Transcripts For MSNBCW Hardball With Chris Matthews 20190703

And the pursuit of happiness. The fourth of july is there for because of these words, essentially the celebration of american ideals, the equality, national unity, of freedom from a bullying government, of the dignity of the individual person. Yet it is on this fourth of july and in this city that this president has decreed that a procession of combat tanks will line the capital while the president speaks to the nation flanked by the nations highest ranking military chiefs. For the first time in the history of our democratic republic, we are being instructed to honor not the declaration of independence, but our military power. And this must be said the grandeur of donald j. Tumps personal self. There is a danger being risked in such a promenade tomorrow. Who come to washington will come to champion the president , this president. Others will not be so moved. A country already divided with such malice by this president faces the peril of driving that wedge even deeper between us. To hope for violence would of course be treasonous. Not to expect it would be naive. The details and costs of trumps marshall spectacle tomorrow have already ignited wide disgust. Earlier the president previewed the speech he plans to give tomorrow on the 243rd anniversary on the birth of this republic, standing in the shadow of president lincoln. Were going to have a great fourth of july in washington, d. C. It will be like no other. It will be special. And i hope a lot of people come, and its going to be about this country. And its a salute to america. Give a speech that can reach all americans . I think so, i think so. I think ive reached most americans. Most americans want no crime. Most americans want a strong military. They want good education. They want good health care. If you look at preexisting conditions, the republicans are going to say preexisting conditions. The democrats wont be able to do it. What the democrats plan is going to destroy the country, and its going to be horrible health care, horrible health care. On twitter this morning, the president boasted the event is looking to be really big. It will be a show of a lifetime, he said. The Washington Post reports the National Park service is diverting nearly 2. 5 million in interests and recreation fees primarily intended to improve parks across the country to cover costs for this exhibit. The spectacle. It adds the diverted park fees represent just a fraction of the extra costs the Government Faces as a result of this event. President trump, by the way, downplayed concerns about the cost on twitter, writing, quote, the cost of our great salute to america tomorrow will be very little compared to what it is worth. We own the planes. We have the pilots. The airport is right next door, andrews, all we need is the fuel. We own the tanks and all fireworks are donated by two of the greats. Nice nice. Im joined by Hakeem Jeffries of new york. Mr. Jeffrey, thank you for joining us, congressman. And i leave the door open to you. Your thoughts about the aesthetics of it, the politics of it, the narcissism. Thanks for having me on, chris. Donald trump is going to turn a National Celebration on the National Mall into a National Embarrassment to feed his outofcontrol ego. This is another example of his narcissism. Sometimes its malignant. Sometimes its out of control. At this particular point in time, it really is an embarrassment, and it will be a waste of taxpayer dollars to use the military as a political prop for his own purposes and its really another sad moment during the trump presidency. Is there any way of stopping him from using the pictures tomorrow, which are basically the production is paid for by the american taxpayer, especially the people that go the older people, the Senior Citizens who go to these National Parks and pay the 10 bucks whatever it is to pay. My question is suppose he turns this into a big extravaganza for his ad Campaign Next year. That legal . Certainly i think it should be looked at, though the president , as you know, chris, is granted wide latitude and discretion in terms of the nongovernmental and the governmental activity. Weve also seen many in his administration, of course, abuse those privileges and violate the hatch act in ways they dont seem to care. I think ultimately this is all going to come down to condemnation from the American People, and a recognition that the fourth of july is a National Celebration not of democrats, independented, or republicans, but as americans. And everything that donald trump touches becomes divisive. And thats why his breaking from past practice is really unfortunate in this particular instance. What do you think about him standing where dr. King stood . Well, its a direct contrast to the things that dr. King stood for that Abraham Lincoln stood for. Those are figures who wanted to bring the country together. Donald trump is tearing us apart. Those were individuals who wanted to move the country forward. Donald trump clearly wants to turn back the clock in ways that will be unfortunate for the great gorgeous mosaic that are the American People. I think if donald trump spent a little bit more time actually focused on trying to work with House Democrats to get things done for the American People, because, chris, after all, thats our job, and we want to fix our crumbling infrastructure. We need a partner in order to do so. We want to lower the high costs of lifesaving prescription drugs. We need a partner to do so. Instead, donald trump has been fantasizing about this grandiose display on the National Mall, and also spending his time sort of interacting with dictators