Department brought Gordon Soundland the u. S. Ambassador to the European Union from speaking to three house committees informing him of that Decision Just hours before he was scheduled for a deposition today. Ambassador sondland is among the three diplomats who exchanged potentially damning Text Messages about a possible effort to leverage the government of ukraine last summer. And according to republican senator ron johnson sondland told him over the summer the release was contingent on ukraine pointing a prosecutor who would quote get to bottom of what happened in 2016. House intelligence chairman adam schiff made clear the administrations stonewalling represents obstruction of justice to him. The failure to produce this witness, the failure to produce these documents we consider yet additional strong evidence of obstruction of the constitutional functions of congress, a coequal branch of government. In a tweet this morning the president took personal responsibility for the decision saying, quote, i would love to send ambassador sondland to testify but unfortunately he would be testifying before a totally compromised kangaroo court. Trump also quoted from one of sondlands texts which was released last week to claim vindication. He said, quote, importantly ambassador sondlands tweets stated the president has been crystal clear, no quid pro quos of any kind that says at all. All of it comes amid new reporting as well from the New York Times about trumps call with ukrainian president zelensky. According to a memo that was written by the whistleblower, a white house official described the call as crazy, frightening and completely lack in substance related to National Security. The whistleblower scribed the official as, quote, visibly shaken by what had transpired and said ipthe officials view the president had clearly committed a criminal act. Nbc has confirmed the existence of the memo and the accuracy of the times description of it. Congressman gregory meech, susan and jeff bennett. Let me start with you to take us through. The day began with ambassador sondland apparently being told, quote, youre not going to be giving that deposition today. And the day now ending with the white house putting out this letter saying theyre not going to cooperate on anything. Whats is going on here . If you read the letter, it actually reads more like a political document than a legal one. So it appears the white house is trying to give republican allies of President Trump some talking points to use in his defense as they try to run out the clock here. But House Speaker nancy pelosi has made clear that this argument made by the white house has no legal ground that its not based on the constitution, certainly not based inhouse precedent. And so what weve heard from adam schiff is that in the face of anymore stonewalling past democrats arent going to seek legal remedy through the courts. What theyre going to do is chalk that up as a new potential avenue, another article of impeachment, and beyond that adam schiff says theyre going to draw an adverse inference. That means if the white house wont give them documents on a subject, they will assume the underlying evidence, the underlying claim is true. They will take that stonewalling to be some sort of confirmation. On the sondland point which i think is fairly instructive as as you mentioned my colleagues and i confirmed today there was a five hour gap in which bill taylor in which a diplomat and sondland were communicating about this quid pro quo, this holding up of Ukrainian Military aid in exchange for trumps desire to have ukrainians dig up this dirt on joe biden. We have confirmed in that fivehour window that sondland communicated directly with President Trump and now today President Trump is now echoing what sondland said in that text message back in he said theres no such thing, there is no quid pro quo. We have a member of the House Foreign Affairs committee that has subpoenaed sondland to testify and appear for a deposition. Now by next wednesday to be deposed to provide documents. If this posture from the white house which shows no signs of relenting, if that continues, if he doesnt show up next wednesday, if these documents dont come forward, what is the next step . The next step is this is what chairman schiff said. Look, enough is enough. If in fact he wants to continue to obstruct, then we will say hes obstructing the fundamental rights of congress to do its job. And then that will become part of the impeachment. It will no longer have to worry about an impeachment inquiry if in fact hes not cooperating and hes intensely trying to cover up his behavior when you say it will become part of the impeachment, would this then be an article that would be fast tracked on its own perhaps in an effort to compel cooperation or would this play out along with the other no, i think this would be an item that could be fast tracked on its own, on its face. It is clear he is trying to obstruct and prevent the congress from getting information that it needs to do its work. And as a result of that its a separate and independent count of impeachment in my opinion, and then you look at other areas of impeachment also. If he continues to obstruct and does