welcome to the show. i'm susan. joanne hayes white is head of the san francisco fire department since 2004. hardly a nine to five job, bringing fire chief brings demands of long hours, daily challenges and budget hurdles. but joanne says i'm humbled. it's a dream come true. joanne hayes white. welcome back, it's been awhile. >> great to see you. >> at seven years in, people aren't looking at you like they look at the president well he has grey hair and wearing down. you look good. >> so far so good. 21 years on the job and 7 years as chief. when i started the first part these are dog years. one year equals seven but i got noon a groove. >> you said it's a dream come true. sevens year. is it still? >> i wake up every morning still loving what i do. absolutely loving what i do. is it a dream job. it's a wonderful opportunity. huge responsibility. i'm proud that over the course of the last seven years we have done a lot of good work in the city. we have great residents. everyone wants to step up, we saw that in 1989 after the earthquake. we realized we have a citizen core of people that are willing to help out. we have done training programs. we have a prepared community. we can always be prepared more. >> with all of that, those are good things and it's nice to feel that you got some good accomplishments under your belt. what do you still love about the work? i mean, let's face it, fire is dangerous, life-threatening, you to move fast and ready to go. you have to give commands to people. there is a lot of challenges there, i would think. >> many challenges particularly in being a fire chief. i do miss the work in the stations going out and not always but in many cases making a difference in terms of coming on scene in an emergency. a lot of chaos. a lot of upset people and emotions running high. with our training and professionalism and if it's running into a burning building or assisting at the side of a sick mother, father or grandfather, being able to make a difference and a positive outcome. that's still very important to me and still what makes me love the job. once in awhile unfortunately people lose lives in fires. you can't save everybody. does it feel when you go home -- does it feel like a failure? >> it does. it definitely does. you to be a certain type of mind you can't let that get to you too often. if you do, the next time you go on the job, you are expected to be able to perform. so that's why i think the fiers department is like a second family. it's important to have the support of your second family and then when you go home to be able to keep that balance and for me a fire chief, it's a very important job. my ultimate job is being a mother of three boys. and balancing that is not always easy, but i get a lot of help from around the office. fire department is very much a team atmosphere. in the fire station as well as down in my office. i surround myself with a team of people we work well together. >> you went into this in 1990. you had a business degree from college. >> i did. >> what set you -- i think i will be a firefighter. >> you sound like my mom and dad. >> taste little bit of a u-turn in the curve. >> it is. and growing up i was intrigued by the red fire engines and trucks speeding by the house. grew up in san francisco. but nevercked -- considered a career option. i went to the college, university of santa clara. my parents made huge sacrifices. put me through college. i never had to workday until i graduated. you can imagine when i said to them in 1988 i'm hearing the fire department is hiring women. i want to give tashot. they were never not supportive but skeptical. >> you are going to what? >> it's dangerous, no women. and we just invested a huge amount in business degree you don't need a degree to take this job. what are you thinking? i said trust me. i want to give tashot and i think it will work out well. it was a better fit than i dreamed of let alone my parents. >> let's talk about this as a career. march is international history month for women. and everybody is focused on what women are doing and the accomplishments and a lot of us are impatient and wish there had were more strides in various places. as a person going into fire -- first of all, would you tell young girls you speak to in school situations or whatever to go into it now. is it stale good profession for women. >> it is. it's one of my favorite things to go out and speak to young women and men. when i first got the job someone said what a great role model you for little girls and i said, probably because i'm the mother of three boys, equally so for young boys for my boys to be being their mother in a nontraditional leadership role. that's important for young girls and young boys. i think in san francisco our best advertisement is the people in the san francisco fire department growing up i never saw a woman on a fire engine or fire truck. now it's common. and you have to be a certain type of person whether man or woman it's a physically demanding job. >> i was going to say. who is the ideal candidate. you have to be strong, in shape. >> physically strong. you are working -- it's para- military, almost like military condition because you are working together. preparing and sthairing meals -- sharing meals. training a lot. and basically when the bell goes off you go to work and rely on the training and the teammates to get you through the incident. >> what about age limits? >> there is no upper age limit. it is a physically demanding job. i came in at 25. but the minimum requirement is that you be 19 years of ages and we have people a lot of times coming from other physically demanding positions like police officers and military move over to the fire department. there was someone in my class 20 years ago who was 44 years old. >> i bet when you go to your own class