Transcripts For KQED PBS NewsHour 20150429

Getting paid. Woodruff plus, a historic legal case has the definition of marriage hanging in the balance at the Supreme Court. Ifill and, forty years after the fall of saigon, the Untold Stories of american troops final days in vietnam. Woodruff those are some of the stories were covering on tonights pbs newshour. Major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by lincoln financial committed to helping you take charge of your life and become youre own chief life officer. And the william and flora hewlett foundation, helping people build immeasurably better lives. And with the ongoing support of these institutions and. This program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. And by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. Thank you. Ifill baltimore was a city in crisis today. Soldiers and police were out in force, determined to prevent a second night of rioting. Mondays violence erupted after the funeral for freddie gray who died in Police Custody with a severe spinal injury. Today, the fires were doused and a tense calm prevailed. This is baltimore. Were winners. We dont lay down. Ifill volunteers were up at first light in baltimore, to start cleaning up the mess. Its going to take people getting involved, getting in the trenches not just behind a lectern or when cameras on, or whatever, you got to get down with the people. This is where the people are. This is where theyre hurting. Ifill the hurting started in west baltimore and spread overnight, leaving shop owners to watch as their livelihoods burned. In all, 15 buildings and 144 vehicles were set on fire by hundreds of youthful rioters. More than 200 people were arrested. Even as freddie grays mother appealed for the violence to stop. I want you all to get justice for my son but dont do it like this here. Dont tear up the whole city, man. Just for him . Its wrong. Ifill today, 2,000 National Guard troops patrolled streets, preparing to enforce the second night of a weeklong curfew. Maryland governor larry hogan said hell call in several thousand more officers from the midatlantic region, as needed. Were still concerned about what might happen this evening. Were continuing to bring more people in from around the state and from around the country. Were going to put as much manpower and as many resources as we can to make sure we do not have that kind of situation tonight. Ifill and in an extraordinary move, the Baltimore Orioles announced theyll bar the public from tomorrows game with the Chicago White sox. They canceled games last night and tonight. Meanwhile, there were questions about the citys response. Police said they were outnumbered last night, with 20 officers injured, six of them seriously. But mayor Stephanie Rawlings blake defended her decision not to ask the governor for help, sooner. You know theres always going to be armchair quarterbacks that have never sat in my seat that see things differently, but this isnt the first emergency ive dealt with. But i know that you have to put in the work on the ground and manage the crisis and thats what were doing. Ifill other city leaders joined the mayor in condemning the rioting, and called for boosting the citys economy to give hope to the young. It is not about freddie gray. It is about the pain the hurt and the suffering of these young people. And there is no excuse for them to loot, riot and destroy our city. I made a comment on yesterday out of frustration and anger when i called our children thugs. They are not thugs, they are just misdirected. We need to direct them on a different path. Ifill and president obama weighed in from the white house. He too, criticized the rioters but said its past time for national soulsearching on what drives the anger. If our society really wanted to solve the problem, it would require everybody saying this is important and dont just Pay Attention to these communities when a cvs burns or when a young man gets shot or has his spine snapped because we consider those kids our kids and they shouldnt be living in poverty and violence. Ifill as the president spoke, protesters in baltimore staged a peaceful demonstration, watched closely by police in riot gear. Ifill well hear more of what the president had to say and get a closer look at the tensions in baltimore, later in the program. Woodruff the issue of whether the constitution guarantees samesex couples the right to marry went before the u. S. Supreme court today. Justices heard two hours of arguments in cases from four states. Afterward, lawyers on both sides said the courts decision will be critical in the life of the nation. The constitution promises equal protection, and due process and liberty to all right now. Its not a popularity contest. The court, absolutely its their job to ensure that every individuals liberty and equality is protected regardless of state laws. What is so important i think for the country to understand is that when the court takes social decisions like this away from the people, it cuts off debate, it hardens positions, and when people are forced to sit down with each other and talk civilly and compassionately and try to persuade, we are a much better democracy for that. Woodruff a decision is expected by june. Well hear some of the audio from todays arguments, and analysis, after the news summary. Ifill little by little, aid began getting to earthquake survivors in nepal today, but the death toll kept rising to more than 4,600. Mark austen of independent Television News reports from the ravaged capital city of kathmandu. Reporter it is desperate, it is disorganized. And it is almost certainly too late. In the center of kathmandu still they dig frantically in