Indepth interviews with leading newsmakers, plus discussions with Americas preeminent political minds. Indepth interviews with leading newsmakers, plus discussions with Americas preeminent political minds. Indepth interviews with leading newsmakers, plus discussions with Americas preeminent political minds. Havent read the Washington Post story, part of that is that donald trump has become enamored of the new Talking Point from his tv lawyer Rudy Giuliani that collusion is not a crime so they have gone from no collusion, no collusion, no collusion to collusion isnt a crime and give us more about whats reported about his mood and raging. He privately has been raging about whats happening vrnl hes upset about the News Coverage, about why isnt he getting more credit for what he views as the good works hes done and as the post reported on friday on the front page, 4,229 lies in the first six month of the this year alone. The reason hes not getting the favorable News Coverage is because the press spends an inordinate amount of time reporting what he says and at the same time Fact Checking what he says. Let me read from the story. This is the Washington Post. Trump has confided to friends and advisers he is worried the Mueller Probe could destroy the lives of what he calls innocent and decent people, namely donald trump jr. Under scrutiny by mueller for his role organizing a june 2016 meeting at 20trump Tower with russians promising dirt on Hillary Clinton. The president does not believe his son purposefully broke the law but is fearful nonetheless that trump jr. May have wandered into legal jeopardy. Let me bring in joyce vance and a about that in just a moment. Donald trump is now saying whereas his previous denials said this was from the New York Times a year ago he told according to the New York Times trump said we primarily discussed a program about the adoption of russian children that was active and popular with American Families years ago and was since ended by the russian government but it was not campaign and theres no followup. That was trump jr. In a statement dictated in part written by his father on air
would have taken such a meeting. He said the New York TimesStatement Wasnt Given to a Court Meaning there was no legal obligation to be truth informal that statement. However, this morning he still is contradicting that statement. Is that a legal problem for donald trump or donald trump. As is often the case during this administration, i find myself studying a tweet by the president like its a religious text and as i read this taex i can see it capable of more than one interpret decontamination because trump said this was a meeting to get information on an opponent and i do not know about it but when was that lack of knowledge . In fact, the interpretation that is most favorable and im thinking like a Defense Attorney here, the one most favorable to donald trump would be if he
didnt know about it until yesterday. If thats the case that means he authorized or approved of statements that were false which means that somebody either duped him or maybe he did know. So this tweet is very problematic because it contradicts whats been said before but depending on the timeline interpretation, and its vague as to when he did not know about it, it could be either a worse problem or a super worse problem. Let me put this up for our audience again and again. We dont normally read his tweets any more on this show because it isnt that edifying for the audience to do so but in this case this is a significant statement so im going to read it. This is what donald trump was up tweeting this morning. From vacation. Fake news reporting a complete fabrication we dont need to read that part. Im concerned about the meeting my wonderful son donald had in trump tower. This was meeting to get
information on an opponent, totally legal and it went nowhere. I do not know about it. Let me bring in david jolly, former republican congressman from florida because what donald trump seems to be doing now is adopting the Communications Strategy of his Television LawyerRudy Giuliani because the line from republicans is that collusion is not a crime. So hes gone from no collusion to collusion is not a crime. I wonder how what we call the committee to defend the president reacts to a shift in the president s explanation to i did it but it Isnt Criminal to the meeting was about getting dirt on Hillary Clinton. Sure, its the final chapter in the gaslighting of the trump base and the Republican Party. You will see no reaction from the Republican Party in this case. Joy, look at what happened from the historical and political perspective. The president of the United States says my son met in my building with russian agents who wanted to influence the
election. That is a declarative by the president this morning. Legally whether or not there was collusion or not if you take a less conservative view, we see a president continuing to become mare careless in his defense and what begins to come on the table is questions of Public Corruption and Honest Services. There may be as joyce said a contributi contribution, an inlegal contribution and the final thing i would say, you read a statement, a tweet from the president suggesting the president is concerned about good people getting hurt, that is the last chapter in a criminal conviction, when they ask for empathy, that these are good people who didnt know they were doing wrong. I want to play for the audience jay sekulow, whos another one of Donald Trumps attorney, a tv attorney on abcs this is week with george stephanopoulos. Hes asked why the explanations for this Trump Tower Meeting keep changing and heres what
it was a meeting about gathering dirt, what would be the crime theoretically. This is one of the easiest crimes in this entire range of electionrelated crimes to prove, its the crime of a u. S. Person soliciting or accepting sis answer t assistance from a Foreign National and we have Foreign Nationals connected to the russian government, although the law doesnt make that distinction, its still a more compelling case so trump has cast himself in the role of a witness against his son, his soninlaw and former Campaign Manager who he is saying went into a meeting where their goal was to solicit something of value from russians that they could use to assist them in the electi election. There might be other crimes, weve had the suggestion of bribery or Honest Services fraud. Those crimes could only have
taken place after trump was in office so not as early as the Trump Tower Meeting but there is a full range of what ill characterize as Public Corruption type claims that we could be looking at as a result of this series of actions. Danny, as a Defense Attorney, how much of a mess is donald trump creating for his legal team this morning . Building on what joyce said, of those elements, the violation of the federal election law, perhaps the only one that is arguably hazy would be anything of value. People think of assistance as a bag of cash or something tangible but its clear under the law that and this has come up in the past, canada wanted to donate pamphlets to aid in an election, that violates the law so its not a stretch to say data or information or emails would be considered anything valuable. It doesnt have to be a big of
illgotten cash. And Something Like this, dirt on an opponent would probably fit to some it would absolutely fit the definition of anything of value so with this admission, assuming that information on an opponent equals anything of value satisfying the criminal statute then you could make an argument with just a few sentences donald trump admitted either to a crime by his himself or at minimum by those around him arguably. And david jolly, im old enough to remember when republicans used to fulminate about president clinton, Vice President al gore, when they talked about chinese donors, renting out the Lincoln Bedroom when they had a sense it was corrupt to deal with a Foreign Government or entity when it came to elections. What happened to the Republican Party . Its hypocrisy of historical proportion. We have corruption in plain sight. Whether it crosses the line of criminal culpability we will find out but this is a president who still has not released his tax returns. We assume there is exposure to people who could have leverage over him and he could settle that question today but refuses to do so. I think one of the things were seeing in the escalation of the president s rhetoric is we are entering a window where hes under serious consideration as to whether or not have rosenstein dismissed and mueller dismissed. Congress is out for two months, now is the time the president might move. This is a big development. Jonathan, david, and danny will join us later in the show. Joyce vance, thank you for your time. Appreciate you calling in. Up next, donald trump Goes To Lebrons Home State but he doesnt even mention his krit schi criticism of the king. Details coming up. Including nasal congestion, which most pills dont. And all from a gentle mist you can barely feel. Flonase sensimist. Well, esurance makes it simple and affordable. In fact, drivers who switched from geico to esurance saved an average of 412. Thats auto and Home Insurance for the modern world. Esurance. An allstate company. Click or call. Paying too much for insurance that isnt the right