Transcripts for KQED 88.5 FM/KQEI 89.3 FM [KQED] KQED 88.5 FM/KQEI 89.3 FM [KQED] 20191101 010000

Continuing efforts to end the 18 year war tone Bowman n.p.r. News Washington consumers are opening their pocketbooks in September the government reporting today consumer spending rose 2 chance of a percent last month stocks lost ground on Wall Street today the Dow dropped 140 points the Nasdaq fell 11 points this is n.p.r. Live from k.q.e.d. News I'm Tara Siler p.g. And e. Says it quote had a good day in its efforts to restore power after the company's preventative blackouts utilities Mark Quinlan says this morning there were 40000 customers still in the dark and we were down all day as of 5 yeah right before this bridge may only have proximity 6700 customers that remain without service in our expectation is there will be a return service they are going to receive out here in the days and day Quinlan also says they don't anticipate any further power shutoffs over the next 7 days Meanwhile they can Cade fire is 60 percent contained and most of the evacuation warnings have been canceled a security officer with the Valley transportation authority shot and killed a man at a center as a light rail station last night authorities allege the man was threatening people with knives and a pair of scissors Santa Clara County sheriff's office spokesman Sergeant Michael low at one point when the suspect was advancing quickly towards that security officer he got within 5 to 10 feet of that security officer who was given those verbal commands to drop the weapon drop the knives and suspect did not comply low says the man was taken to a local hospital where he was pronounced dead his name has not yet been released sheriff's deputies provide security for the p.t.a. Which also employs guards through a contractor of e.t.a. Spokeswoman says this is the 1st such incident the agency has had I'm Terris Siler k.q.e.d. News support comes from Stanford health care where patients and physicians term when health care. Matters Most support for n.p.r. Comes from a group or family foundation supporting N.P.R.'s efforts to promote deeper thinking broader perspective than trusted fact based information always with the goal of creating a more informed public and from the listeners of k.q.e.d. Public radio support for k.q.e.d. Comes from Splunk working to help bring data to every question decision and action that affects an organization from i t operations to security to business analytics Splunk the data to everything platform more at Splunk dot com. From n.p.r. News this is All Things Considered I'm Elsa Chang and I'm Mary Louise Kelly today's headline witness in the impeachment inquiry corroborated many aspects of the now infamous July phone call between President Trump and the president of Ukraine but Tim Morrison said he did not think anything illegal was discussed Morrison as a top official on the National Security Council and he is one of the final witnesses that lawmakers will hear from behind closed doors the House voted today largely along party lines to make impeachment proceedings public next month so let's hear now from a lawmaker who was in the room as Morrison spoke and Democrat Peter Welch of Vermont is a member of the House Intelligence Committee welcome Congressman thank you so I want to zoom in right in on that sentence from Morrison's opening statement he said quote I want to be clear I was not concerned that anything illegal was discussed what you think about interpretation of the July 25th I'm call well he's a trump loyalist but bottom line it's illegal to solicit foreign assistance to participate in a domestic campaign that's the whole. Investigation report about Russian interference and in fact that call that the president made and he released the transcript that has him in his own words asking the president of Ukraine for a favor in the favor is to dig up dirt on a potential political opponent Vice President Biden. To go back to the 2016 campaign and the discredited theory that it was Ukraine not Russia that would head the transaction would have been illegal but Morrison concluded that there was nothing illegal that he heard or that he saw in that phone call doesn't that undercut the argument that the phone call was impeachable conduct No it doesn't I mean that's his opinion in the fact of the president requesting an illegal act that is campaign assistance from a foreign power and of course we have all the other evidence that the president was using the authority of his office to withhold. Congressionally approved military aid to defend help Ukraine defend itself from Russian aggression so am I hearing from what you're saying that this overall picture that's been coalescing from all these different witnesses do you believe that President Trump has committed impeachable offenses Well I voted to proceed with the inquiry today so yes I mean that there there's really 2 major questions that are coming together in midst of all of the conflict back and forth one is is a president about of the rule of law that's a basic question and that has been asked as a result of the president in his own phone call making a request of a foreign power for campaign assistance and then immense evidence to show that he was withholding foreign aid and was running a sidebar 3 and make us foreign policy in Ukraine so that is a very very serious concern and if the president if the Congress comes to the conclusion that he did that it's a question of whether we'll hold him accountable and there's a 2nd question. There's a 2nd question I was going to say there's a 2nd question in its about whether Congress is going to defend what has been our constitutional system of checks and balances where we have co-equal branches of government and nobody has exclusive power and what you've seen from the president in response to the impeachment inquiry is something that neither Nixon nor Bill Clinton did he has repudiated the notion that Congress has any authority whatsoever to even ask the question about what his conduct was I mean is not of that he should be held accountable let me come in on this issue of exclusive power I mean I want to talk about how this whole inquiry has been behind closed doors for weeks I want to ask you this by giving Republicans the opportunity to dig in and argue that so much has been withheld from the public so far Democrats eroding the possibility of some bipartisan support for impeachment. I think that the president trumps doing a good job of eroding. Any bipartisan support because you see he was encouraging this folks in the freedom caucus who came and interfered with that witness who was there to testify and in fact it wasn't about a transparent process about their effort to stop the process but the bottom line here is that standard investigations are done initially in private so that you can get the most information and in fact I've been in all of these hearings and Republicans are there sitting next to me all Republicans who are serving on one of 3 committees in Congress are entitle to be there