All that, plus Julian Castro on a potential 2020 run, and todays historic vote to rebuke the white house on yemen when all in starts right now. Good evening from new york, im chris hayes. The president sounds like a guy who is caught, and thats because he has been. Nbc news is reporting tonight that donald trump was in the room during discussions over paying hush money to silence women in august 2015. That puts the president directly in the middle of the scheme to violate Campaign Finance law that he has tried to pin squarely on Michael Cohen. Its a scheme that both prosecutors and the judge who sent cohen to prison say was a serious criminal felony. Thats not all. Also tonight a brand new federal criminal investigation into the Trump Inauguration. The wall street journal reporting that federal prosecutors in manhattan are investigating whether trumps 2017 inaugural committee misspent some of the record 107 million it raised from donations as well as whether some of the committees top donors gave money in exchange for access to the Incoming Trump administration, policy concessions, or to influence official administration positions. Much more on the very sketchy situation around the inauguration shortly. Meanwhile, as the revelations around the hush money payments have piled up, trump has been desperately trying out defenses, hoping one will stick. Today he took his case to trump tv where he suggested cohen should have saved trump from himself. Let me tell you, i never directed him to do anything wrong. Whatever he did, he did on his own. Hes a lawyer. A lawyer who represents a client is supposed to do the right thing. Thats why you pay them a lot of money, et cetera, et cetera. Et cetera, et cetera. Hilariously in that same interview, he undermined his own case saying actually cohen wasnt really a lawyer at all. Why did you hire Michael Cohen . He was known as a fixer. First of all that was his title, a fixer. He did very low level work. Why did you need him . He did more Public Relations than he did law. Youd see him on television. He was okay on television. Okay. Its worth taking a moment to remember just how much the president s story has changed. At the beginning when this was first being reported, it was total denial. Oh, no, never happened. No, its not true. Now we have come to this. Lets just for a moment take a trip down memory lane and see if you can follow the bouncing ball. Did the president approve of the payment that was made in october of 2016 by his longtime lawyer and advisor, Michael Cohen . Look, the president has addressed these directly and made very well clear that none of these allegations are true. Did you know about the 130,000 payment to Stormy Daniels . No. Then why did Michael Cohen make it if there was no truth to the allegations . You have to ask Michael Cohen. Michael is my attorney and youll have to ask michael. Do you know where he got the money to make that payment . No, i dont know. If he didnt know about the specifics of it, as far as i know, but he did know about the general arrangement that michael would take care of things like this. Its not campaign money. No Campaign Finance violation. So they fund it through a law firm. Fund it through a law firm and the president repaid it. Did you know about the payments . Later on i knew. Later on. He is a lawyer. He represents a client. I never directed him to do anything incorrect or wrong. Joining me now, carol lee who reported that trump is confiding to friends hes concerned about impeachment. Also with me, adam serwer who has a piece out saying trump is running out of alibis. In that piece you lay out that the criminal violations that Michael Cohen has pleaded guilty to and been sentenced to in part are quite serious and it is unusually prosecuted for them but theres a reason theyre prosecuted in this case. Right. I mean these laws are written in such a way as to make it extremely hard to be criminally prosecuted for them. The violation has to be knowing and willful. One of the things prosecutors look at when theyre trying to figure that out is whether theres a pattern of deception with the payments. What weve seen with trump, not just his public denials but in the way that cohen facilitated the hush money payments, theres an obvious effort to hide both the nature of the payments and why they were being made. And i think when you look at the president s shifting explanations, it suggests not only that he might be guilty but also that he is extremely worried about it. Carol, that is your reporting today about confiding about being worried about impeachment. I mean at some level, yes, no kidding. But is there something thats changed specifically in the thinking in the white house about that . Yeah, theres a couple of things, i think, that the president , you know, wasnt as worried about this maybe a week ago prior to interesting. Some of the things that have come out. And, you know, we started reporting this before the news even came out about the ami deal, agreement, and so thats only added to it. Now its come out that the president was in the room he was in a room, by the way, where the only two other people in the room are saying that this was campaign related, right, so hes the odd man out on this. And so what weve seen, according to our reporting, is that over the recent days, hes just gotten more concerned about this. And the people around him have gotten more concerned about this. One of the things that they have raised with him is that the need to keep Establishment Republicans onboard. The view is that if you have democrats and