Transcripts For MSNBCW Morning Joe 20180129

Rothman, chair of africanamerican studies at Princeton University eddy glove jr. And shannon petty piece. Joe, so we start its only monday and we begin that way. Right. Well, yeah. And of course you didnt show the rest of the tape where we kept explaining to donald trump that putin assassinated political opponents and assassinated journalists just didnt seem to care. Didnt matter how far we pushed him. That was revealing. That was in december of 2015. I remember i think it was somebody over at the National Review said that may have been the most telling interview of the entire 2016 campaign. I think they were right. It was because it suggested there was something untoward in that relationship with putin. And that, of course, moves us forward not only to whats happening in russia, not only with franks remarkable reporting about corruption from Paul Manafort and how oligarchs and russians connected with manafort and manafort with the campaign, but also whats happening later on capitol hill and how trump has so corrupted washington, d. C. And so corrupted the republican establishment and so corrupted the conservative establishment that today you actually have on capitol hill republicans that are devin nunes and a few republicans, not conservatives because conservatives actually heed the warning of the Intel Community when the Intel Community says do not release that memo, it will be bad for the United States of america. But these same conservatives, of course, were concerned about Hillary Clinton and her server now suddenly are openly ignoring the advice of the Intel Community and ignoring the advice of Donald Trumps own Justice Department not to release a memo that is twisted with words and facts retched from their proper context to try to now we learn undercut republican Rod Rosenstein. Of course weve had evidence of these conspiracy theories hatched and these troubled Trump Supporters minds saying that a life time republican comey was antitrump despite the fact his memo helped elect Hillary Clinton that rosenstein, a life time republican is inadequately faithful and loyal to donald trump. And so now he must go. We saw it with bob mueller also another life time republican who because the closer, mika, the investigation gets to donald trump, the more that theres a republican that republicans in congress are talking about the Conspiracy Theory. In this tweet, Robert Mueller is a republican. Rod rosenstein a republican. Jeff sessions the republican. The senate run by republicans. The house run by republicans. The Justice Department that is telling the republicans not to release this memo run by Donald Trumps appointed republicans. And yet, mika, they move forward as recklessly as possible, as recklessly as the conspiracy theorists on tv. I want to say this before we launch, we have from time to time over the past several months been tough on Lindsey Graham for some of his tweets and some of his statements regarding donald trump. Lindsey has stood up like a guy who loves America First and his party second over the past several weeks talking about how this investigation needs to move forward, let the chips fall where they may and if donald trump is innocent then stay out of the way, lets get it done. I wonder if paul ryan will say that today. His handpicked intel chairperson Devin Nunes Threatens Americas National security, according to the Intel Community and according to the Justice Department, threatens Americas National security, by releasing information hand picked and misleading that americas own Intel Community and Donald Trumps own Justice Department is begging him not to release for the same of americas security. We shall see how this day unwinds, mika. Why not stand up and speak out . It just shouldnt be hard at this point. With just less than 40 hours until the state of the union, lawmakers seem ready to clash over this controversial memo about Justice Department and the fbi. The House Intelligence Committee meets today at 5 00 p. M. And byron york said they could vote on releasing the memo that was written by Staff Members for chairman devin nunes alleging abuse and bias from investigators in the Clinton Emails and trump russia probes. If approved, house rules call for the committee to await a decision by President Trump on whether he supports or opposes the release of the memo. The Washington Post reports that the president sought the release of the memo siding against his other Justice Department which called it extraordinary reckless in a letter to nunes on wednesday. On that same day, the Washington Post reports that white house chief of staff john kelly spoke twice with attorney general Jeff Sessions and kelly conveyed trumps desire to see the memo released. A Senior Administration official told the post that trump, quote, is inclined to have that released because it will shed light. Apparently all the rumors is that it will shed light, help investigators come to a conclusion. Yesterday republican members of congress, including House Majority leader Kevin Mccarthy, said they support its release. They have been doing their investigation. They found something out. Ive gone down. Ive read it. The committee voted this is the process. They voted to allow members to read it. They have the ability to vote to move it forward, then it would go to the executive branch. Why are they afraid to send this to the Justice Department for review . Arent we separate but coequal . You have the executive branch and the legislative branch. As the legislative branch looks at it, it will send stoit the executive branch beforehand. They have the approval whether to declassify and put it forward. Do you want the president to declassify this memo . Having read it, i think it is appropriate that the public has full view of it. You dont believe this is the president tampering with the investigation . How does this not look like it if he does . It has nothing to do with the president right now. It has everything to do with the president. I dont know if Kevin Mccarthy thinks that everybody is as stupid as some of the people in his caucus, but it has everything to do with it. This past week the New York Times reported that donald trump was desperate to fire Rod Rosenstein. He wants to fire Rod Rosenstein and put somebody else in Rod Rosensteins place who could then fire mueller because rosenstein is the one with the authority to do it. So the republicans set up a hit job. The president says he wants to sign off on the hit job. The Justice Department and the Intel Community says it would be extraordinarily reckless to do so. They say it would shed light on this investigation despite the fact everybody else says that this is misleading as getting information from, oh, i dont know, 1 million russian bots on twitter. Congratulations on your story, by the way. That was a great story yesterday. Yeah, that was incredible. But this is such a hand fisted setup to undermine Rod Rosenstein so they can fire him so he can appoint somebody who can fire mueller. Its all about treating the Justice Department as an extension of the trump tower security force, right . Thats how the president views the nations Law Enforcement agency. What we have been seeing here for the past few months is an effort to wind up and prepare to disengage from whatever the Mueller Probe finds, to discredit it and give the party its own set of reasons for backing away from it. We see that everywhere. By the way, chairman nunes i believe was taken off this investigation and made to recuse himself. What is he still doing out there . Doing his own investigation separate from the committee somehow or next door to it . He was suppose to be conflicted out of it. Its surprising to me that everyone has forgotten that a bit. It is absolutely noah, let me bring you in here. Its also i found it very revealing this weekend that you had a lot of trump people saying they didnt think he should testify and in part they said he couldnt testify because he cant be trusted to not perjure himself. It seems over the weekend theres been especially among conservatives people on the right and republicans this increased cacophony of voices demanding that donald trump not testify in front of bob mueller after, of course, donald trump said he would testify in front of bob mueller. Seems the panic is setting in. Yeah. Theres this notion that there would be perjury traps set for this president , but what we know from his past experience in depositions he has a habit of getting himself into trouble more so than walking into a trap. What i thought was something nick said earlier was unspooling this and getting to the meat of it, which is advocates are being coy about what theyre trying to do to this Mueller Probe but discrediting the warrant that was obtained in 2016 in order to get surveillance on this campaign would somehow discredit the Mueller Probe is sort of a leap from a to b. But thats what this memo is about. Its about undermining the notion that this probe was legitimate because it was obtained via this dossier, but from reports of what we know, there were multiple sources that fed into this report, including a papadopouloss drunken musings with australian officials and carter pages 2016 trip to moscow. Even if you were to say this warrant was fed by this dossier, you still have multiple other things supposedly supporting it that we dont really know, but i cant imagine are going to be discredited by the release of even just this memo. Yeah. Mika, thats what i dont understand about the republicans. Its one Conspiracy Theory after another. Every single Conspiracy Theory gets shot down. They end up looking like fools. They have to know devin nunes, again i will say to paul ryan. Why is devin nunes still in charge of the Intel Committee when he made an absolute fool of himself several months ago claiming he had information that he didnt have, going to the white house being spoon fed. Hes discredited himself. Hes recused himself from the Russian Investigation and yet here he is in the middle of the Russian Investigation. Paul ryan if youre listening or somebody in your staff is listening and i know they are, listen, the Intel Community, the Justice Department said it would be incredibly reckless to release this memo. Go back and see all the things you said about Hillary Clinton and her server, all the things i said about Hillary Clinton and her server, all the things republicans said about Hillary Clinton and her server and how she mistreated classified information. Hillary clinton never had a letter saying if you do x, then that will lead to y which will subvert American National security. Paul ryan, devin nunes, Kevin Mccarthy, House Republicans, you have been explicitly warned that what you do could be extraordinarily reckless. I know, mika, theyre all panicked. Even ken starr came out over the weekend and said he would consider the impeachment of donald trump because his continued lies about this investigation. You know, they have him dead to center, by the way. I wont say peoples names. I dont want to give them any more options. But people saying this weekend in opeds that donald trump hasnt committed obstruction and theres no way he should testify. It is a joke. Donald trump fired the fbi director because the fbi director would not ignore a federal crime that donald trump was aware of that his National Security adviser made. And after firing that fbi director, which every president has the right to do, but after firing that fbi director, donald trump admitted to nbc news and to the Russian Foreign minister and to russias ambassador to the United States, that he did so to kill the Russian Investigation and he said im now no longer under investigation and quotes to the russians, the pressure is off. Yep. Anybody that writes an oped and suggests that donald trump has not put himself directly in the target of an obstruction charge is just fooling themselves and some very, very stupid, illinformed readers because even the firing of bob mueller, the orderering of the firing of bob mueller, the argument is its not done until its done. It goes to intent. Theyre lying to people out there. Mika, a panic is sweeping across Trump Supporters on the right, sweeping across republicans, sweeping across some conservative publications and theyre humiliating themselves and i dont know why theyre doing it because truth will call them out a week from now. It makes no sense. I mean, dont put your hand on a hot stove. Its pretty obvious. Its as obvious as that at this point. The New York Times reports this morning that House Republicans controversial memo on the fbi and the Justice Department targets Deputy Attorney general Rod Rosenstein who has oversight of the special counsels russia probe. According to the times, three people familiar with the memo say it reveals rosenstein approved an application to extend surveillance of former Trump Campaign associate carter page shortly after taking office last spring. Nbc news has not confirmed this report. The renewal allegedly shows that the Justice Department under President Trump saw reason to believe page was acting a as a russian agent. It disclosed that page interacted with an undercover russian spy in 2013 but page denies. According to the washington pos post, the president told close advisers that the memo is starting to make people realize how the fbi and Mueller Probe are biased against him and that it could provide him with grounds for either firing rosenstein or forcing him to leave. Trump has privately derided rosenstein as the democrat from baltimore, however, as we pointed out, hes not a democrat. The Washington Post sited two people familiar with the president s comments on how he views the doj. Trump complained that he doesnt understand why he cant give orders to my guys what he sometimes calls the trump Justice Department. On saturday, white house special counsel ty cobb responded, there is an onslaught of false stories circulating in what appears to be a coordinated effort to distract and deflect from new revelations about already reported bias and corruption. Shannon, i want to ask you first of all if you feel from the folks in the white house that you talked to that the panic is setting in and what is the timeline as to when trump could possibly meet with muler . I think they know a storm, if not a storm, a circus is certainly coming with this interview with the president. That at this point its not a matter of if but it is when and under what terms. The lawyers have been spending weeks trying to get as much of the terms favorable to them to limit the scope, to have it in a comfortable setting that they like. There had been discussion about getting questions in writing, which i dont think is going to happen. Were probably a matter of weeks away. We could be talking two weeks rather than five weeks away. They have been having these talks for a while now since the first of the year. Theres a lot of lawyering going back and forth, but all the momentum is heading in that way. And then once we have that interview, if indeed on the obstruction end mueller is waiting for the president to be interviewed near the very end so he has all his information before he talks to the president , then it could just be another few weeks until mueller actually comes together and writes up his report on the obstruction end of this piece. So, really i spend a lot of time trying to figure out