[captioning made possible by fox news channel] captioned by the national captioning institute ---www.ncicap.org---^ bret: next on "special report "out administration gets creative with more than just the numbers in its report on jobs stimulated by the stimulus and we'll look at the complicated relationship between the u.s. and its largest creditor, china. is the justice department really up to trying the 9/11 suspects in the u.s.? and what obstacles will prosecutors face? the senate's top democrat prepares to unveil healthcare legislation as members of his own party ask him to slow down. all that, plus the fox all-stars, right here, right here, right now. welcome to washington. i'm bret baier. first it was fuzzy math. now, congressional districts that don't exist. those are the latest problems brought to life with the administration's reporting of how many jobs the president's stimulus has created or saved. the numbers that we do know, the october jobless rate, was 10.2%, the highest since 1983, and roughly 2.9 million jobs have been lost since march. shortly after the stimulus was signed. james rosen has the backlash to the jobs report in tonight's "on the job hunt" segment. >> with president obama overseas, his white house has come under attack here at home, after publishing data from recipients of stimulus package money who turn out to have exaggerated, inflated or just plain lied about the number of jobs they have create or saved with that money. >> when you put up information that turns out to be inaccurate, you shouldn't be surprised if the public says hey, do they know what they're doing. >> david obey called the faults posted on recovery.gov and said the obama administration owes the country honest numbers. a republican on the same committee went even further. >> i think they ought to fire people responsible for reporting on the impact of the stimulus program, and they ought to have a peer review third-party independent accounting firm do all the reporting for them. >> the associated press and newspapers in 8 states, massachusetts, wisconsin, colorado, georgia, texas, pennsylvania, illinois and michigan, have all identified multiple cases where recipients of stimulus money made false claims to have created or saved jobs. they included simple pay raises, projects announced but not started and reclassification of existing funding as stimulus funding. aware of such problems, the obama administration scaled back its initial claimless of 700,000 jobs by a full 60,000. >> it's difficult to point to a specific number that says here are jobs created or saved, indirect or direct. i think there is value in tying the numbers to accurate views of spending, which is also something that is absent from the current reporting process. >> and in virtually every state or territory from arizona to neveda, oklahoma to the u.s. virgin islands, recovery.gov shows jobs created or saved in congressional districts that don't exist n iowa, where there are own live five congressional districts, eight non-exist ent districts, including the 00 and 7th districts supposedly created 79 johns n connecticut, the mythical 42nd reported creating 45 jobs after receiving zero stimulus dollars. >> somebody who doesn't know which congressional district they're in doesn't have enough of a clue to receive taxpayers' money in the first place. >> in a blog posted on the website this morning, presidential aide edward deceive seive said it was impress unprecedented because of the scope and transparency and says the white house is using a fine toothed comb to address errors an argued the actual number of jobs is probably double the 640,000 that the administration claims. bret: they're saying watergate, follow the money? >> yes. bret: we will. inspector general for the $700 billion financial bailout said proj officials may have overpaid banks to speed the process along. reports say timothy geithner mismanaged negotiations in his role at the time as the head of the federal reserve bank of new york. geithner reacted to the or the by saying it wasn't his fault. >> we came into this crisis without the basic set of tools we needed to help contain the damage caused by hugely costly mistakes in parts of our financial system. >> president obama's trip to china got down to the bottom line today, money, as in how much changed hands in trade and how much america owes to its top ked tore. major garrett reports from beijing on the delicate give and take relationship between the economic superpowers. >> in china's great hall of the people, an artful economic dance between china's number one trading partner and america's number one debt holder. president tao whose central banks own at least $800 billion in u.s. treasuries spoke refusively about economic cooperation and and scolded president obama about tariffs on tires and steel. there is an investigation on u.s. auto parts, a bargaining chip, a potential lifeline to automakers, might be in jeopardy. >> i told president obama there are vitiations our country needs to impose and reject. protectionism needs a stronger stance. >> mr. obama gave no ground on protectionism and accused china of keeping their currency low and exports cheap