Transcripts For KYW 60 Minutes 20170820

Its the start of a military revolution. Now its looking at me. Martin machines operating on their own. It recognized you instantly. Martin using Artificial Intelligence to make decisions faster than humans, and raising questions the pentagon is only beginning to grapple with. So, if the machines better, why not let it make the decision . This goes to the ethics of the question of whether or not you allow a machine to take a human life without the intervention of a human. Whitaker tell me about the night you got lost. What do you remember . Its a memory thats been within me for such a long time. Whitaker saroo was just five years old when he got lost, and, as depicted in the movie, he ended up on a train that took him a thousand miles away with no way to know how to get home. Its a ghost train. No ones on the train. And. Whitaker and the train is hurtling down the tracks. Its hurtling down the tracks. I was locked in the carriage. I couldnt open it. Whitaker and youre five years old. And im five years old. Im steve kroft. Im lesley stahl. Im bill whitaker. Im Anderson Cooper. Im david martin. Im scott pelley. Those stories, tonight on 60 minutes. When i feel controlled by frequent, unpredictable abdominal pain or discomfort and diarrhea. I tried Lifestyle Changes and overthecounter treatments, but my symptoms keep coming back. It turns out i have Irritable Bowel Syndrome with diarrhea, or ibsd. A condition thats really frustrating. Thats why i talked to my doctor about viberzi. A different way to treat ibsd. Viberzi is a Prescription Medication you take every day that helps proactively manage both abdominal pain and diarrhea at the same time. So i can stay ahead of my symptoms. Viberzi can cause new or worsening abdominal pain. Do not take viberzi if you have no gallbladder, have pancreas or severe liver problems, problems with alcohol abuse, longlasting or severe constipation, or a bowel or gallbladder blockage. 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Is back at outback. Starting at 15. 99 for a limited time, were pairing our signature steaks with a mouthwatering, steamed lobster tail. Starting at only 15. 99. Its time to get back to outback. Stahl isis has claimed responsibility for this past thursdays deadly terror attack in barcelona, spain, that killed and wounded people from at least 34 countries, including the United States. This year alone, the Spanish Police have arrested more than 20 people with links to isis. Here in america, 100 people have been arrested for isisrelated crimes over the last three years. The f. B. I. Devotes significant resources to identifying potential terrorists and sometimes spends years tracking them. The terror attack in garland, texas, two years ago was the first claimed by isis on u. S. Soil. Its mostly forgotten because the two terrorists were killed by local cops before they managed to murder anyone. As Anderson Cooper first reported in march, we were surprised to discover just how close the f. B. I. Was to one of the terrorists. Not only had the f. B. I. Been monitoring him for years, there was an undercover agent right behind him when the first shots were fired. Cooper the target of the attack was an event taking place in this Conference Center on may 3, 2015. A selfdescribed free speech advocate named Pamela Geller was holding a provocative contest, offering a cashprize for the best drawing of the prophet muhammad, whose depiction is considered sacrilege by some muslims. Security outside was heavy. There were dozens of police, a swat team, and snipers. More than 100 people were gathered inside and the event was ending when two terrorists drove up to a checkpoint manned by a Garland Police officer and a School Security guard. This grainy image shows both Law Enforcement personnel standing next to an Unmarked Police car seconds before the attack. Bruce joiner, the security guard, was unarmed. Joiner its like they pull up, stop, and the doors open. Cooper do you remember seeing the weapon . Joiner oh, yeah. Definitely saw their weapon. And thats when i locked onto his face cause hes got this smile. Cooper he was literally smiling . Joiner yeah, like, i got you. I got you. gunshots cooper the two terrorists opened fire with automatic rifles. Joiner dove for cover, but was shot in the leg. Officer greg stevens returned fire with his handgun. Police nearby ran toward the scene. And right here bleep just started shooting at this convention cooper when this video was recorded by a passerby, both terrorists had been mortally wounded by officer stevens and were lying on the ground next to their car. They still shooting, man cooper a swat team shot them both in the head. Joiner because they kept moving and they werent sure there were explosives involved they had to shoot them. Cooper how quick did all of this happen . Joiner oh, its a matter of seconds. I would say 20, 30 seconds. Its very quick. Cooper the next day as the fbi picked through the crime scene, the evidence showed Garland Police had prevented a massacre. The terrorists brought six guns, hundreds of rounds of ammunition, bulletproof and tactical vests, and xeroxed copies of the black flag of isis. They were identified as 31year old Elton Simpson and 34year old nadir soofi. Just hours before the attack they had sent this tweet pledging allegiance to isis. But simpson was already well known to the f. B. I. He grew up in the suburbs of chicago, and moved to phoenix, arizona in