all across the country in ways that are also entirely inappropriate for a country that is a leader of the free world. Well, great countries, great leaders have found ways to solve problems. We had a great poverty problem in this country. Social security went a long way towards dealing with it, especially for older people, and then medicare came along. Of course weve had successful decisions about immigration before that may not have been enforced but there were attempts. Do you think the president wants solutions or he wants issues, that he loves the issues he fights over . Well, i think you hit on something right there. Instead of solving big problems for the American People, he clearly is intent on continuing to motive his very narrow base as a pathway toward another socalled electoral college. Instead of trying to bring people together, reaching across to the other side of the aisle and solving the challenges that the American People confront. If we were able to do that, then i think that would put the American People in a better possible place. One of the reasons why people are so sin tall about the political process right now is because it seems like some in washington, d. C. Are only concerned with the political Permanent Campaign as opposed to the space to govern. We as House Democrats, New Hampshire has indicated time and again, we want to govern, but we need a partner. Thank you so much. U. S. Congressman Hakeem Jeffries, happy fourth of july, sir. Joining me now former Republican Congress carlos cabell of florida and songwriter carole king who is performing tomorrow night at the capitol fourth, a tradition held on the lawn of the u. S. Capitol. Thank you for joining us. Explain the difference. I know youre eager to do that between your professional performance as an entertainer at the steps of the mall and the other end. The performance im performing in is as diverse as a mosaic as jeffrey said people from around the country. This is the traditional 39th event at the lawn of the capitol which celebrates our birthday, birthday of america. In contrast, you have a separate event. And thats the point. But youre the warmup, unfortunately. Isnt yours around 6 00 and yours is later in the evening . I dont think of us as the warmup. We are the main event and he is following. The Weather Report right now is very good for the early part. So lets see how it works out. What do you think about the fact that he is sort of piggybacking his political show on top of this national thing that youre proud to be part of tomorrow night at the capitol . His spectacle, tanks and the air show and everything, is feeding the ego of someone who is arguably the most insecure person on the planet. You think its ego . Totally. And hes insecure that he needs this. Well, white house officials are reportedly anxious about the president s extravaganza. According to politico, white house officials and allies are wringing their hands over the hastily arranged event morphing into trumps inauguration 2. 0 in which the size of the crowd and ensuing Media Coverage do not meet the president s own outsized expectations. Well, here we go again. One aide said there are questions about the Ticket Distribution and who will show up. The weather might be bad. Heads are spinning. Meanwhile, the Washington Post reports that according to one defense official, the pentagon was not planning for tanks to be involved in a july 4th event until late last week. But after the president requested them, they were shipped up by rail from fort stewart in georgia. Congressman, thank you so much. Cal be cabela, thank you for joining. It this seems like an excuse to scare up a program for the president rather than any longterm planning. My fear is a lot of people are going to show white powder are protrump. Theyre going have their confederate flags flying and license plates and all kinds of trouble making. There are going to be other people that meet in like a storm and youre going have a real conflict out there. Your thoughts . Chris, a lot of people in the government are anxious and disappointed. Why, chris . Because George Washington gave a great example of what this country is and showed why our Founding Fathers built an exceptional nation. In the capitol rotunda, there is a painting that captures the moment when washington turns over his military commission after being elected president to make it clear that in this country, the people are in charge and not the military. And that in this country, we celebrate the freedom of the people of every citizen, not the power of the government, as people do in other countries throughout the world. I think of cuba, the country my parents fled. You see military parades there constantly because the government wants to be at the center of society. Our Founding Fathers didnt want the government to be at the center of society, and certainly not the president of the United States. So a lot of people over the country. But even in the president s white house, and even among congressional republicans, there is a lot of consternation about this, because it is a very clean break with an important 243year tradition that were going to see tomorrow. And its not a positive break. Well, why do you think that is, that people that are sort of dictatorish like the castro brothers, why they would instead of giving people political freedom, which they never gave them, having promised it when i was growing up, everybody thought castro was going to be a democrat, a liberal democrat. He promised to be one. He swore he was not a communist dictator. We all heard it. Meet the press and ed sullivan, i think he did all of these shows, and he didnt do any of that. He