Ever directly interviewing the president of the United States about collusion or obstruction of justice. After two years of looking into President Trump, his campaign the kremlins unprecedented interference in the 2016 election, special counsel mueller has delivered his findings to the Justice Department and at 5 00 p. M. Word came that notified congress the russian probe is officially over, leaving the fate in the hands of attorney general william barr. In barrs letter to the house and Senate Judiciary committees, he stated simply special Counsel Robert Mueller has concluded his investigation the to interference in the 2016 election. And i may be able to advise you taz to the principal conclusions as soon as this weekend. I intend to consult with Deputy Attorney general rosenstein and special counsel mueller to determine what other information from the report can be released to congress and the public. There are major questions, Big Questions and calls from congress for Robert Mueller to answer them. We have the best reporters possible tonight. The atlantics and joining me by phone the New York Times michael schmidt. Im going to have this until somebody answers it. How can the president be pointed to as leading collusion with russia, aiding a russian conspiracy to interfere with our election physical none of his henchman, children, associates have been indicted . He was giving orders to do stuff with the russians. If none of them fwhur were indi how can he be blamed . Youre right to question that because we know the president cant be indicted. So we can consider the possibility that mueller is accusing him of impeachable offenses. But the point you raised argus against that. Trump cant conspire with himself. If he was conspiring with it the russians, he would have had to have at least some help, at least with roger stone and when they didnt charge stone with conspiracy, that told us they didnt have it. Will they accuse trump of misjudgment, negligence, of allowing himself and his campaign to be manipulated by a russian covert opraise. What steps did he take during his campaign . Did he open himself up to this . Its all bad but its not crimes if youre a member of congress or you think he missed the boat. Because we know about the meeting june of 2016. The meeting at the cigar bar. We know all those meetings in kislyak in cleveland. All of these dots, were to believe, dont connect . Thats the conclusion in front of us. It didnt prove anything. And the trump tower meeting was bust. They didnt actually hand over incriminating information. It showed that don trump jr. Was willing to accept help. Habbed emails or analytical stuff. It never panned out. I got to stick with you, my colleague, why was there never an interrogation of this president. We were told by weeks that you dont get the motive until you hear from the person himself whos being targeted. So far tonight we have nose reason to believe trump is going to be charged by rhetoric in the document itself, the Mueller Report, without ever having to sit down and answer his dam questions. How can that happen . That is a great question. The spells counsel talked to bill clinton but President Trump wouldnt sit down with him. He would never talk to him and mueller decided it wasnt worth the subpoena fight that would delay the investigation and report for months, knowing he would lose. If at the end of the day President Trump was never going to sit down with mueller chrbs thats what you would advise him to do, then why delay the investigation. Mueller should have sent the subpoena to stand on principal, to show he took that extra step. He chose not to do that. Why no indictment if there is collusion orrer mueller believes there was collusion and why no questioning of the president . In terms of the charges, there are a lot of parts of mueller that have lived on and will live on in attorneys offices from norb to washington. I thin you have to look at mueller and his report as a midway point as these things go forward. Wait a minute. His job is to go to the collusion question. Thats why he had this huge team. They were to look into the collusion matter. He cant pass that off to someone else, can he . I dont know. They take a very lawn period of time and mueller has cast a shadow over the president and the president certainly would want this to be wrapped up as soon as possible. We dont know what mueller found. We dont know what barrs going to tell us. Im not sure we can make a conclusion that they didnt find this or that. We have to look at the results of what barr discloses. Why dump this at 5 00, close of business on a friday . Thats when you dump stuff youre not proud of. Thats when you sneak something through the media. Close of business friday for something weve been waiting for for two years and closing up the report for months, maybe since august. And now they drop it at 5 00 in the afternoon and were left with a question mark. Wheres the collusion report . Obstruction report . And how come you never interviewed the big guy ever . This is a pattern weve seen from the special counsel since the beginning. Hes dropped indictments on friday. I wouldnt read too much into that aspect of it. The fact that mueller is not recommending further indictments is a surprise. But at the same time we dont know what the report says. He might have found evidence of behavior that was unseemly or behavior that was wrong, that did not rise to the level of criminal activity. Theres a lot of this thats couched in the language of a counterintelligence investigation that does not rise to the level of criminal activity. We still dont know one big question. Why was alpha bank paying during the election . What about Michael