Map of Palestine with these little dots here and there that will form the Palestinian communities still in existence and Palestine the only solution would be just a one democratic state secular not Jewish not Muslim just like every other state in the world and let me tell you something right now Israel is the only the only state in the world that is not the state of its citizens like I told you it is not the state of the citizens but the state of the Jewish people if you are a Jew you can go to Palestine or you can go to Israel and become an Israeli citizen immediately where as any other country you cannot do that if if if a Muslim wants to go to Saudi Arabia this Muslim let's say a Pakistani needs to go to Saudi Arabia this person has to apply for a visa he may be accepted or not and of the visas approved he can only go there for a short period of time or for work or something but never become a citizen the only place that this happens is Israel and this is not normal you know the Palestinians have no rights they need to be in their land the refugees and their descendants need to go back to their land and there is plenty of land for all all of the citizens of Israel will remain in the same country and it will become a secular country just like any other country in the world. You're listening to Ronnie bird hoosh on Jordan Palestine Israel and the United States this is independent alternative radio you can order copies of this program by calling 1800 triple 41977 that's 180-444-1977 or you can order online on our website alternative radio dot org That's alternative radio dot r g. I've been seeing change on the Israeli side there are so many Jewish Americans and Jewish Canadians and Jewish Europeans who look at the State of Israel and see for you know see signs of fascism apartheid signs of racism they don't accept these things because these are values that they were not raised with in their countries these are values that are looked down at you know in Europe in the United States and Australia and so on more and more European American Jews are looking at Israel and think to themselves I don't align myself with this ideology and we are seeing people that are coming out and talking you know intellectuals like you the Israeli generals like me copilot and so on coming to the forefront of the discussion and saying loudly that this is wrong what you're doing to the Palestinians is unacceptable the Palestinians have nowhere to go they are not going anywhere you have to give them back their rights they have to live just like everybody else and their own country with respect and dignity now you've spent a lot of time in the United States you were educated there you traveled there what is your understanding in terms of why the u.s. People tend to have a very distorted view of the realities in this part of the world. Generally it's more than one reason one of the reasons why the average American citizen would look at the you know the Palestinian Israeli conflict and think that Israel is the 5th them is because the media in the United States has been you know influenced by a lot by the by the strong Jewish lobby in America you have organizations like APAC and to Defamation League and so on that are really influential in decision making you know the they have very close contact with the Congress with different media. And you know there are strong lobbyists so that's one thing the other thing is that you know for a while maybe for the past 50 years or oil the Gulf oil Saudi Arabian oil and so on has been very very important for the for the American economy. You know Jimmy Carter said that the Gulf oil is a matter of national security for the Americans and the Gulf oil needed to be protected by a proxy something somebody close somebody a country that is going to protect it on behalf of the Americans and Israel was you know was doing that for them so there are interests involved. American governments felt that you know that Israel was the non Arab country in the region that was able to do their job in protecting the oil for American interests and so on but you know at the end of the day the Arabs are to blame to the you know the Arabs or the Palestinians have no voice in the United States they haven't done enough to talk to Americans to show them what you know has been done to them and to connect you know their problems with the problems of other movements and other you know nationalities in the world that went through something like that and is it your sense that ringing declarations that come from Arab capitals about Palestinian independence and Palestinian rights is just a lot of hot air and they pay lip service to the Palestinian cause but don't do anything about it. Many of the Arab regimes get their legitimacy not from their populations they were not voted into into their presidencies or you know or other or their offices but they have their legitimacy come from superpowers like the United States and other big countries so they will function in the interest of those who gave them their legitimacy of those who give them their protection so if I get my protection from the United States I will do what the United States wants me to do if I get my legitimacy from my people I will work for the good of my people unfortunately. The Arabs are also going through problems the Arab people have been trying to get back their rights and maybe you know in getting the kind of governments that will represent them and they are working on it we saw the Arab Spring. You know the people who were trying to get their voices heard but it's going to take some time you know the counter forces are too strong