the timeline, but we really could be looking at having this obstruction end wrapped up in february or march timeline. Now, we reported last week that that is still only one end of muellers investigation. Obstruction. There are still other pieces of this investigation that will go on. But it does look like he is nearing reaching some conclusion on obstruction. Ill just throw in to get to the rosenstein point, rosenstein is a lot more important than people realize here because it is very possible that rosenstein will be the one who determines how the information that mueller reaches is conveyed if it is sent to congress, if it is released public, if there are charges. A lot of this is going to end up in rosensteins lap. Joe, were looking at weeks. Yeah. Of course because rosenstein said that mueller is doing a great job, doing a fine job. Theres no reason to fire him. He has time and time again enraged donald trump so Kevin Mccarthy, paul ryan, devin nunes are doing trumps bidding. They want to release a memo and try to smear with selected information republican Rod Rosenstein and then allow donald trump to try to push him aside or fire him so they can fire mueller. We see what youre doing. Its not really that clever. You really i mean, its kind of like the sham sham. Its too obvious. You have to do a better job with sort of the bait and switch because we know what youre doing, paul ryan. We know what youre doing Kevin Mccarthy. We know what youre doing, devin nunes, while youre still there. We have to ask paul ryan. Mike allen, what is happening . Its fascinating donald trump and his lawyers have been saying hes going to talk, going to cooperate with the investigation and going to let mueller talk to him. And suddenly this weekend its as if everybody on fox news and in right wing media and in republican circles were seized with this sense of panic that they suddenly realized that donald trump has been a liar is the only word that can be used for 40 years and that he just cant help himself. He lies all the time. And now theyre worried about the perjury trap and everybody is running for the exits. Saying oh, no, no, no he cant be interviewed. What is the current state . Is he still moving towards being interviewed by mueller or is mueller going to have to subpoena him . Hes not moving in that direction. Joe, two pieces of reporting about that. One, when the president came out and after maybe he said, oh, im happy to talk to mueller, there was a freak out in the west wing. Forgot the conservative media, specifically among the president s lawyers. They were not there. They are not there. And they are reporting that many people around the president believe he is, as you were suggesting slightly different word, incapable of telling story that he can stick to and that they know will be accurate. We know President Trump ill say it for you, incapable of telling the truth. Sometimes he just lies for the sport of it and you can look at every interview he does. He just wanders in and out of reality. We know he creates his own reality. People talked about the magic crayon. We know he doesnt stick to a particular story. He doesnt like to prep. And going into a federal investigation, those are things that you have to do. So, were told that his lawyers have put the brakes on this and as shannon suggested, weeks of conversations ahead. We think it will be late february before they figure out what theyre going to recommend to the special counsel, but in the meanwhile in the west wing you have this perjury panic. People know that this could well end. Your thoughts especially since the president has been so overt with what hes been doing and he was overt at the top of the show about his feelings about foreign leaders and race every step of the way. In some ways you could say people knew who they were voting for. Oh, yeah. But this is bizarre overall. To be in a political context where republicans are going after the Justice Department and the fbi. For me this makes no sense in that sense. Its bizarreo world. Theres a convergence of two things happening in my mind. One, theres trumps legitimate fears and paranoia converging with what once was a fringe view that the deep state threatened liberty. People we associated in oregon or washington. Now thats at the center of the Republican Party. You have an interesting part. Its legitimate fears the Mueller Investigation is closing in on him. You get is nunes and the intelligence committee, republicans trying to release a memo to undermine the Justice Department and the fbi. I think actually nobody prepared for such a compliant congress. This is the part of the equation that i find vexing. Right. Lets be honest, trump is not alone in this crisis. Theres a whole bunch of folks, paul ryan, Mitch Mcconnell and other republicans. Im stunned at the complicity. Still ahead on morning joe, Hillary Clinton makes a cameo at the grammys and nikki haley didnt like it one bit and what the u. S. Ambassador said afterwards on twitter. Plus, two big stories on russian influence on Paul Manaforts outreach to oligarchs to Donald Trumps questionable real estate deals. We follow the money straight ahead on morning joe. When this bell rings. It starts a chain reaction. Thats heard throughout the connected business world. At t Network Security helps protect business, from the largest Financial Markets to the smallest transactions, by sensing cyberattacks in near real time and automatically deploying countermeasures. Keeping the world of business connected and protected. Thats the power of and. Let office depot® officemax take care of you. This week all dell pcs are up to twenty five percent off save even more when you purchase a dell monitor. And make sure you protect your investment. Office depot® officemax. Officedepot. Com most people would throw in the towel and order delivery. But you have a recipe for redemption. With blue apron, any night is a chance to see what cooking can do. Im the one clocking in when youre clocking out. Sensing your every move and automatically adjusting to help you stay effortlessly comfortable. I can also help with this. Does your bed do that . Oh. I dont actually talk. Though im smart enough to. Im the new sleep number 360 smart bed. Lets meet at a sleep number store. When this guy got a flat tire in the middle of the night, so he got home safe. Yeah, my dad says our insurance doesnt have that. What . you can leave worry behind when liberty stands with you™. Liberty mutual insurance. Did any of you guys read that oped piece about honey, no. What article are you talking about . The one about aziz ansari . I think that some women careful. Or rather some men have a proclivity careful. Help me. If she wanted to leave oh, no. She could have just oh, no. Left. Cant we just go back to the dog . We were happy when we were talking about the dog. Honey, the time for talking about the dog are over. We are in a post babe. Net y universe and we have to finish what we started. Okay. Consent. Past. Dam it. I think were forgetting about the way this interwith the issue of. Oh god, oh god. Race. No that was. What a skit. Watch it. Watch it. Careful. Why couldnt she just walk dont no. So mika, to say that speech codes have been laid down across this entire conversation would be an understatement. What do you think of that skit . I loved it. I thought it was fantastic on many levels but also a little bit because 99 of all joking is true, it touched on the sad truth of the conversation as we work to support a movement in the right direction. It is very difficult to have an honest conversation. Its still very black and white. And if you try to go in the middle, you get skewered. I often hear after careful. Events like trayvon martin, we should have an honest conversation about race, well, nobody wants to have an honest conversation about race because every time you have an honest conversation about race you Say Something that offends something. You would Say Something that offends a certain segment of people. I would Say Something that would offend and we were both on the same side but just trying to flesh out these issues. And so often people say, oh, we need they dont want an honest conversation because theres twitter. There are bloggers who will go after you and try to destroy you the second you break from whatever the orthodoxy is of metoo conversations or race conversations. And weve seen it here. Yeah, its always difficult to have these sorts of conversations, joe, particularly when sometimes i think were absolutely right. Folks we want to dance and we have to be careful because people are afraid that youre going to step on toes or youre going to offend. But sometimes people try to hide behind the notion of honest conversations to traffic innoxious views. So, sometimes honesty with actually serves as protection for the actual views that are offending people. But, but, eddy, if somebody is a bigot, i want to know. Let them say it. If someone is a misogynist, i want to know. Let them put that out there and then we can have an honest conversation about this person having offensive views or that person trying to sort its just, i dont know, theres so much fear that grips any conversation about race and now, mika, as that skit showed yeah. So much fear in this conversation. Its interesting that you now have comedians that are on the forefront of starting to talk about this whether its saturday night live or Dave Chappelle who made headlines by really going there in a way that you just couldnt go there in polite society. Yeah. Im sure offending people, but thats what Dave Chappelle has done for quite some time, but having the conversation. Youve said this nonstop. We have got to have an honest conversation and we cant throw people overboard because they Say Something that offends us. We have to walk through that and keep talking and get this right. Because ultimately metoo is about leveling the Playing Field and creating equality between men and women so women have to have a strong voice that they are able to use. And they need to be paid equally. I mean, these are basics. But you cant get there this way at the rate its going where theres sort of like a steam roller through the conversation and no one is allowed to say anything because ultimately you want to hire really good men who are good on a moral level and add value on a business level and really good women, too. And we havent talked about that part. Weve only talked about women as perfect victims. And its much more complicated. Ive had incredible conversations with women and men over dinner tables where weve been amazingly honest about how complicated this really is. But you try and say it in a public forum and, boy, you get burned at the stake in a way that almost feels like were back in time. Well, the reason that that dinner time conversation rang such a bell with all of us is that this is a corner that no one can see around. People dont know where this is going. So with gay marriage, we knew where that was headed. With race, we know where we should be. Exactly. But with this, nobody knows what the safe place or sensible place will be. Nobody knows what the orthodoxy is going to be. And men are not the only aggressors. Men are not the only people with bad intentions. Men are not the only people who play dirty. They do have certain powers we need to address, level the Playing Field. Thats where it goes ultimately. I find that the conversations about race and gender and sexism have this quality where the stakes are too high in some ways and the conversation is thats constricted. We have to have much more honest conversations with a slightly lower temperature so that we can actually talk about some of the real truths that are happening. I think with donald trump everything is ratcheted up. But its very clear to me that he won in part because theres a segment of people who hold pretty noxious views who are tired of not being able to speak them out loud, to eddys point, and they love that he went out and said, yeah, those countries are terrible countries, shole countries. And they think he is speaking the truth and being honest. You can be very honest about something and be totally dishonest about it at the same time. The flip side of that is also why people like barry weiss are so important which is i believe the oped they were referring to in that skit, unafraid to draw fire and advance ideas that some people think are dangerous. Shes very brave. Mika, thats an important point. Barry weiss caught a lot of flakt with the New York Times by, i think, weeks and weeks ago before anybody else would say this, i think she said given the choice between a witch hunt and due process ill take due process. And she was one of the first to say that. Again, shes trying to have an honest conversation. Anybody who does, mika, they get hammered, but also they move the conversation forward, which is something that barrys been doing. Yeah. Great writer at the new yorker has been doing that as well and several others. Its treacherous. We have to go through this in order to get to the other side. Coming up, Hillary Clinton tries to explain her handling of a staffer accused of Sexual Misconduct during her first president ial run. Well dig into that. Plus, jayz collides with the president over the issue of race. Careful. Were going to play those comments straight ahead on morning joe. Well be right back. New banquet mega bowls, piled high with creamy mashed potatoes, corn, and shredded cheese under a savory blanket of gravy. But thats not all, because we topped it with crispy hunks of proteinpacked chicken. Now thats mega. Why create something this extravagant . Or make a back seat that feels nothing like a back seat . Why give it every feature you could want, along with a few you didnt know you needed . Its simple. You can build a car, or you can build a cadillac. Come in now for this exceptional offer on the cadillac ct6. Get this lowmileage lease on this 2018 cadillac ct6 from around 549 per month. Visit your local cadillac dealer. Its disappointing and its hurtful. It really is hurtful more so. Like everyone feels anger, but after the anger is really hurt because you are looking down on a whole population of people and youre so misinformed because these places have Beautiful People and have beautiful everything. And its just like this is the leader of the free world speaking like this. You dont take the trash out. You just keep spraying whatever over it to make it acceptable. And then, you know, as those things grow, you create a super bug. Then now we have donald trump, the super bug. This is not about money at the end of the day. Money is not doesnt equate to happiness. It doesnt. Youre missing the whole point. You treat people like human beings. And then thats the main point. You cant treat someone like goes back to the whole thing. Youre going to treat me really bad and pay me well. Its not going to lead to happiness. Hip hop mogul jayz speaking with cnn. President trump fired back, somebody inform jayz because of my policies black unemployment is just reported to be at the lowest rate ever recorded. He took cred for the black unemployment numbers. I dont know where to begin. Well, i think the best place to begin and i posted a chart this weekend. I dont know if our control room got it. Black unemployment records lows thanks to massive declining trends that started in 2010 congratulations to barack obama. You look at the peek