping way and end this at once. Is that possible . Sure. Its possible. How . Its not how they normally do business. None of this is normal. You know, normally theres tradeoffs and back and forth. But if they really wanted to, Republican Leaders control the floors of the house and of the senate. And they could write a very narrow bill that i think at least from talking to my ive not done a formal whip count obviously, but ive had conversations with members privately and on camera the last couple of days about this. To a person im trying to think of somebody ive talked to whos not opposed to this policy. Everybody says we dont want to see this, we dont want this to happen. So that suggests to me that you could potentially see a veto proof majority. It would require Republican Leaders to stand up and essentially oppose the president in this. But it is possible for it to be ended today by congress . Sure. Technically possible. Yes, technically possible. It would take the agreement of all 100 senators to do it today, but the house could go right ahead and do it today. Their procedures, the House Speaker has a lot of power over what he could do with the floor. They would probably anger a lot of people because everyone is wedded to how they do things and the processes around there. They could do it if they wanted to. Everyone is very wedded to the process. And i dont think weve seen the process really work over the past few years. And as kasie said, none of this is normal. So 100 senators, theres 100 of you who could do this today and could change the direction of our country which is right now headed in the wrong direction because none of this is normal. Taking babies away from their mothers is not normal. Hiding toddlers from the american public, and large groups of girls that have been separated from their families, hiding them from the american public, and not revealing the pictures, or telling us what their locations are, and telling us whether theyre okay, thats not normal, and thats not american. Taking groups of kids, and marching them off to tents like criminals. Building tent cities for them. Hiding children in cages with blankets that they have to share, and lying on the floor, these are the pictures our government have released to show their policy is working. None of this is normal. We have 100 senators who could step up and do the right thing for the United States of america. And then you can go on and go to your corners and fight about the Different Things you want to fight about. But lets be unified on this. I dont think any of this is normal. And i think that our president , the one thing we havent seen in our lifetimes is a president who brings to the table racist tendencies, bigotry, sexism, bullying, thuggism, and frightens people to say things that they dont mean in order to hold onto their jobs. Weve seen that happen in realtime. Weve seen that play out before our eyes. And it might be personal. It might be political. But this is about our heart. And weve got 100 senators who could change this today. We know the president wont unless for some reason he thinks he might win some p. R. Battle or make some sort of gain for himself in a way that only pertains to him. But you could fight for america. You could fight for who we are. We would support that. Were praying for that as human beings and citizens of the United States of america. Anybody disagree . Well, id like to ask kasie a question. Go ahead. Ive read all the heartbroken tweets from senators and read the strongly worded letters from senators to attorney general sessions. The Republican Congress had a did any of them confront him about this issue when they had a chance . The president didnt take questions. And there were no from my reporting, outbursts from the crowd during the meeting. We talked to one member who on his way in, my colleague Garrett Haake spoke to one in colorado who represents hes been a voice on the immigration issue. I havent had a chance yet to follow up. I didnt catch up with him leaving the meeting. None of my sources said that he was confronted directly on this issue. In fact, typically these meetings, the president likes it when members stick around and take selfies with him. From the photographs it looks like smiles and back slaps and Standing Ovations. General balderas, i want to ask you a question and present the case the administration makes and a lot of conservatives will make too. Which is that its heartbreaking to look at these pictures, but the fact of the matter is many of them are breaking the law and there has to be some punishment for breaking the law. And they believe this is a tough deterrent. We had an interview with one of our reporters with a young mother and her child waiting on the other side of the border and considering whether or not it was worth it to cross into United States because she may be separated from her child. The Trump Administration would say, see, thats what we mean, were deterring people from crossing. What is a better solution here to prevent the crossing of Illegal Immigrants . They just need to use some common sense. They have not built the bureaucracy or the apparatus to provide the significant amount of due process. Its taken years to process families in a humane way. Lets invest to build truly the greatest immigration system we can build. Why are we dillydallying around fighting about policies and trying to pass a bill right now when we should be investing real resources on the border . We are an International World superpower, and we are trying to build a wall rather than build the greatest Justice System to properly process mexico and canada, which are our largest trading partners. We are fighting with north korea when we dont even trade or make money off north korea. So building a real economic engine in that region where we value human rights, employment rights, civil rights, and Law Enforcement. We have great Law Enforcement partners right there where we need to eradicate Drug Trafficking and gun running. But all it takes is putting professionals down there, social workers, judges, counselors, and properly process them. Go back to what we were doing previously. I think its slightly more complicated than that, in a way. Theres basically two groups of people were talking about. There are mexicans who have tried to cross the border, and traditionally our policy there was to send them back. Now you have this new somewhat new problem, in fairness to everybody whos working on this, where you have families fleeing this Gang Violence and these terrible conditions in guatemala, honduras and so on. Theyre seeking asylum, a different legal situation. Thats the point. The question for us as a country is what do you do with the Asylum Seekers . Do you take them because theyre seeking asylum from all this Gang Violence . Or do you send them back as families into the middle of this violence . Or what is our National View of this . That is a great point. Thats what our nation has been missing. Were coming off the heels of the dreamer argument where i had dreamers who were soldiers signing in with Homeland Security passing background checks, where Law Enforcement officers, coming off the old immigration system which was broken. Now we have asylum refugee who have more fundamental legal rights. Both Systems America didnt do well. We built a big mack hamburger. In seconds, we can turn around a greasy burger thats not good for you. But we cant process immigrant rights like the dreamers. We can either turn back a family or process them as a dreamer and we should do it under a year, the way we process a harvard applicant, or we should have some type of fundamental protection for Asylum Seekers. Come on, were the best nation in the world. And where im making the argument, mexico is an ally. Theyre the number three trading partner. If trump is a real businessman, he wont be playing footsies with north korea where we make no money off that economy, and mexico we know we make money because we need their labor, we trade with them and theyre our neighbor. And theyre a better soccer team than we are right now, quite frankly. Why can we not process our neighbors in a human way . I have Law Enforcement partners over there where we are exchanging information. In new mexico, good example, a Mexican National killed every one of his family members. And we have an extradition agreement. In mexico, it was mexican Law Enforcement officers and new mexico Law Enforcement officers that helped me go down and track this killer, coldblooded killer in mexico city. And we brought him back to justice in new mexico. This is the kind of things were doing at the state level. But President Trump just has a deranged argument. Thats all im saying. Its a complicated issue. But we are simply not processing these cases in a way that we are processing a divorce or other systems of justice. That we are the greatest super power in the world and we can do a better job. Barbara mcquaid, lets continue this in one vain. The power of the law, u. S. Attorneys, every u. S. Attorney has a pretty powerful tool box to utilize in various situations. What could a u. S. Attorney do in this case to protect children from being separated from their parents . Its cruel. Its unusual. Its inhumane. What could a u. S. Attorney theoreticallyo . Could a u. S. Attorney do anything at all to protect these children . Well, one of the things that caused all of the u. S. Attorneys from both republican and democratic administrations to write this letter to Jeff Sessions was to draw attention to the fact that the attorney general has ordered all u. S. Attorneys