to push back on process because that issue is gone or on substance, because you kind or caught trump with his hand in the cookie jar in this bribery question. so the reason i think you are seeing people inside the white house come forward and testify. we've had two white house officials come forward and affirm the bribery conspiracy is people are panicking that the evidence is one strong, but, two, the white house has no idea what they are doing in terms of playing an offensive or a defensive strategy here. >> and to your point -- >> and they're nervous about that. >> they don't know edge of where the provable facts are which is where you never want to be when you are making a defense. >> or, ari, they're worried about the edge. >> they're worried about the edge and juanita, free styling on halloween night. my thanks to each of you. up ahead, we have also new ukraine testimony we haven't gone to behind closed doors. we have reports on. donald trump's former top russia aid backing up the quid pro quo bomb still and we will be joined