they start to move towards impeachment, if republicans can hold the line, then that wouldnt really take it wouldnt go anywhere. But if you start to see cracks among some Establishment Republicans, then it would be problematic. One of those republicans was marco rubio who said over the weekend that no one was above the law. He said it multiple times in the context of the president. That really got some of the president s allies to notice. Theres something remarkable here, adam, which is in the grand scheme of things the grand scheme of things that the president may have done, things that hes done in his past or his business, this is a relatively minor infraction. Its a serious one, but hes pinned on it in a way that i havent seen him pinned on other stuff yet. What do you make of it . Well, i think thats right. I think when you look at some of the president s policies that have caused a significant amount of human suffering, obviously trying to get around Campaign Finance laws isnt really high on the list. On the other hand, the fact that you have the two other people in the room, as carol said, saying that this was a campaign payment and not a, quote unquote, personal transaction or private transaction as the president has tried to make it sound has really just made it impossible for him to provide an explanation that makes him sound innocent. Yeah, thats it, carol. This is unambiguous situation in which the judge, the prosecutors, two of the three people in the room all agree what was happening was a criminal conspiracy to commit a felony and the president is the only one left denying it. It is a discreet and easily understandable crime that he appears to have committed. Hes really isolated on this. You know, you make a really good point. The other thing i would say about it is one of the things that theyre really worried about, and weve talked about this a lot over however long this Mueller Investigation has been going on, is the number of investigations that are now going on. Its just theres all of these sort of trains on the track and they dont know where theyre going and they dont know how to stop them and they dont have any control over them. On top of that, they dont know what else is going to come out. Thats whats really got everybody kind of on edge, far more so in the last few days than i think weve seen even in the last few months. Adam, the president has a lot of faith in his own ability to talk his way out of circumstances, but increasingly in the last few days hes sounded to me like someone who has just been brought into the Police Booking office and hes in the Interrogation Room and hes refusing a lawyer and hes talked himself out of a lot of jams and he thinks he can talk himself out of this one. Right. So the problem with that strategy is that the more he talks and the more his explanation shifts, the more it looks to prosecutors like he is knowingly and willfully violating the law. White collar crime is extremely hard to convict because you have to unlike with other laws that mostly apply to people who are low income, White Collar Crime you have to get inside the mind of the perpetrator. And for some reason, trump, probably against advice of his lawyers, keeps on telling everyone what hes thinking. Welcome to my mind he keeps saying. Carol and adam, thank you for your time. For more on the growing scandal on the Trump Inauguration, im joined by andrew prokop. He wrote why trumps inauguration money is a big part of the Mueller Investigation. The background here is before we found out about this investigation, mueller was already looking at it and the finances were already a little red flag raising. Explain. There are many, many red flags. So the inaugural committee raised over 106 million, appeared thats more than twice as much as any other inaugural committee in history. You know, of course hes trump, he does it really big. But then a lot of questions arose about the people who were giving that money, first of all. Kind of shady, scandalplagued people in several cases. Then there was the question of what actually happened to that money. And that is a very big unanswered question still at this point. Its the focus or at least one focus of the new investigation from the u. S. Attorneys office in new york. But mueller seemed to be more interested in the question of foreign money, particularly russia money, but also middle eastern money that they may have thought made its way into the inaugural committee somehow. We should be enclosure that inaugural committees are very loosely regulated, but one thing you cant do is you cant take foreign money. So the mueller team is looking into that as well as sdny. The wall street journal story suggests that it was the raiding of Michael Cohens office and the records therein that led them to start investigating the inaugural committee, including a conversation Michael Cohen and the woman who was tasked with running it, an argument about why it was costing so much. And thats really interesting because that person is Stephanie Winston wulkoff. She used to be a close friend of melania trump. If you look at the filings for the inaugural committee, her company got 26 million from it. Thats almost a quarter of the total spending. Its the single launchest vendor. Theres a tape where even she is saying shes concerned about how this inaugural committee is spending their money and whats actually going on here. Theres a whole lot more we dont know about where the money went. They only have to disclose very limited categories. The top vendors they spent on, certain categories where they gave a lot of spending, but its very vague. So theres about 30 million that we know nothing about and theres another 20 million or so that we know only the vaguest details about. 