essentially flipped from stiff-arming the committee to engaging and to trying to be helpful, and presumably the reason for that is that he doesn't want to get the bannon treatment, he doesn't want to get charged, he's trying to somehow meet the committee in the middle and be helpful, and there's no question that that has the potential to be a substantial breakthrough for investigators. >> all right. betsy woodruff swan. thank you very much. that was illuminating. i want to bring in now barbara mcquade, professor at the university of michigan law school. also served as u.s. attorney for the eastern district of michigan. and on this question of privilege, barbara, i want to read to you the headline that politico wrote. now, we should say, questions during oral arguments don't always correlate to the opinions. but the write-up today, "appeals court judges poised to reject trump's efforts to withhold jan 6 documents." if you listen to the audio it sure sounded like it. how do you sound to you? >> i agree with that, chris.