Transcripts For MSNBCW All In With Chris Hayes 20180301

Knew about the hack of the dnc before the public did. Boy, i love reading those wikilea wikileaks. What to make of the president s gun show. I like taking the guns early. With the lawmaker in the room. I think you underestimate the power of the gun lobby. When all in starts right now. Good evening from new york. Im chris hayes. White House Communications director hope hicks is out. One day after testifying before the House Intelligence Committee, where she acknowledged telling, and im quoting because its such an indicative phrase, white lies. White lies for the president. The president s longest serving aide is joining the extensive and ever growing list of senior officials to leave the Trump Administration. Hicks has been a player in some of the pivotal moments of the russia saga. She was interviewed by Robert Muellers Team Last Year and her departure comes as muellers investigation appears to be turn together key question at the heart of the whole affair. Did the president of the United States conspire with a foreign adversary to influence the 2016 election. According to an explooes cluesive report from nbc news out today, muellers team is now asking witnesses pointed questions whether donald trump was aware that democratic emails had been stolen before that was publicly known and whether he was involved in their strategic release. Now, we already know that members of the president s campaign were aware of the emails. Youll remember George Papadopoulos, that guy . According to his guilty plea about, a month after he attended that meeting with the candidate himself, thats donald trump and George Papadopoulos sitting at the same table talking, about a month after that meeting with the candidate, papadopoulos learned from a russian intermediary the russians had emails of clinton. They have trouz thousands of emails. Thats an amazing thing to know before everyone else knows it we know from the same filings papadopoulos despite being described as coffee boy was in frequent contact with Senior Campaign officials and we just found out, and this got a little lost, this is important, that papadopoulos had been informed that the russians could assist the campaign by anonymously releasing the clinton emails, which sure as heck sounds familiar. Ranking member adam schiff explained the significance of that revelation monday night right here on this program. Our memo discloses for the first time that the russians preview to papadopoulos that they could help with disseminating these stolen emails. We knew from the papadopoulos plea that the russians had told the Trump Campaign very early on in april of 2016 that they were in possession of these stolen emails. We now know that the department of justice presented to the fisa Court Information that the russians previewed what they would do with this information. Their dissemination of it. So the russians have previewed to a campaign surrogate, george popped they have the emails. Thousands of emails of Hillary Clinton. What they would do leaking it anonymously all before this all comes out publicly. The question is with all the information swirling around inside the Trump Campaign, did any of that information make its way to the man at the city of the campaign, the candidate . Did it make its way to donald trump and could it have had anything to do with these very memorable comments in july 2016 . Russia, if youre listening, i hope youre able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing. I think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press. Mike is an nbc National Political reporter who helped break that story. What do we know about these questions muellers team is asking . Well, chris, as you know, this Mueller Investigation has been very tightlipped. Theres been very few leaks coming from it. Anytime we can offer the public insight no what theyre investigating, its significant. In this case, what were reporting along with carol lee and katy tur, puts a spotlight on the collusion aspect of this investigation. Specifically, not necessarily weather senior members of the Trump Campaign and senior russian government officials were coordinating but the nature of potential intermediaries in helping to facilitate leaks that could prove damaging to clinton campaign. The timeline was critical. In march, podestas emails were hacked. In april, George Papadopoulos meeting with the russian agent who informs him they have dirt on Hillary Clinton. The timing of the release of the emails is significant, as well. Have you in july of 2016, just as democrats hope to unite the party ahead of the democratic convention, the dnc emails are leaked. Then in october, just as the access Hollywood Tape breaks, you have the Podesta Emails leaked. So what weve been told in our reporting is that mueller is zeroing in on whether senior members of the Trump Campaign or any allies of trump including roger stone may have been suggesting to the president , the hen candidate in that july famous comment, that clip you just showed whether he was with knowledge of what was to come pleading with the russians to release this. Its also important what we learned from the democratic memo. This is not just information because carter pij if i sa application is part of the precursor to what is now the Mueller Probe. When they went to the fisa court, theyre presenting a potential link between what papadopoulos learned in his conversations with russians and other aspects of interest to this investigation. It lends credibility to it. So the