fit . Well, esurance makes finding the right coverage easy. In fact, drivers who switched from geico to esurance saved an average of 412. Thats auto and Home Insurance for the modern world. Esurance. An allstate company. Click or call. Your hair is so soft e company. Did you use head and shoulders two in one . I did mom. Wanna try it . Yes. It intensely moisturizes your hair and scalp and keeps you flake free. Manolo . Look at my soft hair. I should be in the shot now too. Try head and shoulders two in one. Anchor don lemon. Instead, he trotted out the same old Campaign Hits attacking Congresswoman Mackshi congresswoman Maxine Waters and the news media. Why didnt he go after james . Perhaps because of the backlash. Nba legend bill russell, current nba stars like steph curry, carl Anthony Towns and bradley beal all voiced their support of james. Nba Hall Of Famer and Charlotte Hornets owner Michael Jordan who was mentioned in trumps tweet also offered his support. Even First Lady Melania Trump issued a tacit rebuck to her husband. Her spoke woman saying in part, it looks like lebron james is working to do good things on behalf of our next generation and just as she always has, the first lady encourages everyone to have an open dialogue about issues facing children today. Even if he didnt dare repeat in the front of his rally fans, trumps attack on lebron james and other prominent africanamericans is another sign he plans to use his familiar slate of dog whistles to try to keep republicans in
power. They talk about the elite. The elite. Do you ever see the elite . Theyre not elite. Youre the elite. You are the elite. [ cheers and applause ] youre smarter than they are. You make bigger incomes, youve got everything going. Back with me, david jolly, joining now Politics Editor for theroot. Com Jason Johnson and nationally syndicated columnist connie schultz. Donald trump went to ohio because the Republican Party is worried. Theres a race there with a republican who should be well ahead in ohios 12th congressal district. Theres a guy named Troy Balderson running in that district against a democrat named Danny Oconnor and if you look at the poll, its neck in neck except it should be like seven points for the republican. Whats going on in ohio 12 . It looks like Danny Oconnor could win this but its already a loss for the republicans in that way and they know it. They think theyll make a big statement about this if he preveals, the republican candidate, but theyve lost the argument. Which is why hes there. It was interesting that they moved the venue, you know, to a gymnasium which was smaller according to the reports i saw this morning than the original place. They wanted to make sure there were no empty seats because donald trump hates that and im glad you quickly acknowledged Whats Going On with the attacks on lebron james because its racist. He went after a black athlete, again, he went after a black newsman and then he went after Maxine Waters again and in each case he refers to their intelligence and calls them in different ways calls them stupid and its important that we acknowledge that, at this point, that that is what the president
is doing. What is he saying about his own voters if he thinks its a tactic that will get his base out . He is appealing to a certain percentage of his base. But ive decided im not going to mock Trump Supporters because this responsibility lays with the president and he is working them up, mobbing them up, he wants them to attack journalists, its only a matter of time. We saw from the tweet this morning, he wants to endanger the lives of journalists and i hear the criticism from some, now you care, journalists, because youre the target of population and thats a fair critici criticism but when the president is going after journalists hes going after america because specials should be able to count on journalists to hold the president accountable. Hes making this so personal and is not listening to his critics
in the white house who are telling them you must stop calling journalist the inenemy the people. Donald trump tweets a good game but when it comes to who hes willing to vocally attack, he will go after women, hes gone after Maxine Waters over and over and over again at these rallies, he didnt, actually, though mention lebron james at that rally. Let me play a clip in which he went after republicans of a certain kind. Listen. How do you get 100 of anything . I you always have somebody, i dont like trump, i dont like our president. He destroyed my career. I only destroyed their career because they said bad things about me and you fight back and they go down the tubes and thats okay. Sorry, i wanted to also play donald trump going after congresswoman Maxine Waters at the same rally. Take a listen. Okay, never mind. Jason, what he didnt do is go
after king james in his home state, right because the president s is a coward. He attacks people he thinks he can get away with only in siafe environments. At net roots there are shirts people are staying that is dont test the waters. He would never say this to Maxine Waters in person. Im the last person to say there arent some racist white people who hate lebron james. But at the end of the day the president seldom has the strong go after individuals who can fight back where there may be boos in the crowd so hell go after lebron james through twitter but he wont run the risk in a crowd because there may be people who boo or people in lebron james jerseys. Thats how this president operates, hes a coward and a punk and he doesnt know how to truly confront people. Also, hell go after lebron but not gregg popovich. Hell go after Mackshine Waxinet not steve kerr. He wont go after eminem. Hes afraid of going after white people because that will expose how racist his attacks on black people are. We have that attack of donald trump on Maxine Waters. Lets play that really quick. Theyre talking about this blue wave. I dont think so. I dont think. So mackshine waxine waters is l. Maxine, shes a real beauty. Maxi maxine. A seriously low iq person. Seriousl seriously. Same question, david jolly. Donald trump feels quite flee to go after a black woman, esteemed congresswoman by california by name at his rallies and cause his audience to taunt her but he did not have the dourj renew his
attacks on lebron james. What do you make about that . Donald trumps a weak man with no courage so he would not attack lems in front of a you in ohio but on the issue of race and Donald Trumps view of race and his manipulation of the social construct, you can draw a direct thread from his comments about the central park five to his comments about Maxine Waters and it whats disheartening is that todays Republican Party cheers that on. One of the things weve learned from donald trump is in politics today, many leaders follow policies. Many republicans have been happy to abandon the policies they believed in the past ten years to follow a leader like donald trump. Theres no greater contrast to what donald trump had to say last night than to Barack Obamas 2004 speech where he talked about being one america. Not a black or white america, conservative, progressive, but one america. We have gotten so far away from that and as democrats continue to have a family conversation about their message in november in 2020, yes policies are important but bring us somebody that can unite the country and those medium information voters, those independent voters who are suffering from anxiety that is donald trump, they will move to the blue column and we will see that blue wave. And he also attacks women, whether its Maxine Waters or other women in politics, at some point does that erode his white female base. I think whats eroding his female white base is the family separation separations. Im seeing in the my reader mail that it was the last straw for a lot of women because it involved children. It was interesting the first lady made clear she would like visit lebrons school. Nobody knows a marriage like