to use zero tolerance. So right now u. S. Attorneys cannot do anything other than prosecute all of these cases. And to put it into perspective, the Justice Department, the entire Justice Department across the country every year prosecutes about 70,000 cases a year. And of those 70,000, about 20,000 of those are immigration offenses. If this continues, prosecutors this year will have to handle 300,000 immigration cases. Thats more than theyve ever processed in a single year. Thats if they dont do anything else. And so this is really tieing the hands of those prosecutors on the southern border to do nothing but this. As the attorney general just said, a better use of those resources would be to allow the u. S. Attorneys to go back to their normal practice of using prosecutorial discretion to prosecute the most serious and dangerous cases, to decline prosecution from those who present no threat and instead use expedited removal to send them back. And for Asylum Seekers which International Law says we cannot turn back someone who has a credible fear of death. Investigate into those resources. I think the concern is that people are lying about their asylum seeking, that there is no credible fear, and they just want to come to america. Well, if thats the case, lets put our resources there, and do a better job at that credible fear determination that occurs at the border so only those with a bona fide fear of persecution or death are permitted to seek asylum. The great philosopher studied american democracy and said if america is great, its because america is good. Lets make america good again. Thank you both for being on this morning. Thank you. Still ahead an morning joe, republicans wanted to talk about the fbi and her emails on capitol hill yesterday. But our next guest was more interested in the humanitarian crisis unfolding on the u. S. Border right now. Democratic congressman Elijah Cummings joins us next. Youre watching morning joe. And just like that we felt a little less alone. But then something happened. We had to deal with spam, fake news, and data misuse. 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Youre a nincompoop phone ping gentlemen, i have just received word the louisiana purchase, is complete instant purchase notifications from capital one. So you wont miss a purchase large, small, or very large. Technology this helpful. Could make history. Whats in your wallet . Policy, which is now resulting in child interment camps, thats what i said, child interment camps. We all should be able to agree that in the United States of america we will not intentionally separate children from their parents. We will not do that. We are better than that. We are so much better. We should be able to agree that we will not keep kids in child interment camps indefinitely and hidden away from public view. What country is that . This is the United States of america. That was Ranking Member of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee during a hearing on the inspector generals report on the fbis handling of the Hillary Clinton email investigation. And congressman Elijah Cummings of Maryland Joins us now. Thank you so much for being on this morning. It is great to see you. It is good to be here. Also great to hear your voice yesterday and what you said. Thank you. Tell us whats going on on capitol hill. I think go ahead. Are you being heard . I think we are being heard, but we certainly are being ignored. I think basically what President Trump has done is hes decided that he is going to ram this policy and by the way it is his policy down the throats of the American People. And basically what hell do is a term i often use, hell ropeadope until people get tired and they wont talk about it anymore and then he will have his way. But this is were going down a slippery slope. The question is, where does all of this end . When youve got toddlers sitting around in a room crying for their mother or their dad, and youve got tent cities being built. By the way, which are extremely expensive. And there are people benefiting from this, corporations, nonprofits benefiting big time. And children literally being used as hostages, really, so that President Trump can have his way. And i would appeal to the president , let me just say this to the president , mr. President , when i met with you a year or so ago i did say that you could be a great president. But i also said that you could be a great president only if you represented all the people. Only if you lifted up all of their lives and made their lives better. This does not make their lives better. Nor does it make our country better. Because what is happening now is these children, i mean, think about it, mieke, these children will grow up, many of them angry at the United States of america. I tell my staff that the most of the problems that we deal with in my office started when people were little children. And so the pediatricians, they will tell you the damage that is being done to these children, all were doing is creating a horrible situation. You cannot separate kids from their parents, period. So im wondering what you would say to members of the media who are supportive of this policy, who say things like this, and they believe it and they want people to know, these kids have clean, nice facility, they have recreation, they have tutoring, they are treated as well as we can under the circumstances. And they have entertainment as well. I would say to them they need to talk to child psychiatrists like i have and talk to pediatricians who will tell you that this is very, very traumatic for children, big time. But more significantly, children need their parents. They need them. I mean, i would ask them to look into the eyes of their own children, and imagine somebody coming and snatching their child away from them. They would go through all kinds of trying to get their children back. Something thats significant, 18 members of the house have asked our chairman of our Oversight Committee to help us get more information about what is going on with these children. In other words, questions like the ones that you all have been posing this morning. If a child is taken away, will they how do we track the child to the parents . How long will this last . Where are our children . What is this costing . Why are taxpayers dollars being used to do something that most americans would find just obnoxious. Right. And so we so again, what i would say to them is the attorney general likes to quote the bible. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Come on now. Well, i think the children are given numbers, like criminals i guess. But the one thing ill ask, as a followup, and then willies going to jump in. The administration has also described these cages as walls made of wires and also members of the media have been pushing that forward, that were exaggerating with these parallels of concentration camps. That were exaggerating that these walls are just made of wires. Well, i would say, well, why are you hiding them . Why are you hiding them from the press . Why do we have correspondents going all the way down there having to stand outside of facilities unable to get in . That says something. I mean, this is let me tell you something. I said when President Trump was elected, this is a fight for the soul of our democracy. Im telling you, these kinds of actions just cut away at the very fabric of our democracy. We go all around the world spending billions of dollars trying to tell people how to run their lives and to be democratic. And now look at us. We are no longer the shining example of what is right. And so again i would appeal to the president. Listen to your wife. Listen to your daughter. Listen to us. And you, mr. President , can deal with this with a single stroke of the pen, and you know it. And stop putting it on democrats, please. I mean, we dont have time for that. By the way, while all this is going on, there are children literally crying and very upset. Its not exaggerated. If it is exaggerated, let the media come into all these facilities. And then the other thing, i was about to say, is that the republicans have not lifted one finger to help us try to find out this information that were looking for. And so they become aiders and abetters. Hopefully we will get past this. But i would say to america, and speaking to americans, dont let this happen. Dont because at the rate were going your children will not even know a democracy. They will not even be able to identify with this country because the democracy will be so watered down. Congressman, its willie geist, the president hasnt shown any willingness to budge, as youve heard. Hes dug in harder to this policy. Steve bannon said yesterday, quote, this is why america elected him, its not doubling down, its tripling down. As you know well there are a couple of bills floating through the house right now, republican bills. It appears many republicans disagree with this policy and are willing to do something about it, but then Chuck Schumer said legislation is not the way to go. Its up to the president. Shouldnt they be more open to a legislative fix if it looks like the president wont move on it . I think we should do everything in our power. We should be first of all not taking the weight off of the president as he goes around and tries to blame everybody but himself. We need to put the pressure there. If there are legislative fixes we ought to try them. But usually what has been asked is for to address these issues, youve got to pay a high price. Like paying billions and billions of dollars for a wall