timing is also key that theyre zeroing in on these key sort of plot points in this drama particularly that the wikileaks first set of Podesta Emails i think theyre tweeted a half an hour after the west story on access hollywood. Thats right. Not to be lost in the dnc emails, as well. The comment that you played from then candidate trump was at a press conference just days after those dnc emails were posted. And, of course, again, the role of roger stone. Remember the tweet he cryptically suggested that podestas turn in the barrel was coming. The question that mueller and his other Investigative Team is asking, did he tweet that with knowledge that in fact podestas emails were hacked an ready to be released. Roger stone denied any link with wikileaks, any direct contact with julian assange. He testified before it the House Intelligence Committee last fall and said much of the same. He also said in his Opening Statement before the committee at that time was that when he was referring to podestas time in the barrel, the context was key, was because his friend, hischildhood friend, Paul Manafort, had just resigned as the Trump Campaign chairman. And this was in connection to his own contacts with foreign governments and thats what he was suggesting his tweet was in reference to at the time. Investigators want to know more and want to know whether stone was still in contact with donald trump had himself. Mike memoli, great to have you. Lets bringing in Nick Ackerman, former federal prosecutor paul butler. Paul, let me start with you. Lets say devils advocate posture here. At some level, its not surprising muellers team would be asking these questions since theyre questions you would have to ask if you were getting into collusion anyway. Is it news to you these are being asked now . Its big news. The focus of muellers investigation of trump has seemed heretofore to be about obstruction. The firing of james comey. Right. The meetinging on air force one where he and hope hicks ginned up that false narrative what the meeting with the lawyer was about. But prosecutors have always had this question, if trump only has allegations of obstruction or even evidence, would he bring a case. Now, were thinking squarely about collusion. So the obstruction of justice would be supplemental to trump actually colluding with the russians to subvert democracy to steal the election. The thing there is that collusion by itself is not a crime. Conspiracy to defraud the United States on the other hand is a fiveyear felony. And today were getting evidence that mueller thinks that trump might have been involved in some kind of conspiracy. If he was involved in any way with coordinating the release of hacked emails, hes got criminal exposure. Thats even bigger than a fiveyear felony. What were dealing with is a conspiracy to break in to the Democratic National committee. Steal emails and use those emails to help trump get elected. And the quid pro quo for that was the dropping of sanctions. What was left out of this whole narrative was the one end with Michael Flynn who was dealing with the Russian Ambassador over sanctions and the whole notion that the Trump Administration was going to get rid of all of the sanctions after he took office. We should say, there is reporting indicating that was the order that was sent sort of top down on day one was we want to get rid of the sanctions. There was a rebellion in the state department. If you go to the other end of the conspiracy, what you have is the june 9th meeting where youve got the email to don junior stating that theyre going to bring all of this dirt on Hillary Clinton up to new york to this meeting from russia. The dirt is the equivalent of the emails. Thats what he papadopoulos tells us. Thats whats in this letter the democratic letter issued last week. So all of these emails come up to new york. They realize its too hot to handle. The campaign. This is again, i have to be clear. This is the Nick Ackerman theory of the case of what happened. This is exactly where its going because what happens next is within days, roger stone is dealing with guccifer 2. 0, hes dealing with wikileaks. We know hes dealing because the new Communications Just came out that contradict what he was saying about his later dealings. And then what happens all of the stuff gets released from guccifer 2. 0. It gets released through wikileaks. There are contacts between don junior and wikileaks. The president now president was telling everybody to go to the wikileaks, go to this website. He was encouraging at least a dozen times. He did that during the course of the campaign. Heres the thing. Paul, short of the nick theory, you have a theory of the case which you just laid out. Quid pro quo that involves essentially coconspireing in this criminal conspiracy. Based on evidence. Im not saying based on evidence. But in some ways, paul what, im hearing from you is that short of any of that, lets say there was no quid pro quo or promise, if you know in any way what theyre doing and you help them disseminate the emails youre saying theres criminal exposure right there. Yeah, help is the key. If the president is being more or less passive and understanding that the russians have this information, this dirt on hillary and it would be really cool if it came out but i dont have anything to do with it, i dont think thats hes going to be the subject of an indictment or a report to congress recommending impeachment. On the other hand, if he was active in any kind of participation any kind of active coordination about when the emails