Transcripts For MSNBCW Meet The Press 20141123

Our immigration system is broken and Everybody Knows it. And an icon accused. Bill cosby remains silent over multiple allegations of Sexual Assault as he loses a sit com deal and venues cancel show. And marian berry died overnight at the age of 78, former mayor of washington, d. C. Im chuck todd. Joining me are nbcs joe scarborough, former democratic governor of new mexico, bill richardson, amy walter of the cook little bitle call report and msnbc and telemundo anchor, jose diaz balart. Welcome to meet the press. Good morning. Two big stories dominating the new this is sunday. We will go live to ferguson, missouri, in a few minutes, but first, it is the aftermath of the president s decision on immigration. In total about 5 million undocumented immigrants are shielded are from deportation under president obamas plan. Who are the 5 million . 4 million undocumented parents of legal american residents and 300,000 are young people who were brought to the country illegally but when they were children, and the plan also applies to immigrants who have been in the u. S. For five years or more and they can pass a background check. Whats not there . 6 million who are not covered at all and no pathway for citizenship for those 5 million that are covered. Deportations are being halted, but only for three years. And also, tougher Border Security being promised and the deportation promised focused on new arrivals and criminals. The gop has been unified on one issue how they describe the president. He is not an emperor, but he is sure acting like one. Unaccountable monarch. The question is whether or not republicans can get a bill passed through congress. The president says he has done his part. I cajoled and i called and i met. I told john boehner, i will wash your car, i will walk your dog. Whatever you need to do, just call the bill. Asked john yang to go to arizona to look at how people are reacting to the president s plan. Reporter arizona, outside phoenix, is the kind of place where president obamas immigration policies become real, potentially changing lives. Im going to be able to go to college now. Reporter myra gomez, brought here against the law from el salvador by her parents ten years ago is now eligible for protection. What do you want to study . I want to become a nurse and then become a detective. Reporter 16yearold maria flores watched the president on her laptop at soccer practice. How did you feel . I felt happy, because you know my mom is not shes go being to come out of the shadows. Reporter maria was born in arizona but her mother is an undocumented mexican immigrant. Now her mom may work legally and not worry about being deported. Tell me what thats like to live in is the shadows. Its really a big thing, because a lot of people are like scared of sheriffs, getting deported or not seeing their families ever again. Reporter this is Maricopa County where she have joe arpaio is known for his stuff stance on i willegal immigration. He is suing the to block the policy calling it a free pass for undocumented immigrants. What about the millions that come into our country, they wait to get here and they do it the right way and now how do you think they feel when you are given a get out of jail free to these five Million People . Reporter we asked republican groups for comment and they declined. El mirage was founded by migrant farm workers from mexico who wanted to put down roots of their own. Today, their descendants and newer arrivals documented and undocumented play a crucial role in the area economy. No one knows how many undocumented immigrants work illegally on farms and restaurants or in construction. What would it mean to the community if everyone who was undocumented was deported . This community would become a ghost town. It would be empty. Reporter this farmer says the new policy helps agriculture get the workers it needs. Todays folks dont want to work in the fields. They dont want to drive the hay bail at 3 00 in the morning. They dont want to harvest lettuce. This is a career they choose not to do. Even at 10, 15 an hour, they choose not to do that. Reporter for maria, it means hope for the future. Go to college. Have a better life. Not go through what mom has been through. Reporter the kind of future anyone would wish for the next generation. For meet the press, john yang, el mirage, arizona. A lot of republican groups in arizona did not want to respond on camera when we sent john down there. Im joined by two members of the gang of eight. They drafted a bill in 2013 that passed the senate only to essentially die in the house, though theres still a few more weeks of the session there. Republican senator jeff flake of arizona and democrat bob menendez of new jersey. Thank you both for joining me. Senator flake, let me start with you. Quickly, sheriff joe arpaio, his lawsuit, theres possibly a couple others that states may file. Do you support the lawsuit against the president . What i think we ought to do is put legislation on the president s desk. The president has addressed one small portion of what needs to be done with Immigration Reform. We have to do Border Security, enforcement, and have a mechanism to deal with those illegally. He has done one portion. I would rather move legislation on the other three items and put it on his desk. I understand that. But are you are you for or against the lawsuit . I havent seen the lawsuit. I dont know what it contains. I think the president do you think its appropriate to sue the president on his action . I do think that the president moved beyond his authority, no less than the Washington Post Editorial Board has opined about that. Having said that, from my role in the senate, i think we ought to put legislation on the president s desk. That ought to be the response. Senator menendez, let me pick up on the legal case here. The question is whether the president can be impacting millions of people with prosecutorial discretion and things like that. Are you comfortable this meets a constitutional test . Absolutely. Look. 11 president s going back to eisenhower on 39 separate occasions issued executive actions on immigration over the last 60 years. The most recent significant one was president reagan and the first president bush who issued executive actions that protected 1. 