hope. A community overwhelmed is doing the best it can. But in truth, it is hopelessly inadequate for the task in hand here. This was a temple, a favorite with the tourists, some almost certainly lie buried here. And on the mound of rubble those who came for a holiday are instead helping an illprepared country deal with catastrophe. Nobody whos organizing us. Were just doing what we think is right. And people are giving us like Different Directions all the time. Considering the tools were using and the man power, its amazing. Reporter but it looks so chaotic. It is. It is, really. But its happening looks like they might have found somebody. Reporter as we spoke, the shouts of the chaos signaling another body had been found. With every passing hour, the number of dead increases, and the chances of finding anyone alive diminish. They think they may find survivors here, still. But the cold reality has to be this is day four after the earthquake. And this is now really a recovery operation. And the frantic search for survivors is matched only by the growing clamor for food. Here, they are handing out small bags of cooking oil and noodles. But just look at the desperation. And just look at the queues. These are the people unable or too frightened to return to their homes. And just as nature has dealt them one terrible blow, the weather is frowning on them too. The rain, a lack of sanitation and overcrowded conditions, are all the ingredients needed for one crisis to follow another. This aid worker is very worried. Any outbreak of Waterborne Diseases can happen anytime here. And if that happens, it would be, it would be a scenario of epidemic. You wont be able to control in this population of 5,0007,000 in this ground. And there are people on the other side as well. So its very very difficult here. Reporter and you think that is a realistic possibility . Yes. Thats a very, very realistic possibility. Reporter in this shattered city this evening, more International Specialist rescue teams are finally getting down to work. If there is anyone still alive, these are the people who will find them. But no earthquake can stop the passing of time. It is four days and counting. Kathmandu is a place in need of miracles. When tonight, all it has is despair. Ifill after night fell a french rescue team did free a survivor from the ruins of a hotel in katmandu. But closer to the quake epicenter, 250 people were missing after a mudslide and avalanche. Woodruff in saudi arabia, authorities said theyve broken up a plot to carry out a suicide bombing attack on the u. S. Embassy in riyadh. Two suspects were arrested, along with more than 90 others with alleged ties to the Islamic State group. Ifill tensions flared today in the persian gulf. The u. S. Military said Iranian Forces fired warning shots across the bridge of a cargo vessel, sailing under the flag of the marshall islands. It happened in the strait of hormuz. The iranians directed the ship to sail toward their navys main port at bandar abbas. There were no americans aboard, but the u. S. Navy sent a destroyer to monitor the situation. Woodruff the u. S. Senate has begun debating a bill to let Congress Review and possibly reject any Nuclear Agreement reached with iran. The bill has bipartisan support and republican Majority Leader Mitch Mcconnell predicted a vigorous discussion. Preventing the worlds leading state sponsor of terrorism from gaining access to Nuclear Weapons should be the goal of all senators no matter what party they belong to. The price of a bad agreement with iran could be catastrophic. Woodruff republicans have offered more than 50 amendments on everything from irans human rights record to its support for islamist militants. Minority leader harry reid and other democrats warned some of the amendments are poison pills designed to disrupt the nuclear negotiations. A number of my republican colleagues have stated publicly in their efforts to be a republican nominee for president , what they want to do with this bill. I am concerned that they and others want to use this good, bipartisan piece of legislation as a platform for their political ambitions. Woodruff its unclear exactly when the senate might get to a final vote on the bill. Ifill indonesia executed eight convicted drug smugglers by a firing squad. Indonesia has some of the toughest drug laws in the world and rejected pleas from around the world to delay the executions, amid allegations of flaws. The execution of one drug convict, a woman from the philippines, was delayed. Woodruff from nigeria theres word that nearly 300 girls and women have been rescued from boko haram militants. The Army Announcement today said theyre being screened and profiled. But a spokesman said they do not include any of the 200plus girls abducted from the village of chibok a year ago. Ifill back in this country, president obama and japanese Prime Minister shinzo abe said today theyre determined to go ahead with a free trade agreement. The president acknowledged opposition in congress to the transpacific partnership, but said its critical to expanding u. S. Influence and exports in asia. Abe addresses congress tomorrow. Woodruff the nations largest poultry producer will eliminate the use of human antibiotics in its chicken flocks. Tyson foods announced today its halting the practice in 2017. Its the latest and largest such move in the poultry industry, amid concern that widespread use of antibiotics is generating supergerms. Ifill the National Football league is giving up the tax exempt status its held since the 1940s. In a statement today, commissioner Roger Goodell said the league wants to eliminate a recurring dispute with congress over the issue. Individual nfl teams