Transcripts For MSNBCW Dateline 20200823

Accomplish a great deal. And thats when everything started to change. Something happened to her. In court, youll see it all come pouring out. A hidden crime and a sons heartpounding moment. Thats okay. This is a horrible crime. Im glad we know the truth. Carol lubahn was a restless young mom with two kids when she vanished from her Southern California home. Heartbroken, her loved ones assumed shed left them to start a new life. As years passed with no word from carol, a nag being suspicion took old. Was it something more sinister . Before they could solve the mystery, her son would have to face a dark family secret, but would it lead them to carol . Heres Keith Morrison with secrets in the mist. January 2013, point vicente, california, the wet, gray morning cold has settled in to stay. At noon a police boat sets off in the pea soup fog. A hail mary pass apparently, a slim chance to find the truth at last. But why out there . Why after all those lost 30 years . Maybe some cases are destined to stay cold, easier that way. Before came along with their wild ideas about murder and facebook of all things. And now this their doomed errand into the fog. Her name was carol jean meyer, though she was carol lubahn when all this happened back in march 1981, the night of the slamming doors, the harsh words, the car roaring away. And its an old story anyway pretty girl gets pregnant at 15, marries the guy. Pretty soon shes a 20something with two kids and a hankering to live, really live, for a change. And this particular pretty girl she was fun. She was outgoing. She had a lot of friends. She had these two sisters. Terri was the younger one. Gail the older. We were very close and made each other laugh all the time. But carol lubahn wasnt laughing the end of march 81. For one thing, she wanted to be somebody her own somebody. I know that carol wanted to complete school and further her career, and thats when she went back to study architecture. Sure her husband was a nice kid, and she loved him once with all the intensity of first love, the Handsome High School Football Player whod hang around on her front porch. Dear mike stepped up and married her after the baby was born. He was a really good father. He seemed to really enjoy his kids. Enjoyed carols family, too, especially her dad, milt. Milt brought young mike into the family house painting business. He just took to him immediately. He was always a very likeable person. Friendly, loyal, but not exactly ambitious. He didnt seem to mind at all settling down to a modest existence, them and the two kids all cramped up in a twobedroom, onebath house in torrance, but carol did mind it very much. Shed had a secret affair by then, maybe more than one. She got herself a cute little red car, an audi fox, ordered personalized plates, cjsfox. The car has long gone now, so we did this up to look just like it. Quite often shed get in her little car and go roaring off to school or to meat markets like the local red onion was back then. I know she was going to the red onion. I never went there with her, so i dont know what she was like. And then that night in march, kids off to bed. Their son mike junior was just a boy, 10 years old. I was in bed. I had just got a new stereo for my tenth birthday and was listening to the headphones. From his bed, he could see something happening out in the hallway. I remember them getting into an argument which was unusual. Because they just didnt . Not that i knew of. I remember her marching past and going out the front door and slamming the door. You heard the slam . I heard the slam of the front door, i know that. The next morning we got up, and she wasnt there. Mike senior told carols dad that carol demanded he sign papers to sell their house, and he didnt want to, and she got mad, and they argued. He went to bed. When he woke up in the morning, she was just gone. We just assumed she needed to get away for a few days. But as the days went on, we got extremely worried. Nearly a week after carol departed, her red audi fox showed up in the parking lot of the red onion, dusty, as if it had been there a while. I remember being upset about it. She was gone, and i didnt know where she went. They drove around looking for her, went to bars. Carols picture in hand. The Torrance Police department opened a file, but they couldnt answer any of the questions like had she just finally gotten fed up with mike and this little place and gone off to start a new life somewhere else, or had she been in an accident or something worse . More than a week after carol disappeared, there was still absolutely no sign of her, and then something strange happened here at the house, something very strange. Could it be that carol unbeknownst to anyone sneaked back in when nobody else was around . Imagine what it was like back then in that little house, mike thinking things over. On a hunch he said he placed tape on carols dresser drawers, a little trap. One day he took the kids to universal studios, and sure enough, when they returned, he noticed the tape was broken. And some mail on the counter was moved as well. A few weeks later, it happened again. Some of carols clothes went missing along with some money from a place no burglar would know to look, under the butter dish in the refrigerator where mike said he and carol kept 100 in emergency cash. And now 60 was