not come up with anything that refutes what the facts are. So the discussion thats been playing out, republicans have been making an issue of saying, hey, House Democrats have not had a formal vote in the house to have an impeachment inquiry launched, the committees are investigate. There are no individual articles that have been kprused yet, but are you saying if sondland doesnt show next wednesday there will be an article of impeachment thats then introduced . That is the next step. Thats where we have to move to. If in fact you obstruct the investigation, the inquiry, then we have to look at whats left, what is happening. He is then obstructing the impeachment inquiry, and so now we look as a part of articles of impeachment obstruction. That becomes one of those articles as well as others we can look at, and as chairman schiff has indicated if he does nothing other than that, then we will have to infer that the facts as we see them is what they are. Believe your own eyes, a betrayal of his trust as president of the United States, of the fact that he has endangered the National Security of the United States of america and that hes abused his power as president of the United States of america. Susan, what do you make of this . Because the threat is here. Youre hearing it from a member of the Foreign Affairs committee. If the ambassador does not show up next week, does not cooperate, they are now saying this becomes an article of impeachment. Obstruction of congress. What do you make of the calculation by the white house . Surely youre aware that is likely going to happen if they do this. Choosing to embrace that route rather than have him show up and testify. Im still a little unclear. If he refuses to show up, congressman, will that be part of a number of counts of impeachment or will it be a separate count that you will fast track and use it to kind of hold over the president s head . Because if its separate i think from a Communications Point of view not a legislative one but a communications one, it would be a mistake because thats mud yg the waters about why were going after the president. I think thats why we have to do the investigation, present whatever theyre going to do, obstruction makes sense. The quid pro quo makes sen, have that and keep this as clean as possible. Because what the president does, he denies, he delays, he deflects and right now were getting perilously close to having a conversation about the process than what he did. Arguing that the impeachment inquiry is, quote, alegitimate, the white house letter to pelosi says this. Given your inquiry lacks any constitutional foundation, any pretense of fairness the executive branch cannot be expected to participate in it. Tonight the white house argument is facing criticism from both democrats and at least one republican. The former general counsel to republican senator marco rubio tweeted, quote, wow, this letter is bananas. A barely lawyered temper tantrum, a middle finger to congress and its oversight responsibilities. Democrats will presumably have to fight to get the white house to respond to any of their subpoena requests. And todays subpoena to ambassador sondland is the sixth issue since Speaker Pelosi announced the impeachment inquiry just two weeks ago. Jeff, let me bring you back in on this. You were menging this reads like a political document. Ultimately its a jury of senators if it gets that far that decides that would impeach. This can be read then youre saying as this is the white houses attempt to equip republicans with a political sort of line of attack. Yeah, and interesting enough the trial balloon that the white house floated on friday when they first suggested this letter was coming they were trying to say if the House Speaker doesnt bring this Impeachment Vote to the floor they werent going to cooperate. This letter stops short of making that point. I think because republicans got the message if nancy pelosi were to bring an Impeachment Vote to the floor it would also put republicans on the record, and that was something they didnt want to do. So, yes, it does read a bit like a political screed here, but to susans point nancy pelosi has already said whats already in the Public Record as this investigation goes forward even if they dont get another diplomat to show up, if they dont get the documents they wants, what President Trump has already admitted to is enough of an impeachable offense, undermining the National Security, risking the integrity of elections, that is the case, the argument democrats are trying to build. And they feel they already have the evidence they need to do that including President Trumps own comments. Congressman, jeff mentions this, its in that letter to the speaker. The white house making the point democrats have sort of decreed theres an impeachment inquiry going on. Theres not been a formal house vote to authorize it. There was a formal house vote with nixon. Theyre not required to do it but thats been the custom at least in modern times. Were going to show some of the polling a little bit, but it looks like some consensus in the polling is there is support out there in the impeachment inquiry. Do you want democrats to call out that vote and say, fine . What