Transcripts For KYW Face The Nation 20161204

Reporters give us their views on the week and whats to come. Its all ahead on face the nation. Good morning and welcome to face the nation. Im john dickerson. President elect donald trump maid some key hires this week and shocked some members of the Foreign Policy establishment. We begin this morning with the new white house chief of staff, Reince Priebus, who joins us from the rnc headquarters in washington. Let me ask you about the secretary of state pick. Whats happening with that now . Well, theres going to be an announcement this week, and obviously we know its going to be general mattis and what a hero, someone that i think all americans can look to and say, were going to be in great hands with this person that i think all americans look up to, one of the most decorated marines of our generation and someone who has a strategic mind, someone thats going to lead our Defense Department and someone thats going to clean up the Defense Department and help president elect trump shape his Foreign Policy. Dickerson but what about the secretary of state job . Well, thats a different story. Things are moving quickly. I dont think anyone can accuse president elect trump of not moving fast. We are. Great picks people are seeing, a very smooth transition, but that one is just taking a little bit longer, and i think its just fine. Everything doesnt have to happen all at once. Hes taking his time, making a smart decision, and well see where that goes. Dickerson Kellyanne Conway said there would be a grassroots revolt if donald trump picked mitt romney. Do you agree with that . Look, i think governor romney is very talented. I think what really we should look at is we have a president here in donald trump that wants to look at the best and brightest of america, regardless of background, regardless of past disputes that we may have had with each other, that that is the past. Thats the rearview mirror. We want the look through the front windshield. Thats what hes doing by talking to all of these different people. I think that the folks out there across the country, and i think they, are should be encouraged by a president that really wants to build trust and sort of in the team of rivals concept is something that i think is a good thing for america. But thats where Donald Trumps mind is at. Thats where his heart is at. Thats a great thing for this country. Dickerson team of rivals, the title of doris kerns goodwins book about the lincoln presidency. Lets talk about Donald Trumps style. Theres a school of thought that says hes most influenced by the person he talked to last. Do you agree with that . No, i dont. I think hes someone who likes to listen to lots of different opinion, lots of people, lots of smart people. Hell talk to a lot of folks and say, what do you think about this option . Thats a good thing. But in the end, once he form late his opinion, once he decides, this is where were going to go, he pulls the trigger and he moves. And thats why you see a lot of these cabinet picks, they happen quickly, but what you dont see is that there are days and days and days of deliberation and communication and conversations that take place before those decisions are made. All great qualities in leading our country. Dickerson you say he likes to take in a lot of information. He has not taken in as many Intelligence Briefings as previous president elects. Why is that . But he is. You know, they have daily briefings now. Dickerson is he getting them every day . Its about every day. Its happening quite frequently, john. I think those are just going to ramp up as we get closer to january 20th. But he certainly is informed. Hes getting briefed. And it feels like every day. Im not sure if it is every day. But its a lot. And thats who he is. Its someone who studies and someone who wants to be informed and its someone who asks a lot of questions and listens. Dickerson is he a details guy . He is a details guy. You know, he is. Hes a socratic method guy. It reminds me of being back in law school. He asks a lot of questions. He asks questions about questions. And he will keep going until he is satisfied with the information that hes getting. Dickerson let me ask you, as the incoming chief of staff, what do you do when he says Something Like millions of voters voted illegally in california when you know thats not true . Well, i dont know if thats in the true, john. I saw there was an article in the wall street journal the other day, and it had a certain percentage of people that are voting that shouldnt be voting. There are estimates all over the map on that. Heres the problem. No one really knows. Dickerson but you think millions of people voted illegally . Its possible. Dickerson there is no evidence that it happened in millions of votes in california. I guess is question is when youre president , can you just offer a theory that has no evidence behind it, or does he have to tighten up his standard of proof . I think hes done a great job. I think the president elect is someone who has pushed the envelope and caused people to think in this country. Hes not ticking taking conventional thought on every single issue. Its caused people to look at things that maybe theyve taken for granted. Look at the flagburning issue last week. This is an 80 issue. You watch the news media and they say its constitutional. Well, right, it is constitutional, but it doesnt mean its in the a subject for debate and discussion for the Supreme Court to revisit down the road. So i think he. I think that unconventional thought is something that has caused a revolution in this country, which is why i think President Trump will go down in