missing. Just like carol, said her sister gail. She would have not taken all of it. That was in carols personality to be fair. Made sense then. Uhhuh. And then there were those mysterious phone calls. Wed get the calls on special days, her birthday, my birthday. My grandmother would get calls. And just silence on the other end . Yeah. What did you do . We would say, carol, we love you. We hope you come back. We felt like she was finding a happier life somewhere. And understood that to make that successful, she might have to make a complete and total break. Yeah. Almost three months after carol vanished, the detective handling her case put it in the inactive file. In his report he wrote, no foul play involved. I remember thinking about her all the time. And i used to play records over and over that she liked and just think, where is she, whens she coming back. Eventually mike started dating a 19yearold named carrie. Brought her into the fold. We were happy that mike was going on with life. And so they did all go on with life. And many years went by. Until the morning in a whole new millennium when a torrance detective happened on the case of the missing young mother, and somewhere in the back of his brain, a little light turned on. Im just had a hunch that this didnt sound right to me. As doubts about carols disappearance grew, detectives turned to a surprising source to help solve the mystery. Coming up why dont you establish a facebook account for carol . When dateline continues. There are thoughts that are hard to control youre not good enough but i am enough music and i know what im made of put your skin in the game with a razor that puts your skin first venus my skin. My way. Did you know you can shorten your cold [ ] with coldeeze® lozenges. Coldeeze® can shorten your cold by 42 . It releases zinc ions that some scientists believe inhibit cold viruses from replicating. Try coldeeze® the number one bestselling zinc lozenge. People are surprising themselves the moment realize they can du more with less asthma. Thanks to dupixent, the addon treatment for specific types of moderatetosevere asthma. Dupixent isnt for sudden breathing problems. It can improve lung function for better breathing in as little as 2 weeks and help prevent severe asthma attacks. 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In march of 1981, carol lubahn, a lonely mother of two, known to be unhappy in her marriage, vanished, leaving for parts unknown, leaving not just her husband mike but her son mike junior, just 10 years old. I never felt that my mother abandoned me. I never was upset with her never. I never thought she did. I dont know why. I was upset she wasnt there. I thought she would be there to show up at a graduation or something. But she didnt. And at family gatherings as the years went by, thanksgiving, christmases, that awful question why would she leave them remained the unmentionable elephant in the room. When it came to my family, i think they didnt talk about it because they figured it would upset me or my sister. My family is pretty closed to talking about heavy things, so Something Like that rarely talked about. It was an ultimate heavy thing. Yeah. Could you see it in your mothers eyes or your fathers . In my fathers for sure. What would you see there . A lot of emotion. A lot of sadness. Im going to cry thinking about it. In 1987, almost six years after carol vanished, the Torrance Police department revisited the case and time seemed to have altered mikes mind a little. Details came back to them. Remember soon after she vanished, mike said they argued, he went to bed alone, woke up early, and she was gone . But in 1987, he remembered they argued, went to bed together, she got up at 5 30 to go to the bathroom, he woke up, drifted off to sleep, and woke up to the sound of a car engine starting and driving away. Odd. But memories do play tricks. Anyway it didnt seem terribly significant. So the case went back into the file and got colder. Mike took over the house painting business from carols dad and went on to marry carrie and have two more sons. Gail and teri raised their own families, and it was having babies that started to change terris way of looking at her sisters disappearance. As unhappy as you might be in your life and you might leave your husband, youd take your kids with you. And so when you began to suspect that she wouldnt leave her children, what did that mean to you . That something happened to her. In 1996, 15 years since theyd heard from carol, the police came around again. This time they scanned the lubahns backyard with Ground Penetrating radar, even dug up the ground. Didnt find a thing. Funny thing, though, about four months later, the local paper, the daily breeze, did a story. They interviewed mike. This time his memory was slightly different. He remembered that on that terrible morning when carol left, he heard the garage door go up before she drove away. Just one more little detail, though, nothing profoundly different. Of course, no evidence whatsoever of any crime. The case went away again. And then one day in 2002, a detective named walt delsigne was rummaging through cabinets behind his sergeants desk. I was just being nosey. I thought, what is this . It was the carol lubahn case folder. At that point, more than 20 years old and cold as they come. I never even heard of it before. And i go, this is