that two people in it but im glad im not in it. We have to pay close attention to language coming out of this white house. Hes always hated women. There will always be men who hate women, weve known that. Ive been a columnist since 2002, ive always gotten a certain percentage of mail from angry white men. My husband jokes its my gift, i draw it out but there isnt a single woman in n ameriamerica writes her opinion and gets that hate mail regardless of her party affiliation. Some men cant believe we get that real estate. Amane. Coming up, the political battle over the south is about to get real. Oh ozempic® vo people with Type 2 Diabetes are excited about the potential of onceweekly ozempic®. In a study with ozempic®, a majority of adults lowered their blood sugar and reached an a1c of less than seven and maintained it. Oh under seven . vo and you may lose weight. In the same oneyear study, adults lost on average up to 12 pounds. Oh up to 12 pounds . vo a twoyear study showed that ozempic® does not increase the risk of major cardiovascular events like heart attack, stroke, or death. Oh no increased risk . Ozempic® ozempic® should not be the first medicine for treating diabetes, or for people with Type 1 Diabetes or diabetic ketoacidosis. Do not share needles or pens. Dont reuse needles. Do not take ozempic® if you have a personal or Family History of medullary thyroid cancer, multiple Endocrine Neoplasia Syndrome type 2, or if you are allergic to ozempic®. Stop taking ozempic® and get medical help right away if you get a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, itching, rash, or trouble breathing. Serious side effects may happen, including pancreatitis. Tell your doctor if you have Diabetic Retinopathy or vision changes. Taking ozempic® with a sulfonylurea or insulin may increase the risk for low blood sugar. Common side effects are nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, stomach pain, and constipation. Some side effects can lead to dehydration, which may worsen kidney problems. I discovered the potential with ozempic®. Oh oh oh ozempic® vo ask your Healthcare Provider if ozempic® is right for you. Beto orourke is making ted cruz squirm. Back with me is mayor tomlinson and kaitlin thompson. Stacy abrams, incredibly enough, polling within the margin of error but two points ahead of brian kemp. Thats a gravis poll. Does Sta Say Thtacey Abrams Hav realistic shot of winning the race . Absolutely. All of the democrats are polling ahead of their republican opponents and we have a strong candidate for Attorney General in charlie bailey. We have cracked the code on how to win back the south. Were no kansas or oklahoma, we have not been that red for that long, by the way, we just lost the Governors Mansion in 2002. Thereafter it took a couple years for the senate and house to switch over to republican control so people are out there that remember voting for democrats and remember when democrats were in control of both houses and the Governors Mansion but what weve learned is that democrats can turn out those voters in urban areas, atlanta, columbus. We know how to do that but weve ignored democrats in South Georgia and South Georgia is a democratic area. We know from Polling Dozens and dozens of counties in our black belt that refers to the agrarian area of rich soil, not to color of anyones skin but dozen and dozens of those counties are democratic counties. Weve given them no love for many, many years, stacy abrams is humping it through those
area weve lost ten hospitals under republican control and so these are folks that understand that government is a partner in their prosperity. Staying with you. It is health care helping Democratic Candidates come back in georgia . Expanding medicare has a 73 Approval Rating in georgia. That holds solid for this area in South Georgia that many analysts write off as being the rural red. That suspect true. They want expansion of medicare. Also trumps socalled Tax Cut Plan Obstruction Of Justice has a 39 Approval Rating in georgia and trump himself is floating if
you average the polls 40 Approval Rating in georgia so i think people are painting with too broad a red brush when they try to make georgia sound like a deep red state, it isnt. But people in these areas are looking for prosperity and the opportunity for Economic Development which you cannot have if you dont have basic financial infrastructure, infrastructure like hospitals, access to health care. And democrats are speaking directly to those issues. Republicans, on the other hand, and we have drawn, fortunately, for democrats, a pretty weak slate of republican candidates. Kemp has spent millions of dollars and months telling us He Doesnt Like Brown people. Well 46 of the active registered voters in georgia are nonwhit nonwhite. Lets go to his ads. The scuttlebutt was that the Republican Party writ large
would have preferred to have the other guy but donald trump preferred kemp, kemp won. Heres one of his ads about immigration. Im brian kemp. Im so conservative i blow up government spending. I own guns that no one is taking away. My chain saw is ready to rip up some regulations. I got a big truck just in case i need to round up criminal illegals and take them home myself. Yup. I just said that. Im brian kemp. If you want a politically incorrect conservative, thats me. Kate, is that going to work in a state like georgia that seems to be getting more purple . It works in the primary as you see from the numbers and georgia, President Trump only won georgia by 5 so mgeorgia i new to the Republican Party as far as the changeover from democratic to republican rule
but i would caution you that nathan deal is a popular governor and a lot of these southern states, weve got Governors Races so republicans Wont Lay Down and let them roll all over them. Florida is the most fertile ground. Well see. We have to distance ourselves from these primaries. Everybody knows your base helps you get to the party but the people who didnt vote in either primary matter and how the parties will be defined closer to november. Republicans have a high hill to climb right now. Just history tells you that we have trouble coming in november. Jason johnson, you have been a Georgia Skeptic as far as the Democratic Party but which state seems to be the most fertile ground. Tennessee, the democrat is ahead of marsha black bern. Bred bredesen is going to beat blackburn and bob corker is saying out saying i cant run against this guy, hes too good. Second im moving less out of my cynicism column. I have to mention georgia. Look, the Republican Governors Association just dumped 700,000 into this race. You dont do that if you think you have this locked up. You have brian kemp, i was talking to representatives here this weekend. Brian kemp is not popular with a lot of suburban voters. Theres a Conflict Of Interest with brian kemp being the republican gubernatorial nominee and also secretary of state. He shut down the online Voter Registration for georgia for 30
hours for maintenance this weekend, a week end where people are going out to register people to vote. You dont do that unless youre a Vote Suppressor or youre nervous. I think tennessee and georgia are the places we may see a huge flip. David jolly, youre a former Florida Republican congressman. We are looking at the spectacle where democrats could win the senate race and lose in florida because the incumbent, bill nelson, is behind. That could be the anomaly in a blue wave. Rick scott is an incredibly disciplined campaigner, stays away from the media, spends his own money. Bill nelson has not had a tough race in 18 years, probably, but reports are hes about to spend and spend big. He knows this is going to be a big race one interesting thing to come out of florida politics. Glen graham is disciplined on the message of ending 20 years of one party control. Shes seeing something in the numbers. You have the progressive in Andrew Gillam saying im the
only nonmillionaire in the race. Then you have the Billionaire Class coming in, jeff green spending 40 million in two months to try to win this. Lightning round, one word answer, the state that will be the most surprising on election night. David . I hope texas, beto. Not going to be any surprises. The republicans will do pretty well. Thats a multiple word answer. Jason johnson, state that will be most surprising . Nobody likes ted cruz. I think beto orourke pulls it off. Mayor thompson . Most surprising state . It will be georgia it wont surprise me but it will surprise katon. A little shade in the panel. Thank you guys have been much. In our next hour, trump is calling the press the enemy of the people this morning and
contradicting his earlier explanation of the Trump Tower Meeting his son had with the russian lawyer. More news coming up. The list goes on. How about a discount for long lists . Gold. Mara, you save our customers hundreds for switching almost effortlessly. Its a gift. And jamie. Present. Together we are unstoppable. So, what are we gonna do . Insurance. Thats kind of what we do here. Aggression, hostility, agitation, depressed mood, or suicidal thoughts or actions with chantix. Serious side effects may include seizures, new or worse heart or blood vessel problems, sleepwalking or allergic and skin reactions which can be lifethreatening. Stop chantix and get help right away if you have any of these. Tell your Healthcare Provider if youve had depression or other Mental Health problems. Decrease alcohol use while taking chantix. Use caution when driving or operating machinery. The most common side effect is nausea. I cant tell you how good it feels to have smoking behind me. Talk to your doctor about chantix. This is probably the most
proactive administration regarding Urban America and Faithbased Community and ill be 60 years old in december. To be honest, im going to say this at the table. This is the most pro Black President weve had in our lifetime. Well, that sentiment expressed by cleveland Sterile Scott during a meeting between President Trump and several black pastors seems especially off key after President Trumps attacks on lebron james. Now dozens of high profile black pastors have written a scathing open letter to their trump loving colleagues calling them cheerleaders with a collar. They write in part, it was unsettling and upsetting to witness the meeting with you, our moral leaders, and one of the most amoral persons ever to occupy the white house. Reverend Tracy Blackman is an executive minister. Its always great to see you. And this letter which was delivered to my former outlet, the grio, is pretty scathing. You and your colleagues write, it was errantly exclaimed that this is probably going to be the most pro Black President weve had. Was he being pro black while building his political platform which was fueled by racism . Was he being pro black when he equivocated In Charlottesville that left one person dead and Dozens Injured declaring there was violence on both sides. You were grabbed off the air suddenly as you witnessed that violence firsthand. Why in your view did those pastors go to the white house and sing the praises of a president who praised the people who did that as very fine people . Good morning, joy. Thank you for having me on and i am interested in answering that