30 million that we dont know anything about it. And then theres another sort of 20 million to say that its a little vague. The other thing that strikes me here, there are a lot of people involved in this. One of the things that apparently theyre looking at, the Southern District of new york again, is whether there was essentially quid pro quo. Whether donations were bowing being made for policy considerations from the new administration. Thats been lurking at the back of this all along. Also in the case of mueller in the russian and middle eastern money that they have been questioning people about, oligarchs, but now in the case of the Southern District of new york office, it seems to have perhaps more of an american focus on companies. We should note that several of the major donors to the inaugural have already seemed to be under investigation. Elliott broidy is a big defense contractor. He appears to be in a lot of legal hot water. He was also separately involved in the Michael Cohen you know, one of the hush money payments. Yes, Michael Cohen, who had developed apparently an expertise in hush money payments for rich men who had had affairs decided to do a solid for Elliott Broidy, who had also done this and used the identical contract language he had set up for donald trump to hook up Elliott Broidy with whom he also served on the republican finance committee. So its an interesting small world over there as they begin to untangle the threads. Andrew prokop, thanks for being with me tonight. Thank you. I want to turn to a professor of constitutional law who is also a member of the house of representatives, democrat of maryland and a member of the judiciary committee. Youre someone who has taught, studied and legislated on Campaign Finance. I want you to respond to an argument coming from capitol hill from the president and others being Campaign Finance, are you kidding me . Really . Is that such a big deal . Who cares about Campaign Finance law. Well, thanks for having me, chris. Its a very big deal. If you think about watergate, for example, that scandal was all about Campaign Finance and crimes that were committed in pursuit of the presidency. Here what were talking about crimes committed in pursuit of the presidency and a lot of them have to do with Campaign Finance. But the president s point is debunked and contradicted by his own conduct and behavior. If it wasnt a big deal, why did they go to such Great Lengths to conceal the whole scheme . So what he did essentially was to direct, according to the u. S. Attorney, a sequence of events where they took 150,000 in corporate money and paid it in hush money right before the campaign to one former mistress and then they took 130,000 to pay in hush money to pay off another former mistress to purchase her silence. They went over the 2,700 or 5,400 limit. They shot pretty far over that. They went over that easily and violated the rule against direct corporate contributions, even under the egregious Citizens United case, doing this was not legal. It was a clearly coordinated campaign contribution. They sat in the room together and decided to direct the money there. And then they didnt report any of it. They went to Great Lengths and great pains to conceal the whole conspiracy. So its very serious business. And it is precisely the kind of conduct that was alleged in the impeachment articles by the House Judiciary Committee during watergate. And we know that there was the breakin but there was lots of illegal money flowing in. Look, what im taking from the disclosures this week and from a little conversation that i had with james comey when he came before our committee is that the president has basically been conducting his affairs like a crime family. Comey wrote in his book that when trump was interviewing him for the job of staying on, he said will you have loyalty to me . Will you have personal loyalty to me . Comey wrote and then he reaffirmed in his testimony last week that this was something that he likened to a mob boss. He said he had not experienced this before except in the context of mafia family investigations. The president basically has been running his affairs like an organized crime family. And so there are now all of these corrupt deals that are coming to light, attempts to pay off mistresses, but of course everybody is still waiting for the other shoe to drop with the moscow project, which was the big business ambition of the president. That was, you know, could they actually build for hundreds of millions of dollars a trump tower in moscow in the middle of the president ial campaign. What if the deal had gone through and we had a president who was compromised in that way by Vladimir Putin and by the russian government. It was bad enough just trying to do it, but when if it had gone through. Let me go back to what you just said about comparing to watergate and its true. The follow the money was about where they were getting the money to do all the dirty tricks they were doing. That was a key part of the entire cracking the case open. If its the case that individual 1 has done what he appears to be implicated in doing, which is directing the commission of a felony, multiple felonies, isnt that on its face a high crime or misdemeanor for purposes of the u. S. Constitution . First of all, on the Campaign Finance side, you have to prove that it was willful and knowing. But