and one reason china has pulled oust of out of the global economic recession more andly than the u.s. >> i was please to note the chinese commitment made in past statements to move towards a more market oriented exchange rate over time. >> in the face of iran hiding a separate enrichment facility and foot dragging on reprocess nuclear fuel abroad, the chinese would only say this about possible future sanctions -- >> to appropriately resolve the iranian nuclear issue through negotiations, it's very important. >> later white house officials said mr. obama raised the issue of sanctions but found president tao reluctant as they import 15% of their oil from iran. >> the chinese are less than thus stas tick, historically, about sanctions. i would not say that we got an answer from the chinese, nor did we expect one on the subject. >> in one of his two tourist scwawntses, the president visited the forbidden city where chinese royalty lived. >> it is a testament to chinese greatness and innovation. >> later wednesday in beijing, the president will meet with the chinese premier, the head of cabinet agencies and the top ranking communist party official, and it's called touching all the bases and then a trip to the great wall and a flight to seoul, south korea where the president there will want to know china's latest thoughts on containing with the united states the united states nuclear program. bret: major, that is not all that is on the president's schedule in coming hours, right? >> that's correct. i will sit down on behalf of the fox news channel with an interview with president obama and some other correspondents here will do the same. we will cover a lot of issues, iran, north korea, trade in this region, climate change, jobs and healthcare back home. we're going to try to hit all the bases in a slightly different respect. bret: it should be interesting. majoring thank you. you can see that interview "special or the" six p.m. eastern tomorrow. let's look at the debt relationship now between the u.s. and china. how did we get in such a hole and is it going to get biger? here is correspondent wendell goler. >> it's the elephant in the room that aides say the two leaders didn't talk about, china's huge holding of u.s. treasury bonds. >> the $800 billion never came up in conversation, and the president dealt with every issue on his agenda in a very direct way, and pulled no punches. >> china is able to loan us the money because exports are booming and exports are booming because other country's money goes further since the value of the yuan in which chinese workers are paid is kept artificially low. economist charles scott says it is not a perfect marriage. >> we have become reliant on chinese capital and they have become reliant on their exports to the united states that. is a relationship we need to escape from. we need a divorce from that relationship. >> chinese-made goods are cheaper in this country than they would be if the quawn was properly valued but since we're not making the goods ourselves, we would pay for the difference in jobs. >> overall, the combination of china and other asian countries currency manipulation and protectionism has cost the united states 3 million jobs in this decade. >> this is forcing american workers to retrain or take lower-paying jobs and sometimes both. their complaint may not seem so loud when the unemployment rate is 4% but we hear them loud and cheer when the jobless rate is 10% and climbing. some economists think the threat of tearists would have china assign a more reasonable value to the yuan. >> we have to empower the president, and threaten china and other currency manipulator s that if they don't change their behavior, they will face sanctions, and that threat alone will do the job. >> economists say china won't cash in its dollars because that would lock in its losses and drag down the economy of its biggest trading partner. china's economic level calls for moving 100 million peasant farmers to cities in the coming decades an depends on exports but it could have a global impact. if china moves 100 million people from the fields to factories for exports, it will wipe out every manufacturing job in europe, north america and the industrialized world. >> without those exports, china could have 10 million more unemployed each year. that is a recipe for trouble and some economists say loaning countries the money to buy the exports is china's investment in political stability. bret: wendell, thank you. wholesale prices were up 3/10's of a percentage point in september, indicating inflation is still in check. industrial production rose 1/10 of a percentage point last month following a 6/10 of a point increase in december. the dow today gained 30 1/2. the s&p 500 was un1. s&p 500 finished up about six. >> president obama gets more geef from a core constituency and we take a fair and balanced look for one of the administration's reasons for administration's reasons for bringing 9/11 suspects to the [bell ringing] the way the stock market's been acting lately you may wonder if you've been doing the right thing. is the advice you've been getting helping or hurting? are the fees you're paying