Cohen in prague . There are reports that his phone was there. What about all the meetings Jared Kushner had with the russians during the transition period . Why did mike flynn lie about the sanctions phone call do you think well actually get those nonindictment answerers if you dont indict the president because you dont believe you can . How can you blame the president in any regard if youre not willing to say his henchman carried out his orders . I dont get it. To what extent will mueller get into conduct thats not criminaly charnelable. We might never know the answerers to the questions because muellers going to stick to why decide to prosecute and why not decide to prosecute . If youre going to indict, indict, others with shut up. Youve been instructing me on this about the nature of a possible rico charge, the president over seeing a number of his henchman, people, kids all involved with the russians. How come nobodys been indicted and were told theres not going to be indictments in this report . How can we say the president is a ring leader . I thin tk the answers are contained in the Mueller Report. When he elects not to bring charges, she write as lengthy memo explaining the reason why. So we can be confident that Mueller Report contain as detailed anal sysis of why chars werent brought. The question whether barr will release that information to the congress and the American People. The department has another policy that suggests the reasons should not be made public. For example barr knows from the Mueller Report of high crimes and misdemeanors by the president and mueller says the only reason he didnt indict is because of the doj policy against indicting a sitting president , barr could sit on that information, siting how could the president be responsible for high crimes and misdemeanors if none of his people are responsible for breaking the law . Unless theyre confident they could get a jury to convict, they dont bring charges. Thats higher than the Legal Standard of probable cause. It could be theres sufficiefig sufficient evidence to charge people with crimes come on, paul. A d. C. Jury wouldnt convict in these sets of circumstances, all this information about what it would look like to an average, commonsense juror and you dont feel they could get a conviction . Obstruction of justice, firing the firb director. Does that count as obstruction of justice . And those are complicated questions. I think mueller probably could have got a d. C. Jury to convict based on some of the evidence we already know. I was thinking more of the collusion stuff. You write the big foot articles for the front page. What is the impact with regard, put it together with nancy pelosi said no impeachment on the table. Im curious. The big story is impeachment. Is that still a a big story . All depends on what mueller has found and what is relaid to congress. If its relayed that the president broke the law, then this will head in a certain direction, i am sure and that will pus the democrats on impeachment and their base will want to do something. If barr says he didnt find anything, hell be under pressure to release as much information as possible so they can quote on quote check his homework and see if the investigator truly followed the facts and werent impeded by politics. Theres some indication well find out this weekend. And we will just have to see how far he goes. Lets use your powers of deduction. If there was a criminal conspiracy to advance the russian interference in our elections led by the president , many would be involved. Flynn, it could be manafort, it could be certainly roger stone, rick gates, all his family members, especially those who met with the russians. How can you blame thes for being a rico type leader of the crime if none of his henchman werent indicted and they werent indicted today and were told they wont be. How can you build a case for collusion against the president . You present very logical reasons why that may not exist and a case like that may not exist. I think what youre forgetting about is the issue of obstruction. Thats another question. But go ahead. While theres a lot of questions about russia, theres many more about obstruction and actions he took in office. If you look at the questions mueller wanted to ask the president , there were far more about obstruction than anything else. And he never answered those questions but mueller continued to investigate. Thats when he spent a lot of time to understand the president s mote vases as he tried to gain control of the inquiry. And i think thats the other bucket here that sometimes people forget about but where the president may have the most exposure. I can see him saying all they got me on is this argument of obstruction. By the way im allowed to obstruct when im innocent. He already started saying that today. There was a hunt of that in his box Business Interview that he did. Hes basically saying this is a fake issue. The russia thing was a hoax and i had to protect myself from that. You could see that argument forming in what he was saying today. Collusion has always been the name of the game. Fabulous reporter from the New York Times. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senate Minority leader, Chuck Schumer said attorney general barr must not give President Trump, his lawyers or his staff any sneak preview of special counsel muellers findings or evidence and the white house must not be allowed to interfere in decisions about what parts of those findings or evidence are made public. The American People have a a right for the truth. Transparency. That was strong. And Joaquin Castro who sits on the house intelligence committee. I want to know what you think of this unsatisfactory bit of news which is nothing about collusion except no indictments of the people around the president. Nothing really on obstruction of justice. Not going to be any interview of the president by the special counsel. Obviously the countrys been waiting for this report for a long time. Its owed to the American People. I believe the acting attorney general shouldnt make any changes, deletions, additions. Should just let the American People see for themselves and make their own decision. Theres basically three buckets. Collusion as youve been talking about, obstruction of justice, insurance fraud, anything like that. I think that in that report i would suspect if their obstruction of justice findings, that bob mueller will say congress has to deal with that part. Based on what i heard Michael Cohen talk about with the intelligence committee, i believe the Southern District is looking at some of mr. Trumps business dealings. Thats those two buckets. The third is the collusion bucket. I cant say for sure what they found on that. Obviously theyre not going to go forward and do indictments on the president. Because its been doj policy in the past but we dont know if that means they have no suspicion or evidence and simply didnt think they had enough evidence to convict. What do you think about impeachment now . Does this make it more or less likely the congress will conduct a formal impeachment process, including subpoenaing mr. Mueller himself and make him tell us everything he didnt decide to do. I do think the congress and the American People should hear from mueller directly how he went about it and so forth. I think the important piece or the most important piece for the congress will be obstruction of justice piece and what the Mueller Report lays out with respect to that. How about under oath . Could you put the spelcial counsel under oath . Sure. Somebody that served in the Justice Department, i dont think he would have a problem testifying under oath. Do you think the special counsel will, at some point in the next few days, will clarify what he discovered about this president and the russians . Yeah. I hope so. I think everybody hopes so. Democrats, conservatives, liberals. Our elections were interfered with in 2016 and we know there were russian agent involved with that. The question has been whether and how much any americans helped them achieve that. Senator Joaquin Castro of texas. Thank you, sir. The president laid down his last line of defense. This is critical. There was no collusion, no obstruction. Everybody knows it. Its all a big hoax. No collusion is a big lead. And im going back to your question. How can there be a charge or claim of collusion . Formally the term is advancing a russian conspiracy to interfere and screw with our elections, basically . How can that accusation be laid against the president by mueller if hes not indicting any of trumps people here . Ive been listening to the questions youve been raising and theyre important. Im asking. Im not speculating. We were told by a doj official there will be no indictments. Doesnt that startal you after all these meetings . I would suspect the reason is in the report. Theyre ultimately making clear the report should be released to the public and the underlining findings and evidence should be transferred to the relevant committees. Thats why its important to get the report so we can understand the rational. Weve been waiting for two years. It comes out at a friday at 5 00. Thats the dumping ground close of business on a friday. By the way, does it bother you the president of the United States is the target of this whole inquiry was never interviewed . Again i want to read the report so i understand better why he wasnt interviewed and idea ai would like to understand the razal. Id like the see the report so we can get a better sense. If i were bill clintons lawyer, i would say you mean a president doesnt have to respond to subpoena . When bill was put in that booth, he was forced to talk on the tape all about Monica Lewinsky on the tape. You mean he could have got out of it . I think its hard to make a finding without seeing the report. I think its important we not lose sight how far weve come after 22month vez. 37 indictments. Multiple guilty pleas, convictions including people like Michael Flynn and others. Context matters. Nobody around the president has been indicted ever since this two years began about collusion. Nobody. I think a couple of folks have raised the paint that we also cant lose sight of the obstruction of justice piece of this and the reality that was a big component of the special counsels work. Again id like to see the reports and the findings become public. I think the American Public deserve to know the truth. Unfortunately in the way politics work in 2019 its the democraticb caucus will be interested and the republicans are going to wink at that baby. Theyre going to buy the trump line. Arent you afraid of that . I hope its not the case. I think its going to depend on the evidence that comes out. You are an optimisticb guy. The republicans are waiting for the evidence. You really believe that . Let me say this, chris. Conte context matters, history matters. The last time special counsel was with respect to the waco incident. It should be made pub with redactions and so forth is not consistent with the law, past practice. Release the report that American Public. Transmit the evidence to the relevant committees in the house so we can engage in our important oversight committees. Very judicious tonight from colorado. Still with me is jim delaney, natasha and paul butler. Youve been watching my interrogatives here, my question of