history as a really great president. Dickerson in the brief time i have left, the president elect had a conversation with the president of taiwan. Did he believe he was talking to the leader of a sovereign state in that conversation . No, of course not. He knew exactly what was happening, but look, we have a lot of problems to solve in this country, and were not going to solve them by just making believe that people dont exist. This was a twominute congratulatory call. He talked to president shi over two weeks ago. Im sure hed be willing to talk to him again. This is not a massive deviation of our policy. But President Trump has made it clear that hes going to work with china, prc, to make sure that we have a better deal, that we have better trade agreements, and that we do a better job in protecting the american worker. Hes going to continue to do it. Dickerson so courtesy call, not a change in policy . Exactly. Dickerson all right. Reince priebus, the incoming chief of staff, thanks so much for being with us. You bet. Dickerson last week scott pelley spent some time with Speaker Paul Ryan for tonights 60 minutes. Ryan, whose relationship with donald trump during the campaign was rocky at best, told scott he talks with the president elect nearly every day and that hes confident the two will work well together. Were fine. Were in the looking back. Were looking forward. We actually. Like i said, we speak about every day. Its not about looking back in the past. Thats behind us. Were way beyond that. Now were talking about how do we fix this countrys problems, how do we hit the ground running. Thats what im excited about. What im excited about in my virtually daily conversations with donald trump, its all about how are we going to get things done, what goes first, whats the schedule, how do we get this con, how can we help people here . Its really exciting to see for a long time weve been trying to get unified republican government. We here in congress spent all of 2015 getting ready and preparing for the possible opportunity of a unified republican government. Now we have it, and its very exciting. And those are the kinds of conversations we have on a virtually daily basis. Pelley im curious, how did you patch it up . Who apologized to how . How did that conversation go . We were fine. Basically two days after the election, we said, lets let bygones by bygones. Ever since then weved had nothing but extremely productive conversation. Dickerson for more of Scott Pelleys interview with Speaker Paul Ryan, tune into 60 minutes tonight at 7 00 p. M. Eastern. Joining us now is Newt Gingrich. Mr. Speaker, john kennedy said when he got into the white house, i wish i spent less time getting to know people who helped me get elected and more time with people who would help me be president. Do you think donald trump is learning that . I think if john f. Kennedy spent more time trying to be present, he wouldnt be president. Dickerson first things first. First things first. Trump pulled off one of the most amazing achievements in American History. The only person not to have been a military officer or public elected official. Only person in American History to win the american presidency. Dickerson so having been a public figure. General grant, general washington, general. Dickerson you said donald trump was saying its a bigger job than he thought. What does that mean . I think that particularly when he went to the white house and he was in the oval office, he was beginning to realize that under our system, the full weight of National Security is on one shoulder. Its not 50 people. Its the president. Commanderinchief. The degree to which people around the country, much as what you saw with saving 1,100 jobs at carrier, the degree to which people around the country look to the president to try to make their lives better, i think you realize its like the old story, the doing that caught the bus, and i said, no, this is like the dog that caught a convoy. There are so many ramifications if you take, as he does, trying to truly move america into a different direction, then it is remarkably important job and one that means hes got to build a real team, he cant possibly this it by himself. Hes showing that he understands that. Andy dickerson you mentis all on one shoulder. That why it seems odd hes not starving for intelligence information, every day, wants the daily brief. I once had secretary reuben say to me as secretary of the treasury that during the financial crisis in indonesia he got more out of the Financial Times each morning than out of the c. I. A. And that he just thought, you know, you have to be realistic. I have no idea what the current Intelligence Briefings are like and im not denigrating them, but if you took the total number of foreign leaders that president elect trump has talked to in the last couple weeks, hes clearly engaged in the world. Hes clearly getting advice from a wide range of leaders, from abe in japan, from merkel. At the same time, hes got several people he trusts. Im assuming that flynn and mcfarland are, in fact, taking the briefings, and if they see something they think he needs to know, they come tell him. Dickerson you talked about the team around him, incoming chief of staff Reince Priebus talked about the team of rivals, making the case for mitt romney. You are not making the case for mitt romney. Why isnt that a good team of rivals . First of all, nobody in the lincoln cabinet actively opposed his election up to election day. They were rivals until he got the nomination. And then they were all for him. So theres a. Romney doesnt quite fit that pattern. But second, im very comfortable if, given the amount of time hes