Transcripts For KCSM Democracy Now 20150527

Well talk about the u. S. And swedish legal cases against him and discuss how wikileaks has continued to publish leaked documents from secret drafts of the Transpacific Partnership to europes secret plans to use military force in libya to prevent migrants from leaving the country. It calls for military intervention in libya. To destroy the refugee boats before they leave port from libya coming to europe and also for other attacks on the people who provide the services of the boats. Amy and Julian Assange will respond to the congressional debate over n. S. A. Spying and the patriot act, sparked by the disclosures of Edward Snowden. Julian how can you debate them . Theyre secret. Similarly, what are the actual actions that are occurring not just in policy but what is actually happening. What are they actually doing . If you dont know, how can you possibly have a debate . Amy today wikileaks founder Julian Assange for the hour, all that and more coming up. Amy welcome to democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report, im amy goodman. A Suicide Attack by the selfproclaimed is tam i can state has reportedly killed dozens near the iraqi city of fallujah. The bombing hit an iraqi army convoy involved in the ongoing offensive to retake the capital of an barprove isil. At the white house, the brett secretary stood by comments from defense secretary ash carter that Israeli Forces will lack the will to fight. That certainly has been a problem that weve seen in the past. Thats what allowed isil to make such significant gains last summer, and so what the United States and our coalition has been focused on is making sure that we can enhance the capacity of the Iraqi Security forces in supporting the iraqi Central Government as they try to unite that country and build a multisectarian Security Force to face the threat that is posed by isil. Amy shiite militias have given the offensive to recapture ramadi a sectarian code name in honor of an ancient figure killed in a war that helped set off the shiitesunni divide. On tuesday, the pentagon called the code name unhelpful. Top officials with the worlds governing soccer body, fifa, have been detained in a sweeping corruption investigation that could see them tried in the United States. The suspects were arrested while gathering for fifas annual meeting at a luxury hotel in the swiss city of zurich. The Justice Department has requested their extradition on charges related to accepting bribes on world cup bids and Television Broadcast deals. The f. B. I. Says, undisclosed and illegal payments, kickbacks and bribes became a way of doing business at fifa. Cleveland has agreed to some of the nations toughest limits on the use of police force under a settlement with the federal government. Officers are now barred from firing warning shots and pistolwhipping suspects and can no longer use force against those who talk back or run away. The police force will also undergo increased training on racial bias and will be tracked by an independent monitor. U. S. Attorney Steven Dettelbach said the terms could be a model for other Police Forces nationwide. We have signed and are filing this 105page, comprehensive Consent Decree that, once approved by a federal judge, will not only serve as a road map for reform in cleveland but as a National Model for any Police Department that is ready to escort a great city to the forefront of the 21st century. And even though we are speaking , what we are announcing here today is way more than just talk. Amy the consent agreement was reached after the Justice Department sued cleveland over a pattern of unlawful abuses uncovered in a probe last year. It comes just days after an officer was acquitted in the fatal shootings of two unarmed africanamericans in their car, sparking protests that continued on tuesday. Mayor Frank Johnson called it a defining moment for cleveland. I want to say that this is really a defining moment for the city of cleveland and for the citizens in the city of cleveland. It will define who we are as a people and who we are as a city. Over the last several days, the general peaceful response to the officer brelo verdict has reinforced my belief that cleveland is a community where Peaceful Demonstrations and dialogue will and can provide for change and will make a lasting difference for the people of the city of cleveland. Amy a federal Appeals Court has refused to restore president obamas executive actions protecting millions of undocumented immigrants in deportation. A rightwing judge blocked obamas deportation reprieve earlier this year after a motion filed by texas and 25 other states. The federal government had asked for the injunction to be lifted while the original ruling is appealed, but a divided 21 panel of the fifth Circuit Court of appeals rejected that bid. Nebraska Governor Pete Ricketts has vetoed a landmark measure that calls for abolishing the states Death Penalty. Nebraska lawmakers passed the bill last week and appear to have enough votes to override ricketts veto. If the override prevails, nebraska would be the first conservative state to ban the Death Penalty in more than four decades. Recordsetting floods continue to inundate texas and oklahoma, leaving 17 people dead. Houston was brought to a near standstill tuesday as surging floodwaters stranded motorists across houston. The houston mayor urged residents to stay in their homes. We all have to remember that were the point of a really big funnel that kind of extends up