would be released or who should be targeted, what journalists or other folks should be targeted with this dirt on hillary, then hes going down. And its exactly the same thing he did in the oval office. What you showed with that clip before trump gets up and says russia, get those emails he does it in public. He did the same thing in the oval office with the ambassador where he released classified information that he got from the israelis. This is a man who is very cagey. Does this thing in a public way where it doesnt look like hes actually helping the russians but the bottom line is, he is. And thats where hes going to go down. That point i think is a key one. If you can show the president knowing about what russia is doing via the emails even if the papadopoulos information is passed to him,ham saying publicly, russia if youre listening is no longer a joke. Hes in public giving a directive as part of the conspiracy plausibly. Does he tound sound like hes joking . He claimed it was a joke afterwards. That didnt sound like a joke to me. Go ahead, paul. Thats where Paul Manafort again at some point, chris, Paul Manafort is pleading guilty. Hes 69 years old looking at 40 years. The case against him is really easy to prove. If hes got dirt about the president of the United States, Robert Mueller is going to get that dirt. I pleaded not guilty today and they set a trial date in midseptember. Thanks for being here. The president launches a very public attack on his own attorney general who apparently his nickname for is mr. Mcgeough for not investigating his personal political enemies. Tonight word that Robert Mueller is interested in trumps attempts to fire Jeff Sessions. Next, the white House Communications director quits one day after facing the house russia probe. Why hope hicks is suddenly resigning in two minutes. S. Guys, know anything about this missing inventory . Wasnt me the cheeks dont lie, chet. Irresistibly planters. [thud] [screaming crying] [screaming crying] [phone ping] with esurance photo claims, you could have money for repairs within a day. Wow that was really fast. Thats insurance for the modern world. Esurance. Click or call. Its youve never gamed with speeds like this internet. Its all your teenagers streaming at once internet. Its i can get up to one, two, three, four, five mobile lines included . Internet its internet from xfinity that makes your life simple, easy, awesome. See how you can save by adding Xfinity Mobile to your internet. Plus, save even more when you sign up for internet, tv and voice together. Click, call, or visit an xfinity store today. Now, hope hicks is a tremendously talented person. She started off with us right from day one. Hope hicks, this is hope. This is hope. This is hope. Nobody nobody takes more phone calls i think in a day than hope. The legendary hope hicks. Come on up here, hope. Come, come, come. Shes shy. Get her up here. A shock resignation tonight. Hope hicks trumps longest serving aide announcing she is leaving as white House Communications director telling colleagues a great profile for gq, Ashley Parker from the washington post. Ashley, let me start with you. Why did this happen . What happened . So thats what were still trying to unpack a little bit. Our understanding is that she had told at least some Close Friends before her testimony on the hill yesterday that this was planned. And this job took an incredible personal toll on her. In addition to sort of working with trump for three years, weathering the chaos and the maelstrom of just being in trumps orbit, if you just look at the past month, she was dating rob porter. An alleged Domestic Abuser, she had pap raz ziz staking out her house described by friends as deeply shaken about that and she was also facing this testimony, yesterdays testimony an encoaching Mueller Probe and was exhausted. My understanding as the news broke, she was crying but in some ways relieved to be exiting this white house. Olivia, how important is hope hicks to this white house . I mean, shes extremely important. I would say shes one of the most if not the most important aide there. Remember donald trump has not existed without hope hicks by his side since the winter of 2015. Thats months before he announced he was running for president. She has outlived corey lewandowski, paw manafort, steve bannon, reince priebus, sean spicer. I could go on and on and on. And trump doesnt seem any different in terms of his emotional state, ill put it that way, without those people around. I think without hope, things might be different. I also want to point out, everyones pointing to the testimony yesterday as being what they think is related to her resignation. Maybe thats true but i think a Different Event yesterday which was the resignation of josh raffle, her very close friend from a pr firm she worked for in new york, him leaving probably maybe has more to do with her exit than the testimony even does because she really they are very Close Friends. She doesnt like washington. Shes not very social. They are social together. They hang out all the time. It will be more difficult here for her without him around. And to olivias point, two things. When this whole thing started, it was basically a tabloid scandal before there were any Domestic Abuse allegations it was sort of her and rob porter stepping out on the town. The third wheel in this date not named was josh raffle. He is always there and very close toes hope. To her other point, it was very astute this idea that hope has been with trump from the beginning. Now that shes