Transcripts For KGO This Week With George Stephanopoulos 20160605

Im fast, im pretty and cant possibly be beat. Announcer from abc news, its this week. Here now, chief anchor George Stephanopoulos. Good morning. The world is remembering muhammad ali this week. A legendary champ thanks to his fast hands, even faster mouth. Im not the greatest, im the double greatest, he said. Its hard to be humble when youre as great as i am. Ali knew how to get inside his opponents head, and all through the primaries donald trump showed he could do exactly the same thing with tough talk, taunts and labels that stuck. The big question for him now, will those same tactics work in a general election . Does trump have to change to win . In this weeks latest round of the president ial fight, trump declared hes not changing at all, and Hillary Clinton is following his lead. This week, fists flew in the streets of san jose and donald trump combative as ever on the stump. Is this what its going to be like covering you if youre had president . Yeah, it is. Were going to have this kind of confrontation in the press room. Yeah, it is going to be like this. Attacking the press. Youre a sleaze. Hillary. I watched hillary today. It was pathetic. Even that federal judge. This judge is giving us unfair now i say why. Well, i im building a wall, okay, and its a wall between mexico, not another country hes not from mexico. In my opinion hes from indiana. He has mexican heritage. To anyone who thought they would see a different donald trump in the general election, this definitive answer. You think im going to change . Im not changing. And late this week Hillary Clinton seemed to steal a page from the trump playbook. A volley of hard shots on Trump University. He is trying to scam america the way he scammed all those people at trump u. Those comments about the judge in the case. Judge curiel is as much of an american as i am, but he has mexican roots. So do donald trump. That means he cant do his job. Poking trump for vanity and selfpromotion. Its all about him getting attention. Its all about him seeing his name in the newspaper and seeing his face on television. Making the case he cant be commander in chief. This is not someone who should ever have the Nuclear Codes because its not hard to imagine donald trump leading us into a war just because somebody got under his very thin skin. [ cheers and applause ] and secretary clinton joins us now. Good morning, madam secretary. Thank you, george. Your supporters have been pretty fired up in the last couple of days as youve been taking it to donald trump, and you also step it up using words like demagogue and dictator. Have you concluded that the best way to beat donald trump is to be a bit more like him . No, not at all. I laid out in my speech in san diego the crux of my concerns and my case against him on Foreign Policy and national security, and a lot of what he says plays into what i consider to be a very divisive and dangerous view of the world, and i think its important that we call it for what it is. Youve also said that hes temperamentally unfit to be president , and in that speech you said youre going to leave it to the psychiatrist to explain his affection for tyrants. Are you suggesting hes mentally unstable . Well, no, im suggesting exactly what i said, that hes temperamentally unfit. He doesnt really have ideas. He makes bizarre rants and engages in personal feuds and outright lies. He does apparently seem to have very thin skin, and i think that those kind of attributes, that temperament is illsuited for someone to be our president and commander in chief, and hes already, as i recited in my san diego speech, on record on so many issues that run counter to what democrats, republicans alike over many decades have thought was in americas interests in accordance with our values, and that to me is cause for concern. Whats the biggest danger coming from his temperament . I think he engages in so much scapegetting and fingerpointing and he is someone who doesnt tell the truth. He doesnt seem to be bothered by the constant inherent contradictions. I said he had said that he would not mind having other countries have Nuclear Weapons including korea, japan, saudi arabia. He said he didnt. A lot of news outlets, of course, easily pulled up the video of him saying all of that. His unpredictability, his putting everything in highly personal terms has rattled and thats the word president obama used, has rattled our closest allies, has caused a lot of serious concern around the world, because people are not used to seeing anyone, a republican or a democrat, running for president who is so loose with the truth, so divisive and so dismissive of very legitimate concerns about safety, security, our values and who we are as a nation. As you know, he said several several times over the last few days that he thinks you should be going to jail over the email issues and on face the nation hes just given an interview to John Dickerson where he said he would look at this when he becomes president. Listen. I would have my attorney general look at it because everyone knows that shes guilty. Now, i would say this, shes guilty, but i would let my attorney general make that determination. Maybe they would disagree. Your response . Well, its a typical trumpism. And i dont have any response, you know, when he attacks me, i am not going to respond, but i think it is in keeping with his very vicious public attack against the judge, the federal judge, who is hearing the case against socalled Trump University, a judge who has an impeccable record as a prosecutor, who actually spent, as im told, nearly a year in hiding because of threats from criminal drug cartels against his life, who was appointed first by the republican governor of california, governor schwarzenegger, then appointed by a democratic president , president