really worth it? td ameritrade's fees are fair and straight-forward. their research is independent and unbiased. their investment consultants are knowledgeable and there when you need them. so why not talk to one? announcer: call today to schedule a free investment check-up, or visit a td ameritrade branch. bret: 9/11 commission chairman thomas caine became the latest critic of the obama administration's decision to try suspected 9/11 co-conspirators in criminal court. catherine herridge looks at one of the justifications for the move and whether it holds up. four days after the attorney general announced that the 9/11 suspects will be tried in a new york federal court, he repeated the rational. >> in making the decision that i made, i looked at obviously cognizant of what we have done in the past but focused on what we have to do in the future. >> in bringing khalid sheik mohammed, the self-described architect of the attacks to a federal rather than a military court, the attorney general also points to his department's, quote, long and successful history of prosecuting terrorists, but a closer inspection shows there may be few similarities between those cases where evidence was gathered by the f.b.i., where suspects were picked up inside the u.s., and those where bin laden's alleged assistants were held in c.i.a. secret prisons out of the country. >> i don't think i can name one where it was post-9/11, captured outside the united states, with evidence derived from afghanistan or foreign intelligence services. i mean, it's almost disingenuous to say, well, we did it here. >> based on review of court documents, a recent study by syracuse university found that potential terrorism cases are not prosecuted or at least the defendants are prosecuted on lesser charges other than terrorism. one out of the four of the defendants on the list of terrorism matters prepared by the national security division, an office in the department of justice the report stays states were not classified as having anything to do with terrorism by the prosecutors who actually bout the cases." and jose padilla, picked up at o'hare, was convicted of helping jihadists overseas in 2007. none of the original allegations including claims he plan add dirty bomb attack inside the country were put forward n the shoe bomber case, the f.b.i. gathered evidence by traditional means. the demonstration video one year after richard reid was arrested at logan inter national airport. one week before the trial he pled guilty to terrorism charges to save his family the embarrassment of a prosecution. a former military lawyer says it may all come down to the charges against the 9/11 defendants a if you it ends up that because of the rightly narrower rules of evidence that apply in federal courts that they have to shed some evidence, then our country will have forfeited the opportunity to tell the whole 9/11 story. >> the syracuse report was issued and the justice department spokesman said in the eight years since the 9/11 attacks they have improved their ability to identify, penetrate and dismantle terrorist plots. the 9/11 case will undoubtly put their skills to the test >> government lawyers could face rough sailing ahead. correspondent shannon bream joins me now. shannon, what are some of the potential evidentiary problems prosecutors could face bringing this to court as opposed to a military tribunal. >> there are major differences that could impact this case. let's start with something basic like hearsay, somebody who wants to take the stand and talk about what somebody else said, he versus what somebody else said. i talked to detainee aides and they said that everyone confessed. in a federal court, it is a big no-no. airily is it allowed into court. there is very few exceptions to that. somethinging also like the miranda rights, that is not something a troop is going to do when they kick down a door in fallujah. in a military commission, you don't have to use miranda rights to introduce statements, something you have to have in a federal court that. could be crucial because there is not a lot of physical evidence and prosecutors need to bring those statements in. bret: what about the national security issues, because the evidence obviously would be sent to the defendant's attorneys. >> that's right. clients like khalid sheik mohammed and others are not necessarily going to get to see the information t is a delicate balance. there are rules in place, federal procedure rules and things like the classified information procedures act meant to protect certain information in the way it is handled in a courtroom. so much of this will come down to the judge. they will have so much leeway to be an umpire on deciding what is in, what is out and that could make all the difference on what evidence is allowed under the courtroom, and ultimately an enormous impact on whatever verdict is reached. bret: we have a lot of steps to go. >> absolutely. bret: shannon, thank you. senators voted to end a filibuster by republican jeff sessions against the nomination of judge david hamilton to the 7th circuit court of appeals. shannon showed you friday how critics say hamilton fits the definition