people. Im unsettled by the fact that all this investigation has yielded so far no indictments about collusion. You asking all the right questions. But theres another way to look at this whole collusion question. No conspiracy charges. But the fbi launched an investigation into the question of is donald trump compromised by a foreign adversary by russia . And the answer is not a criminal charge. If you have an affair with a chinese spy, you get fired and lose your security clearance. What if the Mueller Report finds they were dupes to manipulate our election and they allowed themselves by their willingness to accept dirt from the russians, they allowed them selves to be manipulated by a very fisticated russian operation. That may well be impeachable. Just because there wasnt a crime, doesnt mean theres not a scandal. The evidence isnt entirely passive. We know his kid went to trump tower to get dirt on hillary clinton. He went to the meet. We know that theres meetings with kislyak. We know the russian the republican platform was changed akorbd cording to the purposes of the russian government. We know all of this. What we ecan conclude from the absence of criminal charges is it didnt rise to the level of criminal conspiracy but we cant conclude that theyre blameless. So if somebody was paid off for whatever currency to change the republican platform on ukrain, that wouldnt be a crime . That would be bribery, straight up, right . So the question is was there improper influence, which may not be a crime spaeespecially w youre dealing with an adversary. They allowed them selves to be manipulated and used and turned against the democracy, essentially and the details of that, we think are in the Mueller Report. This letter gives us a clue. This letter that Mueller Report is more detailed than we thought. He talked about giving the baseline of declinations. And he says theres this other information im going to discuss about whether we can make this public. The other information, thats the stuff we see. What about the things that are missing. The dog that didnt bark here. There are all kinds of laws about denial of public service. You engage in purposes beyond your elected official position and youre doing something for someone else. Youre denying Public Services to the president here. If youre fobbing for the russians, isnt that a crime . I think it very well might be a crime but then it depends on the facts. We can look at mueller as being a a very efficient and productive prosecutor and a cautious, somewhat conservative one. So 199 criminal charges, every Single Person mueller has charged, hes gotten with the exception of roger stone who hasnt had his day in court yet. He only brings cases when he has unimpeachable evidence he knows he can win and that maybe for people that havent been charged, he didnt feel he had that quality of evidence. Very quickly to kims point. President trump is far from out of the woods. So the with president appears to have made a number of misleading statements about trump tower moscow when he was a candidate for president of the United States. Now, its not a crime for a candidate for office to lie. At the same time the russians knew he was lying and so he may have been compromised in a way that has Important National security imp lblications and co lead to a impeachment removal from office. Whats different than two or three hours ago . We know muellers investigation is over. We dont know that the investigation is over. The house will continue to investigate things like deutsche bank. And i think that the biggest lingering question now is trump compromised by the russians . Because theres nothing else that logically explains his behavior and his deference towards vladimir putin. Schiff has said thats one of the biggest things he wants to investigate. And i think were losing sight of the fact that trump submitted written answers to mueller. Were there any inconsistencies that mueller wanted to charge him with but couldnt because hes a sitting president . You would expect it to. Theres so much out there we dont know. I think the biggest question is what explains the president s behavior throughout course of the campaign . Is he compromised by the fact he was doing trump tower moscow . I think just because there were no indictments related directly to conspiracy, his henchman were indicted. Not yet. Not for collusion. But the purpose was to get information, presumably, to flip them on the president toorbs get information what happened during the campaign. Apparently mueller didnt think it rose to the level of criminal activity. Buts were going to learn more as the days go on. Moments ago Senate Minority leader Chuck Schumer warned President Trump and his lawyers not to interfere with the release of it. Now that special counsel mueller has submitted his report to the attorney general its imperative for mr. Barr to make the full report public and provide its underlined documentation and find toogz congress. Attorney general barr must not give President Trump, his lawyers or his staff any sneak preview of special counsel muellers findings or evidence. And the white house must not be allowed to interfere in decisions about what parts of those findings or evidence should be made public. The watch word is transparency. The president himself has called without qualification for the report to be made public. There is no reason on gods green earth why attorney general barr should do any less. I want to bring in u. S. Congressman ted lie. What is your thinking about not having the president get a sneak preview. Let me say today is a historic, proud day for america, that despite multiple attempts by the president to stop this