of the number, it was right as barack obama had gotten into office. And you see that Straight Line down, that 7 8 of that is during the obama presidency. Yeah, donald trump, eddy, cant just take credit for that because its a declining number that was shooting straight down. Yeah, no, he cant take credit for it. One of the things thats so ironic about his innovation here is we see the underlying inequality in the labor market. You still see, right, the fundamental structural imbalance in the labor market. Donald trump to invoke the black unemployment numbers. Look at my black friend, i have one. Its terrible. The guy has like sensibilities of someone came of age in the 1940s and 1950s, as if that appeal was somehow would vindicate him of any racist views. Look, black unemployment is low under my administration, as if that absolves of racist statement and sentiment. He cant take credit, a. And b, it doesnt help him at all, joe. C, the gap between black and white, thats what he should be pointing to where we have to go. What do we need to do, still. Yeah. Nick confessore, though, it is going to be interesting to see what happens over the next two or three years. You dont turn an economy around immediately. There are some things that donald trump can take credit for. Consumer confidence is high. The stock market is high. It was going up. Its continued to go up, though, in large part because of the tax cuts, because him slashing a lot of regulations that barack obama put in place. So he can take were not saying he cant take credit for anything. He can take credit for the hire segments of the society. Jobs, wage growth, we wont know what his policies do for a couple years, are we . Its certainly possible at the end of this term he runs for eare election, high stock market and job growth and blooming economy. Were not going to know and were also not going to be able to see wage growth is really the key part of this, right . These onetime bonuses from all these companies are great. Its great to get 1,000 bucks in the mail. Its a lot better to get a raise. And companies hate giving raises. People are seeing wage growth over time, thats very good news for the president. Yeah, absolutely. That will be great news. And these quick headlines i said it last week, somebody getting a bonus here, somebody getting a bonus there, thats a oneshot deal. Thats what we saw last year in carrier in indiana, a year later were seeing actually a lot more firings. Well see a year from now if they are giving people raises if jobs are coming back to america, if more and more companies are bringing their money back to the United States of america, donald trump can and should take credit for that. Republicans can and should take credit for that. Its too early to tell now. Really quickly we talked about barry weiss last segment. Also, its marcia guessen at the new yorker that weve been talking about who has done an amazing job having an honest conversation and bringing it full debate. And also, zanib who we had on our show several times also been really important voice. This is a conversation that obviously we have to continue. Well, theyre honest voices and its a difficult time. We appreciate their points of view and putting them on the table. Still ahead, Nick Confessore takes us through the new reporting on the social media black market and the struggle of Companies Like twitter, facebook to contain it that story and Andrea Mitchell will join the conversation. Were back in a moment. This is the story of Green Mountain Coffee Roasters dark magic told in the time it takes to brew your cup. First, we head to vermont. And go to our coffee shop. And meet dave. Hey. Why is dark magic so spellbindingly good, he asks . Let me show you. Lets go. So we climb. Hike. See a bear. Woah. Reach the top. Dave says dark magic is a bold blend of coffee with rich flavors of uganda, sumatra, colombia and other parts of south america. Like these mountains, each amazing on their own. But together . Magical. All, for a smoother tasting cup of coffee. Green mountain Coffee Roasters packed with goodness. Wiback like it could used to . Neutrogena hydro boost water gel. With hyaluronic acid it plumps skin cells with intense hydration and locks it in. For supple, hydrated skin. Hydro boost. From neutrogena its ok that everyone ignores its fine. Drive. Because i get a safe driving bonus check every six months im accident free. And i dont share it with mom right, mom . Righttt. Safe driving bonus checks. Only from allstate. Switching to allstate is worth it. So, nick, you wrote a fascinating article in the New York Times yesterday. Of course, everybody immediately went to the celebrities to see which celebrities were buying but when you get past that, the more important part of it is actually something i saw in another i think it might have been a times article where big corporations are now realizing that the reality they see on social media is not actually a consumer reality and they shouldnt respond so quickly to outrage there. It is an alternate reality, isnt it . The real take away is that when you see your facebook feed or twitter feed what you are seeing is a curated reality by these platforms and theres all these actors out there bot makers and bot designers who have altered the reality and learned how to hack those platforms and affect what you see. What were reporting here is that one tiny company in florida that no one has ever heard of has put 200 million fake follows and millions of fake tweets and retweets into circulation on this one platform and if theyre doing it, there are dozens and dozens of other competitors, criminal syndicates doing it and governments doing it and theyre building bots, fake people online, and theyre often doing it by stealing the identities of real people online. So there could be a fake Joe Scarborough out there, although it would be harder to fake that because youre well known. Mostly its people who are less well known whose pictures and hometowns are being ripped off and turned into bots, including some minors that we found, and their identities are being sold and resold on to a gray market where, you know, celebrities buy them and foreign stars buy them and Companies Buy them. Wow. Wow. And mika its not just on twitter. As we said as i tweeted yesterday, we have this problem with instagram where i was just thinking. Our children, nephews, nieces, cousins, et cetera, et cetera, its constant fake people get their pictures, make fake accounts and just start phishing. Its really frightening out there. Its dangerous and i think its certainly changed the landscape in terms of what exactly is the business transaction thats happening if a star is using their following. Well continue this conversation so you can use that word later, eddie. Well, we did we do need to continue this conversation because peoples twitter feeds, public figures look at their twitter feeds and actually have led in the past that it impact what is they do. They shouldnt. Right. They shouldnt because its like spam email most of the time. If you can be verified and youre in congress be verified and look at your verified responses because so often i had it happen a couple weeks ago, you see a thousand negative things, you know that its theyre spamming you, its bots. Its an imperfect landscape, thats for sure. Coming up, the Washington Posts robert costa joins us with his story about steve wynn resigning amid Sexual Harassment allegations. Plus, the president s legal team wonders if they should delay, limit the scope or avoid all together a meeting with Robert Mueller. Morning joe is coming right back. [ keyboard clacking ] [ click, keyboard clacking ] good questions lead to good answers. Our advisors can help you find both. Talk to one today and see why were bullish on the future. Yours. Talk to one today and see why were bullish on the future. I just want to find a used car start at the new carfax. Com show me used trucks with one owner. Pretty cool. [laughs] ah. Ahem. Show me the carfax. Start your used car search at the allnew carfax. Com. But some of us make somethinge make sommuch more. Dinner. Mom would be proud. With blue apron, any night is a chance to see what cooking can do. Luckily, office depot®not officemax® is hereeart. To take care of you. Taking care of business with print Services Done right. On time. Guaranteed expert tech support. And this week all dell pcs are up to twenty five percent off save even more when you purchase a dell monitor. And make sure you protect your investment. Office depot® officemax. Officedepot. Com taking care of business it is i, george w. Bush, and you might remember the w stands for whazzup . I dont know if youve read the news lately, i certainly have not. A lot of people are saying i wish george w. Bush were my president right now. So i just want to take a minute and remind you guys that i was really bad. [ laughter ] donald trump thinks the media hates him . One time an iraqi reporter threw an actual shoe at me. He took it off his foot, lobbed it straight at my noggin. Then he gathered himself, took off the other one and tried it again. But you know what they say shoe me once, shoes on you. [ laughter ] shoe me twice, im keeping those shoes. Oh, my gosh. Welcome back to morning joe, its monday, january 29. With us we have political reporter for the New York Times Nick Confessore. Associate editor for commentary magazine noah rothman. Chair of the department after africanamerican studies at princeton, university, eddie glaude, jr. , and joining the conversation nbc news chief Foreign Affairs correspondent and host of Andrea Mitchell reports, Andrea Mitchell. Also with us, columnist for the Washington Post jgeorge will and political reporter for the Washington Post, robert costa. Great group this morning, joe. You know, mika, some of trumps biggest sycophant this is weekend have been very excited about whats happening today. For those just waking up and that havent followed those sycophants twitter feeds or see what theyve been saying on their Cable News Network, there is this afternoon a vote. Devin nunes who has before recused himself from the Russian Investigation is somehow in the middle of the Russian Investigation again despite making a fool out of himself claiming he had information on unmasking only to go over to the white house to get information from the white house and then give that information at a press conference later which was incomplete and mislead iing. Well, today they have a new target, if reports are correct, they are trying to undermine Rod Rosenstein because the president wants to fire Rod Rosenstein, the New York Times reports, because Rod Rosenstein will not help him continue to obstruct the investigation of Robert Mueller and fire Robert Mueller. So this is at the end of the day all about paul ryan and Kevin Mccarthy engaging directly or indirectly in a political obstruction of justice attempt at an independent counsel and they are using devin nunes to do that. Of course, devin nunes is where he is because paul ryan put him there and paul ryan can stop it today if he wanted to. But these same republicans who were so concerned about Hillary Clintons misuse of classified information and talked about it for a year and a half, wrote about it for a year and a half, rattled on about it for a year and a half, couldnt to rattle on about it on their Cable News Network so they can avoid donald trump firing fbi directors and committing obstruction of justice, theyre now ignoring our Intel Community and Donald Trumps own Justice Department saying that it would be extraordinarily reckless to release a memo that is cherry picked and misleading and false and as noah rothman suggested, at the end of the day wont even accomplish what these conspiracy theorists want to accomplish. This is just the latest in a long line of twisted realities that they are molding into a Conspiracy Theory that they are using to desperately try to save donald trump and it just wont work. Why do you align yourself with someone who has publicly proven to lie and, wow, the list could go on and on. This doesnt end well it also doesnt seem to be a very good moral choice. Lawmakers seem ready to clash, though, over a controversial memo about the Justice Department and the fbi. The House Intelligence Committee meets today at 5 00 and byron york of the Washington Examiner reports they could vote on releasing the memo which was written by Staff Members for chairman devin nunes based on classified information alleging abuse and bias from investigators in the Clinton Emails and trump russia probes. If approved, house rules call for the committee to await a decision by President Trump on whether he supports or opposes release of the memo. The Washington Post reports the president sought the release of the memo siding against his own Justice Department which called the release of the memo without prior review extraordinarily reckless in a letter to nunes on wednesday on that same day. Chief of staff john kelly said he wanted it released. A senior official told the post that trump is inclined to have that released just because it will shed light, apparently all the rumors are that it will shed light and help investigators come to a conclusion and probably the conclusion he wants, joe. Well, a halfbaked conclusion. Again, the Justice Department, the fbi, others know that this is cherry picked. Its misleading. They are now trying to smear the name of Rod Rosenstein, republican, just like they have tried to smear the name of james comey, life long republican who until recently helped elect donald trump with his memo ten days before the election. Bob costa, first question, why is devin nunes still involved so much in a russian probe where he supposedly recused himself, why is he still involved in it . Secondly, will paul ryan really allow this Intel Community to move forward and release a memo that the russians want released, that russia bots want released but that but that Donald Trumps own Justice Department says would be extraordinarily reckless . Well, to answer your ryan question, think about House Majority leader Kevin Mccarthy on sunday saying when he was asked about all the efforts to protect the Mueller Investigation he said its not yet needed to have any kind of protective measure for that investigation. Why does he say that . Because as the number two in the house and ryan the speaker knows this as well, theres a growing appetite among House Republicans im talking to each day who have read this memo privately, who want to see it moved forward. And there is some worry among the republican leader shship an this could cause a crisis. These republicans right now, today, this morning, are talking about if this memo is release there had should be a major removal of top people at the Justice Department and you could have a real crisis in the congress and in the country if the Republican Party is saying this demands a removal of top people at justice and democrats, meanwhile, say this is a cherrypicked memo, its nonsense, all as the Mueller Investigation moves forward. Youll have a political war. Andrea, im not so sure that its going to be between republicans and democrats. Im not hearing a lot of republican senators being as reckless as their counterparts in the house. Theyre not. But you also do not hear them suggesting that if mueller were fired or rosenstein, which could be more significant because he is