middle school. He briefly played College Basketball before dropping out and converting to islam when he was 20. According to leaders of the phoenix mosque he attended, simpson was wellliked and soft spoken. Shami he was always asking questions, attending lectures. Cooper usama shami is president of the Islamic Community center of phoenix. People here thought so much of the young muslim convert, who took the name ibrahim, that he was included in the mosques promotional video in 2007. When you come together and you pray five times a day with the brothers, and youre reminded about the hereafter. Cooper but at the time of this interview, simpson had already become interested in radical islam, and the phoenix f. B. I. , which was investigating one of his friends, hired an informant, a sudanese refugee named dabla deng, to check simpson out. Cooper there are informants inside the mosque . Shami yeah. I mean, the whole case with Elton Simpson was with an informant, that he was befriending elton and taping his conversations. Cooper dabla deng spent three years pretending to be simpsons friend, and was paid 132,000 by the f. B. I. He taped more than 1,500 hours of their conversations and finally recorded him talking about traveling overseas to wage jihad. Simpson lied to the f. B. I. About it and got three years probation. Shami when he found out that this guy was spying on him, and taping him, and then finding out that the government was doing that, i think something clicked in him. And the mosque, we couldnt do anything, because we dont know what he did. Cooper he felt that the mosque had abandoned him . Shami yes. And he felt that a lot of people had abandoned him. And thats why he stopped coming to the mosque. Cooper he moved into this phoenix apartment complex with nadir soofi, whom he knew from the mosque. Soofi had just had a bitter breakup, and the pizza parlor he owned was going out of business. It was here in this apartment that simpson and soofi began closely following the rise of isis, reaching out to their supporters online and acquiring weapons for a terrorist attack. Hughes simpson and soofi knew what they were getting into, and i think they likely knew they were going to die. Cooper Seamus Hughes tracks the online activities of isis sympathizers in the u. S. He served at the National Counter terrorism center, and is currently Deputy Director of George Washington universitys program on extremism, where he also trains f. B. I. Agents on how to identify american jihadis. Why is the garland attack so significant . Hughes the garland attack is essentially the first opening salvo when it comes to attacks on the homeland. Cooper attacks in the United States . Hughes attacks in the United States. These lowlevel attacks by ones and twos of people who are drawn to the ideology and decide to act. You got to make sense of it all. So what you do is, you bring it all together and put it on a board and say whos connected to who. Cooper using an Old Fashioned Law Enforcement tool, hughes maps out isis online tentacles into the United States. Hughes so you have the two attackers, soofi and simpson. Theyre also talking to mohammed miski, whos an isis recruiter in somalia. Cooper this is somebody in somalia who theyre talking to online. Hughes uhhuh. Yep. Through an encrypted app, surespot. Theyre also talking to junaid hussein. Cooper and hes in raqqa . Hughes hes in raqqa. Cooper raqqa is isiss stronghold in syria. Hughes calls Junaid Hussain an isis rock star, a british citizen who communicated online with englishspeaking recruits worldwide. He was killed in a u. S. Drone strike a year and a half ago. Miski, an american living in somalia, tweeted this link about the draw muhammad contest, in garland, texas, and direct messaged Elton Simpson, urging him to attack it. Hughes the most interesting part about this is were in a hybrid time, right. Before, we used to be worried about these Network Attacks think of 9 11 with the hijackers training for years and then coming over here. And then, we had lone actor attacks, individuals who were kind of drawn to this and decided to act. Now, were in this weird moment in between, where you have a number of individuals in raqqa, reaching out to americans in ohio, new york, and other places and saying so heres the knife you should use. Heres the address of the local u. S. Military officer and do what you can. Cooper do you think Elton Simpson would have launched this attack if it wasnt for people in isis overseas who were online whispering in his ear . Hughes i think the folks whispering in his ear was a big part of it. Cooper the f. B. I. Closed the case on Elton Simpson in 2014, only to reopen it several weeks before the attack because of statements he made on social media. Hughes it speaks to a larger problem the f. B. I. Has, which is, you have an individual who pops into your radar in 2006, but doesnt commit an attack until 2015. So do you want the f. B. I. To watch this individual for nine years . Cooper after the attack, phoenix f. B. I. Agents became convinced the two men hadnt acted alone, and began investigating Elton Simpsons friends. They arrested this man, abdul malik abdulkareem, a 43year old convert to islam who grew up in philadelphia, and accused him of funding the attack, as well as training and encouraging simpson and soofi. Witnesses at abdulkareems trial testified the three men watched isis execution videos together, and discussed attacking a military base or the 2015 super