5 million undocumented people in the country which is 40 of all the undocumented in the country at the time. Over 100 constitutional law professors have issued statements to the president before he acted that this was well within his authority. Look, as a result of the president s actions, more felons will be deported, more Border Patrol will be at the southern border, more people will pay taxes and more families will be able to stay together. I think those are goals that are worthy of being achieved. Senator flake, is there are you against the policy that the president is implemented . It doesnt sound like you are. I should say that we did much of what the president did, in fact, went further in the senate bill. And almost every bit of comprehensive or other immigration legislation thats been proposed in congress did at least what the president did. The problem is the way he did it is going to make it very difficult to move the other parts of Immigration Reform that we really need. Its not that he did something that we wouldnt have done otherwise. Its the way he went about it. Senator menendez, i want to pick up on that. I heard this from activists who worry because the president did this, theres no urgency to pass Immigration Reform in congress. It couldnt be farther from the truth. I think the bill that senator flake and i put together along with others that got 68 out of 100 votes in the senate, we dont get those votes on major issues. We did over a year and a half ago. Its been languishing in the house. They have time to pass that bill and do the comprehensive nature that will strength our security, promote our economy and preserve our history as a nation of immigrants. So theres still clearly a persistent need to do that. The president could not and did not extent his Legal Authority beyond that which he could, which is why he cant deal with the whole issue. Only congress can do that. We did in the senate. The house needs to act. Theres one person stopping us from achieving this and thats speaker boehner. Put the bill on the floor. I believe it would pass and we would move forward. Im going to table immigration for a second. Ask you both one quick Foreign Policy question. Senator flake, House Republican led Intelligence Committee released a benghazi report. Its pretty exculpatory. The key findings, no intelligent failure prior to the attack. Security at cia sufficient. Security at state Department Facilities were inadequate. And yes, some of the development of the talking points that susan rice used were flawed. But no wrongdoing, none of the conspiracy found. Is it time for republicans to drop the benghazi theory . Ive thought the biggest problem with benghazi is how it was cast by the administration and the remarks of rice just really flew in the face of with a we knew was going on. But with regard to the other things that were addressed by this report, yes, i have thought for a long time we ought to move beyond that. Senator menendez, the president is announcing that he is going to expand the presence of troops in afghanistan beyond 2014. Biden said, they are getting out of there in 2014 come hell or high water. Thats not going to happen. Are you comfortable with the decision . We have to preserve the very essence of what we achieved in afghanistan in pursuit of our own National Interests and national security. That means making sure the taliban isnt resurgent. That means we deal with the remnants of al qaeda that are still there. On the other issue, im glad the witch hunt is over. Thats a bipartisan report that you refer to. Its time to move forward and have Embassy Security that the Senate Foreign Relations Committee passed. Is the afghanistan decision a Lesson Learned by the president you think on whats going on in iraq . Theyre not exactly the same. And obviously, in afghanistan, this leadership, the new presidency invited us and has signed a bilateral Security Agreement that was essential for us to have our troops there. In iraq, we couldnt get maliki to agree to that. Senator flake and senator ma den december thank you for joining me. Joe, let me put up reminders that politics is everything which it comes to immigration. Here is december 2006. President bushs plan for undocumented immigrants among democrats, a majority opposed it. Come 2014, in the poll, president obamas plan for undocumented immigrants, a majority of democrats, 63 , were in favor. Let me show you republicans. Republicans for president bush, a majority, smaller majority, were in favor of his plan in 2006. Essentially the same plan that president obama is pushing, guess what, were near 80 of republicans opposing it. Are you shocked that the Political Party of the president matters so much . Republicans and a lot of democrats turned on george w. Bush as he went further. Turned on john mccain. So this is a really tough decision for either party to approach. For the republican party, i think the president has overstepped his bounds. What he has done may be proven to be unconstitutional. That said, the republicans have a lot of choices to make. We have been talking about hearing about impeachment, political suicide. Shutdowns, political suicide. Defunding, its just not possible. What are you going to do . You have a system right now that hes 11. 