some are many of them aren't but you know we've got how do you make this whole process credible to the general public if half of Congress just isn't onboard with how the process has been going so far. Well you're getting to the heart of what is real a reality that there's no escaping impeachment by definition is a very divisive process and as he remembered Speaker Pelosi was really reluctant to go down this route it was only as a result of the release of that transcript in the information that came out about Ukraine that what was politically unpalatable became constitutionally essential to stand up for the rule of law and the separation of powers and equal branch authority of Congress that's Democrat Peter Welch of Vermont thanks very much for joining us thank you all right we're going to bring in now n.p.r. Congressional reporter reporter Claudia solace from the Capitol What stood out to you listening to Congressman Watts just now Potter Well it's interesting he is using the argument of Morrison's testimony being a master of matter of opinion basically in when he this witness said that he didn't see anything illegal happen in the call Ironically that's the same argument that Republicans have used saying that many witnesses before this have expressed their opinion and they also didn't see anything illegal however Democrats such as Congressman Welch point to Morrison is just another piece in this puzzle filling in the picture that the president with health military aid in exchange for an investigation of his political opponents so even though Morrison express this opinion it seems that they feel this inquiry is continuing on the path and they just continue to gather stronger evidence for the final impeachment vote so you did get the sense that more since testimony that nothing illegal was discussed did in fact bolster the Republicans argument that there was nothing impeachable about the conversation on that call yes I have to think today Morrison has to be one of the Republicans favorite witnesses that have come through during this closed door process. However Democrats have seen plenty of evidence before Morrison that has been corroborated Morrison also said that he corroborated previous testimony so it's a bolster for Republicans but they haven't had a lot of that during this process now Democrats are stressing that look this impeachment Kori it's going into this new phase of the republic but aren't the committee's planning more closed door depositions now yeah so this falls into a little bit of logistics the house goes into a recess period tomorrow so closed door proceeding seem like the best avenue However it seems when they return from recess later in November it seems like that maybe when they pull the trigger and go into this public phase with public witnesses and hearings That's N.P.R.'s Claudio Thanks Claudia thanks for having me . Wildfires in northern and southern California have driven tens of thousands of people from their homes some have endured wildfires smoke floods blackouts and evacuations many times before and while California's population is predicted to top 40000000 this year a few people are wondering might it be time to flee for good Leslie McClurg from member station k.q.e.d. Explains just a few weeks ago felt van Gelder is biggest chore was clearing Christie mud and debris from his property we've been through several flood situations there this was the worst we've seen in 40 years in February record breaking downpours drenched the vineyards surrounding dies or Val the idyllic town a few hours north of San Francisco turned into an island water crept toward the front porch of Van Gelder is a green wooden cottage and you know we watch it coming up step by step during the day finally the top step disappeared the 74 year old guitarist lost fruit orchards a wood shop and art studio will be cleaning up from the flood for the rest of our. Yes the property was just starting to look normal when Van Gelder jolted out of bed last Thursday the fires were raging through the hills firefighters warned his family flames could level the town his neighborhood was under a mandatory evacuation order and I said I understand that I say I will remain vigilant he and his wife refused to leave the land they had nurtured for decades they weathered a few smoky days without electricity or gas then ferocious winds picked up again over the weekend and the hills exploded in flames and the house was surrounded with Nash blowing everywhere and Gallagher and his wife snapped into action I wasn't panicky you were even as emotional as I am now trying to recall this sheltered at his daughter's house in Oakland he lowers the bell of his camouflage baseball cap and stares at the floor he says he can't relax he questions his future in California I think the climate is definitely becoming extreme any ideas of where you might go. Though really. There's lots of pipe dreams and it's right at the forefront where do we go Danielle Bryant lost her house in the Santa Rosa fires 2 years ago we were victim to Sichuan of the most terrible events in history flames decimated our neighborhood and killed 44 people the next year a couple hours away more than 80 people died in the camp fire it feels very scary I just don't know where home is right no last weekend at dawn Bryant and her husband fled again they raced out of their temporary apartment it's less than a mile from their old house it was like hitting a fog bank of smoke it looked like we were driving through hell they landed safely at a friend's house and Brian felt frozen she's lost her appetite bad dreams keep her up at night is this the way it's going to be every year apocalypse she and her husband are talking about selling the house they're rebuilding construction is way behind schedule. I just don't know how much more I can take leaving isn't simple Bryant grew up here her aging mother lives nearby yet stress in trauma have taxed her marriage her work and her health. Every day she thinks about relocating at the same time she wonders if it's possible to outrun climate change for n.p.r. News I'm Leslie McLaren in Santa Rosa. You're listening to All Things Considered from n.p.r. News the traffic at 618 starts with better news for San Francisco commuters. And car wreck south 11 before say says Chavez they finally moved to the right hand shoulder there quite a while so a terrible drive onto the upper Jack in the Bay Bridge Still San Jose it's a 3 car pileup North Bend to 80 before Saratoga avenue out of the lanes now you're in a back up to leave Bascom and south than 80 before Great Mall Parkway also 3 vehicles they're cleared and you're a pretty slow Calaveras. Report was brought to you by an org Support for k.q.e.d. Comes from the California Academy of Sciences where visitors can journey through a rain forest outer space the deep sea and meet nearly 40000 live animals all in one day tickets available at Cal Academy dot org And from the top health care where hospice clinician is available by phone 247 to manage a patient or to dispatch a team