overseeing muellers investigation, that they would take action. Its a real softening of the spine in the senate as well but theyre not commenting on nunes and this memo at all. Theyre considering it a house probl problem. And nunes was cleared on that unmasking probe so that gave him the leeway, he believes and his supporters, to jump right back in. He never stopped issuing subpoenas and interfering with the probe according to critics on the House Intelligence Committee and this has destroyed the credibility of the House Intelligence Committee. The fact that senators warner and burr are working so closely together on the senate side for the most part has at least preserved that committee. But the House Intelligence Committee frankly is a joke despite the efforts of adam schiff, swallow and others to preserve their investigative work. And george will, we understand donald trump is a remarkably ignorant man when it comes to the workings of washington, d. C. And checks and balances and but you wonder how a president can talk about as the Washington Post reported this weekend his Justice Department, trumps Justice Department, why cant may guys at the Justice Department do what i tell them to do . Where is paul ryan . Where is Kevin Mccarthy . Where are members of the Judiciary Committee who understand that this is a dangerous, ignorant view of how american Law Enforcement works . The famous episode when Lyndon Johnson was about to fly off somewhere and he got to the airport and an aide said your helicopter is over there, sir. And he said theyre all my helicopters, son. Thats the way president s think. In this case it seems to me if you have a unitary view of the presidency then the Justice Department serves at his pleasure and to carry out his duty to faithfully see the laws are executed. However, my experience in washington is that when you reach a certain Critical Mass of interest in something thats secret, its not going to stay secret for very long. The nixon tapes come to mind. It was a long time between when mr. Butterfield revealed the existence of the tapes during the urban Committee Hearings and when they came out, but come out they did. And in this case, if this memo exists and if this memo is so flagrantly an exercise in cherry picking, theres something to be said for letting it out and demonstrating that it was cherry picked and examining the motives of those who did the cherry picking. Pat moynihan, who wrote a whole book on secrecy, said the thing about secrecy is its a regulation. Most regulations tell us what we cannot do, secrecy tells us what we cannot know and this seems to be a case where were reaching the point where theres a certain level of speculation that can only be quenched by looking at the document in the bright light of day. Perhaps that is the case, noah rothman, but it seems these republicans keep making the same mistake that Newt Gingrich made become during the socalled gingrich revolution. He was always great with the first move, he never had a seconds move, though. He never figured out that the democrats were going to respond to his first move. Devin nunes and the republicans put this out after the Justice Department set toward extraordinarily reckless. George will is right. Theyll be cut off at the knees again, theyll be made to look like fools again and theyll be made to look like fools who went against the Justice Departments recommendation. When thare they going to learn these conspiracy theories always blow up in their face . Youve touched on the most tragic element of all of this. The first year of the Trump Presidency from the perspective of a conservative. Advocates for good, limited governance only have so many credible advocates on their side and they have sacrificed so much of that credibility chasing conspiracy theories from voter fraud to the inauguration the size of the inauguration, the seth rich assassination attempt, supposedly, and now issues like unmasking and fisa abuse. These are real issues of Good Governance and they shouldnt be corrupted by the appearance of politics but we saw republicans jumping down this text message rabbit hole over the course of last week where people like Bob Goodlatte are saying conspiracy was alleged here. If you cant support that, you sacrifice your credibility on whos going to be listening to you when youre raising very valid issues of Good Governance. Thats a terrible tragedy from the perspective of a conservative. And Andrea Mitchell, the democrats want to release their own countermemo. If theyre not allowed to do that, how can that not be seen as blatantly partisan . Where does that stand . It makes no sense. The concern here is that this memo, supposedly, involves sources and methods. Were talking about fisa warrants and wiretaps and what was approved on carter page so there are reasons why this Justice Department says it would be extraordinarily reckless. This isnt just declassifying something. I have to tell you when we talk about the way this president talks about the Justice Department and firing this person or that person or another person and ranting against them, this weekend a lot of people were in washington, ceos and former cabinet members for the alfalfa dinner, as you know, which is off the record but in sidebar conversations i have to tell you that if all their pleasure at deregulation and the Corporate Tax cuts, there is such widespread views among conservatives that this president is destroying the norms of the relationships between the different branches of government and the appropriate strictures in Foreign Policy in terms of blowing up agreements and alliances. Theres real concern which ive never heard before. It began during the transition last year and the First Executive order about immigration and the consternation about that but what were seeing now a year in is a deeply embedded view that he doesnt understand the proper relationships and it will be to his detriment eventually if he blows up this investigation. Thats what i dont get if republicans dont see this, joe. And george will i bring up repeatedly what happened in 1993 during the travelgate crisis where joorj stephanopoulos and didi myers just spoke to a Justice Department or fbi official about a statement they were going to bring out and republicans turned that into a National Crisis for a month or so. We talk about the bright lines that were to separate the fbi and the white house which has been our tradition for a very long time. Those lines appear to be at least republicans want those lines to be blurred. What would be the impact of that . We dont know but we may find out. I referred to the unitary theory of the presidency which is something that was stressed under george w. Bush that the president controls and ought to control the entire operations of the executive branch. That does not mean in all cases and in every department he ought to exercise that control. This gets us back to what you were just talking about a minute ago, the unwritten norms of american politics as opposed to the strict constitutional logic of it all. The amazing thing is that the independent counsel, independent investigation by mueller was created to bring a sense of order to this. When are we going to learn . From Lawrence Walsh through ken starr to today this does not seem to be a mechanism that produces order, it produces rivalries and it produces dismay. This seems to me what were going through right now is an argument for why at all times one house of the congress should be controlled by the party not controlling the white house. So that you can have the kind of institutional rivalry were supposed to have between independent powerful representative branches of government that can move dispatch and will have a harder time maintaining secrecy. In this case, the secrecy is giving rise to the atmosphere in which pure speculation we must have a 99 ratio of speculation to fact by this point. A few facts might calm people dow down. Love facts. After being accused of dozens of employees of Sexual Misconduct, Las Vegas Casino mogul steve wynn stepped down as the finance chair of the rnc on saturday. Wynns decision followed a report from the wall street journal that detailed Sexual Misconduct claims from his employees spanning decades. In the report employees allege the billionaire pressured them to perform sex acts. Wynn has denied the allegations made in a wall street journal article. Republican National Committee chair Romney Mcdaniel released a statement accepting woibs resignation on saturday after speaking with President Trump, according to sources with the direct knowledge of the conversation. Wynn, who the president has called a great friend, had been a prolific republican donor, particularly over the past decade. A number of republicans have faced calls to return donations given by wynn and his company in the wake of the allegations, including House Speaker paul ryan. A spokesperson for ryan confirmed to nbc news that he will donate the 1,000 donation he received from wynn in 2016, hell donate that to a local charity. Its hard to characterize the problems facing the Republican Party right now. Robert costa, there was a lot of backlash in the wake of the Harvey Weinstein scandal for Hillary Clinton to return the money that she received from m him. What is the potential ramifications of this steve wynn scandal . Its major because of that context and talking to republican National Committee members over the weekend, they were pushing on friday when the story broke to have some kind of move against wynn but when the president controls not only the white house but he controls the rnc so they were waiting for a decision to talk to Rana Mcdaniel on saturday, it was then he chose to step down under some pressure and you see the republicans made a huge effort against Harvey Weinstein when that story broke and now theyre in the position of having to give back donations from their top fundraiser. Steve wynn was the number one fundraiser at the republican National Committee. Wow. I want to wrap up this segment talking to you about davos. There was the initial reaction, the flash reaction for donald trump that he did better than expected because he didnt make a fool of himself on stage but the same time republicans began realizing donald trump couldnt tell the truth in front of Robert Mueller internationally people started looking back at davos and seeing what really happened and it looks like china ate our lunch and dominated davos and while donald trump was talking about mining jobs and manufacturing jobs the chinese were running around making deals with everybody a and talking about advanced technology. Give us your summary of what happened at davos and how much of an advantage are the chinese getting over us month by month . An enormous advantage. President xi began dominating davos last year, but this was the first time an american president had gone in 18 years and he recited his version of his accomplishments and they are pleasing to corporate economic i have thes, sp economists, bue vision china has presented and frances president macron in a very important speech theyre talking about the future and the fact that the president opted out of tpp, which was also Hillary Clintons position under pressure from Bernie Sanders has opened up the floodgates for chi china. The Asian Countries are reorganized around tpp and we have not negotiated these bilateral agreements. He has a tough negotiator who is talking about renegotiating nafta and the canadians and mexicans are saying nafta is as good for them. So theres a need for a reality check on this president and what he says about his own accomplishments and the other piece is that today hes having lunch with our european allies, the members of the Security Council as well as russia and china and theyre coming to the white house for lunch and hes going to talk to them about blowing up the iran deal and despite what nickie hakki haley others may say, that wont happen. He is facing a challenge where hell into separating himself from our closest european allies. And while donald trump is blowing up trade agreements, china is making trade agreements. I talked about it with David Ignatius a month ago. If you just read china daily everyday or once a week you see china has thrown their arms open to the world, whether its canada or this weekend brazil, pakistan, you name it. Their one belt one Road Initiative is going to dominate the next 30, 40 years of trade agreements if we dont start waking up and if donald trump doesnt stop looking backward and start looking forward. He keeps talking about America First, America First. When you have to say it, thats not the reality. But well see what happens. Andrea mitchell, thank you very much for being on. Well be watching at noon eastern on Andrea Mitchell reports. George will and robert costa, thank you both as well. Still ahead on morning joe, our next guest spent six months reporting a major profile on Paul Manafort. Frankford joins with us his sweeping new piece. And as Andrea Mitchell mentioned earlier this block its been exactly one year since thousands of americans descended on airports nationwide to protest President Trumps executive order barring citizens of seven mostly muslim countries. Heres part of how our Morning Joe Team tackled that one one year ago. I see your face, i see your staring back at me shes a refugee establishing new vetting measures to keep radical islamic terrorists out of the United States of america. We dont want them here. We only want to admit those into our country who will support our country and love, deeply, our people. Waiting for their ship to sail, sail away were gonna fight, but we dont know what for we go to war, one day hes going to come back from far away in america we do not say no to people based on their religion. Not now, not ever. Greater protection of our borders of our people, its a small price to pay. They cant deny this is a muslim ban, it is a muslim ban. Its not a muslim ban. Were totally prepared to work it out very nicely. I think the effect will give isis some more propaganda. The people that needed to know knew. What we could dont is telegaffe our position. She is waiting, waiting for herman to come you know whats awesome . Gigspeed internet. You know whats not awesome . When only certain people can get it. Lets fix that. Lets give this guy gig really . And these kids, and these guys, him, ah. Oh hello. That lady, these houses yes, yes and yes. And dont forget about them. Uh huh, sure. Still yes xfinity delivers gig speed to more homes than anyone. Now you can get it, too. Welcome to the party. President trump is preparing to give his First Official state of the Union Address tomorrow. Joining us now, nbc News White House correspondent kristen welker. What is the president planning to focus on . Hi, mika, good morning to you. This is an unconventional president about to embark on a timehonored tradition delivering the state of the Union Address. Aides say the theme will be building a safe, strong and proud america. One Senior Administration official says the president will strike a note of bipartisanship and optimism and hell be addressing a deeply divided nation. The president preparing to highlight four key points. Jobs and the economy with a focus on his big tax victory. The president also expected to press congress to pass a trillion dollar infrastructure package and hell call for Immigration