gone, this president is someone who runs the white house like a Family Business. And likes to surround himself with people he is comfortable and familiar with. With her gone, the only people within the white house, the only Friendly Faces people he likes to be around and who can help manage his moods in the margin admitted are dan scavino, social media director and ivanka trump. Theres hope hicks has some exposure in various ways. One of them is, of course, she was part of the drafting of that very flagrantly misleading deceptive statement about the trump tower meeting. The second though just to return to the rob porter thing, im unclear whether theyre still dating or not. She was part of essentially an effort to coverup and protect a senior white house aide whose background check had come back red flagged four different times because both of his etch wives accused him of violence against them. She was part of that effort. Yeah, look, hope hicks since 2015, the winter of 2015, shes repeatedly found herself in very difficult positions in this job with donald trump. And surrounded by very difficult men who i think she often finds herself defending or taking putting out statements on behalf of. It makes her look bad, right . And i think in a lot of ways its just the nature of this job. I find it very difficult to conceive of anybody having this job as the white House Communications director or Donald Trumps Campaign Spokesperson and not finding themselves in similarly precarious positions. On the rob porter thing, theres some conflicting reports about her role in the drafting that have statement and how much discussion there was between her and john kelly. And its very difficult like so much other things involving this white house to get a clear answer about who said what. Who wrote what, and who was responsible for what. I cant get a clear answer on the record about who wrote what involving those statements and rob porter. Ashley, she knows a lot. Shes a person who is floating out there knowing a lot. She absolutely is. She is sort of one of the key people anyone would want to talk to who is investigating President Trump for russia collusion or obstruction of justice. And she is one of the key people they actually are talking to. That said, i dont think shes one of those people now that they are cast out are more dangerous on the outside than the inside. Shes fiercely loyal as she said perhaps problematic little before the House Committee yesterday. She tells white lies on behalf of the president. I assume she will continue to protect him wherever she may. Define white lie. Define nonsubstantive lies. Olivia, Ashley Parker, thanks for joining me. Next as Robert Mueller closes in, the president lashes out at Jeff Sessions. Tonight the breaking news that the Mueller Probe is asking all about trumps attempts to fire Jeff Sessions. That story after the break. Im on the move all day long. And sometimes, i dont eat the way i should. So, i drink boost to get the nutrition im missing. Boost high protein nutritional drink has 15 grams of protein to help maintain muscle and 26 essential vitamins and minerals, including calcium and vitamin d. All with a great taste. Boost gives me everything i need. To be up for doing what i love. Boost high protein be up for it i we worked with pg eof to save energy because wenie. Wanted to help the school. They would put these signs on the door to let the teacher know you didnt cut off the light. The teachers, they would call us the energy patrol. So they would be like, here they come, turn off your lights those three young ladies were teaching the whole school about energy efficiency. We actually saved 50,000. And thats just one school, two semesters, three girls. Together, were building a better california. Wise. We have more breaking news in the Mueller Investigation. Certainly does seem like things are fast and furious in the moment. According to the post, the special counsel Robert Mueller is examining the president s an apparent efforts to oust attorney general Jeff Sessions last summer. People familiar with the matter telling the post a key area of inquiry were whether those were a pattern of obstructing justice. Republican mickey edwards, former u. S. Congressman from oklahoma and democrat barbara boxer. I want to just set up for you guys the president s tweet today at Jeff Sessions which hes done a bunch of this. He cant help but feel this is in the context of the Mueller Investigation. This is about sessions opening an ig investigation into fisa use. He says why is ag Jeff Sessions asking the Inspector General to investigate potentially massive fisa abuse . Also take forever. Already late with reports on comey, et cetera. Why not use use justice appointed lawyers. Disgraceful. Mickey, this seems like the president ordering his ag to open a political investigation of his political enemies which seems a plausibly impeachable offense. This president is like a Junior High School bully used to getting his way and has his little gang who will do whatever he tells them to do. He thinks hes president and he can tell them go ahead, investigate hillary, investigate and he doesnt understand that there are some people going to stand up against him. Look, its not only outrageous hes doing this. Its stupid because i dont know if you remember the history with Jeff Sessions. But when he was nominated for federal judge, he was turned down. He didnt even get out of committee in the senate. And so getting elected to the senate himself and now attorney general is a way of hip getting some kind