Transcripts For MSNBCW Election Night Decision 2020 20201104

Great to have you here in still unfolding night of results. See the bank of american flags there, and a big group of tightly packed together people indoors at the white house. Apparently ready for the president to make remarks. Expect them next couple of minutes. President has telegraphed in advance that he would falsely declare victory. He has falsely claimed on twitter tonight that the election is being stolen from him. These claims are obviously false enough that twitter has flagged them as being potentially misleading about ongoing electoral contest. Well see what he says tonight but i would say im not sure expectations are high whether or not the president is going to follow joe bidens lead needing to be patient. No. And we should be done with any exercise of expecting donald trump to call for calm or be an adult in the room. As he always does, he telegraphed the remarks on twitter feed. What is remarkable is degree to which he continues to flout the cdc guidelines with second member of the team rebuking him this week. Deborah birx. Two of the doctors warning against what is unfolding in the east room. Interesting to see if he says anything that undercuts him. Hes trying to go back to court. If he goes full mad man tonight, im not sure that actually strengthens his position. These courts dont want to look like theyre part of the madness. Will be interesting to see if he further undercuts himself by just going full absolute mad man tonight which is what i expect to happen. But you never know. Im going to ask the control room for something they wont give us, drop everything on the lower third to see the crowd. Im assuming this is pool camera and cant control the angle. Thank you. Wanted to see how close people are together and whether or not theyre masked. Will be important part of the message what the president is broadcasting about his leadership and his campaign. Again we will put those numbers back up, its important part of the way we communicate information on nights like this. Let me just say, i dont think i think he thinks hes winning. And i thought he think before the polls started closing he was strongly positioned. They saw the race tightening in the final days. I think he is going out because he thinks hes still in this. Look at all still uncalled, that is not i dont think hes reached defiant stage yet. I think he feels good where he is. I think exceeds their expectations. Certainly. At this moment, nevada, arizona, North Carolina, maine, hawaii, georgia, michigan, wisconsin, pennsylvania all remain to be called. Any effort by the president to convey finality about the results, let alone a triumph should be viewed as tactics and not truth and dangerous effort to usurp and undermine the democratic process thats still under way. He could surprise us and be responsible here, but i think highly doubtful. Make no mistake, this is a Political Campaign event within the confines of the white house and as youve probably caught on to by now, there are big screen televisions carrying not Just Television but fox news on either side of the collection of every available flag in washington, d. C. So the crowd when we saw them waving and all that, they realized that fox news had taken the live picture of the room. But teleprompter set up, and the like. We should probably one more time warn people going into this. The president has telegraphed his intentions on twitter. Millions of votes have yet to be counted, in case the president falsely claims victory here. In our country, president s dont declare the victors, voters get to decide that. This may be even longer and more drawn out and fraught process than weve already been through. Thats our sometimes messy democracy. Well have to see what he intends to say here at 2 05 00 a. M. Eastern time. Should also be noted that president has not just telegraphed potential premature and false declaration of victory but idea that counting ballots after tonight is wrong, improper or effort to steal the election. In states all the over, including deep red states, long standing and totally normal process to not only count but continue to receive ballots postmarked ahead of election day that may arrive in the mail some number of days thereafter. Republican, democratic, swing states, all regularly accept ballots and count them after election day if they were postmarked and put in the mail before polls closed. Including military ballots. Remember those are some of the ballots that every single election come in after election day. To repudiate ballots after election day would repudiate military ballots. While were waiting, steve do you have news on wisconsin . Waiting for absentee vote from city of milwaukee. Donald trumps lead in statewide count is 105,000. In 2018 had a somewhat similar situation, waiting for absentee vote in milwaukee, it came in late, flipped the race and lifted democrat evers to victory. Weve been told 170,000 absentee ballots, total of which will be released from milwaukee next couple of hours. If it broke like that, 84 of that would erase the 109,000 and put the race in tie. With trump leading by 109,000 and that many absentee votes sitting in that democratic of a city, thats potential there. Not only place with absentee votes, some republican and democratic as well. By far biggest source of them though, thats the potential it has in terms of the effect statewide here. Trump leading, four points, 110,000 votes. But democrats get a monster number, could erode that dramatically. Ive seen reports and forgive me if youre characterized it this way. Seen reports that those ballots from milwaukee will be likely reported in one bolus, one group. Not trickling in whenever they start but all in one fell swoop. Thats right, they route them all in one location, work on them, then report them out. Sounds like will have that in next couple of hours. To underscore what you just said, if biden wins those ballots from that location in same proportion that tony evers did winning the race, would make it a tie. If biden is lower than evers proportion, trump maintains lead. There are other places getting voting here and there, nothing on the scale of milwaukee. See what happens other places but has the potential to become extremely close. I think thats what im saying. Do you have expectation when milwaukee will convey the number . Hearing the next couple of hours, 3 00, 4 00 a. M. Hoping you would say next few minutes. Its 2 10. Talking about 3 00 or 4 00, were closing in. Anecdotally, what the Biden Campaign is hearing from milwaukee, they feel good about that state still. Not going wobbly in terms of their view of how wisconsin will come in. Thats interesting. Another president obviously blew through the previous warning we had when is going to start speaking. Next couple of minutes. Well keep eyes on that. But millions of ballots remain to be tallied. Maine, nevada, pennsylvania, hawaii, North Carolina, none of the states are called by nbc news, most have no characterization who is leading any of the states. Theres a lot still to come in tonight and lot of interesting reporting to be done on the ground in terms of when votes will come in from which of those states. I will stop joking around that the night is young, we know its not. But this election is young in terms of us getting close to figuring out who is going to win it. One of the things that has been interesting, texting back and forth with democrats swirling around the campaign and the calm is remarkable. Democrats on and around the campaign are remarkably calm about the states. People watching in the audience are not calm but theyre not panicked. Even with florida, people around the campaign were pretty sanguine about it. Werent expecting wasnt something they thought they had in the bag. But remarkably calm. Just got a text back about wisconsin, there is no panic. Theyre calm. This was the plan. Whats happening now was the plan. What they were prepared for. This is why bob bower was on in public way not just last night but last couple of weeks talking about all the legal challenges being baseless. People should make no mistake, donald trump is about to come out it was reported he wanted to settle with mueller. There isnt a two sded legal argument here. Theres the law that legally counted votes should be counted and theres whatever trump is about to do. Other thing to keep on the horizon, keep eyes on, popular vote. Bidens lead in popular vote right now roughly 1. 4 million in terms of the popular vote lead. Obviously thats not how we pick the president. Otherwise we would have had a lot more democratic president s in recent decades. For that to be outstanding while so many potentially determinative states are also outstanding shows were still absolutely in middle of this. And i think it gives theres nothing you can do to comfort people watching this happen. I do think that for a lot of americans, looking at the polls, the idea that there isnt a definitive repudiation, ive said it before, of donald trump, hes got to be going in he cannot possibly feel chastened looking at the result because obviously there is a substantial percentage of the American Public that does not look upon the 230,000 dead and economic collapse et cetera as a reason not to let him keep the job. So without that repudiation, one might expect hell be even more fired up right now to try to claim hes got a mandate based on what hes seen so far. But the caution we have to keep giving people is this not the end of the race. This is were in third quarter, and Fourth Quarter might be tomorrow night. Thats not abnormal, nothing to panic about. Its not satisfying emotionally but thats how elections work. There is not definitive end here, trump should not feel vindicated because it hasnt happened yet. We need to keep calm and let it happen. Illinois republican congressman, military veteran, current member of the National Guard has tweeted tonight to and at the president , stop, full stop. The votes will be counted and you will either win or lose and america will accept that. Patience is a virtue. Interesting. He was handily reelected tonight to his seat. Illinoiss 16th. But this will get interesting too. Its a point nicole and i always talk about, the few, the proud, the brave, the republicans who will be vocal about this. Down to two, right . Well. Thats about it. I will say, one of the things thats been interesting tonight, how many incumbents of all kinds have been reelected. Not been a night where incumbent senators have been turfed out or house. Most likely way to lose the house seat is primary rather than general election in our Jerry Mandered United States of america. Its been remarkable to see the stability between the map, congressional and senate races up and down. Either side youre not seeing not only no wave, its a pond you drop in a rock, theres no ripples. And i wonder what you think is the message for republicans . Does appear they were rewarded for slavish devotion to donald trump. Lindsey graham, who has been the most slavishly devoted was quite well rewarded for it. So its a message about the durability of trumpism because of who the Republican Base is. White, rural, you know, workingclass, noncollege voters. Because of that, even if donald trump does not prevail in the end, trumpism aint going nowhere. Each of the senators were reelected to continue to serve dutifully donald trump and his agenda and what he believes in. I think thats right. We have to wait for all the states outstanding whether we would apply that analysis, if he loses rest of what is contested, rust belt, arizona, nevada. It will be viewed perhaps differently. But its certainly the case among the republicans who have been working to try to defeat donald trump that defeating trumpism i think really understanding it is a ecosystem that really exists in its own orbit, not spinning in the sorely system anymore. Fox news has created a gravity system and gravitational pull all of its own. Whether its the pandemic, challenges to legally cast votes, whether its the two dozen women who credibly accused donald trump of sexual misconduct, whether its the mueller investigation. Donald trump so far seems to have benefitted from his own information ecosystem that know longer intersects with the rest of the world. Two adults in the room thrown flags on donald trump are owners of social media companies, facebook and twitter. And question becomes if biden emerges, even if narrowly as the winner, he then faces a country that is substantially trumpist, that has a bare majority of people who reject everything that that comes with, including caging children and stealing them from their parents and the sexual harassment, et cetera. All of that. But then a substantial minority that is okay with it or embraces it. So i just wonder what all of this says about us. As the rest of the world watches this happen all night tonight, i think it raises real questions about what america is at the end of the day, and whether what trump is is more like what the american character is than people ever, ever wanted to admit. I think thats the right line of questioning. Other line of questioning is really examine the despair that people feel at a time of a pandemic when their lives have been taken from them, when theyre home teaching their children, hanging on to jobs, out of work, driving cars they thought they could afford months ago to food banks because they cant afford cereal. Theres a despair that makes insane things that come out of trumps mouth sound better than the despair theyre living with. One conversation is one youre talking about, we may not be the country we think we are. And another may be we are underreporting and misunderstanding the despair people feel with isolation and economic despair. That said, also may be early part of the election returns in which trump is made oneterm president after impeached in first term. We dont turf out president s in first term often, george w. Bush, jimmy carter. Havent been a lot. And he may be about to lose his place as president. Undoubtedly will be narrowly, so both dynamics are still at work. If you had a choice now looking at results to be donald trump or joe biden, think would be hard to say youd prefer to be donald trump right now looking at these results. No doubt. And i think donald trump would have maybe not donald trump himself but his campaign would have agreed to that analysis earlier this evening. We just got the front page of the New York Times, headline over a split photo of biden and trump, headline is this turnout soars, along with suspense, as nation in tumult delivers verdict. The times by necessity silent as to what the verdict is, theyve got to print this now to be on newsstands tomorrow morning. Unlikely will be a verdict known by the time people are reading that print edition by tomorrow as well. We saw a view of the crowd to your point earlier, appears no mask, no problem. Heard earlier tonight that all invited guests were going to offsite facility to get tested prior to arriving at the white house. Fox news images have now been replaced with the slide of the Trump Pence Campaign logo. Some activity at the doorway. Usa, usa, usa, usa, usa. Ladies and gentlemen the president of the United States, donald j. Trump. [ cheers and applause ] thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you very much. Please sit. Thank you. This is without question the latest News Conference ive ever had. We love you. We love you. Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate it very much. And i want to thank the American People for their tremendous support. Millions and millions of people voted for us tonight. And a very sad group of people is trying to disenfranchise that group of people and we wont stand for it. We will not stand for it. I want to thank the first lady, my entire family, and the Vice President pence, mrs. Pence for being with us all through this. And we were getting ready for a big celebration. We were winning everything. And all of a sudden it was just called off. The results tonight have been phenomenal. And we are getting ready, i mean literally were all set to get outside and just celebrate something that was so beautiful, so good. Such a vote, such a success. The citizens of this country have come out in record numbers, this is a record. Theres never been anything like it. To support our incredible movement. We won states we werent expected to win. Florida, we didnt win it, we won it by a lot. We won the great state of ohio. We won texas. We won texas by 700,000 votes and they dont even include it in the tabulations. Its also clear that we have won georgia. Were up by 2. 5 or 117,000 votes with only 7 left. Theyre never going to catch us. They cant catch us. Likewise weve clearly won North Carolina. Were up 1. 