obama, because of his extraordinary legal record. And what trump is doing is trying to divert attention from the very Serious Fraud charges against Trump University that have basically been confirmed by some of the highest officials who worked with him. So, this is typical. He does have that thin skin, and, you know, judge curiel is as american as i am and certainly as american as donald trump is, and trumps continuing ethnic slurs and rants against everyone including a distinguished federal judge i think makes my point rather conclusively. Madam secretary, on the email issue, as you know, the state Department Inspector general report was quite tough on your practices and it concluded i want to show it right here that secretary clinton had an obligation to discuss using her personal email account to conduct official business with their offices, and according to these official, Diplomatic Security and the information Resource Management offices did not and would not approve your exclusive reliance on a personal email account to conduct Department Business because of the restricts in the Foreign Affairs manual and the Security Risk in doing so. Do you know accept their conclusion that your exclusive use of a personal account was not allowed, that you broke state department rules . You know, look, george, i thought that the report actually made it clear that the practice i used was used by other secretaries, other highranking state department officials. No one else had exclusive use of the personal if i had to if i had to do it over again, i certainly wouldnt, but i think that the rules were not clarified until after i had left, because it had been the practice of others. There was certainly reason to believe, which i did, that what i practiced was in keeping with others practices. But you were the only one who had exclusive use of a personal account. Secretary powell did have a personal email account, as well, and they were very, very clear. You know go ahead. Well, george, i have to tell you that, you know, i will say it was a mistake. I would not do it again, but i think that the rules were not clarified until after i had left and the first secretary of state to use a government email account was john kerry some months into his tenure. Those are the facts. But the report so you dont accept the conclusion of the report because they say you were unmindful of the rules. Everybody in the department knew that i was emailing from a personal address. Hundreds of people knew it. People around the government knew it, and, you know, that was what the practice had been, and thats what i did, as well. So ill take it that you dont accept their conclusion. Just one other question on this. Have you had any contact yet with the fbi, you or your agents, over this matter . I have not been asked to come in for an interview. Ive said i am more than willing since last august, and i would like to do that sooner instead of later and get this matter wrapped up and behind us. Lets talk about the Second Amendment. As you know, donald trump has also been out on the stump talking about the Second Amendment saying you want to abolish the Second Amendment. I know you reject that, but i want to ask you a specific question, do you believe an individuals right to bear arms is a constitutional right, that its not linked to service in a militia . I think that for most of our history there was a nuanced reading of the Second Amendment until the decision by the late Justice Scalia and there was no argument until then that localities and states and the federal government had a right as we do with every amendment to impose reasonable regulations, so i believe we can have commonsense gun Safety Measures consistent with the Second Amendment, and, in fact, what i have proposed is supported by 90 of the American People and more than 75 of responsible gun owners, so that is exactly what i think is constitutionally permissible, and once again, you have donald trump just making outright fabrications accusing me of something that is absolutely untrue. But im going to continue to speak out for comprehensive background checks, closing the gun show loophole, closing the online loophole, closing the socalled charleston loophole, reversing the bill that senator sanders voted for and i voted against giving immunity from liability to gunmakers and sellers. I think all of that can and should be done and it is in my view consistent with the constitution. And the decision also says there can be some restrictions but thats not what i asked. Do you believe their conclusion an individuals right to bear arms is a constitutional right . If it is a constitutional right, then it like every other constitutional right is subject to reasonable regulations. And what people have done with that decision is to take it as far as they possibly can and reject what has been our history from the very beginning of the republic where some of the earliest laws that were passed were about firearm, so i think its important to recognize that reasonable people can say, as i do, responsible gun owners have a right, i have no objection to that, but the rest of the American Public has a right to require certain kinds of regulatory, responsible actions to protect everyone else. How far would you go on that . Back in 1993, and i want to show it right here, you actually came out in support a gun tax. Lets listen. How do you react to a 25 sales tax on handguns and on automatic weapons . Im all for that. I just dont know what else were going to do to try to figure out how to get some handle on this violence. We will look at your proposal and be happy to talk with you about it. Im speaking personally, but i feel very strongly about that. Do you still believe that . What i was saying back then was that we have a lot of Public Health costs that taxpayers end up paying for through medicaid, medicare, through