couching it? >> yes and. no let's be grateful that all the fancy law professors and susan collins' and people who told us these folks meant roe was precedent when they said that, okay, that artifice is gone. the artifice i worry about -- you played that kavanaugh clip -- is the artifice of saying, let's be neutral. we're not going to ban abortion, kavanaugh, that's not on the table. we're just going to not say there's a right, and that middle place, the neutral place is to let states decide. amy coney barrett insisted because there were safe haven laws, it's not a problem for women to be forced to carry to term, because they can just give their babies up. so i think for me, the artifice of we're being neutral, we're