interesting. Wonder if this ladys still missing. Of course, she was. So again he read through the police reports. Couldnt help but notice the subtle changes in mikes story. And i thought that was kind of strange because i wouldnt think you would forget the last time you saw your wife. So he went to see carols parents, her mom, melba, her dad, milt. And he looked up at me. And he was starting to cry. Im like, milt, are you okay some and he said, he goes, i just so happy, i cant believe you guys are still interested in this case. How much did that have to do with you driving ahead on this case, that conversation . A lot. Im the father of three daughters, as well. And i thought what if this was my middle daughter. Milt died one month later, never knowing what happened to his beautiful middle daughter. What terri went to her fathers funeral and saw mike there, a private thought ate at her mike must know something. I didnt say anything. I tried to keep away. He was, of course, paying his respects to my family. But i couldnt carry on a conversation with him. Meanwhile, walt delsigne had become a little obsessed. He had many other pressing cases, but something kept pulling him back to carol lubahn. I would shuffle some work away. I got in a little trouble for that sometimes. For years, the detective chipped away until finally eight years after finding that dusty old file, he decided to pay a surprise visit to mike lubahn. His colleagues thought he was a bit nuts. Yeah, you think hes going to admit it to you . I go, well, i played enough sports in my time, i know youre not going to get anywhere if you dont try. You never know. Hi, detective delsigne. We want to talk about carol. What story would mike tell this time . Dateline returns after the break. Okay. 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Five years is just crazy. See me. Learn more at cosentyx. Com. For eight years, Torrance Police detective walt delsigne worried away at the carol lubahn file, drawn by an irresistible hunch that this young mother did not disappear voluntarily, but actual evidence of a crime . Just wasnt any. Finally in 2010, 29 years after carol supposedly walked out on her family and never came back, delsigne decided it was time for a surprise visit to michael lubahn. He went over with his sergeant. He invited us in. We did catch him unexpectedly, but that was the plan. But was mike upset or thrown off . Not at all. Very nice like i anticipated he would be because id now heard from everybody in the family how mikes a good guy. So together they went over again the details of that last night back in march 81. And right away, mike remembered a little more about the night carol presented him with a real estate contract and a demand they sell their tiny house. She came here and no, did she say walk away she said you make my skin crawl. You make my skin crawl. Yeah. I thought being i bet she did say that. I pushed him for some more details. And the details were once again a little different about when and where he last saw her, for example. It wasnt when he went to bed around 10 00 p. M. As he said on one occasion or 5 30 the next morning as he also said. No, this time mike said he last saw carol about 10 30 or 11 00 p. M. In the bathtub. How long was she in the tub . I used the bathroom. And then he said maybe around midnight or 1 00 or 2 00, he heard the garage door go up and actually saw carols car driving away. Lights you see taillights. Yeah. And youre sure it was her car . Yeah. Also, remember the story about putting tape on the dresser drawers after carol left, and later he found it broken . Didnt remember that now. The tape i dont know. You dont know what that is . No. As he sat here in 2010, he did remember some other traps hed set, even more elaborate. Like i would take like baby powder and put it inside the door so if somebody stepped in, id see it. Baby powder . Okay. And what else . Anything else . I think i did that james bond thing with the paper on the door. Paper on the door . If the paper falls. Okay. Thats about it. By now, detective delsigne was working with his colleague jim wallace and deputy d. A. John lewin. Lewin specializes in tackling the most difficult of cold cases. Do you remember when you saw the results of that interview what you thought . Yeah. I thought that his memory had grown in areas where it shouldnt and in areas where he should be saying the same story was different. And thats the hallmark of deception. Sure. But the mind plays tricks. The mind invents things. And and inserts them into your memory, and you believe them as strenuously as if they actually happened. Thats an interesting theory. I dont think its really supported. Memories can be lost. But memories dont increase in details over the years, and they dont increase in different details. And thats a sign of what we call a lie. His version of what happened from the start made no sense to any of us. This is what makes the case and why would mike lie . To the Cold Case Team, it seemed obvious. He killed her that night. She stopped living that night. And Everything Else thats going it doesnt make sense. Its all because you know its a lie. If you know its a lie it all lines up. Remarkably mike lubahn continued to talk to them three more times of his own free will, very friendly. Without an attorney. He even let the prosecutor take a crack at him. If you were me, if