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Etrade offers Investment Advice and guidance from dedicated, professional financial consultants. Its guidance on your terms, not ours. Thats how our system works. Etrade. Less for us. More for you. Kroft there are few people we think we know more about than president barack obama and outgoing secretary of state hillary clinton, and everyone has an opinion about their politics, their marriages, and a rivalry that is one of the richest in american history. On friday we had the opportunity to sit down with the two of them side by side. The white house offered us 30 minutes, barely enough time to scratch the surface of their complicated personal and professional relationship, let alone discuss their policies on iran and israel, russia and china, egypt and libya. There has been much speculation about their evolution from bitter opponents to partners in the corridors of power and the motivation for doing this interview. Now you can be the judge. This is very improbable. This is not an interview i ever expected to be doing. But i understand, mr. President , this was your idea. Why did you want to do this together, a joint interview . Obama well, the main thing is, i just wanted to have a chance to publicly say thank you, because i think hillary will go down as one of the finest secretary of states weve had. It has been a great collaboration over the last four years. Im going to miss her. I wish she was sticking around. But she has logged in so many miles, i cant begrudge her wanting to take it easy for a little bit. But i want the country to appreciate just what an extraordinary role shes played during the course of my administration, and a lot of the successes weve had internationally have been because of her hard work. Kroft theres no political tea leaves to be read here . Clinton we dont have any tea. Weve got some water here is the best i can tell. But, you know, this has been just the most extraordinary honor. And, yes, i mean, a few years ago it would have seen seen as improbable, because we had that very long, hard primary campaign. But, you know, ive gone around the world on behalf of the president and our country, and one of the things that i say to people, because i think it helps them understand, i say, look, in politics and in democracy, sometimes you win elections, sometimes you lose elections. And i worked very hard, but i lost. And then president obama asked me to be secretary of state, and i said yes. And so this has been just an extraordinary opportunity to work with him as a partner and friend, to do our very best on behalf of this country we both love. And its something im going to miss a great deal. Kroft its no secret that your aides cautioned you against. Actually were against you offering secretary clinton this job, and you were just as determined not to take it. And you avoided taking her phone calls for a while, because you were afraid she was going to say no. Why were you so insistent about wanting her to be secretary of state . Obama well, i was a big admirer of hillarys before our primary battles and the general election. You know, her discipline, her stamina, her thoughtfulness, her ability to project, i think, and make clear issues that are important to the American People i thought made her an extraordinary talent. She also was already a world figure. And i thought that somebody stepping into that position of secretary of state at a time when, keep in mind, we were still in iraq, afghanistan was still an enormous challenge, and there was great uncertainty in terms of how we would reset our relations around the world to have somebody who could serve as that effective ambassador in her own right without having to earn her stripes, so to speak, on the international stage, i thought would be hugely important. Kroft youve been quoted as thinking or telling people that there was no way you were going to take this job, and you werent going to let anybody talk you into it. Clinton well, i would. Kroft what did he say that night that made you. Clinton well, i was so surprised, because, you know, after i ended my campaign, i immediately did everything i could to help the president get elected, because, despite our hardfought primary, we had such agreement on what needed to be done for our country. Obama made for tough debates, by the way, because we. Clinton it did. Obama we could never figure out what we were different on. Clinton yeah, we worked at that pretty hard. And so, i really thought id be going back to the senate, where i would be supporting the president on all of the issues. And what surprised me is, he said, well, i want you to come to chicago. And honestly, at the time, i thought, well, you know, thats a very nice gesture. Maybe he wants to ask me about some people that might serve in the administration. So when i got to chicago and he asked me if i would consider being his secretary of state, i immediately said, oh, mr. President , theres so many other people. Let me give you some other names. Because it just took me by surprise. But he is pretty persuasive, ill tell you that much. And he kept saying, well, i want you to think about it again. I want you to wait a minute. Dont make. Dont give me a final answer. Ill tell you what i finally thought. I thought, you know, if the roles had been reversed, and i had ended up winning, i would have desperately wanted him to be in my cabinet. So if im saying i would have wanted him to say yes to me, how am i going to justify saying no to my president . And it was a great decision, despite my