but we really don't think it's going to help us to be part of the debate, what does that say about where we are and not being able to have these intellectual conversations and platforms where voters can make educated decisions? >> absolutely, and it could have a real impact on the race, right? you have donald trump running in first here, but then you have these other candidates who really see the debate as their biggest opening. in the sense it's their best option to be on stage with him, and to create contrast with him, and to make arguments against him. this was going to be their main opportunity. by not showing up on the debate stage, trump is robbing them potentially should he not show up of that opportunity to make up ground against him, potentially. >> and desantis and trump have sort of been battling it out and debating unofficially if you want to call it debating off camera and off the stage. you have chris christie who has received some accolades for how he's been handling everything so