put into this, if president elect trump says, i want romney, im for romney. He has spent more than enough time talking with with mitt, and he accepted the call from taiwan, inmitt will understand trump is his own leader in important policy, and hes looking for somebody to be his secretary of states, not the state departments. If he concludes romney can do the job best, im for romney. What im impressed with is the patient way hes gone about this. He didnt jump in for romney. He didnt jump in against him. He hasnt jumped in for julian giuliani. And i can say, as trust as ive been in public, very aggressive deliberately about mitt, i have gotten no blowback from anybody, including reince. Theres a sense of youre allowed to have your own opinion. This is like the apprentice. When you get to the decision, lets all be on the same team, but until that opinion is made, lets have an opinion. Dickerson the tv, whats more important, something you tell him in person or something on tv . Something you tell him on tv. On occasion it helps to say that on tv. Dickerson it seems like some people, Kellyanne Conway, are sending him messages through tv or maybe weve got that wrong. Dickerson youre also communicating to the millions and millions of people. Ive been out doing book signings. People walk up to us routinely and say, i dont want mitt. Well, those people deserve to know there is a substantial positive part of the trump operation that hears their concerns. That doesnt mean that in the end they shouldnt be for the president elect when he makes a if he makes a decision for romney. But they deserve to know there are people hearing them. Dickerson on the carrier action donald trump said, wouldnt republicans traditionally say hes meddling in the free mar scet . First of all, hes picking winners among americans. Its a very simple model. 1,100 families are going to have a better christmas, and all of the people around them are going to have a better christmas, the local dry cleaner, the local Grocery Store are all going to have a better christmas. Now, you can ask the question should the president elect i think its amazing he did this before he got sworn in should the president elect pick up the phone and call the c. E. O. And say, you know, we want the change things. Give us a shot here. Let us try to fix this. Dickerson the company now says i can get seven million in tax brakes if i say i can go. 50 fofs worked overtime to get companies to stay in their stay says. May in the new world economy, the president should behave like a governor, im competing with mexico and china and germany. I want that factory here. What do i have to do to keep that factory here . Dickerson Newt Gingrich, thank you for joining us. Well be back with one of the Top Democrats in the house, nancy pelosi. Stay with us. Yeah. Everybody two seconds dear sebastian,atioof your application, it is with great pleasure that we offer our congratulations on your acceptance. Through the Tuition Assistance program, every day mcdonalds helps more people go to college. Its part of our commitment to being americas best first job. You may sometimes suffer from a dry mouth. Thats why theres biotene. And biotene also comes in a handy spray. So you can moisturize your mouth anytime, anywhere. Biotene, for people who suffer from dry mouth symptoms. Dickerson and were back with House Democratic leader nancy pelosi. Welcome, leader pelosi. Good morning. Dickerson what is it going to be like with donald trump as president . How are the democrats going to react . Well, first of all, we respect the office he holds and the people who elected him to the office. We will engage with where we can, and we will oppose where we cannot. A good example is how we worked with president george w. Bush when he was president. We opposed him on privatizing social security, the war in iraq, but we worked with him on many, many other issues, including one of the Biggest Energy bills in history, issues that related to tax breaks for lowincome people, the list goes on and on. Dickerson what are some areas where you think you might be able to work with him . Hopefully we can work with him on building the infrastructure of america in a way that increases the paychecks of american workers, that wont be a cooperation if, in fact, its just a tax break for the wealthy disguised as an infrastructure bill, but lets hope for the best. Everything he has said i think is promising about how we can go forward. We can work with him on issues that relate to childcare, Early Childhood education. The rest he has said that would be important and weve had a conversation about that. I want to ask you about Early Childhood. I heard a report that he talked to his daughter you were talking to him and he handed the phone to his daughter. Yes, he did. I took that as its a high priority for him. Dickerson what do you think that the kids are out of the administration and the business. Im not going to go to that place. I would like to say where we wont work with him is on privatization of medicare and private diswaition of the v. A. I think its really important for the American People to know that central to the ryan budget, speaker ryan budget is our voucherrizing of medicare. This would be a tremendous loss, taking away the guarantee of medicare. In addition, over ten years in that bullet, it takes a trillion dollars out of medicaid, twothirds of which drove forth longterm health care for seniors. So seniors have a lot to lose and what the republicans are proposing. Its interesting to see if President Trump will go along with that. Dickerson what about obamacare, why wouldnt that be an initial big fight democrats. Well, it would be a big fight, and