already pay taxes. Woodruff and on wall street, the Dow Jones Industrial average gained more than 70 points to close above 18,100. The nasdaq fell about five points, and the s p added nearly six. Ifill still to come on the newshour we listen in on todays samesex marriage debate at the Supreme Court. Then, we dive deep into the unrest in baltimore. President obama on what he called a slow rolling crisis. South carolina senator tim scott on the Police Accountability link between North Charleston and baltimore. And how a citys troubled history laid the ground for the recent unrest. Plus, a filmmaker documents the last days in vietnam. Woodruff it was a historic day at the Supreme Court. At stake, the definition of marriage. Justices split the issue into two questions must every state permit samesex marriage . And if not, do states have to recognize samesex marriages performed elsewhere . Protesters from both sides of the debate crowded outside the Court Building in washington this morning. Marcia coyle of the National Law Journal was there and joins us now. Marcia, big day at the court. Knowing 36 states already declare samesex marriage legal, what were the petitioners today asking the court to decide . Base canically theyre laying claim to the 14th amendments guarantee of equal protection and due process of law. Theyre saying that the court has recognized that there is a fundamental right to marry and under the 14th amendment theyve been. They deserve to be part and the participate in that fundamental right. The states that still do ban samesex marriage, they claim, are excluding them from that fundamental right to marry. It was a packed courtroom judy, and the arguments were fast paced and intense, and i hope anybody who is interested will listen to the full audio and read the transcript. Woodruff well listen to some of them in a moment. But how did the arguments unfold . First argument was on the marriage question whether the 14th amendment requires states the license these marriages. The arguments focus on several key issues. The justices probed who should be deciding this. Should it be the court itself, or should bit the states through their electorate . Also, has enough time passed for us to gauge whether theres any impact, good or bad, on the family unit and children in particular of samesex marriages, and then also what is the states real interest here in banning these marriages when it recognizes other types of marriages, even though they still stick with the traditional definition. Now we picked out, as you said, this is one rare case where they do allow an audio recording. We have worked with you today to pick out three different clips. The first one, marcia is an exchange initiated by the chief justice with the attorney representing the samesex couple. Almost off the bat the chief justice probed her about the definition of marriage. Woodruff lets listen to that. Woodruff what have we learned from that . Well, i think the justices are being very cautious here. Theyre pointing out how long we have had this definition of marriage as between a man and a woman, but what she was saying and i think she got a real boost from justice ginsburg, Justin Ginsburg noted that the institution of marriage has changed over the years. There was a time when a woman was obligated to follow her husband, but the Supreme Court in a decision ended that so marriage does evolve and change and this is just another instance of how it can change. Woodruff all right. Now the second clip were going to listen to this was initiated by Justice Anthony kennedy. Widely seen as a swing vote on the court. Yes. Woodruff lets listen to that one. Woodruff now what about that . We know that Justice Kennedy had other questions at other times that were more sympathetic. Yes later in the argument there were things that he said that did indicate he was sympathetic to the marriage claims, but, again, the attorney is reassuring the justices that this is not something thats terribly new. As she pointed out, first samesex marriage case came to the Supreme Court in 1972, over 40 years ago. And the hawaii Supreme Court, i think it was back in the early 1990s, indicated that it might rule in favor of samesex marriage. So she is saying that this is something thats been around and has been talked about and its time basically for the court to decide this. Woodruff very quickly, when Justice Kennedy weighed in sounding sympathetic to the other side, what was that about . Justice kennedy has written the three prior decisions of the Court Dealing with gay rights basically, and if you read those decisions and you come to the most recent one u. S. Versus windsor involving the defense of marriage act, hes spoken about the dignity of the individual and hes also talked about the importance of marriage and dignity to gay couples and their children. So in the questioning, he did bring that forward about how marriage does bestow dignity on those who participate in it. Woodruff the third clip is from an exchange from a attorney that represents a state that bans bans samesex marriage and justice sotomayor. Heres that one. Woodruff what do you think . The justices are trying to get from the attorney what is the states real interest here. And not so much who has to decide it, as he was making that argument. That is one of the states argument, but what is the states interest in banning these marriages . And mr. Birsch will tell them and hell be repeatedly asked what this is that basically the states interest is in promoting the stability of the family unit and the bonding of children with their biological parents. An interest in procreation, as well. And thats developed as the arguments go along as justices ask him