you were in my position, tell me what youre thinking. Probably what youre thinking . Which is. That i did it. Mike, i can tell you sometimes you know the kind of murder cases we get, we get cases where the husband finds out that his wife is cheating on him and kills her. So it had nothing to do with that. Did you catch what mike said . It had nothing to do with that. Lewin did. When you look at sentence structure and how people talk and communicate, it wasnt about that, what is it . You gave that great significance, didnt you . Absolutely. They kept at mike. At one point it seemed to them he was on the verge of confessing. Listening, watching the last few days or something to think about all of that ill come back. But when he came back, he didnt give them anything, and they were right back where they started. Suspicion, sure, but no evidence of a crime, no way to even prove carol was dead. Jim wallace was a detective who finally hit on an idea. To use a tool that didnt even exist when carol lubahn fought her husband on a march night in 1981. Coming up a dramatic turn in the case and fresh heartbreak for carols family another nightmare on top of the first nightmare. When dateline continues. Whether its a year old or a few years old, we want to buy your car. So go to carvana and enter your license plate, answer a few questions, and our technowizardry calculates your cars value and gives you a real offer in seconds. When youre ready, well come to you, pay you on the spot, and pick up your car. Thats it. So ditch the old way of selling your car, and say hello to the new way at carvana. Wouldnt iprotected if there was a place that kept you. Playful covered fueled. And safe . Well, there is, and always has been. Walgreens. Everyones place, for healthy and safe. Protect your pet with the 1 name in flea and tick protection. Frontline plus. Trusted by vets for nearly 20 years. I felt gross. It was kind of a shock after i started cosentyx. Four years clear. Real people with psoriasis look and feel better with cosentyx. Dont use if youre allergic to cosentyx. Before starting, get checked for tuberculosis. An increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur. Tell your doctor about an infection or symptoms, if your inflammatory bowel disease symptoms develop or worsen, or if youve had a vaccine or plan to. Serious allergic reactions may occur. Learn more at cosentyx. Com. Hello. Im dara brown. Two hurricanes forecasted to hit the gulf coast backtoback by early next week. Forecasters say tropical storms laura and marco could partially overlap. A Louisiana State Police Bureau of investigation opened a probe into the Fatal Police Shooting of a 31yearold black man. Officers claim they attempted to deploy tasers on him who they say was armed with a knife before shooting him multiple times. Now back to dateline. Welcome back to dateline. Im craig melvin. Detectives believed mike lubahn was on the verge of confessing to the murder of his wife carol, but then he refused to talk, and the investigation hit a wall. Without a body, how could they prove there was a murder at all . The answer would sent the investigators into an unexpected direction. Could Facebook Help them find out what really happened to carol . Here again is Keith Morrison with secrets in the mist. Deputy d. A. John lewin and the Cold Case Team believed mike lubahn killed his wife carol back in 1981, but they had one big problem. They couldnt prove carol was dead. The biggest assumption is going to be how do you know she wasnt across the country or changed her identity . Kind of an important question with no answer. And then in january 2011, jim wallace got the flu. Lucky break no, really. And i was lying in bed, and my wife came in. Unfortunately when you work these cases, all you talk about about we are a dedicated Cold Case Team. You talk about the case youre working on. Im sure she was tired of hearing about it. She said, why dont you establish a facebook account for carol. I thought, that could accomplish a great deal. Of course, back in 1981 when carol disappeared, facebook creator Mark Zuckerberg wasnt even born yet. But 30 years later, detective wallace knew social media and its potential to connect to millions around the globe instantly. It could determine once and for all, he thought, whether carol was alive or dead. Because all of us know from using facebook that its, number one, a kind of a place where we say here i am. Its also a place you can find people. Surely if carol was alive, someone on facebook or twitter would know something. Of course, wallace also knew carol would look vastly different 30 years after her disappearance, so he found an age progression artist to create an image of what she might look like today, and then he placed that photo and others like it on facebook and other sites. It turned out it was a great point of contact for me to contact 350 friends and family of carol. And right away, we said, has anybody seen carol . We discovered immediately that nobody had seen carol since the night she disappeared. And if carol merely googled her own name, shed find herself at wallaces website, caroljeannemeyerlubahn. Com. But that never happened, which meant something significant, said the detective. Shes not looking for herself. Shes dead. Or a farmers wife in uruguay who doesnt go on the computer much . Maybe. Lots of people are not on facebook. Right