hesitancy about it. Kroft what did he promise you . And has he kept the promises . Clinton it was going to be hard. But, you know. Obama and i kept that promise. Clinton welcome to hard times, i mean, because the one thing he did mention was, he basically said, you know, weve got this Major Economic crisis that may push us into a depression. Im not going to be able to do a lot to satisfy the builtup expectations for our role around the world, so youre going to have to get out there and, you know, really represent us while i deal with, you know, the economic catastrophe i inherited. But, you know, were both gluttons for punishment. And, you know, my assessment was, look, we are in a terrible fix. You know, i felt like this president was going to get us out of it, but it wasnt going to be easy. And it was going to need everybody, you know, pulling together. Kroft has she had much influence. Obama well, i. Kroft in this administration . Obama i think everybody understands that hillary has been, you know, one of the most important advisors that ive had on a whole range of issues. Hillarys capacity to travel around the world to lay the groundwork for a new way of doing things; to establish a sense of engagement that, you know, our Foreign Policy was not going to be defined solely by iraq; that we were going to be vigilant about terrorism, but we were going to make sure that we deployed all elements of American Power diplomacy, our economic and cultural and social capital in order to bring about the kinds of International Solutions that we wanted to see. I had confidence that hillary could do that. And, you know, one of the things that i will always be grateful for is. Yeah, it wasnt just that she and i had to integrate. I mean, we had bob gates, who was a holdover from the bush administration, you know, leon panetta to take over the c. I. A. , and so we had a lot of very strong personalities around the table. You know, i think one of the things that hillary did was establish a standard in terms of professionalism and teamwork in our cabinet, in our Foreign Policy making that said were going to have an open discussion, were going to push each other hard; there are going to be times where we have some vigorous disagreements. Once the president makes a decision, though, were going to go out there and execute. Kroft how would you characterize your relationship right now . Obama i consider hillary a strong friend. Clinton i mean, very warm, close. I think theres a sense of understanding that, you know, sometimes doesnt even take words, because we have similar views. We have similar experiences that, i think provide a bond that may seem unlikely to some, but has been really at the core of our relationship over the last four years. I mean, ive read a lot about other president s, and ive, you know, been in the white house as a first lady. And i was a senator in the time of 9 11 and spent time in the white house under the bush administration. And i know how critical it is to really forge that sense of discipline that the president is referring to. Are there going to be differences . Yeah. Deep differences . Of course. You had a lot of strongwilled, minded people. But the president deserves our best judgment, our advice, and then he deserves us to stand with him and to execute. Now, ive watched other administrations where there was pitched warfare between this cabinet secretary and another or this member of the white house. Thats not good for the country. And its not something that would have served this president. Kroft i mean, its one thing to have disagreements between cabinet people. I spent time with both of you in the 2008 campaign. That was a very tough, bitter race, and im going to spare you reading some of the things that you said about each other during that campaign. Clinton please do. Kroft but how long did it take you to get over that . And when did it happen . Obama you know, it didnt take as long as i think people would perceive it. As i said once. Once the primary was over, hillary worked very hard for me. Bill worked very hard for me. So we were interacting on a fairly regular basis. I think it was harder for the staffs, which is understandable because, you know, they get invested in this stuff in ways that i think the candidates maybe dont. You know, hillary mentioned, you know, part of our bond is, weve been through a lot of the same stuff. And part of being through the same stuff is getting whacked around in political campaigns, being criticized in the press. You know, weve both built some pretty thick skins, and, you know, sometimes our staffs dont go through that so they are taking umbrage and offense. And. chuckle and theyre reading every blog and every tweet. You know, and most of the time, you know, hillary, i suspect, you know, handles this the same way i do, you know . We kind of have a block, a screen from a lot of the silliness that happens during president ial campaigns. And so, for me, at least, you know, by the time. By the time hillary joined the administration, i felt very confident and comfortable in. In our working relationship. I think what did evolve was a friendship as opposed to just a professional relationship. Friendships involve a sense of trust and being in the foxhole together, and that emerged during the course of months when we were making some very tough decisions. Kroft you said the staff took a little longer to ignore, to forget the campaign stuff. What about the spouses . Is that an impertinent question . Clinton what i was going to. What i was going to say, steve, is, having