lied to everybody. I think it is wonderful what you said about George Washington. George the third asked someone. What is washington going to do after the war . Washington is going back to virginia, his farm, the plantation. And george the third said then hell be the greatest man in the world because everybody respects giving up power like that to a democracy. George washington had the option of being king, and he said no. That is not what this new experiment in democracy is going to be. Hed take it in a second. He would take it in a second. And thats what part of this event tomorrow is. He wants to be at the center, not just of the government, but of american life. And thats just the complete opposite of what our Founding Fathers designed and of what i think most americans want. Well, i hope that everybody goes there, carole, that if they see somebody looking for trouble, they just walk away. The last thing we need is another charlottesville. The last thing we need is this battle of ideology in the streets. Absolutely. I wanted to make a comment about the fact that this is a day that we at capitol fourth are honoring the troops and are honoring the birthday of our country. This guy is taking troops away from their family. Well, lets see what tracks the tanks leave. Theyre 60 tons, these vehicles. Theyre not meant for promotions, pr displays. Theyre meant for defending the country. Thank you former congressman carlos cabell and thank you coming for your country, carole king again. Coming up, you cant appeal a Supreme Court decision, but President Trump seems to think its possible. He is ordering today the Justice Department to find a way to get that Citizenship Question back into the sentence after the Supreme Court said its not getting in there. And the battle for the democratic president ial nomination is getting tighter. It looks like fewer and fewer people might win this thing. New poll shows some African American voters may be moving away from joe biden to senator kamala harris. I want to talk to the reverend al sharpton about this. And this july, its getting close to the big battles for iowa this fall. Plus the showdown. Were exactly two weeks away from Robert Muellers scheduled congressional testimony, and President Trump is already planning a very public rebuttal that same day in front of a crowd of his own adoring fans. He is counter programing. Does he have a countertruth . Much more ahead. Stay with us. Stay with us with the freestyle libre 14 day system just scan the sensor with your reader, iphone or android and manage your diabetes. With the freestyle libre 14 day system, a continuous glucose monitor, you can check your glucose levels any time, without fingersticks. 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Before discovering nexium 24hr to treat her frequent heartburn, marie could only imagine enjoying freshly squeezed orange juice. Now no fruit is forbidden. Nexium 24hr stops acid before it starts for allday, allnight protection. Can you imagine 24 hours without heartburn . Welcome back to hardball. President trump refusing to take no for an answer, is demanding that his department of justice find a way to circumvent the Supreme Court and get a Citizenship Question on the 2020 census. Early this morning, the president tweeted the news reports about the department of commerce dropping its quest to put the Citizenship Question on the census is incorrect, or to state it differently, fake. We are absolutely moving forward, as we must, because of the importance of the answer to this question. Well, his tweet directly contradicted his secretary of the commerce, wilbur ross, who said this in a statement yesterday. The Census Bureau has started the process of printing the desennial questionnaires. Quote, we at the department of justice have been instructed to examine whether there is a path forward. Another from the Justice Department explained, quote, the tweet this morning was the first i had heard of the president s position. I do not have a deeper understanding of what that means. I can tell you that i have confirmed that the Census Bureau is continuing the process of printing the questionnaire without a Citizenship Question. Well, last week the Supreme Court rejected the Supreme Courts stated reason for adding the question calling it contrived. The administration argued that the citizen question was necessary to protect voters and enforce parts of the Voting Rights act. Im join erin blake and kim whaley, law professor and author of the new book how to read the constitution and why. Thats a timely book. Let me go to aaron first. Okay. Is it going to be in the census question for 2020, the Citizenship Question . As of right now, the government is moving forward, and they are printing the census without this question. They seem to think they can do that right now and still pursue some kind of a court case. If you look at what the Supreme Court ruled last week, it was not there are under no circumstances that you can actually do this. It was the justification that you provided was contrived. It wasnt good enough. It wasnt the actual reason. Basically, you fabricated this entire thing. But john roberts, the chief justice who wrote this decision allowed for them to potentially come back through the court system and make another case, offer another justification. The question from there is do they have enough time, because this needs to start being printed. Its due by april 2020. And also, are they going to be able to come up with a valid justification that doesnt completely fly in the face of what they just told these judges. And patiently the Justice Department decided this was not possible. They didnt have enough