question. I do want to say that i signed that letter as a pastor and as an independent person, not speaking on behalf of the denomination but speaking from my spirit and my soul. Dr. Maya ang lelo reminds us wh people show you who they are you should believe them the first time. Our current president has showed us who he is in terms of people of color long before he entered the oval office. In 1973 at the age of 26 when mr. Trump was then president of the Trump Organization he defended the racially discriminatory Housing Practices of his father that were designed to keep black tenants from Renting Apartments on trump properties. In 1989 after five black and latino teenagers from harlem were arrested and accused of assaulting a white woman in central park, mr. Trump used
85,000 of his own money to launch an attack against those boys who were ultimately found innocent with dna and to this day he has never apologized or rescinded his remarks about those young men. For five years the man who became the 45th president of the United States used his Fame And Fortune to launch a vicious attempt to undermine the legitimacy of the nations first Black President , president barack obama by willfully and knowingly promulgating a lie about his citizenship. He was forced during his campaign to finally admit that he knew all along that Barack Hussein obama was a citizen and there was no issue with his Birth Certificate but hes yet to apologize. Mr. Trumps choice for Attorney General for the United States is
a man who opposed the Voting Rights act and who denied a federal judgeship because of his racism. Mr. Trump is a man who refers to mexicans as rapists, enforced targeted bans on muslims in this country, continues to call for the building of a wall only on the southern border of the United States and has referred to entire african countries in Profane Language that i wont even repeat here. This president has completely denounced the race has refused to denounce the racist antiamerican actions of the recent resurgence of white nationalists. You saw that In Charlottesville, you covered that, joy. Yeah. And he claimed there were good people on both sides. Right. I have to ask you though, pastor, i want to play for you another signator from the reverend in baltimore and ask if you agree with the sentiments about not just donald trump but
the pastors in that room. This is a stain on the body of christ. I need to know how yall are smiling at that tape while the whole world frowns at what this represent and what it looks like. The blood is dripping off your hands. What would you say to the pastors who were in that room if you could talk to them right now . What i would say is i respect the right of every pastor to speak his or her own mind on situations. What i resent is the implication that those pastors speak for the black church. The black community is not monolithic. The black church when we use that phrase, were not simply talking about black ministers who preach or even black members who gather, were talking about the church that was hewn out of resistance to white supremacy,
were talking about the church that formed in spite of a religion that was given to us for subjugation and that we turned into a faith of liberation. Yeah. The assault that these ministers promoted by going to that table and sitting down for a discussion without any kind of plan is that they attacked and they put in a negative light the black church and they dont have the right to do that. Reverend traci blackmon, appreciate you being here and appreciate your insights. Thank you so much. Thank you. And more am joy is coming up. vo love is knowing. It was meant to be. And love always keeps you safe. vo love is why we built a car you can trust for a long time. The allnew Subaru Impreza sedan and fivedoor. A car you can love No Matter What road youre on. The Subaru Impreza. More than a car, its a subaru. Right now, get 0 apr financing
on the 2018 Subaru Impreza. You wouldnt accept an incomplete job from any one else. Why accept it from your Allergy Pills . Flonase sensimist relieves your worst symptoms, including nasal congestion, which most pills dont. It helps block six key inflammatory substances. Most pills block one. Flonase sensimist. I couldnt catch my breath. It was the last song of the night. It felt like my heart was skipping beats. They said i had afib. Whats afib . I knew that meant i was at a greater risk of stroke. I needed answers. My doctor and i chose xarelto® to help keep me protected from a stroke. Oncedaily xarelto®, a latestgeneration Blood Thinner significantly lowers the risk of stroke in people with afib not caused by a heart valve problem. Warfarin interferes with at least 6 of your bodys natural bloodclotting factors. Xarelto® is selective, targeting just one critical factor. For afib patients well managed on warfarin, there is limited information on how xarelto® compares in reducing the risk of stroke. Dont stop taking xarelto® without talking to your doctor, as this may increase your risk of stroke. While taking, you may bruise more easily, or take longer for bleeding to stop. Xarelto® can cause serious, and in rare cases, fatal bleeding. It may increase your risk of bleeding if you take certain medicines. Get help right away for unexpected bleeding or unusual bruising. Do not take xarelto® if you have an Artificial Heart Valve or abnormal bleeding. Before starting, tell your doctor about all planned medical or dental procedures and any kidney or liver problems. Learn all you can to help protect yourself from a stroke. Talk to your doctor about xarelto®. I think one of the things that weve learned here, george, after what now over a year of this investigation is that there has been no evidence put forward by anyone at this point that weve seen, and weve seen 1. 4 million documents, weve prov e provided 32 witness interviews of any type of collusion. What we have seen is one of the most irregular investigations in u. S. History. Welcome back to am joy. Donald trump just put another wrinkle in his defense in russia gate. He took to twitter blasting a story in the Washington Post that hes concerned about the legal jeopardy his son, donald trump jr. May be in over the june 2016 Trump Tower Meeting. Trump contradicted the original explanation suggesting it was about that was suggesting it
was about russian adoptions. Instead this morning he wrote, quote, this was a meeting to get information on an opponent, totally legal, done all the time in politics and it went nowhere. I did not know about it. What does this latest tweet mean for the investigation . Joining me now Jennifer Reuben of the Washington Post, msnbc contributor Jonathan Capeheart and danny savalos, Matthew Miller and Dana Millbank of the Washington Post and joining by phone ellie mistow of above the law. Com. Give us your sense from a legal Point Of View what has donald trump done to his defense or donald trump jr. s potential legal jeopardy . Joy, we are very close to donald trump saying in open court, youre gd right i ordered the code red this is beyond ridiculous. What we have right now is donald trump admitting, admitting for the first time that his son colluded or conspired, which is the legal term, with a foreign
operative to influence an American Election and we have trump admitting now kind of indirectly that he covered it up. So we can talk a lot about whether this proves collusion or conspiracy. What im more focused on is this proves obstruction. You need the underlying crime, the underlying illegality to make an obstruction for justice case and trump just admitted on twitter what the underlying crime was. Its an amazing, hilarious thing. Its actually not the first time he has admitted to something that could be called obstruction of justice. Lets go back to the may 2017 lester holt interview in which donald trump admitted why he fired jim comey. Take a listen. Regardless of recommendation i was going to fire comey knowing there was no good time to do it and, in fact, when i decided to just do it i said to myself, i said, you know, this
russia thing with trump and russia is a madeup story, its an excuse. So, ellie, if donald trump has a history of admitting whatever it is the underlying offense is and kind of skating on it for now, do you think that maybe that experience has taught him that perhaps just admitting it is his best defense . I think the experience has taught him that the Republican Party does not have the will or strength to call him on it, right . We have to remember, impeachment fundamentally is a political crime. At some point, at some point somebody needs to put a microphone in front of paul ryans face and ask him if he is an ally to the American People or if hes an ally to donald trump because increasingly those two things are incompatible. I think trump once again is just banking on the inherent weakness of the Republican Party to actually stop him from doing any of this. Yeah, oh, have i got a panel that would love to weigh in on that. Im going to make them wait one more minute. Im going to danny savalos on
