without the insurrection having happened, lawrence, i think we would be having a different conversation. but it's so clear post january 6th and all the things that have followed we're in precarious place. good to see we have a commander in chief in president biden that understands that our democracy matters and we have to project that to the world and live it every day. >> and we are in a place that's so precarious, that even president barack obama says worry, it is time to worry about this. and i make that point, not because he's not perceptive about all these things, but worry is the last note that barack obama likes to strike. it's just not where he wants to go. he's always telling us to look ahead, look for something positive coming. so it's at point where he's saying we really have to worry about the state of democracy in america. that is a new point.