time, and they actually told this judge on tuesday that they were done, and then the president tweeted on wednesday, he said that this was not a settled issue. He wanted people to look for issue ways to make this happen. And that put these lawyers in the position of basically going back to this judge and offering a mea culpa saying we are going to try something. We dont know what it is. I dont even know what the president is talking about, but were still many this game right now. So theyre doing two things at the same time. Theyre printing the existing format of the questionnaire, which does not include a question about citizenship. Meanwhile, theyre fighting the court case that some hope they can get it overturned. Why do they do this . Why do they want the Citizenship Question in there politically . Well, politically, it looks like from the record that they want to basically make it hard for noncitizens to actually answer the question and then be counted for the census, because the census numbers are used for purposes of reapportioning congressional districts. To scare people who have family members who are undocumented into not participating, and therefore not building up the population of those areas where they live. Correct. And the census itself is about counting heads. Its not about counting citizens. I dont think everyone understands that. Its not like that is impossible. Yhave you have a congressionl seat that represents 600,000 people . Under the enumeration clause, its about counting people. It doesnt forbid getting additional questions on the census form. Thats the issue. Do you think the average trumpite understands this kind of push . No, i teach this kind of law. Agency might have law. Its very, very complicated. Who is going to vote for trump who wouldnt normally vote for trump because he is answering a Citizenship Question on your census . I think very few. But if this continues down this road where it could go, that is the president of the United States flouting a Supreme Court decision. The judge in this hearing said what do you want me to do, issue an injunction telling the president to stop tweeting in a man theyre is inconsistent . I thought they had to come up with a better argument isnt that still the case . Yeah, thats basically what they have to do. Can they be honest and say were doing this for political reasons . The power progressive minority voters . Can they say that . That was actually a theory after these decisions last week. Not only did that decision come down that day, but the partisan gerrymandering case came down. The court basically gave the Courts Authority to do partisan gerrymandering. Why couldnt the Justice Department come forward and say yeah, we did this because we wanted to help republicans. You mean it . There are legal experts who thought that was a potential argument they could make. The problem for the Trump Administration right now is whatever justification they offer, they have to square with what they said before. If they come forward for a completely different justification, theyre admitting what they said before was total nonsense, it wasnt their justification and thats a tough argument. This reminds me of the muslim ban. The first time no muslims could get in the country, no, we better fix that. Now well just have countries that have active terrorist watches going on. But john roberts left it. He said that the secretary of commerce has Broad Authority to put questions on the census. They just basically have to offer an actual justification. I think it was actually a pretty broad door that he left open for this question. But we didnt know if there was going to be enough time for them. We didnt know if they could come forward. Is this part of the Republican Party recognizing that theyre becoming a Smaller Group of older white people basically, recognize that thats the reality so, they have to cheat . They have to cheat through gerrymandering. They have to cheat through suppression efforts like plastic id cards, you have to come with an id card, getting old people who live in row houses to go somewhere and the department of transportation building to get an id card. All this is just to reduce the minority vote. Well, thats the argument. Im not a political analyst. But i think that is certainly what the record was developed in this particular case suggested. And actually, this as a matter of law is kind of an outofthebox decision by justice roberts. The court held that the stated rationale under the statute was actually okay. They can give whatever ration nat they want, as long as its legitimate. The problem is the court said there is bad faith here in actually reaching out and manufacturing this Voting Rights act. Do you agree with aaron, its possible this court, a 54 Republican Court say yeah, its good republican partnership, go ahead . I think not in this case on this record. I think it would have to be in ten years, frankly, otherwise theyre really undermining the rule of law. How does the house look right now . Were going have a census next year that doesnt have the question in it . There is basically no way they can delay this. The real deadline is october 31st. This is being printed right now. Ostensibly they could throw it all away, waste the money and reprint it. But october 31st is the real deadline where they really have to have a resolution on in. Thank you so much, aaron blake. Thank you, kim for coming in. What is the name of your book . How to read the and why. Which does Newt Gingrich says poses the biggest danger to donald trump . The answer may surprise you. Im not sure if newt know what he is talking about here. Im going break down the race with reverend