member to the bedside hospice eligible patient referral information is that . The fires burning around the state many of them sparked by power lines California are asking hard questions about electrical utilities climate change and the future. Political breakdown in a conversation with. The energy and climate expert the governor. And public radio tonight at 630 or wherever you get your part. On the next fresh air the New York Times correspondent in Ukraine Andrew Cramer talks about the impact of President Trump's dealings with Ukraine on that country the difficult balancing act facing Ukraine's new president and why President Trump says Ukrainian officials tried to sabotage his campaign join us. Fresh air comes on at 7 o'clock tonight support for n.p.r. Comes from Sony Pictures Classics presenting pain and glory the new film by Pedro Almodovar starring Antonio Banderas as a film director revisiting his past life and his passions also starring Penelope Cruz now playing the estate of Joan b. Kroc whose bequest serves as an enduring investment in the future of public radio and seeks to help n.p.r. Be the model for high quality journalism in the 21st century and from listeners of k.q.e.d. Public Radio. From n.p.r. News this is All Things Considered I'm Mary Louise Kelly and I'm else itching in St Louis a week long hearing that could determine the fate of Missouri's only abortion clinic ended today lawyers for the state argue that the clinic was the site of significant safety issues Planned Parenthood lawyers argue that Missouri is treating the clinic differently in a politicized effort to close it St Louis Public Radio's Chad Davis reports lawyers representing Missouri and Planned Parenthood have been arguing over the state's only abortion health care clinic for months now earlier this year Missouri refused to extend the license for the Planned Parenthood clinic in St Louis citing for instances where patients experienced complications following abortion procedures need the director of policy in organizing for Planned Parenthood advocates in Missouri says the clinic is being targeted what we have is an agency and a director that appear to be obsessed with attacking access to abortion the state's administrative hearing commission extended Planned Parenthood's license aligned the clinic to remain open until a decision on the case is made Planned Parenthood officials say from time to time complications do occur they argue that focusing on these 4 cases is unfair since the clinic sees thousands of patients a year they also criticized how the records have been requested and stored for some Planned Parenthood patients the Missouri Department of Health revealed at the hearing this week that they collect the data on some patients menstrual cycles to see if there have been failed abortions that news has sparked controversy across the state with several politicians calling on the governor to investigate health director and a woman's some legal professionals have been puzzled by this revelation including Mary's Ziggler who teaches law at Florida State University she spoke to Kansas City's case you are there is a history of. Recordkeeping laws being introduced into motion restrictions so well choir clinics to submit certain records to the state so it's not an entirely new issue. And unshaven I've never heard of anyone heaping that sense of menstrual periods but state officials say Williams did not authorize the recording and that he hadn't seen any of the data in till he was deposed earlier this month Lisa Cox is the communication director for the Missouri Department of Health and Senior Services we have a spreadsheet with every Planned Parenthood patient's menstrual cycles on it absolutely not state officials also maintained that patient privacy was not compromised during the data collection antiabortion activists Kristi Hamrick is among those pushing hard for the state's final clinic that performs abortions to close doesn't matter how many people are harmed What matters is what has happened to the people at that lender but Planned Parenthood officials say the number does matter and that the closure would negatively affect women all across Missouri Dr Colleen McNicholas is a medical officer for Planned Parenthood and says the 4 cases are in line with Missouri's acceptable and legal health standards she says using them to deny access to all patients is just wrong abortion as health care there will be times when there are complications doesn't demonstrate any systematic or systemic wide problem abortion is health care and will continue to provide that quality health care and fight for people that access to that a decision on whether the Planned Parenthood clinic will remain open will be decided later this winter for n.p.r. News I'm Chad Davis. Last night was improbable might even have seemed impossible to I was. She she was such a thing she said I'm smiling just listening to out there on Fox What happened was in a post season littered with juggernauts last night it was the team that had looked a dead in the water back in May that won it all over the Washington Post's Chelsea James worked the Nationals beat for years Chelsea Welcome back to All Things Considered thank you for having me give me some perspective here just how unlikely dude winning the World Series seem back in May when the Nats were what 12 games below 500 Yeah at that point you know it was who's going to make their decision as a national and he's not you know there were there were going to have to be changes and and they didn't make them for the most part they kind of hung in with key people and their patience paid off but to go from where they were to where they ended up last night is improbable not only just statistically but because this team has never been able to come through when they need it in October and just could not stop doing that this year you reference to the many many playoff heartbreaks that Nats fans have endured this year was the 1st in 5 postseason trips that the team has ever won in a playoff series didn't did you have this kind of here we go again feeling when it looked like the Nats were on the brink I think a lot of people did I think what's funny is they had that feeling over and over in these playoffs and then somehow it just kept not happening and it kept being Ok And you know even to the players the other night in game 6 when there was a call that they felt went against them I know Trey Turner said all we can thank is here we go again it's happening again or that not to materialize I think that speaks to whatever it was that helped these guys make this happen and what do you think it was my what do you think happened that that allowed them to pull it together and win and win it all you know I think they had a very different clubhouse culture. This year and I don't think there's any good reason or explanation I think occasionally things just click and they did this year they brought in a lot of veteran players they joked about themselves as a host the old ones you know they were one of the oldest