3 Illegal Immigrants in this country. You can only deport 400,000 a year. You will defund the agencies more . It looks like turning to the Supreme Court makes the most sense. If they just use the words that president obama used in 2011, 2012, 2013, where he said hang on. I will play them. This is how our democracy works. This is not how our constitution works. Let me play the remarks of the president himself questioning his Legal Authority. There are enough laws on the books by congress that are very clear in terms of how we have to enforce our immigration system. That for me to simply, through executive order, ignore the congressional mandates would not conform with my appropriate role as president. We start broadening that, then i would be ignoring the law in a way that i think would be very difficult to defend legally. Im not the emperor of the United States. My job is to execute laws that are passed. Jose, you have done reporting on this. You are finding a few legal scholars that are questioning the legality. Yeah. To put that interview in context, it was in 2013, the first time he went back to the de l s ol high school. He was hoping to motivate he was optimistic. He felt he didnt have the authority to, for example that was a specific question i asked him, why not include which did he not do. Now, on the issue of deportation, this is not a wishy washy president. There have been more than 2 million deportations. Thats the population of houston that has been deported. Every single time someone is deported, the question that many request is, what about those kids that are born in the United States of america . Should they have their families destroyed because their parents are undocumented . He is dealing with this issue because the house of representatives didnt do squat. You just i got to say this. Every time i see the white house or democrats say, he had to do this because congress wouldnt do anything on it, i know there are liberal justices that cringe because they go thats what the separation of powers is for. If you go back to controlling precedent, the president s executive orders are looking at most suspiciously when he does something against the will stated go ahead, you were with the president , i know on friday. Should he have been trying to should he have Given Congress five more months, saying i will sign the order june 1 if you dont act . I think the president didnt take this action before the election respecting the will you think that was the right call . No. I think he should have done it, because i think it would have increased turnout in colorado. Look, i was around. I voted for the im that old. I voted for the 86. George bush president george h. W. Bush signed one like this. And there was no up roar because they did the right thing. That was pertaining to a specific bill though. Thats what president ial orders are for, not to make new policy. It was family. This is a critical point. That was pertaining to a 1986 bill passed by congress. They were it was cleanup operations. This is the cleaning up the bill. Thats the difference. The president is making new policy because he doesnt like what congress has not done. Very quickly. It was very surprising that republicans knew this was coming and they kept talking about they dont have a response. This has been coming down the pike for months. Almost a year. Something. Anything to say here is your bill. The politics, 10 million families are now affected by this act and by the Affordable Care act. They will remember. Im going to pause you guys. Thats why jeff flake said they have to pass legislation. I think you are absolutely right why flake went there. We will have more on this. The tension of what the grand jury will do in the ferguson shooting case. We will be there live. Will is announcer meet the press is brought to you by boeing, where the drive to build Something Better inspires us every day. Theres a reason no one says easy like monday morning. Sundays are the warriors day to unplug and recharge. What if this feeling could last all week . With centurylink as your trusted partner, it can. Our visionary Cloud Infrastructure and Global Broadband network free you to focus on what matters. With Custom Communications solutions and dedicated support, your business can shine all week long. Marion barry died overnight after a brief state in a marion barry died overnight after a brief state in a washington, d. C. Hospital. He rose to prominence as mayor of washington, d. C. He served four terms as mayor and one term in prison. He was a civil rights leader who became mayor. A symbol for africanamericans who put many blacks in positions previously reserved for whites. He also struggled with addiction and was arrested in a sting operation in a Washington Hotel where he had been lured there by a former lover. While that arrest is what Many Americans outside washington remember, for people in washington they would forgive him because of his days as a civil rights leader. He was 78. Any advice . [ advisor ] you can start by applying your skills to areas that interest you. [ alex ] acp advisornet has built a nonprofit Online Community to connect our veterans with business professionals, like you and me. So why not share