al sharpton, after this break. This break so. How are you feeling . On a scale of one to five . One to five . Its more like five million. Theres everything from happy to extremely happy. Theres also angry. Im really angry clive actually, really angry. Thank you. But what if your business could understand what your customers are feeling. And then do something about it. Turn problems into opportunities. Thanks drone. Customers into fanatics change the whole experience. Alright who wants to go again . I do i do i have a really good feeling about this. This is mias pulse. With pressure rising, and racing. This is also mias pulse. That her doctor keeps in check, so she can find balance. This is mias pulse, and now its more stable than ever. This is what medicare from Blue Cross Blue Shield does for mia. And with over 80 years of healthcare expertise, imagine what we can do for you. This is the benefit of blue. New shell vpower nitro premium gasoline is engineered with four levels of defense against gunk, wear, corrosion and friction. That helps keep your Engine Running like new. So, maybe its time to unthink what you think you think about premium fuel. Shell vpower nitro premium gasoline. Its fuel for thought. When you have nausea, heartburn, indigestion, upset stomach, diarrhea try new pepto liquicaps for fast relief and ultracoating. Nausea, heartburn, indigestion, upset stomach, diarrhea get powerful relief with new pepto bismol liquicaps. Welcome back to hardball. Its been one week now since the first democratic debate of the 2020 primaries, enough time for the release of multiple post debate polls. This monday, cnn released a poll showing an increase in support for senator kamala harris, with the race tightening between her and former senator biden. A more dramatic rise for harris, up 13 points from the last poll in june. Only two points away from biden. Well within the polls margin of error. Todays Washington Post abc poll show sanders and sanders still ahead of warren. Here is what Newt Gingrich had to say about her standing in the race. Who poses the biggest threat on the left right now for the president , speaker . Hed probably have a marginally harder time in some ways with biden or marginally harder time with kamala harris, who i think, i just wrote a piece for newsweek, i think she is probably the most dangerous of the democrats. But i also think that a left wing politician from california is a pretty long way from the center of the american political system. Im joined now by reverend al sharpton, host of politics nation on msnbc and kristen hahn who is a democratic strategist. Reverend, i love you thinking, because i dont know what it is. Tell me. There is a conflict than what you heard old newt come out with there. He said dangerous on the stage i think he was saying, but not so much in the voting booth. I think he was saying that. I think that is probably what he was saying. Its hard to tell with newt. But the reality is that what ms. Harris did, senator harris did is show, one, that she would fight, and she would fight on an issue that a lot of people, including her was passionate about. And the issue, chris, is not just bussing. The issue is when mr. Biden responded, he said, well, senator harris, when you were bussed, it was the local school board that chose that, not the federal government. So are you not advocating state rights . Thats a concern not only to blacks, but thats a concern to women and lgbtq. Are we going back to bathroom cases like in indiana . How can we say that to calm people down, we should let the federal government step back in the states decide when effect youre going back into states rights. That makes him very vulnerable if he doesnt clarify that. I think he was doing that to get off the hook, reverend. Im not sure he was arguing the constitutional theory there. I think he was just saying dont blame me. Its not my job. Thats what it seems like he was saying. What do you think . But it is the governments job. The governments job is to protect minorities whether they be black or latino or gay against the tyranny of the majority. Thats what the whole Civil Rights Movement was about. Did they tell the freedom riders dont ride the greyhound buses because its going to cause division . Do they tell gays dont march in indiana because its going to cause division . We would never have the Voting Rights act, any of that if that was the deciding factor on people standing up what was right and what made this country better. You know, i think biden has a problem. She can apologize for certain things, for insensitivity. But he called forced bussing or bussing required by the courts a nine. His language was not nuanced. He really used the language. And lets face it. It wasnt very popular among working class whites who go to public school, thats their option, and they didnt feel like they should go back in the Old Neighborhood they moved out of. And they said why do we have to go back to that Old Neighborhood again. I understand that for kinds of social reasons, but the fact is you cant defend that today. Back then it sounded like a tough call. He is using bad examples. There are all these missteps. In some ways he didnt have any place to go but down. But kamala harris, she showed it wasnt just on one issue, i dont think, particularly to women. She was a strong performance. Can she win i dont know how you lose if youre constantly on offense. If youre scoring baskets in a sports sense, and the other side cant hurt you, how do you lose . Biden, on the other hand, i cant think he goes on offense against her. What is he going to stay against her . I think he has trouble. I think he has trouble against any woman. Im