teams in baseball and it worked so that this time when things started going wrong there was a little less panic a little bit more experience and little bit more edge to this team that I think we've seen in others I alerted listeners might recall that I interviewed you last December because you were switching beats from covering baseball to covering the 2020 campaign which struck me as such an unusual leaf that we got you on to talk about it when we did you go back to baseball I actually was flying back from the Democratic debate last month and the Nationals that just clinched their you know trip to the World Series and the editors reached out and asked if after spending so much time with them for the last few years if I wanted to go and cover that you know it's sort of an all hands on deck situation when he was in the water here and sure you had to think really hard about the answer to that one yeah it was definitely a try to stay calm and cool about it thing but I will be headed back to Iowa tomorrow oh well back to Iowa straight back to the campaign trail that frequent home sale but it's been nice to be able to be a part of that and see them do what they did in person just because you put a lot of time with these people on you go through those those ups and downs sort of 2nd hand when you're trying to interview them after cancer and I think it's nice to see ever on you know that you spend that much time with seeing some of the hard core payoffs I think I have a question for you that you might be uniquely qualified to answer Having fun of back and forth between covering politics and covering baseball and covering baseball in a very political you know partisan town that is at the moment caught up in this impeachment inquiry could not be more divided and yet it felt like everywhere I went this week Republicans and Democrats it didn't matter everybody was a gnat's fan to to to do you feel that as well coming back yeah it's really interesting how many people in the political scene enjoy baseball you know George Will. Well the Republican columnist Yeah go write it baseball fans written a lot of baseball books and he was in the stands at the 1st home game and said you know the good thing about baseball it's a conversation starter it's a it's a subject changer and I think that's you know it's not necessarily going to you know anything that there is a space in which everyone can at least co-exist if not do so in harmony with Chelsea Jeans thanks so much for taking the time to speak to us and good luck back on the on the politics beating back off to Iowa tomorrow thank you I appreciate it Chelsea James of The Washington Post. This is n.p.r. News. Political breakdown starts after a week at a Bay Area traffic updates starting in the South Bay Here's Julie deputy and said overturn ranks still in the Cleary's Nations 237 east bound the 4 1st Street lanes are open but about a 20 minute delay for Middlefield road lookout in Redwood City south and she weighty before Edgewood road some kind of metal debris is in the right lane there the San Francisco crash is cleared south one on one before césar chávez spent do you expect that crawl across the upper deck of the Bay Bridge Julie temp assured that report was brought to you by Positive Coaching Alliance support for k.q.e.d. Comes from City National Bank dedicated since 1954 to helping clients reach their financial goals with a long term approach to relationship banking Morrisey n.v. Dot com City National Bank the way up and from the California Department of Public Health helping parents understand the severity of the babying illness outbreak for c.d.c. Outbreak information go to tobacco free ca dot com. And . Happy Halloween everyone from k.q.e.d. Public Radio this is political breakdown I'm Arisa Lagos' and I'm Scott Shafer tonight on the breakdown we're going to be focusing our show on the inescapable reality of living in California these past few weeks and of course I'm talking about wildfires blackouts or as some call it the new abnormal Yeah the latest fair Scott but we are going to try to secure a bit about seriously how we got here the politics of this whole mess and what we could possibly do to fix things here in the golden state where it's honestly going to an easy few weeks to say the least we're going to bring in our expert on that in a little bit but 1st to important things really happened today on the House of Representatives floor the House voted along party lines pretty much to formalize the impeachment inquiry into President Trump over the kicking and screaming of Republicans will get into that event of a more he said there was also a floor speech today that's getting a lot of attention California congresswoman Kate. Hill's goodbye speech right so you may have heard that kitty who is resigning her c This is after a series of explicit photos were leaked to conservative media outlets and she was accused in those articles of having affairs with both a campaign staffer and a congressional aide she denies the affair with the aid which would be very serious under house Asics rules although she did admitted to quote in an appropriate relationship with a separate campaign staffer More broadly though she says she's the victim of a revenge porn essentially by her husband who she's going through a divorce with a pretty nasty divorce and she talks about this as part of a pretty emotional speech today the forces of revenge by a bitter jealous man cyber exploitation and sexual sheening that target our gender and a large segment of society that fears and hates powerful women have combined to push a young woman out of power and say that she doesn't belong here and of course Katie who also went on to sort of link this to what she called the Predator in the White House that you know talking about the allegations that are made against Trump in of course right having already have an Osprey marriage on this others not by name you know and I think it's I mean this is just been obviously such a messy sort of couple weeks for Katie Hill who should say we had thought we were going to win the breakdown we did we had an interview scheduled with her when we were back in d.c. And our producer guys already had a call just a day before saying she lost her voice because she was back in her district and there were wildfires in the smoke was a problem but now we know there was a right there in that kind of thing yeah yeah yeah I mean but it is raising some interesting issues I think about this issue of revenge porn about it but it's also raising some interesting generational issues I mean she's been actually gotten defended by Matt gats one of the most conservative kind of bomb thirds in the House who is a younger Republican from Florida and of course a lot of I think older members really does not wanting to touch that yeah well and of course there's a lot of hypocrisy to go around not just on key Hill but also I mean Pietschmann stuff will get into some of that but you know in the. People o.c. Was quoted as you know basically being very sympathetic and