bowl in glendale, arizona. Abdulkareem denied taking part in any discussions about a terror attack, and says he rejected his friends growing radicalization. He was found guilty on multiple counts and sentenced to 30 years in prison. But his attorney, dan maynard, continued to investigate, and uncovered new evidence the f. B. I. Was much closer to the garland attack than anyone realized. After the trial, you discovered that the government knew a lot more about the garland attack than they had let on . Maynard thats right. Yeah. After the trial, we found out that they had had an undercover agent who had been texting with simpson less than three weeks before the attack to him tear up texas. Which to me was an encouragement to simpson. Cooper the man hes talking about was a special agent of the f. B. I. , working undercover posing as an islamic radical. The government sent attorney dan maynard 60 pages of declassified encrypted messages between the agent and Elton Simpson, and argued tear up texas was not an incitement. But simpsons response was incriminating, referring to the attack against cartoonists at the french magazine Charlie Hebdo bro, you dont have to say that. He wrote you know what happened in paris. So that goes without saying. No need to be direct. But it turns out the undercover agent did more than just communicate online with Elton Simpson. In an affidavit filed in another case, the government disclosed that the f. B. I. Undercover agent had actually traveled to garland, texas, and was present at the event. Maynard i was shocked. I mean, i was shocked that the government hadnt turned this over. I wanted to know, when did he get there, why was he there . Cooper and this past november, maynard was given another batch of documents by the government, revealing the Biggest Surprise of all. The undercover agent was in a car directly behind Elton Simpson and nadir soofi when they started shooting. This cell phone photo of School Security guard bruce joiner and Police Officer greg stevens was taken by the undercover agent seconds before the attack. The idea that hes taking photograph of the two people who happen to be attacked laughs moments before theyre attacked. Maynard its stunning. Cooper i mean, talk about being in the right or the wrong place at the right or the wrong time. Maynard the idea that hes right there 30 seconds before the attack happens is just incredible to me. Cooper what would you want to ask the undercover agent . Maynard i would love to ask the undercover agent are these the only communications that you had with simpson . Did you have more communications with simpson . How is it that you ended up coming to garland, texas . Why are you even there . Cooper we wanted to ask the f. B. I. Those same questions. But the bureau would not agree to an interview. All the f. B. I. Would give us was this email statement. It reads there was no advance knowledge of a plot to attack the cartoon drawing contest in garland, texas. If youre wondering what happened to the f. B. I. s undercover agent, he fled the scene, but was stopped at gunpoint by Garland Police. This is video of him in handcuffs, recorded by a local news crew. Weve blurred his face to protect his identity. Maynard i cant tell you whether the f. B. I. Knew the attack was going to occur. I dont like to think that they let it occur. But it is shocking to me that an undercover agent sees fellas jumping out of a car. And he drives on. I find that shocking. Cooper that he didnt try to stop. Maynard he didnt try to stop them. Or he didnt do something. I mean, hes an agent, for gosh sakes. Cooper if this attack had gone a different way, and lots of people had been killed, would the fact that an undercover f. B. I. Agent was on the scene have become essentially a scandal . Hughes it would have been a bigger story. I think you would have seen congressional investigations and things like that. Lucky for the f. B. I. And for the participants in the event, you know, here in texas, you know, everyones a good shot there. Cooper the f. B. I. s actions around this foiled attack offer a rare glimpse into the complexities faced by those fighting homegrown extremism. Today the battle often begins online, where identifying terrorists can be the difference between a massacre, and the one that never occurred in garland, texas. I mean, people brag about stuff. People talk big. One of the difficulties for the f. B. I. Is trying to figure out whos just talking and who actually may execute an attack. Hughes thats the hardest part when you talk about this, right. Theres a lot of guys who talk about how great isis is. Its very hard to tell when someone crosses that line. And in most of the cases, you see the f. B. I. Has some touch point with those individuals beforehand. There had been an assessment, a preliminary investigation or a full investigation. Its just very hard to know when somebody decides to jump. Preponderance cbs money watch update. Youre in charge. Quijano good evening. Lowes, gain stop and ultraa beauty are among the Companies Reporting earnings. The v. W. Van is coming back in 2022, and it will be electric, and tomorrows eclipse is expected the cast a 700 million shadow of lost productivity. Im elaine quijano, cbs news. With some big news about type 2 diabetes. You have type 2 diabetes, right . 