this. It appears that if you combine the current reporting along with what youre seeing donald trump doing, hes following the advice and example of his lawyer, his tv lawyer Rudy Giuliani. Heres a couple of examples of Rudy Giuliani saying on tv what donald trump tweeted this morning. Ive been sitting here looking at the federal code trying to find collusion as a crime. Its not. Collusion is not a crime. I dont even know if thats a crime, colluding about russians. The hacking is the crime. That certainly is the original crime. The president didnt hack. Of course not. He didnt pay them. As you know, it led to the meeting with the russians. If you got the hacked information at cnn would you be in jeopardy of going to jail . Of course not. Danny, as i remind our audience that this man is a former federal prosecutor who just did that act. Anyhow, is this an example of donald trump essentially following the very weird republican advice of counsel . I dont know why we continue
to focus on the word collusion and rudy knows better. This is a prosecutor that was a u. S. Attorney here in the Southern District who absolutely nepapalmed the mob using conspiracy law. He is absolutely familiar with defeating Organized Crime by using conspiracy, acting in concert or accompliced liability. Focusing on collusion doesnt have any legal significance. If he looked in the crimes code he would know that there are plenty of crimes that cover this activity. But playing Defense Attorney for a moment, if donald trump and giuliani are retreating, retreating now into this ever shrinking bubble of liability and saying hey even if there was collusion, its not a crime, it could arguably still be consistent with trumps tweet this morning if hes taking the view that donald trump jr. Always admitted to seeking dirt on Hillary Clinton when he admitted in his email, if its
what you say it is, i love it. Maybe this is well see the trump team say this is consistent with what ive been saying the whole time, even if there was a meeting, it was for zirt and donald trump jr. Admitted it was for dirt its not a crime. I suspect you may see that kind of spin coming out of the trump administration. Were now primed to expect anything. I want to play one more thing and bring in the panel. This is another thing giuliani did. He said, yes, indeed, the meeting was about getting dirt on Hillary Clinton. Giuliani threw another wrinkle by mentioning there was a second meeting. There may have been another meeting. He threw a new name into the mix as well. Take a listen. Lenny davis added there was a meeting two days before the meeting took place with donald jr. , jared, manafort and two others. Gates and one more person. Thats a real meeting . Youre saying thats a real meeting on another provable subject in
which maggie miller, maybe they should get flowers from muellers grand jury. They are tieing in cooperating witness rick gates. Theyre admitting the Trump Tower Meeting was what they thought it was, it wasnt what donald trump dictated. This is a gift to the prosecution. No . It is a novel legal strategy. A novel Public Relations strategy. You often hear lawyers say argue the facts and the facts are on your side if the facts are on your side, argue the law. They tried to argue the facts. They came out and said this wasnt about assistance from the russians. It was about adoption. It turned out they were trying to seek assistance from the russians. Now you see them retreating and the president retreating personally and arguing about the law. Well, we did it but it wasnt illegal. But theres one interesting tell in his tweet this morning. Thats the final statement, but i didnt know about it. Right. Fefgs so convinced that there wasnt anything wrong about this meeting why does he continue to insist he doesnt know about it,
a fact that may fall apart because weve seen Michael Cohen telling reporters that in fact the president did know about it. If he didnt know about it, that says hes shoving don jr. Out in front of him saying, well, he knew about it. That would be the case. I think if you were making a conventional legal argument, but it really feels at this point that weve moved beyond any sort of a legal argument and we are sort of preparing and Inokay Cue Lating for whats coming next. He said, okay, i shot somebody on fifth avenue but i missed so its okay. Well, no, that would be a crime, too. But i think the idea is they keep giving out a little more. A few months from now hes going to say, yes, i had a phone call with Vladimir Putin to throw the election in wisconsin but we didnt talk about pennsylvania. It is incredible but elie made the point that all of this is gearing up towards one outcome. There is a finding you cant prosecute the sitting president f. That finding holds, this is
about impeachment. Even with a blatant admission that, yes, this was about essentially collusion, what is paul ryan what are the republicans planning on doing about it . First, id like to remind mr. Trump that that ruling only says you cant be prosecuted while in office. Correct. So before he goes out the door maybe he wants to resign the presidency and have Vice President pence pardon him because hes going to be prosecuteable as soon as he leaves office. Put a pin in that. Right. Republicans are shameless. They wont do anything. We keep waiting for that moment when they will finally topple over and it never comes. So they will, i think at a point in which the prosecutor dumps this report, theyll say, this is much to do about nothing. This is all political. Hopefully by then though there will be a Different Party in control of the house of representatives, then the democrats are going to have the naughty problem, do we proceed with an impeachment case knowing that its very hard if not
impossible to get a conviction . Are we going to do to him what the republicans did to bill clinton, create an issue that rallies his base . So i think we are headed for that moment, but i would say to mr. Trump and the others, you are not in the clear. You can be prosecuted as soon as you leave office. Yeah. Jonathan, we talked earlier off camera about the fact that donald trump this is all about managing the message to the base, right . Hes talking to 30 of the country convince them No Matter What you hear, dont worry about it. You and i are cool. Right. There are two courts in play right now. The court of law, which weve been talking about and the court of Public Opinion which weve been talking about and the only sphere, the only space where trump seems to operate but also actually has proven acumen, you know, he puts these tweets out there and hes got all of these people who support him No Matter What. This guy doesnt understand nuance. He doesnt know nuance and so he
gets information from his real lawyers, Freaks Them Out you think hes hearing hes in trouble . Oh, yeah. Yeah. This amplifies what Matthew Miller tweeted out. He must know that dorn jr. Is i trouble. Right. He lashes out. He says, i didnt know. Which to your point, of course he knew. To elies point earlier which i want to amplify. In josh greenes book, Devils Bargain early in the book he makes the point that donald trump learned early on that he could say and do the most outrageous things and no one in the Republican Party would hold him accountable. Right. Thats what the Birther Issue was. He kept pushing, pushing, pushing on the sitting president of the United States claiming that he was illegitimately in the office and the Republican Party did nothing when they were given every opportunity to push back on the cancer that was starting to spread in the party, they did nothing. To elies point, to jennifers points, to all of our points, if were expecting the Republican Party, for speaker ryan or Mitch Mcconnell to hold President Trump accountable for this tweet, any tweets to come, for any reports coming from robert mueller, you have another thing coming. Nothing is going to happen. It seems to be working. Muellers credibility is being chipped away, chipped away repeatedly a among the trump base. It is having that effect. This was a week where Paul Manafort started his trial, a completely nonpartisan affair. We see the good work mueller is doing but in a sense hes taking us off of that because were talking about the food fight again. I wonder, matthew, whether or not the name of the Vice President mike pence was brought up whether he can. Hes doing the paul ryan, im not here. Im in the curtains. Dont see me. Pretend you dont see me. Paul manafort is largely responsible for picking mike pence. He was a very integral part of