telling you. What there has been a shift, at least in the democratic party, a fundamental shift. We want to see a woman in office. We saw that in the midterms. You speak for yourself. I hear it. Whoever the woman that emerges as the strongest, and i think its her right now, has a really good shot and can be a real danger to President Trump at the ballot box. I think things have changed like you said. In a Campaign Rally today, senator harris made the case why she is ready to prosecute in a political sense trump in the general election. Lets watch. Donald trump has predatory nature and predatory instincts, and the thing about predators you should know is that they prey on the vulnerable. They prey on those who they do not believe are strong, and the thing about predators you must most importantly know, predators are cowards. Predators are cowards. And so when we look at this campaign and we look at the table before us, it will be to successfully prosecute the case against four more years of donald trump, and i am prepared to do that. Reverend al, ive been watching debates for years. Theyre very powerful in the moment. They last in their power about a week, about a week. And then campaigns toned go back to the numbers theyre in before. It just is amazing. I saw that with reagan and carter, nixon and kennedy. Beth fouhy said kamala is very good at winning the moment. She did it against brett kavanaugh, bill barr and joe biden. But she hasnt figured out a way to sustain that forward motion. What do you think . I think that the difference this time is she is dealing with opponents in the primaries, and youre dealing with someone that can continue to guard the offense on policy issues, as i said, states rights versus federal government, deal with health care, deal with Voting Rights. If she stays on the offensive which distinguishes herself from some of the others, i think that she can turn the moment into a movement. When youre doing a standalone announcement with 20,000 people, what she did, thats a moment. But youre not in the ring with some other people. When she got in the ring, she showed her strength. And that is what a lot of democrats want, no matter whether theyre progressive or moderate, and they can see her doing that to donald trump. And we all know donald trump is afraid of prosecutor. We know that. Most people are. But let me ask you about this key question. A lot of democrats are afraid of this rape charge. E. Jean carroll, it looks like a serious charge. It used to be a capital charge in many states. Trump said to people about the central park five, he said they should be executed, even before a trial. And they were later exonerated as factually innocent. What about this case . She was saying predator. I dont know if she is getting closer to effecting that, of saying that is a factor in this case. I heard it. Predator . Im not sure anything sticks. You look at the central park five. With trump . With trump. Why doesnt it stick . A credible charge. A credible charge. We heard him speaking about women in a derogatory way on a recording, and what did he get away with . We heard his voice talk about sexually assaulting women, and it didnt stick. So i think this running against dems is an entirely different ball game. I do think if we have a woman candidate come through the primary, he may have some issues there. Who is a stronger candidate, elizabeth warren, senator, or senator harris . Senator harris. In the general . I think so. I think if she can stay, you know, towards the center. Thats my favorite question right now, because i think those two are really on the move. Thank you, reverend al sharpton, as always, sir. And kristen hawn, thank you so much. Robert mueller is set to testify two weeks from today. President trump is warning him. Who is he . This is al capone stuff. He is warning him to stick to his script and is planning also a counter program, a big rally. Who is he . This guy doesnt work for him. He doesnt work for trump. Who is he to warn him . What is the bullying, or else what, mr. President . What are you going to do about it except youre acting like a bully, or a predator. Were back after this. Ck after. door bell rings its open ck after. Hey. This is amazing. With moderate to severe ulcerative colitis, are you okay . Even when i was there, i never knew when my symptoms would keep us apart. So i talked to my doctor about humira. I learned humira can help get, and keep uc under control when other medications havent worked well enough. And it helps people achieve control that lasts. So you can experience few or no symptoms. Humira can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. 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Two weeks from today, former special Counsel Robert Mueller will testify before congress in what many see as the democrats last good shot at making their case for the impeachment of President Trump. It will either happen now or never. Mueller will testify before the house judiciary and Intelligence Committees in what could be the most consequential hearings of trumps presidency. The president has long called the Mueller Investigation a witch hunt and a hoax, despite the fact that it handed up 34 indictments. And that includes the president s former Campaign Chairman Paul Manafort and the president s former lawyer michael cohen, who are both serving time in prison, as well as the president s former National Security adviser Michael Flynn who is awaiting sentencing. President trump has not shied away from going after the former special counsel. I think he is a total conflicted person. I think mueller is a true never trumper. He is somebody that dislikes donald trump. He