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Now, a new generation of drones is coming, only this time they are autonomous able to operate on their own without humans controlling them from somewhere with a joystick. Some autonomous machines are run by Artificial Intelligence which allows them to learn, Getting Better each time. Its early in the revolution, but the potential exists for all missions considered too dangerous or complex for humans to be turned over to autonomous machines that can make decisions faster and go in harms way without any fear. Think of it as the coming swarm, and if that sounds like the title of a scifi miniseries, well, as we first reported earlier this year, its already a military reality. We saw it with our own eyes and captured it on camera. This swarm over the california desert is like nothing the u. S. Military has ever fielded before. Each of those tiny drones is flying itself. Humans on the ground have given them a mission to patrol a threesquaremile area, but the drones are figuring out for themselves how to do it. They are operating autonomously, and the pentagons dr. Will roper says what youre seeing is a glimpse into the future of combat. Dr. Will roper it opens up a completely different level of warfare, a completely different level of maneuver. Launch team on my count. Martin the drone is called perdix, an unlikely name for an unlikely engine of revolution. Launch team all vehicles up and away. Good launch. Martin roper, head of a oncesecret pentagon Organization Called the strategic capabilities office, remembers the first time he saw perdix, which is named after a bird found in greek mythology. Dr. Roper i held it up in my hands. Its about as big as my hand. And i looked at it and said, really . This is. This is what you want me to. To get excited about . You know, it looks like a toy. Martin perdix flies too fast and too high to follow, so 60 minutes brought specialized highspeed cameras to the china lake weapons station in california to capture it in flight. Launch team very nice. Martin developed by 20 and 30somethings from m. I. T. s lincoln labs, perdix is designed to operate as a team, which you can see when you follow this group of eight on a computer screen. Dr. Roper weve given them a mission at this point, and that mission is as a team, go fly down the road. And so, they allocate that amongst all the individual perdix. Martin and theyre talking to each other. Dr. Roper they are. Martin by what . Dr. Roper so, theyve got radios on, and theyre each telling each other not just what theyre doing but where they are in space. Martin how frequently are they talking back and forth to each other . Dr. Roper many, many times a second when theyre first sorting out. Martin i mean, it looks helter skelter. Dr. Roper you want them to converge to a good enough solution and go ahead and get on with it. Its faster than a human would sort it out. Martin cheap and expendable, perdix tries to make a soft landing. Nice. Martin . But its no great loss if it crashes into the ground. All units. Martin perdix can be used as decoys to confuse enemy air defenses or equipped with electronic transmitters to jam their radar. This one looks like it has a camera. As a swarm of miniature spy planes fitted with cell phone cameras, they could hunt down fleeing terrorists. Dr. Roper theres several different roads they could have gone down, and you dont know which one to search. You can tell them, go search all the roads, and tell them what to search for and let them sort out the best way to do it. Martin the pentagon is spending 3 billion a year on Autonomous Systems, many of them much more sophisticated than a swarm of perdix. This pair of air and ground robots runs on Artificial Intelligence. Captain jim pineiro im going to say start the reconnaissance. Martin they are searching a mock village for a suspected terrorist, reporting back to marine captain jim pineiro and his tablet. Captain pineiro the ground robots continuing on its mission while the air robot is searching on its own. Martin the robots are slow and cumbersome, but theyre just test beds for cuttingedge Computer Software which could power more agile machines, ones that could act as advance scouts for a foot patrol. Captain pineiro i would want to use a system like this to move maybe in front of me or in advance of me, to give me Early Warning of. Of enemy in the area. Martin this time, im the target. The computer already knows what i look like, so now well see if it can match whats stored in its memory with the real thing as i move around this make believe village. The robots Artificial Intelligence had done its homework the night before, Tim Faltemier says, learning what i look like. Tim faltemier we were able to get every picture of every story that youve ever been in. Martin how many pictures of me are there out there . Faltemier when we ran this through, we have about 50,000 different pictures of you that we were able to get. Had we had more time, we probably couldve done a better job. Martin so, because youve got 50,000 images of me, how certain would you be . Faltemier very. Martin now its looking at me. Faltemier it recognized you instantly. So, what we reported today on our scores, were about a one in 10,000 chance of being wrong. Martin while the robot was searching for me inside an auditorium at the Marine Corps Base in quantico, virginia. Lt. Cdr. Rollie wicks this will give us a technological advantage. Martin . Lieutenant commander rollie wicks was watching from a missile boat in the potomac river. Wicks what i was doing was, i was turning over control of the Weapon System