dont check or google things it doesnt mean that she is dead for sure. Absolutely. It just means you have a fair totally circumstantial case. No body, unclear motive, sympathetic defendant. But the prosecutor decided to roll the dice. 30 years after carol lubahn vanished from her familys life. Mike was arrested for carols murder. When you went to the family and said were going to charge him, what was their reaction . Mixed at best. Mixed . Thats a mild word. How about upset, horrified, mystified . In fact, most of carols family members believed the idea that mike could have murdered carol was ludicrous. Well, he was a member of our family, you know. And nobody wanted to see him be arrested or him be the reason or any of that. Its like another nightmare on top of the first nightmare. This was a case where i think the family would have been more than happy to believe that carol is still out there somewhere, shes not dead, and their beloved soninlaw is not a killer. But of all mike seniors family members, perhaps no one was as torn as his namesake firstborn son, mike junior who loved his father unreservedly, followed him into the family painting business, worked side by side with him for decades, and who had confessed to detectives that like his aunt terri, he, too, had doubts about his father. Doubts that had taken root shortly after mike sr. s second wife left him. He talked about my stepmother constantly for years. Was nonstop. And why was that so significant to you . Because he never talked about my mother. At all . Never. But mike never confronted his father. I just knew in the back of my mind that this could be a possibility, and i really honestly at that time, i never wanted my father to go to jail. I just wanted to know. It was so important to me the truth behind that evening. To get the truth and avoid a trial, prosecutor john lewin was willing to make a deal. We had offered him voluntary manslaughter if he gave us carols body. And he turned you down flat . He did, repeatedly. Mike pleaded not guilty. The case was going to trial. And if members of carols own family didnt believe mike did it, what would a jury think . Coming up the accused on the stand. Isnt it true, mr. Lubahn, that carol lived her last breath in that bathtub when you murdered her . When dateline continues. 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Now during the chevy open road sales event, get up to 15 of msrp cash back on select 2020 models. Thats over fiftyseven hundred dollars cash back on this equinox. Its time to find new roads, again. It was september 11th of all days, september 11th, 2012, 31 years, five months, 12 days after the last known sighting of carol lubahn. An inauspicious day to begin the prosecution of a popular man . Could be. But deputy d. A. John lewin went ahead anyway. What im going to be able to prove beyond a reasonable doubt, ladies and gentlemen, is that despite the fact that mike lubahn is a decent man, he murdered his wife. Of course, lewin knew that to prove a murder had occurred, he had to show the victim was, in fact, no longer alive. For that he turned to detective wallace who explained to the jury the facebook and social Media Presence he created for carol had turned up a whole lot of nothing. Have you been contacted by anybody, either by phone, email, in writing, who says, you know what, ive seen carol lubahn after the day she disappeared . No. Though as lewin and the team also let the jury hear, family members like carols sister gail believed what mike told them, that carol had run off. Has it been hard for you to accept the possibility that she may be dead . Well, yes. Is it made even more difficult by the fact that you cared deeply for the defendant . Yes. And younger sister terri, even though she had suspected mike for years do you still think of mike lubahn sr. As a part of your family . Yes. But most anguished of all mike and carols son mike junior. Is there anything about the way that you remember your mom that would make you think or made you feel that she would leave you and never come back and never say goodbye . No. He loved his dad, but also secretly doubted him, something hed never revealed until now. I was sweating so profusely during that whole trial. He never knew i had these feelings. So on the stand publicly, i had to basically say, yeah, im thinking maybe theres some weird things about your story. And it was the first time that my father really would have known i felt that way. So i was really, really stressed out about that. How hard is it for you to be here today . Very. Do you want to believe that your dad is responsible for your mothers disappearance . Do i want to believe it . Yes. No. Lets assume that your dad, in fact, did kill your mom. Would you want to see him punished for it . No, not particularly. Prosecutor lewin knew the ambivalence of the family members did not help his case, but in the end, my job isnt to make sure that the family members get what they want. My job is to make sure that, you know, carols killer is held responsible. But was mike a killer . His attorney, kevin donahue. I think the police are just wrong. No forensics, no witnesses, not even a body. The defense might have stopped right there. Instead, they decided to gamble. Mike was a nice guy. The jury should see that. Do you solemnly state that the details if the details had been a little different each time he