Transcripts For LINKTV Democracy Now 20140317

The cold war. Thee base our position on fact nobody canceled the right of people to selfdetermination. This is one of the main principles of the United Nations charter. We will speak with Dmitri Trenin, his peace and Foreign Policy is headlined, welcome to the cold war two. A proxy war. This may have started off as a Popular Uprising in syria, but by now, it has four or five different conflicts wrapped into one, and you have an opposition which is fragmented and really proxies for foreign powers, qatar. Saudi arabia we will speak with Patrick Cockburn just back from syria. All of that and more coming up. This is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. Crimea has formally asked to join russia after voters overwhelmingly approved a referendum to secede from ukraine. Crimean Authorities Say 96 point eight percent of voters supported the referendum, but many members of the ethnic ukrainian and muslim tatar minorities stayed home in a boycott. The Obama Administration has threatened sanctions and against against russia if crimea follows through and secede. Crimeas occupation of also sparked a massive opposition protest at home with tens of thousands arching in moscow saturday against military intervention in crimea. It was russias largest opposition rally since 2012. Tension is rising in parts of Eastern Ukraine that is seen a series of prorussian rallies. The Ukrainian Parliament has endorsed a president ial decree for partial military mobilization to call up 40,000 reservists to counter russias military actions. We will have more in the crimea vote in ukraine after headlines. The Syrian Military says it has recaptured the town of yabroud, the last rebel stronghold near the lebanese border. Government forces and lebanese allies from the Group Hezbollah have besieged the town for weeks in an attempt to control key transport routes. Yabroudosition had held for most of the duration of the conflict. A group of syrian americans rallied outside the white house on saturday to mark the threeyear anniversary of the protest that set off the civil war of syria. Gives me a lot of satisfaction. It shows the people in syria that we are here for them, that theyre not by themselves. An estimated 146,000 people have been killed since the conflict began on march 15 2011, roughly half of them civilians. We will have more on syria with independent reporter Patrick Cockburn later in the broadcast. The u. S. Has concerned confirmed a new round of weapons shipment to iraq. U. S. Embassy in baghdad says nearly 100 hellfire missiles and hundreds of thousands of ammunition rounds have been delivered this month. The Obama Administration has accelerated weapons aid in recent months to support the iraqi governments against military groups. This comes amidst wanting to terry and violets set up by the u. S. Invasion in 2003. U. S. Forces have taken control of an oil tanker seized by militants at a libyan port earlier this month. The operation occurred in International Waters southeast of cyprus. The pentagon says no one was hurt. It sparked a political crisis in libya eating parliament to the prime minister. The search continues for Malaysian Airline flight 370 more than a week after its disappearance. Malaysian investigators say they believe someone in the cockpit may have diverted the plane and flown for several hours after deliberate lease wishing off its communication and tracking system. The planes pilots and crew members have been under intense investigation since the plane vanished somewhere north of kuala lumpur. President obama has pledged to modify his enforcement of immigration laws halloween a wave of protests against record deportations. The number of undocumented immigrants since you brought under obamas watch is set to reach 2 million. At a white house meeting on friday, obama told immigration activists he will direct the department of Homeland Security help find an approach that ask more humanely. The changes reportedly include halting deportations for most people never convicted of crimes and focusing on those with criminal records or who are deemed a danger to public safety. Obamas law long maintained his denali can on Immigration Reform within confines of the law and congress will have to bring additional change. The white house apparently changed its mind after a flood of criticism in recent weeks that brought obama the moniker of deporter in chief. Top democrats have also started pressuring obama amidst concerns latino voters will stay home in the coming midterm elections. The Obama Administration has issued new rules that barred discrimination against samesex couples and Health Insurance plans. Starting in 2015, insurers will have to offer coverage to samesex couples that they already provide them for harrell heterosexual couples. A federal judge has struck down in arkansas law ending abortions at 12 weeks of pregnancy. The measure became one of the harshest in the country after its passage last year. In her ruling, the district judge Susan Webber Wright let stand requirement that a woman seeking an abortion first undergo an ultrasound to detect a fetal heartbeat. In a. S. General accused highprofile Sexual Assault case has reached a plea deal at his trial. Military prosecutors have agreed to drop Sexual Assault charges against Brigadier General Jeffrey Sinclair in return for a guilty plea on lesser offenses. The accuser, an army captain, testified sinclair twice forced her to perform oral sex during their threeyear affair in afghanistan, and threatened to murder her and her family if she told anyone. Under his plea, sinclair will admit to mistreatment, but avoid charges