i think theres a tremendous circumstantial evidence that they knew what they were doing was an attempt to circumvent the Campaign Finance laws. Now, the question about impeachment is somewhat different because i think all the authorities agree that direct violation of a criminal statute is not necessary for impeachment. It is sufficient for impeachment in most cases, but not always. Theres always this other judgment thats built in impeachment thats not just like the way a prosecutor would look at it. You know, are the elements of the statutory offense met. But also is there a general offense against the character of our government and democracy. In other words, is there really a high crime and misdemeanor in terms of corruption of the government. But it looks like were getting very close to that. Its hard to run away from that conclusion. But remember, impeachment is not the beginning of a process, its the end of a process. And were in no hurry to get there. We just want to get the truth of what happened and try to deal with the various crimes and rob obstructions of justice that we can. Thank you for your time tonight. Was Michael Flynn working on a deal with russia during Trumps Campaign while russia was hacking Hillary Clintons email and the dnc . David corn will join me right after this. Place, the xfinity xfi gateway. And its strengthened by xfi pods, which plug in to extend the wifi even farther, past anything that stands in its way. Well almost anything. Leave no room behind with xfi pods. Simple. Easy. Awesome. Click or visit a retail store today. Heres something we still dont know about Michael Flynn. Why did he lie about speaking with Sergey Kislyak during the transition . We know the circumstances of the lie. We know the lie he told when the fbi talked to him. Weve got all these details about the lie from the Court Filings but even his own attorneys in their own filing never explained why, why he lied. Why not just say i talked to kislyak about the sanctions because i was about to be the National Security advisor. Well, some new information that might shed light on that. Flynn was in touch with kislyak during the campaign on the things that we know the russians were seeking. Mother jones reporting that flynn said he discussed with kislyak a grand bargain in which moscow would cooperate with the Trump Administration to resolve the syrian conflict and washington would end or ease up on the sanctions imposed on russia for its annexation of crimea and military intervention in ukraine. The working conclusion was that the quid was business deals in moscow, helping the campaign, and the quo was what they were really pursuing was sanctions relief. We know Michael Flynn was talking about sanctions relief during the campaign, so is that the reason he was lying . Is there something more there . Joining me now, one of the authors of this report, david corn, Washington Bureau chief, mother jones, also author of russian roulette, the inside story of putins war on america and the election of donald trump. David, what have you learned about the conversations flynn was having during the campaign . Let me take one step back. Back in february, 2017, when the whole flynn story collapsed that he had lied and that he was under investigation, there was a line in a Washington Post story saying that the reporters had talked to ambassador kislyak, the russian man in d. C. , and that those conversations began before the election, not just during the transition period. And so that was always interesting to me because it was never flushed out. What were they talking about, when were they talking . Well, mother jones, we have found two Flynn Associates who say that they have heard that he has said that during the election, before the election day, before the transition, that he was having conversations with kislyak, cant tell you when, cant tell you how many, that involved these grand policy matters, what to do in syria, what to do in iran, and even the possibility of if we get together, the United States and russia under a Trump Presidency on syria, then maybe we can do something on sanctions. Put this to flynns lawyer, he wouldnt respond. This has been a question thats been sitting out there and it raises a host of other questions. This was all happening, if it was happening, while moscow was attacking the american election. And so imagine this is going on and one of the representatives on one of the campaigns comes to you and says, hey, we want to do business with you after the election. Would that dissuade you from carrying on this attack or encourage you to go further . Its also the case here that, remember, the lie was about the day the Obama Administration imposed punitive sanctions that he gets on the phone with kislyak and lies about it. One thing weve seen, david, when they have the trump tower meeting, they want to talk sanctions. When theyre putting together the possible moscow project, theyre using a bank thats sanctioned. When Michael Cohen goes and delivers a peace plan for ukraine, its about lifting the sanctions. Its very clear from the russian side what they were after. Yeah, in fact, you know, we have news today about maria butina, the russian agent, and she got to ask trump a question in 2015 after he had announced that he was a candidate for president at a conference of evangelicals in las vegas, and the question was what would you do about sanctions . We still dont know how she got there and who gave her the right to ask a question of trump. Trump had her prepared answer. It was coherent, it was a paragraph. It