into Central Texas and a lot of water that flows upstream flows through houston. Its still a dangerous situation along the bios. Theyre full of water. The water is moving very very rapidly, and a lot of folks want to come down and look. A lot of kids particularly want to come and toss something in the bio. See what they can see. Its exciting. Still a very dangerous place to be. So i would urge caution. If you can stay home, please stay home today. Amy the death toll from a scorching heat wave in india has topped 1,100. Temperatures have reached as high as 50 degrees celsius, or 122 degrees fahrenheit. An american journalist is on trial in iran nearly one year after he was detained. Jason rezaian the washington posts bureau chief in tehran is accused of espionage and passing information to hostile governments. He phase up to 20 years behind bars. In washington, state Department Spokesperson jeff rathke called for rezaians release. We continue to monitor this as closely as possible, and we continue to call for all of the absurd charges to be dropped and for Jason Rezaian to be released immediately. We always raise the cases of detained and missing u. S. Citizens with iranian officials on the sidelines of the p5 plus one talks and the other interactions that happened in that context and we will continue to do that until all of them are home. Amy israel has carried out bombings on the gaza strip after a rocket landed in the israeli city of ashdod. Palestinian militants say the rocket crossed into israel by mistake as they fired test rockets into the sea. Its at least the fourth time palestinians have launched rockets and israelis conducted air strikes since the ceasefire ending last summers 50day israeli assault. But Israeli Forces have also fired into gaza more than 400 times, including on farmers and fishermen. A new report, meanwhile, from dozens of aid agencies is calling for pressure on israel to lift the blockade and allow gazas reconstruction. The groups including oxfam and save the children endorse measures such as suspending arms transfers that could be used to violate international law. Amnesty International Says hamas used last summers israeli assault to kill 23 palestinians and torture dozens of others accused of collaborating with israel. In a new report, amnesty alleges hamas gave its Security Forces free rein to carry out horrific abuses. Hamas has denied responsibility for the killing of alleged collaborators and has blamed israel for sowing chaos with attacks on the gaza security apparatus. Independent senator Bernie Sanders has formally kicked off his campaign for the democratic president ial nomination. Addressing a rally in his home state of vermont, sanders vowed to tackle income inequality and the political power of the one percent. I am proud to announce my candidacy for president of the United States of america. Today, with your support and the support of millions of people throughout our country we begin a Political Revolution to transform our country economically politically socially, and environmentally. Today we stand here and say loudly and clearly enough is enough, this great nation and its government belong to all of the people and not to a handful of billionaires. Amy vermont independent senator Bernie Sanders is the only challenger to democratic frontrunner Hillary Clinton so far, but former Maryland Governor Martin Omalley could declare later this week. And those are some of the headlines. This is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. We turn now to a democracy now exclusive with wicks i leaks founder Julian Assange, who has spent nearly three years inside Ecuadors Embassy in london where he has political asylum. Assange faces investigations both in swede and not United States. Here in the u. S. A secret grand jury is investigating wikileaks for its role in publishing a trove of leaked documents in the iraq and afghanistan wars, as well as state Department Cables. In sweden, hes wanted for questioning on allegations of sexual misconduct, though no charges have been filed. Earlier this month Swedens Supreme Court rejected his appeal to lift his arrest warrant. Swedish prirs are reportedly preparing to travel to london to interview assange after refusing to do so for years. While holed up inside the Ecuadorian Embassy wikileaks has continued to publish documents from the leaked draft of the t. P. P. , the Transpacific Partnership to the recent disclosures of the British Nuclear submariner whistle blower William Mcneilly, to secret details of a European Union plan to use military force to curb the influx of migrants from libya. I spoke to Julian Assange about these issues and more when i sat down with him inside the embassy on monday. This is democracy now , democracynow. Org the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. Were broadcasting inside the Ecuadorian Embassy in london. Thats right. Here is where Julian Assange has been holed up, granted political asylum by ecuador, holed up here for almost three years. June 19 will mark the date that he came to this embassy in 2012. Welcome to democracy now , julian. It has been three years since you came here. How are you doing . Julian im not doing too badly, given the situation. And i think thats really because i have something significant to focus on other than just my personal circumstance. Its the same for all people who are in a situation of detainment. Its been almost five years now im detained in one form or another without charge here in the United Kingdom. Within the