were not going to do is allow the individual whos subject to the investigation to tell us how to investigate. Were in a very serious time, make sure that we give the white house the opportunity to produce documents if he has those documents and show that theres no need to impeach him for what is obvious to us an abuse of his power, a threat to National Security and a betrayal of the constitution based upon his actions. So absent that that, then what choice do we have but what i do say, susan, i am talking about all three. Obstruction becomes one of the counts that would be included therein with the same thing we talked about as far as betrayal, abuse of power and National Security interests. Those would all be compiled therein. Thats what we have to do. Its a serious time and were not going to allow the president to act as if he is one of those authoritarians who he seems to embrace. Okay, your argument is trump says you dont want to just let trump dictate the terms. It was done, though, with nixon. It was done with clinton. Is there a compelling argument to put it on the record that, hey, each individual member put their name out there and said we are as a house going to go forward with an impeachment inquiry . It is a serious and rare thing in our system. At some time when comes to a vote of whether or not to impeach or not, every member of the house will be on record because they will vote. Okay, the president s allies are echoing his allegation that the impeachment inquiry is nothing more than a compromised kangaroo court. Now as far as the administration goes if they dont want to send ambassador sondland here because this is a kangaroo court. This is not a fair process. What we see in this impeachment is a kangaroo court, and chairman schiff is acting like a malicious captain kangaroo. At the same time republicans are seeking to counter trumps impeachment hearing depositions with a hearing of their own. Senator Lindsey Graham, a chairman of the Senate Judiciary committee tweeted today he will invite the president Rudy Giuliani to testify before his committee. As the president s point man to ukraine giuliani has been trafficking in information that even the National Security advisor said was completely debunked. My initial response was theyre ready to throw Rudy Giuliani under the bus. If he has to testify under oath, hes not going to be answering Lindsey Grahams questions, hes going to be answering democratic senators, three of which are president ial candidates, i cant figure out how this reconciles and if he testifies in front of the senate, how does he not testify in front of the house . The whole thing seems a little bit off. Again, it could be part of that deflection and process instead of focusing on what the president is being charged with or investigated for. Nbcs jeff bennett there on capitol hill, thank tuesday all of you for being with us, and coming up some of the president s closest allies with uried about how the white house is dealing with this impeachment inquiry. Could a strategy of not cooperating at all actually work . Plus several polls have shown rapidly growing public support for the inquiry. We have a brand new nbc news poll on this subject. Were going to take you through all of it. A lot more to get through as well. Stay with us. Re to get through s well stay with us hey allergy muddlers. Achoo . Do your sneezes turn heads . Try zyrtec. It starts working hard at hour one. And works twice as hard when you take it again the next day. Zyrtec muddle no more. High protein. Low sugar. Tastes great high protein. Low sugar. So good high protein. Low sugar. Mmmm, birthday cake pure protein bars. Try lemon cake. What they to this contray is unthinkable and its lucky im the president because a lot of people said very few people could handle it and i sort of thrive on it. You know why . Because its so important we get to the bottom. We wept through the whole mueller scam. You cant impeach a president for doing a great job. Welcome back to hardball. That was President Trump yesterday attacking democrats for launching the impeachment inquiry into his interactions with ukraine. The president s attempts to undermine the credibility of the whistleblower had been hampered by a second whistleblower claiming to have firsthand knowledge of his actions. The president told reporters yesterday he is not worried. Not at all because the call was a perfect call. You had stenographers, people who took it down exactly. It was a perfect call. Its just a scam. Its a scam by the democrats to try to win an election theyre not going to win in 2020. Meanwhile the Associated Press reports, quote, the white house is finalizing a high stakes strategy to counter the impeachment threat to President Trump. Stall, obfisicate, attack, repeat as lawmakers seek to amass amination to be used in an impeachment trial the white house increasingly believes all out warfare is its best course of action. For more im joined by jill colvin the White House Reporter for the Associated Press, and james stewart. We are talking about this letter that went out tonight to nancy pelosi, refusal to cooperate on any aspect of this congressional inquiry here. You mentioned that timing here might be at the heart