seniors should know how it affects them because we extended the solvency of medicare in that. We gave three checkups, all of that closed the doughnut hole which increased prescription drugs to seniors. So seniors have a lot to lose, both in the voucherrizing of medicare, cutting of medicaid and what it wants to do for the Affordable Care act . Dickerson the Democratic Party is in a moment of questioning about its identity. You were reelected to lead the democrats in the house. What do you tell democrats who want a new direction and what are you going to do differently . I dont think people want a new direction. Our values unify us and our values are about supporting americas working families. Thats one that everyone is in agreement on. What we want is a better connection of our message to working families in our country, and that clearly in the election showed that that message wasnt coming through. But we are united in terms of the security of our country, which is our first responsibility. To be smart and strong and not reckless in how we protect the American People, strong in how we protect our economy. Dickerson heres my question, though, democrats since 2008, the numbers are ghastly for democrats. Democrats are down 10 , in the house down 19. 3 and in governors 35 . The democrats are getting clobbered at every level over multiple elections. That seems like a real crisis for the party . Youre forgetting that we went up so high in 2006 and 2008, and let me just put that in perspective. When president clinton was elected, republicans came in big in the next election. When president bush was president , we came in big in the next election. When president obama became president , the republicans came in big in the next election. Dickerson i guess me question is the republicans reacted to their losses with a big revolution and a change. They have a very new president at the top of their party now. You have somebody like agricultural secretary tom vilsack saying the Democratic Party is like a tree that looks healthy on the outside but is in the throes of a slow and longterm demise. I have enormous respect for the secretary, but im more optimistic about the strength of the Democratic Party, and what i would say, because you talked about these numbers, some reasons to be hopeful, because its necessary, because this is about policy, its not about politics. Its about politics for some, but for us its about protecting medicare, social security, good. Paying jobs, americas workers, protecting a womans right to choose, issues that unify us. But let me just say this any time that a president ial. The change in president from one party to the next, the states receive an infusion of talent. President obama going out of the office sadly not having come in, but those democrats will come back. Run for government, run for state legislatures and the rest. And we will build up the numbers that youre talking about there. Dickerson all right. We have to leave it there. Thank you. Upward and onward. Upward and onward. Dickerson thank you. Well be right back. Thank you. 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Com experts dickerson we sat down with former defense secretary leon panetta just hours before president elect trump announced that retired marine general james mattis was his pick to head the pentagon. In order for mattis to serve, Congress Must change a law that States Military officials must be out of the service for seven years prior to taking control of the pentagon. Mattis, who headed up central command, retired three and a half years ago. Explain for people why the civilian control of the military is a tradition and why having a general is a good or a bad thing or just what kinds of things people should be thinking about. Well, you know, it goes back to George Washington. There is a great portrait up at the capital of George Washington giving up his commission in the military in order to become president of the United States, which i think was a reflection of the fact that its important to have civilian leadership and civilian perspective when it comes to those issues. It doesnt mean you cant have a military background. That is important to have that background, but at the same time, in those jobs, you have to exercise the ability to understand political issues, to deal with broader issues that involve your capability the relate to the American People. So, yes, having a Strong Defense background is important, but its also important to be able to have that ability to understand the civilian side of that job, because both are involved. Dickerson you worked with james mattis. What do you think about him . I liked james mattis a lot. Hes a tough general, spoke the truth, was a good adviser. I trusted his defense judgment, so i think hes got a lot of qualities that are important to secretary of defense job. I do think that its important for congress to talk with him if he is nominated, to make sure that he also understands the civilian perspective, because i think its important to have that when you become secretary. That when you become secretary. 