United Kingdom im an australian. Its quite difficult for my family but for me, wikileaks worked and the verse cases that we have, defensive and offensive, is enough to keep my mind out of the situation that im in. Thats very important. Amy which brings us to Edward Snowden, a man who you helped to secure his freedom, at least for now, though hes not in the United States as he would like to be. He has political asylum in russia. And what the revelations have led to well so many things all over the world, but in the United States, congressional action just in the last week, the challenges to the u. S. A. Patriot act. Can you talk about whats taken place . This is an absolutely critical week. June 1, the u. S. A. Patriot act sections of it sunset unless they are continued. The administration has not appealed applied for an automatic extension. And a number of senators, republican and democrat, have now bucked the corporate republicandemocratic establishment and said they dont want the overall surveillance of americans. Explain more specifically whats taken place. Julian the snowden revelations documented various forms of National Security agency spying and secret interpretations. Its been constructed by the Justice Department and fisa courts. Now, some of those hinged on section 215 of the u. S. Patriot act, a secret interpretation that has been found just this month to be unlawful in the u. S. Federal court of appeals. Now that has dove tailed with the electrical process in the United States, and so theres now increasing push to be increasing push for popularism. Rand paul and ron widen have tapped into that. The u. S. Patriot act has been on rolling sunset quotas since 2001. The sunset clause is june 1 and so ron widen and rand paul engage in a filibuster pushing the passage of the renewal of the patriot act off to a week where congress is scheduled to be away, all the way leading up to june 1. So unless theres an emergency recall of enough of the congress, the sunset clause will hit, and that means there will have to be a new patriot act reintroduced. We have to be resuscitated, as opposed to having a roll over, and thats more involved process. However, sources say that the n. S. S. Is not too concerned that it has secret interpretations of other authorities that give it much the same power that it would have had under the secret interpretation and other areas of the u. S. Patriot act. What Edward Snowden revealed about the secret interpretation of section 215 on the patriot act was the National Security agency was using it to bulk collect the calling records every day of essentially every american in the United States. The majority of the big companies. However, thats only a very small part of the National Security agencys mass interpretation system. On one hand, it can suck information out of the and on the other hand, even more data is collected as a result of information flowing across the border of the United States or across borders of the United Kingdom, within a sharing agreement of the National Security agency. But it is a type of at least political victory, showing that you can rand paul believes that you can garnish a type of political power by having a filibuster on this issue. I think thats quite an important thing leading up to the 2016 president ial election. Its safe now to have this as part of the political debate. Amy the administration has said, well, well put the information in the control of the telecoms, the telephone companies, but thats also something that rand paul has challenged. Why should the Telecommunications Companies why should private enterprise have this Information Holding it to be sought by the government . Julian thats right. The alternative proposal, which is something that was in the u. S. A. Freedom act, which is pretty misnamed. It is a sort of mild version of the u. S. A. Patriot act in some ways. Instead it relies on at t, other big telcos withholding information, ready for the National Security agency. You know, it doesnt make much of a difference if thats an automated system. 80 of the National Security agency is outsourced anyway in terms of the management, in this case, if it has automatic connections to at t and verizon, theres no difference in terms of its searching ability. Now, in terms of whether theres warrants that are used for searches it is perhaps an aid, because the companies could be made legally liable. Thats up to congress for not insisting on taxes for that information. I rather suspect that Congress Wont mandate that e companies cant hand over information unless its warranted. Now, its interesting to contrast that with a situation here in europe. So in europe there was legislation that telcos should hold that information for 18 months. Now, in germany, that has been found effective, the European Court level has been found to be unconstitutional. And in germany theres already information hard away. And now theres a fight with various european states such as sweden, insisting they can retain the information, even though the laws of europe say that theyre not permitted to retain that information. Amy before we get to germany and what youve revealed there, i want to stay with the u. S. For a minute, because president obama famously said that the debate over privacy and surveillance would have been had without Edward Snowden. Can you respond to that . Julian i think its obvious to everyone that that is false. How can you have a debate with secret interpretations of the law . How can you debate them . Theyre secret. Similarly, what