your valuable experience . [ advisor ] i can help you with your resume. [ vet ] thatd be great. [ alex ] please go to acp advisornet. Because their Service Deserves our service. Because their Service Deserves our service. [mony mony by billy idole she cokicks in on car stereo]y. Dont stop now come on mony come on yeah i say yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah cause you make me feel like a pony so good like your pony so good ride the pony the sentra, with bose audio and nissanconnect technology. Spread your joy. Nissan. Innovation that excites. Welcome back. The eyes of the nation are focused on ferguson, missouri, where residents are awaiting a decision on whether Police Officer Darren Wilson will stand trial for shooting dead 18yearold Michael Brown in august. That killing triggered violent confrontations between protesters and police in the town outside of st. Louis over the summer. Missouri governor declared a preemptive state of emergency on monday and hundreds of reporters and satellite trucks have converged on the town. Are they preparing for the worst or making an already delicate situation even more tense . Ron allen starts our coverage this morning in ferguson. Reporter just about every one of the 107 days and nights since Michael Brown was shot and killed by officer wilson, this man has faced down the ferguson police. What do you think you are accomplishing now . I mean, were continuing to keep the presence here because we want to let them know were not going anywhere. Reporter his shirt says militarize the police. He was appointed to a highlevel commission, tasked with finding solutions to poverty, education, policing, issues fuelling the protests. You can be on the Governors Commission and also out here . Yeah. Im going to be me. Im not going to join the commission and be a sellout. Reporter at 20, he is the youngest member, a student who washes cars to help pay for college with goals well beyond justice for Michael Brown. Do you think they will indict the officer . No. Reporter you dont . If there was an indictment we would continue to be out there trying to seek change. Change is changing the system, the Justice System. People are not in the system for time that they dont need to be in. Change could be a livable wage for people so they dont have to live paycheck to paycheck. Reporter the tension builds where the grand jury decision whether to charge the officer expected any day now. The governor declared a state of emergency criticized as too confrontational and too soon. He said its his responsibility to protect public safety. Im not preparing for war. Im preparing for peace. Reporter now with protests planned in as many as 100 cities across the country, from los angeles to boston, the nations top cop has called for everyone to take a deep breath. The Justice Department encourages Law Enforcement officials to work with the communities that they serve to minimize needless confrontation. Reporter back on the streets of ferguson, aldridge who sees this as a generational fight vows to be out there regardless what the grand jury decides with his young comrades. They understand this isnt the same standard civil rights protest. This is a group of folks who are just tired of being pushed against the wall. Once you are pushed so far, what do do you . You fight back. Reporter here outside the courthouse this morning, you can see there are barricades in place. We expect the grand jury to reconvene monday. Its unclear whether they will vote, unclear whether they will hear more evidence. Its a secret process. Thats creating anxiety because people dont know whats going on. Theres distrust, especially from the community of the victim. They dont trust this process as being fair. Everyone taking precautions. A lot of businesses boarded up, barricades in place. We wait to see what the grand jury will do. Chuck . Ron, thanks very much. Im joined from ferguson by anthony gray, a lawyer for Michael Brown, Rudy Giuliani who joins me from Rockefeller Center and Michael Eric Dyson who is here in washington. Mr. Gray, ron allen brought up the anxiety of the process of the grand jury. To be effective, they need to be secretive. What are you concerned about in the process . Are you concerned about the secrecy or that they are not going to indict . Im not concerned theyre not going to indict. Im concerned about the process itself. There seems to have like you said before, theres a level of distrust over the process and those that are involved in the process that i think that thats adding a level of anxiety to this whole situation that doesnt have to be necessary had they done things a little bit differently in the beginning. Do you believe if theres a trial, even if its a trial that the cop is found innocent, mr. Wilson is found officer wilson is found innocent, that having the trial itself will be therapeutic for the community . I think it may be therapeutic. But you got to understand, chuck, there are people that are locked and loaded into how they feel about this situation. Anything short of reaching their full expectation will just never be satisfied. You got that small or maybe perhaps large group of people that feel that way. Im not so sure if it will be therapeutic for them. It may be therapeutic for the community. Mayor, im curious what you thought of governor nixons decision. You managed the largest city bigger than just about every most states. Governor nixon declares a state of emergency not for a Natural Disaster. Was that the right call . You know, its hard to second guess a governor in a situation like that. What i would have done i have