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Yeah. Find out from paul ryan on 60 minutes tonight. Dickerson welcome back to face the nation. Im john dickerson. We continue our interview with former secretary of defense leon panetta. We pick up with my asking him what he makes of donald trump. John, i think like a lot of people, im still trying to figure him out and try to figure out just exactly who were going to have as the new president. Hes very unconventional. And, you know, youre just not quite sure which donald trump is going to walk into the oval office, whether its the, you know, the reality tvtweeting president , or whether its the business president who will be seriousminded about approaching it. So its really difficult right now to try to get a sense of just exactly what the president elect is going to be like. Dickerson and what do you make of some of the picks hes made for top positions . Do they give you a sense of what his administration might look like . Well, in many ways it reflex some of the positions obviously he took during the campaign, but at the same time, obviously hes talking to a lot of people, and i suspect he is probably for the first time getting a real sense of what the awesome responsibility of president is all about. And it just seems to me that in light of, that hes beginning to talk to a number of people that will bring some experience and some perspective that i think hes going to need if hes going to, you know, be able to deal with the multitude of crises hes going to be confronted with. Dickerson one thing ive heard over and over again during the campaign is voters would say, he doesnt have washington experience, but hell be able to surround himself with advisers. Thats not good enough. The reality is it is the president of the United States who has to make the final decision. And you can have a lot of bright people. They can present you a lot of options. But unless youve taken the time as president to understand those issues to, read into those issues, to understand the consequences of those issues, you cannot just rely on others to tell you what you should or shouldnt do. You have to make the decision. Dickerson so far donald trump has picked a lot of people who are already on his team. They call them loyalists inside the trump campaign. What does that suggest to you in terms of this quality that people talk about with president , somebody needing to be able to go in there and tell them now . How important is that quality . Well, look, theres no question that loyalty is important, but if youre going to be, you know, a top staff assistant to the president of the United States, you have to be willing to tell him the truth. You have to be willing to tell him when you think hes wrong. And when hes taking the wrong step. I mean, the biggest problem in the white house that ive experienced is that everybody is trying to figure out what the president wants to hear and then tell the president what he wants to hear. And i suspect that a Big Personality like donald trump, you know, probably intimidates a lot of people who dont necessarily want to look him in the eye and tell him exactly what he may not want to hear. I always felt my responsibility as chief of staff was to be the person who walked into the oval office and said to the president , you cant do that or this is wrong and be able to tell him what you believe is the truth, and if you dont have that, thats. That i think starts the president off on the wrong foot. Dickerson speaking of congress and confirmations, what questions should members of congress ask a director about taking over the c. I. A. Now . I think the most important question is to ask whether or not you are willing to provide the most accurate and credible intelligence to the president of the United States, whether he wants to hear it or not. The role of the c. I. A. Director is to provide that kind of credible intelligence. Thats the whole purpose of providing the socalled president ial daily brief. Its to inform the president of whats taking place in the world, what do we know about the world, what do we know about crises, what do we know about those that are trying to in some way threaten this country . Frankly, one of the concerns i have right now is that this president is not getting his Intelligence Briefings. Hes taken a few of them, but hes not getting them every day. If youre president of the United States, you better be in touch on a daily basis with your intelligence briefers so that you have an understanding as the what is happening in the world, what are the crises you have to Pay Attention to and what steps do you have to take in order to deal with those crises. Dickerson explain for people why a president couldnt check in with his intelligence briefers every once in a while, didnt need it every day . It doesnt work that way. You are constantly on the intelligence scale looking at a series of threats that may be out there. Some of them may be credible. Some may not be credible. But those threats change on a daytoday basis with new intelligence, with new sources, with new assets that provide information. Every president i know and i have worked under nine president s, every one has taken their intelligence daily brief, because that sets the agenda for what you have to focus on as president of the United States. Dickerson the only job you havent held it seems would be secretary of state, but donald trump is looking at a secretary of state. If you were giving him advice, giving all that you know, the nine president s you served, people have been discussed are general petraeus, mitt romney, rudy giuliani. Assess that field in terms of what you know from your inside experience a secretary of state has to do. For this president in particular, but its probably true for every president , no matter how experienced they may be, you want to have a secretary of state that understands the world, understands the issues that are out there, has the ability to relate to other world leaders, has the ability to be able to implement diplomacy, to engage with others. The most important has the ability to understand how do you on a diplomatic basis approach the crises that a president of the United States has to deal with. You need to have a strong secretary of