at this point. Talk about the country you live in right now Jordan its kind of and old land but a new country how was it formed. Jordan has 2 stories of how it was founded there is the view that Jordan was founded as a triumph of the Arabs Arab revolt against the Ottoman Empire and the Turks towards the beginning of the 20th century the Ottoman Empire which ruled over all of the Arab world was we was getting weakened. And it was you know it hardly had enough resources to sustain its forces outside of Turkey so the Arabs wanted their independence and the Arab revolt that created the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan was considered. To do the Hashemites that are ruling Jordan now it was the founding of Jordan was the the and triumph of the Arab revolt now the other the other view is that Jordan was founded as a byproduct of the buffer declaration in 1917 when for the secretary the foreign secretary of England gave the letter to Lord Rothschild that we promise you basically we promise you Palestine as a Jewish homeland. The area that is east of the Jordan River which was which was called Trans-Jordan which is today's Jordan was considered part of the belt for the clear ation and then when the Hashemites worked with the British to get out the Turks from this area and by the end of the 1st World War the Ottoman Empire was finished the British felt that they needed to reward the Hashemites for their support in getting the Ottomans out and they promised East. Of the Jordan River to the Hashemites So it is either seen as a triumph of the Arabs against the Turks or it is seen as a byproduct of the big Zionist project that was manifested by the Balfour Declaration but didn't the British and the French basically double cross the Arabs they were promising them if they joined the revolt against the Ottoman Turks that they would have independent states when the war ended they were promising everybody everything they promised the. Family the whole of gnashed and his eyes which is to decide the Arabia they promise to Hashemites part of which is today's Mecca and Trans-Jordan Palestine Syria and Lebanon they promised the Jews Palestine and then the 1st World War And so the British decided to divide the area that we call the Levant which today make up Palestine slash Israel Jordan Syria and Lebanon in the agreement of sites because they divided it so that Jordan and Palestine would go to the British Syria and Lebanon would go to the French they promise to Hashemites Jordan and Palestine but they also promised the Jews Palestine so there was a double crossing at the end of the day the Jews got Palestine and the Hashemites got the area that's east of the Jordan river so the monarchy is established here in Amman and if in continues now. What is the structure of political power in the country is is the monarch a figurehead or does he wheeled actual power. The monarch has absolute power here we have a parliament and it's elected but the Parliament can be dissolved by the king the head of the government is not elected you know the prime minister and the ministers are all appointed by the king the head of the army is appointed by appointed by the king and the and I think the head of intelligence is also appointed by the king so the monarch really runs the show enjoy it and what about economic power Jordan is a small country and it's you know surrounded by problems everywhere to the west we have the Palestine Israeli problem to the north we have the Syrian problem to the east we have a dark to the south we have Saudi Arabia and its problems with Yemen So Jordan has maintained its stability the monarchy has a king here has been very careful not to not to step on anyone and not to let anybody step on him so the country has kept its stability but at the same time you know because of its position between warring you know warring countries everywhere trade has been difficult expansion you know in trade agreements has been difficult progress has been difficult so Jordan that you know doesn't have a very bright future economically but I've heard in terms of divisions of labor if you will that you know political power goes mostly to the Jordanians for want of a better term and economic power lies mostly with the Palestinians who have been living in this country for many years. Since the establishment of the state of Israel. The Jewish terrorist gangs like Stern and Hogan and so on where we're very effective in creating the refugee problem of the Palestinians and the Palestinians because of the military power of these gangsters and you know these terrorists against the Jewish gangs that the time had to flee so hundreds of thousands of Palestinians went to Jordan some went up to Lebanon and Syria and some went to Egypt. Or Jordan which was you know typically an empty and empty land with a few cities and some big tribes some Bedouin tribes now had you know had hundreds of thousands of Palestinians come and stay as refugees these Palestinians had to you know build themselves into communities had to start trade and so on and then 20 years after that 1000 years after that 967 another war the occupation of the West Bank drove more Palestinians to work to Jordan so now Palestinians Jordanians of Palestinian origin I might say because most of them got to the Jordanian citizenship but Jordanians of Palestinian origin constitute something around 60 percent of the country King Abdullah the grandfather current king whose name is also Abdullah in 1050 Annex is the West Bank and he's assassinated by Palestinian nationalists the next year in 1951 what happened there. The Palestinians. We're not