investigation, Robert Mueller and his team were able to finish it and the fact that he kept his job and Deputy Attorney general rosenstein kept his job. So lets not lose that sight. If there are portions classified, congress should be allowed to see it. Whats the concern about the president getting a look before the rest of the country does at this report . The concern that they would tamper with it, that they would put pressure on attorney general bill barr to redact certain portions and that would be unacceptable. My question is it wasnt really conclusive because they never interviewed under oath the president. We were told for weeks you have to get to mote whv it comes to obstruction. You have to figure out what the person says is being investigated. And weve never got an on the record, under oath interview of the president. Ever. That is correct. Im a foreign prosecutor. It would have been really great if donald trump was curages enough to do an interview. But hes not required to as a tart of an investigation. He could simply clam up and not say anything if he wanted to. There was no legal, formal requirement. Why did bill clinton have to be taped before the American People about monica . He had to go through that humiliation on it television, basically for all to see and this president skips town . Bill clinton could have asserted his fifth amendment rights. He didnt have to do it legally. Whaults the next step . Congress decides on impeachment. Is it backen the table or still off the table its late march. Its going to come up in the next couple months or not . The mission is fairly narrow. Hes looking at whether he can get enough evidence to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that someone committed a federal crime. The committees in congress have a much broader mission. We want to know did donald trump, his family or associates commit any crime whether or not it was related to russia and third, how to keep this from happening again and how to explain it to the American People. Based on what we find, well decide should we go forward or not with impeachment but we dont have enough of a record to decide that now. Wlaults hats winning as of . I dont think we have enough evidence for impeachment. I want to bring in roger of illinois. Let me ask you this. Youre smiling. I dont know why anybodys smiling tonight. My two questions. If theres collusion, how come none of his family, associate said have been indicted and theres not going to be anymore indictments . We dont know there was collusion by the president. But we need to see the refoort understand why he decided not to charge. Theoretically its possible, although unlikely, that he may have thought the charges may have risen to the level of an indictable crime with regard to the president. And nobed ay else was involved. Theoretically others were involved. He organized this whole thing by himself. That he had his people involved in doing it for him. None of his kids, nobody. No indictments. Right. I mean one evidence piece of evidence that i thought was pretty striking was the meeting between mr. Manafort and kilminik in new york where he passed private polling data to him who was thought to be connected to t connect russian inittelligence services. M manafort lied about that in the recent proceedings. Im curious what did mr. Mueller say about this particular episode and did it get passed tough to someone else to investigate . I know youre focussed on this collusion issue. Thats why we had the special counsel. Yeah. With regard the collusion issue, i would like to know what mr. Mueller thought he could not pursue on his own but he needed assistance from other investigative agencies or u. S. Attorneys who are also continuing their investigations. In other words im curious whether in this report and i think the American People must see this report by the way whether this was a midterm report or a final thesis . Did he basically farm out the rest of the investigation to other u. S. Attorneys to complete the investigation . Well see. Good thought. Stay with us. Much more coming up in tonights breaking news. Special counsel mueller has can concluded this is his final report and submitted it to the u. S. Attorney general, william barr. Apparently hes going to feed morsels to the members of congress over the weekend. D rsels to the members of congress over the weekend. Some things are out of your control. Like bedhead. Hmmmm. Rubadub ducky. And then. Theres national car rental. At national, im in total control. I can just skip the counter and choose any car in the aisle i like. So i can rent fast without getting a hair out of place. Heeeeey. Hey ah, control. vo go national. Go like a pro. This and even this. Hark, i deep clean messes like this. But i dont have to clean this, because the selfcleaning brush roll removes hair, while i clean. [announcer] shark, the vacuum that deep cleans, now cleans itself. I felt i couldnt be at my best wifor my family. C, in only 8 weeks with mavyret, i was cured and left those doubts behind. 