of this strategy, the idea that the white house may be trying to buy itself enough time until some point early next year where the Election Year calendar overwhelms everything . Yeah, so we saw today with that letter finally relezed by the white house and then moving forward with this strategy which they are refusing to comply whatsoever with any of these congressional requests. Theyre going to ask everybody they possibly have control over not to appear, not to comply with the subpoenas for documents. Part of this strategy from the white house could be a tactic to try to delay this whole process. Weve heard from nancy pelosi and other democrats on the hill who want to get this over as quickly as possible. There are concerns if they let it extend through the 2020 election season, it could increasingly pea seen as a political act, an Election Year attempt to try to undermine the president. But as the president hits the campaign trail later this week and next week, were going to really see him try to run on this impeachment mantle, try to make the case the democrats are trying to take him down from the very first day he took control of the oval office. The democrats were trying to get him, undermine the 2016 election and it gives him this platform to be able to run as this victim which is something he likes to do. Were seeing in many ways here very similar trump traits on display in response to this. You have an unusually good sense of him. Do you think he views this as a different kind of threat than hes faced before in his presidency or does he view this as par for the course . When you give a speech at the United Nations and a couple of press conferences ultimately the petulant, angry emotions he doesnt have out in public, people see this in private with him all the time. I think he was under stress, i think he was worried. I think hes emerged from that somewhat and hes in a Playing Field that hes very comfortable with. You know, one of the things of donald trump is hes an incredible survivor. And he has this kind of he has a lack of remorse and a lack of guilt that turns him into a sort of perpetual crime machine almost. He doesnt care about criticism that comes his way, he embraces the fight. Hes willing to say outlandish things or slag anyone whos a critic. What theyre going to do here is anyone whos criticizing the president is deep state, has an agenda, cant be trusted, is a liberal democrat, et cetera, et cetera. I think thats why at the end of the day the cohort thats going to matter here are independent voters. Not the trump base is going to move. You know, the liberal wing of the Democratic Party is not going to move. But people who are caught between those points and i think care about Good Government and care about institutions and the rule of law, theyre going to come into play in a very potent way here regardless of what trump does. You mentioned those two words we hear a lot from the president and his supporters, deep state. Also reverting to what has become one of his goto attack lines that democrats are part of a deep state plot against his presidency. First of all, the impeachment inquiry is a scam. The mistake they made, the opponents, the democrats, the radical left dep state whatever you want to call them came out with a report. And this comes a day after ron johnson used a similar line referencing the deep state of what became the Mueller Investigation originating from fbi officials who were biased against the president. You dont trust the fbi, you dont trust the cia. Im very confused here. No, i dont. After james comey you believe the fbi and cia and these Government Agencies i dont trust anything. Do you trust them now . No, i didnt trust them back then. And james, who better to have with us than the author of the book deep state. But take us through this here because you spent a lot of time looking into this. The president mentions it, his supporters mention it. At its core what is it theyre trying to say here when theyre talking about a deep state. We have an entrenched bur bureaucracy and to protect that well overturn a democratically elected president. Let me be categorical here, this is preposterous. What trump is calling a deep state in the United States is in fact patriots who recognize that they, a, work for the American People, and b, their sworn allegiance is to the constitution. They do not work for a president. James comey, of course, a pillar of the socalled deep state told me he thought in that sense, yes, there is a deep state in this country because it is protecting us and preserving the rule of law when we have elected officials trying to rub shot over it. And the idea of a deep state intersects with ukraine. We talk about was the president trying to get ukraine to dig up dirt on joe biden, his potential 2020 opponent . But the other aspect of it is ukorean is central in a lot of ways or a key player in terms of what the proponents thing happened in 2016. Spending taxpayer money and to reinvestigate the opening of the russia investigation. There is nothing to reinvestigate. It is all out there. It is not a mystery, and it is a not a deep state conspiracy. It started with one of the closest allies of the United States, the Australian