Reform after rolling out the plan last week that offers d. R. E. A. M. Ers a path to citizenship along with border wall funding and National Security. The white house not weighing in on whether the president will address one of the biggest cultural flash points, the me too movement, but during a recent interview with piers morgan the president was asked if he sees himself as a feminist. He said that would be going too far, he doesnt see himself as a feminist but he said im for women, im for men, im for everyone. Now while it has become a tradition as well for president s to hit the road to sell their message, President Trump is not planning any type of multistate trip this week. Hell be holding key meetings at the white house. Meanwhile this is a sharp left turn news on one of his former staffers here. Omarosa, you might remember her, she has a new gig. According to the hollywood reporter, she is joining the cast of celebrity big brother. So maybe the whole team will sit down and watch the state of the union tomorrow night. Why does that im just going to have no comment. Nbcs kristen welker, thank you very much. Thanks, mika. Tomorrow morning well have complete coverage previewing President Trumps state of the Union Address. Among our many guests will be senator chris murphy, john kasich and steny hoyer. Coming up on morning joe, according to our next guest, there would be no swamp to drain if it werent for the man tapped to lead Donald Trumps campaign. A new profile says Paul Manafort has made a career off shady deals and foreign money. Well talk to the author next. This is the story of Green Mountain Coffee Roasters dark magic told in the time it takes to brew your cup. First, we head to vermont. And go to our coffee shop. And meet dave. Hey. Why is dark magic so spellbindingly good, he asks . Let me show you. Lets go. So we climb. Hike. See a bear. Woah. Reach the top. Dave says dark magic is a bold blend of coffee with rich flavors of uganda, sumatra, colombia and other parts of south america. Like these mountains, each amazing on their own. But together . Magical. All, for a smoother tasting cup of coffee. Green mountain Coffee Roasters packed with goodness. With moderate to severe Rheumatoid Arthritis . How do you chase what you love do what i did. Ask your doctor about humira. Its proven to help relieve pain and protect joints from further irreversible damage in many adults. Humira works by targeting and helping to block a specific source of inflammation that contributes to ra symptoms. Humira has been clinically studied for over 20 years. Humira can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. Serious, sometimes fatal infections and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened; as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. Before treatment, get tested for tb. Tell your doctor if youve been to areas where certain fungal infections are common, and if youve had tb, hepatitis b, are prone to infections, or have flulike symptoms or sores. Dont start humira if you have an infection. Ready for a new chapter . Talk to your rheumatologist about humira. This is humira at work. We have two segments ahead that, as the saying goes, follow the money. A look at the new documentary that looks into the rise and reign of trump, ining. But first, a look at Paul Manafort. Frank foer writes the cover story for the atlantic entitled american hustler. In it he details manaforts interactions with the governments of russia and ukraine before the 2016 election began. He writes in part a Paul Manafort deputy once boasted to a group of lobbyist that in every ministry he has a guy. Only a small handful of americans, oil executives, cold war spy masters could claim to have ever have amassed such influence in a foreign regime. The power helped fill manaforts bank accounts, according to his recent indictment he had tens of millions of dollars stashed in havens like cyprus and the grenadines. Manafort profited from the sort of excesses that make a country ripe for revolution. Manaforts role in muellers broader narrative remains carefully guarded and unknown to the public and his personal corruption is less significantly, ultimately, than his lifetime role as a corrupter of the american system that he would be accused of helping foreign power subvert american democracy is a fitting coda to his life story. Joe, again, you know, this is theres two issues here, one of following the money and the other potentially obstructing justice following the money. Yeah, frank, thank you so much for being with us. This is a remarkable piece. Thank you. I would prefer to talk to you about how liverpool has the habit of shocking man city and then collapsing which weve done two years in a row but the piece is so important we wont have a chance to get to that ch. But you take a look at manaforts darkally complex influence in the washington lobbying game and what struck me the most about your investigation is that this guy could not help himself. He always flew too close to the sun and he finally got burned when he flew so close he decided to take a highprofile role in Donald Trumps campaign which was the beginning of the end. Exactly. Exactly. It was a mystery to a lot of his friends why he would take this role because all of his friends long time republican operatives, Political Consultants understood manaforts career involved all sorts of shady dealings, he was getting paid for work he had done for all sorts of authoritarian characters, shady goons that he had helped launder the careers, the reputations of all sorts of people who never deserved to have entry into washington, d. C. And he helped arrange for their entry into washington, d. C. So the question about manafort is why would this guy, who had so much to lose by having the public spotlight get turned on him, why would he have joined up with the donald Trump Campaign . Because as you say, if he had not taken this step to join up with trump he would have gotten away scotfree. Nobody would be paying attention to him right now, all of the money he had stashed but, frank. You answered the question. The guy couldnt keep his head down, he couldnt take the easier path, the smarter path. I had no idea the amount of excess, the amount of money you write that he worked for oligarchs and wanted to live like an oligarch. The money he went through is just breathtaking. Yeah, this was a guy who liked conspicuous consumption and we had a taste of this in the mueller indictment which talked about the Million Dollars he spent on a tailor in Beverly Hills but this was a guy who had almost a mania for accumulating property. That it was not just the first and second home, it was the third and the fourth home and he was a guy who liked to live high. I dont think he was out to get rich, he just loved living the jet set life that hed spent a lot of time in the south of france where he was hanging out with arms dealers and the like and so he had a taste for the high e highest echelon of the european global elite and thats what he wanted for himself. This is eddie glaude. Help me understand since you have republican operatives knowing how shady he was, how did donald trump come to hire him . Since he chooses best people. Lets go back to early 2016 and ill give you the story from two perspectives. You have Paul Manafort himself whose life crumbled in the months leading up to the donald Trump Campaign. He was professionally in crisis because his main client was the president of ukraine. Hed been in ukraine for nearly ten years and he was making gobs of money but his client got swept away in a revolution in 2014 so manafort needed a new client. He lost his status, he lost his power. He had little access to money because the fbi started to poke around into his finances and the fbi asked him questions connected to a broader investigation they were doing of ukrainian Money Laundering about these account he is had in cyprus so he wasnt able to actually access his primary source of wealth like hed been doing for so many years so he was financially in distress and his daughter talked about how in the days leading up to their wedding he scaled back plans, he talked about his tight cash flow and he canceled the line item for ice at her wedding kickoff reception and that he was personally in distress because hed had an affair that had been uncovered and his family had ultimately asked him to go to a clinic arizona to recover from his personal crisis. His daughter talked about how he had had a very large personal meltdown so he needed Something Like the Trump Campaign for a comeback. And so he went to one of his old friends who is also one of Donald Trumps closest friends and he said can you help me get into the Trump Campaign . So he wrote a very compelling memo to trump that positioned Paul Manafort, who had been the ultimate insider, as the ultimate outsider and the Trump Campaign was a mess, it was improvisational genius but it didnt have technical expertise, it needed establishment credibility and in waltzes Paul Manafort and hes able to supply the Trump Campaign with the things it desperately needed at that moment. Frank, Nick Confessore here, fascinating piece. So here you have a man whos spent years and years helping foreign dictate yourself win friends in washington. Now as the coda to his life story hes involved in an investigation of a big foreign power, russia, trying to have influence in the Trump Administration. Right. What would the current year look like if this had never come to light. What was manafort . Your view trying to set himself up to do in trumps washington and how much of what he may have been trying to do do you see happening with other people in the coterie around the president right now . Youve written about Corey Lewandowski and others around the president whove managed to profit in glorious sorts of ways from their connections to donald trump and the ultimate point is donald trump, the guy who campaigned to wanting to drain the swamp, is surrounded by people who want to profit from the swamp and who want to keep breaking norms and set not guilty standards for how you can profit in this town and Paul Manafort is a guy who over the course of his career kept breaking the rules. He kept setting new rules and new standards for what was acceptable in washington. You have to remember, corruption has always existed in washington but the scale and magnitude of corruption in washington changes all the time. Whats acceptable in washington changes all the time and manafort was the guy who changed what was acceptable and he was setting himself up to be the primary operator in Donald Trumps washington. All right, thank you so much, frank foer, great to have you with us. Its the cover story of the atlantic. How tough was it working with Jeffrey Goldberg who, i understand, walks around with a revolver and shoots computer screens he doesnt like. Is it rough . Its a real pain in the ass, its the kind of guy manafort would take on as a client. [ laughter ] no, the beauty of the atlantic is that you get to spend months working on a piece like this and just the care that goes into even Fact Checking it i think we spent maybe four or five weeks Fact Checking this piece so theres a rigor that comes with working at a place like the atlantic and with a guy like Jeffrey Goldberg, so im blessed. Jeffreys great. Hes great. Thank you so much, frank, hope youll come back very soon. The one thing that article shows us, its not a surprise he selected manafort because manafort had a recklessness bordering on stupidity. You look at the people and we saw this up close you look at the people trump surrounded himself, even family members, they walked blindly through legal and ethical mine fields everyday and were too ignorant to understand what they were doing and too arrogant to care which is why we find ourselves where we are today with this investigation and why manafort finds himself and gates finds himself and all of them find themselves where they are. Manafort was a very tight fit into an organization that was both ignorant and arrogant of the law and ethical traps that were laid before them. Absolutely. Up next, confidencem men and by the way, not just laid before them, but its important, laid before anybody that goes to washington, d. C. There are rules that you have to play by and people like manafort and trump dont like playing by those rules. And some members of the family as well but you wonder where that comes from. They may be so much like trump himself. Up next, confidence man. A new investigative documentary takes us inside trump inc. We continue to follow the money when morning joe comes right back. Today, innovation in the finger lakes is helping build the new new york. Once home to the worlds image center, new york state is now a leader in optics, photonics and imaging. Fueled by strong university partnerships, providing the worlds best talent. And supported with Workforce Development to create even more opportunities. All across new york state, were building the new new york. To grow your business with us in new york state, visit esd. Ny. Gov. This beneful grain free is so with healthy. York state, oh farmraised chicken thats good chicken hm . Here come the accents. Blueberries and pumpkin. Wow. And spinach that was my favorite bite so far. avo beneful grain free. 