happy with the way the Arab leadership dealt with the Palestinian problem you know there were deals between some Arab leaders and the Jewish Agency before the establishment of Israel as the Arabs did not put and their power to try to you know to help the Palestinians get back their country and King Abdullah was seen by some Palestinians as somebody who had betrayed their cause so somebody assassinated him when he was praying in the in the arts or mosque and he was succeeded by his son Talal who very quickly you know left office and succeeded by his grandson dollars grandson King Hussein who at that time was a teenager and he is the one you know often called the plucky little king he died in 1999 he's kind of been the face of Jordan that a lot of people outside this region recognize yes when King Abdullah was assassinated his son took office the law was a nationalist during his brief 2 years asking they drew up the Jordanian constitution of 1952 it was a very nice constitution it gave powers to the parliament and the parliament could appoint governments and you know it was it was a very good constitution that you know clearly divided powers in the country in a way that will sustain it efficiently but then after 2 years he was seen incapable of rule. By home but he was seen by Apparently the doctor of the family by his wife by the people close to him that he was incapable of continuing his rule so his son Hussein became king but his son was still young so his uncle his mother's brother. Was sort of a trustee until Hussein reached you know the proper age for kingship. And King Hussein dies in 1909 he's succeeded by his son King Abdullah who rules today what are his politics like. King Abdullah believes in Neal liberal ideas he believes that the government's hands should take a rest and the free hand of the market should work he believes in privatization of the economy he worked on doing some of these things Jordan the World Bank Jordan you know has debt of the World Bank and the World Bank has a condition sometimes it's not that the king wants to maybe privatized or not the king that wants to sell the resources it is The World Bank's condition sometimes that force the country to do certain things to keep it on its good side when the king took control in 1909 he saw that the country was and that the World Bank advised that maybe you know you should sell your resources to create cash flow you should reduce government spending so our government spending was reduced and then there was a lot of deregulation so that you can attract investors to come and buy the government you know agencies or government companies that were being privatized I've seen flyers and posters around Jordan saying no to the gas deal what's that about. Jordan historically has been buying natural gas from Egypt and then when Egypt from 2011 started going through its turmoil of the Arab Spring and afterwards there were some of the pipes so Jordan would have erratic supply of natural gas now the alternatives were many you know we can we can get the gas from the world market we can get the gas from Qatar we can get the gas from Algeria we can get the gas from any other country but unfortunately Jordan signed the agreement with Israel which found as on the Mediterranean outside of the shores to me that agreement with Israel to so that Israel would supply Jordan with gas for 15 years and we see this as capitulation to a country that is occupying the land of Palestine we see this as an extension of the occupation of Palestine this is the kind of New York you patient where they maybe they don't come here with their forces and military but they come here to control the economy you have the president of an environment to organization here in Jordan wasn't there any move toward sustainable energy such as all the sunshine you have here something like $300.00 days a year of sun and all the wind power that exists you know Jordan has plenty of area to put the solar panels Jordan also has a grid that is not very efficient and just you know fixing the grid would would save something around 35 percent of the electricity. And we have different sources of natural gas we can get from other countries we have a lot of shale oil that we can extract if we wanted to we have one power but unfortunately Jordan has decided to buy the natural gas from Israel now we are working on you know in the country on some solar solar energy programs and projects but they haven't materialized fully yet and we hope that once they do we won't be in need of you know working with Israel. And what about for example alternative transportation to get some of the North Korea's traffic jams and then at least diminished what about recycling Are there any kind of state programs on those areas in general what is the environmental equal consciousness here in Jordan Unfortunately we are very slow on these projects the Jordanians are hardly coping with a very fast increase in population in 2003 I'll go back to 1990 the 1st American invasion of Iraq about 400-002-5000 extension 00 Jordanians that worked in Kuwait came back to Jordan created a big big change in the demographics 13 years after the American invasion of Iraq again. You know destroyed hundreds of thousands and you know some some estimates would take that up to a 1000000 Iraqis came to Jordan So Jordan has been having one influx after the other and now after 2011 you have so many Syrians in Jordan Jordan is hardly coping with this fast fast fast growth and population you have problems and water supply you have problems and traffic and you know not much is actually being done to deal with all of this because