who then by in kiven mccarthy's case, the 28th of january, was licking the boot. it wasn't even bending the knee. it was licking the boot to curry favor with the guy who two weeks before they thought was a real threat to the democracy. barbara, we have seen bannon really just flouted it. and he was referred for contempt and is going to be prosecuted. everyone else has kind of played it both ways. med owes was cooperating then wasn't. he has a contempt referral. others pleaded the fifth. others cited privilege, et cetera. it's not like members of congress are going to treat this like nothing if they get a subpoena. >> i think that's right. i think onest things the committee has done well is sort of this public shaming with the six page letter and laying out all of the details about why they want his testimony and why it's so compelling. anybody who reads that i think