of an and an activist judge of. the vote was 70-29 with ten republicans siding with majority democrats a final vote is expected wednesday. we could soon have multiple investigations into the fort hood shootings. we'll explain, and why some democrats want to slow down their leader's push to get a vote on healthcare 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yours free, so call now. and learn how aarp medicare supplement insurance... can help make your sixties a time of freedom. again. bret: some senate democrats breaking ranks with their leader and questioning the need for speed on their healthcare reform bill. carl cameron is live on capitol hill tonight with he details. good evening, carl. >> hi, bret. senator democrats are hoping and scrambling tonight that they will be able to unveil their full healthcare reform package tomorrow with a cost analysis and price tag. senate majority leader harry reid with the help of the white house has been working on the bill for three and a half weeks. various parts have already been studied by the non-partisan congressional budget office. >> of all the bills we have seen, it will be the best. it saves more money. it is more protective of medicare. it is a bill that is good for the american people. aim not going to get into numbers today, but i think if you're not impressed, you should be. >> unimpressed by reid's lack of a bill and cost analysis so far are four influential democrats who opposed beginning the first initial debate without having three days to study the bill. their concerns include healthcare and premium cost increases, the deficit, tax increases, and the consequences of the government entering the private insurance market. those very worries have republicans poised to oppose whatever reid comes out with wednesday, because for weeks all they have had to study is the house bill. >> we'd love to know what it is going to cost. the american people would love to know what it is cost and would like to have time to look at it. >> we want to read it before we get out of here alt at the end of the week. >> senators could review it up to 72 hours an vote by the end of the week, to officially begin debate when they return from their week-long thanksgiving vacation. the latest "washington post"/abc news poll shows 49% are opposed to the democrat's healthcare efforts and only 48% in favor, while 52% think their own healthcare will become more expensive. that is at odds with the democrats' stated goal of reducing the overall cost of healthcare, and because of that problem, it's precisely request so many moderate democrats have big misgivings until such time as they see the bill and the price tag. >> so c.b.o. numbers possibly tomorrow. >> and if they don't get them, then there is a distinct possibility they won't have a bill to debate until after thanksgiving, putting the clock back more than a week, really. bret: carl, thank you. there is reaction on both sides of the iem to monday's announcement by a government task force that women should wait until they turn 50 to add mammograms to screen for breast cancer. some women diagnosed with cancer at a young age are fearful of those guidelines as is the american cancer society, but the vice chairman of the group says it produces fewer benefits and more harm. robert byrd will become the longest serving member of congress in history wednesday. byrd holds the senate record. he has served 20,774 days. that's 56 years and ten and a half months. byrd turns 92 friday. environmentalists, president obama was blowing smoke when he addressed climate change and sarah palin is stirring up interesting commentary as the reviews of her book fly in. that'sxxxxxxxx÷ bret: and now fresh pickings from the political grapevine. the reviews for sarah palin's new book "going rogue" could be giving us new outbreaks of p.d.s. palin derrangement syndrome. jeffrey dunn writes under the headlines "sarah vain and simple, going deeper into her narcissism sissism and victimhood" "the new york times" calls the book part cagey spin, part earnest autobiography, part payback hit job. "the washington post" enlisted reviews from a liberal and conservative writing for the left, anna ana marie cox's headline reads amid cloudy rhetoric the challenge to find political smoke and fire. cox admits to skimming the last 150 pages, more than a third of the book, because she was on deadline. quote, it's terrible, i know, but if i didn't read it all, neither can sarah palin claim to have completely written it ." many environmentalists upset with president obama following word that a global climate change teat ti will not happen during next month's summit in copenhagen. a headline declares "obama has failed the world on climate change" saying the president was dishonest with europe during his much touted berlin speech in 2008 when he declared himself a citizen of the world. brittish greenpeace activists josh garmin says the u.s. has been dead weight on the climate talks, and that president obama wants the world to wait for a climate change bill currently bogged down in the u.s. senate. finally, new york governor daifd paterson could have a battle in his question to be elected to a full term next yearment a new poll shows that paterson is trailing andrew cuomo, who has not even declared he will run, by nearly 60 points. 