been a spouse, having been a candidate, i think spouses take it much harder. You know, in a away. Obama theres no doubt. Clinton . Just as the president said, were out there, and were responding minute by minute. And you just dont have time to sit around and, you know, think about what, you know, some insult that youve felt youve suffered. I can remember, you know, watching my husband do debates. And i mean, i was like this. And he was relaxed and everything like that. And then, when the shoes were on the other feet, all of a sudden, you know, this calm, cool guy who never was upset by anything is all of a sudden watching me. So, look, but that is just ancient history now. And its ancient history because of who. The kind of people we all are, but also were professionals. Kroft this administration, i mean, youve generally gotten high marks, particularly from the voters, for your handling of Foreign Policy. But theres no big singular achievement that. In the first four years that you can put your names on. What do you think the biggest success has been, Foreign Policy success, of the first term . Obama for us to be able to wind down one war, to be on the path of ending a second war, to do that in a way that honors the sac. Enormous sacrifices our troops have made, to sustain the pressure on al qaeda and terrorist organizations so that not only did we avoid a significant terrorist attack on the homeland, but were able to dismantle the core leadership of al qaeda. Thats all a consequence of the great work that hillary did and her team did and the state department did in conjunction with our National Security team. Kroft whats the. I have to ask you, whats the date of expiration on this endorsement . Clinton oh, steve, what. You know. laughs you know. Kroft no, no, i have to ask that question. I mean, come on. I mean, youre sitting here together. Everybody in town is talking about it already, and the inter. And this is. Its taking place. Obama you know, steve, ive got to tell you, the. You guys in the press are incorrigible. I was literally. laughs . Inaugurated four days ago, and youre talking about elections four years from now. Clinton yeah, and i am. As you know, steve, i am still secretary of state, so im out of politics. And im forbidden from even hearing these questions. I think that. You know, look, obviously, the president and i care deeply about whats going to happen for our country in the future, and i dont think, you know, either he or i can make predictions about whats going to happen tomorrow or. Or the next year. What weve tried to do over the last four years is get up every day, have a cleareyed view of whats going on in the world. And im really proud of where we are. Kroft when we come back, the president and secretary clinton discuss the disaster in benghazi and the state of her health. Cbs money watch update sponsored by glor good evening. The dow and the s p begin the week at their highest levels in five years. The senate this week is expected to approve an increase in the nations borrowing limit. And it will cost more to mail a letter. Today the price of a stamp is up a penny to 46 cents. Im jim axelrod l rod, cbs news. Wanna see me get some great deals . Ok its a new way to get cash back deals and its called bankamerideals. I sign in to my Online Banking. Click the cash back deals tab. And pick the deals i want. I just use my bank of america debit or credit card when i pay. And then i get up to 15 cash back. Put into my account i know, right . [ male announcer ] introducing bankamerideals, free for Online Banking customers. Sign in to your Online Banking to choose your deals today. Fast food restaurants are catching an earful these days. Too much fat. Too much cholesterol. Too much too much. So when the American Heart Association says something positive about a fast food restaurant, thats news, too, isnt it . Subway is proud to be the first restaurant with meals to earn the American Heart Association heart check. Look for the heart check on many tempting subway fresh fit meals. Subway. Eat fresh. Kroft Hillary Clintons final days as secretary of state included one of her most difficult. On wednesday, she spent more than five hours being grilled on capital hill for the security failures in benghazi that led to the deaths of u. S. Ambassador Chris Stevens and three other americans, the biggest diplomatic disaster of this administration. The accountability review led by admiral mike mullen and ambassador Thomas Pickering found, among many failures, that stevens repeated requests for better security never made it to clintons desk. And representatives and senators pressed her on whether the administration covered up the nature of the terrorist attack. Clinton the fact is, we have four dead americans. Was it because of a protest, or was it because of guys going out for a walk and deciding theyll go kill some americans . What difference. At this point, what difference does it make . It is our job to figure out what happened and do everything we can to prevent it from happening again, senator. Kroft i want to talk about the hearings this week. You had. You had a very long day. Also, how is your health . Clinton oh, its great. Its great. Now, you know, i still have some lingering effects from falling on my head and having the blood clot. But, you know, the doctors tell me that that will all recede. And so, thankfully, im, you know, looking forward to being at full speed. Kroft right. I noticed your glasses are. Clinton yeah, i have some lingering effects from the concussion that are decreasing and. And