had i had three situations similar to this. I would have had a state of emergency, but i would have kept it quiet. I would have kept my police on alert. I would have kept them in places where you couldnt see them, be ready in a moments notice to stop any kind of violence. But maybe not do it in advance. Its hard to second guess him. He had a tremendous amount of violence in august. Had he not declared a state of emergency, he would get criticized for not doing it. What im concerned about is no one is explaining the grand jury to people. Were not educating people. Grand juries are secret to protect innocent people. Thats why theyre secret. Its a federal crime to release information from a grand jury because a grand jury has a very low burden of proof, probable cause to commit a crime. And this grand jury is under incredible pressure, incredible pressure to indict. I feel sorry for these people, because they know if they walk out of that grand jury room and have not indicted, they may have created a massive riot in their city and maybe throughout the United States. To me, that kind of pressure is completely inconsistent with the american criminal Justice System and the people who are putting on that pressure should be ashamed of themselves. Michael, i want to go back to the decision to preemptively declare a state of emergency. Its interesting to say the mayor would have done it without telling anybody. Thats the criticism. When troops march in with an expectation protest will become violent, it creates a crowd atmosphere of ugliness and conflict. The concern has become officer safety not to protect and serve the community. Right. I mean, the mayor speaks about whats unconscionable and what should be indicted. What should be indicted is the criminal Justice System that continues to impose undue burdens on africanamerican, latino and other poor people. Number two, the police force is not to be an occupying force. Its there to be there to protect and serve. If you happen to be in the majority population where the police have acted that way, then your expectations follow sue. If you have been in the community where i have been, personally subjected to countless and repeated efforts of the police to contain for no legitimate reason, then thats a different story. Yes, the sources tell me that attorney general holder is highly upset by governor nixons particular actions there, because they send the wrong signal. They are not there to protect. Duly appropriate forms of protest by people who are citizens. Lets talk about the larger issue here that i think other communities may need to confront. I want to show you this graphic of the disproportionality of white Police Forces not look like the communities that they serve. I highlighted six here of the most dramatic. This was a Washington Post analysis where the proportion of white Police Officers was much higher than the proportion of the white population. Miami gardens, florida, right outside miami, gary, indiana, newark, detroit, thats all of those places could become future fergusons. How do you make a police force that looks like the community they serve . Well, starting with mayor koch, myself, mayor bloomberg, we have tried to make the police force in new york city as proportionate as we can. We go out of our way to do that. I think we do a pretty good job, not a perfect job. But the reality. Youre not on this list. Thats a good thing. Right. I was glad to see that we werent. The fact is, i find it very disappointing that you are not discussing the fact that 93 of blacks in america are killed by other blacks. Were talking about the exception here. Go ahead, michael. Let me finish. We are talking about the significant exception, 93 of blacks are killed by other blacks. I would like to see the attention paid to that that you are paying to this and the solutions so to that. Can i say this . First of all, most black people who commit crimes against black people go to jail. They are not sworn by the Police Department as a agent of the state to uphold the law. In both cases, thats a false equivalency that the mayor has drown which has exacerbated which is imbedded in american culture. Black people who kill black people go to jail. Its hardly if a jury can indict its hardly insignificant. Its the trust issue. This is a trust issue. Its hardly insignificant. I didnt say it was insignificant. Its the reason for the heavy Police Presence in the black community. Not at all. 93 . Not at all. The Police Presence cannot make a distinction between those who are criminals and what about the poor black child killed by another black child . Why arent you protesting . I do protest. They go to jail. Why dont you talk about the way in which white policemen are undercut the abilities of americans to live . Where dont you cut it down so so many white Police Officers dont have to be in black airs . They dont have to be. Its the matter of the affect of the state occupying the forces. How about 70 do 75 of the crime in my city how about your attitude reinforced the prop attic this is a debate that how about you reduce crime . This is a debate wait. When i became mayor, i will do that. Lets not make this. Hang on. The white Police Officers wouldnt be there if you werent killing each other. The second michael im going to stop it there. Michael, mayor, as you can see, this has a lot of tension to it, a lot of heated debate. Thank you both for being here. Anthony, thank you for coming on. Lets hope theres peace in ferguson. Are you confident there will be peace in ferguson . Im not. Its just difficult to predict how people are going to respond. Im