uncompensated care because that was in the context of the push for Health Care Reform and that we needed some way to try to defray those costs, and im not going to commit to any specific proposal. I was speaking personally then. I would have to, you know, consider any proposal in light of how it interacted with all the others that we want to continue to advocate for, particularly, as i said, comprehensive background checks. But that was in the context of health care. When you have mass shootings, you not only have the terrible deaths, you have people who are injured. You know, i was just in San Bernardino yesterday, and i met some of the survivors. One woman who was shot twice whos had a series of surgeries, two other women who were cowering in abject terror by the terrorists unbelievable assault on their coworkers. What they talked to me about is where do they get the Financial Support to deal with both the physical and the Emotional Trauma . You know, is it workmans comp support which is one of the arguments . Is it private insurance . Is it because they worked for the county, something the county should pay for . There are real costs that people incur because of the terrible gun violence epidemic and we have to deal with it and im going to be looking for ways to deal with it. Im not committed to anything other than what ive said in this campaign. But i do want people to ask themselves, cant we do better than have 33,000 People Killed every year by guns and many thousands more injured . And i think we can. Finally, madam secretary, several more states voting on tuesday including california where you are right now. Is this race against Bernie Sanders over, whether or not you win california on tuesday . Well, i think if you look at the popular vote, if you look at the majority of pledge delegates, i should have captured those by tuesday. But im going to keep fighting hard here in california and in the other states that are voting on tuesday because i want to get as strong a vote as i possibly can. But i think given where we are in this race, that i will have not only more than a 3 millionvote margin, but i will have a significant majority of pledge delegates by the close of voting on tuesday. Madam secretary, thanks for your time today. Thank you. Thank you so much. Byebye. And when we come back, the republican response from the chair of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. Hes advised donald trump. Senator bob corker joins us live. Plus our powerhouse roundtable. And after a dismal jobs report, how will the economy shape the race . Paul krugman and Grover Norquist debate. Its brought to you by blackberry priv. With priv your business is secured. Shop now at blackberry. Com. Art. 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So you can seize those moments, wherever you find them. Flonase. Six is greater than one changes everything. The world is a mess. We helped make the world a mess. Going into iraq was a disastrous decision. Maybe the worst decision ever in the history of our country. Number two, getting out of iraq the way obama did it, he didnt have a clue. Theres donald trump laying out his views on Foreign Policy last night. Well talk about that with the chair of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee bob corker next. Relations Committee Bob corker next. Were good. Okay. What if a Million People download the new app . Were good. Five million . Good. We scale on demand. Hybrid infrastructure, boom. Ok. What if 30 Million People download the app . Were not good. Were total heroes. Scale on demand with the Number One Company in cloud infrastructure. Yourbut the omega3s in fish oil differ from megared krill oil. Unlike fish oil, megared is easily absorbed by your body. Megared. 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We need to make sure that we have a beautiful place for our children to live. Together, were building a better california. Hes challenging some of the status quo, if you will. It is causing these countries to think a little bit differently about the u. S. , and i say that in a positive way. We had a good conversation about those types of things, other Foreign Policy issues. That is the chair of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee bob corker after his meeting with donald trump last month. Senator corker is a supporter of the republican nominee. He joins us now. Senator, thank you for joining us this morning. I want to talk about Foreign Policy, but i have to begin with those attacks on judge curiel from donald trump that have gotten so much news this week. He says that when he questions whether the judge can be fair because of his mexican heritage, that is not racist. Do you agree . Look, i dont condone the comments, and we can press on to another topic. I think we need to move beyond that, and i think he has a tremendous opportunity to disrupt the direction that washington is moving in and create tremendous opportunity and i hope hes going to take advantage of that and i think he will. But you just heard secretary clinton say thats one of the reasons she thinks hes temperamentally unfit and how he is loose with the truth and divisive and doesnt have any real ideas. She made the case why he is not fit to be commander in chief. Can you make the affirmative case . Why are you confident hell be a good commander in chief . Yeah. So i listened to the speech and i heard a little bit of the interview in advance, george. And my take on it is this, i think that her team feels that her service as secretary of state has made her incredibly vulnerable. I think you talked to her about some of the judgment issues that she made in actually running the department, but if you think back to the decisions that were made in 2011, they were really disastrous, and she played a central role in really creating a home for where isis