Intelligence Service passing on seemingly incredible information and today we have the whistleblower coming forward and we now have an attorney general who seems to be under the thumb of the president who immediately says theres no crime here and they should be investigating. Meanwhile according to bloomberg House Republicans felt blind sided by the decision to prevent ambassador sopdland from testifying today. Quote, a handful of gop lawmakers went to the white house to discuss the issue with trump and senior advisers. White house officials agreed to approve communication of their impeachment strategy with allies who are on the front lines. The report adds this, quote, while many republicans especially in the house are anxious to defend the president , they could be in political danger when i say these aspects are familiar, this seems to be one of them, a sort of go it alone improvisational and here are House Republicans saying, gee, we wish wed known about this. And he decided to withdraw military from Northern Syria and abandon without consulting anybody. You know, when trump accuses the deep state of being involved here, the real difference of whats happening in the ukraine egent and what happened in the Mueller Investigation is trump set this in motion, nobody else did. The mueller event began when people got intelligence and began looking at the implications of it. The ukraine debacle began a day trump picked up the telephone and did exactly the same thing hed investigated mueller. And people have to come back to that time and time again. The second he picked up the phone and asked, you know, ukraines leader to dig up dirt on joe biden he abused the power of his office. I think on its face that was an impeachable act. The quid pro quos are crazy and trump cant rewrite that script. I think the other thing youre going to see happen here is theres the Intelligence Committee and Law Enforcement are going to start to coalesce around this. Youre seeing this with more whistleblowers coming to the floor and trump in that context i think is going to be his own worst enemy because hes a solo pilot, undisciplined. I think its a mistake to talk about trump as a strategic thinker. Hes really more like a visceral almost reptilian operator. Its why he survives, why he usually cant be beaten down easily. But its usually his own development that hes his own worst enemy. In terms republicans in washington, clearly some of them are frustrated by the white house and its handling of this way. To what extent, though, do they feel because of the president s support from Republican Voters they have to sort of go along with it . Its definitely something that weighs on republican minds, they know if they cross the president , come out and express any kind of reservations about what he did here, that could open them up to attacks not just by the president utilizing his twitter feed to attack them but could potentially alienate them from voters especially folks come 2020 will be on the ballot there next to the president s name. I cant emphasize enough the concerns among the president s allies and even some inside concerned about the fact he has not launched a broad enough or effective enough counter perching effort here. You didnt see a single white house official on any of the sunday shows over the weekend, youve not seen white house officials or outside allies with a unified message trying to fight back against this, and they would like to see a stepped up effort from the white house. Check out his new book, deep states. Up next im going to head over to the big board, take a look at the latest polling on impeachment. Brand new wall street journal numbers out in just the last two hours. Youre not going to want to miss these. Youre watching hardball. O was these. Youre watching hardball. So, you bought those good enough paper towels . [daughter laughs] not such a bargain. Theres only one quicker picker upper. Bounty, the quicker picker upper. If you build a truck tough enough to pull this much forward. You better make sure its smart enough to back it all up. Tailored recommendations, taxefficient investing strategies, and a dedicated advisor to help you grow and protect your wealth. Fidelity wealth management. To help you grow and protect your wealth. Hey allergy muddlers. Achoo . Do your sneezes turn heads . Try zyrtec. It starts working hard at hour one. And works twice as hard when you take it again the next day. Zyrtec muddle no more. To bring all of these stories thatity ive heard to life. I wanted to keep digging, keep learning. This journey has just begun. Bring your Family History to life like never before. Get started for free at ancestry. Com great riches will find you when Liberty Mutual customizes your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. Wow. Thanks, zoltar. How can i ever repay you . Maybe you could free zoltar . Thanks, lady. Taxi only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Welcome back to hardball. You remember from the longest time when you poll the question of impeachment it really wasnt moving, it wasnt budging. A lot of this was back during the Mueller Investigation, the russia probe. You might have somewhere in the 30s, you might have on a good day