the campaign. Papadopoulos was interacting. How long does mike pence get to stay in the curtains . Its a great question. Bob muellers been conducting this investigation going around talking to a number of people in the white house. Hes interviewed numbers of people in the white house, interviewed reince priebus, interviewed the former press secretary. If mike pence had any involvement both either on the Campaign Side or obstruction of justice side through the involvement of firing of jim comey or other things he claimed he knew notion about until after the fact, well hear about it. Pence might have been smart enough to recognize early on that this administration was a train wreck and at times he was better off hiding behind the curtains inside and not being involved with the president s reckless illegality. Let me go back to elie. You have Paul Manafort on trial not related to this but potential tax evasion, money laundering, items like that. Hes already in trouble. You have donald trump jr. It does seem his father has shoved him out front. He was the principle person who organized that and you had Jared Kushner in that meeting. In your view how much legal jeopardy are those people in that meeting in starting with the son . Infinite. I dont know what it takes. Im a father. I do not know what it takes to throw your own son under the bus on twitter because youre angry at 9 00 in the morning. I just i cannot conceive of what kind of person does that. He just loradoed his son for what . For what gain . Jared is in a lot of trouble, manafort is in a lot of trouble. Don jr. Is now in a lot of trouble because don jr. Lied in front of congress and his father just admitted it. So bad. Its bad for them. Its bad for all of them. Yeah. You wanted to jump in, matt. I wanted to say one of the
things one of the big open questions for the Mueller Investigation is has he contacted don jr. . Jay sekulow said hes not been contacted. If hes not been contacted its because hes a target. Exactly. One is, yes, you have all of that testimony and theres a reason why the republicans havent let those transcripts out because theyre damning. So to the extent to which he lied and then don jr. Also put his name on a statement that said this was about adoption, hes in trouble. In terms of crime . This is like a video camera of the bank robbery. They have all of the people in the room, they have the email saying, yes, thanks for the information from a russian person that im going to use to help my father you dont have evidence like this in a normal case. Yes. Because no ones this stupid except these people. Well, danny, you have a bank
robbery on tape where donald trump jr. Has essentially thrown the bag of money to donald trump jr. Hes thrown him the bag of money. What defense is left for don jr. Whose statement was dictated, written by his father, turns out to have been completely false, tried to say adoption was the reason for the meeting when everyone knows that means Magnitsky Act which still leads back to russia. What Legal Defense is left for donald trump jr. . Thats right. Theres a Glaring Inconsistency between what donald trump jr. Has said and testified to and to what trump sr. Has just said in this tweet, but just to play again devils advocate, isnt it possible in trumps mind that everything he said today in his tweet is consistent with his view of this meeting, which is that there wasnt anything wrong with this meeting. And in that sense because its long been suspected, just as you said that this meeting was not about adoptions, it was about
getting dirt on Hillary Clinton, if that is the case and weve known that for a while, then in trump sr. s mind hes done nothing but maintain the status quo and concedes that, hey, this may have been a meeting about dirt but meeting about dirt is not a crime. Now it is, turns out, a crime. Thats the problem. Thats the issue. But it is a crime that is not as its a crime that is not commonly charged. Right. And in trumps mind thinking like a trump, if he believes there was nothing wrong with goating dirt from russians or someone from arkansas or someone from anywhere, then this is consistent with how he views this case. Ultimately as no big deal and much ado about nothing. Ive got to throw it to the panel. I dont know how many elections youve covered. Have you ever heard of a campaign, an american president ial campaign fielding dirt from the kremlin and saying thats normal political oppo
research. No, no, no, no, no. Not even one . No. It is a really bad move. What danny was just saying, in trumps mind an illegal act is not illegal in his mind. Yeah. But on paper its illegal. We did have an instance, in the 2000 campaign, the Gore Campaign book no, the bush Campaign Book landed in the gores team office and they looked at that, nope, gave it to the fbi. Thats what moral people do. Thats what people who follow the law do. Thats what patriots do. And understand their defense, their political defense is we went to the russians. Whats wrong with that . Whats wrong with that . So basically the republicans are content to have a foreign power intervene on their behalf. Thats where weve gotten to. Thats where weve gotten to. Youve just had the junior senator from kentucky, land pr l
paul, there is an open affinity to russia acceptable in the Republican Party. The only thing i can think of is they are building a stupidity defense. This is the fifth explanation for this meeting now by my count. Right. And from the very beginning they said a lot of them say privately, we were too inept to collude. Right. That is the one thing that possibly rings true when you see stupid at this. Im going to ask elie . No, ignorance of the law is no defense. No defense they cant be they cant get out of this by saying they were too stupid to do it correctly. Let me ask you one other question, elie, elie and danny. First elie. Is there a way to legally obtain is it lawful in any way to obtain Opposition Research from a Foreign Government to use in an american president ial campaign . Is there any way that that is
legal . I mean, really, what the system wants what the system wants is transparency so whatever youre getting, whatever is helping your campaign, theyre supposed to register as who they are and you are supposed to be able to transparently know who is helping you. A lot of the problem here is the secretiveness of the entire situation. And, danny, to that also point, if theres stolen material the nixon case was about stolen material from the Democratic National committee being used in the president ial campaign. In this case the stolen material was hacked by russians, by a Foreign Government that was connected to the kremlin. Is there any way to legally use that stolen material in an american president ial campaign and not disclose it . No, but not even necessarily because its stolen, more because its anything of value and the statute prohibits
receiving or trying to receive or obtain anything of value from a foreign power. We need not reach whether or not the material was stolen because as long as it is something of value, it doesnt need to be a bag of cash or a bar of gold. Anything of value can be pamphlets, it can be it can be information and in this case if it is information in the form of emails or Something Like that, then its not a hard case to make it it meets the anything of Value Definition in the Statute Irrespective of whether it was stolen, borrowed or on lease. Yeah. The reason we know its something of value is trump called for it to be used. Right. This gave the look of valueness, if you will, during the campaign, during the convention when he goes out and he says, russia, if youre listening yeah. Send the tweets out. Then they subsequently went and started following instructions. Exactly. Its only because this stuff is
in public that we pause. Imagine if quietly he had said tell the russians we want them to release the emails. Yes. There wouldnt be all of this questioning, is it legal, is it illegal . Or imagine if, i dont know, when he met with Vladimir Putin for two hours, doing it again. We dont know what they talked about. Thank you to our guests. Also to our legal eagles. Up next, Donald Trumps latest shot in social media. The fact is, there are over ninetysix hundred roads named park in the u. S. Its americas most popular street name. But Allstate Agents know thats where the similarity stops. If youre on park street in reno, nevada, the high winds of the Washoe Zephyr could damage your siding. And thats very different than living on park ave in sheboygan, wisconsin, where ice dams could cause water damage. But No Matter What park you live on, one