will disappear. But i have a lot of sympathy now when i pick up the paper and read about an athlete or one of our soldiers whos had traumatic brain injury. Id never had anything like that in my family. And so, you know, im. Im very conscious of how lucky i was. Kroft you said during the hearings. I mean, youve accepted responsibility. Youve accepted the very critical findings of admiral mullen and ambassador pickering. As the New York Times put it, you accepted responsibility but not blame. Do you feel guilty in any way, at a personal level . Do you. Do you blame yourself that you didnt know or that you should have known . Clinton well, steve, obviously, i deeply regret what happened, as ive said many times. I knew Chris Stevens. I sent him there originally. It was a great personal loss, to lose him and three other brave americans. But i also have looked back and tried to figure out what we could do so that nobody insofar is possible would be in this position again. And as the accountability review board pointed out, we did fix responsibility appropriately. And were taking steps to implement that. But we also live in a dangerous world, and, you know, the people im proud to serve and work with in our diplomatic and Development Personnel ranks, they know its a dangerous and risky world. We just have to do everything we can to try to make it as secure as possible for them. Obama i think, you know, one of the things that humbles you as president im sure hillary feels the same way as secretary of state is that you realize that all you can do every single day is to figure out a direction, make sure that you are working as hard as you can to put people in place where they can succeed, ask the right questions, shape the right strategy. But its going to be a team that both succeeds and fails. And its a process of constant improvement, because the world is big and it is chaotic. You know, i. I remember bob gates, you know, the first thing he said to me, i think maybe first week or two. And he, obviously, has been through seven president s or something. And he says, mr. President , one thing i can guarantee you is that, at this moment, somewhere, somehow, somebody in the federal government is screwing up. laughs and, you know, youre. And so, part of what youre trying to do is to constantly improve systems and accountability and transparency to minimize those mistakes and ensure success. It is a dangerous world, and thats part of the reason why we have to continue to get better. Kroft the biggest criticism of this team in the u. S. Foreign policy from your political opposition has been what they say an abdication of the United States on the world stage, sort of a reluctance to become involved in another entanglement, an unwillingness or what seems. Appears to be an unwillingness to gauge big issues. Syria, for example. Obama yeah, well. Kroft i mean, that. Obama well, moammar gaddafi probably does not agree with that assessment or at least if he was around, he wouldnt agree with that assessment. Obviously, you know, we helped to put together and lay the groundwork for liberating libya. You know, when it comes to egypt, i think, had it not been for the leadership we showed, you might have seen a different outcome there. But also understanding that we do nobody a service when we leap before we look. Where we, you know, take on things without having thought through all the consequences of it. And syrias a classic example of where our involvement. We want to make sure that not only does it enhance u. S. Security, but also that it is doing right by the people of syria and neighbors like israel that are going to be profoundly affected by it. And so, its true sometimes that we dont just shoot from the hip. Clinton we live not only in a dangerous, but an incredibly complicated world right now with many different forces at work, both statebased and nonstate technology and communications. And, you know, i. Im. Im older than the president. I dont want to surprise anybody by saying that. Obama but not by much. Clinton but, you know, i remember, you know, some of the speeches of eisenhower as a young girl, you know . Youve got to be careful. You have to be thoughtful. You cant rush in, especially now, where its more complex than its been in decades. So, yes, are there what we call Wicked Problems like syria, which is the one you named . Absolutely. And we are on the side of american values. Were on the side of freedom. Were on the side of the aspirations of all people to have a better life, have the opportunities that we are fortunate to have here. But its not always easy to perceive exactly what must be done in order to get to that outcome. So, you know, i certainly am grateful for the president s steady hand and hard questions and thoughtful analysis as to what we should and shouldnt do. Obama you know, there. There are transitions and transformations taking place all around the world. We are not going to be able to control every aspect of every transition and transformation. Sometimes theyre going to go sideways. Sometimes, you know, therell be unintended consequences. And. And our job is to, number one, look after americas security and national interest; but number two, find were are those opportunities. Where our intervention, our engagement can really make a difference and to be opportunistic about that. And thats something that i think hillary has done consistently, i think the team at the state departments done consistently, and thats what i intend to continue to do over the next four years. Kroft thank you very much. Obama all right. Welcome to the cbs sports update. Novak djokovic made history today, becoming the first man in the open era to win three straight Australian Open titles with a victory over andy murray. In the nba, led by paul pierces tripledouble, boston held off miami to win in Double Overtime and the celtics confirmed rajon rondo is out for the season. And indiana beat Minnesota State in college basketball. 