for democrats get to low 40s in terms of finding support in terms of impeaching the president. It has started to change though since the ukraine situation came to light and since House Democrats announced they were Going Forward with an impeachment inquiry, and today we have three new polls that came out. The quinnipiac, the Washington Post and our very own nbc news wall street germ poll, three new polls that come out and today show just how much the ground has shifted when it comes to impeachment. Let me show you what i mean. Remember two different questions that are being asked in these polls. The first question is not fullfledged impeachment. The first question is just the impeachment inquiry. Democrats say congress is now, the house is now launching an impeachment inquiry. The three new polls today 53 in the quinnipiac, 55 in tthe wal street journal poll and 58 the highest number weve seen yet supporting the impeachment inquiry. Low 40s, high 30s in terms of opposition. This is pretty solid support for the impeachment inquiry and put this in bigger context, over the last two weeks heres all the polls that have come out about an impeachment inquiry. Count them up, one, two, three, four, five, six of those 8 are outright majority support, and over 50 and the other two still plurality support, 49 , 43 , and in all eight polls theres more support than opposition for the inquiry and in 6 of the 8 theres outright majority support. So democrats in terms of taking that step, they have to like what theyre seeing in term of the Public Opinion polling. Take a step further . What about outright impeachment, and then the senate convicts and trump is removed from office . And the three new polls that came out today, it is a different story. You see in quinnipiac, remember outright support for the inquiry, opposition by a 49 , 45 margin to impeachic and removing trump. In our own poll opposition by a 49 , 43 margin and 49 , 44 and certainly less than there was in terms of support for the inquiry. So much more support for ininquiry. The question of actually impeaching and removing, that gets to be a lot more contested in terms of Public Opinion. Partisan divide, here democratic strong support across the board, this is the number, though, were looking at in every one of these polls that comes out there, and only 46 of republicans support impeachable and removing trump. Thats the number trump and his allies want to keep seeing. They think that keeps republican numbers in line. On the other end, the Washington Post poll, that number was 18 . Right now that looks like an out liar. If that becomes the norm, if that number or higher becomes the norm in subsequent polling, that might start to make the white house nervous, they dont want to see any dissension when it comes to republicans on this, and were going to keep an eye obviously on everyone of these polls that comes out, what does that look like, a lot of new data on this question and im sure there will be more to come and more hardball to come, too, so stay with us. Ball to c, too, so stay with us our 18yearold was in an accident. When i called usaa, it was that voice asking me, is your daughter ok . Thats where i felt relief. Were the rivera family and we plan to be with usaa for life. See how much you can save with usaa insurance. See how much you can save hey allergy muddlers. Achoo . Do your sneezes turn heads . Try zyrtec. It starts working hard at hour one. And works twice as hard when you take it again the next day. Zyrtec muddle no more. Tailored recommendations, taxefficient investing strategies, and a dedicated advisor to help you grow and protect your wealth. Fidelity wealth management. Welcome back to hardball. President trump dispatched pentagon officials to capitol hill today to give members of congress a top secret briefing on the situation on northeast syria. The briefing comes amid a torrent of criticism from lawmakers from both parties. Today President Trump invited turkeys president erdogan to the white house. At the same time he pushed back against the criticism he was hanging a key ally out to dry. Quote, we may be in the process of leaving syria but in no way have we abandoned the kurds who are special people and wonderful fighters. A top kurdish general told nbc news the president s decision was disappointing and that it hurts american credibility. He added that watching over isis prisoners locked up in syria has become a second priority. Yesterday nbc reported President Trump wanted to smooth things over the with turbish president who was upset he didnt get a oneonone meeting with trump during the u. N. General assembly. An official tells nbc the president told erdogan that it would be unacceptable. Trump left senior officials at the state department, pentagon and white house blindsided. When a National Security official told reuters, quote, theres a real sense nobodys going to stop trump from being trump at this stage, so in a tweet earlier today senator Lindsey Graham, a trump ally warned, quote, if turkey moves into northern sear dwru, a sanctions from hell by congress will follow. Senator Lindsey Graham whos called this decision a disaster in the making has spent a lot of time cultivating this relationship with the president apparently trying to avoid this rash policy type decision. So why didnt the president listen to his close ally on this one . Youre watching hardball. His s one . Youre watching hardball. 