hopeful that there will be peace in ferguson. Im prayerful that peace will reign. Mayor, michael, anthony, thank you all for being here. Spirited conversation for sure. Let me quickly go to the panel. Amy, i think he would saw the emotion and the tension that comes out of here. I think its clear the issue here is trust between the black community and a white police force. Its not always just about the police. This is about a bigger, broader cultural issue in terms of communities feeling like they are outsiders and not connected to other parts of america. I think thats what were seeing here. We are focused on this grand jury, on the specific crime. But its more than what happened that night. Thats why people are turning out. Its as much about the feelings of being misplaced its almost as if the shooting is . The background there. This is not part of it governor, did you declare a preemptive state of emergency that was not about a Natural Disaster during your two terms . I did one or immigration. I think calling in the National Guard was a little excessive. Now, in a state of emergency, a governor has flexibility do it silently, add more police. But i think we have to focus on the lessons learned. The grand jury, as i understand it, only has about 5 of the information. Let the grand jury proceed. Lets do something about the diversifying Police Forces. Thats the issue. Diversifying Police Forces is the issue. Training our Police Officers more effectively. And then i think last, do we need all these tanks, all this equipment and all these mill it makes it worse. I think at the same time, lets be calm about this, peaceful protest. There were a lot of inequities in our criminal Justice System as the professor mentioned. Joe, are you concerned that there seems to be too much preparation. News media playing a role. Theres so many things to be concerned about. Concerned about a police force in ferguson that was disproportionately white. The criminal Justice System obviously, two we saw it play out right there. Im concerned right now about this Police Officer, that there is a burden on the grand jury to not indict. Michael said, you can indict a grapefruit. But i would say that a grapefruit would have a fairer opportunity than this that Community Needs a trial. You say they need a trial. They need a trial and they need a trial. If this is an indictable offense, if they get the evidence, if they pour through the evidence and if its justified. This guy no doubt. Has Constitutional Rights as well. Very quickly, i do think its all about Michael Brown. I think thats the focus. I think thats the focus since day one in august when this occurred. One more thing, if people are upset theyre not being represented by authorities, change the system. Register and vote. There you go. In a few minutes, the story that has been grabbing headlines. This is the front page of sundays this sundays Washington Post. More accusations against bill cosby. We will be right back. receptionist gunderman group. Gunderman group is growing. Getting in a groove. Growth is gratifying. Goal is to grow. Gotta get greater growth. I just talked to ups. They got expert advise, special discounts, new technologies. Like smart pick ups. Theyll only show up when you print a label and its automatic. We save time and money. Time . Money . Time and money. Awesome. Awesome awesome awesome awesome all awesome i love logistics. Ameriprise asked people a simple question in retirement, will you outlive your money . Uhhh. No, that cant happen. Thats the thing, you dont know how long it has to last. Everyone has retirement questions. So ameriprise created the exclusive. Confident retirement approach. Now you and your ameripise advisor can get the real answers you need. Well, knowing gives you confidence. Start building your confident retirement today. We will be right back. The fight over keystone. How important is it really . And a discussion on the bill cosby accusation. Ure, you could drive home for the holidays in a germanengineered volkswagen. Like the sporty, advanced new jetta. And the 2015 motor trend car of the year allnew golf. If youre wishing for a new volkswagen this season. Just about all you need is a finely tuned. Pen. Hurry in and get zero due at signing, zero down, zero deposit, and zero first months payment on select new volkswagen models. Ay. Sometimes too close, which means were always getting into each others hair. Thats why we use head shoulders. Keeps us 100 flake free, and smells gorgeous. I use it. My whole world uses it. Head shoulders. Now smells better than ever. Welcome back. There were many take aways from my road trip across swing states. One thing i couldnt help but notice was how cheap gas was. Right now, its cheap because of the slumping global oil price. It has huge implications for the u. S. Economy and it also raises the question, with all of that going on, why is washington so obsessed with a little pipeline known as keystone . The debate over keystone, the final 1,200 miles of the pipeline which would transport canadian oil from canada to nebraska has become a care couture of itself. Its called keystone xl. Extra lethal. Hooray. We can also create jobs not just in the u. S. But in mexico. Hooray. It can help us solve some of our immigration problems. Pencil in a confrontation between the white house and the new republican majority. The Democratic Senate blocked authorization this week but a Republican Senate will likely approve it next year. Forcing the president to decide whether to issue his third veto ever. Here is the thing. Keystone is largely a is symbolic fight. They