resides today. If you look at the libyan incursion which i think will be a textbook case for what not to do in making Foreign Policy decisions, unbelievable decision, then you look at the precipitous leaving of iraq, and then you look at encouraging the moderate opposition in syria and never following through, i think that they feel that shes very vulnerable and i think thats why these attacks are being made. I understand that is your case against what is the affirmative case, though, for donald trump . Why are you confident hes going to be a good commander in chief . So, look, i think hes at a point where its at his fingertips now. He has an opportunity to transition. Hes talking to people that i respect greatly. Secretary baker, dr. Kissinger are people that are two of the most the greatest Foreign Policy experts in our nation, so hes talking to the right people, and its my hope that now that this primary decision process is over, its like moving from the major leagues to the world series, its my hope that he is going to transition into that phase. He has an opportunity to really change the trajectory of our country, and its my sense that he will take advantage of that. I hope that he will. But well have to see. He said this week hes not going to change. Well, i think that hes going to have to change. And the fact is im not talking about him necessarily changing his views. But i think that hes now moving into a different phase. Hes talking to the right my sense is, i spoke to dr. Kissinger and secretary baker before and after the meetings and hes asking all the right questions. Hes talking to people all around the country that are experts in this regard and i think they know that theyre at a place where this campaign has to evolve. Lets talk about let me go back and say, again go ahead. I think, again, if you go bark and look at secretary clinton, who had a professional relationship with, the fact is that shes already shown that her judgments relative to Foreign Policy have much to much lacking. She made decisions back in 2011 that really created a home for isis today, and i think i think that they are trying to obviously paint him as someone who is unstable, because they really realize the vulnerabilities that she has and the judgments that she made in the past have made her that way. Lets talk about his ideas. Lets talk about his ideas. You are the chair of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and said his call for a temporary ban on muslim immigration is not a serious proposal and the former head of the ceo Michael Hayden said this morning its a recruiting tool for isis. If donald trump as president moved to impose that ban, would you support it or try to stop it . No, i would not support it and ive already issued statements to that effect and what i understand is he has stepped away from those statements. Well, he has said he still supports those statements. Hes also said in every speech that he talks about building a wall on our border and getting mexico to pay for it. Is that realistic, and what would it do to our relations with mexico . You know, obviously we do need to have good relations with mexico and canada. We do. Thats one of the things that makes our country in such a stable environment, having two friends on our borders unlike many countries around the world. There is a security issue. I authored an amendment during the immigration debate that actually makes building a wall look like ned in the first reader, meaning it was even more difficult and, by the way, a tougher security border measure. By the way, every democrat in the senate voted for that measure. So theres no question that we have agreement in our country that we need greater security. Its strongly bipartisan, and i hope that we will implement that because it is a security threat. But is it realistic to expect mexico to pay for the wall . I think people agree with that whats that . Is it realistic for people to expect mexico to pay for that wall . Well, again, i dont want to get into a debate about the nuances of that. I mean its a statement that he has made. I thought this interview was going to be more about the Foreign Policy arena. I think he has a tremendous opportunity there. Well, our relations with mexico is Foreign Policy. Okay. Well, look, as to how the wall is paid for, thats something that Congress Certainly will debate. My guess is there will be additional debates regarding how the actual security measures will be put in place, but securing our border has been something that people on both sides of the aisle have supported for years and we need to do that, and its understandable that its become an issue because its lingered for so long. We had an opportunity to deal with this years ago. It wasnt dealt with. It needs to be dealt with now. And hopefully well move beyond that very quickly. Well, youre also on Foreign Policy. Youre a strong supporter of trade deals including the new trancepacific partnership and donald trump is opposed to that and says hes putting on 45 tariffs on them if they dont change the way they do business. Youd have to vote for that in the senate. Is that something you could support . The fact is that, look, we were involved we are involved in globalization. Every person who picks up their iphone in the morning deals in globalization. The fact is that trade agreements set the rules of the road, and sometimes we negotiate trade agreements that are good. Some of them are not as good as they should be. The tpp program is something strategically for our nation is important to get right. There are flaws in it that need to be stiffened, and so i hope that well move through that. I do believe that having a trade agreement that works for our country is important as we have countries that want to move our way. China is pushing them our way. Its my hope that well be able to negotiate something