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Oh oh oh ozempic® announcer if eligible, you may pay as little as 25 per prescription. Ask your Health Care Provider today about onceweekly ozempic®. Heres the thing about managing for your business. S when youve got public clouds, and private clouds, and hybrid clouds things can get a bit cloudy for you. But now, theres the Dell Technologies cloud, powered by vmware. A single hub for a consistent operating experience across all your clouds. That should clear things up. Welcome back to hardball. Turkeys Vice President said, quote, it would not react to threats from President Trump as it continues its preparation for a military offensive against u. S. Allied kurdish forces. This comes just days after President Trump siped off on a small turkish incursion into syria and then turned around and threatened turkey with obliteration. Earlier today republican senator bill cassidy told politico that President Trump was reconsidering that decision. Yesterday senator Lindsey Graham said he would put forward a resolution asking to change course, but its unclear if he will. Shar lei psyches cautioned that rand told himself by staying close to trump trump didnt even consult him before making the decision to abandon the kurds. Graham who had giving up so much selfrespect just to prevent this outcome was not even in the room. Im joined by a member of the House Armed Services committee and an executive director of stand up republican. And senator bill cassidy says, trump is reconsidering this. Do you think thats the case . I dont know but the damage has been done. The kurds right now are probably mistrusting everything we do and say. We basically have also told the rest of the world were not trusted allies and also it shows how chaotic International Relations are in the Decision Making process and theyre not even consulting what seems to be the state department, National Security counsel or anybody else. The damage the president has done, the president has really stepped in it, and were going to be the ones that have to pay for this. Is there on that front or any other front is that going to express itself in the form of Bipartisan Legislation here . Potentially but what we really have to do is step back and figure out where we got, and stg that the Armed Services committee investigate, we got answers from the pentagon, who do we talk to . Do we talk to our generals, advisers, do we talk to the turks, the fact this president is continuously putting our National Security, our alliances at risk is something i think we should all be very worried about. We mentioned that piece there from charlie psyches about Lindsey Graham. A lot of people have been very curious about that relationship. Lindsey graham did run for president and had some extremely harsh words and obviously had been a close ally. What do you make of his role or his lack of a role i should say in this . Well, i think lindsey dpram as hes described it is pursuing reelection, and i think he said to the the New York Times months ago if you dont want to be reelected, the problem of course is lindsey has compromised many of his principles to align and i think shar lei psyches makes a great point in this piece whats the benefit to the country here, lindsey, for making this compromise of your principles even on the issues you care most about these National Security oilgss. Youre not even being consulted, and so i think thats what were seeing here. Lindsey graham may put forward, and i would imagine it may have strong bipartisan support. I dont know if theyll pursue it to the point theyll overcome a pezdential veto if the president decides to stick to this policy position, but who can really say what hell do. But i agree with congressman that damage is being done here every time we fail to live up to our commitments our strengthen globally depends on our relationships and i think the damage is being done here, and i think were looking at years of work to repair not only this relationship with the kurds but other relationships with our allies abroad. Susan rice President Trumps president obama, excuse me she slammed President Trumps decision to pull back turkish troops from syria. She called the president s decision crazy. Take a look. It seems like six days a week i just put my head in my hands. This is bat [ bleep ] crazy. These are the people who for the last four years have been fighting on our behalf with our equipment to defeat isis, and theyve sacrificed immensely and weve basically just said to them see you. A difficult way of asking the first question that i led with here, youre talking about longterm damage to the u. S. , and i take that point but listening to what susan rice said there on the cobear show and people from both parties yesterday were talking about because of this decision pie trump, the imminent slaughter of the kurds, given the reaction in the last 24 hours and what youre seeing from the administration now is your sense at least when the comes to that threat, that