of validation, some kind of and theres no way he is going to let his reputation go down the tubes in order to bail out donald trump. To that point, senator boxer, this is the sessions response. Id like your response to it. Usually he shrugs this off. He gets a lot of abuse. Reporting today the president calls him mr. Mcgeough. Complains about him, hates the fact he removed himself from the russia inquiry. He wants him gone. His response today we have initiated the appropriate process that will ensure complaints against this department will be fully and fairly acted upon as necessary. As long as im attorney general ill continue to discharge my duties with honor. That sounds like step off, mr. President. Uhhuh. I have to say this whole thing is unbelievable. I dont know if mickey can remember back, i dont remember anytime that a president turned on his attorney general that he hand picked. That was his first supporter in the United States senate. Its extraordinary and i guess its kind of a new version of youre fired, the apprentice. Is he trying to force sessions out. He doesnt want to say the words, youre fired, because that could set him up for obstruction of justice. Right. Because as we know, sessions is recused from russia investigation. And if trump puts someone else in there and fires mueller, katy, bar the door. This thing is a nightmare. I never agreed with Jeff Sessions. We bed together for a long time in the senate. We were going toe to toe against each other on womens rights, gay rights, immigrants rights. I have to applaud him for staying in there and hanging in there. If youre watching, jeff, stay in there. He watches every night. Im sure he does. But barbara, its also true that i think Donald Trumps picking a fight with the wrong guy because. Right. This is something that Jeff Sessions has wanted all the time. He supports trump because of policy agreements. Because jeff is a conservative. But he is not going to let himself go down in history as somebody who became attorney general and blocked a legitimate investigation. Hes just not going to let that happen. To that point, mickey, you raise the idea that this has a way of essentially stiffening the resolve of sessions. If you keep doing this in public, people have some sense of dignity and honor. Besieged sessions dines with rosenstein in show of solidarity. Senator boxer, it seems it me like thats him basically saying i will not wilt under your pressure. You know. Let me say yes. I totally agree with that. I was just going to say, i totally agree. I mean, mickeys right on point that Jeff Sessions always worried about the fact that he once got turned down for judge. Hes been trying to make up for it ever since. And now, even though trump agrees with every single thought i think that Jeff Sessions has, its all about russia. And everything keeps coming back to russia. And hes furious, trump is, at Jeff Sessions for recusing himself which was the honorable and correct thing to do. Yeah. Let me just add quickly, most president s bring into the white house with them people who are competent and they say who can i bring in here who can do the job. What trump looks for is who can i bring in who will be loyal to me. Thats totally different way of looking at it. Robert mueller is investigating obstruction. The president babing this way publicly is not helping. Whatever if youre conceding about is this an individual capable of attempting to obstruct justice, this is obvious and public. I imagine his lawyers are not happy with him. Mickey and barbara, thank you. Thank you, chris. Still ahead, you should not fall for the president S Performance today if you can call it that actually. Its one hes tried to use before. Plus, tonights thing 1, thing 2 starts next. Job from any one else. Why accept it from your allergy pills . Flonase relieves your worst symptoms including nasal congestion, which most pills dont. Flonase helps block 6 key inflammatory substances. Most pills only block one. Flonase. Were all under one roof now. Congratulations. Thank you. How many kids . My two. His three. Along with two dogs and jake, our new parrot. That is quite the family. Quite a lot of colleges to pay for though. A lot of colleges. You get any Financial Advice . Yeah, but im pretty sure its the same plan they sold me before. Well your situations totally changed now. Right, right. How bout a plan that works for 5 kids, 2 dogs and jake over here . That would be great. That would be great. That okay with you, jake . 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Spokesperson said he didnt know the table had been purchased but doesnt believe the cost was too steep and does not intend to return it. That last line is funny. Last late night, guardian reporting hud has agreed to spend 165,000 on and again i quote, lounge furniture for its washington head quaers which ive been to and dont recall a lot of lounges in. Just as a reminder, carson is the guy who warned last year, dont make housing for the poor too cozy. Interesting advice. The Trump Administration is trying to cut nearly 7 billion from huds budget that would directly affect poor and homeless americans. Laishly spending it government money on lounge furniture doesnt look great for ben carson. He did not try to pull pilots from fighting wildfires just so he could fly charter. The secretary who allegedly did that is thing 2 in 60 seconds. Prevagen is the number one selling brainhealth supplement in drug stores nationwide. Prevagen. The name to remember. 