that would have forced him to register as a sex offender if convicted. The Obama Administration has announced u. S. Will give up the administering of domain names and web addresses on the internet. The new predatory body will be created to exert formal control. Internet operation will assign names and numbers welcome the move. This is a moment of triumph. This is a moment where it shows it is mature and ready and we no longer need the stewardship of one government. We now need the worlds stewardship to come and ensure that our functions are performed as requested by the global community. U. S. Has faced calls to relinquish its control of internet addresses in the wake of the revelations over extensive nsa spying. Clashes broke out in venezuela on sunday amidst continued antigovernment protests. Now since of demonstrators marched on the Venezuelan Army base to protest what they claim to be cuban interference in venezuelas military. At least 28 people have been killed and over 300 wounded in the last six weeks, marking venezuelas worst violence in 10 years. A group of haitians and their advocates have filed a new classaction lawsuit against the United Nations for the cholera outbreak in haiti that has killed more than 8000 people. The disease strain has been traced to you in peacekeepers from nepal deployed after the january 2010 earthquake. The u. N. Rejected a formal petition for compensating the victims last year. Federal prosecutors in new york recently sided with the uns claim immunity from legal redress. Report hasd nations called for independent probes of a series of drone attacks that have killed civilians around the world. Ben emerson identified 30 drone them by theost of u. S. In which civilians were killed, badly injured, or threatened. They include a u. S. Drone strike on a Wedding Party in yemen that killed as many as 12 civilians in december. While drone strikes in pakistan appear to have declined, strikes in yemen increased insulin casualties tripled in afghanistan last year. Hundreds of farmworkers and their supporters have wrapped up a five state, nineday march in her latest effort to improve conditions in the fields and farms serving major food companies. The coalition of immokalee workers now is the time march focused on urging the food giants publix and wendys to join the immokalee workers fair food program. The march set off from florida, reaching as far north as ohio four returning home for an overnight vigil on saturday outside a publix store in the town of lakeland. And those are some of the headlines. This is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. The United States and the European Union are warning russia not to annex crimea after voters theyre overwhelmingly backed a referendum to leave ukraine and join russia. Crimean authorities said 96. 8 of voters in the black sea peninsula supported the referendum, but many members of the ethnic ukrainian and muslim tatar minorities boycotted the poll. Were today the Crimean Parliament voted in favor of region joining russia. The situation in crimea has sparked the gravest crisis in eastwest relations since the cold war. U. S. Secretary of state john kerry said the vote in crimea will not be recognized by the International Community. The United States position on that referendum, i must say, is clear. We believe the referendum is contrary to the constitution of ukraine, contrary to international law, is in violation of that law, and we believe it is illegitimate. And as the president put it, illegal under the ukrainian constitution. Neither we nor the International Community will recognize the results of this referendum. And we also remain deeply concerned about the large deployments of Russian Forces in crimea and along the eastern border with russia. On the eve of the vote, Russian Forces seized a natural gas terminal in ukraine, just outside crimeas regional border. Minister Sergei Lavrov defended the referendum vote in crimea saying there is a historical precedent for peoples and regions pursuing selfdetermination. As far as statements by our western partners on the acceptability of the referendum, i have already explained our view on the subject. We based our position on the fact nobody canceled the right of people to selfdetermination. This is one of the main principles of the United Nations charter. Tension is rising in other parts of Eastern Ukraine to chas seen a series of prorussian rallies. Earlier today, the Ukrainian Parliament endorsed a president ial decree for partial military mobilization the call up 40,000 reservists to counter russias military actions. It is also unclear what will happen to the Ukrainian Military bases in crimea. They have been surrounded for weeks by Russian Forces. To talk more about the situation in crimea, were joined by Oliver Bullough from crimea, caucuses editor for the institute for war and peace reporting. His book is called, let our fame be great journeys among the defiant people of the caucasus. Is a freelancen journalist who just left crimea. Yes cover the south caucasus since 2009. In moscow, were joined by Dmitri Trenin, director of the carnegie moscow center. He recently published an article in the guardian titled, the crisis in crimea could lead the world into a second cold war. Lets go first to crimea itself. You talk about the vote, what took place, what was the atmosphere and the response right now with this overwhelming vote for secession from ukraine to join russia . About thest thing vote, the result was never in any doubt. The only option essentially on the ballot paper was either you can leave ukraine or join russia. Coastals no no option. Option. Cant believe the turnout was as high