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Im the biggest developer in new york by par. Im building 90story buildings all over the place. He was never the biggest Real Estate Developer in new york by any measure. That was a clip from the new Netflix Documentary series, dirty money. The series is made up of six episodes focused on corporate greed. And the clip you just saw was from the episode entitled the confidence man, a are profile of Donald Trumps business career. Joining us now, the man behind that episode, director fisher stevens. Its good to have you on the show this morning. Thank you. Noah. The clip reminded me of an image that my colleague has been passing around. Hes originally from iran. And it shows donald trump in in tehran, 1979, with Jack Nicholson and warren beatty. Oh, my. Just hanging out investigating a casino. Highways the extent to which he was able to insert himself into these affairs and create this image of himself as bigger than life character, which obviously served him well. Yes. Got it early on. He got it, yeah. In the last segment, we were talking about the extent to which Paul Manafort sort of reactivated his ukrainian connections, despite the fact that he was under reinvestigation, despite the fact this ledger was out there and he was doing so in order to impress donald trump. Not because they had to, but because they knew the boss wanted them. Adam davidson who writes for the new yorker writes on trump signing real estate deals in places he probably never even heard of thinking maybe even at the time that he meant georgia, atlanta georgia, but no, part of the former soviet union. And for like, 1 million 1 mill million, he would go over there, cut a ribbon. They would do a design. And he wouldnt do any Due Diligence about who was with behind these deals in terms of the reporting davidson did in the new yorker. His family is very involved in his business. Its a tiny mom and pop business, the trump organization. So ivanka went out and she was very responsible for the actual baku design and got into the gardens and the whole thing ended up falling apart. But like you were saying about manafort, i dont think they do Due Diligence. Theyre open for business. Its kind of like what were open for today in our government. And youre talking in here about how trump kind of rose to sell an image of himself as successful, that he was selling the image of success as much as the reality sometimes in place of the reality. But if he fakes it until he makes it, he has made it all the way to the top. Its incredible. Isnt there something to be said for his success . Thats what a trump supporter would say. But i think were pretty clear in the film, donald trump is incredibly charismatic. He has charisma. Look, people everybody covered the hell out of him when he was runninging because you cant stop watching him. Even his show, coming out, people are interested in it. He has that tv thing. I we bring that up. What we say in the show is, his business, his doing commercials, selling insurance, selling products youve never heard of because he would do anything just to stay in the public eye because he felt he needed that. Trump steaks. Dont eat them. They dont do well. So, yes, he realized. And the apprentices was like, oh, my goodness, this is my so the. Friends, apprentice, thursday night. He got that and then im taking all these deals. Brand myself and that is where he is super smart. But as everyone knows, what goes up must come counsel. Trump steaks lasted for about six weeks. The presidency is continuing. So far, its been a year, one long year. We should mention that the preliminarys Production Team reached out to the White House Press office over the summer to participate in the documentary at the suggestion of the trump organization, but the white house did not respond. The new Netflix Series is dirty money and its out now. The episode is the confidence man. Fisher stevens, thank you so much for coming on the show this morning. Still ahead, the Justice Department says releasing that controversial republican memo would be reckless, but the president reportedly wants it out, anyway. Well discuss the implications of that. Plus, fire and fury at the grammy, stars read from the blockbuster trump all. Even Hillary Clinton makes a cameo to troll the president and columnist ruth marcus is here with her new oped, what she calls Hillary Clintons infuriating response to alleged harassment during her 2008 campaign. We are back with all that in a moment. Finally. Hey ron theyre finally taking down that schwab billboard. Oh, not so fast, carl. Oh no. Schwab, again . Index investing for that low . Thats three times less than fidelity. And four times less than vanguard. Whats next, no minimums . No minimums. Schwab has lowered the cost of investing again. Introducing the lowest cost index funds in the industry with no minimums. I bet theyre calling about the schwab news. Schwab. A modern approach to wealth management. Its always good, especially when the person heads up russia. Well, i mean, he also is a person that kills journalists, political opponents and invades countries. Obviously, that it would be a concern, would it not . Hes running his country and at least hes a leader, unlike what we have in this country. Okay. So just over two years ago, tt downtown praised Vladimir Putins approach to dealing with political opponents. We saw that approach over the weekend in moscow as one of those political leaders was violently wrestled from a rally after urging voters there to protest the next election. Back here at home, the Washington Post reports that trump has complained in recent weeks that he does not understand why he cannot simply give orders to, quote, my guys at what he sometimes calls the trump Justice Department. Good morning, everyone. Its monday, january 29th. Welcome to morning joe. With us we have Political Writer for the New York Times nick convasori, the cofounder of axias, mike allen, associate editor of commentary magazine, noah rothman, eddie glow jr. And White House Correspondent for bloomberg news, shannon petty piece. Joe, we start, its only monday and we begin that way. Right. Well, yeah, and, of course, you didnt show the rest of the tape where we kept explaining to donald trump that putin assassinated political opponents and assassinated journalists just didnt seem to care. Didnt matter how far we pushed him. That was really that was in december of 2015. I remember i think it was somebody over at the National Review said that may have been the most telling interview of the entire 2016 campaign. I think they were right. It was. Because it suggested there was something untoward in that relationship with putin. And that, of course, moves us forward not only to what is happening in russia, not only with frank foors remarkable reporting about corruption and Paul Manafort and how oligarchs connected with the campaign and what is happening today on capitol hill and how its now trump is so corrupted, washington, d. C. , and so corrupted the republican establishment and so corrupted the conservative establishment that today you actually have on capital little republicans that are devin nunes and a few republicans, sicko fants for donald trump, not conservatives because conservatives actually heed the warning of the Intel Community when the Intel Community says do not release that memo. It will be bad for the United States of america. But these same conservatives who, of course, were concerned about Hillary Clinton. Her server now suddenly are openly ignoring the advice of the Intel Community and ignoring the advice of Donald Trumps own Justice Department not to release a memo that is twisted with words and facts wretched from their proper context to try to now, we learn, undercut republican Rod Rosenstein. Of course, weve had evidence of these conspiracy theories hatched in these troubled Trump Supporters minds saying that lifetime republican comey was antitrump despite the fact his memo helped elect Hillary Clinton, that rosenstein, a lifetime republican, not a baltimore democrat as donald trump said, but a lifetime republican is inadequately faithful and loyal to donald trump. And so now he must go. We saw it with bob mueller also, another lifetime republican who, because the closer, mika, the investigation gets to donald trump, the more that theres a republican that republicans in congress are talking about the Conspiracy Theory. But as you see in this tweet, Robert Mueller is a republican, Rod Rosenstein is a republican, jeff session sess a republican, don mcgahn is a republican, the house run by republicans, the white house and executive branch run the by republicans. The Justice Department that is telling the republicans not to release this memo by Donald Trumps appointed republicans. And yet, mika, they move forward as recklessly as possible, as recklessly as the conspiracy theorists on tv. I just want to say this. We have from time to time over the past several months been tough on Lindsey Graham for some of his tweets and some of his statements regarding donald trump. Lindsey has stood up like a guy who loves America First and his party second over the past several weeks talking about how this investigation needs to move forward, let the chips fall where they may, and if donald trump is independent, then stay out of the way, lets get it done. I wonder if paul ryan will come out and say that today. As his hand picked chairman can Devin Nunes Threatens Americas National security, according to the Intel Community and according to the Justice Department threatens Americas National security by releasing information hand picked and misleading that americas own Intel Community and Donald Trumps own Justice Department is begging him not to release for the sake of americas security. We shall see how this day unwinds, mika. Why not stand up and speak out. It just shouldnt be hard at this point. With just less than 40 hours, actually, until the state of the union, lawmakers seem ready to clash over this controversial memo about Justice Department and the fbi. The House Intelligence Committee meets today at 5 00. And byron york of the Washington Examiner reports they could vote on releasing the memo which was written by Staff Members for chairman devin nunes based on classified information alleging abuse and bias from investigators in the Clinton Emails and trump russia probes. If approved, the house calls for a committee to await a decision by President Trump on whether he supports or opposes the release of the memo. The Washington Post reports that the president sought the release of the memo citing against his own Justice Department which called the release of the memo without prior review extraordinary reckless in a letter to nunes on wednesday. On that same day, the Washington Post reports that white house chief of staff john kelly spoke twice with attorney general Jeff Sessions and kelly conveyed trumps desire to see the memo released. A Senior Administration official told the post that trump, quote, is inclined to have that released just because it will shed light. Apparently all the rumors are that it will shed light, it will help investigators come to a conclusion. Yesterday, republican members of congress, including House Majority leader Kevin Mccarthy, said they support its release. They have been doing their investigation. They found something out. Ive gone down, ive read it. The committee voted this is the process. They voted to allow members to read it. Heavy the ability the to vote, to move it forward, just like being and then it would go to the executive branch. Why are they afraid to send this to the Justice Department for review . Arent we separate but coequal . Dont we have the responsibility for oversight . And the Justice Department will be able to see it. You have the executive branch and you have the legislative branch and as the legislative branch looks at it, it will send it to the executive branch beforehand. Do you want to declassify this memo . Ing having read this memo, i think it would be appropriate that the public have full view of it. And you dont believe this is tampering with the investigation . It has the nothing to do with the president right now. It has everything to do with the president. I dont know if Kevin Mccarthy thinks that everybody is as stupid as some of the people in his caucus, bit has everything to do whit. Nick, in this past week the New York Times reported that donald trump was desperate to fire Rod Rosenstein and put somebody else in Rod Rosensteins place who could then fire mueller because rosenstein is the one with the authority to do it. So the republicans set up a hit job. The president wants to sign off on the hit job. The Justice Department says it would be extraordinarily difficult to do so. Everybody else says this is misleading as getting information from, oh, i dont know, a million russian bots on twitter. Congratulations on your story, by the way. That was a great story yesterday. Thank you. But this is such a hand fisted setup to undermine Rod Rosenstein so they can fire him so they can appoint somebody who can fire bob mueller. Its all about the trump power security force, right . I think that is how the president views the nations Law Enforcement agency. What we have been seeing here for the past few months is an effort to wind up and prepare to disengage from whatever the Mueller Probe finds to discredit it and give the party its own set of reasons for backinging away from it. We see that everywhere. And by the way, chairman nunes, i believe, was taken off the this investigation and made to recuse himself. What is he still doing out there, you know, doing his own investigation separate from the committee somehow or next door to it . He was supposed to be conflicted out of this and its surprise to go me that everyone has sort of forgotten that a bit. It seems over this weekend there has been especially among conservatives and people on the right and republicans, this increased cacophony of voices demanding the that donald trump not testify in front of bob mueller after, of course, donald trump said he would testify in front of bob mueller. It seems the panic is setting in. Yeah. There is this notion that there would be perjury traps set for this president been but what we know is that he has a habit of embellishing and getting himself more into trouble than being walked into a trap. What i thought was interesting was what nick said earlier was that theyre discrediting the warrant that was obtained in 2016 in order to get surveillance on this campaign would somehow discredibility the Mueller Probe. Its sort of a leap from a to b. But thats what this memo is about. Its about undermining the notion that this probe was legitimate because it was obtained via this toss yeah. But as we know, there were multiple sources that fed into this including papadopoulos s musings and carter pages trip to moscow. You still have multiple other things supposedly supporting it that we dont really know. But i cant imagine theyre going to be discredited by the release of this memo. And devin nunes, why is he still in charge of the Intel Committee when he made an absolute fool of himself several months ago claiming he had information that he didnt have, xwg to the white house, beale spoon fed. Hes discredited himself. And yesterday here he is in the middle of the Russian Investigation. Paul ryan if youre will listening or if somebody in your staff is listening, and i know they are, listen, the Intel Community, the Justice Department said it would be incredibly reckless to release this memo. Go back and see all the things you said about Hillary Clinton and her server, all the things i said about Hillary Clinton and had he her server, all the things republicans said about Hillary Clinton and her server and how she mistreated classified information. Hillary clinton never had a letter saying, if you do x, then that will lead to y which will subvert American National security. Paul ryan, devin nunes, Kevin Mccarthy, House Republicans, you have been explicitly warned that what you do would be extraordinarily reckless. I know, mika, theyre all panicked, even ken star came out over the weekend and said that he would consider the impeachment of donald trump because his continued lies about this investigation. You know, they have him dead to center, by the way. I wont say peoples names. I dont want to give them any more oxygen. But people writing learned opeds this weekend saying that donald trump has not committed obstruction and there is no way he should even testify. It is a joke. Donald trump fired the fbi director because the fbi director would not ignore a federal crime that donald trump was aware of that his National Security adviser made. And after firing that fbi director, which every president has the right to do, but after firing that fbi director, donald trump admitted to nbc news and to the Russian Foreign minister and to russias ambassador of the United States that he did so to kill the Russian Investigation and he said im now no longer under investigation and quote, to the russians, the pressure is off. Yeah. Anybody that writes an oped and suggests that donald trump has not put himself direct will i in the target of an obstructionist position is just fooling themselves and some very, very stupid ill inform readers. Because even the firing of bob mueller, the ordering of the firing of bob mueller, the argument is well, its not done until its done. It goes to intend. They know the truth. Theyre lying to people out there. Sweeping across republicans, sweeping across some conservative publications. And theyre humiliating themselves and i dont know why theyre doing it because truth will call them out a week from now. It makes no sense. Coming up, more on the, quote, democrat from baltimore. President trump tags a top justice official with political labels. At the same time, republicans accuse the fbi of doing the same. In both cases, the facts are not there to back up the claims. Well continue this conversation straight ahead. But first, here is bill carin wes a check of the forecast. Across the country, weve had this beautiful january thaw. Were starting off with the rain exiting the southeast. Its going be a Beautiful Day from the texas through florida. Did i mention the cold is on its way . Negative 6 windchill in minneapolis. It will be a chilly week for the super bowl. By super bowl sunday, it will be very cold. Game is indoors, but for the fans and everyone heading to minneapolis, a typical winter for them. The storm exits off the coast. A little bit of snow from cape cod and down east main. A little bit of snow coming through areas of ohio and pennsylvania. We could maybe pick up an inch or so to coat the grass. The heavier snow is off of lake erie between cleveland and buffalo. Theres some of that light snow from boston down through the cape. The other stories out there today, high wind and fire danger in southern california. There is a new fire that just formed in malibu. There have been about 1,000 people that have been ordered for mandatory evacuations. Hopefully that wont turn into a big blaze, but it is dangerous there today. Leave you with a shot, gorgeous. Statue of liberty, liberty island, shaking a little bit in the breeze. This is the story of Green Mountain Coffee Roasters dark magic told in the time it takes to brew your cup. First, we head to vermont. And go to our coffee shop. And meet dave. Hey. Why is dark magic so spellbindingly good, he asks . Let me show you. Lets go. So we climb. Hike. 