are their actual actions that are occurring, not just in policy, but what is actually happening . What are these democracies actually doing . If you dont know, how can you possibly have the debate . Information is classified no debate is possible. Amy Julian Assange speaking inside the Ecuadorian Embassy in london. If he steps foot outside, he will be arrested by british authorities. Well return to our interview with him in a minute and talk about the Transpacific Partnership, as well as British Nuclear submarine whistle blower William Mcneilly. Stay with us. [music break] amy String Quartet number one here on democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. As we return to our exclusive interview with wikileaks founder Julian Assange, i spoke to him inside the Ecuadorian Embassy in london on monday. Julian assange, lets stay with the United States for a moment with the t. P. P. , the Transpacific Partnership which certainly doesnt only involve the United States, but theres a huge debate within the United States about it right now. I dare say, some of that debate is as a result of what wikileaks revealed. For some people, this treaty that will determine 40 of the global economy, the only thick that we have seen about it comes from wikileaks. Explain what the t. P. P. Is and the information that you got, that you put out about this topsecret agreement. Julian well, the t. P. P. Is an International Treaty that has 29 different chapters. We have released four of them. And we are trying to get the remainder. For the information that has been released through the chapters that we got hold of and through some congressmen who have seen the contents of some of the others today and aly are loud to write it down. Amy they can go into a room and look at it . Julian they can go into a room. Its not formally classified, but its been treated as if its classified in terms of the information is being managed. They go into a room. If they try and take notes, the notes have to be handed over to the government for safe keeping and, of Course Congress over that situations wont take notes. And so it is very well guarded from the press and the majority of people and even from congressmen. But 600 u. S. Companies are part of the process and i think theyve been given access to various parts of the t. P. P. Ok its a its the largest ever International Economic treaty that has ever been negotiated. Very considerably larger than nafta. It is mostly not about trade. Only five of the 29 chapters are about traditional trade. The others are about regulating the internet and what Internet Service providers have to collect information. They have to hand it over to companies under certain circumstances. Its about regulating labor, what Labor Conditions can be applied, regulating, whether you can favor local industry, regulating the hospital healthcare system, privatization of hospitals. So essentially every aspect of the modern economy, even banking services, are in the t. P. P. So that is erecting and embeding new you will at that modern neoliberal structure. In u. S. Law and in the laws of the other countries that are participating and is putting it in a treaty form. By putting it in a treaty form, that means the 14 countries involved, that means its very, very hard to overturn. Theres a democratic desire in the United States to go down a different path for example to introduce more public support public transport, then you cant change it because you have to get agreement from the other nations involved. Now, looking at that example, what if the government or a State Government decides it wants to build a hospital somewhere, and theres a private hospital that has been erected nearby well, the t. P. P. Gives the private hospital the right to sue the government over the expected examined loss in future prfts. This is expected future profits. This is not an actual loss that has been sustained but a desire to be compensated. This is a claim about the future and we know from similar instruments where governments can be trade free treaties, that that is used to construct the Chilling Effect on government or Health Regulation law. For example, togo, australia uruguay are all being sued by tobacco companies, Philip Morris the leading one to prevent them from introducing Health Warnings on the cigarette packet. Amy that we have in the United States on our own cigarette packages. Julian yes. And its not an even playing field. Lets say, ok, well, were going to make it easier for companies to sue the government , maybe, thats right, maybe the government is too powerful and companies should have a right to sue the government in various circumstances. But its only multinational that is get this right. U. S. Companies operating purely in the u. S. In relation to investment that is happen in the u. S. Will not have this right, whereas Large Companies that are multinationals, that have registrations overseas, can structure things such that theyre taking investments in the u. S. And that then gives them the right to sue the government over it. Now, its not so easy to get up these cases and win them. However, the Chilling Effect, the concern that there might be such a case is severe. Each one of these cases on average government spend more than 10 million for each case to defend it even successfully. So if you have you know, a city council or a state considering legislation, then theres a threat from one of these multinationals about expected future profits. They know that even if they have the law on their