considering the fact all of the ukrainians living crimea and together they make up more than 30 of the population what cut at the polls. Can you explain what the question was . What were the questions the choices . There were two choices. One was to join russia and the other was to return to the 1992 constitution. [indiscernible] it was overwhelming 97 in joining russia. They have already passed a series of laws to move to the moscow times on, to adopt the ruble. Theyre not wasting any time in parliament. The mood on the streets is rather subdued. Quite a lot of people have a hangover this morning. What was the atmosphere in crimea during the vote . Out tole were turning the polling stations, casting their vote in a fairly orderly manner. It became obvious as the day went on which way people were going to vote. There was a rock concert and people gathered and waved russian flags and chanted russia, russia, russia. It was a very peculiar atmosphere to the degree of celebration. I found it a little weird as a nonrussian. And those were boycotting, those were voting, the attitude of the russians in crimea and also the press . Ive just been talking to a trainee and later equanimity and they have three mothers. They have their own mother, the motherland, and the virgin mary. Her own mother died last year and she said it felt to her like they took away her own mother and now took away her motherland. She was devastated by what is happening. They are on edge about the prospect of going to russia. Interest in joining russia at all. However, the majority of the population the russians and are very happy about it. Not the least of which they can move onto the russian system of Social Security and social benefits, which means theyre already counting the money. I was in a bank this morning and there was a steady stream of people going to the crash years asking with the new cashier and asking what it would go into effect. Haveitri trenin, you written a number of pieces for different publications. Your piece for foreignpolicy welcome the cold war 2 this is what it will look like. Vote from your perch in moscow. What is the attitude there . The attitude of most people in moscow is that the people of crimea have been able to decide their fate and are joining russia there will be some sacrifice the russian people will have to pay for that, but it is certainly worth having because what has been done is correcting the injustice committed about 70 years ago when crimea was detached from the then soviet russian republic and attached to the been soviet ukrainian public. Attitude, the position of president putin, if you could explain what he sees right now and what the Russian Parliament will do . I think it is quite clear what the Russian Parliament will do. The Russian Parliament is paving the way for crimea to become part of the russian federation. A republic within the russian federation. They started working on that sometime ago. Theyre pretty well advanced. There will be no delay. So i think in terms of the russian constitution, everything will be done quickly so that crimea becomes part of the russian federation. As i said, this is something that is widely supported by the bulk of the russian population. Mr. Putins Approval Rating has already very high last month, about 71 . Creased to so the bulk of the people welcome crimeas reification with russia. This does not mean a lot of people disagree. Hef the intelligence opposition, especially the nonsystemic opposition, those who are not represented under doma, they staged a march in moscow. Not a very numerous one, but a ofonstration of rejection this policy by president clinton. I dont think that coogan plays much attentionoo to that. He sees himself correcting the injustices done at the end of the cold war, the end of the soviet union. He sees himself supported by the russian people and he is wellprepared, i think, to take on his opponents both domestically and internationally. Fromght u. S. Senators after meeting with leaders from ukraine, this is the group leader, senator john mccain. I dont believe there will be a reignition of the cold war, but i do believe it is long overdue that we understand Vladimir Putin for who he is and what he is and what his ambitions are. Stated the person that that the greatest catastrophe of the 20th century was the breakup of the soviet union. This is a person who wants to restore [indiscernible] this is a person that occupies parts of the sovereign nation of an in andhat occupies active, negative aggression. All of us are concerned about recent reports of additional military buildup in this area, so we have to treat him for what he is, and that does not reignite the cold war, but it least we enact steps that make it clear to Vladimir Putin that his ambitions will not be realized by the Great Community of nations that would resist it. That a senator john mccain, just back from ukraine. Dmitri trenin in moscow, your response . I think we can debate what constitutes a cold war with what does not. In my view, situation in which there is more competition and mylaboration would be explanation of what the cold war is. I dont think people will pay much attention. That people here will pay much attention to what the senator has just said. I think they basically see him and so many others as being trying to rush in and hold believeown and i dont this is something new. However, i think the policy of putin will not aim and actually confrontation more than what it will necessarily be. I think putins ambition, if you like, or putins next aim is to help ukraine toward some kind of a federation, some kind of a system in which the southern and eastern portions of that