4 . Or 77,000 votes with only approximately 5 left. They cant catch us. We also, if you look and you see, arizona we have a lot of life in that. And somebody said somebody declared it was a victory for and maybe it will be, thats possible. But certainly there were a lot of votes out there that we could get because were now just coming into what they call trump territory. I dont know what you call it, but these were friendly trump voters and could be overturned. Gentleman that called it, i watched tonight. We think its fairly unlikely that he could catch. Fairly unlikely . And we dont even need it. We dont need that. Just a state if we would have gotten it, would have been nice, arizona. But theres a possibility, maybe even a good possibility, in fact since i saw that originally its been changed and the numbers have substantially come down just in a small amount of votes. So we want that obviously to stay in play. But most importantly, were winning pennsylvania by a tremendous amount of votes. [ cheers and applause ] weve up 600 think of this. Were up 690,000 votes in pennsylvania. These arent even close. This is not like oh, its close. With 64 of the vote in, its going to be almost impossible to catch. And were coming into good pennsylvania areas where they happen to like your president. So well probably expand that. Were winning michigan, i tell you, looked at numbers, said whoa. Wow thats a lot. By almost 300,000 votes. And 65 of the vote is in. Were winning wisconsin. We dont need all of them. We need because when you add texas in, which wasnt added. I spoke with the really wonderful governor of texas just a little while ago, greg abbott, called to congratulate me on winning texas. We won texas, i dont think theyve finished the tabulation, but theres no way. Almost complete. Congratulated me, said by the way, whats going on, never seen anything like this. Tell you what, nobody has. We won by 107,000 votes with 81 of the vote in michigan. Take those three states in particular and you take all of the others, i mean we have so many had such a big night. You just take a look at all of the states weve won tonight, then you look at kind of margins weve won them by, and all of a sudden its not like were up 12 votes and we have 60 left, we won states and all of a sudden i said what happened to the election . Its off, and we have all these announcers saying what happened, then they said oh, you know what happened . They knew they couldnt win so they said lets go to court and did i predict this . Did i say this . Ive been saying this from the day i heard they were going to send out tens of millions of ballots, i said exactly. Either they were going to win or if they didnt win, theyll take us to court. So florida was a tremendous victory. 377,000. Texas as we said. Ohio. Think of this. Ohio a tremendous state, big state. I love ohio. We won by 8. 1 , think of it. Almost 500,000 votes. North carolina, big victory with North Carolina. And so we won there, we lead by 76,000 votes with almost nothing left. And all of a sudden everything just stopped. This is a fraud. On the American Public. This is an embarrassment to our country. We were getting ready to win this election, frankly we did win this election. Now to ensure the integrity for the good of this nation, this is a very big moment. This is a major fraud on our nation. We want the law to be used in a proper manner. So well be going to the u. S. Supreme court. We want all voting to stop. We dont want them to find any ballots at 4 00 in the morning and add them to the list, okay . Its a very sad moment. To me this is a very sad moment. And we will win this, as far as im concerned we already have won it. So i just want to thank you. We are reluctant to step in but duty bound to point out when he says we did win this election, weve already won, thats not based in the facts at all. Again, there are millions of votes yet to be counted, our president s dont select our victors. Steve kornacki is at the board. We heard a lot there. We always allow a lot on Election Night, hooiyperbole. But weve not called the states he claimed for victory. Georgia, pennsylvania, michigan, wisconsin, could you fill in some of the blanks on the truth . Lets look at pennsylvania. Again youre seeing the tally of the votes so far that have been tabulated in pennsylvania is 56 to 43 . First and most important thing to say about these numbers, there are counties, a number of counties in pennsylvania that announced before tonight that they were not even going to open mailin ballots they received until tomorrow. So there are some places in pennsylvania that havent counted a single mailin ballot. Plenty of counties like that in pennsylvania. Many other counties in pennsylvania have that only counted a small fraction of their mailin ballots. Why this late on Election Night are we saying they havent counted many or any of the mailin ballots because they werent allowed by state law in pennsylvania to open the mailin ballots until this morning. Theres been a long some counties have been able to churn through some of the mailin ballots. But youve got hundreds of thousands in some counties, theyre just getting to them. If you take a look in largest city in pennsylvania. Philadelphia. Were expecting when all is said and done over 800,000 votes are going to come out of philadelphia. What has been accounted for so far . See this bar right here . Yellow bar . Those are votes cast by people who voted in person today in philadelphia. Those votes are tabulated. Biden won pretty overwhelmingly. This sliver down here is the beginning of the mailin ballot in philadelphia. Do you see this giant gray space up here . Thats the rest of the mail. Theyve got to get from 400,000 or so votes counted right now all the way up to the 820,000 or so actually cast, and again because they werent able to even begin the processing of these until today, theyre saying its going to take them time to get to all of it. Could take into tomorrow to do. Youre seeing joe biden overwhelming here winning in philadelphia. Leading the vote i should say in philadelphia with hundreds of thousands of votes to come there. That can change. Its not just philadelphia. Im showing you philadelphia. Lets go out to the suburbs of philadelphia. Densely populated Montgomery County. Again youre going to see the same dynamic. Counted some of the mail, the votes cast today in person, and guess what, were not at the top of the vote thermometer. Theres over 100,000 votes remaining to be counted in a giant county that joe biden right now is leading tabulations in with 60 . This is true in pittsburgh. Pittsburgh right now, pretty dramatic example. Second largest city in the state, they have counted the same day vote. Thats why donald trump looks like hes doing better than republican normally does in Allegheny County right now because same day vote, more favorable to trump, has been tabulated but not tabulated is bulk of the mail vote, more than 3 4 of a million ballots to be tabulated. 240,000 left. Im giving you big ones here. As i said, small and medium sized counties arent going to have a little bit of the mail done tonight. Not going to touch it until tomorrow. Big picture in pennsylvania, we think there are upward of 2 million ballots that have not yet been counted and that are not part of this tally. Donald trumps lead right now in what has been tabulated is sitting at a little bit less than 700,000. Again, nearly 2 million to come and they are disproportionately pittsburgh, philadelphia, Montgomery County democratic areas. And we have been seeing this split where the votes that were cast by mail, for whatever reason this year, democratic voters seemed to have preferred to cast by mail and trump voters preferred to turn out on election day and vote in person. In these counties youre seeing election day vote all counted. All the republican votes and trump votes are included in so many of the tallies, county by county. Whats not included spauspartiar wholly across the commonwealth of pennsylvania is the mail vote. We have a scattering of completed counties. Looks competitive race to me right now. Not a race anybody could call. Looks like competitive race in which one of the candidates is so afraid of the ultimate tallying of the votes hes pulled this hee haw laugh track move. Literally said we want all the voting to stop. Weve already won it. But thats not his position, heres how we know still cant swear, even at 2 00 in the morning, bs. He wants them to keep counting in arizona. Keep it open later. Exactly. Straight up autocratic malarkey, and what we have to do keep in mind is that hes not the boss of the counting. Thats correct. Bosses of the counting are the precincts and counties and states as you said, counting will continue. And cant say it enough that Donald Trumps words have no legal meaning. Theyre entertainment for people in the room without masks on who want to be entertained. Entertainment for friends on fox, people who love him. Donald trump has no Decision Making authority over the end of the election. It ends when all the votes are contcounted if it takes five days, ten days, doesnt matter. That the election was over earlier in the evening and then it was un it was canceled. Kept saying, getting ready for big celebration. All over, we were winning. Then they counted more votes and went down. They counted more ballots, which is terrible. We must stop counting ballots because we decided thats a fraud. Im glad he told us in advance he was going to do this so were less bowled over and more willing to laugh at it. Remarkable a to see a Campaign Event in the white house, but b to see president saying want the voting to stop so weve won it. In pennsylvania alone, millions left to be counted. And some of people who voted for him. Reality is this is the pure autocratic move. This is the reason its so shocking so many people think this man is qualified to be president of the United States. Not only completely incompetent but a wannabee autocrat. This is victor orbonesque behavior. Reliving the night, remember when i was ahead by two points . That was the best. Im embarrassed that around the world people can see it, see this is what we are, this is what is leading the United States. Absolutely embarrassing. There is a deadly serious side to this though. How far does attorney general bill barr go as his lawyer. Levers of the government that autocrat can pull in service of Political Campaign and donald trump wont hesitate. Bill barr hasnt hesitated up to now to be pulled. And Supreme Court. He mentioned the Supreme Court, very specific about that. Telegraphed that. As if he can take the election, call it over, announce there wont be more voting and Supreme Court will take over. Thats not how it works. And not exactly clear we can trust Amy Coney Barrett and kavanaugh and others not to be just like bill barr. What scares people is that if he decides to do something that legally makes no sense, youre right, mr. Bower is ready for him. But if somehow they stumble into the Supreme Court, do any of you trust uncle clarence and Amy Coney Barrett and those guys to actually follow the letter of the law . No. It is a completely politicized Supreme Court that you cant just trust theyll do the right thing. So far the courts have actually been pretty good. Well see. Brian. Only something Say Something obvious to the three of you, if he doesnt prevail, tonight lays the predicate for the election was stolen, a powerful and potent talking point they can return to, a grievance in over the course of four years again, if he does not prevail. Joy raises excellent point about the Supreme Court, but we have great inhouse counsel, ari melber, host of the beat. I know you lawyers love the term standing, would a course that goes direct to the Supreme Court, can that happen, is it possible without making its way to the Supreme Court . And two, justice barrett, the president theres Public Record of his comments saying of course i want her seated on the court in case the election goes to the court. Is that not old timy grounds for recusal . Lot of people think that calls into question her impartiality. What we heard from the plresidet is horrific for democracy. Mark down the time, president of the United States declaring we want all voting to top. Constitutionally thats not how it works. Its wrong legally. This is important for the days ahead. Legally what the president just told the nation is worthless. As a legal matter, those remarks could be written in invisible ink. Election and counting and processing of ballots is not controlled legally by the president. As joy and others mentioned. But this could get very hot very quickly. Ill tell you exactly why. Mentioned how do you get something to the Supreme Court, if a state or several states has a margin that relates to certain types of ballots, for example the counting of mail ballots, those cases can go up through appeals to the Supreme Court. Indeed as recently as last wednesday with regard to mail ballots in pennsylvania, Court Majority said they think that potentially ballots counted after today might be tossed under the constitution. That would be a change, a new ruling. But weve seen that foreshadowed. Big problem here, reason why the president addressing the nation here at this late hour and saying that he wants the votes stopped, declaring himself the winner, this is serious business. He said we did win the election, end quote. He said that falsely. Is a big problem as this all plays out. If theres a margin when the votes are counted this week formed by several states would be much harder to find standing to get before the Supreme Court. But two or one state and relates to mail ballots, there are ways to get before the court. Everyone has to be clear. Keep open mind, rule of law, report out whatever the courts decide, open mind about all the states telling us the votes. Pennsylvania and North Carolina, they count votes for days. Votes were cast by today but count them for days. Keep open mind about all that. But cant keep open mind or sound neutral about the falsehoods that came out of the white house. It pains me to say it, but the president was lying with the Election Results and speaking to address the democracy by telling the democracy he doesnt believe in democracy, stop the voting. Its a Serious Development tonight. David plouffe is joining our conversation. Ari thank you. David, reaction to the words without precedent certainly, given everything uttered in the east room over the history of our republic and that structure. Yeah. One of the darkest hours the white house has ever seen. One of the darkest hours in american history. I dont think donald trump is going to be successful if joe biden gets to 270 electoral votes. All the votes were legally cast, not being counted in michigan, wisconsin or pennsylvania ahead of the election by state law but a dangerous and dark moment. Even if hes not successful and i dont think he will be if the votes are there for joe biden. Youre going to have 40 or 45 of the country believing him. Going to affect the democracy Going Forward, president elect bidens ability to work with the republicans in congress. Knew he was going to say it. Been telegraphing it. Tweeted it out a couple of hours ago but to see the president of the United States in the white house basically saying i dont care what votes have been counted or not, at some point in the night i thought i was going to win, election should be over. Its startling, dark and scary. Still think if joe biden wins arizona, wisconsin, michigan. Hes won nebraska second Congressional District, gets to 270, will be the president but will be dark and scary days next few days or weeks. Credit where credit is due, Jonathan Swan at axios reported what was denied by the president , the plan was for the president to prematurely go out, claim victory, real or imagined, before such a thing was legally awarded. David, talk about the democrats ability and means for going about this as a counterbalance. Well, listen, because trump has telegraphed this, you can never rule anything out with him, the Biden Campaign, democratic lawyers community, led by bob bower and mark elias have been ready for this. I think theyll be ready on legal grounds. Trump wants voting to continue in arizona. Wants voting to continue in nevada. Wants to stop in the states where hes ahead. Those states are not counting ballots many were sent in two, four weeks ago, just sitting there because by law you cant start counting them until today. Some of the counties decided to do it tomorrow. Democrats will be ready. Always good when opponent telegraphs plays ahead of time. We knew trump was going to say it but it was super painful to watch as american citizen. One of the darkest moments in american history, one of the darkest moments that building has seen. Sooner we get votes counted, if joe biden can be declared winner in arizona, wisconsin, michigan, the better. But i agree with ari, if this comes down to one state, obviously trump does not want to go meekly into the night no matter what damage he does to our democracy and our country. David plouffe, i agree with you, theres extra layer of pain if you worked in the white house. I worked for president who didnt let us wear jeans into the building because of its sacred nature. Just had somebody try to literally hijack and desiccate our country from the east room. Two pieces of feedback. Chris christie on abc news, staunch trump ally and adviser said it was bad strategic decision and political decision. Ben ginsberg, republican counterpart to mr. Bower, said over on cnn there is no direct right of appeal to the Supreme Court to stop counting ballots. They can challenge individual states over procedures. Says courts would believe trumps lawsuit would be a quote massive disenfranchisement that would be frowned upon. Hot takes from staunch conservatives about the political stupidity and legal weakness of the case. Question isnt does it slow trump down, but does that render fruitless the shenanigans, really reinforce the biden message of stay