if repeatedly also, what is the harm to children or the family you it in if there are gay marriages. Woodruff just finally marcia, there was a second question earlier that the justices were discussing as part of the argument, and that is whether states should recognize marriages performed in other states if that state itself bans samesex marriage. This question will become critical if those who are in favor of gay marriage lose on that first question. Then it does become a recognition issue. And today the lawyer for already married gay couples told the court theres not only a fundamental right to marry but there is a right to remain married, and these states that dont recognize those marriages are basically destroying that family unit in their state. And he pointed to the historical practice of states to recognize marriages conducted in other states, so why not these. In reply, tennessees lawyer said basically that it was the historical practice when all the states had the same definition of marriage. The landscape is different today, and the state can decide not to recognize a marriage that doesnt comport with its own policies. Woodruff marcia coyle the decision is coming in june. Yes, it is. Its going to be a big june, judy. Woodruff thank you. My pleasure. Ifill we return now to the turmoil in baltimore, beginning with a portion of president obamas extensive remarks on the topic, this afternoon in the rose garden. When individuals get crowbars and start prying open doors to loot, theyre not protesting. Theyre not making a statement. Theyre stealing. When they burn down a building theyre committing arson. And theyre destroying and undermining businesses and opportunities in their own communities that rob jobs and opportunity from people in that area. The violence that happened yesterday distracted from the fact that you had seen multiple days of peaceful protest that were focused on entirely legitimate concerns of these communities in baltimore. Led by clergy and Community Leaders, and they were constructive. And they were thoughtful. And frankly it didnt get that much attention. And one burning building will be looped on television over and over and over again, and the thousands of demonstrators who did it the right way i think have been lost in the discussion. What id say is this has been a slow rolling crisis this has been going on for a long time. This is not new. And we shouldnt predead pretend that its new. The good news is that perhaps theres some newfound awareness because of social media and video cams are and so forth that there are problems and challenges when it comes to how policing and our laws are applied in certain communities, and we have to Pay Attention to that and respond. If we are serious about solving this problem, then were going to not only have to help the police, but were going to have to think about what can we do the rest of us, to make sure that were providing Early Education to these kids, to make sure that were reforming our criminal Justice System so its not just a pipeline from schools to prisons. So that were not rendering men in these communities unemployable because of a felony record for a nonviolent drug offense, that were making investments so they can get the training they need the find jobs. Thats hard. That requires more than just the occasional news report or task force. Thats how i feel. I think there are a lot of good people around the country that feel that way, but that kind of political mobilization i think we havent seen that in quite some time. And what ive tried to do is to promote those ideas that would make a difference, but i think we all understand that the politics are rather tough because its easy to take more of those problems or the treat them just as a law and order issue as opposed to a broader social issue. Ifill less than a month ago all eyes were on North Charleston, south carolina, where another Police Department was under fire in the unexplained death of yet another black man. Republican senator tim scott of south carolina, one of only two African Americans in the senate is also saying things have to change. I met him at his Capitol Hill Office earlier today to talk about it. Senator, thank you for joining us. Yes maam. Ifill as you watch everything thats unfolding in baltimore, does it remind you at all of North Charleston and the walter scott situation . The images i see in baltimore are very different than what i experienced at home in North Charleston for several reasons. One reason is we had a video. The second reason, there was quick action and abarrest, and third is that the mother of the victim was very clear in asking for peace and sharing in her heart the forgiveness that resided in her heart for the officers. Ifill two things at work here. On one hand, there is the reaction to the incident. Yes. Ifill and then theres the incident itself. If there had not been video you seem to suggest what would have happened later wouldnt happen. And theres still uncertainty about what happened in baltimore to freddie gray after he was arrested. So youre talking about body cameras. How does that get to the bottom of this . Well, i tell you theres no doubt that bodyworn cameras are effective tools to make it so that justice is done, that clarity and transparency are available. It also helps to reduce the number of complaints against Law Enforcement officers and it also, according to some studies, reduces the amount of violence and or force used by officers by 60 . So the result of officers wearing cameras has been very positive, and the information that continues to come in reinforces the fact that body cameras are a positive tool in Law Enforcement and bringing the community and the police