side, even if this t. P. P. Is on their side they can expect to suffer. Amy so lets talk about more recently what youve been able to get out. I want to work backwards. William mcneilly, explain who he is and what he has to say. Julian William Mcneilly is a submariner for the u. K. Trident fleet. Trident is the u. K. S Nuclear Weapons system. All itS Nuclear Weapons are in four submarines called trident. Theyre expensive program for more than 30 years which is a matter of significant debate now in the United Kingdom. Because it has been stationed in scotland. If you look at this from the scottish perspective, england put all its nukes and nuclear processing in scotland, making it a nuclear target, but also making it you know, potential nuclear spill, nuclear accident. And so with the rise of the Scottish Independence movement has come a formal statement by the Scottish Government the Scottish National party, that they want those weapons out, and that if they get independence, they will take them out. And William Mcneilly revealed to us, our analysis of accidents and of the dangerous activities that had happened in those in the trident and Nuclear Weapons System Program and some extracts from the Nuclear Weapons safety book. And he went he learned quite a lot from the Bradley Manning Josie Manning and Edward Snowden situation. You can see that quite clearly. And yeah, he learned quite a lot from that, and he was successful in bringing public debate. Although that said, the u. K. Media was very conspicuously silent. We suspect that there is a standing notice on all trident weapons issues that would not be issued. The d note system here is a defense advisory notice in major newspapers. They meet once a month in a closed session with the government which says what things it doesnt want to appear as far as military intelligence is concerned. Eventually that was broken off to be published, and some of the scottish newspapers also pecked up aggressively on the issue. Amy so, i mean, here you have this trident whistle blower who actually has just turned himself in. He in an ode way like you now in captivity, puts out this extended statement trying to explain his concern about the lax security around the trident Missile System how easy it is to get into the heart, into the belly of the beast, saying its harder to get into a bar than to lay a duffel bag that no one has ever checked the insides of next to a Nuclear Submarine or a nuclear missile. Julian a Nuclear Submarine, nuclear whistle. Amy explain some of the things that he has documented here that wikileaks put out. Julian well, hes documented fires on Nuclear Submarines so many false positives in the alarm systems. You know whether the fault or problem is that people just started turning them off because, you know, theyre irritating. A gradual collapse in the maintenance standards. In some ways these are all things that you would expect. For example, he gets another example that its harder to get through Airport Security than it to get on to a tridepth Nuclear Weapons submarine. Im he said rarely was his i. D. Checked, almost never. Julian yes. And another trident submariner came out and said that as well backed him up, after this revelation, on exactly that point. And that is actually not surprising. If you studied institutions and how they work, for example in a nightclub, you have people trying to sneak in all the time. You know clearly succeeding, and as a result, that disciplines the security staff if they start slacking off, then very quickly they pay the consequences. And similarly, with airport, passengers trying to get through all the time. Now, for Something Like the trident system you have 30 years, if anyone is getting in, its perhaps russian, chinese spies historically and they keep it all quiet. So theres no disciplining effect when it goes wrong. And so gradually this all starts to decline and people engage in a kind of pan toe mime for the higherups, but everyone understands that we dont bother to do this because its too much work. Amy were here with Julian Assange at the Ecuadorian Embassy, where hes lived taken refuge, has had political asylum for almost three years. And now were talking about William Mcneilly, the man known as the trident whistle blower, who has just turned himself in after releasing remarkable documents about his observations getting to the actual Nuclear Missiles with hardly i. D. Let alone checking for example, big duffel bags who knows what would be in them. So why did mcneilly turn himself in . Julian theres two potential actions against mcneilly. One is a Political Action for his revelations. Now, the u. K. Military navy is very concerned about politics. We have these missiles all based in scotland. The recent election shows that the scoitish National Party was completely dominant. They won 57 out of 60 seats in the election, and it says its going to remove trident. That is its policy. As soon as it becomes independent, it will do that. Scotland becomes an independent nation, which theyll pushing for, they will do that. So the politics at this moment are acute and the u. K. Doesnt want to pour more fuel onto the political fire. Its trying to do everything to get out from under discussion on this temple the other attack is this. Amy hes irish, right . Julian hes from northern ireland. The other attack on him is that he went awol during this whistle blowing period, clearly learning from Edward Snowdens playbook and stepped back released material, try to manage the situation with the media and