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Im cool. [burke] thats one way to fire up the crowd. But we covered it. Talk to farmers. We know a thing or two because weve seen a thing or two. We are farmers. Bumpadum, bumbumbumbum the New York Times reports the this morning that House Republicans controversial memo on the fbi and the Justice Department targets Deputy Attorney general Rod Rosenstein who has oversight of the special counsels russia probe. According to the times, three people familiar with the memo say it reveals rosenstein approved an application to approve surveillance of former Trump Campaign associate carter page shor page shortly after taking off this past spring. This shows the Justice Department under President Trump saw a reason to believe page was acting as a russian agent. Court documents earlier disclosed that page interacted with an undercover russian spy in 2013, but page denies he would have knowingly cooperated with russian intelligence. According to the Washington Post, the president has told close advisers that the memo is start to go make people realize how the fbi and Mueller Probe are bias against him. And that it could provide him with grounds for either firing rosenstein or forcing him to leave. Trump has privately deride rosenstein as the democrat from baltimore. However, as we have pointed out, he is not a democrat. The post cited two people familiar with the president s comments on how he views the doj. Trump has complained to confidants in recent weeks that he doesnt understand why he can, quote, give orders to my guys, what he sometimes calls the trump Justice Department. On saturday, white house special counsel ty cobb responded, we do not find it to be a questions dense that there is an onslaught of false stories circulating in what appears to be a coordinated effort to distract and deflect from new revelations the about already reported bias and corruption. Shannon, i want to ask you, first of all, if you feel from the folks in the white house that you talked to that the panic is setting in. And what is the timeline as to when trump could possibly pete with mueller . I think they know a storm, if not a storm, a circus is certainly coming with this interview with the president , that at the this point it is not a matter of if, but it is when and under what terms. And the lawyers have been spending weeks to get the terms as favorable to them, to have it in a comfortable setting that they like. There had been discussion at one point about getting questions in writing which i dont think is going to happen. Were probably a matter of weeks away. I mean, we could be talking two weeks rather than five weeks away. They have been having these talks for a while now, since the first of the year. Theres a lot of lawyering going back and forth. But all the momentum is heading in that way. And then once we have that interview, if indeed on the obstruction end mueller is waiting for the president to be interviewed near the very end, so he has all this information before he talks tot president , then it could be another few weeks until mueller actually comes together and writes up his report on the obstruction end of this piece. So, really, like i mean, i spent a lot of time trying to figure out the timeline here, but we could be looking at having the this obstruction end, you know, wrapped up maybe in february or march timeline. Now we reported last week that that is still only one end of muellers investigation, obstruction. There are still other pieces of this investigation that will go on. But it does look like he is nearing, reaching some conclusion on obstruction. Ill just throw in, to get to the rosen sateen point, rosen sateen is a lot more important than people realize here because it is very possible rosen sateen will be the one who determines how the information that mueller reaches is conveyed, if it is sent to congress, if it is released public, if there are charges. A lot of this is going to end up in rosensteins lap. Coming up on morning joe, few things seem to rile up the president more than Hillary Clinton and criticism from the hollywood elite. We got a double dose of it last fight. Whoooo. Looking for a hotel that fits. Your budget . Tripadvisor now searches over. 200 sites to find you the. Hotel you want at the lowest price. Grazi, gino find a price that fits. Tripadvisor. Luckily, office depot® officemax® is hereeart. To take care of you. Taking care of business with print Services Done right. On time. Guaranteed expert tech support. And this week all dell pcs are up to twenty five percent off save even more when you purchase a dell monitor. And make sure you protect your investment. Office depot® officemax. Officedepot. Com taking care of business and sometimes, i dont eat the way i should. So, i drink boost. Boost high protein nutritional drink has 15 grams of protein to help maintain muscle and 26 essential vitamins and minerals, including calcium and vitamin d. Boost high protein be up for it [ click, keyboard clacking ] [ keyboard clacking ] [ click, keyboard clacking ] good questions lead to good answers. Our advisors can help you find both. Talk to one today and see why were bullish on the future. Yours. We have one to two fires a day and when you respond together and you put your lives on the line, you do have to surround yourself with experts. And for us the expert in gas and electric is pg e. We run about 2,500 2,800 fire calls a year and on almost every one of those calls pg e is responding to that call as well. And so when we show up to a fire and pg e shows up with us it makes a tremendous team during a moment of crisis. I rely on them, the firefighters in this department rely on them, and so we have to practice safety everyday. Utilizing pg es talent and expertise in that area trains our firefighters on the gas or electric aspect of a fire and when we have an emergency situation we are going to be much more skilled and prepared to mitigate that emergency for all concerned. The things we do every single day that puts ourselves in harms way, and to have a partner that is so skilled at what they do is indispensable, and i couldnt ask for a better partner. Fire and ur fury spoken word auditions, take one. Trump wont read anything. He gets up halfway through meetings with World Leaders because he is bored. Sorry, john. It was wonderful. I just with felt a bit too smooth. I dont think its going to work. Spoken word. If trump isnt having his 6 30 evening dinner with steve bannon, more than likely he was in bed by that time eating a cheeseburger. Why am i reading this [ bleep ] . I cant believe this. This is how he lives his life . He had a long time fear of being poisoned. One reason why he liked to eat at mcdonalds, nobody few he was coming and the food was safe. Thats it. Highways the one. You think so . Hillary clinton with a cameo appearance in a sketch during last nights grammy awards. Ambassador nikki haley was not laughing, tweeting i have always loved the grammys, but to have artists read the fire and furry book killed it. Dont ruin great music with trash. Some of us love music without the politics thrown in it. I dont think nikki haley is portrayed very well in the book, so shes upset about that. She was smeared over the weekend by the books author who dropped the insinuation that she was having an affair with the president and, therefore, thats how she succeeded in life. Oh, and by the way, he said he didnt have the reporting to put it in his book, yet he still said it in the air on a tv show. No. This occurred on friday after we learned Hillary Clinton sort of kept around somebody accused of sexual assault. Hillary clinton was already in the news this weekend before last nights grammys. On friday, we learned a Senior Adviser to Hillary Clintons 2008 campaign who was accused of Sexual Misconduct was allowed to remain on the campaign at her request. The New York Times reports a cording to four people familiar with the situation, clintons Senior Adviser, berne strider, was accused of repeatedly sexually harassing a young subordinate. Buzz feed news reports that according to Campaign Documents from the time, the young woman alleged strider gave her five kisses on the head and engaged in excessive tracking of her whereabouts among other claims. According to three officials, former officials, Clintons Campaign manager recommended that strider be fired, but clinton decided against doing that. The times reports that strider was docked several weeks pay in order to undergo counselor and the young woman was moved to a new job. Years later, strider was hired to helm the super pac correct the record that packed clintons 2016 run. Now, according to three people close to correct the records management, strider was fired after several months for workplace issues, including allegations that he harassed a young aid. In an interview with buzz feed, strider acknowledged many of the incidents as true and said for some he did not recall the incidents in the same way strider did. He dismissed some of his actions as simply friendly on characteristics of his southern background. Clinton tweeted a response to the report on friday saying, i was dismayed when it occurred, but was heartened the young woman came forward, was heard and had her concerns taken seriously and addressed. I called her today to tell her how proud i am of her and to make sure she knows what all a women should. We deserve to be heard. Joining us now, columnist and deputy Editorial Page Editor at the Washington Post ruth marcus. Her latest column takes on that story entitled Hillary Clinton metoo meet sowhat. Also with us, former editor in chief joanne lipman, her new book, which i have been waiting for. Thats what she said, what men need to know and women feed to tell them about working together. Its out tomorrow. Well get to that in just a moment. Joanne, i am so glad to have you on today. Ruth you, was your Biggest Issue well, ill tell you, what struck me about it was Hillary Clintons response recently. To calling the girl. I dont know if we can pore into the details of what happened exactly with strider and the young woman. Later on in his life, but its her reaction that shes responsible for in realtime. Am i correct . Once again, mika, i think youre totally correct. I probably would not have written about this, absent the tweet. Which i thought, like i wrote, it made me head explode. We cant really know what happened in 2008, but by the way, let me just say, 2008 was not the dark ages in terms of dealing with Sexual Harassment. We had been through a lot of things that Hillary Clinton knows about. We had been through not just the episode in the white house, but we had been through anita hill in 1991. And we know that the Campaign Manager and other senior officials recommended firing. So, okay, maybe it was handled appropriately. Maybe it wasnt. But then to use a word and this is the one that really set me on fire to use a word like dismayed, okay, mika, you have daughters. I have daughters. Hillary clinton has a daughter. If if Something Like that happened to our daughters, i would not be dismayed. I would be furious. And especially when i found out that the person who i had invited into my campaign who then was working for a super pac that was supporting me had done it again, which is what we have all learned, that this doesnt happen just once. I would not be dismayed. I would be ballistic. Right. Absolutely. This is the part of the conversation thats hard to have. Well, it is. It is a part of the conversation thats hard to have, but also, ruth, it was this what hangs over this story and i think in the New York Times and Washington Post have commented on this, what hangs over this story is what hung over the entire 2016 campaign, when donald trump treated women badly. Hillary clinton was frozen because of what happened in the 70s and the 80s and the 90s with her husband. Somebody commented it may have been you. I loved your outfit. Im trying to remember. But somebody commented that she was compromised by coming out too strongly against strider because of what she had said or not said regarding her own husbands activities. She was i think that was me. She was in an it was brilliant. I thought so. I think she was in a really exquisitely difficult position and always has been all along, trying to present herselves as and when i say trying to present herself as, she has been in many, many ways a champion of women and she has had really universi unfortunate facts to deal with in materials of her husbands behavior. If she had said, you know what, my Campaign Manager is right, youre out of here, what if he said, excuse me, why do i get punished for this when your husband did worse and you were busy standing by him . Shes in an uncomfortable position. The this has always been true of Hillary Clinton and this is just another example of it. I was trying actually in that part to uvend a lot bit, maybe, about why she responded and what seemed like from the outside a ten the yid way. Yep. I dont disagree at all. And i think this is worth talking about. I think we should pull out to 20,000 feet and look at me too in light of this conversation and in light of joannes book. Because in some ways im going to be careful, careful, watch it. Careful. In some ways, this whole its important that womens voices are heard is a condescending pat on the head. Pay us, promote us and respect our voices and give our voices value and i believe, joanne, as you write, she will be heard. Absolutely. Correct . Absolutely. The reason i wrote the book is because women have been talking about all of these issues. Sexual harassment, thats like the extreme. Women talk amongst ourselves all the time about were not paid, were overlooked, marginalized, disrespected. But why would you listen to the lowest paid person in the room . Why would you even give her time . Right. She doesnt feel very valuable, either. So she looks like she feels. Shes hunched over, shes concerned, her voice is small and she doesnt feel like you want to hear her. Youre not paying her well. And thats me too. Thats why theres been such outrage over the Sexual Harassment piece of this is because not every woman has been sexually assaulted at work. But every woman knows what it feels like to be marginalized, interrupted, not heard, not appreciated. And the thing is that weve been talking amongst ourselves, women have been talking amongst ourselves about these issues for years. And we have books and we have conferences and we talk more to ourselves. But we will never, half of us, right, were never going to get to a whole solution. 