that the president said would be paid for by the mexicans. Or curtailing immigrant opportunities of becoming citizens and coming into our country tremendously. Youve got to figure out what the tradeoffs are. We shouldnt even be in a position where we have to talk about tradeoffs because what were dealing with are moral issues. This is moral. And, you know, the thing, will ie that im concerned about is the damage being done by President Trump. Im sad to say this. To correct the damage wont happen during my lifetime. I think people need to understand that. So congressman, paul ryan, youve known him quite a while, speaker of the house. Yeah, yeah. Has your opinion of him changed . No. As a matter of fact, i did not have a great opinion from him at all. Youve got to remember, weve been trying to get paul ryan to bring a Voting Rights bill to the floor of the house, and he wont do it. And that goes to fundamental rights of American People. The rights that my mother fought for, and my father fought for. And my mother on her dying bed talked about the fact that she hated the idea that she saw her people going backwards. Ryan, ive not been impressed when he could have stood up to this president. He didnt. And so now hes on his way out, and now hes talking a little bit of stuff. Thats the other thing that bothers me. When people like ryan and even my good friend trey gowdy says something that is reasonable, the press says oh, oh, oh, this is wonderful. But thats what theyre supposed to do. I mean, come on now. We have moved to a new sense of normal. And thats why the media, i tell every time i meet with the press, i tell them you have got to get this right. People will look at us 200 years from now and say what did you do . Did you stand by and say nothing . How did hitler get all the power that he got . Did people just stand by and say nothing and do nothing . Last but not least, let me say this, that Martin Luther king in one of his speeches said something i love. He said quite often what happens is that silence becomes betrayal. Silence becomes betrayal. I would say to the American People we cannot be silent. This is not the moment for silence. Do not be silent. Do whatever you have to do. Again, we need to approach this from every single way we can. And im sure i just believe that we will get through this. But its going to be tough times. Silence is betrayal. And Elijah Cummings, thank you so much. It is so great to hear your voice on this this morning. We appreciate it. Thank you, thank you. Still ahead so does all of this come down to base politics . The ap reports that the president sees this immigration fight as a Winning Culture war issue. Well dig into that. Plus, scott pruitt, betsy devos, Jeff Sessions, besides being in trumps cabinet, they have Something Else in common. They were recommended by the Heritage Foundation. We have new reporting on how the conservative think tank is helping staff the Trump Administration. 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These countries that we give tremendous foreign aid to in many cases, they send these people up and theyre not sending their finest. Does that sound familiar . Remember i made that speech and i was madly criticized, so terrible what he said. Turned out i was 100 right. Thats why i got elected. President trump there in his speech yesterday to a Small Business group in washington as republicans face daunting poll numbers heading into this years midterms. President trump is reportedly betting that a hardline stance on immigration will result in victory. According to the Associated Press trump has told advisers he believes he looks strong on the matter, suggesting that it would be a Winning Culture wor issue, much like his attacks on nfl players who take a knee for the national anthem. But as republican pollster whit airs told the New York Times somehow i dont think putting people in cages is likely to go well with suburban moms. Susan, as a republican, help me understand how this is playing across america, not just with the base, but theres also another part of america thats included in this process that votes as well. I cant imagine. Maybe im wrong. I dont think youre wrong. I think the quote you just read is spot on. Theres the congress is based on the swing seats, who will hold it . It all comes down to about 24 seats. Thats what we need to focus on. White suburban women will be out against donald trump to begin with. Weve seen that this past year in special lelections and the year prior. Why he thinks this is a winning issue, i dont know. I just happen to think its the president s natural default to be divisive and to go to these types of issues. Its part of who he is and his makeup, a fundamental fault that you cant necessarily change unless you really can put some poll numbers or something that will make him absolutely kind of freak out that hes losing. But speaking of poll numbers, the polls on this issue are terrible for him, 17, 20 approval rate for this, what hes doing with these children, versus 60 to 70 against him. On guns, its a 90, 10 issue. Not for his base. Thats the problem. Thats the point. Hes not running. Thats my question though. If you just appeal to your base, how do you win an election . Right now hes focused on well, he should be focused on 2018. Hes creating these issues that he thinks will turn out people. He has it in his mind that voter turnout, because he heard so much about it during the special elections for democrats, is essential. What he doesnt realize is, these issues do key up republicans. But they key up democrats even more. So even if republican turnout increases by 5 or 6 because of it, if democrat turnout increases 20 , well, thats a losing issue. Thats what he doesnt understand. Well, he does believe what he said right there, which is that this is his issue. Immigration got him elected. Its very instructive to hear him say this makes him look strong. The pictures were seeing of kids at those detention facilities, toddlers we showed this morning, thats his view of strength and being tough on immigration. And jonathan mueller, his new piece in the magazine titled all the right people, looks at the role the Heritage Foundation has played in helping staff the Trump Administration. Jonathan, great to see you. This is a fascinating piece. Thank you. The list of names, scott pruitt, betsy devos, Jeff Sessions. It goes on and on. It speaks to a little about the surprise, perhaps, that the Trump Campaign when they won on election day, maybe not being prepared to fill all the positions that needed to be f e filled. They had no idea how to staff a government. And of course governor christy was fired right after the election. All of his research dumped into the trash with great ceremony. But the Heritage Foundation had been preparing literally for years for this moment, had invested money and resources and time in getting ready to staff a Republican Administration with right wingers. They were ready to go. For people who dont know, what is the Heritage Foundation . Its a hard right conservative think tank thats been around since the early 1970s, rose from the Goldwater Campaign in 64. Has always been kind of staunchly right. Has always kind of held the hard right line. And has a history of calling out congressmen for not being right wing enough. And so at the time was run by jim demint, the tea party fire brand. And he was determined to be prepared to fill an administration. And lo and behold, he had this crazy opportunity. Besides the cabinet appointments it seems like on the judiciary, theyre beyond prepared, and that this administration is taking anyone that they send their way. Absolutely, yeah. I mean, in fact, the first in many ways heritage was a strange fit for trump because during the Campaign Trump didnt seem like a conservative at all. But that didnt stop the Heritage Foundation. And they had their first meeting with him back in march of 2016 when the republican establishment was still really shunning him. And that was to give him a list for the supreme court. And since then, basically heritage and the Federalist Society and other, you know, sort of right Wing Organization has been making all the judicial worth pointing out the Heritage Foundation saw much earlier than most people in the country that trump had a realistic shot, saw that he knew which buttons to push for the conservative base. Part of that goes back to the fact that jim demint was running the Heritage Foundation and he was very connected to the tea party. And so he could see that he had this appeal among a certain kind of base. Jonathan, thank you so much. Well be reading your new piece in the New York Times magazine. Thanks, jonathan. My pleasure. Scott pruitts scandals have been well documented, but in the words of george ccostanza suddenly a new contender has emerged. The title of swampiest member of the Trump Administration, thats next on morning joe. I mean wish i had time to take care of my portfolio, but. Well, what are you doing tomorrow 10am . Staff meeting. Noon . Eating. 3 45 . Uh, compliance training. 6 30 . Sams baseball practice. 