telling her the caucus when she met with them to warn younger members and even kids not to put this stuff on your phone and share it yeah I mean although Katie what she says is that somebody else recorded somebody else recorded this without her knowledge that they're that she is basically stepping out because she was worried that they would continue to leak out I mean there are some really shady elements as a society we can talk about the alleged affairs but of the way this came out including the fact that one of the people who quote unquote broke the story was an actual campaign staffer for the Republican. Beat last year you know this really did come out in some very you know not the most sort of reputed lets you know you can say well you know and that's a whole thing too these days like what is reputable and what isn't and you know Nancy Pelosi although she clearly was taking Katie Hill under her wing she was a have become a real protege of Nancy Pelosi you have to think too when all this broke she must have gone to the speaker and said What should I do you know I think if the speaker it's a hate hang in there we're going to stick with you she'd still be there but you know with the impeachment inquiry underway clearly they felt it would be too big a disruption Yeah and I do think that you know one thing obviously there's this rush for people to run for the seat it was a really big win for Democrats and a decisive one in 29 point you know in a district that you know had been held by Republican for a while but I do think that I'm not sure this is the last we'll hear from Katie how she sort of seemed to indicate that now yeah it's definitely got the sense she may be you know once she gets her feet back on the ground and deals with all this with her family everybody else is she she could run again and who knows depending on you know things have a way of looking different in the rearview mirror sometimes I do think though that what you said about you know Nancy Pelosi sort of warning people and Katie hell brought up this idea that this could really deter other young women from running for office but it isn't. Interesting question Mike in the age of social media where we have people in college now who did not grow up you know with the Internet around them their entire lives I don't does the culture change are is something like this is going to be that sort of defining moment and it will tell you tell you number one smoking pot like I inhale I did I was it would you say I did I did but I didn't you know nowadays you've got you know Barack Obama and everyone else since same way I tried to didn't like it or whatever you know but Gavin Newsome still says he hasn't tried pot but you know it's a cultural norms change it does take sometimes the politics a little longer to change are we jumped the shark in the can take a short break when we get back we're going to talk with Sanford's climate energy expert Michael wore out you're listening to political breakdown from k.q.e.d. Public Radio. Support for k.q.e.d. Comes from Guy Co protecting people and their vehicles for over 75 years Geico is proud to offer emergency roadside service to Bay Area drivers learn more at Geico dot com or 180947 auto in from Skee big 3 in Canada's Banff National Park offering flight access to 3 resorts from San Francisco to the Canadian Rockies in less than 3 hours learn more at Ski Big 3 dot com slash n.p.r. 636 I'm Michele Hannigan Julie definitional be here after political breakdown with traffic update at 7 o'clock on fresh air the guest is journalist Andrew Kramer He covers Ukraine for the New York Times and then stay with us at 8 o'clock for spooked it's the hollowing spectacular from snap judgment this is k.q.e.d. F.m. San Francisco k.q.e.d. I f.m. North Highlands Sacramento. Welcome back to political breakdown I'm raising Lagos' here with Scott Shafer and today we have Stanford University's Michael Warren here with us he's senior research scholar at the Woods Institute for the environment and direct. Of the Climate and Energy Policy Program that was a mouthful Michael said about that. It's all a fancy way of saying you are you really become one of the go to experts on this whole wildfire utility crisis in California and we really appreciate you coming in well thanks for having me on so like I said you've been everywhere even like in The New York Times you've been on k.q.e.d. You advise the governor on the stuff how did you get roped into all of this but I come to this because I care a lot about energy and climate policy in California and recognized after Napa Sonoma fires in 27 What a huge threat this was to all the work that have been done over the last decade 2 decades really to make air cleaner in California and then make California a leader on climate change so I got interested in the problem and the more you learn about it the more complicated it gets in the more layers and so it's become you know that I like that there's a lot of us. What are some of the things you think people should know but don't. Well I think there's a lot of confusion about how to keep communities safe you know and and there is there are some pretty clear answers there that involve hardening homes and even just the 5 feet around homes and having communities take action to gather because even if I make my home safe my if my neighbor's home isn't safe the heat from that home igniting might burn down my house things like that I think I think people are really looking for answers about. How can I not have the fall in the Bay area in northern California which is like than most lovely time of year now you know I mean yeah be a time where you feel dread and we need to work our way out of that situation so broadly because I think there's a lot of pessimism right now I mean summer Sanibel we've had now the 3rd fall in a row of really scary conditions now these blackouts are happening I mean what offer some optimism for Michael like is this a problem that we can solve our way out of when we talk about the utilities and climate change and everything I think we definitely can and we can do it in ways that are actually really good for California. The kinds of the kinds of changes we need to make are to our communities they aren't free they'll cost money but they'll also generate tons of jobs for Californians You know for Californians maybe don't have a college degree that really struggle in our job market and they'll make our homes more comfortable specially if we help low income folks make these changes which we need to to keep the whole community safe right you can't just have the rich people do it that doesn't help you're on this wildfire task force the governor knew some put together talk about that and you know to what extent were the recommendations that they came up with have they been you know embraced Well you know we are goal was to figure out how to manage the costs that the state has experienced over the last couple of years and especially to sort of develop a plan for the next decade or so sort of until we think the tillage