country enjoy a wide degree of linguistic from a cultural commitment autonomy, and that ukraine itself as a country does not join nato or the European Union or become associated with the European Union. Putinsthat is mr. Plan, color goal, but i think that is what he is aiming at. I think that is what people in the United States dont have very informed concept about russias attitude toward the expansion of nato. Could you explain how russia sees what has taken place in the last several years . Let me clarify that. I russia would mean primarily the russian establishment. The russian government, the. Remlin ago,gan about two decades as an attempt or as a project by the victorious powers in the cold war led by the United States to consolidate their wins at the expense of russian security. They saw nato coming closer to russias borders, and they saw their own bids and there have been numerous bids by russia to join nato they saw those bids rejected by essentially the United States. So having no chance to become part of the alliance and having the alliance, which used to be the soviet unions adversary in the cold war, coming closer and closer to russias borders, they certainly became very concerned. I think from the standpoint of mr. Putin and his associates in the kremlin, ukraine is a red line. And anyone who ventured out there, had to be met with some kind of a response which is exactly what happened after the toppling of president yanukovych , who was, you know, someone either with russia more fully with the west. Fully with the west. He was notionally prowestern. And hismr. Putin associates was the West Crossing a red line. And the attitude of the United States, when it came to what took place and yanukovych being pushed out, calling that constitutional, but calling the referendum of crimea unconstitutional . Well, i was a the russians have become used to people at essentially using various standards for the own behavior and for other peoples behavior. A sickly, president putin in his press conference recently intimated he was doing the things the United States was doing. He was placing the legitimate above the legal. If you need something and need it badly, you go for it. It may not be legal, but if it is in your national interest, then you go for it. Libya ore cases of kosovo or iraq, arguably, were less important for the United States National Security interest than the issue of crimea and ukraine is, or was, for mr. Putin at the kremlin. Dmitri trenin Dmitri Trenin were speaking to in moscow and Oliver Bullough in crimea. When we come back, we will also be joined by nicholas clayton, freelance journalist who just came from crimea. Stay with us. [music break] this is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. We continue our discussion about the vote in crimea, the overwhelming referendum vote for secession from ukraine to join russia. Were joined in moscow by Dmitri Trenin, and now we are turning to as well nicholas clayton, who is a freelance journalist just back from crimea and ukraine. He is cover the south caucasus since 2009, contributed a recent piece in usa today called military tension. Youre speaking to us from istanbul. Talk about the new leadership in ukraine, and what the response has been. Appearsew leadership theyre still very much in crisis mode. It is attempting to hold the country together. Many of them were not in the government before yanukovych regime. One of the more controversial things that happened recently and with from her gesture is saying that those advocating secession in other ukrainian territories will be apprehended. Anone hand this is a bit of escalation of rhetoric within ukraine, however, it also represents very much the crisis mentality of the new government. As she mentioned before, there have been an increasing protest in other cities. Where prorussia and proukrainian protest have clashed and three people have died so far. There been accusations traded, but kiev has claimed a large portion or majority of these prorussian protesters are indeed russian citizens that russiaen busased in from and are also tightening the border. It appears theyre trying hard to avoid any other province in ukraine from getting the crimea treatment at this point. On sunday, Prominent Russian state tv host who has close ties to Vladimir Putin warned russia could launch a Nuclear Strike against the United States. The anchor spoke with a picture of a Nuclear Explosion behind radioactives into ashes. Russia is the only country in the world that is really able to turn the United States into radioactive ashes. I dont know if it is a coincidence, but obama called putin and probably again try to put pressure on him. The very next day on january 22, the official newspaper of the government of russia published an article where clearly explain in detail how our system is guaranteed Nuclear Revenge works. I advise you to read the article. That is a russian state tv host who has close ties to Vladimir Putin, speaking on sunday. Nicholas clayton, your response . How heated thews rhetoric has become. Honestly, i think it has to be looked at from two different ways. The whole situation is very much a crisis mode in ukraine politics and also and also the class from the east and the west. I do think many in the west underestimated how strategic ukraine is to russia, in particular crimea. Been since the 18th century. It is probably the best harbor in the black sea and one of the only ones that could safely hold a large fleet. It is a deep harbor, very large, and protected on both sides by hills, which means the wind is not a factor. If russia were to be booted from there, it would have to drastically reduce its