that works. The flaws in this agreement have been pointed out, and there are things that need to be resolved but having an agreement with country in the Southeast Asia area is important for our nation and i hope well get to a place where we have an agreement that americans can support. So which specific ideas of donald trump on Foreign Policy are you enthusiastic about, are you ready to fight for . So, i think heres what i have seen in many of the statements that hes made. Its something that secretary baker would its a degree of realism coming back and our Foreign Policy. For years weve had neocons on the republican side. Weve had liberal internationalists on the democratic side, and i think bringing that maturity back into our Foreign Policy is something thats important. That doesnt mean us being isolationists, but it does mean selective engagement, and weve had some great hearings on this topic. Its bringing a maturity, looking at our u. S. National interest realizing who our friends are, relationships, things like throwing aside mubarak so quickly after decades of relationship and not figuring out a better way for him to be eased out. The thing we did in libya, i mean, again, that was one of the most immature excursions. That will be used, george, again as an exhibit in International Policy schools as to what not to do here in america. So i see a degree of maturity stepping in. Ive obviously encouraged that. I want to see good things for our nation. George, i think the thing that has caused people to be tantalized, if you will, to a degree by the trump candidacy is they realize that the two parties acting as they are today will continue to enable each other to go down a path that is really degrading our nations greatness. It is. And what they see in donald trump is a disrupter, someone who can change that trajectory. Okay. It is up to him now. It is up to his campaign now to take advantage of that, to pivot and move in a direction that shows that they have the ability to do that. I am hopeful that that is going to occur, but theyre at that point right now as they move beyond this, the primary process this week to the world series of the election, and im hopeful that that is what is going to happen. And thats what well be watching for. Senator corker, thanks very much. Roundtable is up next plus president obama is talking up the economy this week. In elkhart, indiana. Paul krugman and Grover Norquist standing by to debate the state of the economy and the candidates proposals when we come back. Announcer this week with George Stephanopoulos brought to you by carmax. To you by carmax. Came out today thousands of people to run the race for retirement. So we asked them. Are you completely prepared for retirement . Okay, mostly prepared . Could you save 1 more of your income . It doesnt sound like much, but saving an additional 1 now, could make a big difference over time. Im going to be even better about saving. You can do it, it helps in the long run. Prudential bring your challenges yourbut the omega3s in fish oil differ from megared krill oil. Unlike fish oil, megared is easily absorbed by your body. Megared. The difference is easy to absorb. Poallergies . Reather. Stuffy nose . 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But are you asking enough about how your wealth is managed . Wealth management, at charles schwab. The call just came in. Shes about to arrive. And with her, a flood of potential patients. A deluge of digital records. Xrays, mris. All on account. Of penelope. But with the help of at t, and a network that scales up and down ondemand, this hospital can be ready. Giving them the agility to be flexible reliable. Because no one knows like at t. I wanwho doesnt . Ape. So i bike. I get all of my greens. And i try not to faint. This. I can do easily. Benefiber® healthy shape. Just a couple of spoonfuls every day means fewer cravings. Plus, its all natural, clear, tastefree and dissolves completely. Its clinically proven to keep me fuller longer and helps keep me healthy inside and out. Benefiber® healthy shape. This, i can do. Find benefiber® healthy shape in the fiber aisle. And were back now with our roundtable joined by our own matthew dowd, Roland Martin of news one now, e. J. Dionne columnist from the Washington Post and republican strategist sara fagen, also cnbc contributor also. Let me begin with you, matt. What a week. I think we say that just about every week and heard donald trump declared again and again this week hes not going to change and heard senator bob corker, republican, saying hes going to have to. Who is right . I think i mean, believe donald trump when he says it because he hasnt changed in the course of this campaign. Im fascinated by donald trump and has been very successful in all this but usually you see politicians grow as candidates or grow as leaders in the course of this. Donald trump has stayed exactly the same he was when he came down the escalator and when he where he is today. The exact same person saying the exact same things. Been quite successful winning this, the republican nomination in the course of this and is problematic if he doesnt grow as a candidate and grow as a leader for the 45 or 50 million that will ultimately decide this election. Sara . He hasnt grown as a candidate not only on the policy side but on the political side. I mean, think about the fact he spent five days in california over the course of the last two weeks. Hes now the republican nominee. This general election is going to be decided in virginia, ohio and florida. And he is spending time in a state that he doesnt need to be spending time in unless hes raising money. He says he can win. Well, the Los Angeles Times had Hillary Clinton up over 20 points on donald trump. I dont think california is going to be a trump column. In washington, d. C. , they now can smoke marijuana. Republicans