was asked to tell the story, here was his chance to straighten it out for the jury. How odd then that mike under oath now amended his story just a little again, like when he added the detail that carol was in the bathtub when she said something mean to him. She said, you make my skin crawl. Also slightly different, the way he discovered she was gone. I opened the front door and went out, and the garage door was open, and the car was gone. In earlier versions, didnt mike say he heard the garage door go up, but then saw taillights as carol drove away . Why had his story changed again . Whats the deal with that . Did you hear the garage door . I dont think so. Why do you think that now . What has jogged your memory . Because i think over the years, i thought about this night so many times. And i just you know, id seen that car back out of the driveway many, many times when she was leaving, so i think i thought repeatedly in my mind that thats what i thought. I saw the car. I can see it right now. He never thought for a moment, he said, it would be the last time hed see his wife. I thought maybe she had gone out dancing and stayed the night with a friend. What did happen to her . Mike insisted he simply didnt know. Did you have anything to do with killing her . No. Did you have anything to do with her disappearance . No. Other than i didnt sign the papers and made her upset, but thats it. Successful testimony . Maybe. But now the downside. Hed have to answer questions from john lewin. Do you lie sometimes . No. You never lie. I wouldnt say never. I mean, a white lie, who knows . Well, let me ask. Have you ever lied about something serious that wasnt a white lie in your life . No. In your entire life youve never lied once about anything that wasnt a white lie . Ill just say not that i can remember. In fact, mike had a hard time remembering a lot of things prosecutor lewin asked about. I dont remember. I dont remember going to bed. I dont remember saying that. I dont know. But how on earth, asked lewin, could he not remember the last time he saw his wife . Would you agree that that would be one of the most significant events, details of your entire life . Yes, but i that doesnt mean i had to remember it. Lewin wasnt buying it. Isnt it true, mr. Lubahn, that the last place that carol lived her last breath was taken in that bathtub when you murdered her . No. Why are you looking at the judge . Because im waiting for him to correct you. No. I didnt murder her. Im sorry. In the bathtub . And, mr. Lubahn, if you had murdered her, you would tell us today if i asked. I would have admitted it. You would admit it on the stand today . Yes. Do you think that statements believable . I think so. Im done. Of course, believability was a question for the jury to decide, and decide they did. Though, as youll see, that wasnt the end of the story, not by a mile. Coming up a final push for the truth. Please, for your family, for your kids, tell us what happened. When dateline continues. Protect your pet with the 1 name in flea and tick protection. Frontline plus. Trusted by vets for nearly 20 years. Wouldnship shapeice if there was a place that kept you. Frontline plus. Soothed comfortable restocked. And safe . Well, there is, and always has been. Walgreens. Everyones place, for healthy and safe. I felt gross. People were afraid i was contagious. I was covered from head to toe. I was afraid to show my skin. After i started cosentyx i wasnt covered anymore. Four years clear. Five years now. I just look and feel better. See me. Real people with psoriasis look and feel better with cosentyx. Dont use if youre allergic to cosentyx. Before starting, get checked for tuberculosis. An increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur. Tell your doctor about an infection or symptoms, if your inflammatory bowel disease symptoms develop or worsen, or if youve had a vaccine, or plan to. Serious allergic reactions may occur. Five years is just crazy. See me. Learn more at cosentyx. Com. Reinventing. Its what with comcast business, your Small Business can work faster, with powerful internet from the nations largest gigspeed network. Work safer, with all your connected devices automatically protected by securityedge. And work anywhere, with comcast business at home, our new businessgrade Internet Solution for remote workers. Whatever your business needs, comcast business has the solutions to help you not just bounce back, but bounce forward. Call or go online to find out more. Okay. Lets call the jurors out. There are few things in American Life as dramatic, as weighted with consequence as the moment a jury, verdict in hand, files into a courtroom. Had they been persuaded that mike killed carol or even that she was dead . Mikes family held its breath. So did the prosecutor and the police. You know, you dont know what to expect. And now here was mikes fate. We, the jury, in the aboveentitled action find the defendant Michael Clark lubahn sr. Guilty. Guilty of seconddegree murder. Mike lubahn was going to prison. Ive had cases before where you get done and you walk out of the courtroom and the family throws their arms around you. Theyre just so grateful. Thats not this case. I was just very surprised the jury would convict him on such little evidence, and i dont think any of us are happy to see mike go to jail. And you still believe mike is a nice guy, believable