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Ive just completed your new policy. Now please enjoy this hold music, performed by the worlds cutest, sweetest, cutest, musician ever. Did i mention hes cute . Employee shes. Not supposed to. Do that. Anncr call 1888metlife to buy or apply today. Pelley we have learned that u. S. Antidoping authorities have given Lance Armstrong a deadline of february 6 to agree to confess all under oath. If he declines, we are told that his lifetime ban in sports will be irreversible. Armstrong admitted to doping, for the first time, in an interview with Oprah Winfrey last week. But the director of the u. S. Antidoping agency, travis tygart, told us that armstrong did not tell the truth in that interview and left out the most important facts that investigators want to nail down. Tygart is the official who pursued the armstrong investigation when others had given up. The evidence amassed by his Antidoping Agency forced armstrong to surrender his titles, lose his sponsors and quit his charity. Armstrong says he wants to return to sport. Travis tygart holds the keys to that decision. So we asked him this week about armstrongs talk show confession. You know, at one point in the interview he said that he was curious about the definition of the word cheater. And he looked it up in the dictionary and didnt think it necessarily applied to him. Trvavis tygart its amazing. I mean scott you could go to almost any kindergarten in this country or frankly around the world and find kids playing tag or four square and ask them what cheating is. And every one of them will tell you its breaking the rules of the game. No. No real athlete has to look up the definition of cheating. Pelley armstrong described doping as so routine, it was, like the air in our tires and the water in our bottles. What did you think of that . Tygart its just simply not true. And. And i think its a pretty cowardly self interested justification or rationalization for his decision to defraud millions of people. Pelley the u. S. Anti doping agency, known as u. S. A. D. A. , polices u. S. Olympic sport. Last october it issued a report that is called a reasoned decision. It was a thousand pages of evidence that found that armstrong had run the most sophisticated, professionalized and successful doping program that sport had ever seen. That was one of u. S. A. D. A. S conclusions that armstrong denied in his interview last week. He suggested that cycling in those years was a level Playing Field because everyone did it. He wasnt doing anything special. Travis tygart its just simply not true. The access they had to inside information to how the tests work, what tests went in place at what time, special access to the laboratory, he. He was on an entirely different Playing Field than all the other athletes even if you assume all the other athletes had access to some doping products. Pelley armstrong admitted in the interview to doping throughout his seven Tour De France victories. He tried to make a comeback in 2009. He admitted the first seven, but those last two races in 2009 and 2010 he said he did not dope, he was racing clean. Tygart just contrary to the evidence. The evidence is clear. His blood tests in 2009, 2010, expert reports based on the variation of his blood values from those tests, one to a million chance that it was due to something other than doping. Pelley you have to wonder why, if he admits to doping in the first seven Tour De France races, why he would proclaim his innocence in 2009 and 2010 . Tygart i think it stops the criminal conspiracy and protects him and the others that helped him pull off this scheme from potential criminal prosecution if that was in fact true. Pelley how does that help him in that way . Tygart theres a fiveyear statute on a fraud criminal charge. So the five years today would have been expired. However, if the last point of his doping, as we alleged and proved in our reasoned decision, was in 2010, then the statute has not yet expired, and he potentially could be charged with a criminal violation for conspiracy to defraud. Pelley the famous u. S. Postal team was fueled by dope. There was an illegal blood booster called e. P. O. , there was testosterone, and a banned technique called blood doping in which riders store fresh blood and transfuse it into their bodies during a race. Records were broken, victories spoke for themselves and, for a decade, no one spoke of anything else. Tygart the first break that finally cracked the code of silence or the omerta that existed in the sport was when several witnesses in the spring of 2010 came forward and they told us their stories. Pelley you used the word omerta. Thats a mafia term. Tygart it is a mafia term. And i think there were parts of this scheme that were run like a mafia. Pelley in 2010, the u. S. Department of justice opened a criminal investigation. Armstrongs teammates were forced to testify, subpoenaed by a grand jury. One of them was tyler hamilton. Pelley one of the things that is so amazing about all of this is how long it was kept quiet. How many people knew and didnt say . Hamilton yeah, people were afraid of Lance Armstrong. People