wasnt word salad and all about doing something to ease the sanctions, that we dont need the sanctions. So sanctions were always there. So i think its a very legitimate question, did Michael Flynn talk to the russians, talk to kislyak during the election, did sanctions come up. We know that Jeff Sessions as a senator, but as a top advisor to trump in september 2016 had a meeting in his own office with kislyak again while the russians were attacking the american election. So did flynn do the same . These are the type of things that a congressional investigation run by mature, responsible investigators would have gotten to and would have told the public about. In the case of Michael Flynn, we know that hes cooperating with three separate investigations. The bulk of his cooperation, redacted of course in that special Counsel Office filing. Its interesting from the president this morning, who basically is trying to throw cohen under the bus and say hes a rat, this is him about flynn. They gave flynn a great deal because they were embarrassed by the way he was treated. The fib said he didnt lie, thats not true. They want to scare everybody into making up stories that are not true by catching them in the smallest misstatements. Hes trying to hold out hope that hes staying strong. Theres speculation on all the reasons why flynn has cooperated and took a deal. Of course hes not the type of fellow, according to his own defenders, who would plead guilty to something if he were innocent. Right. But he also has concerns about family members and other business dealings hes had that have come under investigation. So he may have a very good reason to cooperate and it has nothing to do with anything that trump said. David corn, thank you very much. Thank you, chris. A russian agent pleads guilty to conspiracy and is now cooperating with prosecutors. The russian plot to influence the nra and republicans, next. Today is the day youre going to get motivated. Get stronger. Get closer. Start listening today to the Worlds Largest selection of audiobooks on audible. And now, get more. For just 14. 95 a month, youll get a credit a month good for any audiobook, plus two Audible Originals exclusive titles you cant find anywhere else. If you dont like a book, you can exchange it any time, no questions asked. Automatically roll your credits over to the next month if you dont use them. With the free audible app, you can listen anytime, and anywhere. Plus for the first time ever, youll get access to exclusive fitness programs a 95 value free with membership. Start a 30day trial today and your first audiobook is free. Cancel anytime and your books are yours to keep forever. Audible. The most inspiring minds. The most compelling stories. Text listen27 to 500500 to start your free trial today. For the first time that we know of, there is now a Russian National cooperating with investigators about russian influence in the 2016 president ial election. Maria butina pleaded guilty to one count of conspiracy today for illegally acting as a Foreign Agent and agreed to cooperate with the office of the u. S. Attorney for the district of columbia. Even as butina hobnobbed in prominent conservative and gun rights circles, prosecutors say she was actually working with central banker Alexander Torshin to establish back channels to powerful americans. Theres still, however, a lot we dont know about butinas case from the roles of certain americans who helped her and particularly her relationship with the National Rifle association. Here to answer some of those unresolved questions, mark fullman and ben rhodes, former National Security advisor and miscellaneous nbc political contributor. Mark, this was someone who was quite successful from just out of nowhere essentially in weaving herself into the center of a lot of conservative politics. Yeah. Well, i think first todays plea deal is just stunning confirmation of what we at mother jones and many other news outlets have been reporting for a long time about the way that they so successfully were able to ingratiate themselves with conservatives in american politics, but especially leaders in the National Rifle association. And, you know, its been understood for a while now they have had long ties to this group, but were seeing more evidence now that this is increasingly a story about, what else, following the money. We just reported yesterday at mother jones, my colleague dan friedman and i, some new evidence we found, photographic evidence of torshin at an annual conference in 2013 where not only is he hobnobbing with top officials in the nra, hes spending time with them in private and public settings. Hes at a fundraiser for elite donors, whats called their elite ring of freedom. An it raises more questions about what is this guy doing with them in this setting of money and what other money might be involved in this relationship. Ben, i want to play for you this moment, this maria butina moment in las vegas where she manages to get the microphone and Ask Donald Trump about sanctions and just what that means to you now given all that we know. Take a listen. If you are elected as president , what will be your foreign politics especially in relationship to my country, and do you want to continue the politics of sanctions that damage both economy or you have any other ideas . I believe i would get along very nicely with putin, okay . And i mean where we have the strength. I dont think youd need the sanctions. I think that we would get along very, very well. I really believe that. What do you think . Well, chris, a