will need that in congress if he continues to do what hes doing. At the end of the day what you have, a candidate who refuses to understand that people will now judge you based upon stature, based upon how you present yourself, and when secretary clinton hits him saying about his temperament, that simply raises more flags, and when he what hes doing to this federal judge is beyond shameful. I dont see how independents will say, yeah, thats my guy. And you saw, e. J. Dionne, of course, republicans coming out saying they cant condone what he said about judge curiel, but on the same day that hes making those charges and the same day Hillary Clinton is giving that speech about his temperament, paul ryan, speaker of the house, endorses donald trump. You know, i think he may have picked the worst day of the year. Some people speculated hes getting in the way of hillarys speech. I think he had no idea how effective that would be or that the very next day ryan would have to say, oh, im for trump but i dont believe in what hes doing with that judge. I think this was a real turning point week because Hillary Clintons attack on trump laid out almost the entire case against him in detail. She was calm, and she finally solved or at least began solving this authenticity problem. Shes not really comfortable attacking bob burnquist. Theres too much cost to that, but she believe d every word she said about donald trump because he so offends her notion of what a president looks like, so i think that was a kind of twofer for her and the republicans knew it. It was shocking that trump had nothing ready in response to that speech. And it was shocking because there is a great case to be made against Hillary Clinton and her Foreign Policy. Well, and you heard bob corker making part of that. Exactly. Bob corker just did it. Donald trump should have given that response to her speech instead of talking about this judge and attacking this judge and putting all republicans on the defense against his comments. But its not shocking. Its not shocking. Were talking about the death of muhammad ali. What did he do against sonny liston . He atalked a bully and when you attack a bully, what does sonny liston do, he quit. The bottom line is republicans Hillary Clinton is not going to quit. No, no. Follow me, republicans in the primary were afraid to go after the bully. They ran away from him. The smartest thing in the world is to hit him and when hes saying she lied, nope, here are all the things you said. Hold on a second. Let me bring this question to maddie mastro. One thing youre seeing and saw it in the bob corker interview and youve seen it from donald trump, when theyre asked about when theyre asked about donald trump, they talk about Hillary Clinton. Is he going to need people out there making the affirmative case for his candidacy . In any normal year, yes. But this is not a normal year in the course of this. I think part of the problem and i think this is evidence of it is is most of the people voting for Hillary Clinton right now are voting because they dont want donald trump, and most of the people that are voting for donald trump right now are voting for that because they dont want hiraoka so the negative hiraoka will spend 80 of her time saying why not donald trump and donald trump will spend his time talking about Hillary Clinton. Thats the problem in the course of this election. We have two candidates we talked about it before. Its as if somebody said youll move in a house and get a roommate but the roommate is someone you dont like and dont trust and youll have to move in and live with that person. At some point the voters are like, im going to sleep in the car. Thats the choice in this election. The biggest beneficiary this week from all the things that happened is gary johnson. The libertarian. I think he and bill have an opportunity to get a high enough percentage to get in the debate. If theyre in the debate they wont win the election but itll change the stakes. Who does that help and hurt . You know, in a normal election the libertarian candidates hurt the republicans. The question in this election, does the vote get high enough that they start taking away votes from Hillary Clinton from people who really, really hate donald trump but cant quite get to her so i think the Third Party Candidate and the green Party Candidate jill stein that we draw from the democrats, i think there is a risk here. Heres the thing about what republicans couldnt do with trump that clinton can. There are arguments she can make about immigration that republicans were afraid to make in the primaries and the most frightening thing about her speech was her optimistic reaganesque view of america, you know, quoting lincoln last best hope on earth, republicans have been selling an idea of decline for so long, that it was very hard for them to make the argument she made in the primary because some republican, jeb bush, perhaps should have given the speech Hillary Clinton gave during the republican primary. Well, i think he did. I dont think it got it didnt have the coverage that this speech obviously got, but, look, donald trump does have some things going for him. Youre going to have a segment next on the economy and the economy is not good and that is usually very beneficial to the party out of power. He has record turnout. He has enthusiasm and a wide Enthusiasm Gap among republicans in his favor. There are things going for trump but youre right. He has got to pivot roland, while he still has a divided Democratic Party, hiraoka had another victory in the Virgin Islands yesterday. Probably going to do well in edgard periera today and have the pledge delegates she needs by 8 00 p. M. Tuesday night so how does this end on the democratic side . Is there a way to get Bernie Sanders out before the convention or is he in all the way . This is