calm and carry on . Well again, when you look at the legal regimes in the states around elections, theyre following the law. Im not a lawyer, i occasionally played one on tv. I just dont see legal pathway here. But i do think it would undermine trumps megaphone if you had chris christie, great. Lets see Mitch Mcconnell and other republican senators. How fox handles this, theyve handled Election Night responsibly, do they continue to handle it responsibly is really important. My sense is next 72 hours people are going to say, even trump allies, we ought to let the votes be counted. Maybe hes more of a paper tiger. Doesnt mean its any less alarming. Correct. To see sitting american president saying im going to stay in the white house, i dont care what the voters had to say, im going to stay here. Never seen anything like this in the history of our republic. David plouffe, thank you very much. Bring into the conversation, lawrence odonnell, watching alongside us. President did telegraph he was going to do this tonight. There was a little bit of debate whether or not backlash to the reporting that he intended to do this was going to be enough to stop him from doing it but he barrelled right through it tonight. I think what you can gather from a couple of things, Chris Christies comments saying it was illadvised thing to do, not smart speech, and fact there were teleprompters there, the president did not use. Something was written and placed in those teleprompters that is different from what the president decided to say after the very long delay before the president went out there and started to speak. When he started to speak, we had every reason to question exactly what his drug regime is, especially at 2 00 in the morning in the post coronavirus state he is in at the moment because the incoherence was at a new level for donald trump. He said for example we have won texas and they dont even include it in the tabulations. He said that more than once. That sentence doesnt make any sense no matter how you read it. He also went on as if lost, in a room as if completely lost. What happens to the election . Its off. Thats a direct quote. Word for word what the man said. He then said, this is important sequencing. He then said theyll take us to court. Then he said everything just stopped, then said we want all voting to stop. All voting has stopped. We all agree on that, all the voting has stopped. Did not say we want all counting to stop but it sounded like thats what he was trying to say. Then he said well be going to the Supreme Court, which is legally impossible. Theres no such thing as a first stop at the Supreme Court. What hes clearly going to do he said most importantly hes winning in pennsylvania. Thats where hes going to go. We know the lawsuit theyre going to bring in pennsylvania. Might be only one they bring. Theyve brought it before. Theyre saying you are not allowed to accept mailin ballots in pennsylvania for those three extra days that have been set up this year without the legislatures approval. Pennsylvania intends to accept ballots that arrive three days after election day. Thats what they will legally fight. Thats the only thing they will legally fight. They will never bring a lawsuit anywhere in any state saying stop the counting of ballots that arrived on time. This is a mostly meaningless event tonight that is as dark as everyone has said it is. As disgraceful as everyone has said it is. But like so much of trump, it is mostly meaningless. Lawrence, i want to let you know while we have been talking and absorbing this, republican governor of arizona has weighed in on this as well, doug ducey, by nbcs count, arizona is too early to call but joe biden is in the lead there. That would be a pickup for the democrats since trump won arizona in 2016. Doug ducey says quote, it is far too early to call the election in arizona. Election day votes are not fully reported and havent started to count early ballots dropped at polls. In arizona we protected election day, lets count all the votes before making declarations. Passive voice doing a lot of work, not directly having to confront the president of his own party. What donald trump said tonight doesnt actually disagree with that. We all think we heard him say he wants counting stopped but he didnt actually say that. He wants voting stopped, which has already stopped. And so theres no lawyer in the building who is going to try to bring a lawsuit to any state that says stop counting your ballots, except in pennsylvania where theyre going to say stop accepting ballots that arrive after the deadline that the legislature had in place which was replaced by threeday extension that is going to be the subject of a lawsuit. Thats it. Probably no other lawsuit on the electoral map that donald trump can bring. To that point, hearing bob bower, legal director for the Biden Campaign address that potential lawsuit in pennsylvania last night and express absolutely no concerns whatsoever about the Biden Campaigns prospects in that kind of lawsuit tells you how desperate this is. Just got a couple of minutes here. One thing underappreciated about what the president is doing here, he wouldnt have to do that if he thought he was going to win the election. Only reason you come out say i won georgia, pennsylvania, michigan, wisconsin is because you havent and you have to assert it because its not otherwise true. And it got out, front page of todays New York Times said trump with no path to victory plans to turn to legal matchnations. Only thing i quibble with, its incoherent to people devoted to nouns and verbs but i think trumps base heard him loud and clear. Whatever happens in next 24 to 48 hours, hopefully votes will be counted. Biden Campaign Still feels good about the states. Trumps base heard him if biden wins, it will be a fraud. Break in a moment. Joy . Problem if biden wins, having to govern people who believe it was a great fraud, robbed from trump, meaning well probably still hear from donald trump. But ill go back to saying latest text again, the campaign is confident. And confidence of the biden side and the steadiness and stability of what theyve been saying all night to you, what ive been hearing, steadiness versus the frantic mess we just saw very good point. In the east room tells you which side understands where the race really is. I want to see the event the wall street journal covered. President trump told voters he was confident he would win the election, projecting confidence he had won pennsylvania. Would have fun to watch. Break for us. Live coverage continues as we crest the top of the hour. Smart tech is everywhere. Smart fridge. Smart car. Smart doorbell. Door bell hello but fitbit makes you smart about your health. This isnt some phone on your wrist. Its a way to help manage stress. Keep your heart strong. And detect potential signs of illness. Its more than a smartwatch. Its a smarter way to transform your health. Whove got their eczema under control. With less eczema, you can show more skin. So roll up those sleeves. And help heal your skin from within with dupixent. Dupixent is the first treatment of its kind that continuously treats moderatetosevere eczema, or atopic dermatitis, even between flare ups. Dupixent is a biologic, and not a cream or steroid. Many people taking dupixent saw clear or almost clear skin, and, had significantly less itch. Dont use if youre allergic to dupixent. Serious allergic reactions can occur, including anaphylaxis, which is severe. Tell your doctor about new or worsening eye problems, such as eye pain or vision changes, or a parasitic infection. If you take asthma medicines, dont change or stop them without talking to your doctor. So help heal your skin from within, and talk to your eczema specialist about dupixent. If your financial situation has changed, we may be able to help. All right. Hello there, everyone, welcome to msnbcs continued special coverage of the 2020 election. It is 3 00 a. M. Eastern time. Im ayman moll hedin. And im katy tur. You were warned. Weve been saying that rather than Election Night voters should prepare for election week. And now that warning has become a reality. And here is where things stand at this hour. Joe biden right now with a 220 electoral lead to President Trumps 213. Biden has a popular vote of 65,819,000 to President Trumps 64,211,000. Heres how the map looks right there on your screen at this hour. Michigan, one of those states, still in the midwest, undecided at this hour. So is wisconsin. Pennsylvania as well. So is pennsylvania. So is North Carolina. Michigan too early to call. Donald trump currently in the lead there, but there are still a ton of ballots that have yet to be counted. Wisconsin too close to call. A difference of 116,437. Again, a lot of votes to count there as well. Pennsylvania, too early to call. You just heard Steve Kornacki moments ago talk about millions of ballots that have yet to be counted in pennsylvania. Also North Carolina too close to call. 76,737 separating the two. Donald trump with a narrow lead right now. And lets take a look at arizona as well. Arizona too early to call, though joe biden is in a narrow lead. Were also going to look at georgia. This is a state that democrats are still hoping to win. Too close to call with a difference of 117,521 votes. Donald trump again with a narrow lead. Steve kornacki, thats just the broad numbers. Youre going to get into some of those counties to tell us where things really stand. The president a moment ago claimed victory in a number of states that have yet to be called. Yeah. Weve got a lot of really tight ones here. Lets just walk through them and then walk through the panel for 270 electoral votes here. In arizona youre looking at a situation where they are counting up the sameday vote, the votes that were cast today. Theyve already given us a huge chunk of the early vote, the absentee vote that was cast in arizona. Trump is doing significantly better on the sameday vote than he did in that absentee vote that came in earlier, but you see he is still facing a gap here of about 130,000 votes. I think its a question right now, are there enough sameday ballots that are left in this mix for trump at the rate hes winning them to overtake biden . And theres also the issue theres going to be another batch of votes thats going to be counted at the end of this. These are the most latearriving absentee ballots, like the ones that arrived yesterday, today. Those also have to be counted as well. So there are some variables here, but trump is playing from behind in arizona. Hes also playing from behind right now in nevada, about 80 of the vote is in. The gap here is 26,000 votes. Again, its clark county. You know, where las vegas is. 10point biden edge there. Washu county. A ton of the vote is in there. Biden actually leading that by five points right now. Trump is playing certainly from behind there as well. Where this starts to get interesting, though, because if you play this out from the Electoral College standpoint, if biden hangs on to the leads hes got right now in arizona, thats 11 electoral votes. In nevada thats 6 electoral votes. That would put biden at 237 electoral votes. Remember, the name of the game is 270 here. Where else could biden pick those up . Well, theres georgia right now. Georgia, worth 16 electoral votes. Thats been getting tighter and tighter. Its all about the Atlanta Metro area right now. Heavily democratic, which is slow to count, and where that lead now the trump lead statewide i should say sits at about 115,000 votes. It continues to close. We need to see atlanta, dekalb county. Those are kind of the two areas, fulton and dekalb county. Theres a lot of votes left there. How they finish there will pretty much i think decide that state. But its an opportunity there for biden. North carolina there are some votes that are going to arrive, if theyre postmarked by today they can count. But the trump lead there is pretty substantial. So well see. Outside of that biden leads in maine right now, in the vote counting in maine right now. However, theres that one Congressional District in maine that donald trump won in 2016 that hes winning right now. So maybe biden could pick up three there. Would put him at 240. And its a long way of saying here we go, here we come. Wisconsin, michigan, and pennsylvania potentially here decisive for this election. So what are we looking at in these states right now . In wisconsin this is one of those three we are by far the closest to knowing. Over 80 of the vote is in. You see a lead here for donald trump. What this is coming down to, and were expecting this, im looking at my clock now, probably in the next hour we are going to get from the city of milwaukee, were going to get their absentee vote. Only 40 of the vote it in in milwaukee. Theyve been counting it at a central processing facility. Theyre going to announce that they say i think in the next hour. If past is prologue, thats probably going to be worth about 100,000 votes net for joe biden. Thats going to dramatically cut that trump advantage. Is it going to cut it enough, though . There are a couple other places in ws which is. Waukesha county, racine, kenosha, green bay, a couple of other places with outstanding vote. But is biden going to be able to erase all of that . Wisconsin, despite what the polls were showing us before this election, is extremely close right now. Michigan we have less of the vote counted. Some of this is uneven in michigan because in some of these counties we have a ton of mailin vote that has not yet been counted, some of these are more even but i think what youre seeing, one of the things youre seeing in michigan is something we saw in wisconsin tonight and something weve seen in many states like it around the country, and that is there had been talk coming into tonight that Donald Trumps core base, bluecollar white, rural white voters, workingclass white voters, that that had been a road incoming tonight. And im telling you, were looking around wisconsin, looking around michigan tonight, counties where we do have completed the vote. Its still with them. So its telling me what were seeing here in wisconsin, where this is just substantially closer than the polls looked. And really, this is a nail biter where i think we may get some clarity in the next hour in wisconsin. But i think its a little less clear in michigan just because theres more outstanding vote but im seeing a lot of the same patterns in michigan that im seeing in wisconsin. So both of those states right now very much i think question marks. Pennsylvania by far the most incomplete. But again, if wisconsin and michigan are that close, pennsylvania likely to be as well. So there are a lot of question marks for both candidates right now when it comes to a path to 270 electoral votes. Let me ask you a question, steve. If joe biden does not win wisconsin, does he have a path to the white house . So lets take a look at it. Again, there are 11 in arizona. 