couple things. First of all, lets remember the context, right . This was at a time when russia had recently invaded and annexed crimea. Russia was an outright hostile actor towards the United States and our interests and thats why those sanctions were put in place. The second thing i would say is this is how the russians operate. If you know how the russians deal with spying and influence, they find people who are one or two degrees removed from the kremlin, who are reporting back to some russian agent who has a relationship with the kremlin. And the purpose of that persons work is to establish relationships, to try to get influence, so clearly she was operating and swimming in these circles around the nra, around various rightwing interest groups, trying to get close to trump, trying to develop these relationships, and then getting in front of the person who was going to be the republican nominee. And clearly, she got exactly the answer from trump that she wanted. If putin is sitting there and hes thinking whether or not to intervene in our election, right, because this is about the time that hes making that determination, donald trump is now just giving essentially the signal its not unlike when he said lets hack hillarys emails, hell say in that answer im get along with you guys. Im the person you should bet on. Mark, who else is exposed here . She had contact with a lot of people. Shes a boyfriend whos a big republican donor. Where do you think this can go next . Well, i think the nra has a lot of questions to answer. Its very interesting, for a while now the Million Dollar question, so to speak, has been has there been more money provided by the russians through the nra possibly to support the Trump Campaign . The nra spent a whopping 30 million to back his president ial bid. You know, the nra has essentially stonewalled questions from investigators on the hill. In our reporting this week, we heard from several sources on the hill that theres growing interest in this potential money trail and the question of whether or not there was more russian money flowing into the nra and possibly even to the Trump Campaign, which of course would be illegal. So, you know, i think were hearing very sharp skepticism from sources on the hill about the nras claim so far that they have seen no russian money essentially. They disclosed a few hundred dollars here and there over the last few years. Then why was Alexander Torshin getting such vip treatment for so many years at their conferences . Also one other point i want to make, for so long the question has been about what are maria butina and Alexander Torshin doing with the nra, spending all this time in the United States. But really i think we need to reverse that question and asking what is the nra doing with these russian operatives, including the two trips that they took, some of their top executives and leaders to moscow, first in 2013 and then in 2015 to spend time with Maria Butinas gun group there. Its called the golden ring of freedom. Mark freeman and ben rhodes, thank you both. Up next the historic smackdown after the cowardly behavior of paul ryan. One of the republicans who sided with the speaker joins me next. These folks, they dont have time to go to the post office they have businesses to grow customers to care for lives to get home to they use stamps. Com print discounted postage for any letter any package any time right from your computer all the Amazing Services of the post office only cheaper get our special tv offer a 4week trial plus postage and a digital scale go to stamps. Com tv and never go to the post office again in a historic repudiation of the Trump Administration, the senate voted today to end u. S. Support for the saudi war in yemen. The vote 5641 marked bipartisan condemnation of the u. S. Role in yemen which has killed tens of thousands and now threatens to starve a whopping 14 million people. In a second voice vote, the second condemned the brutal murder of journalist Jamal Khashoggi at the direction of mohammed bin salman. Todays vote was also a strong statement against the unfetterred power of american president s, democrat and republican, to engage the u. S. Military wherever they want whenever they want. In fact today was the First Time Since the war powers act was enacted in 1973 that either chamber has voted to end american involvement in the war. The war powers act was intended to this debate over the war in yemen cannot move to the house because of a cowardly procedural move by speaker paul ryan. He attached a rule to the farm bill of all things that would block a yemen debate on the resolution. Congressman Ryan Costello voted yes in the narrow vote to not debate in the house. You are one of the 206 members to vote for the rule which came up for the farm bill itself that specifically had an item that says we wont consider the war powers resolution on yemen. Why did you vote yes . Didnt like the vote in the respect that i dont think we should be combining whether to proceed with a war powers resolution in a farm bill. So the answer to your question is, number one, the farm bill needs to get passed. Weve been working on it way too long. We have issues of crop insurance, snap, theres a lot in there that needs to get done. Lets focus specifically on the yemen issue, which i and i think many others, even who voted for the rule would like to make an affirmative position that we do need more clarity on what our involvement is in yemen at this point in time. My understanding is were talking about intelligence gathering, refueling of saudi