right now that might be on hold at least in terms of the administrations action . In terms of what the administration has, i think what congress is trying to communicate to turkey is do not attack the kurds, do not use this as an excuse to attack the kurds. It does not give license to you to attack the kurdish people. The other thing i think really bothers many of us is that they are currently Holding Close to 20,000 isis fighters right now. If this incursion happens whos going to hold these isis fighters . Slaern its not necessarily in the best interest of turkey. Turkey could care less about isis, and the assad regime could care less about isis. This is why this is such a betrayal. Just for folks who say the United States, they dont want the United States necessarily in syria but they certainly dont want the slaughter of the kurds, whats the answer to them . I would say wave only got about a thousand troops in syria right now. Thats of course a decrease from a higher number that we had, about 2,500 months ago. But weve got a thousand elite special forces, units or troops there. And so our investment is actually quite minimal, but its very consequential because those troops are supporting a kurdish Arab Christian force of about 60,000 fighters who are helping us beat isis, and we need them there and need to continue to support them. Its very little cost on our part but its a critical relationship. Thank you both for joining us. And up next Elizabeth Warren is now leading joe biden in a Critical National polling average. A lot can change between now and the iowa caucuses. Youre watching hardball. The iowa caucuses. Youre watching hardball. count time for one chore of the day ah, ah, ah [thunder crashing] ahh my mower burke the number one. Seen it, covered it. At farmers insurance, we know a thing or two because weve seen a thing or two. bert mmm. We are farmers. Bumpadum, bumbumbumbum its rukmini here from the New York Times. Hey, you see this . Were oscar mayer deli fresh your very first sandwich,m. Your mammoth masterpiece. And. Whatever this was. Because we make our meat with the good of the deli and no artificial preservatives. Make every sandwich count with oscar mayer deli fresh. [dogs [dogs whimpering]ering] the allnew 2020 Ford Explorer limited hybrid. Can tow up to 5000 lbs and has an epaestimated range of 500 miles per tank. Its the greatest exploration vehicle of all time. That could allow hackers devices into your home. Ys and like all doors, theyre safer when locked. Thats why you need xfinity xfi. With the xfi gateway, devices connected to your homes wifi are protected. Which helps keep people outside from accessing your passwords, credit cards and cameras. And people inside from accidentally visiting sites that arent secure. And if someone trys well let you know. Xfi advanced security. If its connected, its protected. Call, click, or visit a store today. For the first time joe biden is not in first place in the democratic race. Elizabeth warren passed him today in the real clear politics poll average. Its very narrow, but she has edged into the lead by two tenths of a point for the first time. It has been the biggest single story of this democratic race so far. Warren so and steady rise from it back of the pack and now into the lead. The other big story of course the doubts about biden, the shaky debate performances that have raised alarms, the questions about whether as one of his rivals put it, he can get the ball across the goal line against donald trump. But will these be the big stories four months from now when the first votes are finally cast . Will it be a race between warren and biden with Bernie Sanders back in third place, or is there another big story that is yet to be written here . A candidate from the back of the pack who will suddenly after months and months of toiling gain traction and become a contender . Well, if that is going to happy it will probably be out in iowa. Thats a state where retail politics can still make a difference. The voters are highly engaged. All those town hall meetings, the personal oneonone encounters they can still matter. Will we look up in a few weeks, maybe a few months and suddenly see Amy Klobuchar in iowa or cory booker or even Pete Buttigieg vie frg the lead or someone new altogether. More questions from debates, more money from done, more momentum overall. We have seen candidates suddenly break out in iowa before. He was going nowhere for a year and he surged in iowa and this democratic race looks Pretty Simple right now. Maybe itll stay that way, but theres still time for the candidates who dream of breaking out. That is hardball for now. All in with chris hayes starts right now. Tonight on all in am. The president is secretary of state are taking actions that prevent us from getting the facts needed for the fashions security. The American People have the right to know if the president is acting in their interests. As the white house announces it will not comply with the impeachment inquiry. The impeachment inquiry is a scam. Tonight now reporting on why donald trump doesnt want Gordon Sondland to talk. I actually spoke to President Trump just a few minutes before he placed the call. New reporting on the crazy