are getting to refineries in the u. S. By barge and train. The state department estimates that the pipelines construction would support about 42,000 temporary jobs but only 35 permanent jobs. Whether keystone is approved or not, a u. S. Energy boom is already transforming the debate over Energy Policy. Thanks to the domestic Shale Oil Boom, gas prices are at a fouryear low. Below 3 a gallon in more than 35 states, driven down by the tumbling price of oil now at just 80 a barrel. U. S. Crude Oil Production is up almost 80 since 2008. By 2015, the u. S. The is expected to surpass russia and saudi arabia as the worlds top oil producer. Environmentalists argue theres a cost to growing energy independence. Shale Oil Extraction and fracturing have a higher environmental cost than traditional drilling. A big expose about all this this morning. John hofmeister. Thats what is stunning is its a fiveyear shift. Is it all shale oil exporting . Thats why opec is meeting because of the growth in u. S. Oil production that has taken them and many other people by surprise. The impact this has, john, its not just the American Economy and gas prices. Were in the middle of negotiating a nuclear deal with iran. We have sanctions against russia. When it comes to how they dealt with ukraine. And yet the price of oil dropping serves as an extra sanction against iran and russia. Explain. It s. Its an extra sanction because it reduced their economic clout. Im sure we have seen what happened to the russian ruble. Iran is not able to subsidize many of its programs. They need oil to be at 100 or more a barrel for them to balance the budget . The estimates are russia needs over 100. Iran even more. The consequence of that is the people of russia, the people of iran will suffer as a consequence of the low oil prize. Thats why the panic feeling within the opec meeting coming up thursday. The reality,we bill be short of oil in the world over next several years. Global growth exceeds Oil Production. We need all the production we can have. We need all the infrastructure we can build to make sure the United States is taken care of. Are we rushing things too much . I look at the story this morning about north dakota and theres not a lot of regulating going on. When the lead regulate Tory Commission in north dakota, as the New York Times pointed are, are run by elected officials, including the governor, that just screams potential conflict of interest. In fact, the oil and gas industry is pretty highly regulated, which happened in north dakota, it has gone from nowhere to be the second largest Oil Producing state in the country. Under the three elected officials are 12 departments that do the regulation. Right. But you are confident that decent regulation is happening . That story didnt make it seem like it is. I think in every state where you had the growth, its there. You have to get the regulatory machinery in there. Its very its stronger than it was three or four years ago. They have to get it in place to deal with the scale of the activity. Its happening fast. Its happening fast in texas which has a wellestablished regulatory system. Do you think the federal government needs to get move involved . The State Government can do it provided they follow what the other states are doing. The federal government has a role to play offshore and certain epa requirements. But the states have to take care of the states. I agree with daniel that it the rush has been so rapid that its not caught up. The industry wants regulation. It wants a level Playing Field for all the actors. The reputation of the industry demands adherence to tough regulations. Daniel, in 2009 when i was covering the white house, there was talk of a comprehensive energy bill that was going to be all of the above, including nuclear power. It was close to happening. There would have been a price or carbon. Is that urgency gone because of this Shale Oil Boom . Is that a bad thing . I think it changed the mentality where we have this great sense of confidence. By the way, all around the world people look at the United States we talk about u. S. Decline. They see this as a source of u. S. Strength. Nuclear and energy source. And on terms of nuclear, it has slowed down. So we dont quite have all of the above Energy Policy we have a some of the above Energy Policy. John, are you confident that the Oil Companies can handle pricing of carbon . Yes. Many of them are actually advocating pricing of carbon. I was very heavily involved in cap and trade when it was put forward by congress and helped with is there an argument to republicans that you can make to make that happen . Yes. Cap and trade is a system that generates economic value. Republicans have trashed it unfortunately. Its got a bad reputation. I think its far better than a carbon tax when all is said and done because you can direct the activities towards reducing carbon with the cap and trade system. Daniel, john, thank you both very much. We will be back in 30 seconds. The latest on an American Icon that has been accused, bill cosby. Yeah yeah yeah yeah cause you make me feel like a pony so good like your pony so good ride the pony the sentra, with bose audio and nissanconnect technology. Spread your joy. Nissan. Innovation that excites. [singing] mony mony he told me theres a whole new way to treat sensitivity. He suggested i try new crest sensistop strips. [ male announcer ] just apply to the gumline of sensitive teeth for a quick 10 minutes. The special ingredient forms a lasting barrier that provides immediate relief and up to one month of protection. See why dental professionals endorse crest sensistop strips to treat sensitivity. Thats 1 strip. 