can do the things that they need to do to really reduce risk and some of our recommendations were adopted by the state especially we made this recommendation to create a sort of a wildfire fund that I think listeners should really think of as like an insurance policy and with the idea that we want to prove. Tax rate payers and victims from the impacts of fire make sure that rate payers don't see rates go up a lot from a big fire make sure the victims aren't any any more some people perceive that also as protecting the utilities from the costs right well I think you know. The impacts of that do have do do positive things for the utilities too and that's true the utilities that were most in danger at the time that we were working were at Assen and San Diego Gas and Electric the Southern California utilities which were threatened with kind of a big financial hits from ratings downgrades and we averted that I think that's a net win for customers because if the utilities are not investment grade ultimately customers pay so let's talk about Pete Chaney because you know that's what you and I like to do together talk about pitching. The lot of I think especially from media outside of California but I think even within the state a lot of sort of confusion about how we got here and I know there's a lot of blame to go around you mentioned Home hardening and forest management but I would love to really talk about p.g. And state regulators who I think are rightfully getting a lot of fingers pointed out them in this moment. Can you talk about just sort of the structure of them I mean why is it because one thing that I think people don't understand is like there's a lot of like we need to make the shareholders you know feel pain that the repairs have been paying their rates and we all thought that the utility was doing its job and but I mean isn't every penny that they have really from rate payers to begin with just talk yes level so. Utilities are heavily regulated by the state in which they operate and that's to protect rate payers because they're a monopolist who provides an essential service so you don't want someone like that having free reign to charge whatever they want so far since they were created utilities have had their rates set or approved by utility commissions and what that really means is that utilities can't charge customers money unless the Commission approves that and that also means that the spending plans that utilities undertake have to be reviewed in detail and approved by the commission and there are opportunities for all stakeholders to get involved and argue about what's appropriate So does that mean that everything that p.g. And e. And any other utility has or hasn't done that they should have is really also you know part of the part of the blame there belongs with the c.p.c. I think there is shared responsibility there and but I also think that the utility takes the lead right so the utility comes to the commission with a proposal and then everybody argues about that proposal there was a big miss in northern California right the the p.g.d. Didn't see this coming at them neither did the commission this being a wild fire that they were caught that caused by them yes they you know after the San Bruno accident which many folks may remember this terrible gas explosion that killed 8 people on 2010 Yeah there was a big process at the p.c. To think about the risks that utilities faced and wildfire was identified in but I think no one Invision this kind of catastrophe where we were burning down thousands of houses where the cause was utility fires so the governor's been everywhere this week and he kind of talked about this a little bit and talking about p.g. County and the c.p.u. You see despite our fundamental differences between p.j. What I think is dead. It's of mismanagement that pre-date the currency you know to be fair and if you see that frankly was a little too cozy respectfully over the last few decades to the utilities that predates this administration that we still confined areas we work together and so in the spirit of your question I think we found out that balance so. It's interesting I mean I think that as the governor alluded to there's a lot of people who look at say the executive compensation at p. Genie in the bonuses they get paid out and you know the shareholder profits I mean they are guaranteed a profit margin of 9 to 10 percent depending on the place right. But there's also you know the fact that like you said this wasn't being seen coming I wonder how you just assess the way you think the politicians have kind of been talking about p.g. And e. Is it fair or are they being too hard on the utility not hard enough I think the utilities deserve a lot of criticism like let's be clear right they did not see this risk coming at them even after the Butte fire in 2015 they they fail to take strong to face of action now is a very destructive fire and after that they should have reevaluated the situation in a didn't so they deserve a lot of Christopher could you say the same about San Diego Gas and Electric or you know after the before the San Diego Fire in 2000 says that I think that well I think yeah you know San Diego didn't totally see this coming but But what to their credit after that fire they said we need to reinvent how we run our system to keep our community safe and they didn't let there there was no 2nd fire after that 2007 fire and I think that's highly significant at the same time I worry that we're getting too concerned about blame we need to focus on solutions here like we need to get things going on the ground changes happening so that by next fire season we're in a better place as a state can we do that with out these power blackouts. I think the power blackouts are going to be a feature of California's energy system for at least the next several years maybe more than that is your way to mitigate that yeah I I think there is you know we need to look in a very systematic way at who is being blocked out and then develop programs to provide those people with effective backup power we also need to harden the grid so ultimately we can blackout fewer people but to be clear San Diego keeps people safe by Still blacking out sections of their grid $30000.00 studio customers were offline during the recent Santa Ana event and we should say I mean that's of much smaller utility right I mean the area they cover a smaller so there blackout imprint a footprint is going to be smaller if you're just joining us you're listening to political breakdown from k.q.e.d. Public Radio I'm Arisa Lagos' here is Scott Shafer and we're talking with Michael Warren he is a climate and energy expert at Stanford so we kind of alluded to this but you talked about the San Bruno blast and it's important to note I mean I will just like point to fact here we haven't mentioned p.g. Is in bankruptcy largely because of the last 2 years of fires that they are blamed for and they were taken to court not just in terms of the regulatory issues after San Bruno but by the federal