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It appears there were other requests that went unfull illed. An internal email says were having trouble getting two pilots. Were still waiting to hear from one more vendor. Please let me know if were willing to proceed with the flights if there is only one pilot. Why did i want a crest 3d white smile . Dinner date. Meeting his parents dinner date. So i used crest. Crest 3d white removes. 95 of surface stains in just 3 days. For a whiter smile. That will win them over. Crest. Healthy, beautiful smiles for life. You can do it. We can do this. At fidelity, our online planning tools are clear and straightforward so you can plan for retirement while saving for the things you want to do today. Whoo even more breaking news tonight for this already scandal plagued white house just today, okay . While weve been on air, the New York Times just published a story moments ago that the company of a private equity billionaire who met on multiple occasions with Jared Kushner at the white house and discussed a possible job at the white house ended up lending millions to kushners family real estate firm. Joining me now asawin suebsaeng, gabe sherman, and gabe, youve been reporting on kushner. This story is not your reporting. Youve got someone ming with kushner about infrastructure plans, maybe a white house job and his firm lending kushner 184 million. Triple the size of their average real estate loan to a Real Estate Holdings that are very cash strapped and desperately seeking creditors. Exactly right, chris. This is the story that raises all of the questions that people were asking when Jared Kushner went into the white house which is how does he separate himself out from his real estate empire that is facing had cash calls on its crown jewel 666 fifth avenue. Kushner said hes divested himself from his Family Business and yet, hes taking meetings with these investors. As the times reporting, is then receiving his family is receiving hundreds of millions of loans from the very people kushner met with. Even if he as his lawyer and spokesman have said did not discuss business or his Real Estate Holdings with these individuals, the fact they are giving his family money is a direct conflict of interest even on the appearance of its face. Asawin, jared lost his security clearance. New york sent comprehensive inquiries to banks about their relationship with kushner and his finances. Youve got a kind of war brewing between him and kelly. What is going on for him right now . He seems in danger to me. Well, something to take note is whether he i was talking to senior trump aides a few months ago and over the summer and on about Jared Kushners increasingly precarious situation, several of them would jokingly refer to kushner with terms such as and i quote, a made man. Meaning that as much as things may seem precarious for him in the west wing or outside of it, that because of his relationship with donald trump because hes his soninlaw and married to ivanka, that he was essentially untouchable. And that there was seemingly no bottom to the floor of what he could get away with. Now, when we try getting senior officials in the Trump White House to defend him even off the record, the number of people willing to do that again even completely off the record seems to be dwindling rapidly. I am not saying that that means kushner is short for this world in trump world or the west wing. What i and saying is that people increasingly seem unwilling or not wanting to have his back. Well, and heres part of the problem, right, natasha . This is the problem with having a special counsel investigating you in a general sense which is you know, in a normal world like this is scandalous and maybe looks bad, maybe theres a House Oversight. But we know that Robert Mueller is asking questions about investments that happened overseas or courting investors overseas. Youve got to imagine anything like this is crossing their desk, as well. This shows a very, very problematic its a problematic sign. We dont know if it extended to more than just this one incident. We know jared with the 666 fifth Avenue Property that gabe mentioned was trying to get investors for that property even before he entered the white house. During the transition period, he was frantically looking for people to salvage this building that he had on fifth av. One of those meetings he held wuss with the sanctioned russian ceo, the ceo of a sanctioned russian bank ho says he met with as part of a Transition Team effort as a diplomatic kind of channel but who the bank ceo said it was au matter of business. Right. Then he met with chinese investors and there was going to be a big investment by a chinese insurance company. Theres a lot of questions now that we know that kushner has been actually received a big loan from one of these companies that whether or not he actually did the same or not or courted Foreign Investors on purpose. Heres what weve got. Weve got the soninlaw of the president of the United States wholly unqualified in any tangible sense for any of his for the folio who is incanable of passing an fbi background check according to reporter whose family empire is desperately looking for creditors around the world freelancing meetings with interested parties domestically and foreign who are possibly looking to extract leverage out of loans to him, gabe. Yeah. Thats a bad scene. Its on its face just the case that you laid out. Its devastating. One thing we should point out is chief of staff john kelly as effectively maneuvered Jared Kushner out of a job by rescinding his access to classified