size of its fleet and spend billions of dollars attempting to build facilities and one of its other ports to hold it. The Russian Black Sea fleet is the portion of the navy that uses to protect naval force into that only the black sea where it has Significant Interest but also the Mediterranean Sea and the indian ocean, therefore, it is an important part in of their merely strategy and foreignpolicy in those regions. It is what the russians call a steel interest, something that is certainly a redline and something russia had to retreat from. It would very much hurt their foreignpolicy and ability to project power in the world. This is partially why russia moved so quickly in the upper house was many figures in the new government of kiev made statement saying they did not want to basically cancel the lease that russia has for these of the base. The current lease gives russia the right to use that port until 2042, but there is previous governments that had to write had tried to push out russia. Very much has been a huge card in the eastwest battle over ukraine. We saw what happened when the u. S. Military was concerned he was interest were being threatened in the panama canal when the u. S. Invaded panama. Ityou add to this, i mean, is definitely hyperbolic. Theres little to no evidence the russian speakers were threatened physically by the change of government in ukraine. There are more serious fears and a lot of apprehension among russian speakers in that portion of the country absent of this media blitz the russia has been piping out. Use an american analogy, it would be as if the occupy movement regardless of what you think of the occupy movement, but if it had grown in intensity to the point were the two violence that left over 100 people dead including a couple dozen Police Officers and took power in the u. S. , filling up a government with protest leaders and the more liberal wing of the democratic party. Right or wrong, that would automatically force a very strong reaction and a lot of paranoia and the conservative portions of the country. The way ukraine has been isitically divided, this receiving a similar reaction. Ukraine has been politically divided between east and west. Even a lot of russians the did not necessarily fear or have specific fears about their rights, nonetheless, the fact there was an overthrow of the andrnment just a month ago all of the uncertainty that came from that, many in crimea were saying they were looking for some sort of sign up for detection or stability. In crimea, that came in the form of russia. That is why it is important the western powers to understand right or wrong, there are many in ukraine and russia that do not recognize the new Ukrainian Government of kiev is legitimate. While it is important to support the government in the short term to make sure ukraine remained stable, i think it is also important for russia during western countries to understand it did not necessarily represent they ukrainian just like occupy movement was not necessarily supported by constituencies in kansas and utah. And there needs to be a solution and a push for a solution that incorporates interests of both sides anchor new deuce and to reduce the overall tensions in ukraine. Dmitri trenin, the comparison of the u. S. And the west really recognizing kosovo as an compared tonation the response to the referendum in crimea. How is that seen in moscow . I think it is ironic. It is one of those things that the west and russia have traded places. I would say cynics would say this was normal because the error interest to men they do so their interests demand they do so. In kosovo, independence was not of thed with the consent serbian government. It did not have a referendum. And yet it was recognized by most of european countries, by the United States. The russians did not recognize it. But now the russians are using to justifyprecedent their position on crimea. Although it is clear the theent in kiev revolutionary government, should say, does not have an impeccable legal mandate, to put it mildly, it is clear whatever you think for theeferendum russian role in that, the legality of it, the short Order Holding of that referendum, it is clear the advanced majority of the people in crimea welcomed the chance to be reunited with russia. And the west does not recognize the referendum. The west and russia changing places depending on, essentially, their interest. This is a good demonstration of double standard on both sides. As we wrap up, what do you think could diminish the tensions . The u. S. Is pushing for increased sanctions against russia. Lets start with Dmitri Trenin in moscow. I think that will have to go through a period of heightened tensions. The question is, how long this period will be, how deep the sanctions will bite, what kind of response will russia give. I think were standing at the beginning of some pretty turbulent period in international relations. Nicholas clayton . What is difficult to see they would be lifted to get out of it at the stage. What is important as the trust has been undermined by several episodes in this crisis. At this point, russia looks at it like it has gotten what it wants and the western standpoint, they seem to be putting most of their backing behind the government ofkiev, therefore, they dont want to make concessions on that account, either. While a federalist option in some sort of neutral compromise involving autonomy in certain regions would be beneficial to the country potentially, it is difficult to see if both sides have the willingness to come together on that. We will leave it there, nicholas clayton, recently reported from crimea and now in istanbul. I