planes. And the real constitutional question here is, is that kind of assistance. Does it give rise to military forces using the term hostilities under the war powers act. So im happy to talk to you more about that. Heres the problem, right, and i understand the pragmatic calculation. We need the farm bill, so i vote for the rule. Leadership says vote for the bill. But there were a lot of republicans who defected, a surprising number who defected on the rule. You cut off the debate on it. It just seems to me so bizarre and disingenuous and the opposite of what you want in a vibrant democracy, which is just pass a rule that doesnt have this blockage and pass the farm bill. Agreed, totally bizarre. I didnt like it. Moving forward, chris, i want to try and be helpful to the discussion here and the issue is going to be as follows. What we really actually need to do in yemen in terms of getting more clarity and determine what our role is going to be, if any, is something that will probably fall outside the war powers resolution. So and by the way, the president would have vetoed this anyway and im not sure we get twothirds in the house and the senate to do it, but the real function here is a standalone bill. Because the constitutional argument is, and i think its the correct one, is that what we actually need to decide whether were going to be involved or not falls outside the war powers resolution that may be true, and i get that. And that was part of that was part of my calculus. Again, i was asked to eat a sandwich and it wasnt a Peanut Butter and jelly sandwich, if you know what im saying. Look, leadership does this all the time. It jams the members on rules. But it was striking to me that they went out of their way on this, right . I didnt understand that. I agree with you. Thats my question. Whats so scary . If the president is going to veto it anyway, and to me heres ill tell you what my theory is. You tell me if you think im right, youre closer than i am on this. They dont want their members to take a vote because it looks pretty bad theres a bunch of kids starving and theyre starving because of things were doing and facilitating and paul ryan doesnt want a bunch of members to say this is why those kids have to starve and he saved everybody the trouble. I dont know thats it. Listen, its a fair question. If we remove ourselves from the situation entirely, in other words, not a penny of aid, not a penny of assistance, is the situation better in yemen . Im not sure that it is. I think the odds are decent. All right. Question number two, i think its less about putting us on the record, because i think that vote was not a vote that makes anybody happy. Youre saying the rule vote, that people were pissed about the rule vote. Correct. I think this is administration driven, and i think that the administration probably does not want to deal does not want to question number two, i think its less about putting us on the record, because i think that vote was not a vote that makes anybody happy. Youre saying the rule vote, that people were pissed about the rule vote. Correct. I think this is administration driven, and i think that the administration probably does not want to deal does not want to conflate what happened in saudi arabia with the murder of the journalist with whats happening in yemen. Interesting. And to be honest with you, i think for as horrific as that was and is and for as much as we should question and seek justice, whether or not we provide assistance in yemen because of the relationship with iran to the Houthi Rebels needs to be treated independently. And im not saying that as long as saudi arabia is doing i understand that argument, although i do think its revealed something about the regime and how that regime may treat civilian life given the way they treated the life of Jamal Khashoggi. I agree with you. Congressman Ryan Costello. Thank you for making time tonight. The race to be the next democratic candidate for president is already under way. Ill ask one of the early contenders what he brings to the table, ahead. I want to give my thanks to ali velshi for filling in for me a few nights this week. I really appreciate it, while i was taking a little time off with my family. A new pod up this week with Joanne Freeman about the shocking violence in congress on the house floor leading up to the civil war. Were talking duels, brawls and public beatings. Its really riveting stuff. Check it out wherever you get your podcasts. Today is the day youre going to get motivated. Get stronger. Get closer. Start listening today to the Worlds Largest selection of audiobooks on audible. And now, get more. For just 14. 95 a month, youll get a credit a month good for any audiobook, plus two Audible Originals exclusive titles you cant find anywhere else. If you dont like a book, you can exchange it any time, no questions asked. Automatically roll your credits over to the next month if you dont use them. With the free audible app, you can listen anytime, and anywhere. Plus for the first time ever, youll get access to exclusive fitness programs a 95 value free with membership. Start a 30day trial today and your first audiobook is free. Cancel anytime and your books are yours to keep forever. Audible. The most inspiring minds. The most compelling stories. Text listen27 to 500500 to start your free trial today. This may sound crazy or abrupt or impossible, but it is the truth. Were a little more than a year away from the iowa caucuses, which Means Campaign season is upon us. Poem Democratic Candidates are already scrambling to