reunions -- where did you go to high school? >> mercy high school in san francisco. >> nuns. >> mercy nuns. you know what? the thing is people say how does it feel to wear a uniform, i wore a uniform for the first 12 years of my education. >> i went to catholic school. i bet you are the only one at reunion and says what are you doing? i'm fire chief in san francisco. not here but know what i'm saying? >> pretty unique. that's right. it's unique. >> nice of you to show up. thinking, good. when you first took over, you were in the department. and so you had to go from being a peer to being a boss of people maybe you were buddies with, colleagues. >> younger than. >> younger than. and probably i'm guessing mostly men. >> correct. >> how much resentment did you have to overcome? >> i think the initial resentment came when i was on the job because it was such a new witness to have women in the fire -- nuance i'm and i'm someone who doesn't roll over on certain things. i was very sympathetic to the fact that change was huge for these men who worked together and now women coming into the environment. knowing it wasn't going to be a better -- a bed of roses. i came in with a practical realistic view. i think early on by the way i displayed my interest in being their equal, asking all the questions i could, being as diligent i could i gained a reputation of someone who was confident and capable and some of these men knew i was up to par and could work with them equally. but there were some long days when you work in the firehouse 24 hour shift initially the 24 hour shifts were tough and when i had my family, when i had my son, first shift back after five months when i saw the next day i thought, you know, was he going to caught tooth or will he be walking, he was an infant. i had all my three children on the job. not light literally. >> have i three boys. been in the department 21 years and my boys are 17, 14 and 11. so when i was working 24 hour shifts, a bit of a challenge raising young children. a lot of family support. we will continue our conversation after we take a break and find out more about this as a career. and also what about the economy? has that impacted the fire department? are we prepared? do we have what we need if disaster strikes when we return. my second diagnosis-- i was told to go home, retire, and enjoy the time i had left. to say it was a shock is just a complete understatement. i mean, i don't think there are words. she had put up a really good fight, but it was her time. you... don't have a choice of getting breast cancer. i had no choice. i wanted to do something bigger than myself. that 3-day gave me that opportunity. and i can actually do something to help. i think it's a very bold thing to do. 60 miles in 3 days-- i can do that. i'm sure if it was 100 miles, we'd still walk it. it was a big statement for me of... (voice breaks) i'm alive. we can do this. we can do this. we can rid the world of this terrible disease... so that no mother... granddaughter... sister... daughter... mother... go through what my wife had to go through. this is more than just three days. this is a lifetime. (man) register today for the... and receive $25 off your registration fee. because everyone deserves a lifetime. san francisco fire chief joanne hayes white is back with us. you are -- you know, i love this line. largest city fire department in the world with a female chief. does that -- that must be a lot of pressure to know that and see that in print. >> yeah, i always since i had been in the department operating a little fish in a fish bowl. everyone is looking. all eyes are on me. now it's seven years, i mean -- i think it's a credit to the team i have built and my enthusiasm for the job. put it this way. the previous selfs year i was chief, there were three other chiefs. it's a good thing and for the organization and for the city it's been good because we were able to set the course and make some accomplishments along the way as opposed to the starts and starts of the previous administrations. with that consistency we were able to make a lot of progress. >> what about your family? you talked about your kids, but in terms of your own nuclear unit at home and also your parentses who said, what do you mean? we paid for a business degree and now going into firefighting. >> they have always been supportive but the great thing is it's a big city, small town. we live next door to my mom and dad. i lost my father last year and one of my biggest mentors that i would look to for advice and everything. they were very supportive. >> get promoted to this level. >> i said, this business degree paid off they felt good about it when i got the chief spot. >> what's the worst part of the job? >> toughest part i would say is and it comes not just with the fire service but in any organization when you lead an organization is not being able to please everyone. that's difficult. the politics were something that i was not familiar with. i am now. making sure that you bring up what's important to the legislative and the executive branches of government. not that i'm running the fire department but work collaboratively. budget is very difficult. years ago fire and police historically would get a rubber stamp to the budget and not necessarily was a good thing. now we have to fight and compete for every dollar. that's challenging. >> do we have what we need if god forbid there was an earthquake tomorrow? >> on a daily basis we were adequately resourced. we have 350 firefighters working 24 hours a day and that means within three to five minutes we can get to the scene of any emergency that goes out the window for large scale emergency. we certainly particularly in these difficult economic times we can't staff up like every day will be an earthquake. we have mechanisms in place where