11 electoral votes. So if biden hangs on to that, he moves up to 231. There are six in nevada. And if he hangs on to that, he moves up to 237 electoral votes. Maine, as we say, its that split. So right now biden is ahead in one of the two Congressional Districts and hes ahead in the statewide vote. He trails in the other Congressional District. So at this point lets say maybe he could get three electoral votes from maine. That would bump him to 240. Okay. So what are the options here . We say carolina looks like the longer shot between carolina and georgia. Were he to get georgia, thats 16 electoral votes. That would move him to 256. That would move him substantially closer. If he didnt get georgia, though, and youre down to these three states, okay, if he didnt get wisconsin, he misses out on that, you could still get michigan and that would move him in this scenario to 256, and then it really would be down to pennsylvania. Pennsylvania with its 20 electoral votes. If biden misses in wisconsin, misses in North Carolina, and he misses in georgia, then he would need michigan and he would need pennsylvania. If hes able to get georgia, as i say, that is 16 electoral votes there. And depending on how that Atlanta Metro vote that still comes in, that could still anybody play for him. But otherwise, yeah, you are looking at a situation where if hes not able to pick off wisconsin late tonight and hes not able to pick off a georgia or a carolina, michigan and pennsylvania really do become mustwins for him. Yeah, i was going to say, steve, that is the long way of simply saying this is far from over. And against that backdrop i want to bring in robert gibbs, former Obama White House press secretary. Because robert, the first question i have for you is picking off or picking up from what we just heard there from Steve Kornacki, juxtaposed with what we heard from the president saying frankly we won this election. It is far from over at this hour. Yeah, its far from over. Were going to know, as steve said, maybe a little bit in an hour or so from a couple of these places. But in reality it could be days before we know the final score of this. And i think youre going to see a big push to count the rest of this vote. Its just going to take a while. And look, we know the republican legislatures in michigan and wisconsin and pennsylvania wouldnt let these votes be counted until election day. And so this process is following what they wanted to do, and its going to take a while to get to a final outcome regardless of what the president says and the white house. Robert, what do you think about the polling in wisconsin . And i guess what is your advice for the Democratic Party Going Forward . Even if joe biden is able to pull off a win in a state like wisconsin. Well, look, i think polling in general maybe we should all take a breath and take a step back from. You know, we may find out that the National Polling isnt as far off as some of the state polling, but i think theres a lot of state polling thats bouncing around thats not so good. But look, i think its hard to make generalizations about what were going to see at the end of this at this point. But i think theres going to be some interesting questions that we all have to ask in the Democratic Party. Look, the miamidade numbers in florida are certainly a question mark. Theres some Rio Grande Valley vote in texas that weve got to ask some hard questions about. And certainly, you know, white workingclass voters in the upper midwest are still going to be tough voters for democrats. Again, we have a lot of questions to ask ourselves in the Democratic Party, but i do think weve overrelied on public polling. Were overrelying on all polling as a coverage metric of this race. Rather than a race on what the issues might be about or what the changes in the policies might be about. Maybe im sounding too good government. But it seems like weve all too often in the last two weeks woken up to not why these people are winning but whether or not the score changed overnight. And i just dont think thats maybe the healthiest way to cover this democratic process. So to that point, robert, as we think about where we go over the next two days and were using the messaging that is coming out of the white house, which is what they are attempting to do, they have been projecting this over the capacity couple of days, the president was going to come out and prematurely declare a victory and then push this to the courts. This ultimately raises the question what do you do if you are the Biden Campaign at this hour thinking about not just the outcome of state by state but then the legal challenges that may be rolled out. Well, theyve anticipated this for quite some time. This has been telegraphed by the president and from the white house for quite some time. There are a lot of lawyers on the biden side that are ready to do and have already done battle with the white houses legal team or the department of justice or whoever gets sent forward. So look, i think we may see this very readily move into a much more protracted argument not just over a map but in the court system. And well see how that goes. Theres a lot of state law thats going to have to get looked at. We know that theres the pennsylvania case that the Supreme Court essentially didnt rule on and that petition still sits before them. So theres a lot left to go here. I think both in the counting and in the courts. I guess, robert, if youre a member of the biden team right now where are you setting your hopes . How do you feel at this moment . Well, i still think theres reason to feel quite optimistic. I mean, look, i think a couple of things that have happened in the past few hours that are big. Right . All these electoral votes we know count. Winning that vote in nebraska could end up being that could be a big electoral vote. Right . I think arizonas still going to be a very interesting place. All of a sudden you win arizona, you win that electoral vote in nebraska, you pick up those three votes in maine and all of a sudden youve got alternative paths. Its not just that upper midwestern path. A lot of votes still left in georgia, particularly in the Atlanta Metro. Youve still got some paths where you can see this happening. So you know, look, democrats were really down at the beginning of the night because we had a fantasy that we were going to win texas and that florida was going to go democratic quickly and this was all going to be over by 10 00 p. M. And when that didnt happen, everybody reverted to i think a much more pessimistic night. I think theres still a lot of paths left and i think theres still a lot of counting left and theres no reason to be overly pessimistic at this point. All right, robert, stay with us for a moment. Before we head out to arizona we want to cross over back to Steve Kornacki at the big board, who has an update for us. Steve, what have you got . I just want to keep you posted because were down to such little left here in terms of wisconsin. We said there are a few places here. Basically what were waiting for, cities where they have the absentee ballot. Take a look here in let me get that again. Racine. We now have all the vote in racine county. Were waiting for racine to come in here. Trump the key here, trumps improved slightly in terms of his vote share relative to 2016. But the key here that im trying to show you is his lead statewide was not dented by what just came in in racine. So i think it underscores there are a few, as i say, waukesha county, kenosha, green bay, there are a few other places where were going to get vote dumps like we just got in racine. In racine it did not budge the statewide number, did not bring biden any closer. So what that means, it really again underscores for biden the importance of milwaukee and getting a massive number he needs out of milwaukee because again, right now trumps leads 118,000. Getting those votes in from racine didnt change that at all. There arent that many places left on the map here to report in. So weve got milwaukee by far the biggest thing left, when we get the absentee this numbers going to change. Is that going to come down 120,000 . Thats what youve got ask yourself right now. Certainly. Were keeping a close eye on wisconsin. Steve, if you get any more numbers out of wisconsin, ill say what brian says. Wave your hands and well go over to you. Lets get a look at Vaughn Hilliard whos out in chandler, arizona. Vaughn, arizona is a state democrats are still quite hopeful for. They feel positive about what they are seeing out there. Tell me what youre seeing on the ground, especially in Maricopa County. Reporter yeah, good evening, katie and ayman. Were still waiting for more ballots, about 130,000 votes that will be registered into the system here. This evening out of Maricopa County specifically, when you look at where this race currently stands you see that eightpoint margin here. Yet at the same time there are still thousands, hundreds of thousands of outstanding votes here in the state of arizona. Number one, the biggest unknown is how many early ballots were handdelivered to polling locations today. Elections officials tell me that they do not have that number, that they will report that number back to me tomorrow. Again, that particularly is of concern for democrats out in the rural part of the state. You know, just this last week i was up in mojave county. This is a county that appears to go in Donald Trumps favor right now by 50 Percentage Points. And the question is how many folks didnt show up in 2016 but came in here in these final days and cast their ballot . That is what is still outstanding. And what we saw over the last several days were that these late early ballot returns were trending toward donald trump, toward republicans, and then today at inperson voting, which we are still waiting on about 130,000 of those votes out of Maricopa County as well, republicans were coming and casting their ballots at a 21 rate compared to democrats. So when you start crunching these numbers, youve got about 20 roughly is the estimate left. And ill let steve better crunch the numbers here. But the Trump Campaign is very specific to say hold your guard. While others may be eager to call the shot, they say that there are still votes out there. And to their point there are thousands of ballots that we specifically dont know just how many are still out there. I know us at nbc news are holding back in calling this race as those ballots are processed over the next 24 hours. Let me just express shock as somebody whos been covering politics now since 2015 and how much time donald trump personally has spent in arizona and how much effort hes put into turning out the vote there and really hammering immigration. It was one of his first stops in 2015. Hes kept up the effort there all along. What has been his achilles heel in arizona . Was it the attacks on john mccain . Is it the diversifying electorate . Is it the moderate republicans who were turned off by his behavior . I think thats what well have a better understanding and answer to 48 hours from now, because to your point, katy, weve often said whichever way Maricopa County goes the state goes. Only one statewide candidate in the state of arizona over the last decade has lost Maricopa County but statewide. Only one candidate. And thats why President Trump, he made seven trips here across the state of arizona over the last year. He made two stops down to yuma, arizona, a Border Community of about 100,000. He was in Bull Head City literally six days before the election here because they realized that they had deficits. At least according to polling. In the greater suburbs of the phoenix and tucson areas. You saw among independents, he won independents back in 2016, albeit narrowly, but now polling consistently showed him down by 15 to 20 Percentage Points among independents. And thats when this campaign started looking elsewhere, started looking out to the more rural areas because it was the Democratic Party the likes of kyrsten sinema, mark kelly, that tried to rein in that old john mccain sort of western independence mantle and that is when this campaign realized what these numbers look like in the suburbs, athong those collegeeducated voters. Even shifts among senior voters. Thats when they started looking elsewhere in the state. And you know, we were out there last week and stalking to people like stephanie corson, who did not vote in 2016, thought it was in the bag for donald trump because, well, its arizona. Well, he only won it by 3 1 2 Percentage Points in 2016 and a great number of republicans not only up there but even thoekz like this gentleman named rick who was standing in line last minute in scottsdale today told me that they realized that the stakes are different in arizona here in 2020 and they found it important to get out there to support him. Whether its enough to close this gap, which is quite a heck of a gap right now, is you know, vaughn, youre from arizona. Youve been reporting in the leadup to this election talking a lot about Maricopa County and the surprise you were seeing in some of those specific areas that frankly had been red all your life and were suddenly turning blue. Any surprises now that we have come to election day or now the day after the election in the way the vote count has shaped up . No. Not at this point. And i think the numbers here are looking sort of as we were expecting and sort of the ways that actually polling was showing here in the state of arizona. I think the one particular number that well be looking at especially is the share of the latino vote here. When were talking about where this political map goes here, you know, it started california. Nevada. Colorado. New mexico. Is arizona suddenly that next brick to fall over for the democrats here . And yes, you know, were waiting to see what the results look like in georgia. Texas went in Donald Trumps favor. At the same time latino activists here i talked to they say this is not just a 2020 race. Yes, donald trump made them a catalyst for speeding this up here. At the same time this goes back to the likes of the Farm Workers Movement back in the 60s and 70s, which led way to the 90s and early 2000s, fights among activists and legislation, that was targeting undocumented immigrants in the community. It spans you know, theres one woman, maria hernandez, who at the age of 19 joined this campaign called adios arpaio, an effort to get the longtime Maricopa County lawman out of office. Well, they succeeded in 2016. He lost here in Maricopa County. And they said now for the first time after Kyrsten Sinemas 2018 win here in the state of arizona, thats when they said they realized in talking with their family and their friends and others in the predominantly communities of color here in the greater phoenix area, that they could have National Consequences and they said that they hoped that this race not only mark kellys senate race but also electing joe biden could be evidence of the role that they can play in elections Going Forward here. All right. Vaughn hilliard, stay with us for a moment. I do want to cross over to steve. Steve, weve been talking about georgia throughout the evening because all eyes are now on that Metro Atlanta area. The nine counties that surround. R georgias capital. Thats where were expecting more nukz to come in. I understand you have some more data for us. We just can get some more in in Fulton County which is where atlanta is. We just got a big batch of votes in here. Again, joe biden winning this county overwhelmingly. You see about 80 now. And in Fulton County we think not sure exactly how many ballots are left there. But what that did if youve been monitoring this all night, it brought trumps margin down in the state. Its now sitting at just basically 100,000 votes statewide. Thats trumps lead. You see its two points. 100,000 votes. Where are the votes left in georgia at this point . Let me call that up for you here. The outstanding vote, remember, the bigger the bubble here the more votes there are left to be counted. And you can see it remains in the Atlanta Metro area and its really its primarily fulton, where i just showed you, theres still a lot of vote to come there. You see how bidens doing there. Its next door in dekalb, and bidens doing even better there. Hes got two big opportunities there in Fulton County. There are some others around the state. Albany down here, this is where bidens doing well. Macon bidens doing well. Augusta bidens doing well. But there already are some republican counties lower in size but you see the dots kind of scattered around the state. So there are also places where President Trump will be gaining as more votes are counted as well. But the bulk of it is in the Atlanta Metro area. Its anyones guess where this is going to land at this point. But biden has as more and more of Atlanta Metro has come in biden has chipped away at the lead. He looks likely to chip away further, to chip away substantially here. Can he chip away all 102,000 votes . Thats the suspense in georgia right now. Stheef, i do want to pick up on that and ask you because the pattern throughout the evening as i understand it has been that the early vote and the mailin vote has favored joe biden and the sameday voting has favored President Trump in many of these states youve been highlighting. It seems as we go into the late hours or early hours of the day after the election the pattern is different in the areas you that just highlighted because were waiting on those votes. Do we know if those votes are same day votes in Fulton County, in the metro area, are they mailin votes or early votes . Were getting a sense, ill give you dekalb for instance here where about 80 is in. Heres how we think the early absentee vote went. We think biden got about 85 of them. Now, again, hes running at about 83 . What it means here in a county like dekalb, in a county like fulton is, even though youre talking in a place like this about same day where trump is doing better, biden is still the one whos winning the clear majority of those votes. He with theyve a place like dekalb right now hes getting about 70 of those voters. Hes not doing as well, bide erngs with the same day as he did with the absentee but hes still getting about 70 . As they are counted up, he is still making big strides here in dekalb county. If youre getting about 70 of the vote, thats whats going to happen. Its just that democratic of a county. Its the same thing in fulton. These are just two gigantic democratic counties. You go down to albany, i say again, pretty heavily democratic there as well. So even in the early vote in places like that democratic excuse me, even in the same day vote in laces like that democrats are gaining ground. Steve, what about arizona . We were just with Vaughn Hilliard talking about the vote count out there and how its looking. What are you seeing . Lets take a look here. So again, weve got about 75 of arizona all at once a couple of hours ago and its been inching up since then. But you see were keeping an eye on maricopa and the sameday vote thats being reported. Vaughn was just taking you through all that. You do see from the initial report, we initially got absenteeboats votes, we initially got votes that were cast really early. The earliest votes up until this past weekend. Thats how they divided it in arizona. That was the first batch of votes that got reported out nap put biden up by about ten points in Maricopa County. As you see, theyve been reporting out same day votes. There are far fewer sameday votes but heres a place where the sameday votes clearly are favoring President Trump. It looks like about 60 hes winning them by in arizona, in Maricopa County right now. So hes brought that gap trump has down to 8 points in Maricopa County. Were not quite sure here exactly how many sameday are left. And the other issue too is i think