of 10,000 local Allstate Agents knows yours. Now that you know the truth, are you in good hands . And the wolf huffed and puffed. Like you do sometimes, grandpa . Well, when you have copd, it can be hard to breathe. So my doctor said. Symbicort can help you breathe better. Starting within 5 minutes. It doesnt replace a Rescue Inhaler for sudden symptoms. Doctor symbicort helps provide significant improvement of your lung function. Symbicort is for copd, including Chronic Bronchitis and emphysema. It should not be taken more than twice a day. It may increase your risk of lung infections, osteoporosis, and some eye problems. Tell your doctor if you have a Heart Condition or high Blood Pressure before taking it. Grandpa symbicort could mean a day with better breathing. Watch out, piggy giggles get symbicort free at saveonsymbicort. Com. If you cant afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help. If you cant afford your medication, if your adventure. Keeps turning into unexpected bathroom trips. You may have overactive bladder, or oab. Ohhhh. Enough already we need to see a doctor. Ask your doctor about myrbetriq® mirabegron . It treats oab symptoms of urgency, frequency, and leakage. Its the first and only Oab Treatment in its class. Myrbetriq may increase Blood Pressure. Tell your doctor right away if you have trouble emptying your bladder or have a weak urine stream. Myrbetriq may cause serious allergic reactions. Like swelling of the face, lips, throat or tongue, or trouble breathing. If experienced, stop taking and tell your doctor right away. Myrbetriq may interact with other medicines. Tell your doctor if you have liver or kidney problems. Common side effects include increased Blood Pressure, common cold or flu symptoms,. Sinus irritation, dry mouth, urinary tract infection, bladder inflammation,. Back or joint pain, constipation, dizziness, and headache. Need some help managing your oab symptoms along the way . Ask your doctor if myrbetriq is right for you, and visit myrbetriq. Com to learn more. Crisp leaves of lettuce. Freshly made dressing. Clean food that looks this good. Delivered to your desk. Now delivering to home or office. Panera. Food as it should be. We are especially concerned that these attacks increase the risks of journalists being targeted with violence. On thursday when Cnns Jim Acosta challenged the White House Press secretary over journalists of late offering an opportunity for the administration to say they are not an enemy of the people. This was Sarah Huckabees response. Its ironic, jim, that not only you and the media attack the president for his rhetoric when they frequently lower the level of conversation in this country repeatedly, repeatedly the media resorts to personal attacks without any context to incite anger. His own daughter acknowledges that. All im asking you to do, sarah, is to acknowledge that right now and right here. I appreciate your passion. I share it. Ive addressed this question. Ive addressed my personal feelings. Im here to speak on behalf of the president. Hes made his comments clear. Host of in the thick and nprs latino media. Im going to you, maria. I want to play for you our own katie tur of msnbc telling you some of the things she still hears and things shes heard and get your response about this atmosphere that particularly is toxic for women journalists. Take a listen. I hope you get raped and killed, one person wrote to me just this week. Raped and killed. Not just me but a couple of my female colleagues as well, and in case you want to argue that this has nothing to do with the president , the most recent i note i got ended with maga. Maria, you had spoken with the president and complained about personal attacks against her and how she feels she feels about donald trump. This atmosphere has been very pointed, very targeted and women
journalists have taken the brunt of it. You know who im thinking about right now . Im thinking about identia b. W. She wanted to cover and report on the lynchings that were happening in the United States of america. Because she wanted to report on that she was labeled some kind of advocacy journalist and that she had around agenda. The reason im bringing up ida b. Wells is because women journalists, women of color journalists, we bear an incredible responsibility in how the role of journalism exists in the United States of america. So we have to be out there speaking out and of course, joy, as you know, oftentimes when we do speak out were criticized. Were told, you have an agenda. Theres something wrong with you. Youre mexican . Oh, youre a woman, you have an agenda on that. As journalists, we have to continue to speak the truth but this is not normal, as ive said
multiple times right here with you, joy. I feel like us as journalists, we continue to play by the same rules. And ive been trying to think, like what can we do . We have to come up with some kind of a strategy. Is it a Media Blackout . Do all of the heads of the National News media get together . We have a conference and figure out what we do . Well, most of the people who run the networks are white men and so these kinds of attacks yet i think that i dont even want to say it, but one of us is going to go down and what are we going to do then . Were just going to report on it like another headline, another story . You know, eric, as someone whos analyzed the media for a long time, that is a good question. What can the meet yeah do . The media is still subjecting themselves to these conferences with Sarah Huckabee sanders . If we look at trumps tweet this morning which was
completely unhinged, inciting violence and inciting it against the press. I dont know how any journalist shows up at the White House Press briefing. These Press Briefings are a joke. Theyre an avalanche of lies. Theyre not a good forum to be fact checked instantly. There is no factual information shared at a White House Press briefing. That is where we are. It doesnt exist. If youre a White House Reporter working hard to get information, you cant get any in a briefing. What has also become new is the sort of scripted set performance pieces by Sarah Sanders from the grievance si nation, right . You just played one. And so now its just become this platform for bashing the press, for demonizing the press, for hating the press. I wrote a column a year ago. I said can the White House Press briefings be saved. It seemed glaringly obvious it
could not and i dont understand why anyone is playing this game anymore. Jennifer, if you go to authoritarian countries, one of the features is you do not have a free press. Theres very limited ability to speak out against the regime in power and the media that does exist is very coopted. It praises the administration. You see the tactic all over the parts of europe that are going in that authoritarian direction. Donald trump this morning literally tweeted out and accused the media of not only being the enemy of the people which is a stalinist term. Chuck todd tweeted in terms, this is outrate gous. Im sorry. I know hes baiting us to respond. Im taking the bait in hopes that rational people realize this is wrong. Chuck todd is probably the most straight ahead, down the middle
journalist. If he is having to tweet in that kind of exasperation, what is it the media could do differently . Come around to the view that i share now with eric. I thought they were there to document the horror but now we know what the horror is. We dont have to put it on television. We dont have to put it on television live. If by some chance she utters some morsel of accurate information, it could be fact checked and related to the audience. The same thing with the rallies. No reason to put them on live television. If there is news made, Print Journalism or on air journalism can report that. But to run an entire rally is just to add fuel to the fire. And i will say this. I think its about time that the major news outlets, abc, nbc, cbs, major newspapers pen a letter to the president that we
are physically endangering our reporters and that we will hold you responsible for their safety. Yeah. I think its time to put him on notice and let them contemplate. I would also add one little thing. Sarah Huckabee Sanders is so concerned that people arent nice to her and people like me think that not that she should be harassed but ishunned. The reason is that she lies. She attacks our free press. No respectable employer should hire her after this term. No university. No news outlet. She has lied and she has endangered the lives of reporters. Thats why she should be shunned. Not harassed, shunned. Joy, what would happen if we did like, again well, one, yes, the rallies, forget about that. We dont have to cover that. Thats not news. What if, and ive said this on your show before, again, send the interns. Its a great training to the press conference. If we completely we as the media have got to start taking certain steps to communicate
things. I think a letter, absolutely. But what if we just turn away . What if We Didnt Show what if all of us said for a whole week were not going to talk about one thing that comes out of the white house . I mean, its radical. I know, its upsetting, but this is not how we operate but he is coming after us. Are we going to have to Start Talking about this after one of us has been killed . Is that it . Yeah. And, you know, eric, youve had the difference also is that theres a lot of personalization in a way that we know in the age of social media can send sort of people out to get a person. Donald trump calling don lemon dumb and impugning his intelligence as an awardwinning journalist. When you have right now sarah jong is their new flavor of the month or the person they dont want the New York Times to have on staff. We know George Ronalds was
removed and its very personalized. Are you concerned that the personalization of it combined with the real furor could get somebody hurt . Oh, yeah. People have already been hurt. Indianapolis newsroom experienced that massacre. Trump is going to get more journalists killed and hes not going to care when it happens, period. Thats where we are. Weve come so far from spero o agnew. We are so far beyond that now. As you say, this is a toxic, dangerous, personalized war. How many journalists have been killed under putins rule . Thats where we may be headed. Its scary to think about. It isnt complaining among journalists. This is serious stuff. Jennifer rubin, maria, eric, thank you all very much. Really appreciate you. Next up, not everyone is mad at the nfl for xing Colin Kaepernick over his take a knee