by we can recall people in if needed floornlg scale emergency. one of the things that we were proud of is we have a community that's active and they take advantage of free training programs. i'm proud of a program that's the neighborhood emergency response team program. people can sign up. sex three hour training system how to keep yourself, your family, workplace safe and how to be prepared because we think the more people that are prepared the better off our economy and our city will be in the recovery phases because it's not a matter of if there is a earthquake, it's a matter of when. >> i heard that before. staying with the economy just for a second to touch on there are so much controversy and certainly that includes people in the fire department and early retirement and paying so much money and on and on. where do you stand? >> it is definitely a challenge. the firefighters that i work with i'm prowt of every member. they work very hard, however i do think the time is now to realize that there needs to be some compromises made in terms of not necessarily taking away all the benefits that labor has garnered for our work force, but the fact that people are out of jobs, people are out of health insurance and so i know that there are members in the fire department and particularly in the union that are sitting at the table trying to do some pension reforms. >> and in some cases aren't these people not only colleagues of yours but friends. it must be hard to fire a friend or promote somebody else over a friend. >> yes, always a challenge. i came up through the ranks and i promoted up through the ranks. i worked with three-quarters to probably at least three- quarters of the department. 1800 members in the department. i know about 1500 of them by their first name because i bounced around to various stations. >> and you are native san franciscoan. >> i am. >> those are tough decisions sometimes when you have to do hr whether it's promoting people or disciplining people. that can be difficult. >> you are obviously good on your feet and the common wealth club has seen that and asked you to be one of the foacts who are -- folks that are leading discussions. they are having an event on the 15th and distinguished citizen award. they are calling it a room with views and discussions led at the tables rather than one big forum. people like willie brown and davis and keller and yourself. high profile people. >> great company. >> here is the question, at your table of however many there are, maybe eightish. >> eight or ten. >> how do you decide what you going to do? >> i think it's a great format. three people that are honored that night. ted tawb, mary cranston and janet lampkin. great citizens. it's about them. but i think it's kind of a bold format instead of a key note speaker. they asked and delighted to be asked to lead a discussion. so i always start off my topic, usually for a younger group but i said do you have burning questions for the fire chief. i will let them roll. and in the business of reacting to things and responsing to things. i'm not going to have a lot on my agenda. the agenda will be theirs and ask whatever questions they like. >> how long do you want to do this job? >> i still have the same amount of energy. i'm 47, just turned 47. i like to do it as long as the new mayor or the next mayor will have me. mayor newsome gave me a huge opportunity. i have a greet relationship with mayor edly. we will see what happens in the november election. i serve at the pleasure of the mayor. >> and should things change, what advice would you give a successor and will you be there to do that? >> i like to be there when the time comes when a new fire chief takes over because there is a lot of institutional knowledge i would like to pass along whether he or she takes that or not, i think they will because we saturday good course and we are down the road quite a bit from where we were seven years ago. you are certainly a wonderful spokesperson for the fire department besides you good at your job. you need a barbie doll that is dressed in a fire chief's outfit. i think that would be a great thing for a girl. >> nice role model. >> we want to thank you for being here. wish you well and continued success and come back any time. if you like to meet chief white you can attend the common wealth club a room with views. gala takes place tuesday march 15 at the palace hotel in san francisco. and for more information on that event, you visit www.commonwealthclub.org. we will make your dreams come true next. welcome back. bad things will always happen. it's how we respond that makes the difference. good advice though hardly new. when life turns tough, death of someone close, loss of a home or job. rejection by one you love, it seems your pain will never leave, your tears will never stop. bay area author has been through all of these and believes there are opportunities even joy in bad batches that won't quit. she explains all in her newest book, glad no matter what. >> welcome. >> thank you so much. >> let's talk about how you got this one lane because there is cher and madonna and now sark. >> susan aerial rainbow kennedy. >> i figured it was shorker? >> well, the name was given to me by the author henry miller. >> really? >> i writben it in my book. it's a fabulous story. >> i will have to reread that part. glad no matter what. i hate to sound like i'm a buzz kill here but the truth is it's a tough time. there are people watching this show right now and i won't fool myself for a minute who lost their jobs. who perhaps are going to lose their home into foreclosure. who have to move the family. go through that. who lost a loved one. who perhaps are in love with somebody that's not in love with them. >> sure. >> how can you be glad through that? >> first of all let's be sure to say