vaughn mentioned this, theres that third group of ballots that will also enter into these picture. Its the late arriving early votes. If that makes any sense. The late arriving absentee that came in yesterday, they came in today, they were brought in in person today. Those votes too need to be counted wp we need to see what the trend is as well. But again, maricopa, if you can win Maricopa County you can probably win arizona. This is a hill for trump to climb. It just depends on the number of ballots especially in that same day pool. We dont have a perfect sense of that right now. All right, steve, im going to give you a chance to reset and refresh that board. Were going to take a quick break. When we come back, were going to go to the respective headquarters of both campaigns and get a quick check on the mood there. Stay with us. Here stay with us for skin that never holds you back dont settle for silver 1 for diabetic dry skin 1 for psoriasis symptom relief and 1 for eczema symptom relief gold bond champion your skin for the better. Whatever question i have i feel like theres an avenue to seek the answer. Hit that app and you start a story, youre on an adventure. Download a new book within seconds and its ready to go. Theres something for everybody on audible. I like short stories. Short stories are easy. Theyre quick. I like long and like intricate stories, thats really what i love. Audible originals. I like biographies. Selfhelp. Fantasy. True crime podcasts. I love it so much. I can literally listen to anything. I can do it any time. And any place. And you know, for as long as i like. Getting really into a story can totally transform where you are and your mindset. Its really cool. Every time i learn something new, it just fuels the curiosity to explore more, to learn more. Theres anything and everything. To start your free 30day trial, just text listen 17 to 500500. To start your free 30day trial, we feel good about where we a are. We really do. Im here to tell you tonight we believe were on track to win this election. Yes. Joe biden telling democrats and americans to be patient about what the outcome is going to be. Ayman, we have been talking about this for weeks and months. It is going to take some time to get all the results and especially with all the mailin ballots and especially because so many states werent allowed to start counting their votes until election day. That is what makes what joe biden said so striking in comparison to what donald trump said, wanting to stop the vote count in states right now because hes leading in the dayof vote count even though those states like pennsylvania were not allowed to start counting ballots until today. Had they let them count them earlier, we would have been a lot farther along in this process. You could not have a more striking contrast between the two statements that came out from the two candidates this evening. For more on that lets bring in ally vitali. Shes at the biden headquarters in wilmington, delaware. Aly, let me begin with you. Obviously the message tonight from the Biden Campaign is one of patience but confidence. Patience but confidence. And yet again, weve seen so many contrasts between these two candidates throughout this race. Certainly Election Night would be no exception here. I think the word heading out of the evening and into these wee hours of the morning right now is that this is going to be a slog. The Biden Campaign and our sources in and around telling us they still feel good about rebuilding that blue wall, the michigan, wisconsin and pennsylvania parts of it. At the same time, though, we were primed from the very beginning that this was going to be a race that took some time zbliejtds living that in reality now. Its anxiety inducing, stressful pimm theyll xanl aildsrail feeling that. And thats even without the reality of the president trying to muddy waters here swrielts still being counted. And i think some of the reaction is this is what we expected to see from the president. His aides and other reports had telegraphed this was something he could do in the hours after polls closed. At the same time, though, those same sources do acknowledge that there is a danger to this in watching the sitting american president in the east room of the white house declaring victory when votes are still being counted. Of course that is, as we laid out, a very contrasting message to the way joe biden played this. But i will say while joe biden was urging patience and saying he was feeling like he was on his own path to victory there was someone else at the white house who was making that same argument although they were arguing for a Different Party having a path to victory. And it was mike pence. Donald trump came out and with a lot of bravado said he thought that they had won. But at the same time mike pence really had a little bit more of a note of caution there saying that the votes were still being counted and he believed they were on a road to victory. But again, it was a subtle shift but frankly one that i found stunning as you saw both of those men standing at the podium at the white house tonight, guys. Monica, i noticed the president was reading off the teleprompter for at least part of his speech from the white house. Any idea if the claims about what states he had won and talking about going to the Supreme Court to stop the vote count, was that in the prompter or was that off the cuff . He had some prepared remarks that he used the teleprompter for but he also had some written ones that were actually left on the podium, and photographers who went into the room were able to get a snapshot of what was resting there and what the president was referencing when he spoke earl yerl this will mornlling. Partially, two words. One, texas. That was something the president clearly wanted to echl sooilz. Bull thoelzll thoelz aol comments that are so staggeringly important to put into context has been something the president was telegraphing he was going to do for weeks if not months now, which is potentially call this election into question if he didnt like the result. And of course tonight he said essentially claiming that they had won the election when we know thats not the case, there are still millions of votes left to be cast. But its something that the president this morning actually was asked about in a fox news interview whether he was going to declare victory prematurely. He said no, they werent going to be doing that he was going to try to be disciplined and would only do that if and when that was the case. Clearly that did not last 12 hours because once we saw the president speaking in the east room he has declared that. And i think what ali mentions there is so important as well. It stood out to me that Vice President mike pence has often had to be the one to have a little bit more message discipline and that is why you saw him very carefully choose his words there, saying were on the road to victory potentially, not flat out saying what the president did. But also what i thought was so striking about that event here at the white house is we continue to see this blurring of official White House Events with campaign business. Thats almost become something thats commonplace. And also you had nearly 200 people there in a small room indoors. They were all apparently tested for coronavirus in advance were told by white house officials. But as this pandemic rages on its still striking to see everybody indoors without Wearing Masks and without social distancing as also weve now become accustomed to seeing at these kinds of events, katy. The white house also tested everybody before Amy Coney Barretts im not sure how much confidence i would have in those tests. Nomination party and they still got the coronavirus. I just find it striking. Somebody who thinks theyre going to win this election is not going to call and demand for the election vote to stop. So whatever he said on fox news this morning clearly it was in his head to declare victory if he felt he needed to for messaging to his supporters. And thats what he did tonight. Even though he has not won. Even though the votes are still being counted. And it doesnt matter what he says. You know this better than anyone because theres this kind of uniqueness to President Trump that he telegraphs what hes about to do. And he talked about legal challenges sxwle doesnt just telegraph it. He tells everyone. Yeah. And earlier this week said he was going to as soon as the election is over go in with his lawyers and were getting a sense of that tonight with his claims to go to the Supreme Court. And i want to bring in nbc newss legal analyst nate purcell. Rees also a professor at stanford law school. Its great to have you with us, nate, to talk about this because as i was saying, President Trump earlier in the week, before a single outcome was even determined in any state said he had planned to go in there with his lawyers and challenge some of the results. Today he was saying hes going to fight it to the Supreme Court. What if any legal action could the president take . What do you make of his threats there to try and halt the counting of the votes this evening . Well, as you say, this does follow a playbook that was written several weeks ago. And because the margins are close it looks like its being activated. Now, you cannot just go to the Supreme Court, as he said in his speech, and just ask them to shut down the count or declare the victor. There has to be a claim. But were getting ahead of ourselves here. There is a state process that will unfold in the next 48 hours. We will count the votes. If theres a dispute over that count that goes into state court. If there is legal problems with the state court proceedings, potentially it ends up at the u. S. Supreme court like bush versus gore. But were very far away from that. The first step is just to trust the process. Thns the first time that these states have had close elections. There are procedures in place to count these absentee ballots and then to adjudicate any controversy surrounding them. Let me ask you something about what the Supreme Court might decide, any clues that youve gleaned from the decisions leading up to the election decisions in wisconsin decisions in pennsylvania or lack thereof about the mailin vote and when it can be counted. What is your expectation for how the Supreme Court might rule on this if they decide to take the case up . Well, to some extent it depends what this is. We dont really know what the legal infirmity might be in the count. So youre right that weve had several cases that have gone up to the Supreme Court. Weve had them from pennsylvania, wisconsin, South Carolina even and others and this is a divided court. We saw several cases from pennsylvania go up that split 44. So its possible that Amy Coney Barretts vote could be dispositive. But we dont even know whether she would sit for a case like this. So we need to wait and see what the arguments are going to be as to why these ballots might be infirm. Lets also admit the fact that its possible when all the ballots are counted that President Trump may win reelection, in which case then he wouldnt feel the need to go to the Supreme Court. But right now well trust the state process, the administrators who are doing the counting, and then the state courts to adjudicate any controversies. Well, if he doesnt wait until pennsylvania gets counted, i know there was already discussion among republicans about fighting back against the count going on till friday in pennsylvania. If they do file something tomorrow to stop the count in pennsylvania where donald trump is currently doing well with the sameday vote, what is your expectation for what an argument like that is going to look like and a potential ruling . Well, we already have two court case thats have been filed in i guess the last 15 hours in pennsylvania by the republicans. One of them had to do with provisional ballots and whether certain counties had allowed defective absentee ballots to be cured by way of provisional ballots. These are those ballots that you can cast when you come into the polling place and theres sort of an Insurance Scheme so you dont get turned away from the polls. So theres one lawsuit with respect to that. Theres a similar type of lawsuit in Montgomery County which is north of philadelphia dealing with whether the administrators there properly helped people cure their absentee ballot. That is what exists right now. But you cant simply say that the count stops now. You have to have some legal reason for stopping it. And that would be unprecedented. And so you know, pennsylvanias going to take a day. Theyre going to count the votes. And then depending on the margin, perhaps one or the other candidate might sue. But for right now were in just that period where all the votes need to be counted. Let me ask you really quickly, nate, if i can because one of the things thats seared into the psyche or the memory of this country is what happened in florida back in 2000 with gore v. Bush. The question this time around might be a little bit different given the fact were seeing at least a handful of very close states. And the question to you is do we have the bandwidth from a judiciary point of view and certainly the Supreme Court to take on multiple cases or do they get lumped up if theres a running theme in some of them when you have potentially two different sets of legal challenges playing out in multiple states woshlgling thrl wail to the Supreme Courtllllllllllll thrl wail to the Supreme Court. Zbll ail the sermt quellsale might whether state courts or administrators when they expand Voting Rights or interpret the state constitution in a way that is perceived to be limiting of the state legislatures power does that violate article 2 section 1 of the constitution which gives the state legislature the power to appoint electors. And so that has divided the court. We saw that chief Justice Roberts actually joined with the three more liberal justices in that 44 decision out of pennsylvania on that issue. And so you could see potentially that different states could have similar controversies that then would be involved in one case. Nate persi lichlt, thank you. My dad told me when i was in college that i should be a lawyer because ill always have work. And i think this election is an example of election lawyers always having work. Theres going to be a lot of interesting stuff happening as we get into tomorrow and the next few days, especially when it comes to the legal challenges. Big questions with Amy Coney Barrett now on the Supreme Court, how might she rule. Would she recuse herself since she was just confirmed by the president , who said that he wanted her on there for the election . Were going to take a very quick break. And on the other side were going to talk to two congresspeople. Congressman Eric Swalwell and congresswoman Sheila Jackson lee. Dont go anywhere. Lee. Dont go anywhere. You wont see these folks, at the post office they have businesses to grow customers to care for lives to get home to they use stamps. Com print discounted postage for any letter any package any time right from your computer get the services of the post office plus ups at up to 62 off get our special tv offer a 4week trial plus postage and a digital scale go to stamps. Com save and never go to the post office again do you have a Life Insurance policy you no longer need . Now you can sell your policy, even a term policy, for an immediate cash payment. Call Coventry Direct to learn more. We thought we had planned carefully for our retirement. But we quickly realized that we needed a way to supplement our income. Our friends sold their policy to help pay for their medical bills and that got me thinking. Maybe selling our policy could help with our retirement. Im skeptical, so i did some research and called Coventry Direct. They explained Life Insurance is a valuable asset that can be sold. We learned that we can sell all of our policy or keep part of it with no future payments, who knew . We sold our policy. Now we can relax and enjoy our retirement as we had planned. If you have one hundred thousand dollars or more of Life Insurance you may qualify to sell your policy. Dont cancel or let your policy lapse without finding out what its worth. Visit conventrydirect. Com to find out if you policy qualifies. Or call the number on your screen. Coventry direct, redefining insurance. I got it all from you im always pushing through i know well make it to the finish line i know youre waiting on the other side im like you ondemand glucose monitoring. Because theyre always on. Another lifechanging technology from abbott. So you dont wait for life. You live it. I got this Mountain Bike for only 11. Dealdash. Com, the fair and honest bidding site. An ipad worth 505, was sold for less than 24; a playstation 4 for less than 16; and a schultz 4k television for less than 2. I won these bluetooth headphones for 20. I got these three suitcases for less than 40. And shipping is always free. Go to dealdash. Com right now and see how much you can save. It is 3 50 a. M. , and depending on which side of the camera youre on youre either on your multiple cups of coffee or your multiple bottles of wine this election second day i guess, morning, early morning. Steve cokornacki, you got some w numbers out of milwaukee. Tell us what you have. A little bit here. Ive been saying wait till we get this vote here from milwaukee, the