8 30 . Tai chi. Yeah, so sounds relaxing. Alright, 9 53 . I usually make their lunches then, and i have a little vegan so wow, you are busy. Wouldnt it be great if you had investments that worked as hard as you do . Yeah. Introducing essential portfolios. The automated investing solution that lets you focus on your life. With my bladder leakage, the products ive tried just didnt fit right. They were very saggy. Its getting in the way of our camping trips. But with new sizes, depend fitflex is made for me. Introducing more sizes for better comfort. New depend fitflex underwear is guaranteed to be your best fit. Bp is taking safety to new heights. Using drones and robots offshore so engineers can stop potential problems before they start. Because safety is never being satisfied and always working to be better. Hi are you two getting along . Oh, yeah, yeah. [ hiss ] [ gasps ] [ birds chirping] no matter what you are theyre a perfect match. The new ipad and Xfinity Stream app. Hey guys, im home surprise i got a puppy. Add an ipad to select packages for just 5 a month for 24 months. Upgrade online now. Commerce secretary wilbur ross allegedly shorted stock just days after learning reporters were preparing a potentially negative story about his involvement with a kremlinlinked shipping firm. According to the New York Times, ross opened a short position in navigator three days after he was approached by times reporters about his relationship with the company. The stock price slid about 4 before ross closed his position, nearly two weeks after the Paradise Papers named him as a major investor. That transaction first reported by forbes has an estimated value between 100,000 and 250,000. Ross insists he was trying to divest from navigator and making money was not the goal of his short sale, and he disclosed the transaction to the government ethics office. Steve radnor . Well, i guess the last part is true, he disclosed it to the governments ethics office. President discloses everything he does, good, bad, or ugly. One thing they have in common, they lie about their net worth. He said he was a billionaire, which, in fact, hes much less than that. He gets a letter from the times saying they are going to write a story, likely to make the stock go down, negative story about navigator and he goes out and shorts the stock three days later and says i was trying to get out of it anyway. So, you know, you can make your own decision. Shorted it before the piece came out. Exactly. Between the time he was told they were writing about it and when the piece came out. It wasnt insider information. Might well be insider information. If the New York Times is the source . If you have material nonpublic information, you know something that is going to move a stock price that nobody else knows, then that can be even if its from a reporter . Even if its from a reporter. I still think epa scott pruitt, his dirty mattresses. Hand lotion. The level of conflict of interest throughout this administration and the sense that youre surrounded by some of them who resemble grifters every day is astounding. Look, its extraordinary that this administration allowed people to retain holdings in companies that no other administration in my experience, you had to divest everything. Go back and read the divestiture agreement with the government, shes a real billionaire, she complied, but in this administration it seems anything goes. Well, you have a president not willing to disclose his tax returns and whose children are making upwards of 82 million in one year and dont disclose it all either. Thats a problem. Its a very, very, very difficult time. Im having trouble kind of joshing about this. But this is from a president who came who said he was coming to washington to clean up the swamp. I know. And brought a bigger swamp than weve ever had in my lifetime. Believe it or not, thats the least of our problems. It is the least of our problems. But it actually shows that because of his actions on his financial matters, other members of his cabinet followed. Because of his policies, he requires loyalty, so we see the actions of the homeland secretary, so it does at every level we see this administration being corrupt and this president demanding full loyalty and doesnt want to know the truth. That was one of the most staggering displays of im not even sure how to describe it, but the dhs secretarys press briefing on trying to explain this policy. She didnt understand half of what she was saying, and the other half didnt appear to be true. Is that a Fair Assessment . Ive never seen anyone want their job as much as she did. Person who debates themselves. And shes celebrated in the west wing now. She was never on the good side of the president , she was not a trump person during the campaign, and with that performance two days ago, shes on the good side. He yelled at her in a Cabinet Meeting a couple weeks ago for not doing something about this. I dont want to joke about this at all, because i dont think its funny, but the tone deafness or even the trolling nature of her then going to a Mexican Restaurant, because you know her staff had to front that for her and make the reservation. And then, obviously, people get very upset, because thats exactly the kind of place where youre going to find people who are very upset about the policy. And the kind of thing the president said that a girl, good for you. And thats whats even more depressing. You know, there are women that he puts out to speak for him. And then there are women that he wont. And its all very frightening. Still ahead, well go live to both sides of the u. S. Mexico border for the latest on trumps zero tolerance policy. Plus, the president says the separations are temporary, but well hear from an immigration official who says they could be permanent. And what is congress doing about it all . Much more morning joe ahead. 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Your doctor should monitor your weight and may stop treatment. Other side effects include upper respiratory tract infection and headache. Tell your doctor about all the medicines you take and if youre pregnant or planning to be. Otezla. Show more of you. Good morning and welcome to morning joe. We begin with four words, tone deaf, callous, heartless. First, tone deaf. Here we have the secretary of Homeland Security choosing to eat at a Mexican Restaurant last night, where she was promptly heckled by protesters. We have that video for you and well show it to you later. Not sure why she thought that was the place to go after her lies and deceit about how children are treated at the border. Now to callous. Heres former White House Press Secretary Sean Spicer showing a picture of a champagne celebration last night at trump hotel in washington. How about heartless, corey lewandowski, when hearing of a child with down syndrome being forcibly separated from her parents. Look, i read today about a 10yearold girl with down syndrome who was taken from her mother and put in a cage. Womp, womp. How dare you. How dare you. How absolutely dare you, sir. Here are the children, torn from their families, caged by the american government. Babies sent to shelters. Mothers begging to keep their kids. Heres capitol hill, where members of congress are talking and debating, signing letters. Some fighting to end this heinous policy. Others defending it. And heres the president of the United States again claiming he is somehow not personally responsible for this policy that is ripping families apart. As a result of democratsupported loopholes in our federal laws, most illegal immigrant families and minors from Central America who arrive unlawfully at the border cannot be detained together or removed together, only released. These are crippling loopholes that cause family separation, which we dont want. With us this morning, we have msnbc contributor mike barnacle, analyst susan del percio. Are you at all closer to walking away from the party . Still holding on . Im Still Holding on, because there are people in my party willing to stand up for whats right. Morning joe economic analyst Steve Rattner. Capitol hill correspondent and host of kc dc, kasie hunt, and author of the soul of america, a battle were in right now, john meachem. Joe will be back tomorrow, so well have a lightning rod for k. C. And well enjoy him coming back and hearing his voice on all of this. In a moment, President Trumps meeting on capitol hill and all the politics surrounding this immigration battle, but first we think its important to update you on the scene at the southern border. A report overnight from the Associated Press attempts to answer a question that the Trump Administration has dodged for the last few days, where are the girls, and where are the young toddlers among Migrant Children separated from their families at the border . The a. P. Reports that babies and other very Young Children are being sent to at least three tender age shelters in south texas. Thats what they are called. According to the a. P. , lawyers and medical providers who have visited the Rio Grande Valley shelters described playrooms of crying, preschoolaged children in crisis. The report unconfirmed by msnbc says the government also plans to open a fourth shelter to house hundreds of young Migrant Children in houston. According to numbers from u. S. Customs and border protection, 2,235 families have been apprehended at the border between may 5th when the zero tolerance policy put out by the attorney general and the Trump Administration was put in place and june 9th. Among more than 4,500 family members were 2,342 children, who were then designated as unaccompanied. Yesterday, the former head of the u. S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement told nbcs Andrea Mitchell that some migrant family separations will end up being permanent. How are these families supposed to get back together . Dont forget just two weeks ago they lost track of 1500 kids inside the United States, now you have to keep track of the kids and the parents. I can tell you from experience its more difficult than it