government there a felon there on felony probation one of the things that the National Transportation Safety Board said after that was that the c.p. You see the state commission overseeing utilities. Essentially place blind trust in operators to the detriment of public safety and given the fact that as we just mentioned like a city Genie had a fire in 2007 that was pretty horrific there was other So Cal Fire I mean can you talk about like how much of this is just everybody not seeing the forest through the trees so to speak or is it is there any evidence that p.g. And e. Say took our ratepayer money to do maintenance work that they never did I mean what how do you kind of think about what we have paid for and whether or not the utility and c.p.c. Have been responsible with that money well I think you know the 1st thing to say is the way I look at this problem is that there are multiple causes and but that things probably would have been Ok but for climate change right so what we're encountering here is is a situation where a way of doing things a set of practices was safe 20 years ago and it's no longer safe today because of the weather and the climate are changing. That being said like Did did did the utility. Do what it said it was going to do with the money well the utility has a list of things they want to get done in any given year and they have a number a certain number of dollars to do it and a certain number of personnel they don't always get that work done I don't know that there is evidence there maybe some evidence but I don't know about I don't know that there's evidence that they were actually diverting money into dividends for example that should have been spent elsewhere when it comes to the c.p.c. They have such a large menu of things that they are supposed to be overseeing are not crazy like it's it is crazy and getting all the way down to the lift which you know really I think in many ways should be a city function I mean in addition to really I just think you know rich as it's from their website like what but you know as we reimagine p.g. News which is the phrase that the governor uses Should we also be reimagining the c.p.c. I think so and I know in the governor's initial report on his actions around wildfire he mentioned this as a core focus that he wanted to take was sort of reimagining the pc's role and and of course like if you were reimagine the utility you kind of have to reimagine a regulator that's so heavily involved in what utility does and so that should be a part of what we do in it and certainly his appointment to the president of the p.c. Is kind of a specialist in remaking agencies right back sure before she was at the p.c. He was in charge of trying to fix the d.m.v. Mary Boucher he appointed Burleigh tiddly recently All right so you're emperor of California for a day what happened what do you think me and so happened with p.g. Any and by extension maybe some of the other utilities but they are the biggest They are the biggest problem it seems at this point for the state and for these blackouts and potentially for the fire we saw burning in Sonoma these past few weeks well I guess from my perspective. I'd love to see p.g. Me hiring some folks to think about safety from outside the utility industry we need p.g. And e. . Thinking about the problem of fire safety in the way that airlines think about safety where a crash is unacceptable and their job this is no good well they say they're not yes they're pulling their leg over the c.e.o. Is grilled All right 2 days well but at least but the airlines and the way that they maintain aircraft and you know the airline operations have made flight an incredibly safe activity it didn't used to be that way and at a certain point the airlines realized they were going to have a business unless they fix that and that's kind of where we are with p.g. And e. We need them thinking about how to how to really raise the bar on safety and there's a set of practices out in other industries that can tolerate accidents for how to do that but not so much in the utility industry why is that and why is it that we're not hearing about this happening in or Arizona or you know or get other places of wildfires like is it p.g. And e. Or is it something unique about California do you think. So one thing to note is that what is happening in other areas and v.n. Are g. The Nevada utility is busy designing its own power shut off program because it is terrified of what might happen in the taco basin and the Oregon utility commission is also thinking about how they need to respond what stays in California is unlikely to or what started in California is unlikely to stay in California given what the climate forecasts look like so they're going to school on us because yeah they can learn from our were the kind of 1st mover Unfortunately when it comes to welfare safety and they're going to learn from us and hopefully adopt our practices and not have to confront the catastrophe that's occurred and who's going to pay for these the changes the years you said earlier you're optimistic there are things we could do so where does the money come from to do those things well I think that. You know there's only so many buckets and they and then you know how is a rate payer you're different from a taxpayer right and that's the question we really I think need to be thinking about is and you know should it be. That folks in wildfire areas pay these costs are does it make more sense to spread the cost out over a broader part of the state. Distribution should should low income people pay 0 a smaller proportion of the cost what's the best way to accomplish that I tend to think we need to think outside of the electricity rates base and be starting to think about non utility programs that are paid for out of tax dollars or bond finance only because we can do that a lot faster we're I mean you you may not have kids but you still pay taxes that go to schools you may not you know use some of our social services you do that so you know we've been talking a lot about p genie in the safety culture but the one thing that a lot of people in Northern California and I would assume parts of southern California are looking at right now is how they can sort of insulate themselves from a lot of these issues and we talked a lot about home hardening the other thing people are looking to is solar and sort of closed circuit you know to get on the grid and that brings up I think a lot of socio economic divides and potential sort of unintended consequences can you talk about that because I do think you know even to the point of seeing cities like San Francisco and San Jose say we're just going to buy the infrastructure for p.g. And e. Well what about everyone in Santa Rosa in Auburn and Butte County or whatever I think this is a moment where the state needs to come together and make sure that all Californians are included in a solution I agree you know well where I live I live in marine County and everyone's going generators and I think not far behind now to the people