were afraid. Pelley but what is to be afraid of . Hamilton its the machine, you know, the lance machine. Hes got a lot of connections. If you go against Lance Armstrong, your. Your days in cycling are done. Pelley the testimony of hamilton and others before the grand jury in los angeles was secret until hamilton told his story in an interview on 60 minutes. Hamilton there was e. P. O. , there was testosterone. And i did see a transfusion, a blood transfusion. Pelley three weeks after that story in 2011, hamilton was in aspen, colorado, working his way through a crowded bar. Hamilton turned to my right, and it was Lance Armstrong. Pelley so he stops you cold . Hamilton stops me cold. Pelley and says what . Hamilton well, first he asked how much 60 minutes had paid me to. To do that interview. Pelley answer nothing. Hamilton obviously, nothing, yeah. The biggest thing he said is, you know, we are going to make your life a living, effing hell, both in the courtroom and out. Pelley he was, at that moment, the target of a federal investigation. And you were a witness in that federal investigation . Hamilton yeah, yeah. Pelley intimidating a witness is a federal crime. Did you feel intimidated . Hamilton i did, i did, i did. Pelley the grand jury heard from at least a dozen postal riders. There was testimony that a team bus had been pulled over in france while the riders inside were hooked up to banned blood transfusions. Some testified that riders used makeup to cover needle marks. The secret grand jury proceeding went on for two years but in 2012 the u. S. Attorney dropped the case without explanation. Hamilton i was really angry. I knew. You know, im not a rocket scientist, but i knew justice wasnt being served here. Pelley youd gone to the grand jury. Youd told the truth. And the government dropped the case. Youre out there twisting in the wind by yourself. Hamilton yeah, yeah. And i knew a lot of other people had testified and it was all gonna be sealed. And everybody was just going to go along like it had never happened. Pelley usada had been monitoring the investigation and tygart thought that the evidence gathered by the u. S. Attorney was overwhelming. Why do you think he dropped the case . Travis i dont know, scott. Its a good question and one that if you find the answer, let me know. Pelley armstrong congratulated the government for closing the investigation and kept repeating what he told cbs sports in 2005. Lance armstrong explain to me how weve passed so many tests if we are so dirty . And they dont want to answer that question. And thats not fair. Pelley but tygart did want to answer that question and he began an investigation. He convinced riders to testify to usada. He looked at armstrongs tests from his first Tour De France victory in 1999 and found e. P. O. Then, a swiss lab director, marcial saugy, said that after he got a suspicious test result on armstrong in 2001, he was directed to meet armstrong and his coach Johan Bruyneel. Saugy said the meeting was set up by the International Cycling union, which oversees the sport. Tygart he was instructed by u. C. I. To meet with Lance Armstrong and Johan Bruyneel and explain the e. P. O. Testing process, which he told us was unprecedented. And i asked him, did you give Lance Armstrong and Johan Bruyneel the keys to defeat the e. P. O. Test . And he nodded his head yes. Pelley tygart believes armstrong had influence over the u. C. I. Lance armstrong made a generous donation to the International Cycling union of 100,000. Do you think that was meant to influence them . Tygart i dont know. Obviously, totally inappropriate. Pelley why inappropriate . Lance armstrongs trying to support antidoping in sport. Thats what he would tell you. Tygart its an inherent conflict of interest. During that interview last week, armstrong was asked about that 2001 swiss test. Armstrong that story isnt true. There was no positive test. There was no paying off of the lab. There was no secret meeting with the lab director. Oprah winfrey the u. C. I. Didnt make that go away. Armstrong nope. Tygart he exonerated essentially the u. C. I. And our information is. And the evidence is different than that. Pelley what was it about what armstrong said in the interview about u. C. I. That you thought was wrong . Tygart i think their involvement was a lot deeper in him pulling off this heist than he was willing to admit to. Pelley and tygart told us armstrong tried to make a similar donation to u. S. A. D. A. Tygart made that revelation during our first interview earlier this month which was for 60 minutes sports, our program on the showtime network. Armstrong was asked about that in the interview last week. Winfrey were you trying to pay off u. S. A. D. A. . Armstrong no, that is not true. Winfrey thats not true . Armstrong that is not true. Tygart thats just not true. I received a phone call from one of his closest associates and they offered us the the money. Pelley you took this phone call yourself . Tygart yes pelley and armstrongs representative said what to you precisely . Tygart lance wants to make a financial donation to u. S. A. D. A. Pelley who was this representative . Tygart its one of his closest representatives. Ive told the federal government in its investigation on the civil fraud side, so i dont think it would be appropriate now to name the name because its still one of his closest representatives. Pelley there was no mistaking the purpose of that call . Tygart absolutely not. Pelley influence and intimidation were key, according to tygart, to getting riders onboard