sounds. If they dont reunite these kids with their parents right away, what could happen is the kids will be stuck in the United States for years, and the parent will be down in honduras or guatemala with no idea where their children are and no meaningful way to reunite. Pictures are staggering. Politics from this on capitol hill, but i dont think anybody reporting on this i dont know whats going on at fox, but its hard. I couldnt even read the script, i was beginning to cry. Im not sure how anybody can defend this without feeling a pit in their stomach. Yeah. I think youre right. And you asked susan del percio whether she was thinking about leaving the party. Steve schmidt, who was been on the show many times, ran john mccains president ial campaign at 2 41 a. M. Tweeted hes leaving the Republican Party. That was overnight. Not just any republican, a leader in the party has renounced his membership in the Republican Party. There you go. So thats where some people are, but i think the reality is, youre going to listen to President Trump, the president can end this with a phone call, with a stroke of a pen, full stop, period, end of sentence. So the question, i guess, kasie hunt, is what to do with all this energy and outrage. Whats the productive way to change this . How do you fix this . They are trying on capitol hill and the house, trying in the senate to some extent. Chuck schumer says, though, this has to be done through the president , not through legislation. The reality, again, and i think it is important to underscore this every single time, and you just did, the president could change this by picking up the phone. This was an administrative policy change. Now, could congress in theory do something about it . Yes, but theres really no clear path forward. Democrats are arguing that, essentially, the president is holding these kids hostage and this is a repeat of what he did with dreamers, created a crisis, a vulnerable population, and used that as political leverage to turn around and push through the other immigration policies that he championed on the campaign trail. That is whats going on in the house, those two bills are much more sweeping. They are not narrow. They dont just deal with this question. There is listening to potentially address the family separation included in the bills, but they sharply curtail legal immigration, they change the rules for asking for asylum making it more difficult to do that. In the senate, the path is potentially different, but there are so many competing proposals. Democrats are saying, look, its a snake pit is what one aide said about negotiating with republicans on immigration. Congress hasnt been able to do anything about this in literally decades. They could add something very narrow to a mustpass defense spending bill thats on the floor this week. That seems to me to be the likeliest scenario where we get something small and narrow to deal with this and put an end to it, but the reality is, they are not acting right now on this. The political will, i will say, much, much different. What mika said at the top of the show about everybody being on the same page for the first time in, quite frankly from what i can remember, the entirety of the Trump Administration to date. People dont like this. They dont want this. Across the board. Republicans, democrats, but the problem is that, you know, its not clear they can get their act together and actually stop it. There were Standing Ovations and back slapping on capitol hill last night when President Trump went up there late yesterday, meeting with House Republicans for nearly 45 minutes. Speaker paul ryan began the closeddoor session by discussing the compromised immigration bill thats just been filed. President trump spoke briefly about immigration, then reportedly ran through a number of topics, including what he called the hoax russia investigation, north korea, cost of jet fighters, trade, and mocking recently defeated congressman mark sanford, who was not in the room, before the president returned to immigration. Sources in the room said trump said he is 1,000 with them to pass a sprawling immigration bill and told them the burden for getting citizenship would be significant and linked to the construction of the border wall. He said, quote, you have to work, work, work, then after ten, 12, maybe 13 years you get a chance to become a citizen. Trump went on. So youre talking 12, 13 years out and you dont even get a green card until the wall is built, so this is an incentive to get the wall built faster. Also saying the president addressed his controversy policy on Migrant Children reportedly saying, quote, weve got to take care of separation, its too nasty. Well, he could take care of it. Members say trump said he talked with his daughter ivanka about the images of children in cages and she asked him to find a way to put a stop to it. In his public remarks yesterday, the president continued to insist the responsibility rests with democrats, tweeting this, democrats are the problem, they dont care about crime and wanting Illegal Immigrants, no matter how bad they be, to pour into and infest our country like ms13. They cant win on their terrible policies, so they view them as potential voters. President then said this at an event in washington. As a result of democratsupported loopholes in our federal laws, most illegal immigrant families and minors from Central America who arrive unlawfully at the border cannot be detained together or removed together, only released. These are crippling loopholes that cause family separation. Which we dont want. I want to read Steve Schmidts tweet, actually. He says, 29 years and nine months ago i registered to vote and became a member of the Republican Party, which was founded in 1854 to oppose slavery and stand for the dignity of human life. Today i renounce my membership in the Republican Party. It is fully the party of trump. And, you know, i do ill just take my knowledge of how donald trump thinks and what i know about him, and i think there may have been some sort of strange back plan in his head, where maybe he would blame it on the democrats and then sign this away and be the hero to change it. Its too late. Its yours, youve done it. And there are babies who are hurting right now, and that wont end. And that trauma is permanent. This is a massive p. R. Fail, and as far as his daughter saying something to him, ivanka trump is counsel to the president , you need to step up. I know you wont. You need to step up and speak for yourself. But keep in mind the way trump works with the people close to him like ivanka and others, those people dont have to step up and take questions. They are too feckless, too stupid, or smart enough not to actually put themselves out there. They get protected by the inner circle, which is very small around this president. People like secretary nielsen, Sarah Huckabee sanders, sean spicer at one point, they are forced out there to make fools of themselves because they have no choice, they think. You do have a choice, and we need more people to step up. We are seeing more republicans, susan del percio. Theres a list, and its a sign of hope at a time where it really is very difficult to report on a story like this without shaking. And you have republican senators, some who are up for reelection, rick scott whos seeking the senate in florida, who again came out against this. You even have two republican governors both up for election from massachusetts and maryland, who withdraw the National Guard troops they had sent, so republicans are stepping up. What this is starting to seem like is a lot about charlottesville, an issue that has racial overtones, that is dividing the nation. The difference is, last time they had steve bannon to resign. That kind of blew over and let people go forward. I think donald trump is digging in, and what hes missing is this is bad politics, bad policy, and bad tv. Right. You know, mika, this is not well beyond politics. The soul, the character, and the definition of the america we know, the america that we grew up with, the america that the world became familiar with, is now being called into question by the actions of a single man, donald trump, and his associates. There are 286 members of the Republican Party serving in both the house and the senate. They were elected by individual citizens in their districts and in their states. Where are they . Susan, with all due respect, you say they are starting to step up and say they are muted. They are muted. Whats worse is this is a value decision. This is who we are as a valuebased decision. We saw the president with the g7 and now even just yesterday saying it costs too much. This is not financial, this is who we are as a nation, and i have i stand by this 1,000 . Shows who donald trump is. Goes back to when he said he didnt want people from shole countries and only wanted people from norway. Youre right, this is a time when americans, especially republicans, if they want to hold on to any sense of dignity, have to speak out. And i think were going to see what happens in the midterm elections and thats going to definitely change a lot of peoples opinions. Coming up, President Trump clearly has plenty on his plate, but hes finding time to take shots at germany and canada. Thats ahead on morning joe. Can you love wearing powerful sunscreen . Yes neutrogena® ultra sheer. Unbeatable protection helps prevent early skin aging and skin cancer with a clean feel. The best for your skin. Ultra sheer®. Neutrogena®. The Washington Post recently highlighted a study saying charts change hearts and minds better than words do. Easier to read than say. So, steve, go ahead, change our hearts and minds and tell us about the border crisis. Im not sure i can better than the pictures, which were so incredibly wrenching. Ill try to do better than words anyway. As usual, trump is filled with a number of falsehoods, starting with the claim the number of people crossing the border has exploded. What you can see what hes talking about is hes comparing whats happening this year in terms of Border Apprehensions to what happened last year in 2017, but what hes ignoring is the fact three other previous years the rate of apprehensions was roughly the same as now. If you take out last year as an aberration, theres really no particular change in the number of people trying to cross the border. In fact, this is also kind of a seasonal high, and generally this declines as the year wears on. So thats sort of lie number one that we can put to rest. The second question is, where does it stand relative to history . And if you go back in history, you can see that the number of border crossings in the last several years has been at the lowest level its been since 1971. If you go back to the year 2000, it was up over 1. 