so on, and then see how its going maybe step back into the fold. So every day he was away, he was technically committing another crime in military law of act way without leave. The u. K. Military have now said well see whether they stick to this but theyre not going to prosecute him under the official act. Theyre going to go for him under awol, and i imagine if theyre trying to suppress debate about this matter, they will prosecute him for being away without leave, prosecute him for 28 days, and theyll give him a dishonorable discharge as a way to dampen the conflict. If it comes to court about the material that hes been released theyll have to say yeah, its true, this is true, and it was unlawful for him to release this information, and he will say well, but theres a Public Interest in this, and theyll say, well youre right to argue about the interest and so on. So at the moment, it appears that the u. K. Government is heading down this direction of trying to not have it be a highprofile court case, which would probably be held in scotland and further inflame the Scottish Independence movement. Amy so, i just want to read from his observations, this contains references, he writes, to cb8890, the instructions for the safety and security of the trident 2 d5 weapons s. Im sure all the systems are scratching their heads and wondering how im writing this on think Personnel Lab top i think he means personal laptop in referencing a book, which is contained within a safe in the missile control center, m. C. C. The m. C. C. Is the compartment used to control the launch of the Nuclear Missiles. It can only be accessed by people on the access list, and no Personnel Electronics are allowed. I was on the access list, but how could i have gotten a copy of every single chapter on my phone . A hid cran . No. Smuggled the book out, then filmed it . No. What i did was walk into a room where no recording device are allowed, i sat down, took my Samsung Galaxy out of my pocket and recorded the entire book word for word. I held the phone still about a foot in front of my face, and anyone who looked at the screen or used common sense would have seen i was recording. There were other personnel in the room. In the video, you can see an s. W. S. Junior about three feet in front of me about three feet in front of me, talking to another s. W. S. Junior sitting right beside me. You probably think thats impossible, but ive got the evidence to prove t. The complete lack of skern for security worries me. The fact, is it would have been even easier for me to cause a Nuclear Catastrophe than to gather that information and gathering that information was actually quite simple due to the amount of ignorance, he writes. These are the words of William Mcneilly. He says he filmed this topsecret book with his samsung, which is white, out in front of other people in a room where he wasnt even supposed to have a personal device. Scombroip gives quote from it in the material to be released, yeah. Amy so this is a tremendous embarrassment to say the least to the british military. Julian it is. But its very interesting to see the way its playing out in the u. K. Press. It seems like an initial ban on reporting any of the information. Amy has a deal been made between journalists, or is there a kind of actual official ban . Julian u. K. Society is often an informal society. In london, things work behind the scenes, but there is a formal mechanism as well, which is the d notice advisory system where the military intelligence agencies meet with the editors in the u. K. , and they say what things are not to be reported, and then its a gentlemans agreement that these things are not reported. Its a sort of, the media selfregulates because theres a fear of regulation if they dont do what theyre told. Amy wikileaks founder Julian Assange speaking from the embassy, where hes taken refuge the past three years. Well be back in a minute with another explosive revelation. [music break] amy rise above that was an original sodge. This is democracy now democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. Lets return to our exclusive interview with Julian Assange. I went to london examine spoke to him inside the Ecuadorian Embassy there on memorial day. Can you talk about the documents you have released around libya and the immigrants that are trying to escape . Julian the secret plan was constructed by the defense ministers of europe, the defense ministers from the various countries. The plan was led by the u. K. And italy. And that plan, offered on the 13th of may, is what we have released. Now, it calls for military intervention in libya to destroy refugee boats before they leave port from libya coming to europe and also for other attacks on the people who provide the services of conducting the boats called, of course in that plan, people smugglers necessary to stop the network. Amy you said destroy the boats. What do you mean . Julian thats right. Bere the refugees get into the boats, destroy the boats. And so of course, this involves potential infringements of libyan destroying boats in port. Im what do you mean destroying, blowing them up . Julian blowing them up, sabotaging them, destroying them through military means is what is specified in the document. Amy how would they know if there are people in them . Julian well, they may not. They may conduct surveillance operations to detect people. They may be unconcerned about people. The way that theyre talking about people smugglers in the document is such that you have the