to the Autonomous Systems that youve seen on the floor today. Martin had wicks given permission to shoot, the missile would have struck my location using a set of coordinates given to it by the robots. Wicks they were controlling a remote weapons system. They were controlling where that weapons system was pointing, with me supervising. Martin it will be about three years before these robots will be ready for the battlefield. By then, captain pineiro says, they will look considerably different. Will those robots. When they reach the battlefield, will they be able to defend themselves . Pineiro we are looking into that. We are looking into defensive capability for a robot, armed robots. Martin shoot back . Pineiro correct. Martin this pentagon directive states Autonomous Systems shall be designed to allow commanders and operators to exercise appropriate levels of human judgment over the use of force. What that means, says general paul selva, vice chairman of the joint chiefs of staff and the militarys man in charge of autonomy, is that life or death decisions will be made only by humans, even though machines can do it faster and, in some cases, better. Are machines better at facial recognition than humans . Paul selva all the research ive seen says, about five years ago, machines actually got better at Image Recognition than humans. Martin can a disguise defeat machine recognition . Selva if you think about the proportions of the human body, there are several that are discrete and difficult to hide. The example that i will use, as i look at you, is the distance between your pupils. It is very likely unique to you and a handful of other humans. A disguise cannot move your eyes. Martin so, if i have a ski mask on, that doesnt help . Selva not if your eyes are visible. If you have to see, you cant change that proportion. Martin so, if the machines better, why not let it make the decision . Selva this goes to the ethics of the question of whether or not you allow a machine to take a human life without the intervention of a human. Martin do you know where this is headed . Selva i dont. Martin virtually any military vehicle has the potential to become autonomous. The navy has begun testing sea hunter, an autonomous ship to track submarines. Program manager Scott Littlefield says that when you no longer have to make room for a crew, you can afford to buy a lot of them. Scott littlefield you could buy somewhere between 50 and 100 of these for the price of one warship. Martin ive heard somebody describe this ship as looking like an overgrown polynesian war canoe. laughs why does it look like it does . Littlefield to be able to go across the Pacific Ocean without refueling, this hull form, the. The trimaran, was. Was the best thing we could come up with. Martin what is its range . Littlefield we can go about 10,000 nautical miles on. On. On a tank of gas, 14,000 gallons. Martin sea hunter is at least two years away from being ready to steam across the pacific on its own. Among other things, it has to learn how to follow the rules of the road to avoid collisions with other ships. When we went aboard, it had only been operating autonomously for a few weeks and there was still a human crew, just in case. When testing is done, this pilot house will come off and the crew will be standing on the pier waving goodbye. From then on, this will be a ghost ship, commanded by 36 Computers Running 50 million lines of software code. And these life lines will have to come off, too, since theres no need for them with no humans on board. It has a top speed of 26 knots and a tight turning radius which should enable it to use its sonar to track dieselpowered submarines for weeks at a time. Littlefield many countries have diesel submarines. Thats the most common kind of submarine thats out there. Martin china . Littlefield china has them. Martin russia . Littlefield russia has them. Martin iran . Littlefield iran has them. Martin north korea . Littlefield yes. Martin i think i get the picture. Littlefield yes. Martin but of everything we saw, tiny perdix is closest to being ready to go operational, if it passes its final exam. Will roper and his team of desert rats are about to attempt to fly the largest autonomous swarm ever 100 perdix drones. Dr. Roper this is one of the riskiest, most exciting things thats going on right now in the pentagon. Martin risky not only because the swarm would be more than three times larger than anything ropers ever done before, but also because 60 minutes is here to record the outcome for all to see. Why are you letting us watch . Dr. Roper couple of reasons, david. I. I. When this first came up, i have. I have to be honest with you, my First Response was, that sound. Sounds like a horrible idea. Right . I mean, its just human nature. I. I dont want this to fail on camera. But i did not like the fear of failure being my only reason for not letting you be here. And we also wanted the world to see that were doing some new things. Martin this time, the perdix will be launched from three f18 jet fighters, just as they would on a real battlefield. Dr. Roper there they are. Martin yep. Dr. Roper all right. A little piece of. A little piece of the future. Pilot five, four, three. Martin the f18s are traveling at almost the speed of sound. Pilot mark release. Martin so, the first test for perdix is whether they will survive their violent ejection into the atmosphere. Radio complete. 