what i'm not saying. i'm not saying be glad when you are not. how annoying. you know, mindlessly positive people annoy me. that's not what i'm talking about. i grew up with insist in my family -- incest in my family. i was in poverty, attempted suicide. i transformed and changed many things. i written this is my 16th book. all my books are about transformation. i know that people are transformational change agents. and i now have developed practices and processes so that people can respond differently and better so yes, we need to feel the challenging feelings but we don't need to stay there so long. people are staying there like this long. i'm showing them how to get to about here. >> so folks sitting there now and just had a good cry and not the first time and -- feels like the tears won't stop. >> that's what we fear. but what we don't understand and what people don't understand and this is what i'm here to say, when we can turn toward a challenging feeling for five seconds and say sadness, i feel you. if we can acknowledge and turn towards our feeling, it will feel tended to and it will stop calling for our attention. >> a psychologist was here and said basically cry your heart out first. what if it seems like you aren't moving beyond that point? what if you are stuck there? >> people do ged stuck. >> how do you get unstuck. >> there is a difference. something about dwelling in negative feelings or challenging feelings and such a thing of feeling it and moving on. >> it's moving on always happens. >> if you are skillfully applying practices and processes. whether mine or someone else's. but for instance in my book i put a feeling menu in the beginning of the book. most people don't know how they feel. identifying how you feel. so feeling your feelings down to your toes and that's part of crying your head off. then using practices and processes to keep moving. and that's what people aren't doing. they get stuck and keep repeating the same stories. the house is in foreclosure. i lost my job. there is a time to repeat the stories of what has happened to us. certainly. it's important to say i am losing my job. my house is foreclosed. but that time ends. that time ends and transformation comes. and we have the opportunity to say, my house foreclosed but guess what i'm doing now. and it's something good. >> would you give somebody out there watching who is in tears or finished with a lot of kleenex there crying their eyes out something to do today? >> well, yeah. >> a practical thing. >> absolutely. first thing is give yourself a big fabulous hug. >> that sounds a little woo- woo. >> is it, but it works and also my friend christian northrop who is a physician, all your endorphines will raise. you will feel like ten good friends have hugged you and then you can have the opportunity to live what i say live like a full cup of self- love, sharing the overflow with the world. so then no matter what happens to you are unshakeable in your self-love center. >> you said a magic word now. friends, how crucial is it to have friends around you who are you're sympathetic or at least will lend an ear so you don't end up where you are k50eu7bd of like rat in a maze where you are running through the same thing -- i told you the story and you but you aren't getting anywhere. >> exactly. even more important to have friends who are reading a book or doing transformational practices and processes along with you. they are tending to their feelings too. if they see you -- they can hear you repeating a story that is in a dwelling way. they can say, it feels like you are a little stuck there. want to come over for tea. let's go for a walk. let's write the new story. >> you take them -- you go for the tea, take the walk. and what happens on that walk? they may give you advice that may not be the right advice. might be somebody that's sympathetic but not wise about your particular situation? >> this is the opportunity to empower other people to mentor us. this is where you say we are all mentors. you don't need to go to a special school or class. we have wisdom and things to share. it's free. you say to a friend, i'm not looking for solutions or i'm not looking for sympathy. now i'm looking for solutions. do you feel like offering solutions and your friend will say, i don't know i can only do the sympathy. you thank her and have the tea and find the friend with solutions. >> what if you don't have one or more to the point do you worry that someone who is reading this book is really in some kind of a severe even clinical depression and needs professional help and thinks i will find my friends with the solutions or i will read the book and read it again, i will do this on my own and not get help they need. >> sure, i was certainly one of those people and i had to get professional help and for quite a few years. but i stumbled and floundered and made all the mistakes and tried to do it all myself and guess what, we find out if it works because we don't feel good if it's not working. we can be glad more often. i call -- it's practical gladness. we are meant to live with all of our feelings in the middle and what i call the marvelous messy middle. >> tell people quickfully you take a look at this, i don't have the time to get into why actually, but this is sort of written looks like a crayon sort of format if you will. i'm not sure why you did that, but it's -- >> all my books are hand written. i written from my heart to your heart. >> okay. for more information from susan kennedy, sark, visit her at planet sark.com. could be a starting point for you. leave you now with a sound who is performing with a star studded cast to raise fund for st. jude research hospital thursday march 17 at the razz room here in san francisco. for tickets and information, jiset razzroom.com. thank you for watching.