who are going to buy batteries to put in their garages from Tessler Sun Run and solar panels to put on the roofs. Low income people cannot access those solutions not the generator not the battery and we need to make sure that they're included and they need help when I talk to Governor Newsome a couple days ago and I asked him about the politics of all this he said well not thinking about politics and they kind of rattled off 8 things that he had done since he was governor which you know is kind of politics how the. Fact that we have politicians the legislators the governor and everyone else that you know thinking about these things making a decision does that how does that affect the kind of solutions we can come up with . Well I think everyone in Sacramento remembers another energy crisis and. Doesn't Yes And this is not that to be clear I was just being written about energy deregulation which Pete Wilson signed into law passed unanimously through the legislature and which resulted as a ruling by Hartley in the recall of Governor Gray Davis. I think nobody wants to see that outcome they want to craft solutions that are workable. But I also think that. Legislators are struggling with kind of how to come to grips with this and how to address the anger that is so visceral for so many people who have been sitting in the dark for days on end in a way that's consistent with the timeframe that those folks have expectations about the problem because you know I mean we've been talking a lot about the sort of the policy and then the nitty gritty but a lot of this is just about humanity right and Scott actually talked to Governor Gray Davis earlier this week about that angle of this like well the human experience Let's listen to that I mean that's a very human moment and to be there as Gavin Newsome is I think is extraordinarily memorable board to be with you help people out. There moments of peril they will remember you for a very long time and of course new Some has been all over the state this week going to emergency centers going to evacuated in centers he went to elementary school on Thursday that had lost power. Really have to strike a balance Jim this is the empathy part the sort of consoler in chief kind of bit and then also standing in the shoes of ratepayers and being angry you know at p.g. And e. But then at the same time you have to work with g.m. So it's it is a it's a really tough balancing act yeah I mean it's a tricky problem especially because. P.g. And e. Needs to be healthy as a company in order to do the things that we desperately need to do to create safety if p.g. And e. Is still in bankruptcy or is perceived as very risky it's going to have a hard time investing and so we really need to be walk a very fine line between holding them accountable and making sure that they are healthy enough to fix the problem we have a little less than a minute left a lot of people including Congressman Rick Honna and others have been calling for like the state to take over p.g. Any I know you and I have discussed that there could be like a middle ground there or maybe the state took you know some shares something like that I mean do you think that the state needs to exercise broadly a more sort of important role in really guiding this utility out of bankruptcy. I think that the all options seem to be on the table and if it turns out. Well but I mean I wouldn't normally say that and I am not typically a fan of municipal ization just because it takes so long and I don't see it as we need short term solutions even as we need these kind of longer medium term maybe even 10 year solutions and I'm most concerned about the short term and making sure that we don't have more fires that kill people and destroy communities and that people don't have to sit in the dark in the meantime especially the folks that already struggle to afford California and I'm not sure if someone can demonstrate to me that municipal ization will achieve back hole I support it I just haven't seen that showing yet. All right we'll have to leave it there Michael wara of Stanford thank you so much for coming in thanks thanks for having me all right that's it for hollowing edition of political breakdown of production at k.q.e.d. Public radio producers gomers or audio engineers are Jim Bennett and seal Mahler. Team includes Holly Kernan Even Lindsey and Vinnie I'm Scott Shafer You can follow me on Twitter I'm Scott Shafer and you can follow me on Twitter I'm at am Lagos' stay safe out there on. Your k.q.e.d. Traffic update at 659 starts with a wreck in Oakland Here's Julie and big delays Here's a 3 vehicle pileup eastbound 580 before high street there take it away to to a left lanes traffic stop back to Oakland Ave sold big rig on the sand until a bridge eastbound after the high rise may still be partially blocking the right lane and they've cleared a stall in the South by South Bay South Bend 88 Gish road is still a back up to Great Mall Parkway. Thank you Julie that report was brought to you by Mothers Against Drunk Driving in support for k.q.e.d. Comes from the Wells Fargo foundation seeking new ways to grow affordable housing through its 20000000 dollar housing affordability challenge more stories that w.f. Dot com. You're listening to k.q.e.d. 88.5 San Francisco and I 89.3 North Highland Sacramento at 7 o'clock. From why why in Philadelphia I'm Terry Gross with fresh air today the Ukrainian side of the impeachment drama New York Times reporter Andrew Kramer speaks to us from where he says the new president. Is in a tough spot responding to President Trump's requests for investigations into Joe Biden and the 26000 election really have been trying hard to stay on the fence on this issue he may be dealing with a President Biden next year or he may be dealing with President Cramer says politicized investigations are common in Ukraine and ambitious players in the country may be willing to share information or rumors to gain favor with Americans on one side or the other in the impeachment fight also can Tucker reviews the new album by country singer John party who says it's making excellent music and. Film The Irishman. Live from n.p.r. News in Washington I'm Jack Speer the House vote to proceed with a formal impeachment inquiry establishes a set of rules for how the process will go from here this is the 3rd impeachment inquiry in the last 45 years and N.P.R.'s Brian Naylor reports the rules this time are very similar to the last 2 the process approved by the House allows for the investigation led by intelligence committee chairman Adam Schiff of California Democrat to continue that investigation involving Democrats and Republicans on 3 House panels will hold public hearings in November see if will then turn his findings over to the House Judiciary Committee which would then begin the formal process of whether to draw up articles of impeachment the president or his attorneys can then cross-examine witnesses and subpoena their own although they'll need image or.

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