hire top flight talent before its picked clean, hoping to make an impression before an expected explosion of Campaign Announcements in january there could be as many as two dozen democrats vying for the white house, maybe more. While many are playing it coy right now thinking theyre considering it. Or Julian Castro has actually taken concrete steps towards a run. He Just Announced an Exploratory Committee and he joins me here tonight. You filed the paperwork this. We did. I had to file it by mail, snail mail, because i was trying to put the accent over the a with my name. Apparently, if the fec is watching, you cannot have any accented characters in there. For my name going in the form. Thats how bad it is. So i had to file snail mail. Why should Julian Castro be president of the United States . Because i have a strong vision for the future of the country. Because ive shown that i can get things done and create opportunity for folks. I have done that at the local level and the national level. And because ive lived a life where ive seen the experiences of people in this country who both are struggling, who are pursuing their American Dream in earnest, and also, ive served at the highest levels of government and had the opportunity to do well in my own life. And i feel like i have both policy experience, a vision for the country, and also in Life Experience something that resonates with people across the board. How important is experience . How much experience should a person have to run for president or to be president . I think somebody should have relevant experience of getting things done, right . Oftentimes historically thats been either in government the military. Yep. The argument that donald trump made in 2016 was that his experience in business would somehow translate into success at the oval office. And you know what . Maybe for some people it would, but it clearly has not for him. You just mentioned the military. I think this all the time. I think about someone who is going to run for president. If you win, it would mean ordering people into battle. You would make decisions that result in people dying whether American Service members who die on your command as commander in chief, or people that are being fought by the u. S. Military, oftentimes civilians through accidents. Do you think about that . Do you think about violence and death as things that you will be intimately part of would you win this job . Of course you think about that. You know, you read about president ial Decision Making or watch incidents, they talk a lot about the hardest part of the job being those kinds of decisions, of sending young men and women into battle. And so of course you think about that. I think that, you know, the ability to make those decisions depends on different things. But at base, its a healthy respect for those types of decisions for the people that youre sending into harms way. And i think that in the last 15 years, we have seen rather spectacular examples of individuals that i think didnt have enough of a respect for that. What is the worst thing that and i think that in the last 15 years, we have seen rather spectacular examples of individuals that i think didnt have enough of a respect for that. What is the worst thing that donald trump has done . There are a lot of them. I think the worst thing that he has done is he has completely debased our sense of the office, and hes created he is marching towards the creation of this alternative reality, talk about alternative facts. And in doing that, he has polarized the country, divided the country. Wasnt that there beforehand . Oh, it was. But i think its been amped up significantly since he became president. And that has a human impact. There are people who have brown skin or black skin or who wear a turban or a yarmulke who dont feel safe walking down their own neighborhood because he has unleashed this bigotry and hatred in our country in a way that we havent seen in a long time. And i think thats because of how he has conducted himself. Final quick question. You become president. Youre sworn in. You have a Democratic House and senate. The first bill, the first big domestic policy legislation you move is . Health care. Health care. Specifically . I believe that we need medicare for all. I believe that we need to recoup the millions of people that have already lost. Medicare for all first thing out of the box is in the castro mix . I believe we need to recoup the millions of people who have already lost health insurance, and we need to do more than that and ensure that everybody has health insurance. Thats a god clear answer. I want to get everyone running on this very question. I think thats going to be very important should that come about. Julian castro, thanks. Thanks for having me. Tonight several sources say the president is alarmed at his own he impeachment and new reporting says he was in the room when hush money payoffs to women were discussed. Plus the wall street journal out with a block buster. The Trump Inauguration is now also under federal criminal investigation because of questions about all the money they raised and where it went. And could it be serious . This new reporting tonight that the president s soninlaw Jared Kushner is a serious candidate for white house chief of staff. As the 11th hour gets underway on a thursday night. Well, good evening once again from our nbc news headquarters here in new york. Day 693 of this Trump Administration, and we have new reporting tonight on a number of fronts, from the president being concerned about his own