impression that the people smugglers themselves would be a military target. The infrastructure, specifically boats, are brought in frain structure also appears to be a military target. So for example the systems that repair boats or who are involved in collecting together the refugees, these seem like they would also be military targets. Sexoip whose documents are these . Amy and whose documents are these . Julian this is classified from the e. U. Military committee and the e. U. Military committee is the defense ministers of the European Union. The document was led by the United Kingdom and italy, and it will be italy who is leading the on the ground it will be italy who is mill tailor coordinating on the ground efforts. Amy and in the documents, the concerns about what this will look like, the socalled optics of the situation. Julian yes, theres a layout for immediate operations, at the same time, very significant concern about the optics, about where theres media scrutiny of the e. U. For killing people or false reports of killing people. They say, you know, where the e. Cufment has actually killed people in this operation, they are intending to at least risk killing people in blowing up these boats. I guess from a if we now pull back a bit, where is this coming from . Well its no surprise that the u. K. Was involved in the draft since the new conservative government here having a majority, weve seen a very strong push along a conservative agenda against migrants, against pulling out of some parts of the e. U. , against retardation of the European Court of human rights. From the italian perspective they have to deal with the migrants they come across. Now, this will be the first time that the e. U. Has a military force, the e. U. Is engaged in hostilities, so its quite its quite significant from the perspective of what the e. U. Is going to look like as a military force. And if you think of libya, theres a question of what do these e. U. Nations want with libya. Well, remember kwlabe was largely libya was largely hillary was pushing for. From the memory side, there wasnt unity in pursuing the prosecution of libya because the pentagon was worried about the postgaddafi environment, for exactly the same reasons exactly same lessons that were learned in iraq. Now, there was considerable european push for war in libya as well from italy, from france and from the United Kingdom to get at libyan oil. Deals were done in terms of splits with the libyan rebels, the splits that italy would have, the splits that france would have. So it may also be looking at an excuse to get on to the shoreline of libya. They will establish a breach of security, and they will be engaging in destruction of these boats and people smuggling operations on libyan soil. Amy and the documents address the western back groups within libya and what they feel about this . Julian it has come out publicly, some versions of this plan have been spoken about in the media, the man hasnt come out, but versions of it have been spoken about, and the groups that the west says is the government of libya if you like, both factions around benghazi, the Libyan Foreign minister says that this should not be tolerated. Of course, libyans could not accept the prevention of libyan pursued by jihadists. Its really a very new situation. Its new in terms of the e. U. Acting as a force in this manner acting as a force against refugees, against refugee boats acting as a force, in effect, to assist isis. These are people that have been driven out of libya by jihadists, of various factions, including isis. So i find it quite you know, quite a dangerous precedent. Now, having once established themselves on the northern shore of libya, theres a question about then what happens. Presumably e. U. Troops or e. U. Agents or e. U. War ships on the shore of libya are going to receive some kind of resistance occasionally and they will meet that resistance. And that could then well snowball into an invasion, and that may, im going to speculate that that may be part of the vision. Amy julian, the swedish Supreme Court just ruled against you in a 41 decision. Can you explain what this means for your case . Julian well, the case is the u. S. Case, which started in the beginning of 2010. The grand jury information place by the middle of 2010. Wikileaks war room was established by the pentagon, comprised predominantly of Defense Intelligence agency and f. B. I. Over 120 people working 24 7. More than a dozen different Government Departments involved. Amy how do you know this . Julian its publicly stated by those organizations. And subsequently, the case has narrowed down in its focus and is now being run by the department of justice, National Security division, the department of justice criminal division. The latest information is in federal court. This year, march 4 the u. S. Government again admitted that they are pending prosecution and they are proceeding, and it is a National Security criminal investigation multisubject, longterm prosecution. And as a result, the press is not entitled to any information at all. Theres around 500 freedom of information requests from different media organizations, trying to look at whether the case is being conducted in a legal manner spying on our supporters spying on funding and so on, all of that is restricted under the basis and the matter is pending prosecution. Now, the swedish Supreme Court in its split decision, said that they will not drop the arrest warrant. But interestingly one judge did go our way and the