6 million, and so it is possible if you look at the little extrapolation we did here that the number of border crossings could be slightly higher this year than last year, but were bumping along for a variety of reasons. The financial crisis caused a lot of people from mexico to decide the u. S. Wasnt actually such a great place to come after all. Things in mexico notwithstanding some of what we saw there, but in the broader mexican economy have gotten better, there are more jobs, more things for people to do, so the number of people trying to cross the border has generally been trending down. Is any of that, steve, tied to policy . In other words, president obama, who President Trump accused of being weak on immigration and the border, it is the economy, yes, but is it something president obama did to bring about that sort of precipitous drop during his two terms . Actually, yes, in fact, i didnt show it in this graph, but if you looked at the number of Border Patrol agents assigned to the border, its going up sharply. Its down lately because of budget cuts, but it had been rising sharply. Yes, we did a lot more to enforce the border and, in fact, obama did consider policies like what trump is doing but rejected the idea of separating families, but he did step up the enforcement of the border of people trying to cross illegally. Lastly, lets deal with the question whether people who come here as trump said are rapists, murderers, carrying drugs, a few good people. Look at the record of immigrants who come to the country. So what you can see here is that Illegal Immigrants actually are incarcerated half the rate of nativeborn americans and legal immigrants are incarcerated at an even lower rate than that. So the whole notion were bringing in gang members and people who are going to rape, murder, and pillage our country is not born out by the facts. Coming up, live to the southern border for an update how the president s policy is playing on the ground. Were back in a moment with much more morning joe. [ roar ] [ heavy breathing ] [ scream ] rated pg13. When you barelyonto clip a passing car. Minor accidentno big deal, right . Wrong. Your Insurance Company is gonna raise your rate after the other car got a scratch so small you coulda fixed it with a pen. Maybe you should take that pen and use it to sign up with a different Insurance Company. For drivers with accident forgiveness, Liberty Mutual wont raise their rates because of their first accident. Liberty stands with you. Liberty mutual insurance. 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What guides me is ensuring that the public is going to be safer and that these forests can be sustained and enjoyed by the community in the future. Theresa may just came out against the policy. British Prime Minister says the pictures of children held in cages are deeply disturbing. This is wrong, not something we agree with, this is not the uks approach. This was my point when i was saying yesterday, the world is watching. The world is watching whats happening here. Outrage over the separation of parents and children has led to governors from at least eight states to announce they will not send their National Guard troops to the u. S. Mexico border. Marylands republican governor tweeted yesterday, until this policy of separating children from their families has been rescinded, maryland will not deploy any National Guard resources to the border. North carolinas democratic governor roy cooper also tweeted, the cruel policy of tearing children away from their parents requires a strong response. Im recalling the three members of the North Carolina National Guard from the border. Virginias governor, ralph northam, said recalled four troops and one helicopter. And Massachusetts Governor Charlie Baker rescinded his offer to send helicopters and personnel. New York Governor Andrew Cuomo announced monday the state would not deploy its National Guard, calling the administrations treatment of families a moral outrage. Meanwhile, cuomo announced yesterday that his state plans to file a multiagency lawsuit against the Trump Administration for violating the Constitutional Rights of imMigrant Children and their families who have been separated at the border. Meanwhile, attorney general Jeff Sessions coming under fire from members of his own church. A group of more than 600 United Methodist clergy and members filed a formal complaint against sessions. The charges include child abuse, immorality, racial discrimination. The complaint says sessions advocacy and actions have led to harm against thousands of vulnerable humans. Sessions has not publicly responded. And pope francis has weighed in on the Trump Administrations immigration policy. The pope telling reuters he supported recent statements by u. S. Catholic beneficiaishops wd the separations of children and families, quote, contrary to our Catholic Values and morals. We get a report from Stephanie Rhule in mccallen, mexico, and Gabe Gutierrez is just across the border from texas in mexico. Stephanie, well begin with you. Youre looking at how this policy is playing with evangelicals, a group thats long stood behind and supported President Trump. What are they saying about this . You know, they are somewhat split, willie. There is a new quinnipiac poll that says 66 of americans asked oppose the child separation policy, that sounds logical, but 55 of republicans, they support it, and within that 55 , you still have a large majority of evangelicals. I know you pointed it out a moment ago, franklin graham, who said he opposes this and some other evangelicals, but for the most part they stand with the president because they believe his ideology supports their overall values, and thats whats stunning. I want you to take a listen specifically to those right here in this community in mccallum. Blind faith is how you have to trut the lord. We have to put our faith in him. The lord and elected officials are two Different Things. Yes, but i dont believe any person is in any office that god has not allowed it to be there. He leads Trinity Baptist church in mccallen, texas. I do care about these kids. I just dont know what to do, but ive got to put my trust somewhere. I cant solve it, so im trying to believe the government will do that which is right, because they are ministers of god for righteousness. Mike jones, an evangelical christian from North Carolina questions whether the jarring images of children at Detention Centers are even real. I dont believe it. I think its all a big lie. Like i said, i dont think thats happening. I dont think that the people who are socalled being separated are what the news has portrayed them to be. Also in North Carolina, antioch Baptist Church pastor places the blame squarely on the parents. Who am i upset with . Its the parents. The parents who bring their children to the border to violate the law. But other prominent christians are publicly blaming the administration. More than 600 leaders and members of the United Methodist church signed a formal complaint against attorney general Jeff Sessions, a member of their church, who quoted the bible to defend the immigration policy. Accusing him, among others, of child abuse. And evangelical graham didnt mince words on the christian broadcast network. I think its disgraceful and terrible to see families ripped apart, and i dont support that one bit. And i blame the politicians for the last 20, 30 years that had allowed this to escalate to the point it is today. Pastor sutton said none of them speak for him or then else. Every Baptist Church is autonomous and independent. But for these christians, theres no question about standing by a president championing their ideology. What happened was millions and millions of people all seemed to wake up at the same time, and they begin to have a sense of nationalism. Out of that awakening, donald trump said all the things that the people wanted to hear. He believed them and hes true. Hes honest. Willie, i just want to share this one point with you, that last pastor that i spoke to, you would think here in mccallum he would be entrenched in this migrant crisis. He wasnt exactly up to speed. Its not because hes ill informed. Here in mcallen its not a crisis. Its an issue. I thought i was going to come down here and see people in the streets and it would be chi yachtic, this idea of migrants flooding in. Its just not the