state because that person is your ambassador to the world, and without that, you are left without the information and without the ability to make the right decisions that have to be made in a complicated world. Were dealing with a world thats very dangerous right now. Got a lot of flash points in this world. You need to have a secretary of state that understands those flash points and understands how to deal with our adversaries, but also how to deal with our allies. Dickerson do you think one of those fits that criteria . I know hes talking to mitt romney. I think romney would be able to fit that. I think there are others hes talking to that would obviously be able to accomplish that, as well. But i think the president needs to understand that if hes going to implement a strong Foreign Policy, if hes going to take care of our National Security, a strong secretary of state is absolutely essential to your ability to protect this country and to advance our interests in the world. Dickerson leon panetta, thanks so much for being here. And well be right back with our panel. Tech wonders, with the geico app you can get roadside assistance, digital id cards. Or even file a claim. Do that. Yeah, yeah that should work. Its not happening. Just try again. Uh, i think i found your problem. Thanks. Hmm. The awardwinning geico app. Download it today. Whats going on . Oh hey thats it . Yeah. Everybody two seconds dear sebastian, after careful consideration of your application, it is with great pleasure that we offer our congratulations on your acceptance. Through the Tuition Assistance program, every day mcdonalds helps more people go to college. Its part of our commitment to being americas best first job. Dickerson were back now with our sunday politics panel. Susan page is usa todays washington pure rechief, reihan salam is the executive editor of the national review, Audie Cornish is host of all Things Considered at npr and dan balz is chief correspondent at the washington post. Reihan salam, i want the start with you. What have we learned about donald trump from the people hes picked . Weve learned hes drawing on a broad array of people ranging from loyalists to a lot of republican regulars. I found the pick of elaine chao to be particularly telling. Elaine chao is not an old school donald trump loyalist, qlet shes someone who has served in cabinets before as secretary of labor and she is, of course, also the wife of the Senate Majority leader, mitch mcconnell. So that is a sign that, hey, maybe transportation is indeed a very high priority and hes thinking about legislative strategy. At the other end of the spectrum, you know, you have the designate for attorney general Jeff Sessions who distinguished himself by being an early staunch supporter and somebody who has shaped Donald Trumps views on immigration policy. So i would say those are two ends of the spectrum, a loyalist and also someone who will facilitate trumps us a tensive future role as a deal maker. Drew dickerson do you think we have administration where donald trump does what he did with carrier, has a big flashy moment and leaves the details to other people . What do we know or can we know at this point about the kind of separation of duties between donald trump and the people he picks to head these departments or even his Vice President . John, i think theres still a lot we wont know until hes actually in power. Were beginning to see some signs of it. And i think certainly in terms of the cabinet picks and the kinds of things hes done, theres the two Donald Trumps. De campaign. Theres the donald trump on the one hand who is unpredictability, who likes to mix it up, who wants to stir the pot, who will continue to tweet things that will upset people, and we also saw at certain times in the campaign and were seeing in this election in the cabinet, a donald trump who in some ways comes off as a generic republican, and i think that thats going to be the tension within a trump administration, which is the more significant, who is really running things, is he really running it or is he being guided by others, particularly those that are sort of in the republican mainstream. My guess is donald trump will cant the try to shake things up. Dickerson susan, Newt Gingrich has been interviewed today. He sounds like he would be okay with mitt romney being secretary of state. What do you make of that post . Sometimes it seems like messages are coming to donald trump through his staff from the television. What do you think is going on . I think its interesting and not surprising that hes taking time with secretary of state. No more important appointment hell make. You see the competition between a loyalist and his fiercest critic, mitt romney. I do think there are signs that they are looking for maybe some additional names, and one name ive heard is john huntsman, the former ambassador to china for barack obama, a guy who ran for president himself not so successfully for the republican ticket. But someone who was never part of never trump movement, has some Foreign Policy experience. Maybe the standoff between giuliani and romney has created the opening for a third person to walk through, whether it be huntsman or bob corker or someone else. Drew one question i wondered about, audie, i asked Reince Priebus about millions of votes being made in california, the reason i asked is because there is no evidence of that, priebus was in the position of defending his boss, but to dans point about two different donald trump, how does the presidency accommodate this . When the president said things. I thought the point about two different trumps was interesting, because the trump im seeing is like the one