registrar itself, documents have just now come out that the court investigated the matter and said that this should go away. So we have the court itself saying that due to injustices that have occurred in the matter to date, that it should be dropped, and one judge going our way said ultimately the decision was made. It looks like a political decision, but i think that the cost to sweden and its relationship with the United States would be too much, and as a result, theyre not going to go there yet. But its still under consideration by the u. N. Working group on detention, which is a panel of five, which is about to make a decision and then we have other opportunities, the European Court of human rights. The u. S. Case against wikileaks is widely believed to be the largest ever investigation into a publisher. It is territorial. It set a new precedent about the ability of the u. S. Government to reach out to any media publisher in europe or the rest of the world and try to achieve a prosecution. They say the offenses are conspiracy, conspiracy to commit espionage computer hacking, conversion stealing government documents. Amy i was wondering if you could respond to the lawyers for the complainant, klaus borstrom, who said hes very satisfied by the swedish Supreme Courts decision, but surprised that one of the judges dissented. He said if assange was suspected of a theft or another minor crime, proportionality would be different, but he is suspected of rape, a very serious crime. Your response . Julian well, thats simply not true. In fact, both of the women involved explicitly say that they had not alleged rape. In fact, even in the court documents, they say they had no intention of making a complaint and that this is something that the swedish state brought. But you mentioned this is detail. But you mentioned this here, and i think thats interesting. This is details which no one will know about, but this clears borgstrom, was a very senior politician in sweden, and the investigation the investigation was dropped by the most senior prosecutor. He was the politician who intervened in the case, took it to another prosecutor, the current one, and resurrected the matter, which is the swedish Justice System that you can shop around to different prosecutors. Amy so one prosecutor can drop it and another can then pick it up . Julian very well regarded, he dropped it and said there was no rape that had been committed, there was not even any evidence, and then he took this to gottenberg. Squem, hes become the most disgraced flaur sweden. He was kicked out of his political party. Hes involved as a central person in the most scandalous judicial case in europe, the case was promised quick where an innocent machine was convicted across six separate trials for eight murders and imprisonned for more than 20 years. All of those conditions have now been quashed. But it was borgstrom who was a central figure in fixing the framing of thomas quick. Amy how do you keep up your health . I mean, you have not stepped foot outside in three years. Julian i think, like all other detained people, you just have to be diligent about your exercise. Theres a unique situation here. In some ways its easier. Its easier to get visitors, although they do have to pass the political surveillance operation the Police Surveillance operation. On the other hand, yes, absence of sunlight is a problem. Theres a reason why ive seen, since world war ii, the u. N. Minimum requirement for prisoners is at least one hour a day, even solitary confinement prisoners are meant to get one hour a day, even if its an outside exercise yard even if its by themselves, to have the sun. Amy and you havent had that . Julian no. Amy what gives you hope . Julian well if you look at, despite the situation, weve kept together as an organization, have a really strong team thats been through some pretty tough times, we have defeated this blockade. We continue on our publications and sources still have confidence that we can get impact for their material. A very wide range of people in the United States have come forward to work for us in a variety of different ways most visibly michael ratner. We have more than we have used more than 150 lawyers and we had to add it up the other day for another case, so thats a lot of work in terms of legal fight. But theres something to be said for small, International Investigative publisher is able to keep going under in a pressure and not only keep pressure, but to expand. Not many publishers have been expanding in the past five years. Amy the founder, wikileaks founder Julian Assange, speaking in london, where hes taken refuge for the past three years. When we went inside the embassy on memorial day, British Police asked the Ecuadorian Embassy to hand over our identification. We refused. Just hours before we went to air today, wikileaks released more than a half a million u. S. State Department Cables from 1978. Tune in tomorrow thursday, for part two of our interview with the wikileaks founder. Well speak with Julian Assange about the cables, as well as the leaked sony documents, the new i. C. Watch database, which couples personal details from linkedin posted by the intelligence community, and the inside story about why the United States forced president morales to land during the 2013 hunt for Edward Snowden. Buon giorno today, four great recipes. Each one could be a main course of its own or the makings of a great party. Tutti a tavola a mangiare the italian art of good eating. Monini extra virgin olive oil