case. Its definitely an issue. This is a border area, they need to be careful with their relationship with mexico, they care about border security, but every store i walk by in almost every window theres a help wanted sign. The immigration issue is, there are more jobs than there are people, and the more people i talk to on the ground here, they are saying weve got to find a solution. So i just want to impress upon people at home, here in mcallen where its actually happening, there are not migrants that have overrun this town. There are not criminals who have stolen jobs. There are people that are trying to figure out the right path for immigration. Its very different than what youre hearing. Thats really important context and so interesting, steph, to hear the pastors put it in a context of politicians being agents of god, therefore, i implicitly trust them to do what is right. And, therefore, i implicitly tre decisions they are making, specifically on this issue now, are correct. As we pointed out a moment ago, pope francis disagrees with that assessment. He calls the policy immoral. Willie, to your exact point, it was that baptist pastor when he kept talking about morality, i was saying i brought up President Trump and his history and the fact that he lies, and he stopped me and said, but in the end, god wanted him to be president and its gods will, and we have to give the president the path. And he felt like many others, you dont criticize god, you shouldnt criticize our leaders, so for someone like me, i was shocked to hear that, but i certainly listened. So revealing. Stephanie rhule, thanks so much. Well let you go. Can i just make one point to you . The point that is pretty hypocritical for these pastors who talk so much about the most important thing is pro life, its stunning that they are willing to say that about unborn children, but they are not willing to consider these children who are being torn from their mothers and have no idea when theyll see them again. When you think about the welfare of a child, it should possibly never begin or end. As you pointed out in your piece, as well, many pastors and religious leaders coming out against this policy. See you in a few minutes. Top of the hour, 9 00, Gabe Gutierrez is on the mexican side of the border. Gabe, what are you seeing there . Hi there, willie. Migrant families here are waking up this morning, were here in mexico, the u. S. Side, brownsville, texas, is just across from there. Over there you can see some cbp agents. These are migrant families, some of whom have been waiting here for days. There you see a young child asleep. They spent the night here in a lengthy rainstorm overnight. This family that weve spoken with, they say theyve been here since at least sunday seeking asylum. The department of Homeland Security, they say these migrant families that want to come here to the ports of entry seeking asylum, they will not be separated from their families and they will be processed within 72 hours, but some of these families say, listen, they are just waiting longer than the 72 hours. And we spoke with another family that have been here since sunday, one mother with her young child, 3yearold son. We learned overnight she was taken in for processing, but again, this other family that weve been talking to has been here since sunday. Immigration advocates say that the Trump Administration is essentially setting up a difficult situation for these people, on the one hand telling them to come and apply for asylum here, but making them wait in difficult conditions somehow and thats why some of these families cross the border illegally, but immigration courts are overflowing here in parts of south texas. Certainly, this controversial crackdown making it difficult on both sides of the border right now. Gabe, just to be clear what were looking at behind you, those are people who are going through the process the right way, theyve applied from asylum and are waiting to hear back if they can cross in. The alternative would be to cross illegally and risk being apprehended and lose their child. Yeah, thats exactly right. We were talking with some of these mothers. They say, look, we dont want to cross over illegally. They say they are fleeing violence in Central America. The families weve been speaking with here in particular are from honduras. Some of them saying they are fleeing Gang Violence, one family say two of her husbands cousins have been killed, so shes trying to come over here. One other mother says she did try to come to the u. S. Once before, was deported, but decided to try again for fear of her familys safety, but they say, look, they are waiting here, they are trying to get in, but the cbp agents say theres no room, they are letting them in when they can, but its taking longer in some cases than the 72 hours dhs says the migrants are supposed to be waiting. Well be checking in all day, gabe, thank you. The American Medical Association has released a statement that reads in part, it is well known that childhood trauma and Adverse Childhood Experiences created by Inhumane Treatment often create negative Health Impacts that can last an individuals entire life span. Therefore, the ama believes strongly that in the absence of immediate physical or emotional threats to the childs well being, migrating children should not be separated from their parents or caregivers. Meanwhile, we have a new trump tweet. Moments ago, the fake news is not mentioning the safety and security of our country when talking about illegal immigration. Our immigration laws are the weakest and worst anywhere in the world, and the dems will do anything not to change them and to obstruct. Want open borders, which means crime. There he goes again. So, the pictures that weve been showing you, this is what the world is watching. The pope has spoken out. Theresa may has spoken out. Were diminishing our place in the world, tearing apart the fabric of the country, but even more importantly, were separating children from their mothers. Thats the bottom line. Thats Donald Trumps policy. This is nothing to do with the dems. This is nothing to do with congress, unless they want to act across the board and do something today to stop this, 100 senators, but this is what is brought to you by president donald j. Trump. And this is happening right now. Up next, some of the nations Top Tech Companies came out against the trump separation policy. Thats next on morning joe. At t gives you more for your thing. Your getting serious thing. That moving out of the friend zone, moving in together and getting two of everything thing. Those fur babies preparing you for real babies thing. That one for me, one for you, us together for the rest of everything. Buy one iphone 8 and get one iphone 8 on us. More for your thing. Thats our thing. Visit att dot com. Looking for a hotel that fits. Whoooo. Your budget . Tripadvisor now searches over. 200 sites to find you the. Hotel you want at the lowest price. Grazi, gino find a price that fits. Tripadvisor. 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But prevagen helps your brain with an ingredient originally discovered. In jellyfish. In clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve shortterm memory. Prevagen. The name to remember. The chancellor of germany has personally responded, as President Trump pushed bogus claims about crime in her country for a second day in a row. Yesterday trump tweeted that crime in germany is up 10 , plus officials do not want to report these crimes since migrants were accepted. Other countries are even worse. Be smart america. Speaking to reporters, german chancellor Angela Merkel cited figures showing a nearly 10 drop in crime nationwide, bringing it to the lowest level since 1992. The leader of the worlds fourth largest economy added, the interior ministry recently released the criminal statistics, and they speak for themselves. Were seeing small positive developments and we must, of course, continue to do more on the fight against crime. But think about that. That she has to respond to americas president lying about her country. Think about our place in the world. Yesterday, President Trump also took this swipe at canadians. And, by the way, canada, they like to talk. They are our great neighbor. They fought world war ii with us. We appreciate it. They fought world war i with us, and we appreciate it, but were protecting each other. There was a story two days ago in a major newspaper talking about People Living in canada coming into the United States and smuggling things back into canada, because the tariffs are so massive. The tariffs to get common items back into canada are so high, that they have to smuggle them in. They buy shoes and they wear them. They scuff them up. They make them sound old or look old. No. Were treated horribly. We can no longer be the stupid country. We want to be the smart country. Is it okay . Sounds like maybe hes got a hes losing his mind. Theres nothing to say. Theres nothing you can say. There are no words. How do you justify put this in context, there is none. So, apparently, the back reference here, well make it even odder for you, because it appears the president was referencing a recent opinion piece in the new york post. Trump seems to be talking about the writers anecdote about how her nephew once hid expensive italian shoes when returning to canada. We know he reads the new york post, he loves the new york papers, and apparently he only believes the media when its convenient to him and back slap his crazy story. And it would be funny, if it all wasnt so sad. Willie . So