intelligence because of, as you just mentioned his lack of a permanent security clearance. Its unclear to me since i cover this white house and others what exactly Jared Kushner does all day because he cant run point on the mideast Peace Process as was part part of his portfolio. Cant be a direct line to cheyne because all of that work relies on classified information and even his relationship with mexico and him being another channel between the Trump White House and the Mexican Government to me is unclear because of the intelligence question. So i think the white house needs to answer in a way what exactly is Jared Kushners job. Asawin there has to be public reckoning with whats going on with him. Someone should say something. To gabes point, whats his job and what he is qualified to do. They should probably clear up all this stuff whether hes trading announce for loans. Im going to make a bold prediction. Be bold. I dont think that Jared Kushner even before all of this had investment scandal was going to solve peace in the middle east or bring peace to the middle east. I dont think those that was in the cards for him or this administration. But the funny thing, a lot of stuff that he is working on nowadays that he can work on without that top security clearance is kind of reduced to sort of b copy Trump Administration fodder, pet projects such as criminal justice and Prison Reform which actually do not have that much momentum in this administration and certainly republicans on capitol hill dont have much appetite for it. So as his portfolio shrinks and starts getting smaller, youll start hearing about him working on more b team stuff liking that. To that point about Prison Reform, he was on the hill yesterday on Prison Reform. I thought thats funny. Then i remembered well in the shakespearean sense, Jared Kushner inherited a real estate empire from his father who went to prison who was prosecuted by chris christie, part of this amazing plot twist. He has seen intimately up close what it is to be on the other side of a prosecutor coming at you and i just wonder what is the inner life of Jared Kushner like right now. I mean, the amount of confidence that he must have had to enter into the white house and be at the same time kind of seeking out Foreign Investors for his manhattan real estate project is really something else. I mean, i dont think that he ever expected necessarily to be under criminal investigation. But now that he is, this is obviously something that mueller is going to be looking very closely at. And people in that world must not be very confident about or according to my conversations anyway, theyre not very confident about Jared Kushner getting off kind of squeaky clean after this probe ends. They say theres a lot of exposure he has in terms of possible Money Laundering charges and. Yes. Just. I think. Improper activity. Hes incredibly exposed. Thank you all for joining me. Thank you. Next, just like his meeting with lawmakers on daca, today President Trump put on a gun show at the white house. Well talk to one of the lawmakers who was in the room. 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My job is to help educate our First Responders on how to deal with natural gas and electric emergencies. Everyday when we go to work we want everyone to work safely and come home safely. I live right here in auburn, i absolutely love this community. Once i moved here i didnt want to live anywhere else. I love that people in this community are willing to come together to make a difference for other peoples lives. Together, were building a better california. Were determined to turn our grief into action. I really believe that. I think that the people at this table want it. I mean, i see some folks that dont say nice things about me, and thats okay. Because, if you turn that into this energy, ill love you. I dont care. Were going to be able to do it. And i think were going to have a vote. I think its going to be a very successful vote, and i will sign it. President trump meeting with lawmakers today, promising to love them. A meeting on possible gun control measures, and what he said seems familiar, its because the president sounded equally willing to compromise on daca and immigration just last month. When this group comes back, hopefully with an agreement, this group and others from the senate, from the house, comes back with an agreement, im signing it. I mean, i will be signing it. Im not going to say oh, gee, i want this, i want that, hell be signing it. Congressman Elizabeth Epstein represents the district with sandy hook elementary. Starting with that clip, the president says bring me a daca bill, im going to seen it. He was brought two, with bipartisan support and rejected them both. Why is that a preamble . I tell you, i represent newtown, didnt. I got elected and less than six weeks later, six and seven year olds were shot in their classroom, and im never going to give up. And i dont have to like or dislike the president to know what my job is, and my job is to get something done for the people of america. Might he blow up a deal . Absolutely, he might. But if we have a chance to get something done, we have to do that. Respectfully, congress mawom this really feels like lucy and the football. Ive watched him do the same thing and do the opposite. Is there any sense that anything he says there is going to be an actual accountable promise thats going to have any legislative effect . Well, there are really two choices. It has a legislative effect, or its going to have an electoral effect. Were