together. Ifill does it bother you at all that its even necessary, that in order to protect people from Inappropriate Police violence that you need the videotape . Isnt there a problem here . There certainly are a lot of things to consider. One thing you know for sure is that those cameras do help. I would suggest that the vast majority of Law Enforcement officers every single day work with integrity the highest level of character, but its finding the bad apple that spoils the whole bunch. One thing that a camera does is it captures and very often the information that it captures is indisputable. What we need today more than ever before is indisputable evidence that leads to conclusions that can be reinforced by the very evidence that we have. So i dont know that what were seeing today is brandnew. As much as it is bringing it to the surface because of the cameras. Ifill does the federal government have a responsibility to address the root causes . People say its unemployment that its anger after years of being profiled stereotyped whatever you think the reason behind all of this is, does the federal government have a role . I think the nation as a whole has a role in making sure that each individual, each citizen maximizes ones potential. So we all have a role in that. As it relates to the federal government taking over local Law Enforcement issues, i dont think that we should. I dont think that we can and i dont think that we will, but having a role to play in making sure that we use the positions that we have to bring peace and transparency throughout the nation is very very necessary. The kid who failed out of high school as a freshman i know firsthand and personally that sense of hopelessness and just being drifting in the wrong direction, having really no hope. Being able to harness that frustration was incredibly valuable in my life. Thats one of the reason i focus so consistently on the foundation of education because it helps to eviscerate those things that unemployment high jobless rates, poverty its as close to magic as you can get in america education. Ifill you voted against the confirmation of loretta lynch. Ifill yes. Is there any role she should play now . Well certainly congratulations. Shes our attorney general. I look forward to working with her. She stands ready to provide assistance when necessary. I think at this point the state and the city are trying to address the situation. I think the federal government can play a role if necessary. At this point the city and the state have been able to Work Together and they have seen the delimit of National Guard units prepared to go in. Ifill you are obviously a black man, one of only two African American men in the senate. I wonder if you were the while you talked about before who could have gone off on a bad path whether you would expect more of government in this kind of situation. I think people, especially being that kid, i was that kid just a couple years ago. I use that term loosely obviously. The fact of the matter is that kids look for hope. They look for inspiration. It doesnt have to come from the government frankly. It just has to come. For me it came in the form of a mentor who created the first four years of my new life. Hope comes from many sources. I think depending on the federal government to be some sort of a savior is false hope. Ifill lets take the government out of. This just as Community Leaders, youve met with Community Lead centers ferguson. You have obviously met with ones in North Charleston, watching very closely as this unfolds in baltimore, what should we as a society be thinking, be doing on behalf to soften the pain arising in these communities. My three ps would be pray. Pray first. Second prepare. And then persist. Persisting to me means today is the day for full engagement. We have to be persistent in engaging those folks in the community who have the ability to influence others. Its very difficult from the outside to come into a community and make a difference, but it was very easy for me as a North Charleston native to sit down and talk with immunities leaders and pastors, to young people about what was happening. So being persistent is very, very helpful. co we have to also prepare. Part of preparation is understanding how do you avoid circumstances that were seeing unfold. Thats why the body cameras are important from my perspective. It prepares us in advance of a crisis. Another part of preparation is looking at the educational outcome of the kids in the neighborhood. When you have high unemployment you have low graduation rates, you are starting to see the formation of challenging circumstances, especially when its steeped in poverty. So we can do something about those issues on the local level, on the state level and on the federal level. We can unleash american capitalism in such a way it helps to become headwinds to things that are destructive. We can be a force for good. Senator tim scott, thank you very much. Yes, maam, good to be with you. Woodruff now, the view from the neighborhood where freddy gray lived. Pbs newshour special correspondent jackie judd has spent the last few days trying to understand why grays death has sparked so much rage. Reporter baltimore often lives up to its nickname of charm city. But after a week of peaceful protests, baltimore is now showing itself to be an angry and volatile city. Baltimore, we dont have a Good Relationship with the police. They whip our ass every day. This is nothing new to baltimore. Reporter freddie grays videotaped arrest april 12, and his death a week later from a severe spinal cord injury, has exposed a crisis long in the making. The citys Police Commissioner Anthony Batts acknowledged that broken