about leverage. You need to go back to 1988. Reverend Jesse Jackson and michael dukakis. I know for a fact that reverend jackson has been trying to reach Bernie Sanders to have a conversation with him about how he should operate. When i interviewed reverend jackson on tv one, he said point blank, how bernie behaves is critically important to what kind of leverage he has. Remember, reverend thats how you got proportioned delegation and thats how you actually got an increase in superdelegates and thats how ron brown became chairman of the dnc, but his behavior and how he responds over the next couple of months will determine whether the party listens to him or not. 88 is the blueprint for him. I agree with roland on this. I think this is much more contingent on Bernie Sanders than Hillary Clinton. Everybody knows she has the math. Shell win the delegates. Its all there. Bernie sanders does not which he put himself in this place. He does not want to be the populist candidate who has run against a rigged system that says i want a bunch of elites to overturn the election and give it to me. He does not want to the question hes got to ask himself does, he want to be part of the Democratic Party like candidates in the previous years like Hillary Clinton did in 2008 or does he want to leave and start another push this movement outside the party. Enl, whats the answer to that question . I think the answer is that if Bernie Sanders wants an effect at the long run, he is going to have to start supporting clinton. There are already bernie people out there saying, look, we know clinton is going to be the nominee and cant risk having donald trump as the president. If he does that, i think he increases his influence in the party in the long run because he has built a big movement out there. You get the last word. Her speech was important for two reasons, not only because she started to define donald trump but gave Bernie Sanders the pathway to come to her side of the aisle and coalesce the Democratic Party. She laid it out well. Has more power outside than inside. Next the jobs report and crucial debate on the economy. Nobel prize Winning Economist paul krugman squares off with tax activist Grover Norquist. Thats next. Grover norquist. Thats next. Americas economy is not just better than it was eight years ago. It is the strongest, most durable economy in the world. [ cheers and applause ] president obama in elkhart, indiana, this week, but that argument took a bit of a hilt with the job report. They hired at the slowest pace in more than five years in may with just 38,000 jobs. Unemployment rate continued to drop. 10 in 2010. 4. 7 now but heres a lessening trend, in 1995, medium Household Income 52,600. 20 years later just 2 higher, 2 raise in 20 years. Todays debate, can the next president do anything to turn it around . Whats the state of the economy right now. Were joined by paul krugman, Nobel Prize Winner and Grover Norquist longtime president of americans for tax reform and, paul, lets begin with fridays jobs report. Does it undercut the president s argument about the economy being so strong over the last well, i happen to have a chart which i made this morning which gives you a little perspective. This is private sector jobs under obama and under his predecessor, and this report is that little thing at the end there, that little sort of flattening out. So the perspective is still that you had a long run of pretty good job creation and then you had a bad month which was not part of that was the verizon strike so the number would have been twice if we saw if verizon had not 35,000 workers. Thats right. Even so, no question job growth is slowing. The economy is slowing. That happens. Theres no particular explanation that, you know, i think it has a lot to do with fed missteps last year, but thats sort of by the side. The question is if the economy slows more, what can we do about it . And the answer is, well, we know very well what to do, the problem is political. The question is, will the next president well, actually if the next president is donald trump, hell send out a bunch of tweets to china and mexico. Where are we on this . 660,000 people walked out of the workforce last month. Not only with 38,000 people got jobs, but 660,000 said were not loofshging for work nimg. One of the challenges we had the obama recovery is so weak, the reagan recovery from the end of the recession out to the years was 4 growth. Its been 2 under obama. If we had grown at reagan rates and job creation, there would be 14. 7 million more americans working. The reason why theyre so happy, why trump gets support, why sanders gets supports, why people are grumpy, the economy sucks. Its not cheerful, 14. 5 million more people would be at work. Fathers, mothers, sisters, brothers with jobs. They dont have jobs. Whats trumps answer to turn it around . Im happy with his tax plan, step one well take business taxes both corporations and people who drive uber, independent contractors, 15 tax. Not 35 corporate rate which is 10 higher than the european average, stupider than france is not where you want to be on your corporate and business taxes. A 15 rate, extremely good step in the right direction, and hes competing with Hillary Clinton who outlined six major taxes, three of which she admits will cost a trillion dollars. Wow, i find its kind of pathetic that were still saying, oh, look at ronald reagan. We had a republican president before obama who got tax Economic Policy and obama is out before him. We disagree on each of those points. Okay. We go to reagan because he had reagan policies. Anyway, the point is that the recovery has been disappointing, i will admit that but its been disappointing largely because we have had incredible cutbacks in public employment, public spending which obama didnt control. And the way forward is not more tax cuts for