or shot by kyle rittenhouse, took the stand. and under cross-examination, there was this moment. and i want to play it and paul, i want to talk to you about what you see about its potential significance. >> when you were standing three to five feet from him with your arms up in the air, he never fired, right? >> correct. >> it wasn't until you pointed your gun at him, advanced on him, with your gun -- now your hands down pointed at him, that he fired, right? >> correct. >> and observerser saw that as potentially bolstering the case for the defense here. do you think that was a moment that perhaps the jury sort of latched on to? >> 100%. that was a linchpin. and i think you saw it, if you panned the crowd and looked out youb saw the da team lower their head. you saw them, oh, that wasn't a great moment, that was a terrible moment. and let's just be clear. this case was very definitely