of monetary hardships you know Jordan is a country that's and that it's trying to do things here and there but it's not enough. Why did the king decide to deploy the Jordanian air force in Syria. You know Jordan like I said has been very very careful not to not to step on anyone and you know Jordan is the neighbor to the richest Arab country with this which is Saudi Arabia and in so many instances when Jordan was in you know dire monetary situation Saudi Arabia stepped in to help Jordan and you know with the problems in Syria Saudi Arabia was worried that if the problems get closer to Jordan if the you know you know radical groups like ISIS and so on would get to the borders of Jordan maybe they could start problems in Jordan and Jordan is at the doorsteps of Saudi Arabia so there was a lot of pressure on Jordan to join the countries that are fighting ISIS in Syria Jordan is also considered an American ally Jordan tries to go on the American lines to accept the American the you know the American strategies for this for this region and there was pressure also from the United States to join the you know join the alliance against ISIS in Syria so Jordanians Jordanian planes were sent to fight ISIS and in conversations I've had since I've been in Jordan for about a week a lot of people ask me who is Dish who is the Islamic state who are these people where do they come from how did they get their funding do you have any insight into their origins. I'm telling you if anybody does you they know who dies as or who ISIS is or where their funding is coming it comes from I think they're lying they have so many cars they have so many people they have so many weapons you just don't know how it started you know they came out of nowhere all of a sudden occupying the city of Mosul down at Arc declaring do you know this lamb a state of Syria and Iran and they become so powerful all of a sudden nobody understands what ISIS as and King Abdullah was in Washington meeting with Trump he made a number of a very supportive comments about the United States and Trump he said is bringing beginning to bring Palestinians and Israelis together is Trump doing that in my missing something here I think the king goes to the superpower of the world he's going to say something positive about the president and I don't think it goes any further than that. I mean what is your reaction to the appointment of David Friedman who is Trump's personal bankruptcy lawyer and a supporter of this the better El settlement in the occupied West Bank. There is nothing new here you know the United States has been an unconditional support of Israel like one Israeli journalist and writer once said if the Jewish lobby in the United States wants to cancel the 10 commandments from the Bible they will get so with an overwhelming majority in the u.s. Senate that doesn't make any difference to us anymore who is in office in the United States who is the ambassador in Israel who is the ambassador in Jordan or Saudi Arabia to us the United States is going to be on the side of Israel they are not honest brokers when it comes to the Middle East when it comes to the Palestinian conflict to the contrary they keep fighting the Palestinians not to get their rights to keep supporting Israel despite Israel's abuses of international law despite Israel's attacks against the Palestinians against the Lebanese despite Israeli checkpoints uprooting of millions of trees the robbing of Palestinian water and you know the continuous occupation the building of the wall none of these instances that we see the United States step up to its moral responsibility to stop the funding of these atrocious acts so what gives you hope. What gives me hope is that things are changing with social media things are changing in the West and you know those who are liberal are fighting for morals and fighting for you know universal principles like human rights and freedom of expression and so on and we see so many people in the West looking at the Palestinian problem as a as a as a contradiction you know contradiction with what they believe in and especially Jews they're still marginal but they're they they are coming out and they are saying you know we don't approve of what the state of Israel is doing in the name of the Jewish people we are not like that our religion doesn't teach us to treat others like that this is completely something that is unacceptable by us and they are you know they're dissociating themselves from the state of Israel and they're And there's ainus ideologies and what is the background of your activism How did you get engaged. You know living in this part of the world you see the effects of American policy every day you see the effects of the wars every day and when the 2nd Palestinian uprising the intifada broke out we were seeing that 40 miles from here. People were being you know treated like animals every day in a small area like the West Bank you had over 500 checkpoints Palestinians could not move from one village to the other without being interrogated without being questioned without being harassed women were having their children on the checkpoints because the Israelis would not allow them to go to the hospitals let me tell you the occupation it is by default a military occupation so violent it is so oppressive it is so unhuman right like and you know when you live so close to this used you need you need to do something about it you need to alleviate the problems of your you know of your Palestinian neighbors. You were just listening to Rami bout hoosh on Jordan Palestine Israel and the United States I talked with him in Amman Jordan Rami