z zelensky there was that pull aside conversation made and pence didn't know about that, it's an interesting argument pence's folks try to make. because it suggests how much did the vice president know if he was in the room with this guy -- >> yeah, i think there's down sides to be donald trump's vice president. >> i mean, i doubt there are many things happening without them getting approval from the president. i mean, what we've seen is this all comes back to the president. this is not about the vice president. it's not about giuliani. i've heard a lot of stories about all the people surrounding him. i think ultimately it falls back on president trump and what he has directed the people to do around him, which is to violate the constitution, to seek foreign interference, to help his re-election campaign, and again for me it was a clear national security issue. >> you're an american citizen. >> i became an american citizen, yes. >> you have an amazing american