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Liberty mutual customizes your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Steven could only imaginem 24hr to trenjoying a spicy taco. Burn, now, his world explodes with flavor. Nexium 24hr stops acid before it starts for allday allnight protection. Can you imagine 24hours without heartburn . Welcome back to hardball. Special Counsel Robert Mueller has concluded his investigation of the russian interference in the 2016 election. Nbc news reports no more indictments. He may be able to brief them on some of the morsels. He says the big stuff over the weekend. White house reporter for bloomberg news. Author of the plot to destroy democracy. Since 5 00 when you heard no indictments, no interview with the president. Theres one indictment i thought was critical to the entire matter. That was for Julian Assange and wikileaks. Because if theres a bridge between roger stone and the Trump White House its one thing to say theyre a nonstate Intelligence Agency and another thing to bring a criminal indictment against them the way they did the Internet Research agency. The whether its going to be handed toff be processed later, i dont know. But that should have happened. In the narrative we covered, roger stone knew ahead of time about the email dump. Nobody can tell the future. He had it inside. And you were suggesting that could be the dreirection of a conspiracy. I recall two years ago saying spy hunters, unless its a specific individual who has handed over intelligence to a foreign power, those things dont get adjudicated the way you would think. This is an investigation into the president of the United States and his immediate staff, who may have conspired with a a foreign power and this report may spell it all out and leave it for the congress. Let me ask you, daniel about this. We understand the reporting is right now. The president is sitting outside the terrace at maralago. Should they feel they just skipped justice . That they got away with everything . No. We just dont know that. They probably know more than we do, frankly. All those meetings with the russians and scot free . I think that is probably right. Showed all the set of stars weve been looking frat all these months maybe dont make constilation like we thought. Ive been told you got to get to motive and you got to interrogate the guy. In the typical criminal investigation, you dont get to a interview the charger. Yes, you need to know what his or her intent was but you learn that through other sources. In a corruption investigation or a investigation of a high level official, time was they would not dare take the fifth because they would get so much public condemnation for doing that. Ive been noticing they tend to do it and say thats my right. They can make plausible argument, as the president s lawyers have here saying its a perjury trap. Keeps saying that over and over again. Its not a perjury trap just because youre interviewing it. Are the kids clear . Of the conspiracy piece, likely. What bot new york . I think Southern District is very much investigating the trump organization. Robert mueller was named to investigate possible collusion by the president , v russian conspiracy on interfering with our elections. We dont have that tonight. An indictment means criminal activity. It does not mean that theres not anything the public might find distasteful. Theyve been saying all along that maybe theres questionable activity or things that are unsavory, but was a crime broken . What crime is collusion . And people have mentioned conspiracy. Thats a hard crime to prove and establish its not necessarily illegal to give information to a russian spy and they cant prove that you knew that. So internal polling data, you could share that with someone posing as a russian professor and thats not a crime. Ruling out the indictments does not rule out there could be things in the report the public would find distasteful. We follow politics here at hardball. Have been riding this through the desert waiting for an explosive report that would determine if the president did can anything impeachable. Isnt there a sense of dissolution here . That clarity has not come to bear . Weve been seeing the democrats trying to hedge this, talk about how its not just about russian interference in the election. Its about any foreign interference in the election. Talking about the other investigations. The democrats have seemed aware that they need diversify i understand completely. But you have to get some republican buy in and i dont know that tonights news is goi going to add to that case. We still dont know so much of this. Well said. Thank you sir. I think youd be spiting more fire at malcolm. That document, that report could be an impeachment document. It could be itself an indictment of the president. Its too early to say. Will we know this weekend . Who knows. Its huge. Robert mueller has completed his investigation. Were back after this. Were back after this. My experience with usaa has been excellent. They really appreciate the military family and it really shows. With all that usaa offers why go with anybody else . We know their rates are good, we know that theyre always going to take care of us. It was an instant savings and i should have changed a long time ago. It was funny because when we would call another insurance company, hey would say oh we cant beat usaa were the webber family. Were the tenneys were the hayles, and were usaa members for life. Get your usaa Auto Insurance quote today. Around the clock. And with a 0 copay, thats something to groove about. Lets groove tonight. 