city of milwaukee. What we did just get was its not just milwaukee and Milwaukee County. Some of the smaller cities, towns around there. We also just got in what that did their absentee vote, what that did is it brought that statewide lead in wisconsin for donald trump to 108,000. And its almost all the city of milwaukee that is left there. The absentee vote from the city of milwaukee, which we expect to be overwhelmingly democratic and we expect to see any minute now. Theres one other small municipality there where were going to get the absentee vote in Milwaukee County. But its really down to kenosha, milwaukee, and green bay. Brown county here but i think green bay more specifically were waiting on the vote from green bay. Were waiting on that absentee ballot from heavily democratic milwaukee. We are waiting on absentee vote from kenosha. And then theres just a skatdering skat scattering of some other precincts around the state. Boy, that milwaukee votes going to be big. Well keep on eye on that and get back to you in just a moment. I want to bring in right now democratic congresswoman excuse me, congressman of california Eric Swalwell and donationwoman barbara lee as well. Thank you both for joining us. Congressman, let me begin with you. Im curious to get your thoughts as a prosecutor and both as a member much congress. What is your general reaction to how this is playing out this evening, what are you concerned about at this late hour or early hour of the morning when we hear from the two candidates and see the state of the race . Well, good evening. Its also nice to be on with my neighbor, barbara lee. But as a lawyer but also as a citizen allow every vote to be counted. And as we see, as the vote counts come in, it looks more and more like joe biden is going to be the next president of the United States. And im pretty confident about that. Essentially, you have five states. Right . Arizona, michigan, pennsylvania, wisconsin, and georgia. It looks like arizonas going to go to biden. The a. P. Has called it that way. If biden can win two more states, thats it. Its over. But the best thing we can do, whether youre the president of the United States or running against him, is just to say let all the votes be counted. And congresswoman, let me ask you, as a democrat right now are you feeling good about tonight . Are you feeling like there needs to be some soul searching about who the Democratic Party appeals to more broadly across the country . Listen, i am feeling very good and i too am happy to be on with my friend and colleague, Eric Swalwell. You know, we Work Together on so many issues. And let me tell you, voter protection, getting out the vote, doing what we have done and what the country has done in terms of registering people and more people voting in historic numbers, i feel that our democracy is really intact. And i have to tell you, i have monitored elections in south africa, in nigeria, all around the world, and always wanted to see people vote like we have seen during this election. And when you look at the Africanamerican Community, lines of people voting early, casting absentee ballots, you cant tell me that these votes will not be counted. So i feel very proud of our country and proud of so many people, especially all the young people who got out and voted. Let me just ask you really quickly because youre bringing up the reference to south africa and other countries, im curious to get your thoughts when you have a president in the white house declaring victory ahead of the votes being completely counted, threatening to take legal action. You have all the cases that were in the runup to the election. The speaker of the house at one point cast doubt about the integrity of this while President Trump was attacking the voting process. How confident are you that this is going to be resolved in a free and fair manner . Well, i have to believe in our Democratic Institutions and i believe that this president is acting in a very undemocratic way. Hes acting like a strong man. This is a democracy. Thns a dictat this is not a dictatorship. What he said tonight and he telegraphed this earlier, that he was going to come out and say what he said. So we just have to be patient. We have to make sure that all of our votes are counted. And we are prepared for whats next. But i agree with congressman swalwell. I believe that there are no surprises yet and the road to victory is very clear. All right, congresswoman barbara lee. Congressman Eric Swalwell. Thank you both very much for joining us this hour. When we come back, were going to go back to Steve Kornacki. Hes got an update on some of those numbers were expecting from milwaukee city at the top of the hour. Quick break. Stay with us. A live bookkeeper is helping customize quickbooks for me. Okay, youre all set up. Thanks that was my business gi, this ones casual. Get set up right with a live bookkeeper with intuit quickbooks. All right. Welcome back, everyone. Youre watching msnbcs continuing coverage of the 2020 election. Right now, you see it on your screen, joe biden has 220 electoral votes, President Trump, 213. A lot at stake. A lot of states undecided despite what President Trump said. The senate 46 seat its in hands of the democrats, 47 in the republicans. Some big races they were keeping an eye on that may not necessarily have panned out. It has not been a good night so far for democrats in terms of the control of the senate. They were really hoping to have the ability to regain the senate. They were looking at a number of races when they thought they had a good shot. Right now, some of those races have not panned out. We are sit waiting for them, they lost some seats in the house. Obviously, were waiting for Election Results. And the name of the game right now is patience. Patience. The votes are not all counted. Despite what the president says, there are a lot of votes out there system not counted. And we might not know the results of this election for days, perhaps longer, but we still are going to know potentially some major states tonight. Steve kornacki has been monitoring wisconsin, a state that democrats were very hopeful about which is extremely close right now. Weve all been waiting for the count in milwaukee which should be coming, steve, correct me if im wrong, any moment now. I keep hyping this, youre going to stop believing me, but i swear any second now. Look, this is a battle for 270. This is the real estate left to be claimed. We are still waiting, nothing has been updated the last time we looked. The bottom like that in wisconsin, donald trump leads by 100,000 votes, 108,000 votes. Whats left to come is certainly going to favor joe biden. The question is is it going to favor him by 108,000 votes. By far, the biggest thing left here is the absentee vote in the city of milwaukee. Thats what we think well get any minute now. Its past 4 00 a. M. On the east coast. I really think, based on what theyre saying were going to get it any minute. Theres the potential there. Lets see, if that vote comes does that erase all of that 108,000. Does it fall short . Does it go over . Its that big what comes in there. There are other outstanding things, kenosha, were waiting on an absentee vote from kenosha. Were waiting on the city of green bay. There are some other, a few other republican spots on this map, too, that might come in. Nothing, though, the size of milwaukee and absentee votes. Trust me, ill let you know as soon as steve, the good news is, were not going anywhere. Were going to be here even if that comes in. Let me ask you quickly, you say theres 100 plus votes that favor joe biden at this moment. Do we have a number of outstanding ballots that could potentially still be coming in . Yeah. Ill show you this, this is my outstanding vote feature here. You can see it. That just gives you the scale of what were looking at here, overwhelmingly, the votes that are yet to come in here, that are about to come in, are coming from this milwaukee basically, the milwaukee absentee. You see, kenosha, theres still a little in kenosha. Green bay, the second biggest thing on the board right now is green bay. Weve got to get all of the votes in from green bay. Up do see, you see the dots that kind of pick up around the map here . Right. A lot of these, not all, are republican areas, the scale to be reported usually talking the hundreds. Whereas, were talking about is is it 100,000. A plurality biden, is it 100,000 . Thats the story right now, if this leaves this to a place where its a couple hundred votes either way then the dots start to become very important. Steve, are we going to know which direction this election is headed once we know wisconsin. Wisconsin is a huge piece of the electoral map. Again, you see 220 to 213 here. Wisconsin worth 10. Lets look at this from bidens standpoint, because he is leading in a couple states im looking at now. If biden were to hold on in arizona where hes ahead in the vote returns right now, if he were to hold on in nevada, i dont want to forget, hawaii, too, democratic stronghold, that would move him to 251, if he were to get wisconsin. You know, at that point, you got michigan next door, if youre able to pull out wisconsin, maybe you feel better about michigan, thats worth 16. Youve got 20 available in pennsylvania. You got 15 available in North Carolina, although that one, ive got to say, the vote thats left to come, what democrats need, they need a ton of votes that have been put in the mail basically in the last day in North Carolina and still be arriving. Youve got 16 in georgia. Georgia is a very interesting one right now, because the democrats are making up ground with votes. Later with vote returns from the Atlanta Metro area. Democrats certainly have their eye on georgia. They believe they can get, arizona, nevada and hawaii, certainly, theyve really got to pick up wisconsin to start breathing easy if youre a democrat. Its 4 06 in the morning. Steve, youre been on the air since i woke up this morning, youre still doing math in your head on the fly. Im so impressed. Tell me what your spidey sense what your spidey sense says about georgia . Yeah, its all a question. Im just looking at to see, somebody will shout in my ear if Milwaukee County comes right now. Take a look, 102,000 votes. Again, lets put our filter on here. Where is the remaining vote . Joe biden is trying to make up 102,000. Fulton county, dekalb, macon, aug augusta. The biggest circles are in the core democratic areas. Youre talking about in Fulton County, somewhere joe biden is winning with north of 70 of the vote right now. So there are opportunities here for them to get close. Again, there are smaller areas that favor trump. Weve seen trump continue his strength in rural areas, with large rural white populations. Blue collar populations. His strength from 2016. Youre still seeing it. In the south in georgia, youre seeing it in the north in wisconsin. There are places that trump can pick things up. Its one of those, high population, high density, heavily democratic areas left to come here. Is that enough to get to 102,000. Im avoiding making a prediction because one of the variables, too, we are unclear exactly how many votes are left to be counted. Were trying to determine that. Theres the potential given the terrain were talking about, but very close. All right were going to let you work on those milwaukee numbers, if you get an update, if you do, wave us, well come back to you. In the meantime, we want to bring in jason johnson, professor of politics and journalist at morgan state university. Jason, weve been tracking this throughout the day. When you look at the lay of the land at this hour, youre looking at the state that is coming down to certainly, georgia, wisconsin, how do you think democrats are feeling with the way the map is shaping up to be at 4 00 a. M. . Well, it depends who you talk to. If you talk to people at the state level, most of them are still very anxious and very, very concerned. The people who i have talked to within the Biden Campaign have pretty much said this is what we told you was going to happen all along and theyre still remaining calm. I can tell you from a purely academic standpoint when i talked about polling, i thought it was a lazy thing to say the polls were wrong in 2016, because they werent on so many different levels. This year, this is looking strange, weve had so many different instances where polling has been improved and yet you see results that are nowhere close to what anybody expected. I dont know if im going to find out if has to do with mistakes in polling or tampering of the vote, et cetera, to see what we saw in florida, to see the democrats lose six house seats in a night thats have very much in favor of a turnout, thats strange. I think there are some structural things we need to examine how we do our coverage and analysis of upcoming elections. I think youre right. Again, just like in 2016, there should be a serious conversation about polling, especially on the district level, where were seeing democrats lose seats in the house. They are also very hopeful about the senate, and its not looking so great right now. Other than that, though, barring any nefarious behavior, right now, we dont have any evidence of that, do the democrats need to do some soul searching about who they are appealing to . I mean, miamidade county, hispanic vote, donald trump gained the hispanic vote, clearly, socialism and labeling that donald trump did of joe biden worked among cubanamericans it seems in miamidade. Also, when you look at wisconsin seems to be going over the numbers and counties, when you look at 2012 and what obama did wisconsin, its mostly blue. You look at 2016 and now 2020, its mostly red. Democrats are still not appealing to white, rural, working class voters. What are the soulsearching going to be once the election is over . Well, i think youre talking about completely different things, katie. And one, ive had this conversation with a lot of latino scholars that i know, that i work with, et cetera, et cetera, weve got to move away and start disaggregating this word latino what we saw in arizona, what we saw in texas, and what we saw in florida, just because people are native spanish speakers in their home. A lot of hispanics are white, and they identify as white. They vote as white americans. Quote unquote, latino voters are the second most favored group for donald trump among white people. If you believe that joe biden is a socialist, youre never going to vote for a democrat, its a ridiculous claim. As far as White Working Class voters, lets be candid, i mean, joe biden was always going to have a struggle with noncollege educated white people. But it remains to be seen what the story will be because we dont know whats going to happen in wisconsin, once we see that, maybe you can have the full narrative. Let me ask you this, i think youre right to say that latino hispanic voters are not a monolith. No ethnic group is a monolith. How do you for the Democratic Party start delineating blocs of voters. What is a better way to look at it . Well, first, its about spending money, right . Its spending money in these particular communities. Its about longterm work. When you talk to people in arizona, what they talk about is chief arpaia, show me your papers, senate bill 1070 in arizona. Those things activated and galvanized a whole generation of spanishspeaking voters for years. By the time it came to election time, people were active. I think the same thing applies to the Africanamerican Community in 2008, 2012 and 2016, the more hispanic americans we have in media who are intimately familiar with these communities we dont get a surprise. When ive been able to make assessments about how black voters were behaving in georgia, hey, you had lots of africanamericans down there reporting, this is what im hearing, these are certain thing i may hear that different reporters dont. I think if we had large analysts of consultants who are members of these communities, we might get a better assessment and wouldnt get as surprised as we do on Election Nights. Again, i think you can draw completely different stories from what happened in texas, what happened in arizona and what happened in florida. But if we had experts in these areas we could probably know how to draw a story from it. Jason johnson, appreciate you joining us this hour. Lets cross to philadelphia and bring in rehema ellis, nbc correspondent. All eyes are on pennsylvania. All eyes on philadelphia. The president has specifically put that state in his cross hairs the last few days. Give me a sense of how things have played out on election day, and looking ahead to how the counting will resume on wednesday morning. Reporter well, its not that the counting is going to resume on wednesday morning, eamon. Look over here, this is the Pennsylvania Convention center. The counting is going on. Up on the second floor of this building, this is the Central Place where they are bringing in all of those mail ballots. And theyre counting them around the clock. Literally 24 hours. They are nonstop. Now, 24 not hearing what the reporting is of that count. And this is whats so important. This is philadelphia. The largest of the two cities, two big cities in pennsylvania. The other one being pittsburgh, out in Allegheny County. The largest number of mail ballots came from here. 430,000 mail ballots. They have received 350,000 of them. Right