and keeping them in line. Pelley the impression that armstrong makes in the interview was that he was doping, yes, but he was just one of the guys. Tygart he was the boss. The evidence is clear he was one of the ringleaders of this conspiracy that pulled off this grand heist that defrauded using tens of millions of taxpayer dollars, defrauded millions of sports fans and his fellow competitors. Pelley there was a rider on the team named Christian Vande velde. What happened to him . Tygart lance called christian to his apartment and lance verbally accosted christian for not fully being on the doping program to maximize christians performance because his performance was not very good at that point. Pelley and Christian Vande veldes understanding was after that meeting that if he didnt dope, what would happen . Tygart lance made it Crystal Clear as did the doctor who was sitting there that you better fully get on the program or youre gonna be off the team. Pelley another u. S. Postal Service Rider named Frankie Andreu testified that after he refused to dope, he was fired and armstrong destroyed his career. Tygart it was tough. All these witnesses were scared of the repercussions of them simply telling the truth. Pelley what could Lance Armstrong do to them . Tygart incinerate them. Pelley former teamate Levi Leipheimer felt the heat. Leipheimer said in his sworn affidavit that he came to a cycling dinner after his testimony. Leipheimer says armstrong was there and sent leipheimers wife a text. It read run, dont walk. Pelley what did she take it to mean . Tygart its a veiled threat. Knowing her husband had just testified, truthfully, in front of the grand jury and had told citizens of this country about this great fraud; that it was a message, you better run. Pelley your investigation showed that there were personal threats made against riders who had decided to come clean. I wonder if there were any threats against you. Tygart there were, scott. Pelley these threats came from where . Tygart emails, letters. Pelley anonymous . Tygart yeah. Pelley can you remember any of the lines from the emails or the letters . Tygart the worst was probably putting a bullet in my head. Pelley did you take that seriously . Tygart absolutely. Turned it over to the f. B. I. To investigate it, which they are doing. Pelley tygarts agency was also threatened. The c. E. O. Of the livestrong foundation, armstrongs cancer charity, lobbied against usada before congress. Members of congress and 23 california state representatives called for an investigation of the agencys practices and its taxpayer funding. And yet, you chose to go ahead . You were gambling the fate of usada itself on this one case. Tygart if were unwilling to take this case and help this sport move forward, that were here for naught. We should shut down. And if they want to shut us down for doing our job on behalf of clean athletes, and the integrity of competition, then shut us down. Pelley last year, when tygart made his evidence public, armstrong had the option of a hearing and confronting the witnesses, but he chose not to fight, and he was handed that lifetime ban. In last weeks interview, armstrong said the ban was unfair considering that riders who testified against him were banned for only six months. Tygart if you traffic, if you distribute, if you possess, if you use the number of substances that he used over the period of time that he used, then you cover it up and you refuse to come in and be part of the solution, the rules mandate a lifetime ban. But the lowest his ban could go under the rules would be to an eightyear suspension. Pelley what does Lance Armstrong have to do for there to be a possibility that usadas lifetime ban would be lifted . Tygart he would have to come in just like all 11 of his teammates did and testify truthfully about all of those who were involved with him pulling off this grant heist. Pelley armstrong is facing a lawsuit that alleges he defrauded the federal government when he lied about cheating to get that Postal Service sponsorship. The suit was filed by former teammate floyd landis, and, in the next few weeks, the federal government is expected to decide whether to join landis in the suit. The potential penalty for armstrong and his Business Partners is 90 million. The department of justice has not made a decision about whether to join that lawsuit against Lance Armstrong. What do you think they should do . Tygart i think they have to join the suit. I mean, we were surprised the criminal case didnt go forward based on the evidence that. That we had seen and generated through our investigation. So, well be, you know, once again shocked if they dont join the suit. I think a jury should have an opportunity to decide whether the tens of millions of taxpayer dollars that were defrauded by this team and Lance Armstrong and his associates, whether or not the government should be paid back for that. Pelley as we reported, tygart has given armstrong a deadline of february 6 to agree to tell all under oath. Amstrongs lawyers have now replied to that, saying armstrong cannot appear by that date and, rather than usada, they say armstrong is more likely to tell his story to the International Cycling union, the same organization that tygart believes was complicit in hiding armstrongs doping. If Lance Armstrong had prevailed in this case and you had failed, what would the effect on sport have been . Tygart it. It would have been huge because athletes would have known that some are too big to fail. 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