protest. We have a great debate coming up after this break. Stay with us. I did mom. Wanna try it . Yes. It intensely moisturizes your hair and scalp and keeps you flake free. Manolo . Look at my soft hair. I should be in the shot now too. Try head and shoulders two in one. Let these Family Members know that theyre not alone. Nfl star randy moss made a quiet but powerful statement Saturday Night during his induction into the Pro Football Hall Of Fame sporting a time emblazoned with the names of black and brown victims. Moss once played football with former San Francisco 49ers quarterback Colin Kaepernick, another outspoken athlete who used his platform who paid for it with his career. Joining me are two men who disagree on whether the price that kaepernick paid was justified. Camille foster, host of the podcast the fifth column and teray host of the teray show. Thank you for being here. Thank you. Since weve been talking about Lebron Playing what lebron james told our friend don lemon on monday about colin
kaepernick. You heard what the president has said about marshawn, about stef. Yup. About, you know, it seems like cap perfect zblik yekaeperni. Yeah. Men of color. Whats up with that . Whats up with that is all wrong, its not up, its down. For him to, like i said, use force to kind of divide us is something i cant i cant sit back and not say nothing. Do you think he uses black athletes as a scapegoat . At times. At times and more often than not i believe he uses anything thats popular to try to negate people from thinking about the positive that they could actually be doing. Camille foster, do you think the president has unfairly demonized Colin Kaepernick . Do you think it is unjust that Colin Kaepernick is no longer playing in the nfl . Let me take the last question first. Im not certain why colin
kaepernick is not playing in the nfl. I dont know if it has to do with the skill on the field or something with the very, very vocal protests. With respect to the president s antics, i think its fair to call them antics, the president is a bit of a bore. He calls people names and does all sorts of silliness. I dont think that is appropriate. I think its a problem when the president of the United States is caricaturing people and demagoguing them. That being said, the fact is there is a lot about the conversation about police reforms, policeinvolved shootings that i think is very unhealthy. The fact is when people in a black lives matter camp talk about things or someone takes a knee, the thinking is anyone who disagrees with their perspective does so because they dont care about black lives. On The Other Side, the sensibility is if youre taking a knee, youre disrespecting my flag. These are two camps talking past one another and not talking about the issues that they
fundamentally care about which is why i would say if you have a Movement Like this, youre interested in achieving reforms, its not apparent that having Colin Kaepernick at the tip of your spear is good. Hes going to inflame things that are hyperbolic and dont get to the heart of the issue. In 2017 you had less than 1,000 people shot and killed by police. Thats a number thats important but its less than 1,000. We shouldnt be hysterical. Only about 68 of those people were unarmed and only 20 of those people were black. 30 of them were white. This is an issue that is materially significant for allamericans of all races and we should be talking about it in that way, not valkanizing and making it about race. I have no thoughts about why
Colin Kaepernick is not in the nfl. Hes not there because they dont like his protests because a lot of the fans, the white fans are bothered by his protests. The core issue here is the killing, the wrongful killing of black people by agents of their government. Colin kaepernick is morally right, indeed, has a moral imperative to speak about this when he has a platform and the notion that you dont do this in your workplace really does not fit. I would agree with it, in 99 of the cases accountants should not be going into h. R block and saying, lets talk about our education system. When you have a case of life and death. One, two, three is far too many wrongfully killed by our government. When you have an issue like that and you have a platform like Colin Kaepernick has, you have to say something. My question is not why is kaepernick saying so much, my
question is why are not more people saying more . Because this is an incredibly important issue in modern america . Why would we settle for any number of black people being wrongfully killed by their own government . And, you know, i have to take exception to the first thing you said, that theres a question of why Colin Kaepernick isnt playing. Its the subject of a lawsuit hes filed saying there was collusion. It seems more coincidenceal that he and eric reid are not on rosters. Other players are not on rosters. E. A. Sports had to a popollogizr cutting Colin Kaepernicks name out of the sound track to the madden nfl game and to big shawn and other people. My friend kyle harvey has a piece up at the Shadow League asking when did Colin Kaepernicks name essentially a curse sfwhord how can yword . How can you say that . I can only speculate about the reason why he has not been picked up by a team. There are plenty of players who have really dodgy track records who still manage to get picked up by teams in various circumstances. What i can talk about in a concrete way but not nearly as concrete as i would like, i am an advocate for criminal justice reform. I think there should be independent investigation of all policeinvolved shootings and i think narrowly talking about this as a racial issue or primarily a racial issue is myopic. This is the point of some of the fundamental reforms that benefit allamericans. This doesnt have to be something where people are vehemently disagreeing with one another. If the police kill, should they investigate themselves . I dont know an american of any Political Party that could disagree with that. I would disagree because id rather see an independent board. Thats not the answer to the question. Investigating themselves doesnt ever work. Thats what happens in nearly 100 of policeinvolved shootings. Let toure finish his thought. No, just like that. We have a significant because they dont want to deal with the problem that too many black men and women are being killed by agents of their government. The police are part of the government, and we are not receiving effective policing when we are scared in our communities of being killed by the police. This is not something that we can just just say just shut up and play. That is The Other Side of this. Thats ultimately what you are saying. We dont want to hear what you are saying, Colin Kaepernick. There is a First Amendment argument and issue, and just the right in america to protest when you are not getting the justice that you deserve, and if Colin Kaepernick is saying, dont protest, youre saying, shut up and play. Statistically, it is just a
fact that black that africanamericans are killed more often than their white counterparts by police. That is just an actual fact. So what would be wrong with athletes who are black and subject to that kind of violence potentially joining in those protests . Black people are overrepresented in shooting statistics and rates of homicide, and are you doing black on black crime . Im saying something fundamentally different than that. Im saying that i dont know just looking at the disparities is enough. We have to have you guys come back. That wasnt what i asked you about. I was asking about murders by police. Well have you back. Thank you guys. More a. M. Joy coming up. Call. And they greeted me as they always do. Sergeant baker, how are you . They took care of everything a to z. Having insurance is something everyone needs, but having usaa now thats a privilege. When heartburn hits. Fight back fast with tums smoothies. It neutralizes stomach acid at the source. Tum tum tum tum tums. Smoothies. And introducing new tums sugarfree. Ron dellams, an unwavering force in congress, passed away on monday after battling prostate cancer. During his time in congress, he led a 14year campaign against a p partide in south africa and wrote the legislation that imposed sanctions on that country, that were lifted in 1991 after they repealed their laws and released nelson mandela
from prison. He spent more than two decades in congress after serving as the mayor of oakland, california, and was among the most prominent africanamericans in Public Office who also happened to have helped change the course of history. Our condolences to his family. And thats it. Before i go, i also want to congratulate team a. M. Joy on our award for the National Association of black journalists. We were honored for our segment on the kalif browder story. And the creator of the jayz executive producer documentary series. Many thanks. Wu wish i could have been with you guys. Thank you for joining us. Well be back next week, and stay with msnbc. Goes into making americas 1 shave. Precision machinery and highquality materials from around the world. Nobody else even comes close. Now starting at 7. 99. Gillette. The best a man can get. You know how painful heartburn can be. For fastacting, longlasting relief, try doctor recommended gaviscon. It quickly neutralizes stomach acid and helps keep acid down for hours. Relieve heartburn with fast acting, longlasting gaviscon