is somebody that didnt get a job that he requested that he wanted very badly. Bob mueller is no friend of mine. I had conflicts with him. We had a business dispute. We had somebody that is in love with james comey. Terminated them illegally. He terminated the emails. He terminated all of the stuff between strzok and page. Theyre gone. And thats illegal. Thats a crime. Well, mueller has already laid out what to expect from his testimony during his only Public Statement on camera back in may. Any testimony from this office would not go beyond our report. It contains our findings and analysis and the reasons for the decisions we made. And the report is my testimony. I would not provide information beyond that which is already public in any appearance before congress. And President Trump is warning mueller that he better hold true to that and limit his testimony to whats in the report. The president tweeted he said he could only stick to the report, and that is what he would and must do after so much testimony and total transparency. This witch hunt must now end. No more do overs. No collusion, no obstruction. The great hoax is dead. Thats trump talking. And now weve learn in order about the president s strategy to counter Robert Muellers testimony two weeks from tonight. Its the most trumpian approach possible. Think about it. Thats coming up, next. Stay with us. , next stay with us when you have nausea, heartburn, indigestion, upset stomach, diarrhea try new pepto liquicaps for fast relief and ultracoating. Nausea, heartburn, indigestion, upset stomach, diarrhea get powerful relief with new pepto bismol liquicaps. But prevagen helps your brain with an ingredient originally discovered. In jellyfish. In clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve shortterm memory. Prevagen. Healthier brain. Better life. Most people think a button is just a button. 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Donald trump is trying to make sure that he is playing offense, not defense when former special Counsel Robert Mueller testifies in front of congress in 14 days. Last night, the Trump Campaign announced the president will be holding a rally in greenville, North Carolina on that same day as mueller is testifying. On capitol hill, the president s republican allies, meanwhile, are preparing a coordinated effort to try to, quote, undercut muellers credibility and paint him as a political pawn and democrats efforts to try to undermine the president. Trump has already tried to intimidate mueller to deliver his testimony to congress. Im joined by mike quigley of illinois, member of the house Intelligence Committee, and ken dilanian, nbc news National Security reporter. Congressman, what do you make of these three salients, if you will, points of attack. Theyre going to try to intimidate the guy into not saying anything more than he put in the report. The republicans in your committees are going to go after him probably for strzok and his girlfriend and all the bad stuff, the bad apple stuff, and all that stuff. And of course he is holding a rally. I guess the rally cant do much about. But youre going to be sitting there with each democrat getting five minutes to make their own pitch. Meanwhile, the republicans apparently have a coordinated campaign to bring up all the dirt on mueller. Yeah. I think what ill point out first is when a special counsel was appointed there was bipartisan support, talking about the integrity of mr. Mueller, and that he was the perfect choice. Of course when they come out with a report they dont quite like, all of that changes. None of this is any different than what theyve done for the last almost three years, which is to act like the president s political counselor and legal lap dog, doing whatever it does to take to protect the president politically and legally. So thats no surprise. At least part of our time on the democratic side will probably be involved with defending the special counsel at that time. What about getting him to go a bit further than he did in his report and what he said in those eight minutes in that later statement . I think thats a great point. Look, i have the greatest admiration for the special counsel, but he doesnt get to decide what he is going to talk about. There are very fair questions about what happened to t counterintelligence investigation, where all this began. Talk about trump tower moscow and what they gleaned, the possibility of money laundering. We know there were people working on the counterintelligence investigation. What did they learn are, they still working on this project, and what is the role of the fbi . A lot of questions for us to understand how the president was compromised. What are the risk to our country as a result of the president being compromised . Kim, what i was struck by was the bullying tactic of the president. It was almost like al capone. He better not go he doesnt have any authority in the institution over this guy mueller. He has no right to tell him what to say. I think he is scared, because robert mueller, if he could speak freely could really powerfully criticize the president in a way that almost no one else can. This is a lifelong republican, chris. He volunteered for the vietnam war when donald trump was in studio 54, who led the fbi after 9 11. And what he didnt do in his report, he said there was no conspiracy, no crime that he could prove, but he didnt pass moral judgment on the Trump Campaigns flirtation with the russians. He didnt say you know what . This is a terrible idea thif th did this. That would be bad for donald trump. He is going to demolish trumps two big talking points that mueller found no collusion and mueller