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How you live, what you love. Thats what inspired us to create americas most advanced internet. Internet that puts you in charge. That protects whats important. It handles everything, and reaches everywhere. This is beyond wifi, this is xfi. Simple. Easy. Awesome. Xfinity, the future of awesome. Great graphics. At the end of the special counsel investigation, the focus shifts to the attorney general and to the congress and what this report might mean for the fate of Donald Trumps presidency. Weve got a great panel to close the show. Joy reed, charley psychos. This is an allstar time. Ive expressed my skepticism because of no indictments and culose itself. Im going to talk about charley. Charley, what do you think the right wing will say tomorrow morning when it theyre having coffee around the country and as they talk to each other saturday night, will they say he got away with it . Yeah, theyre going to spike the football, claim vindication and its all premature. I dont think critics should be as disappointed as they sound and i dont think the spin the president has been vindicated. And as ken mensed earlier. Something may not be a crime but it could be a scandal. Come on, charley. You really believe you can impeach a guy because of scandalous behavior and not criminal behavior. High crimes . Because we know the president cannot be indicted under Justice Department guidelines. So yes, thats a political judgement and there are things you can do within the law that constitute an abuse of power. Lets go back to the fact that right now in the giant spin room, but we do not know what is in that report and the report is not the only investigation. You still have the congressional investigation. You still have new york. If i were trump, id be having a happy dinner tonight because they missed the blade of the guillotine tonight. Youre agreeing with charley or me . Theyre high fiving. The idea they didnt see any indictments here. In their mind theyre through the collusion piece of this after this. And in their mind the talking points tomorrow will be donald trump has been cleared of any collusion. The Russian Investigation is a bust. The other question people should be asking is how much are we willing to trust william barr . He shows himself to be an absolute defender of the president in the devin nrunes school . Maybe the guy who proceeded him school. Do we trust its going to be a complete and full report . He may bury it. In terms of burying things f the president says no collusion. I can see on saturday night live, no collusion. If that turns out to be the case, they dont have a criminal case against him for advancing a russian conspiracy, can he then say since i was innocent of the investigation focus, therefore i was right to defend myself, therefore there no obstruction of justice. The only thing their prime directive, protect trump. The worse. Hip of him is what t party is about. If theres nothing that is a complete and clear indictment of the president , they will refuse to act. Thats what theyll do. They are just the rear guard. I say fay langs. Thats my roman term. Thats a nice way. Your book is great on thi this what does this do in terms of none of the kids, none of the henchman have been indicted. How can the president be accused of being a ring leader if hes not accused of a crime . I think we fell on a trap that the only issue was criminal collusion, which isnt even a defined legal concept. We have a situation which trump did collude with putins office to try to advance a business deal and lied to the pub lb about it. His top three advisors, manafort, Jared Kushner, don jr. Met with a russian emsary to get a a secret plot to get trump going. Then lied about it. Manafort met with a russian intellig talked about a plan that would help the kremlin. He did t the behest of a putinfriendly oligarch and the big lie saying the whole campaign the russians were not attacking to help him, when they were and he was briefed it was happen. Weve fallen in a trap of criminal collusion when we see time and again prosecutors go after crime. Thats all im saying. But this is bigger than crimes is what im saying. Tonight we dont have the fact. Michael, no indictments. That would have been a lot more of a powerful statement. Number one lets wait a couplef days going beyond the criminal aspect of it. And if this doesnt change, this is the first time in 230 years a lot of americans think our last president ial election may have been decided by a hostile foreign power. And this is also the first president in 230 years, George Washington was inaugurated 230 years ago next month in which a lot of americans are suspicious that donald trump is acting on behalf of the russians and has a seeberate relationship there. The report may shed light, it may not. Youre going to have a Democratic House working very hard to answer those questions. What is the thresh hold for impeachment . Scandal . Is it playing patsy with loosy goosy with the russians . It may not be criminal but youre working with the bad guys. Is that impeachable . As you remember gerald ford said the standard for impeachment in the house is whatever the house says it is. I think it shows the insanity that for the current in congress the idea a president of the United States would willingly take the help of a hostile foreign power to make money or whatever reason hes in bed with americas adversary, that should be enough. It should be eflf tnough for republicans on impeachment. The fact that they dont care, they dont mind. No. Current republicans, this party is a colt of personality and schaubingly enough and it depressingly enough they dont care. Well, it shows Robert Mueller is not a politician, apparently looking at the law, very narrowly and not looking for a frighting aspects of the United States and they were doing what they wanted done because why did we change the republican platform . Why was the president so gungho promoscow all these years . Thank you, sir. Thats hardball for now. All in with chris hayes starts right now. Er good evening from new york. Im chris hayes. The brab news the political world has been anticipating for weeks. Special counsel bob mueller has concluded his investigation of russia and the campaign. We got word at 5 00 p. M. That mueller delivered his report to william barr, recently confirmed, for barrs review. In a letter to the bipartisan leaders of the house