want to thank Dmitri Trenin for joining us, director of the carnegie moscow center. Among his pieces, the crisis in crimea could lead the world into a second cold war. Before that, Oliver Bullough speaking to us from crimea. Now the caucasus editor of institute for war and peace reporting. This is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. We will be back in a moment speaking with Patrick Cockburn on this third anniversary of the syrian conflict. Stay with us. This is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. We turn now to syria, where the conflict between president Bashar Alassad and rebels seeking his ouster has just entered its fourth year. The britainbased syrian observatory for human rights says more than 146,000 people have been killed since the conflict began march 15, 2011. The conflict has displaced more than 9 Million People with 2. 5 million refugees living outside syria, and 6. 5 million displaced within the country. Last week, save the children reported several thousand syrian kids have died because of the drastic reduction in access to health services, losing their lives to disease and conditions including cancer, epilepsy, asthma, diabetes, hypertension, and kidney failure. Overall, at least 10,000 children have died in violence. Last month, the second round of peace talks aimed at resolving the conflict ended in deadlock in geneva. This is you and special envoy Lakhdar Brahimi. And very, very sorry and apologize to the syrian people. Hopes, which were very, very high that something would littlehere, i think the but has been achieved has given them even more hope that maybe this is the beginning of the coming out of the crisis they are in. Apologize to them we have not helped them very much on these rounds. Inu. N. Envoy Lakhdar Brahimi iran for talks with the top or any leaders on the steering conflict. Earlier this month, a United Nations panel said the assad regime is waging a campaign of siege warfare and starvation against hundreds of thousands of syrian civilians. The commission of inquiry said syrians are being denied humanitarian aid, food, and such basic necessities as medical care and must choose between surrender and starvation. The report also fault Syrian Rebels for scores of extradition visual extrajudicial killings. In a key symbolic victory for the assad regime, the town of yabroud, the last rebel stronghold near the lebanese border. Government forces and lebanese allies from the Group Hezbollah have besieged the town for weeks in an attempt to control key transport routes. Yabroud having control by the opposition for much of the last three years. To find out more, were joined by video stream by Patrick Cockburn, middle east correspondent for the independent. His latest piece on serious called, an unhappy anniversary why the end of Bashar Alassad is as far waya as ever and how syrias rebels lost the plot. He was in syria for several weeks last month. Welcome back. Talk about this third anniversary. It is very bad for syria and for the syrians. It is a stalemate somewhat in favor of the government, taking yabroud, taking the Southern Suburbs of damascus by getting stronger, but not so strong theyre going to win. The northeast is held by the opposition, and above all, by the to heidi jihadis. [indiscernible] wares no way i think this can really be seen in doing this year or in the next few years. Your comment on the failure of the peace talks in geneva . Once john kerry said it was going to be about transition and iran was not going to come, theyre going to fail. It is somewhat hypocritical about this in my mind. Doingasically the west is in the original powers like saudi arabia, is asking Bashar Alassad to step down and the regime to and. But the regime holds 13 out of 14 provincial capitals. It holds most of the populated areas. Maturely, and is growing stronger and not weaker. So why should leave our . Although as a pretense this is looking toward peace, the only power is aould leave complete confirmation of the situation and that could only hope and happen after he period of years. What looks like an attempt to make peace, is an ingredient for a long war. Fromeveral representatives humanitarian aid agencies visited lebanon this weekend to mark the third anniversary of the syrian conflict. Again, over 145,000 people have been killed, millions forced to leave their homes since 2011. Speaking of beirut, the uns high commissioner for refugees called for border restrictions to be relaxed to allow those most at risk to flee to safety. For all orders to be open to syrians and the children. To see syrian children drowning today after fleeing the conflict of syria is something totally unacceptable. Borders need to be open everywhere. The uns high commissioner for refugees also urged the International Community to respond to the crisis. Knowing that 9 Million People refugeesaced between and the displaced, the largest population displaced in the world today is something that really should deserve a much stronger commitment of International Community to stop this war, first of all, and to mobilize resources for effective assistance to the syrian victims and solidarity with countries like lebanon. , can youk cockburn talk about that in the report, for example, from the u. N. Penalty assad is waging campaign of siege warfare and starvation against hundreds of thousands of civilians . Siegess waging a war of and ceiling all barriers and so forth, but also have to bear in mind, the opposition of the rebels were doing the same thing where they could. Theyre surrounded, besieged, and starved. You have to look at this look at both sides. This is a genuine civil war. All of these atrocious