up there. Now, what theyre going to do theyre also going to receive as many other ballots that have been postmarked as of election day at 8 00 p. M. And they have until 5 00 on friday for those to be brought in bit United States Postal Service into this building and theyre going to be counted. Again, one of the important things is youre not going to hear what the numbers are out of there, because we were told just a few hours ago that first theyre going to be reporting the inperson voting that curled on election day. Theyve still got a lot of work to do on that. Only then will they start to tell you what the numbers are out of here. They dont think theyre going to be able to tell you anything for not just hours, but days to come, as i say, theyre going to wait until theyve got everything counted. And then theyre going to push it out in a block. The governor of pennsylvania says he wants people to be calm and patient. And confident that every single mailin ballot that was duly submitted on time is indeed going to be counted. Its going to take a while. And its going to be they think its going to be decisive in determining who is going to win the state. The other reason why those ballots are so important, remember what happened in 2016, Hillary Clinton lost this very strong Democratic State by less than 1 . And that was 44,000 votes. Again, were talking upwards of 430,000 mailin ballots that were sent out and have yet, all of them have not yet been received. It could be critical in determining who wins this race. And again, were just talking about whats happening here in the city of philadelphia, to say nothing of what is going on in the city of pittsburgh, out in Allegheny County, out west. I was talking to the Lieutenant Governor John Fetterman today about the ballots that come in after the polls closed yesterday in pennsylvania. They say they will be separated out just in case theres a legal challenge there. They are taking every precaution, they say and firmly believe all of those votes are valid. And postmarked before election day. Its not the fault of the voter, they got it in on time. Its the fault of Postal Service getting it back to election offices. Right. Theyll have until friday. Theres also a federal order for all postal offices to do a sweep of facilities across the country to make sure there arent any uncovered ballots, undiscovered ballots. Lets bring in the democratic strategist and former Senior Adviser to the Bernie Sanders campaign. Susan del percio, republican strategist, peter hannity, vanity fair contributor and host of good luck america. On snapchat and nbc news contributor, and former congressman, david jolly. First, what do you feel about the Election Results so far . Its classic 2020. Im so tired of 2020, when it slows down, im going to get off and walk the rest of the way. Tell me how you think joe biden is doing. I know miamidade is a bit of a letdown. The expectation was not that the biden team was going to win florida. Miamidade, the numbers coming out of there are not what the biden team or democrats would have expected for a democrat in that normally very blue county. A county that Hillary Clinton won by a much wider margin than joe biden did. To jasons point earlier, i wasnt surprised, and i wasnt surprised about what happened in florida. And brother jolley knows the same thing. Theyre not a monolith, a lot of people using that word dont even know what it means. I only figured it out a couple weeks ago. Tonight in miamidade, biden underperformed Hillary Clinton 18 points. We lost two Congressional Districts down there that we should not have won because of what happened down there. Theres going to be a lot of sunday morning, monday morning quarterbacking. Ive been watching the latino vote, the ebb and flow. The average latino vote in america is 27. You got to take florida and set it aside. Joe biden is going to do fine with the latino vote in other states but we do need to do a deep dive in how the money was spent. I watched a lot of money go around to worldwide consultants and go to the latino communities. What do you think when the trump team tried to paint biden as a socialist . That obviously resonated with a number of voters in miamidade . I remember getting a phone call from brother joe garcia down there, a congressman. This was on the late summer. Hes like, chuck, you got to get people on these radio stations to push back on this socialism and communism. I know its wrong. You have to push back every day and put together an operation. That coupled with probably the most Misinformation Campaign that ive ever seen run in spanish in my 31 years of running campaigns. Ive come from texas, ive seen a few misinformation. What we saw in florida, what we saw in miami had a dramatic effect. How big will yet to be seen but ive never seen the misinformation, justed badness of what people were doing to our community by spreading lies. David, i want you to comment but first a little information. I know weve been waiting for an update. Shack brewster is reporting that the citial arrived at the courthouse with the absentee data. It could take half an hour to post it. Mark your watches, 4 21, maybe at 4 51, well find out what happened in milwaukee. And maybe what happened in wisconsin. David, back to florida and miamidade. And more broadly, florida, what are your thoughts . I totally agree. In south florida, democrats have an issue with the cubanamerican, hispanic population, some of the venezuelan americans. Others for whom, frankly, you can label it socialism or not, katy, but the reality is if those communities look at the platforms of the two parties its an uniquely situated community in south florida. And issues resonate. And to bring in a president who tags everything as socialism, its very effective. Statewide, i spoke with the chair of the Democratic Party and the chair of the republican party, for two years, theyve each been mobilizing the 60county strategy. Theyre both optimistic about it. Democrats have the highest number of registrations, and theyve closed the gap to the smaller dealt talta theyve eve. Each knew it was going to come down to i the npas performed one interesting thing in this election given the covid pandemic. The democratic chair told me when the pandemic hit, they had to stop a lot of their Voter Registration and mobilization and move a vote by mail strategy. The republican chairman said they just kept pressing. They had about 5,000 community events. Some of them household events, some of them rallies. They had 4. 5 million door knocks despite the pandemic. Look, whether or not that put them over the edge in terms of mobilizing and getting out the vote. Clearly republicans showed they can win a twopoint race in the state of florida. David, let me pick up on a point you just brought up there. And that has do deal specifically with the republican inroads they made in the state of florida. Obviously, democrats were hopeful they were going to flip that state with texas, perhaps even North Carolina. But specifically, when youre talking about the pandemic, and their efforts to mobilize and register, more, if will you, npas or at least new voters in that state, it seems like that effort fell somewhat short given the turnout were seeing in florida. And obviously going to President Trump. But ultimately, the real shortage here has been the messaging of the democrats. They try to get something to stick on President Trump in that state, the way katy was talk about the socialist label against joe biden with the cuban voters. It didnt seem like anything that joe biden was sticking on President Trump whether covid related or the economy really worked in florida. Yeah, i love that question, eamon, because we were looking at two demographics. One, the senior vote that seemed to break a little bit more towards biden and democrats in the past. You talk about the villages in central florida, they got to 32 , 33 , but it wasnt a significant move. Inroads within the republican and, frankly, the Trump Campaign with africanamerican male voters they saw significantly move a little higher. Youre still talking high Single Digits or low double digits, not a significant portion of the demographic. Eamon, to your point, ive been in Florida Politics a long time, ive been in politics my whole life, im looking at an see election of the night, despite the drama of the last four year, the outrage of last four years unprecedented behavior of a president and party that affirms him. Im wondering do candidates even matter now. Are our allegiances truly red and blue and were going to perform as a nation in a strictly partisan way and you can look at the ballot in florida tonight and say maybe that is the case. I was going to say it was more about the partisan allegiance than a specific candidate. Peter, i understand you wanted to weigh in on this . Yeah, i do. I believe theres a misleading narrative getting out there, joe biden outperformed Hillary Clinton in terms of a raw vote number, across the country. Pretty much in every county including hispanic counties. He outran Hillary Clinton in Orange County where you have a lot of puerto rican voters he outran Hillary Clinton in hill darling go county in south texas, and duval county, outran hillary in pensacola. He did well in florida. But if you go to miamidade, he was basically at parity with Hillary Clinton. The issue here is that donald trump added 200,000 votes to his vote number in miamidade. Whether or not those are all cubans, maybe they are. He added to his vote number in hispanic count this around the country. Democrats need to ask themselves not just, you know, what can we do better, but they need to examine why trump is winning in these communities. You know, i spent a lot of time in texas covering rick perry when he was governor. When he first ran for governor, he won 13 of hispanic vote. When he got reelected in 2010, he won 8 of the hispanic vote. When you talk to him and ted cruz who also won 10 of the vote against beto, those are conservative people, they go to church, they own guns. A lot of them are Small Business owners. Thats the monolith question. A lot of them are second, third, fourth generation mexicanamerican immigrants who might be appalled at the fact that donald trump is putting kids in cages but those also might be immigrants from el salvador who are coming here illegally, and they dont like that. There are discreet communities who might just be patriotic because he talks about america brashly. Trump is adding to his hispanic totals in all of these communities, whereas, biden is actually doing better than hillary. Thats what weve been trying to say, was that democrats believe that they had a lot of room to build among the hispanic and latino communities. Theyve been targeting those communities for a long time. Believing they were part of the democratic fold, only to see that donald trump either way with some of that, donald trump to strengthen his hold, as he claimed he would in 2016. And there was a lot of eye rolling as you said,. Twitter class. And clearly that is happening, susan del percio, more broadly when we look across the country, and this is a race that is very much still up in the air. And democrats could come out on top in the election. So, theyre doing better in arizona than anyone would have expected a few months back. They came pretty close in texas, all things considered. Theyre still open in georgia which is traditionally quite a red state. There are a lot of bright spots for democrats. But this election really comes down, to i think david was saying this, to a matter of personality. I mean, donald trump did so much in the last four years. You and i have discussed a lot of it, the child separations, the muslim ban. He was impeached. The list goes on and on. I could spend quite a long time, naming the things that were extraordinary controversial during this four years. Also the response to the coronavirus. When you look at this map right now, at 4 28 a. M. , what are your thoughts . Well, you know, katy, i certainly am no supporter of donald trump, and i can go on for hours about the way hes failed our country. However, that being said, the trump team has been working very hard since 2016 to find new voters, to work the states. Theyve shown that they can do it in two ways. One, they got right into the state parties to avoid any potential primary. That was amazing work that they did in taking controls of states around the country. But the second thing is finding those voters. Because as peter said in florida, you had 200,000 more voters trump got so far, anyway, than in 2016. At 2016, trump had over almost 250,000 more voters than mitt romney did in 2012. They are finding and registering voters. They are also doing another thing. While theres a National Message going out, and we know that these are not national campaigns, the Trump Campaign has been targeting the cubanamerican Community Since he was elected. He has not stopped. We all rolled our eyes when he was running for reelection just hours after he was sworn in as president but he has been doing it. And its been in small focused, determined laser focused, i should say, ways that have gone after small slivers of groups that are now adding up. So, the work they have put in has started to pay off. And joe biden couldnt do it because he wasnt the nominee until august. So it is that personality, but its also able to brand a message which trump has done. Which, again, the outcome is far from over. I happen to think that biden is still in very good shape to win. Arizona puts things in a whole different category as far as what he needs to win. When you look at the map, even without pennsylvania, he can still get to 270. So, i think this is far from over. Right. But you cannot overlook the work that the Trump Campaign has put in. Steve kornacki is focused heavily on wisconsin right now. We are watching the numbers come in. Theyre not coming in yet. Were watching from Milwaukee County. Were counting down 20 minutes or so before we expect to get them, so, steve, are you okay over there . Yeah, i feel like im a used car salesman. Im making all of these promises. One thing i can give you an update on. We are waiting on the absentee vote from Milwaukee County. It has been brought over to the facility, and we were today, i believe, about 20 minutes or so now, it takes 30 minutes to upload it to the computer. I know ive been saying this forever, but apparently, they have the votes and apparently, they are in the process of getting them on to this computer. And at that point, we are going to find out, this is the Milwaukee County total right now. How much does it change. And thats going to be the story because trump continues to lead by 107,000. This could be about 100,000. This could be bigger for joe biden. Its going to be very telling to get it. This is going to tell us a lot about where this election is going. And just to reemphasize what susan del percio was saying, there are some bright spots left on the map for democrats that does include arizona which is a state they want to flip. Which also includes georgia which is a state that has a chance to flip. I know things arent looking as great as North Carolina. Those are the states that could learn sooner than later. We still have to wait quite a bit of time for pennsylvania, michigan. I really do feel this is a big moment were coming up here in wisconsin. If biden gets over the top and gets withes with, you can do the math here, if he gets four in hawaii, 224. 11, in arizona, 235. If he gets six in nevada, 241. If he gets ten here in wisconsin, 251. If he pulls that off, perhaps it would make you think hes more likely to get michigan in the end, gets that, hes at 267, and at that point, okay. Theres pennsylvania, well see what happens there. Or were looking at maine right now where statewide biden is leading in the vote, in the second Congressional District of maine, hes trailing but if he gets those three, 270. Someone get steve another bottle of diet coke, i think, were going to be here a little while longer. Dont go anywhere. Milwaukee, those results are coming to us. Youre not going to want to miss that. We also have a lot of senate races to discuss. Heres where the senate stands, 46 democrats, 47 republicans, theres still some open races, also a big one in arizona. Stay with us. Its totally normal to have constipation with belly pain, straining, and bloating, again and again. No way. More exercise. More water. And more fiber is the only way to manage it. Is it . Maybe you think. Its occasional constipation. Maybe its not. It could be a chronic medical condition called ibsc, and time to say yesss to linzess. Linzess works differently than laxatives. It helps relieve belly pain and lets you have more frequent and complete bowel movements. Do not give linzess to children less than six and it should not be given to children six to less than 18, it may harm them. Do not take linzess if you have a bowel blockage. Get immediate help if you develop unusual or severe stomach pain, especially with bloody or black stools. The most common side effect is diarrhea, sometimes severe. If its severe, stop taking linzess and call your doctor right away. Other side effects include gas, stomach area pain, and swelling. Change your thinking to ibsc. If your constipation and belly pain keeps coming back, tell your doctor and say yesss to linzess. All right, welcome back. We have a projection actually a call to make at 4 38 a. M. The state of hawaii and its four electoral votes going to joe biden. Hes the projected winner in that state. We just saw steve talk about why thats important. Once again, hawaii now being called for joe biden. Winning there quite substantially, 65 to joe biden. That brings his total up to 224 electoral votes to President Trumps 213. Heres where things stand now in the senate, with everything thats been going on at this hour. Republicans control, i believe, 47 seats, you see it right there on the screen. 