you have him attacking yesterday Canadian Shoe smugglers, lying about Angela Merkel, and theresa may the Prime Minister today condemning what shes seeing on the United States border with mexico. Three of our closest allies. Lets bring in cnbcs dom chu. How are the markets reacting to the trade tensions between the u. S. And china . I mean, its a sixday losing streak for the dow and arguably its the most important driver of whats happening in the markets, both here and abroad. That ongoing trade dispute between the u. S. And countries around the world, including canada, mexico, china, and, of course, members of the european union, developments on that escalation of trade conflicts with those countries has been the biggest driving force, arguably, in whats happening so far. Now, we have new news this morning, interesting on the Positive Side perhaps, this is according to the wall street journal. Its reporting talks between the u. S. And german automakers may have opened up the idea of ending german import tax on American Made cars, but in return they want the u. S. To drop the 25 tax on imported trucks and suvs and large vans. Of course, well be keeping a close eye on anything auto related on the heels of that report. Again, something to watch there. On the immigration front, a slate of high profile corporate chief executives have come out with very vocal statements about separating Migrant Children from their parents and the latest from Jpmorgan Chase ceo jamie dimon. In a report he referred people to a business round table statement that called the separation policies cruel and contrary to american values, adding that he strongly agrees with the statement and that his heart goes autoto affected families. Hes not the only one. Microsofts ceo, facebooks ceo, mark zuckerberg, tim cook, all weighing in on this particular issue, guys, as well. Back over to you. Dom chu, thanks. Up next, in addition to immigration, theres another issue thats languished for years on capitol hill without a solution. Gun reform. Our next guest, david hogg, is a leading voice on the issue, and he joins us straight ahead on morning joe. Have you smelled this new litter . No. Nobody has its unscented vo new tidy cats free clean unscented. Powerful odor control with activated charcoal. Free of dyes. Free of fragrances. Tidy cats free clean. When no scents makes sense. Where were changing withs . Contemporary makeovers. Then, use the ultimate power handshake, the upper hander with a double palm grab. Who has the upper hand now . Start winning today. Book now at lq. Com. Hey allergy muddlers are you one sneeze away from being voted out of the carpool . Try zyrtec® zyrtec® starts working hard at hour one and works twice as hard when you take it again the next day. Stick with zyrtec®. Muddle no more®. And try childrens zyrtec® for consistently powerful relief of your kids allergies. Lets put the usa over the nra. This is the start of the spring and the blossoming of our democracy. So, lets take this to our local legislators and lets take this to midterm elections as those policies will change as they come. I say we will not stop until every man, every woman, every child, and ever american can live without fear of gun violence. And that i say, no more. We can and we will change the world. That was parkland Florida Shooting survivor david hogg speaking for the march for our lives back on valentines day. Davids sister also was in the shooting but she lost four friends killed in the tragedy. The first counts of the shooting and the movements sparked in its aftermath, entitled never again. The proceeds of which will be donated to charity. Morgan and david hogg joins us. Good to see you both. Thank you. It seems that both of you, particularly, david, have become activists and political actors and i havent seen many people ask you how youre doing in the wake of none of us will imagine, god forbid have to imagine. How are you doing . 17 of your friends were killed and you were there. How are you feeling . Have you had time to grieve while youve been on the road . We have to, but as my sister says, we see these people as characters even when theyre on tv. The best thing i can say is imagine the person you hold the closest and love the most and imagine them being shot and killed. Thats what these people were to someone and many other people. Thats what happens every other day, in d. C. , since the beginning of the school year, in chicago, over 150 kids have been murdered on the streets under the age of 21. And we dont hear their voices. Oftentimes when im going out there and i may feel disrupted or just sad about whats going on, a lot of that comes from lobbying in congress and see the inaction of our politicians. And to take action, like, for example, paul ryan, if hes going to take any action to allow a vote on universal background checks. And i get so depressed when i go there. But then i go to different parts of d. C. And different areas where i met with people like zion kelly who spoke at the march, whose brother was killed. And i see the strength and love and compassion within them. And how they strive every day to fight through the gun violence and really work to save each other. Thats what we hope and how to change the future. What about for you, lauren, you lost four very close friends. How are you doing . Im doing good. But something that i talk about in the book for me and david and our friend, activism has become our therapy. Its one of the best ways i found to feel. While were on our road to change tour, being around our friends is much of our lives, weve become a family. Its something ive never really experienced outside of my own family. But we gained this bond that none of us should have had. But its the shared common experience that brings us so close to together. Whats your level, both of you, whats your thinking about the fact that the level of gun violence has reduced in a way the sense of shock about it . Within this country . And youre dealing with it, youve dealt with it as very few people have dealt with it. And yet, city by city, the sense of shock with mass murders, school shootings. Its there for an hour or two when its on tv, maybe half a day. And then we move on. Honestly, i think a lot of it may come down to the way the media covers these tragedies. Especially in communities of color and socioeconomical status. They say its Gang Violence. Zion who was walking home from d. C. His brother was shot and killed close to home. America, if you live on a block that has a gang on it, the media automatically assumes youre part of that gang even if youre not. A lot of the time when youre out there and youre just trying to make your community covered, people see it as hopeless and that you cant do anything. On friday night, when i saw what they do every friday on the south side of d. C. At st. Boniface church chicago. Sorry, chicago. Where they march for peace every friday night. Thats what gives me hope. And those people in these communities that weve gone to from ferguson, to d. C. , to chicago, i know this is going to change. Thats kind of what this book shows, too. America has to learn about empathy. You got to put yourself in these peoples shoes. They lost people. People that die every day in america are people just like you and me. Theyre kids like just everybody here was at one time. And theyre kids just like yours. And somebody has to look at that suffering and never be able to talk to them for the rest of their life. Thats why we wrote this book, to practice empathy. Thank you so much, both of, for continuing to fight for what is right. I know youve had doors slammed on you by members of congress in washington. And i know its been a very, very difficult experience just trying to get your message across, let alone everything, and we appreciate it. Youre always welcome here. Thank you. Final thoughts this morning, mike barnicle, start with you. Well, you know, to their point, we are living in a country today for the first time in my lifetime where we have a president of the United States who seeks actively on a daily basis to divide us. Rather than bring the country together. And its incredibly troubling. Incredibly depressing to think that we live with this each and every day. Despite all of the outrage were seeing on tv, despite all of the outrage we share, this is an issue, ill say again, the president does not mind. He doesnt mind this fight because he thinks it helps him win in 2018. He believes hes elected on the immigration issue. He feels like its a wedge issue like nfl kneeling for the national anthem. This is a fight hes happy to have. Well, and we know about him. I mean, there are some troops we have been able to dediscuss in almost a year and a half of covering this presidency. And also in the runup to the election. There are, and i will say this carefully, tendencies to be abrasive, or you could say racist. Bigoted tendencies, sexist tendencies, racist, a sexist, a bigot. Thats at the top. And then the question is whats happening around the top. And how does our democracy function. Were expecting others to step up. Tomorrow on the show, were going to do our best to look for solutions, to talk about solutions. To talk about what people can do. If people dont believe babys should be separated from their mothers, watch our show tomorrow morning. Well talk about what you can do, who you can call. Well talk about what legal aid organizations can do. What doctors can do. What members of the congress can do. We will pressure this president to pull back on this policy. That does it for us this morning. Stephanie ruhle picks