we know from the apprentice, the cabinet process feels like a reality show. You have these people traipsing in and out, in fact, its more like the bachelor. Somebody is going to get a rose, that photo of romney, that row row romantic dinner. At the end of the day, somebodying is going to get tapped. Your question is if you take a position with the trump administration, how much say do you have. Will you be listened to . Will you be respected . What if you cant do it anymore . What if you want to resign or step aside in i think anybody who wanted the state Department Job and saw what happened with taiwan in the last week is probably thinking, i dont know. You know what struck me, you know that civil war, i and others predicted in the republican party, that isnt happening. This is Donald Trumps party. Dickerson victory tends to do that. Donald trump has been split in rewarding loyalty with some but not with others. Rudy giuliani still doesnt have a job. Not forgiving everybody but forgiving some of the people who were critical of him during the campaign. This is Donald Trumps party. This is Donald Trumps administration. While hes somebody that we can see already is willing to delegate, especially to mike pence, mike pence has emerged as a really powerful figure, this is his administration. Dickerson to offer a somewhat different perspective, i think about this through the lens of the past. If you think about jimmy carter and bill clinton, here were two figures who in a lot of ways were unconventional democrats. Jimmy carter ran really an opposition to the Democratic Party in lots of ways. He was an idiosyncratic figure. His Democratic Coalition was very different from the Democratic Coalition, and he struggled as president. He was a governor from georgia georgia who came in without the support of the crackal Democratic Party that. Was a disaster some would say. Bill clinton, a very different situation. He ran as a pop list, as a new democrat. The trouble is there were no new democrats. There were no actual craw dres. There were maybe 15, 20, 30 people. He could not actually staff his administration with people who represented his particular world view. He wound up staffing it with some retreads from the carter administration, a lot of fairly conventional liberals and there was a fight in the party, but basically he rounded up not pop list democrats but a wall street democrat. Robert rubin defined the clinton presidency. Similarly with trump, you can imagine a scenario in which like jimmy carter her fights tooth and nail against his party. You can imagine another scenario which he gets assimilated to the kind of power brokers of his party. And maybe a third case in which he advances his distinctive nationalism and populism. The problem is you need cadrings. You need actual trumpets in order for that to happen. Maybe steve bannon is, maybe a handful of other people are trumpist, but its not clear he has the people to staff 4,000 jobs in his administration to advance that distinctive perspective. So i see the clinton scenario or the carter scenario as the two things at work right now. Drew unless his perspective is whatever works at the time, and everybody is trying to get a result. That could be, okay, you give it to the power brokers of the party. Dickerson audie, let me ask you about this deal that donald trump worked with carrier this week. He said he would punish them, but they got 7 million in tax breaks. What did you make of this at the end of the day in. I think its interesting that trump has rejected the kind of check list that republicans have. I think, dan, youve written about this. They can be independents and therefore he doesnt have to do the free market. Cant do that, right . So all of a sudden thats okay. And i think maybe he could see it. I think the thing ill be looking for is will that change the atmosphere for corp ratted decision making. If you have a president thats not constricted by all of those kind of party dynamics, that creates some uncertainty and who knows kind of how they could take that going forward. Dickerson what do you think . Are we going to see donald trump basically. Is this the model for his presidency, these highprofile, handson, but in a limited way . Well, donald trump is a showman, and he likes to create these moments, and weve seen him do it throughout the campaign. I cant imagine that given his age and his experience that hes going to fundamentally change the way he approaches this new job even though its totally different than anything hes done. On the issue of the carrier case, the question is what signals does that send outside of that particular episode . Is it incentives of other companies to try the come in and bargain with him . Does it create some sense of intimidation that the president of the United States is going to call you out if he sees you doing something he doesnt like . I think that everybody is going to be making judgments based on a handful of symbolic but real things that he does early on in his tenure, and they will begin to calibrate how they deal with him from there. Its fascinating to see the opposition. Larry summers, very prominent democrat, this isnt the rule of law. He never mentions people said this same thing about the all the bailout. And Bernie Sanders is saying this isnt hard enough on the corporations. Its just a huge giveaway. Which is it going to be . And i think in that is room for maneuver for trump. And you have sarah palin calling it crony capitalism. Theres no ideological test for donald trump. Hes not an ideological guy. Hes whatever the result is, bhaib thats whatever looks good. That gives him chance to have tremendous sway and probably a great deal