relationship in a remarkably candid interview. Where we thought we were doing gods work, where were going out trying to make the community safer, weve made mass arrests. Weve locked people up, weve taken people to jail in numbers and weve obliterated this community. Reporter if there is a ground zero, it is here where gray lived. Sandtown in west baltimore. Pock marked by vacant buildings, struggling with higher than average unemployment and poverty, and a robust heroin market. It is a place empty of what usually constitutes a neighborhood. There are no grocery stores, no banks, no restaurants. But plentiful liquor stores. A place seemingly without a future for its young men and women. Ray kelley had runins with local police as a young man and is now a Community Activist youre dealing with a population here trying to survive, trying to eat. And its not really about black or white, its about survival. Reporter officers do not have an easy task in patrolling sandtown and similar high crime neighborhoods. The very Tactics Police employ to serve them are alienating residents like tito dillard. You know its just kind of devastating to know that at the end of the day i would rather put my trust in my neighbor. I would rather call my neighbor in the need of help. Rather than someone who is getting paid. Reporter a front page story in the Baltimore Sun last year caused ripples through the city because it confirmed the reality of what had long been alleged. Investigative reporter marc puente documented Excessive Force almost exclusively against black men and women. They were teenagers up to an 87yearold grandmother. She suffered a broken arm. A church deacon, a 25yearold accountant, a 50yearold cafeteria worker. Reporter and what conclusion did you come away with . The baltimore Police Department has a culture where discipline is not a priority. We looked at and asked for discipline files. People filed complaints against officers. Internal affairs didnt investigate them. They couldnt provide any paperwork on what the complaints said. Or they said the people never filed complaints, although they did. Reporter despite the stonewalling, residents were still able to reach legal settlements in more than 100 cases, costing the city over six million dollars. How did baltimore get to such a low point . In other cities, like North Charleston or ferguson, where black men have been victimized by police, the assumption has been that if minority communities were more fully represented on the police force and in city hall then their deaths may not have occurred. But, baltimore has a black mayor, a black Police Commissioner, a largely black city council and a diverse police force. Thats not enough according to lawrence bell, himself a former elected official. Its less about the color of the officer its about the culture. Its kind of an old boy network. Its very military to a large extent. And there are people who have been recruited, many of whom have a spirit of service but then you have people who have a spirit of adventurism. And theyre people recruited from outside the city who see African American men and see the enemy. I know we need to make changes. We need to change the culture in this organization. And i am going to make it happen. Reporter some here in baltimore trace the uneasy relations back 50 years to the Civil Rights Movement and subsequent riots. Or, to the late 90s when Violent Crime was alarmingly high, and thenmayor Martin Omalley instituted a zero tolerance crime policy. What you do is you go around and arrest people for petty crimes. The idea is you can stop major crimes by enforcing petty crimes. But what happened is we had just an epidemic of arrests. Reporter Violent Crime dropped dramatically. At a cost. So we created an antagonism. It seemed like every black man in the inner city of baltimore was being arrested. So you have a whole generation of people who have arrest records, which affects their ability to get employment. So that exacerbated that strain. Reporter which helps explain the rage seen on the streets of baltimore in recent days. At freddie grays funeral yesterday, speaker after speaker expressed hope that this fraught moment in the citys history would be an opportunity to institute reform. But shortly after, that rage again took over, and in the words of mayor rawlingsblake thugs looted stores, set fires and clashed violently with the police. Some reform ideas being talked about include outfitting the police with body cameras. The gray familys lawyer spoke about a need for a special prosecutor. Community organizer ray kelly wants a more engaged mayor. She still has not come out as a leader in sandtown. Where we need a leader right now. Right now, unless we can reach every resident individually we need our city leader to come forward and say, look, heres what we are gonna do about it. Thats why theres pandemonium because there is no structure from the top. Reporter it is not uncommon for black parents to explain to their children how to behave to be invisible around police. Freddie grays troubles started when he looked an officer in the eye, instead of looking away. Mariska lee, a Community Activist, says her hope is that change will now come, and the conversation wont be needed when her toddler son is a teenager. The thing that bothers me the most is, i see people looking at him and oohing and aahing and cooing. And those very same people may one day be afraid of him. I dont want to have to teach him certain things. Reporter it will take breaking very old, very embedded habits to end the long mistrust between police and those they pledge to serve and protect. For the pbs newshour, this is jackie judd in baltimore. Woodruff this week marks