going to hold him to account, you know. He made a lot of promises today. He said he was going to stand up to the nra. He said he was going to support comprehensive background checks. He said hed support bills like mine to deal with extreme risk, to take guns out of the hands of people who are desperate lay in need of being separated from their guns because they might hurt themselves or someone else. He said he would support cdc funding, a bunch of stuff weve been fighting for. Obviously, the proof is going to be in the pudding. But if he doesnt, if he doesnt, you have a bunch of students in parkland and across america who are looking, and you know what . Walmart is paying attention. Dicks is paying attention. So is united and delta. They understand they are talking about the next generation, they are angry. They want the action, and the time for action is now. He basically, as you said, essentially endorsed what sound like a democrat being package, more or less. What was the reaction, what was it like in the room . There was some pretty stunned faces around the room. I have to say, steve scalise, the majority whip, was stunned. And so were the rest of the republicans, when twice, the president directly rebuffed his, his ask to have, you know, concealed carry reciprocity included. And he said its not going to happen. You dont have the votes. That shouldnt be in the bill. And he said it twice. People are not used to that kind of direct talk, and the president also said directly to several of the republicans, im not afraid of the nra. You shouldnt be either. That is a little different message, and well see if he follows it up with action. You know, talk is cheap. Action is hard. Were going to be fighting hard to get real action. And were agoing to be Holding Everyone to account. All right. The congresswoman was in that room today. Thanks. Thanks, chris. Am i crazy . I understand the congresswomans job, and its her job to go to that meeting and its her job to attempt to turn those words into action, but i just felt sitting, watching the whole thing, which was like compelling episode of apprentice 1600 pennsylvania avenue. This guy will say anything and who knows where well end up. Its the narrative the president wants to tell the country at the time. Less than four hours ago, he was going to run into a school and save a bunch of kids. So i guess hes going to run interference with the nra if the Congress Votes for gun control. He literally said an identical thing about daca. He said i will take the heat. In this open room setting, im the courageous one. Ill stand up to interest groups. Guess what happened after they worked him over behind the scenes. They dont have to work him over behind the scenes. They do it publicly. And he automatically cowers, this is one of the things, i respect the congresswoman for going. I respect people for going, but its not just lucy and the football or pull being away the fishing rod. The man is kind of a pathological liar. And you cant trust anything hes saying. I think hes convinced by the last thing he heard. Im going to play this clip. The counter factual game. If obama had said this. This is an exchange about taking guns away, take a listen. Allow due process, so no ones rights are trampled, but the ability to go to court, obtain an order and collect not only the firearms but any, any weapons in the or take the firearms first and then go to court. Because thats another system, because a lot of times, by the time you go to court, it takes so long to go to court to get the due process procedures, i like taking the guns early, so you could do exactly what youre saying, but take the guns first, go through due process second. I like taking the guns early. Take the guns first, also due process procedures for those playing along at home. Right. Thats not just stomping on the second amendment. Thats burning it, throwing it up in the air and setting a flame to it. Heres the thing, though. I think this is really important. Weve already seen that if obama did a third of the things that trump did he never could have gotten elected, he would have been kicked out of office. For men and women who sincerely want policy solutions on the right and the left, when you have a president who consistently lies or is incapable of remembering what he said yesterday, it makes it difficult for everybody. That is a great point. Its not just that. Even if you take out lying and you just say doesnt actually have positions, this was the whole problem with daca. The white house just said youre not getting a deal, then everyone could have gone on their way. It was never actually clear what the white house wanted that created the confusion that led to that short shutdown. Unless you know what the white house wants you cannot do anything. All the actors in the drama are playing after that. Jason johnson, thank you. Thank you. The Rachel Maddow show starts now. Totally normal day in the news, right . Oh, my word. My heart rate is totally fine. Are you doing, i never ask you this. Youre doing the kushner thing, right . I just threw out my whole a, b, and c block. Its all i mean, give me a break, honestly. The reporter from the kushner thing is physically running into the building right now. Hes not here right now as im start being this. Hes due to arrive while im speaking. Talk about breaking news, its for real. And thank you at home for joining us. Who knows whats going to happen this hour. We are used to this pattern where if its a day that ends in y its a day when massive news breaks literally as were going