46 to the democrats. There are still, do the math here with me, im not good at math at 4 30 in the morning. Seven. Seats up for grabs. Seven seating up for grabs. I hope thats seven, im bad at math when im wide awake and drinking coffee. Right now, lets look at the state of maine and the senate race. Democrats are very hopeful about the state of maine. 66 of the vote in. It is still too early to call. You see Susan Collins with a slight lead over her competitor, sarah gideon, democrats still hopeful that Susan Collins will not keep that seat. There are a lot of other seats out there, and there is talk about whether democrats are able to inch this out in the senate. Joining me is former senator and democrat richard gephardt. He knows the sword can cut both ways. Mr. Gephardt, thank you for joining us. Democrats thought they were going to gain seats in the house. Didnt eke that out, actually lost some seats. And the senate is getting farther and farther away from their grasp. This is not the night that the democrats were hoping for. Its not the night that the polls showed. Well, were a closely divided country. We have been for some time. And thats what youre still seeing. Now, the democrats thought they could pick up seats in the house. And they thought they could win the senate. Well see what happens when all of the votes are counted. My main concern right now is whether or not were going to count all of the votes before candidates decide what the election is. So, ive been part of a group of 40 farmer federal officials. We call it the National Council for electoral integrity. And weve actually been running ads in the big swing states, telling people that this could take a long time to count these votes because of the pandemic. And the high volume of mailin ballots. And during that count, people have to be patient, they have to demand that every vote be counted. They have to reject violence, if it comes to that, with protests during this period of time. And we have to let the voters, the people, decide this election. No one else can decide this election. Only the people. What happens if the republicans are able to maintain control of the senate, if donald trump wins reelection . These are all big ifs now. Im gaming out scenarios what is your expectation for how unleashed the president is going to feel. And how unwilling republicans are going to be rein him in. Well, its a hypothetical question. Obviously, hes been pretty unleashed in the last four years. So, if he wins reelection, and he still has a majority in the senate, hes got an open lane. And it will continue. I would assume, to do the things that hes done, unfortunately. I wish that we would win this election. We still dont know what the result is. And, again, we have to to be patient and let these Election Officials which have done a great job in putting this election together, count these votes and giving us the verdict. At the end of the day. This is a democracy thats based on being able to decide close fights. And have the losing side accept that, thats the essence of democracy. And my hope and prayer tonight, or this morning is that both sides will accept whatever the result comes from the voters. Mr. Gephardt, i appreciate your time. Thank you so much for joining us. We want to bring you an update. The much anticipated numbers and update from milwaukee. Steve kornacki just got the numbers, what do you got, steve . I told you these could be critical, joe biden has moved into the lead in wisconsin by 11,000 votes. Wow. It is courtesy of the city of milwaukee absentee vote. You can see that has now been reported. It moves bidens lead in Milwaukee County up to 180,000 votes. Basically what just happened here, the absentee vote, city of milwaukee. We were saying this was going to be overwhelmingly democratic. The gap statewide for biden as the vote was being reported. He was down 108,000 votes statewide. He got 143,000 absentee votes counted here in milwaukee. Donald trumps total was 24,000. 143,000 to 24,000. We expected this to be big. That is very big. And what that has done, again, that has moved joe biden 11,000 votes ahead in wisconsin. Now, that is still close. What is left on this map . Let me see, this has changed. We are still waiting for the city of green bay. This is brouis brown county, br county on the whole has been friendly to donald trump. You can see this is basically the rest of brown county except green bay. If green bay goes a little more democratic when the vote comes in this might not be a vote gained for trump even though the county is red here. Let me see, did we get the rest of washington in . We had a little bit this is a republican county here. Wouldnt of those wow counties, trying to track down if we have a little bit of extra vote here. There just arent many places. How about this, theres the city of kenosha, we got the absentee vote from kenosha, kenosha county, the city of kenosha, the absentee vote, too. That could also be a little bit more favorable to biden than the rest of the county, a bit of a dynamic like you see in green bay. For the Biden Campaign, im sure they are very happy to see this number right now. So its 11,000. Im just seeing if anything else has changed. Im going to try to track down exactly how many votes are left in the state right now. You saw it biden was staring at that gap all night. Was going to need Milwaukee County to erase it. Hes erased it and given himself an 11,000 vote pad with not much to call up you read my mind. Still the milwaukee bubble that will come down. The bubble gives us a sense of how many votes are outstanding. So thats going to be critical in the final tally for what were trying to tabulate here, right . Yeah, no, there are still some votes left here. So, were trying to figure out exactly where. But i said for a long time there, the question was are there 110,000 votes left for bide ton net to take the lead. He just showed there were. Now, this has just flipped around from trumps standpoint. Is there 11,000 for donald trump to get back in the lead . This state, in this state, it was a 23,000 victory statewide for donald trump. With that, joe biden has moved up to 11,000. This is a state, a tight state. Are we going to be able to call wisconsin tonight . I want to confer with the decision desk and see what they think about it. Again, this is exceedingly narrow. Si i do know there is some other vote out. I want to confer, thats a margin right now that came down to 10,900. If joe biden wins withes with, thats an if, were not calling it. If he does, where do we land in our race to 270 . Thats a hugely significant victory for joe biden if he does get it in the road for 270. He had all of these opportunities, florida, texas, et cetera, so far, hes not hitting any. Well see what happens in georgia and North Carolina, if he didnt getting georgia and North Carolina, the path that exists is win arizona. Hold on to nevada, well see what happens. But he leads in the tabulations by a dozen in both of those states right now. Youre not seeing it right now on this map, but biden did flip the Congressional District in nebraska. That was part of the recipe. Then get wisconsin and get michigan. And that combination could get him there. He has 16 electoral votes. 10 electoral votes, also getting hawaii. And maine. Thats the one i knew i was forgetting one there. Right. Maine, with those three, if he doesnt get that Congressional District, he only needs three out of maine. Also, if he gets withes with, it opens up flexibility for joe biden, in the path. He could get a pennsylvania, instead of a michigan, a michigan instead of a pennsylvania. A georgia there would be options, a lot more options. Its kept his options open as youve been outlining through the night. Again, its 10,600. Im eyeing smos cou ining some. There are precincts that could be closer here. Let me take a look and get an exact sense of where the vote is. What about the city of green bay and the city of kenosha . Yeah, thats still thats the big one. Green bay in brown county and still waiting on kenosha as well. So, i believe its you know, the in kenosha, its what we saw in milwaukee, its the absentee vote that theyre doing at a separate facility. Theyre going to report that out, green bay, were waiting on, too. Weve gotten the rest of the county. There are, if youre a democrat, some reason to suspect that that vote might not be hostile to you. Biden leads by 10,613 thats a very small margin. Thats even smaller margin than when trump won. Is there an automatic recount trigger in the state of wisconsin. I know florida has one. Does wisconsin have that . I have to doublecheck this, im thinking back to 2016 when it was called that night, Election Night at 23 votes. That was 0. 7 of 1 . If its inside of 0. 5 . Im saying to my producer, adam, can you get that information if thats triggered within half a percent. Steve, you and i were talking about this over the last 24 hours, i remember you saying 2 could come back to pennsylvania, michigan and wisconsin. With the way things are shaping out to be. And the ventures that the Biden Campaign went in florida, went in ohio, fwhewent in, in texas, is surprisingly playing out as suspected to some degree. That it is going to come back to these three states that youll been hammering about for the past couple days. It almost comes back to 2016, doesnt it . Yeah. Thats this map. Its amazing when you look at the map tonight, so far, weve had one call thats a change from exten2016. Its that single vote in omaha. Thats the switch. Biden is leading in the tabulation in arizona, if he can hang on and win there, that would be a switch. But it comes down to the midwest. Those become the pickoff opportunities for biden, just taking a long time to get there. Shaq brewster who has been conferring wisconsin for us. Hes answered the question i have. He says the recount rules in wisconsin are this. Wisconsin does not have an automatic recount even if the unofficial results are extremely close. So losing candidate who does want to ask for a recount must wait until the last day a county board or canvasser meets, which is one week after the election. Requesting a recount is three Business Days after the Elections Commission receives the last statement from a county board of canvassers. This is from the Elections Commission. If the loser of wisconsin thinks its too close, they do have recourse, but an automatic trigger does not exist in that state. Steve, what is keeping us from calling arizona . Well, theres a lot of votes still, and the vote in arizona, lets call it up here on the screen. Youre sitting at a lead of 130,000 votes for joe biden. Lets take a look at maricopa. This is the vast majority of the state. Remember, they do it in three buckets. The vote comes in, in three buckets in arizona. The first bucket is most favorable for the democrats. The early vote, the early votes cast up until this past weekend. It got the lead up in Maricopa County when those votes came in ten points. Biden was a little above ten points when that first came in. Whats being added to this right now are the votes cast today, or yesterday now. But the votes that were cast on election in person. We knew that was going to be a big republican group. You see so far, trump has cut into bidens lead. We want to know exactly how many of those sameday votes are left. Can we cut closer with that . Then the third group, the folks who sent in their early votes, brought them in at the very last minute. How does that group rate . We have to see that. Steve kornacki, we finally got the numbers we do want to bring in nbc news terrorism analyst malcolm nance and joyce vance. Hes a former u. S. Attorney and professor at the university of alabama law school. Let me begin with you, joyce, the big question tonight not only has to do with all of these counts that were going to see continued throughout the next couple days and potential legal challenges, but it really has to do with the rhetoric coming out of the white house this evening, which is one of concern, raising doubts about this process, trying to stop the vote. And ultimately threatening to take this to the Supreme Court, as we heard there from President Trump. So the legal question to you, today, at this moment is the concern that you have. I thought it was shocking to hear this president , in the white house to say that not all the votes should be counted. And as pointed out earlier, this is not the rhetoric of someone that the votes goring to favor him. This is the sort of rhetoric we hear from someone who thinks theyre going to lose the election and is desperate to suppress votes. Thats definitely what President Trumps strategy is, its one of suppression. Republicans have already launched suits, or prepared to launch suits in many close call states for Vice President joe biden to win. What will we should expect to city over the next few days will be an effort not to change the rules in these states but to go vote by vote, try to obliterate votes to make ballots not count, based on challenges that republicans will try to bring. Malcolm, i appreciate you staying up late. Im going to give you the final word when you look at the long list of things the president has said and done over the past couple of years. This one fits the playbook of what many are saying that many say is an authoritarian leader with an attempt. I wouldnt say its an attempt. Is this an authoritarian leader. He wants a full belarus. He wants the election to be called in his favor. And he expects the organizations and systems in place to do that. But one thing thats working in our favor is that this election is actually going so long, to be quite honest, i just got up, but this election with the count going on, which in some instances could favor him, that is actually tempered some of the hotter heads out there. Malcolm nance, i appreciate that as well. Before we go, can i just sit down, take a moment, take a breath and send my love and appreciation to Steve Kornacki for all hes been doing. You have your own mog emoji on twitter, its tracking kornacki emoji, its the epitome of success. That doesnt sound right. Youve been doing an amazing job. You havent gotten any sleep, and youre working for us tomorrow. Thank you for making this night enjoyable. Steve kornacki, thank you. Thats going to do it for us. Im katy tur. And im ayman mohyeldin. Coming up our election coverage continues with morning joe. Dont go anywhere. Still the rig . Having the wrong plan may cost you thousands of dollars out of pocket. Still the rig . And thats why i love healthmarkets, your Insurance Marketplace. With healthmarkets fitscore, they compare thousands of plans from National Insurance companies to find the right medicare plan that fits you. Call or visit healthmarkets to find your fitscore today. In minutes, you can find out if your current plan is the right fit and once youve let the fitscore do the work, sit back and enjoy not having to shop for insurance again. Healthmarkets fitscore forever technology will continuously scan the market for the best coverage at the best price. So you can shop once and save again and again and again. Rest easy knowing youll have the right plan at the right price and the right fit for you. Best of all, their services are completely free. Does your plan have 0 copays, 0 deductibles and 0 premiums . If not, maybe its not the right fit. Does it include dental and vision coverage . Well, if not, maybe its not the right fit. How about hearing aids, glasses and even telemedicine at no additional cost . Maybe theres a better fit for you. Call healthmarkets now, or visit healthmarkets. Com for your free fitscore. They can instantly compare thousands of medicare plans with all these benefits and more including plans that may let you keep your doctor and save money. Healthmarkets doesnt just work for one insurance company. They work to help you, and they do it all for free. Having helped enroll americans in millions of policies while earning an a plus Customer Satisfaction rating from the Better Business bureau, you can trust healthmarkets. With the annual medicare enrollment deadline coming, go to healthmarkets. Com or call right now. Your Insurance Market place. Healthmarkets. Find your fitscore and get your answers today to get the most out of medicare. Call the number on your screen or go to healthmarkets. Com call now. I got this Mountain Bike for only 11. Dealdash. Com, the fair and honest bidding site. An ipad worth 505, was sold for less than 24; a playstation 4 for less than 16; and a schultz 4k television for less than 2. I won these bluetooth headphones for 20. I got these three suitcases for less than 40. And shipping is always free. Go to dealdash. Com right now and see how much you can save. Some people say dress your age. Thats ridiculous. Age is just an illusion. How you show up for the world, thats whats real. Whats your idea . I put it out there with a godaddy website