of irritation for other politicians. Dickerson well cut it there for a moment. Well be right back. Stay with us. Dickerson and were back now with more from our politics panel. Audie, i want to ask you about nancy pelosi. She was reelected as the democratic leader. She said she respects the office of the presidency. A lot of democrats say, not my president. They want tougher fighting against donald trump. How does that get worked out . I think thats why she is back as leader, right . Basically lawmakers in that caucus said we want somebody prepared to do the legislative battling we need to run defense for the next two years, and she knows how to do that. I know that that was looked at purely through the lens of election and what does this mean for the whole party going forward. But i think some of that was about what is our defense going to be against this unified republican government, and therefore donald trump. Dickerson saw san, what do democrats do when theyre looking for their new vibrant voice thats going to keep this from being a Coastal Party that keeps losing in those percentages . I think democrats are in for a world of hurt at the moment. Theyve reduced to one tactic. The senate filibuster. That doesnt say much for party if you have lost the white house, the house, the senate. Youre going to have a Supreme Court thats going to be less friendly. Youve lost all these state legislature, which may be the most serious thing. Democrats face a world in which theyve been hallowed out. They have not had people in the pipeline whereas republicans have done that for the past 20 years. So they need a address not only the geography of their party but also Building Back lower ranks of the party, state legislature, statewide elected officials, so you have more profitability to move into the top ranks. Dickerson one of the ways, dan, that this is showing itself, the conversation in the Democratic Party is looking at the clinton campaign, in the way it was run, you were part as susan was of the Harvard Campaign managers where the managers for all the campaigns get together. There was a real crash between the trump forces and the clintons. What happened and what does it mean, not so much what happened, but does it mean anything large center. I think it means that this campaign has left this country in such a kind of a raw state of emotion about the outcome. The outcome was a surprise, a big surprise on both sides, i think its fair to say. And the clinton team reflecting both the sort of sense of devastation had some things they wanted to put out on the table, critical of the way donald trump ran the campaign. The trump campaign, i think, because perhaps they have. They didnt get the popular vote, they think they are not getting the respect that he deserves for having won a campaign that almost nobody said he could win. And so neither side seems to be really prepared to make the real steps to try to bring about reconciliation. People said this the day after the election, donald trump did, Health Care Hillary clinton did, president United States did, but there are lots of people nervous. There are lots of resentments and grievances. And that afternoon seconds on harvard on thursday afternoon boiled over. And you are too modest to say you were the moderator. You said afterward you needed a fire extinguisher. The question is what could happen that could put out these fires that are really still raging even a month after the election . Dickerson explain what the fire is to people who werent there. What is the central nature of it . On the one hand, the trump people feel resentful about a lack of respect, and the clinton people arguing they won by appealing to the darkest forces in american politics, and that was the ignition point for the fiercest exchanges they had. But this is. Its not like theyre friendly and love each other, its just that theyve civil to each other. That sense of civility was not apparent on ider side. I will say there is a fire within the Democratic Party, too. There is a process to which the Democratic Party is always learning and relearning certain lessons. The Democratic Party is the bigcity party, the urban party. Thats a huge advantage in some respects. It means grew have resources and lots of cultural capital, as well, but the tricky thing is that our political system is stacked against an urban party. When we want to win seats in the house of representatives and forget about the senate, you need to be able to win some suburban, rural voters, and so this stacking up in big cities. Thats a fundamental challenge some what nancy pelosi managed to do, what howard dean and other folks managed to do is lets find democrats who can win in these rural districts. Lets manage to do that. The thing is the fire in the party is that urban fire of moving the party away from that. Hillary clinton cosponsored legislation to punish flag burning with a year in prison in 2005. Donald trump wants to punish people, too. Dickerson well have to end it there. Thanks to all of you. Well be back in a moment. Since zostavax contains a weakened chickenpox virus. Remember one in three people get shingles in their lifetime, will it be you . Talk you to your doctor or pharmacist about me, single shot zostavax. Youve got a shot against shingles. Dickerson thats it for us. Until next week for phase face the nation. Im john dickerson. At the 20, 15, 10, 5, touchdown this is toyota sunday kickoff on cbs3 what up, good people . Happy sunday, fun day, welcome to toyota sunday kickoff im don bell. Im lesley van arsdall. We have a great show of football ahead. And you can be part of the show tweeting us contribution 3 3creekoff. They fell flat against the