10 minutes. And up to 1 month of protection. Satisfaction guaranteed. [ woman ] life opens up when you relieve sensitivity. Satisfaction guaranteed. Satisfa tion guaranteed. Welcome back and the panel is here, welcome back. The panel is here. Michael has rejoined us because he is the author of the 2006 book is bill cosby right, or has the black middle class lost its mind . Lets start by discussing the latest allegations against bill cosby. Michael, front page of the Washington Post has a bunch of interviewed with new folks this morning. Let me go through a quick time line of events and how this came up, rumors of him sexually assaulting women has been around hollywood for years. It came back in october. A comedian basically called cosby a rapist during it a routine. That went viral. Then november 13, Barbara Bowman wrote an essay bill cosby raped me. November 16, a publicist writes an essay recounting two times where she alleges that she was raped by cosby. November 18, an interview with janice dickinson, alleged being assaulted by chaosby. Nbc, netflix pulled projects with cosby. Three more women come forward. Michael, you wrote the book. Is this something the world that people knew about but a lot of us didnt . I think so. It was an open secret to many people. At least the allegations. But as dr. King was proud of saying, truth will rise again. I wrote a book, mr. Cosby was irate. A new biography talked about his hatred of me. I challenged him on the fact that he was going around giving moral lessons to young africanamerican people and they were nasty and vicious. This is where the retaliation is coming from. Its more because he was basically preaching. He is throwing he is throwing rocks and living in a glass house. That will always get you sunk. Its interesting. Bill cosby, look, you just sit there i think no one before there was oprah, bill cosby did more i think to bridge white and black america together culturally in a way that seemed to be inclusive, not exclusive. Im a child of the 80s. I grew up with the cosby show. I grew up with fat albert. There is so much about cosby that seems i feel like this has been happening a lot with allegations coming out of university of virginia and the Fraternity System there that its almost like every day theres another element here. Being female on the panel, you do feel as if all of these institutions that were supposed to protect women, the ones that the people that we saw as icons, that were out there as people we looked up to, its crumbling away. So i think its a broader statement to culturally and why people feel so disconnected and so frustrated with what we want to call the establishment. Its not doing what it was supposed to do. Theres the expression, say it aint so, joe. I feel i sit there with cosby and, say it aint so. I think part of the reluctance is to cover is this because nobody wants to believe it. Hes a transformative figure. You talk about the cosby show in the 80s. Talk about fat albert. I was born in georgia in 1963. I can tell you the deep south in 67, 68, my parents were playing bill cosby records. Remember when right, right. The comedy albums. He was transformative. Mika, my cohost i have heard of her. Said, why arent people more interested in talking about this . I said, two reasons. The reluctance because hes a transformative figure. Secondly, 40 years later. Its hard enough to prove a negative in real time. Now all of this is coming out 40 years later. A man has a comedian in an off comment thats what goes viral. Whats interesting is, unfortunately, thats part of the rape culture. The internet has done so. It has. How does he prove the negative . Thats you cant. You dont unring the bell. He will always be known as an alleged rapist. Two points. Bill cosby needs a real crisis manager to come out and not just say, this is discredited. He needs to come out and face these charges. Secondly, my wife barbara when we were in office, she handled sexual abuse, rape, domestic violence. Theres still a judicial system that doesnt respond adequately to dealing with these problems. We have to do that on a national basis. Theres a difference between the public person and the private person. Regardless of his positions on social positions, even society positions, i think its time not presuming guilt or innocence, but its time for this part, the private part, to be amy brings up a good point about the uva situation, whats going on there and this which it does feel as if women have a harder time proving this for some reason. They are big major figures, institutions. Its amazing. Before we go, i want do congratulate my friend and colleague and mentor, tom brokaw. He will receive the president ial medal of freedom. How cool is that . Tom will be on a baseball card. Topps puts out cards of the winners. Have a very happy thanksgiving. Thats all for today. We will be next sunday. Because you know why. If its sunday, its meet the press. Thanksgiving, and we wi will see you next sunday, and you know why, because if it is sunday, it is meet the press. When it comes to viral videos, seeing isnt always believing. Fantasy football league. Man, did he really do that . No way. Treacherous trick shots. Bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger. It would be very easy to fake this. Parking pandemonium. Im the crazy guy who cuts off parking meters. It feels real. Breathtaking biking. This is exactly the kind of place that your mother told you not to ride your bike. Insane inventions. So this is a shaving helmet. Sometimes we like to see bad