Baer who she is an activist and president of the Arab group for the protection of nature based in a man. This program is produced by alternative radio based in Boulder Colorado we are independent and part of the nonprofit media education organization rise up we are supported soley by individuals just like you we featured progressive voices rarely heard in the media such as Nancy McLean Noam Chomsky Max Blumenthal Michael Parenti Roxanne Dunbar Ortiz and Chris Hedges we have a number of programs on the Middle East to access our complete audio and book catalog and by the way my new book with Noam Chomsky has just come out and we have copies it's called Global discontents just go to our website alternative radio dot org Again our website where we are pod casting alternative radio dot au argy to place a credit card order for C.D.'s and be threes or written transcripts of today's program Rami but hoosh on Jordan Palestine Israel and the United States call us at $1800.00 triple for 1977 again that number is 180-444-1977 or you can order on our website alternative radio dot org Joe Ritchie is our general manager and editor I'm David Barsamian thank you for listening. This is k.t. You are Durango at 91.9 or 93.9 f.m. Bread is a proud supporter of alternative radio in k.t. You are bred because of holding specialty breads and pastries any worms spot for morning coffee or a healthy lunch is located at the intersection of County Road to 50 and Florida road bread can be reached by phone at 247-5100 bread not bombs right now we have a couple of minutes a pulse of the planet in Patrick and myself my name is Stephanie will be back to get the rez Billy breakdown bluegrass show started. From before the time of the Renaissance until the late 18th hundreds the 13th day after Christmas was known as plow Monday the parts of England where the field laborers could have some fun at the expense of their wealthier neighbors I'm Jim Metzner and this is the pulse of the planet supre Leeds and Somali a group which reenacts the plough Monday celebrations each year at Princeton University plow Monday was observed by farm workers by villagers and in a sense you could say it was observed by the upper class people whose houses were to be visited I don't know that they welcomed the visits but it was a tradition in the East Anglia region I think it was customary on plough Monday for some of the field hands to dress up in women's clothing these workers calling themselves Molly's would decorate a farmer's plough and drag it along from house to house see and dancing and demanding money and drink Now if the owner didn't come through revelers with plough up his yard in retribution they were doing property damage they were drinking heavily as the day went on they'd get into fights sometimes they'd meet rival groups of Mali dancers. So it was pretty disreputable historians think that plow Monday was tolerated for so many years because it offered a kind of social safety valve for agricultural communities we think the purpose of it was to give farm workers a chance to blow off steam you know just to do outrageous riotous things to collect money from the more well to do and just a thumb their noses and it was such a conventions of the time. And the. Pulse of the planet is presented by the National Science Foundation I'm Jim Metzner . Good evening folks this is k.t. You are Durango at 91.9 or 93.9 f.m. You are tuned in to the rez Billy breakdown bluegrass show started this program goes from 6 30 pm until 9 o'clock pm Mountain Standard Time we are located at Fort Lewis College in Durango Colorado My name is Stephanie and I am your host along with my husband Patrick. And we will be bringing you bluegrass music new old and everything in between today's date is Tuesday January 9th 2018 the time is now 6 32 pm If you have any request give us a call at 970-247-7262 you can also to go to w w w dot org to web stream this program and also to check out the set lists in you can also use a tuneup real smartphone if you have told you what number to call for requests. So let's get going with things oh and just a reminder at the top of the hour at 7 o'clock pm is the concert calendar and also following this radio's radio program from 9 pm to midnight is the cranky old guy rock show with your host cranky puts it going with some music right now so my Indigenous tune selection tonight comes from a compilation album of native contemporary need of American artists the name of the album is called Native American currents we're going to listen to poetry and song from Joy Harjo in poetic justice she does one. Lifetime Achievement prize last year called The Ruth Lilly poetry prize and along with recognizing her lifetime accomplishments she gets $100000.00 for all her work with poetry and all her activism and what have you with just using the word in so let's listen to some stuff from Joy Harjo in poetic pointed justice and will to segue into bluegrass music after that will be back at 7 o'clock p m. Below me. At the little tree. Was alone. There rather a stool. And a ration the one doing light never seems to love me any more. I could not. Get taller than kids in hardware blue. Little to. No no please 40 years to get a laugh track. On the scenes that long since walking home with trainees saying Sunday at. Least here is a no love song it brings our men. When they call him Grandpa good brings a smile and startle to Lynn. Anyone can tell. He plays in. All of these years just melt away. Knowing they are the young. Love them no guitars and kids are prevented. By these j. . And their lives you. 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