the fortieth anniversary of the fall of saigon, when the north Vietnamese Army completed its takeover of the city, bringing a twodecade long conflict to a close. Tonights American Experience tells the story of those frenzied final days in an oscar nominated documentary, last days in vietnam. I sat down with filmmaker rory kennedy recently about her film which shows harrowing evacuations, the city under assault, and efforts to save americans and South Vietnamese. We began with an excerpt about those final hours. That morning c. I. A. Choppers began picking up evacuators off the roofs of buildings and bringing them to the embassy. He was an old pilot he was blind in one eye and lame in one leg, and i said harnage weve got people. You got to go pick them up. It was the deputy c. I. A. Station chiefs apartment building. There were a number of very highrisk vietnamese, including the defense minister of South Vietnam, all waiting to be rescued. As they climbed up the ladder to the roof, the photographer took that famous photograph, many people thought that was the u. S. Embassy. It wasnt. But it indicated to what extent chaos had descended on this entire operation. Inside the embassy, everywhere we looked was teeming with vietnamese. We counted. The total number was about 2,800. There was no hiding it that somehow people had to have let these people into the embassy. Was it, you know security guards who looked the other way . Was it American Employees in the embassy who were doing kind of what we did, black ops and taking care of their own . We never got to the bottom of that, and frankly, we never pursued it. Woodruff rory kennedy who created the documentary last days in vietnam, thank you for being with us. As we just saw, a remarkable story. There was chaos but it was also an incredible human story wasnt it . Silt a human story. And i think that the film ultimately is a reminder of the human cost of war. The way we tell the story we dont have a narrator. We dont have any historians. Its all people who were in saigon, who were on the front lines and telling us what happened. It really is told like a thriller, you know these Extraordinary Events unfold and the people on the ground acted with incredible courage and i think with one of the things thats remarkable about the story is its really been largely untold. I think its a story we think we know, for example that helicopter we all think was on top of the embassy, it was not on top of the embassy. And thats what we know as a story, but we dont know what happened. I think for the first time this story is told in this film, and its really eye opening. Well, you said, we think we know so much. Its true. So much has been written and said and filmed about vietnam. What drew you back to it and especially what drew you back to those final hours . Well i think in part i felt that the story had not been told and needed to be told. I think that in vietnam as a seminole moment in our nations history, and to go back and tell the story of these final days seemed important that also timely and i think were struggling with how to get out of iraq and afghanistan, and there are a lot ofless isnts to be learned from what happened in vietnam, how we got out of that war, what we failed to do, our responsibility to the people left behind, particularly the people who worked so closely with americans who because of their association with the americans faced greater vulnerability. Woodruff there were some truly courageous people, are truly courageous people in the telling of this story. In fact you focus on the hero, the ones who went against what they were being told by their bosses, whether it was the white house or the ambassador, and worked very hard to get as many vietnamese out as possible. I think the film takes an unflinching look at american policy and the fact that ultimately we abandoned our vietnamese allies. In the face of that there were handful of americans and South Vietnamese who were on the ground who really acted heroically, who went against u. S. Policy, who certainly risked their jobs and arguably their lives to save as many vietnamese as possible. Woodruff you were able to get remarkable video from on board the ships that were out just off shore from vietnam, some with helicopters landing, jam, crammed with people who were just some of them miraculously able to get them to safety. Yeah, well, its an extraordinary story. What happened was the u. S. Fleet was in the south china sea, and the u. S. Helicopters were heading out to that fleet. The south Vietnamese Air force had disintegrated. But they were still South Vietnamese pilots with their helicopters, so they started chasing the u. S. Helicopters out to the fleet and first ship they came to the was the u. S. S. Kirk. The captain of the kirk said, who are these people . We dont know lets bring them down. Brought the first helicopter down some many vietnamese came out they were so grateful they didnt have room for more helicopters. The crusade, what do we do . He said, throw that helicopter overboard, lets make room for the next one. There is an amazing story in the film for a chinook helicopter that comes to the kirk its the doubleprop helicopter. It cant land because its too big. The helicopter pilot opens the door of the helicopter and he has his eightmonthold baby, his twoyearold, fiveyearold, and he throws them out the door on to the moving ship thats 18 feet below. One by one we jumped out. I jumped out. My brother jumped out. My mom was holding my sister. Obviously very scary. And she just, you know, just trusted me with her right hand, holding on with her left to brace herself just dropped my baby sister. One guy was standing there and he said he looked