exonerated trump. Neither of those things are true. Mueller said it in the eightminute News Conference, but now he is going to talk about it in detail. Lets not forget that News Conference moved the polls on impeachment. Lets talk than for a moment with the congressman. Congressman, youre a political kind of guy. Tell me how you can move that dial. Can you move it from 20 some percent who support impeachment to 40 . How do you do that when your big day comes two weeks from now . I think members have to be very judicious in their time and not give a 4 30 speech and give the special counsel 30 seconds to respond. I think this needs to be a coordinated plan to allow the special counsel to tell the truth. And youre absolutely right. In eight minutes, he moved the dial. He is going to have four hours in front of the American People. Its our job to set him up in a position where hes allowed to go into this in more detail, tell the American People. And if anything, if all he does in four hours is to go into more detail as the fact that the president was not exonerated and why, i think that in itself moves the needle. Hell have the opportunity to go into detail in a manner that matters. When i would write long briefs in criminal cases that a threejudge panel would still have a lot of questions, and obviously, the members of the Judiciary Committee and the Intelligence Committee will have those kinds of questions. Has Speaker Pelosi told you folks on the committees that are hearing the testimony from two weeks from now what her standard is in terms of changing her position and going along with impeachment . Is there any signal what the standard would be . I think that the speakers public stance has been her private stance. I think she understands how to count noses in the senate and what it might mean from a political point of view. I do think that the needle is moving within the caucus and within the American People. I think asking for the impeachment inquiry will help us from a legal point of view. I call it obstruction after the fact. After the muller repoeller repo out, the trumps obstruction has only got worse. If were going get to the truth, were going have to move forward with the inquiry. Thank you so much. Mike quigley over illinois, ken dilanian, thank you both. Have a nice fourth of july. There is some good news there. Well, about our country, i should say, not about this president. Youre watching hardball. T ths t. Esiden youre watching h ardball. Cake in the Conference Room showing em youre ready to be your own boss. Thats the beauty of your smile. Bring out the best in it with crest 3d white. Crest removes 95 of surface stains. In just three days. Wanna take your xfi now you can with xfi advantage. Giving you enhanced performance and protection. When devices are connected to your homes wifi, theyre protected. Helping keep outsiders from getting inside. And if someone tries, well let you know. So you can stream, surf and game all you want, with confidence you can get coverage where you need it most. Thats xfi advantage. Make your xfi even better. Upgrade today. Call, click or visit a store. I speak now on the eve of this undemocratic spectacle in this city where i work, a city where i have chosen to live my life, a city that i love. I am as you all know a student of national politics. My interests are the relationship between the free individual and the government in washington and the role america should rightly play in the world. I like the way that president harry truman talked about we americans. He called us this country. He didnt mean the government in washington, but the American People and those splendid moments when we feel and act as one. Some of those moments i have shared myself. I was in college when jack kennedy was killed. I was in remote africa when 50 years ago this month americans crossed the starfilled night on their way to the moon. I shared this countrys anger at our leaders lies over vietnam and watergate, and yes, the petty indignities of the clinton era. And through it all, i have watched the american spirit not only survive, but prevail, where politicians have failed us, the country itself has risen to the challenge, quickened to each new assault on its morale. I have loved this city of washington that trump intends to abuse tomorrow. Since my first visit here with my parents and two of my brothers back in 1954. Im especially fond now of driving home at night past the monuments of lincoln and jefferson and looking across the potomac to the lee mansion, and on it the little twinkle of light guarding the grave of john f. Kennedy. The good news is that we are all still americans, and that same spirit that built this great country continues to rip across it today. The same destiny lures us, the same optimistic rebellious nature drives us that did even in those early scary days of recreating our republic. When our country was small but our soul was large, large enough and gutsy enough to declare to the whole world that all are created equal. And thats hardball for now. Thanks for being with us. All in with chris hayes starts right now. Tonight on all in what is the president afraid of . Is he afraid of the truth . The exuberantly lawless president defying congress at every turn. I respect the courts. I respect congress. And tonight as the tanks line up in washington for trumps fourth of july jamboree, what where is the oversight from democrats . Its almost saying i dare you to make me obey the law. I dare you. Then disturbing new accounts from inside the migrant camps. They have no right to try to keep legislators who are entrusted with oversight of their agency from documenting what they see. Congresan