the rich which havent worked in kansas. Hasnt have never been shown to do what they do. What we really need is a big infrastructure build. That would make total sense given extremely low borrowing costs and given that we need the infrastructure and the job thats not going to happen with a republican house. Donald trump agrees with that. The question, how to pay for it. And will the house support it . The argument is growth. But we had 800 billion thrown at this issue, and we were told that was going to create jobs and none of the jobs they said would happen the economy continued to do poorly with all of that debt built up, 800 for the stimulus package. That policy doesnt work. Its not going to work. If you have progrowth policies and talk about states, look at texas, look at florida, North Carolina where theyre reducing taxes and spending. Kansas has a challenge where the Supreme Court tells them they have to spend money then people say, oh, my goodness, you cut tacks too much. The Supreme Court demanding, so, but look at the states with higher taxes, illinois versus states like texas without and you see different job creation. But i think the point is we know extremely well what to do. We know exactly what is needed and the problem is the people the ideology that grover is giving here is what stands in the way. The fact youll have complete rigid adherence to that ideology which has failed again and again and again and nothing has changed. Reagan created more jobs and reagan created got to go back 35 years to a completely different situation. We had bush, got all this stuff, none of it delivered, and its kind of an amazing thing how bush has become a nonperson. Well, no, but he had significant spending increases in the last two years of his administration. Democrats did the budget, not republicans so looking at a number of challenges and didnt have a supply side to economics like trump is looking at. Hes also talking about regulation. Not talking about controlling spending trump is completely yeah, trump is completely incoherent on Economic Policy. You can find him on any given day supporting almost anything. He said he wanted to maybe raise taxes on the rich then cut them. To actually try to suss out what trump means, god knows. Its written down and i think the proposal that he has getting rid of the death tax and getting rid of the amt finally and take corporate and business takes to 15 , hes actually going to be a great advantage to the gig economy, 1099 economy, the sharing economy which Hillary Clinton is actually bared her teeth at and she said shes going to crack down on independent contractors which basically make uber and airbnb illegal in this country. Hillary is on the wrong side of the future, on the wrong side of the gig economy, the sharing economy and trump has a tax plan . That they found out whos been hacking into our network. Who . Guess. I dont know, some kids in a basement . You watch too many movies. Who . A Small Business in china. A business . They work nine to five. They take lunch hours. Like a job . Like a job. We tracked them. How did we do that . We have some new guys defending our network. New guys . Well, theyre not that new. Theyve been defending things for a long time. [ digital typewriting ] its not just security. Its defense. Bae systems. All weekend long weve been celebrating the greatest of all time. Tributes for muhammad ali pouring in from all over the globe and end with the personal reflections of our own pierre thomas. Reporter ali, beautiful. That smile. That twinkle of mischief radiating from his eyes. Brash. Im handsome, im fast. Im pretty and cant possibly be beat. Reporter so powerful, so graceful and so crafty. Ali with a sneaky right hand. Reporter we all remember him outfoxing the titan george foreman, tricking himself into punching himself into exhaustion. Champion again. So much sweeter because we knew his history. Principled. Refusing to fight in the vietnam war at a time when his native country still struggled with issues of equality and poverty. You want me to go somewhere and fight but you wont even stand up for me here at home. As playful as he was controversial. Im amazed youre famous enough. Reporter i can remember him teasing the great Howard Cosell even playing with the mans toupee. Laugh out loud. But human. Not a perfect man but at one point rejecting integration. At times cruel to his opponents. When he said he would fight a gorilla in manila, i could not believe such a champion for justice could say that about another black man with all the ugly symbolism. Yes, human, not perfect. Yet subject to growth and redemption. A champion who first inspired his own people and eventually the world to be unafraid, proud and defiant. Evolving to become a symbol of love and peace. Even as he fought a disease that took so much of the physical and verbal poetry we so revered. Unsteady yet still graceful. Parkinsons tried to silence ali but never really did. He won. An example of the indomitable human spirit. He was the greatest. Thanks to pierre for that. And now we honor our fellow americans who serve and sacrifice. In the last four weeks, two Service Members died overseas supporting operations in iraq. And that is all for us today. Thanks for sharing part of your sunday with us. Check out world news tonight. Ill see you tomorrow on gma. World news tonight. Ill see you tomorrow on gma. Announcer the following is a presentation of espn on abc. Here we go, folks. Yeah one for the ages. I dont even know what to say at this point. The final x games has had it all. Unbelievable. But before the sun sets there is one final day of mayhem. Its a battle for big air gold on double down day at the mega ramp. Then aussie kyle baldock pedals for his fourth straight gold in bmx dirt. And Curren Caples and pedro barros are set to drop in again after trading gold the last four