50 of us, of the population, can at left get to 50 of a solution. Its half a conversation. So the reason i wrote thats what she said is because we need men to come into this conversation, to understand what are the issues we face. And then to move on to the solutions. Eddie. So, in understanding the issues we face, does it require us to move to structures . I mean, so to talk about pay in the workplace, to talk about family, that we could begin to think about a range of things in terms of just the way the society is organized, how do we get me too to Start Talking about patriarchky. That doesnt just involve men being sexist. One of the ways we can talk about this is the way shes trying to talk about patriarchy. And youre exactly right about the systemic question. But to solve the systemic question, the first thing we have to have is awareness of the issues. There was a really interesting study by catalyst which is this. Nonprofit that looks at womens issues that surveyed men and found that more than half of men are not actually aware of what the issues are that women face. Not only that, 74 of men who they talk to said one reason that would prevent them from championing women and equality generally is fear. Fear that they will be embarrassed, fear that other men, that they will lose status among other men, and fear that theyll Say Something wrong. And what im trying to do with thats what she said is, hey, lets put these issues out there. I went across the country and the world interviewing men who are trying to reach across the gender divide, talk, them about what are some of the vatgies theyre using, kind of what theyve learned, some mistakes theyve made with the idea being lets put it out there so that we all can Work Together to actually try and close the gap. And thats what she said is a play on what happens to women all the time . Well, yes. Its a dirty joke that we are reclaiming for women. But its also every woman knows what its like to be the woman in the room who finally gets a word in edgewise and then she says has a good idea, she says something smart and its crickets, right . And two minutes later, bob repeats the same thing and bob is a genius, right . Brilliant idea. Bob is so smart. Oh, my god, can you believe bob came one that idea . How many times, mika, have you talked about that happening . My god, i think we should ask ruth marcus. Ruth, in all your years in journalism, how many times have you come one a great idea around the table, people stared at you and some guy said it a few minutes later and people were like, hear, hear, so smart. Never, ever happened at the Washington Post. It happens to all of us. And i think the interesting question is to understand why. And it may not even be only men reacting that way. But what i cant wait to read joannes book, but one thing whats has really been striking me and theres a white chilling piece in the Washington Post right now about some of the me too backlash that ive been worrying about. Which is instead of figuring out how to hear women and include them at the table, there is something thats happening in some quarters where people get nervous about traveling with women. People get nervous on business trips. People get nervous about going out the dinner with women. This is exactly the opposite of having women be heard and included. Its protecting yourself. That is crazy and damaging and if that is a legacy of the me too moment, were all in a heap of trouble. I dont think its going to be the legacy. We have to make sure that its not and be cognizant of that. Very focused on that real quick because we have to go. But this is important and it goes straight to the point in this book. Men, its very easy if youre on a business trip with a colleague, dont pat her on the knee. Dont make sexual advances on her. Act professionally. Its actually very simple. It goes beyond that. Its dont interrupt her. Let her speak. Give her credit for her ideas, right . Its much more the focus purely on the harassment piece of it is misleading because what most women is not sexual assault. What most women experience is the every day, just multiple times a day daily indignities of not being respected. The new book thats what she said is out tomorrow. I have mine now. Joanne, great you have to on. Ruth, you stay if you can. It was a three column week last week so we have a lot to talk to you about. Also ahead, a new report claims what the Trump Administration is looking at ways to nationalize part of the countrys mobile network. Well explain that, next on morning joe. Running a business is not for the faint of heart. Luckily, office depot® officemax® is here to take care of you. 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One of the main drivers for that possible move to nationalize Telecommunications Infrastructure is the growing security concern involving china. One of the openings being considered by National Security officials in the Trump Administration is to have the government pay for examine build its own super fast mobile network and rent it out for private use to Companies Like at t and verizon, all this coming from axios, citing documents that it obtained. Speaking of wireless technology, appearing may be looking to cart the mattockly scale back production for its iphone x model. Apple told key suppliers it will have production targets for the first quarter, but its going to keep production targets unchanged for lower priced models. Nikkei did not cite a source for that report. And the big merger news on the morning comes by the nonalcoholic beverage industry, publicly traded sodamaker dr. Pepper snapple will be bought out by keurig Green Mountain. That combined company, guys, is going to have around 11 billion a year in global sales. Back over to you. Cnbcs dominic chu, thank you very much. Coming up, he says its become easier for conservatives to believe lies then speak truths. Eric erickson joins the conversation next on morning joe. Two,that was awful. Why are you so good at this . Had a coach in high school. Really helped me up my game. I had a coach. Math. Ooh. So, why dont traders have coaches . Who says they dont . Coach mcadoo you know, at td ameritrade, we offer free access to coaches and a full education curriculum just to help you improve your skills. Boom thats lesson one. Education to take your trading to the next level. Only with td ameritrade. My names dustin. Hey, dustin. Grab a seat. Woman okay. Moderator nice to meet you. Have you ever had car trouble in a place like this . roaring of truck yes and it was like the worst experience of my life. Seven lanes of traffic and i was in the second lane. 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Lets bring in right now radio talk show host and also founder of the most importantly the guy who works every day at the station that i grew up listening to in the late 60s, 70s and 80s when i wanted to hear the braves lose 100 games a year, wsb. Who i think tom brokaw also worked for wsb. Thank you very much for being here. Nothing changes with the braves. Nothing changes with the braves. So you had a tweet this weekend that i think is very timely today. Every once in a while, im reminded were in our present absurd situation because President Trump couldnt control himself and fired james comey. It appears republicans on capitol hill are going to ignore the Justice Department and intel warnings and try to release a memo to set up the firing of rod rose enstein which would set up the firing of bob mueller. Why cant donald trump and the republicans help themselves when they know how this story ends . Well, because, they feel like theyve been in the opposition for so long, theyve forgotten how not to be in the opposition. They control everything right now and feel like the whole world is out to get them. So theyre fighting back. And unfortunately, the problem is theyre not in the opposition anymore. Theyve got the white house, the house and the senate and still cant get anything done. Yes, and, you know, this is its amazing, and yes, you and i grew up in the same movement. We always felt like we were besieged upon by democrats running capitol hill and running the media and running hollywood and Running College campuses. Bob muellers a republican. Rosensteins a republican. Sessionings s is a republican. The senates republican. The house is republican. The administrations republican. The Justice Departments republican. How do you make a Conspiracy Theory out of people in your own party . Well, you know, joe, this is the craziest thing, this smoke and mirrors show. You do control everything. You should be able to go privately to sessions. But theyre running to the camera. We know from the Justice Department nunez and his staff never saw the classified information they wrote a memo about that stoked all these fears of republicans. Its really irresponsible. Speaking of really irresponsible, i want to talk to you about something that also is very close to your heart. And evangelical leaders over past week, id love to get your input on Jerry Falwell jr. , if you can even call him that, and also quite a few others i have a lot of respect for that i no longer have respect for, who have admitted they sold their spiritual soul, they sold their position in the evangelical movement for access to donald trump and trumpism. How are we, how are people in the pews across the south and across america, how are we to take that . Well, you know, i think people across pews in america need to remember that they need to seek their faith in god and not in donald trump, unlike a lot of these leaderingleaders. Falwells son has basically embraced the guy who is emblematic of the collapse of culture with donald trump posing as he did in front of that Playboy Magazine donald trump was on. They really probably need to turn back to god and need to remember their faith. Erick, theres always been a strain on the right of antigovernment conservativism, curdles into militias and sovereign citizens, but now were seeing into the mainstream this idea of the deep state and the fbi is an instrument of nefarious forces. Is this like a cancer that has grown to consume, metastasize the patient . You know, i think its fair to say it consumes both sides to a degree. It certainly is with republicans these days. Feels like its much more on their side. Theres been a latent suspicion of government and the fbi on both sides for a while. I think these republican congressmen are playing to badly. Seeking to undermine the institution to protect the president. Its unhealthy for the republican when either side views the government that suspiciously. I certainly wish the government would leave us alone and have some concerns about the 5g network buildout, but at the same time, i dont think theres a nefarious conspiracy in government to stop the guy they werent competent enough to stop at the ballot box. You wrote trumps decision not to fire mueller still fills you with dread. I see a lot of problems with that coming, but whats your take . Well, my take is what weve seen repeatedly is a president who chafes at any limitations on his power and any respect for the normal guardrails of president ial power. And so in that sense i have a question for erick if he doesnt mind. Sure. Lindsey graham said over the weekend that the white house knows that if trump were to fire mueller, that would be the end of his presidency. But given this knee jerk tribal system weve been talking about, do you think that thats true . Would it be the end of his presidency if he were to do that or something similar, fire rosenstein, issue mass pardons . . Well, maybe it would be with Senate Republicans but with most of the House Republicans, i dont think it would. It would probably wipe him out at the bowl late box and republicans along with him in 2018. But i just, i think the president really does believe he can go out on fifth avenue and kill someone, as he said on the campaign trail. Im starting to believe hes probably telling the truth with his republican base. Weve gotten so tribal in this country. No one wants to hold their own side accountable. Joe. You know, so lets wrap it up really quickly with the fascinating column this weekend, you see the headline at least i sort of flinched when he said the only way youre going to get a deal is, like, having Stephen Miller at the table. At the same time, you see how george w. Bush failed when he had Republican Leaders and Democratic Leaders behind him on Immigration Reform. And he failed. It seems to me that the hardliners will have i think ross is right. If the hardliners dont have a seat at the table, a gang of four, a gang of eight, a gang of 48 will not work. What do you think . Yes, you know, back even during the Bush Administration days, calling people who want to restrict immigration racist isnt helpful. There are legitimate reasons. There are Public Policy reasons beyond race. And youve got to give these people a seat at the table or theyre going to drum up conspiracies. And believe the conspiracy. Thank you very much. Eddie, last word of the entire show. Make it work, eddie. I think we live in a postfact world. A world in which we just want to confirm our opinions and we dont want to pursue the truth and we need to be better. I think its work than that but we can talk about that tomorrow. Yes. By the way, eddie, mika always thinks its worse than whatever you or i say. You could say i think Nuclear Bombs are going to rain down on all of us in the next 15 minutes, mika would go, oh, its much worse than that. Question for you as we close the show, am i ever wrong . Never, youre never wrong. Careful. Youre perfect. Acceptable . Except with the pig. The pig, that was wrong. That does it for us this morning. I love the pig. Whats the pig . No. Stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. Thank you, mika. Thank you joe. Im going to go im with her, mikas always right. Im Stephanie Ruhle with much to cover this morning. Starting with the state of the investigation. The cloud of the russia probe hangs over President Trumps first state of the Union Address. While lawmakers are divided over protecting mueller after revelations the president tried to fire him. Right now,