guy . Yes. What gale and the rest of the family wanted most were some answers. Its not so much that i want mike to pay for what he did. I just want to know what happened to my sister. And at the sentencing hearing in december of 2012, mikes own son echoed those sentiments. Guilt or innocence aside, ive never wanted my father to go to prison. Ive only asked if he knows anything, to please let me know. Then mike made a heartbreaking plea. Hes been a good father and a good person. If hes sent to prison today, i want him to know im going to miss our time together. Its going to be hard to see the world change without him. I humbly stand before the court today to request leniency for my father when giving his sentence. Thank you for the opportunity to speak. After that, well, then the strange tale of a much loved killer took a remarkable turn. It happened that very day in court. Im asking right now as we sit here, mr. Lubahns going to have a chance. Please for your family, for your kids, just let it go. Tell us what happened. Could i just have a moment . The judge granted a recess so mike could speak with his attorney privately. Did he actually have something to confess . They returned a few minutes later. And were asking to continue the sentencing. Time to think . The judge pushed back sentencing for a month. My hope was that he would tell us what happened, that he would tell us what he did with carol, and that he would be honest about both. For almost four weeks they waited until january 7th, 2013. All eyes were on mike lubahn as he entered the courtroom and then shifted to one prosecutor lewin who told the court that very morning mike finally revealed to him the secret hed been keeping almost 32 years. He did the talking and mike said not a word. All of the information about them fighting about the selling of the house, he said that was truthful. That occurred. Then carol stormed out, and it might have blown over as arguments do, but she came back 1 30 a. M. And said the one thing that would not blow over, not ever. She told him that she was going to be taking somebody else, another man to her sister terris upcoming wedding. He said he was very upset. She tried to comfort him then, he said. And she was telling him, dont worry, youll find somebody else, et cetera. And that was the last thing carol lubahn ever said. He didnt want to hear it and he said that he pushed her. She fell and hit her head on a heavy end table in the living room. He said she didnt bleed, but he knew instantly that she was dead. Detectives hooked lubahn up to a polygraph machine. After the polygraph, the test was done, he confronted her and says, you didnt pass. Now the defendant changes his story and says, okay, i punched her in the head and i punched her hard, but he said only one time. Then he told what he did with carols body. After he killed her, he put her in the garage behind some carpet. He took her car the next morning to the red onion parking lot, dumped it there. At some point she was placed in the trunk of mr. Lubahns vehicle. Then he said he took her to the ocean, put her on a raft, paddled out to sea and dropped her down, a cinderblock tied to her body. It was a shock, of course, a big shock. For so long the family or most of it believed mike. And now in this very public way, they finally knew that carol was dead, and he, their sweet mike, killed her, but the whole truth . Was it actually out there somewhere . And so on that cold and foggy january day, mike surrounded by a retinue of cops and lawyers floated out into the mist to find carol, find whatever was left. If they find the cinderblock in the ocean, that will give me half of the closure i need. She didnt get it because after the boat ride, mike admitted his ocean tale was one more lie. And perhaps it was finally for the sake of his son, the son who never abandoned him, that he finally led investigators to the place he said mikes mother had actually been all these many years. Police searched the area, but once again were unable to locate carols remains and give the family what they hoped for most, the chance to say goodbye. I dont know why getting her back is the ultimate bookend for me. I want to know that shes, you know, properly buried or cremated or whatever we would choose do with her. Why is that so important . I think it just is the ultimate answer. This is it. Theres no more wondering. No, not about that. But his father in prison 15 to life . When we last spoke to mike, it was clear he had a good deal of wondering left to do about that man and what he took away. Do you still love him . Yeah, i do. I mean i always will. Ive just got to figure out how im going to process these facts i know. I dont know yet. I kind of thought a perfect punishment for my father, i was going to ask him to write one sentence to me about my mother every week while hes in prison so he has to think about her and i can remember her again. Thats all for this edition of dateline. Im craig melvin. Thank you for watching. First up on msnbc, storm stories. Two potential hurricanes on the path for nearly the same location in the southeast United States detailing the potential nightmare scenario next. Another bombshell from the president s niece. She releases secret recordings of the president s sister making sweeping and critical remarks about donald trump. Well tell you what she said. And a closer look at 9 polls. E