104 alive. Dr. Roper thats 104 in the swarm, david. Martin 104 alive. Dr. Roper thats 100 swarm. laughs there they are. You see them . Martin yeah, yeah. Dr. Roper look at them. Look at them. They flash in the sun as they come into view. Martin theres a. Oh, yeah. As the perdix descend in front of our cameras, they organize themselves into a tighter swarm. Imagine the splitsecond calculations a human would have to make to keep them from crashing into each other. Dr. Roper look at that its just everywhere you look, theyre coming into view. It does feel like a plague of locusts. So, theyre running out of battery. Martin there are reams of data that still have to be analyzed, but roper is confident perdix passed its final exam. Radio one vehicle down. Martin . And could become operational as early as this year. Ive heard people say that autonomy is the biggest thing in military Technology Since nuclear weapons. Really . Dr. Roper i think i might agree with that, david. I mean, if what we mean by biggest thing is, something thats going to change everything, i think autonomy is going to change everything. This cbs sports update is brought to you by ford division. Hello, everyone. Im bill macatee in greensboro, North Carolina where Henrik Stenson has won the final regular season event on the pga tour, the windham championship. In major league baseball, the red sox take the rubber game to the yankees. Boston now with a fivegame lead in the a. L. East. The angels win two of three in baltimore, and the twins sweep the diamondbacks. For more sports news and information, go to cbssports. Com. Blow your mind. Whoa. Awesome. That is really cool. Take on summer right with ford, americas bestselling brand. Now with summers hottest offer on ford f150. Get zero percent for sixty months plus an additional thousand on top of your tradein. Thats the built ford tough f150 with zero percent for sixty months plus an additional thousand on top of your tradein offer ends soon during the ford summer sales event. I even accept i have a higher risk of stroke due to afib, i accept i take easier trails than i used to. A type of irregular heartbeat not caused by a heart valve problem. But no matter what path i take, i go for my best. So if theres Something Better than warfarin, ill go for that too. Eliquis. Eliquis reduced the risk of stroke better than warfarin, plus had less major bleeding than warfarin. Eliquis had both. Dont stop taking eliquis unless your doctor tells you to, as stopping increases your risk of having a stroke. Eliquis can cause serious and in rare cases fatal bleeding. Dont take eliquis if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. While taking eliquis, you may bruise more easily. And it may take longer than usual for any bleeding to stop. Seek immediate medical care for sudden signs of bleeding, like unusual bruising. Eliquis may increase your bleeding risk if you take certain medicines. Tell your doctor about all planned medical or dental procedures. Im still going for my best. And for eliquis. Ask your doctor about eliquis. We cut the price of trades to give investors even more value. And at 4. 95, you can trade with a clear advantage. Fidelity, where smarter investors will always be. And at 4. 95, you can trade with a clear advantage. So its an extra 5 off on all tyep, all this. All this. The moment you realize you can save big, even on the small stuff. You get an extra 5 off everyday on items big or small with your lowes advantage card. Whitaker Saroo Brierley is a 36yearold man with a powerful story of loss and love. As a fiveyearold child in india, he became impossibly lost in calcutta, a sprawling, chaotic city of 14 Million People. He said he had no money, no one to help him, no clue how to get back home. That he survived is amazing enough. What happened next got hollywoods attention. His story is now a movie called lion, the english translation of his indian name. But there would be no movie, no story without saroos memories, the recollections of a terrified little boy. Its hard to recall events from age five, but witnesses we talked to and documents we found support almost all that he remembers. As we reported last december, Saroo Brierley considers himself lucky to be alive. When you hear his story, we think youll understand why. Tell me about the night you got lost. What do you remember . Saroo brierley i remember it so vividly. Its its a memory thats been within me for such a long time. Whitaker it began when Saroo Brierley was five in his village in central india. He lived in a cramped one room house made of cow dung and brick with his mother, two older brothers, and younger sister. His father had abandoned them, leaving them penniless. Do you remember being hungry . Saroo brierley were always hungry. We were always sort of having to sort of live a day at a time. Whitaker you found more food at the train station than anyplace else . Saroo brierley if i really wanted to sort of find food, the train station is the best place. It wasnt just myself, there was other beggars and people at the train station too. Whitaker is that what you and your brothers were . Saroo brierley we were beggars, yeah. Whitaker he says his mother would often leave the children for days on their own so she could earn less than 1 a day hauling rocks at construction sites. Saroo brierley when i saw her eyes as a child, i know she was going through hardship. Whitaker you remember thinking that, looking at your mother . Saroo brierley yeah. Id see, whilst im sort of sleeping