up and he saw this big bundle of stuff flying out and it was the baby. It was the oneyearold baby. Can you imagine throwing your child out of a helicopter and. The baby was caught. And the baby was call by the crew. Its all on film. And the story after story like that in this film that i mean. I certainly didnt know going into this. It had just been a great honor to be able to share it with people. Woodruff is part of this to say it wasnt all bad as you just said there were people doing things, trying to save as many South Vietnamese as they could who had been important to americans . Its what happened on the ground. We really tell the story of what was going on in saigon in those last 24 hours. The airport was bombed. The north said youve got 24 hours to get out of here. The evacuation was moved to the embassy. It was based on a helicopter airlift. So the perspective we tell is what was going on at that airport, what was going on in the embassy, what was going on in the fleet. What were the helicopter pilots doing . What about the marines who were left behind. What was happening and the reality was they were doing everything they could to save South Vietnam vietnam needs. I think it does adjust our understanding of those final days in an important way. Woodruff rory kennedy, the documentary is last days in vietnam on American Experience. We thank you. Thank you so much. Ifill finally tonight, broadway honors some of its finest shows and performers. The tony nominations were released today, with the musicals an american in paris and fun home leading the pack with 12 nods each. Arts correspondent Jeffrey Brown has profiled several of this years nominees, including disgraced, which is up for best play. It examines questions about identity and islam in america after 9 11. Jeff spoke with playwright, ayad akhtar, about what he was hoping to convey to audiences. There was a character who was speaking to me with this kind of relentless passion, amir, the lead character in the play, who has this very particular point of view on islam. Hes muslim birth, of birth and origin, but has sort of strongly moved away from it and is very critical of islam. But i came to understand that what the play was really trying to get at was the way in which we secretly continue to hold on to our tribal identities, our identities of birth, of education, despite our, despite getting more enlightened. Brown theres almost a suggestion that, whatever we do, our education, or our jobs, or our marriages, we cant, we never get past this kind of tribal allegiances. It i didnt seem to be able to pull the play away from that conclusion. I tried. But these characters continued to find meaning and find some kind of safety as the situation, the dramatic situation devolved, in those tribal identities. Ifill the play wolf hall picked up eight nominations, including best play and best costume design. Its based on a novel by british author hilary mantel, which tells the story of king henry the eighth and his chief advisor, thomas cromwell. And in addition to a play the novel has been made into a masterpiece miniseries on pbs. Jeffs piece on wolf hall, in all its forms, aired earlier this month. Heres a portion of that. Brown the theater production also went for historical accuracy, from jewelry to the elaborate costumes, which took 25 seamstresses more than 8,000 hours to make. Mantel has worked closely with both productions, especially the play, including attending previews on broadway, observing actor ben miles as cromwell, and then giving notes and ideas to the director and cast. I dont think of the novels when im in the theater, but my mind is divided, because part of me is thinking, now, this scene is looking interesting tonight. What is the king going to do next . Brown really . Even youre thinking that . I think that an imaginative writer for stage or novel has a still has a responsibility to their reader, and that responsibility is to get the history right. Brown you want to do that . Absolutely. Thats the absolute foundation of what i do. I begin to imagine at the point where the facts run out. But, like a historian, im working on the great marshy ground of interpretation. Ifill online, you can watch the complete interviews. Plus Jeffrey Browns chat with elisabeth moss, nominated today for best actress, for her perfomance in the heidi chronicles. All that and more is on our web site, pbs. Org newshour. Woodruff tune in later this evening,on charlie rose. How will the Supreme Court rule . An analysis of the same sex marriage case. Ifill and thats the newshour for tonight. Im gwen ifill. Woodruff and im judy woodruff. Well see you online, and again here tomorrow evening. For all of us here at the pbs newshour, thank you and good night. Moving our economy for 160 years. Bnsf, the engine that connects us. Lincoln financial committed to helping you take charge of your life and become youre own chief life officer. And with the ongoing support of these institutions and. This program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. And by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. Thank you. Captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc captioned by Media Access Group at wgbh access. Wgbh. Org this is nightly business with Tyler Mathisen and sue herera. Miss tweets. Shares of twitter plunged nearly 20 after earnings were leaked early on what else . Twitter. Battling back. Hammering the global pharmaceutical and what they are doing to get back. And what the top money mathers expect from the Federal Reserve as they begin a twoday policy meet all of that and more for tuesd february 28th. Im Tyler Mathisen sue herera has the night off. Call it a taste of a twofleet tweet