wonttarian situations stop until the end of the war. Over northern iraq, the to hotties have taken over now. Jihadis have taken over now. [indiscernible] this is held by jihadis, similar to al qaeda. While that remains out of control, it is a contribute in fact to the war going on and off. I figure west capitals, they tend to underestimate what has happened in missouri large area in this very large area. The jihadis have taken over. You mention iraq. In the headlines today, we talked about the u. S. Confirming a new round of weapon shipments to iraq, u. S. Embassy in baghdad says barely 100 hellfire missiles and hundreds of thousands of ammunition rounds have been delivered. The Obama Administration accelerating weapons aid to support the iraqi governments campaign. Theyou talk about connections between iraq and syria and the significance of this . Outthink the significance of this is basically it is insignificant. The administration trying to show it is doing something but i think 100 hellfire missiles and some ammunition [indiscernible] it could get it elsewhere if it wanted to. It underestimates the size of [indiscernible] qaeda taking over in sunni areas. [indiscernible] the christians have fled. This is a genuine civil war. And just looking for the humanitarian situation to improve isnt enough. Turks left open the border of which the jihadi and al qaeda organizations have been moving freely. That probably needs to be shut. And an approach to peace. And on the issue of chemical weapons, what is happening with the chemical weapons been removed from syria . Well, they are removing them. It is not easy to do. The loads are susceptible to attack. You mentioned yabroud earlier, to just be taken by the syrian army. But you can see that from the main road. Just to move chemical weapons up and down roads when there is fighting, maybe half a mile away. It is not too surprising it is delayed. But i cant really imagine the government of damascus [indiscernible] 03 17 14 03 17 14 patrckburn, thank you for being with us, middle east correspondent for the independent. We will have a link to your piece including your last, an unhappy anniversary why the end of Bashar Alassad is as far away as ever and how syrias rebels lost the plot. As we turn now to our last segment come the latest on leaks from edward snowden, and intercept. Org reported last week the National Security agency has traumatic week expanding its ability to covertly hack into computers on a mass scale are using Automated Systems that reduce the level of human oversight in the process. Intercept revealed the nsa has masqueraded as a fake facebook server to infect a targets computer and exfiltrate files from a hard drive. Joining us now is Ryan Gallagher. The story we wrote last week, the key thing about it is the extent to which [indiscernible] to basically steal data from the systems. About 10 years ago, they heard between 100 130. Within the last decade, that has expanded to an estimated 100,000 and some reports, and building a system to be capable of deploying millions to work in these empires. The revelation around the issue of facebook has led facebook founder mark seco berg to call president obama on wednesday in demand an explanation. He later wrote in a blog post Mark Zuckerberg was very agitated about the report and seems to have gotten on the horn about it. Interestingly, the nsa issued a claim they had not [indiscernible] own of documents a they pretended to be facebook. Their denial really doesnt hold up scrutiny when compared with their own documents. There are questions to be asked about that. So how do people protect themselves . If youre mean, really in the nsass hearers, nsas crosshairs, it is difficult. There are methods people can use to reduce the level of risk. For instance, using Encryption Technology and guard against all kinds of surveillance and using certain kinds of operating systems like the lennox system can limit their ability to target you. Problem, using these technologies to circumvent. That is what people are worried. That poses the fundamental question for the security of the internet. Is this legal, Ryan Gallagher . That is a really good question. Ist is completely unclear the level of oversight in the Legal Framework that underpins these techniques. When youre deploying methods like this against 100, 130 people maybe 10 years ago, that is pretty easy to manage. But they have deliberately expanded this technique by making them automated so theres less human oversight, so it is completely unclear to what the malware is being overseen, the legal from work that operate in. To comment. Declined these are vital questions that should be asked. And the nsas response to your report . Most of the recent reports, thereve been putting out a boilerplate statement that says they adhere to the law and that they only collect intelligence for legitimate purposes. But the statements are very, very vague. Theyre open to anyones interpretation of what they actually mean. I think what we really need is some clear answers and more transparency on a lot of the revelations that weve been reporting in the last couple of weeks. Ryan gallagher, thank you for being with us. We will have a link to her pieces that the intercept coming up on California Country think this sweet treat just cant get any better . Think again. Oh, my its ready. Its ready . Its ready. Then find out why this meal was 52 weeks in the making. I would like you to know that this morning at the farmers market, we purchased everything that youre gonna have for dinner tonight. Next, learn the hidden ranching roots behind hearst castle. 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