or almost asleep next to my sister, and i could see sort of tears going down her eyes as well. Whitaker one night, guddu, his oldest brother he idolized, wanted to scavenge at the big train station down the track. Saroo says he begged to go with him. Reluctantly, his brother gave in. Saroo remembers the station had a water tower and a pedestrian walkway. He also remembers he was exhausted. When they got there, it was late at night. Saroo brierley and i just wanted to go to sleep, and my brother said, wait here. Ill be back. I ended up going to sleep on the bench. Im not too sure whether it was like ten minutes, 20 minutes, an hour, two hours, three hours. Whitaker when he woke up, he remembers a train was there but his brother was not. Saroo thought he might be inside looking under seats for coins and food. He didnt find him, but he did find a comfortable seat and fell back to sleep. When he woke up again, as depicted in the movie, the train was careening across india for hours and hours. Saroo brierley its a ghost train. No ones on the train. And whitaker and the train is hurtling down the tracks Saroo Brierley its hurtling down the tracks. And i just ran up and down. Tears. I was locked in the carriage. I couldnt open it. Im on this carriage, on this train, all by myself locked as a prisoner. Its prisoner. Whitaker and youre five years old. Saroo brierley and im five years old. Whitaker he thinks he was trapped more than a day. He ended up 1,000 miles from home, in the crowds and chaos of the main calcutta train station. More than a Million People pass through here every day. Saroo brierley i was panicking. My heart was going triple time. Im calling out for my brother, my sister and my mother. Whitaker was no one paying attention to a little little kid in the crowd . Saroo brierley no one was paying attention. No. To them, its like youre just another kid outside the train station, you know . Whitaker to make matters worse he spoke hindi. In calcutta, people speak bengali. He avoided the police because, at home, Police Arrested beggars. So hed have to do what hed learned from his brothers survive on his wits and scavenge in a vast, unforgiving city threatening to swallow him up. He slept alongside other street kids in the train station, but there were adult predators at night. Saroo says he barely survived perhaps for weeks before a young man helped him and brought him to the police. A judge sent him to an orphanage. While the movie heightened the action for dramatic effect, we confirmed with the director of the orphanage that saroo told his story of being lost when they took him in. The social workers wrote his story in this log. Fiveyearold saroo didnt know his last name, didnt know his address, didnt know the name of his village. They put his picture on flyers, on tv, in the paper, but no one responded. He was declared a lost child of india. The woman who ran the orphanage told saroo a family in australia wanted to adopt him. About six months after getting on that train, he got on a jumbo jet to australia where he met his new mom and dad, sue and John Brierley. What was that like when he gets off the plane . Sue brierley sighs oh. John brierley pretty incredible sue brierley yes. John brierley yeah sue brierley it was just so amazing. He just had these incredible eyes, and calmness about him. He seemed a little bit cautious, but he didnt seem fearful. Whitaker they took saroo back to their home on the australian island of tasmania, where he had a toyfilled room as big as his house in india. His new mother put a map of india on his wall, so hed always remember where he came from. Sue brierley he virtually put his life in our hands from the first moment we met. Whitaker you could feel that . Sue brierley yes. Yes. Definitely. Whitaker they saved you. Saroo brierley they did. But they didnt know my past and what had been. And i only told them to the point of, you know, as much language as i had that i could describe things. Whitaker slowly, as he learned english in school, he began to reveal his past. He remembered details of the station where he got on the train to calcutta. The water tower. The pedestrian bridge. He remembered the dam where he would play in the river. Sue wrote it all down in this diary. Under the love and care of sue and john, saroo thrived. He excelled at sports. He was popular at school. Saroo brierley i was happy, i was comfortable, getting the love that i that ive always sort of wanted. Whitaker with your new life, did you think about your old life often . Saroo brierley of course i did. Those memories came alive when i went to sleep. Whitaker but sometimes in his waking hours, he would search the map of india, hoping to recognize something, hoping to find his mother. He said he feared she was anguished over losing him. How did you feel about that . Saroo brierley helpless. Thats what it was, at the end of the day. You couldnt do anything. You think about it quite a bit. I was holding onto those memories, never to let go. Whitaker nearly 20 years after he went missing, he discovered he could use his memories like a mental map to find his way home. His discovery . Google earth. Saroo brierley its just so massive. And this is what ive been sort of looking at. Whitaker with google earth, he could get a birds eye view of towns and landmarks. He calculated a search radius from calcutta based on the speed of trains and the time he thought he was locked on board. Night after night, he would follow the tracks looking for anything that would match his memory of the station where he got lost. So out of all of india, all the train stations in all of india, youre looking for a water tower and a walkway over the train tracks . Saroo brierley uhhuh. Basically, a needle in a haystack. Whitaker one night, frustrated by hours, years, of fruitless searching, he looked out farther than he ever imagined he could have traveled. Saroo brierley all of a sudden i come to this train station here and i zoom down. It matched absolutely perfectly. Whitaker the water towers right there Saroo Brierley the water tower is right there. Whitaker laughs and the pedestrian walkway. Saroo brierley the flyover bridge, the pedestrian walkway. Whitaker farther on, he saw the dam where he played in the river. It all matched what hed told his adoptive mother, sue, years earlier, down to the map they had drawn in the diary. Many people dont remember younger than five, but yet you remember in such great detail. Why do you think that is . Saroo brierley i reckon what it is, is that i never went to school. So language wasnt really in me, you know. It was all visual. My visual senses were extremely heightened. Whitaker he knew he had to go to india to try to find his mother. At the airport, sue gave him this photo. Its how he would have looked when his birth mother last saw him. Saroo brierley and all of a sudden, you know, my emotions and everything just take over me, and im just in tears. It was almost like feeling, you know, before actually knowing, mum, im coming home to see you. Whitaker after 25 years, 16 hours on the plane, and a fourhour drive, he was finally home. It was just as hed remembered the path hed walked many times to his house. But when he got there, it was abandoned. Your familys not there. What are you thinking . Saroo brierley i thought, theyre dead. I thought the worst. All the worst things that you could think of possibly was just going through my head. Whitaker saroo, now an aussie, stood out in the slum. He couldnt communicate. A man approached who spoke english. Saroo said he was looking for the family that had lived in this house. The man told saroo to come with him. Saroo brierley and i walked for about 15 meters just around the corner, and the man goes, this is your mother. And she walked forward, and i walked towards her. We were our eyes were locked together. Whitaker whatd you see in your birth mothers eyes, when you look in them for the first time in years . Saroo brierley the tears that i saw when i used to look at her and i can see that shes struggling but this time it was tears of joy. Whitaker we sent our cameras to his home village. His mother, kamla, told us, when i saw him, i knew he was my saroo. Hes now been back to india 15 times. He reunited with his sister and one brother who both had moved to a nearby city, but his mother never left their village. The movie shows the love between saroo and his oldest brother guddu, who took him to that train platform 25 years before. Kamla told saroo his brother was killed on the tracks the very night saroo was lost. On that one night, your mother lost two sons . Saroo brierley yes, and i cant think, you know, what she went through. Its like, one is just, you know, here it is, hes died, but the other one, hes just disappeared. Whitaker why did your birth mother decide to stay there in that very village . Saroo brierley because she felt that one day the son that she had lost would come back. And it was amazing because here i am, determined to find my hometown and my family from one side of the world, oceans apart, and heres my birth mother sitting there and waiting because she knew that one day her son would come back. And im so glad that she did. Whitaker saroo is now helping his biological mother in india financially, but he considers sue and John Brierley his mom and dad, and australia his home. For a look at how 60 minutes reports its stories, as well as interviews with correspondents and producers, go to 60minutesovertime. Com, sponsored by lyrica. Before fibromyalgia, i was a doer. I was active. Then the chronic, widespread pain drained my energy. My doctor said moving more helps ease fibromyalgia pain. She also prescribed lyrica. Fibromyalgia is thought to be the result of overactive nerves. Lyrica is believed to calm these nerves. Woman for some, lyrica can significantly relieve fibromyalgia pain and improve function, so i feel better. Lyrica may cause serious allergic reactions or suicidal thoughts or actions. Tell your doctor right away if you have these, new or worsening depression, or unusual changes in mood or behavior. Or swelling, trouble breathing, rash, hives, blisters, muscle pain with fever, tired feeling, or blurry vision. Common side effects are dizziness, sleepiness, weight gain and swelling of hands, legs and feet. Dont drink alcohol while taking lyrica. Dont drive or use machinery until you know how lyrica affects you. Those who have had a drug or alcohol problem may be more likely to misuse lyrica. With less pain, i can be more active. Ask your doctor about lyrica. Im bill whitaker. Well be back next week with another edition of 60 minutes. Captioning funded by cbs and ford. We go further, so you can. Captioned by Media Access Group at wgbh access. Wgbh. Org except when it comes to retirement. At fidelity, you get a retirement score in just 60 seconds. And well help you make decisions for your plan. 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