75% to 16%. the poll also shows paterson trailing rudy julian nigh by more than 20 points in the general election faceoff. larry sabato says "no governor in modern times has been in such bad shapeless than a year ahead of the election. it would take a miracle or a pock pocket full of them for paterson to win in 201o" texas republican congressman john carter whose district includes fort hood introduced legislation designating the victims of this month's shootings as combat casualties, opening up more benefits and strengthening the benefit of considering it a national terrorist event. steve centanni joins us with an update from the pentagon. good evening, steve. >> republicans on capitol hill are prushing for prompt congressional hearings into what one lawmaker called a systematic breakdown that led to the fort hood shooting a capitol hill news conference was held today and house republicans also said the fort hood shooting should be investigated by congress as a possible terrorist attack, and insisted there is no time to waste. >> congress needs to begin their work now. >> lawmakers also claimed that they have been hindered because of unspecified tools that used to be at their disposal are no longer available. the chairman of the house intelligence committee was asked about that. >> i don't know of any tools that have been curtailed or limited. this may be just, again, a political smoke screen thrown out there. >> reyes calls republicans irresponsible for wanting to forge ahead before f.b.i. and army investigators have had a chance to, quote, get the facts. this morning, the national security council organized a briefing for key members of congress held by the f.b.i., national counterterrorism center and the pentagon. meantime, the dallas morning news or thes that nidal malik hasan may have tried to report some of his patients for war crimes when he worked as a psychiatrist at fort hood. the article quoted some who thought this was a violation of doctor-patient confidentiality and others who point out it is a psychiatrist's job to report such crimes. abc news says his efforts to report his patients failed and that investigators were looking into whether that rejection could have triggered the shooting rampage. finally, both the department of defense and the army appear to be moving closer to appointing special panels to look into what went wrong, what clues may have been overlooked about hasan in the past and why. back to you, bret. bret: steve, thank you. in world headlines, kurdish political leaders are threatening to boycott iraq's national elections unless they receive more seats in parliament. the voting in january is seen as key to the progress of u.s. troop withdrawls in iraq. pakistani military commanders say their forces have captured most main taliban bases and say troops are advancing faster than expected in their month-long offensive. there the chief military spokesman in pakistan says 500 militants have been killed in that operation. military sources tell fox that israel has received a shipment of bunker-busting bombs from the u.s. the deliver delivery came on the same day benjamin netanyahu visited an israeli submarine and said he believes israel would be the first target of a nuclear-armed iran. we will look at what is behind all of the problems with the administration's numbers on job stimulation from the stimulus. the fox all-stars weigh in after the break many >> these mistakes are frustrating and infuriating because they get in the way of having an honest discussion of exactly what the role of the recovery package has been on the economy. >> nower they've started to make up congressional districts. i'm looking forward to meeting the congress man or woman from the 86th distinct district of arizona. >> there are only 8 congressional districts in arizona. this is about recovery.gov, the listing of how many jobs the administration says have been saved or created by the stimulus package and there are some problems. here is what the white house is saying about that, quote, we are going to identify mistakes and three points should not be lost. first, the mistakes are relatively few and don't change the conclusions one can draw, and second, some of the mistakes are typos an coding errors that don't undermine information at the heart of the data. when people send in 130,000 reports some will have mistakes. third, transparency will be messy but it is better than the alternative. what about this? let's bring in steve hayes, nina easton of fortune magazine and charles krauthammer. steve. >> well, you know, the federal government said that $5 million in stimulus money was spent in north chicago public districts, saving 473 jobs. the problem was there were only 293 jobs there right now in existence. they asked the superintendent of of the schools how did it happen, and she said i don't know where the number comes from. it was a similar thing in wilmette outside of chicago. you are seeing these reports pop up again and again and again. bret: they're trickling out from every media outlet. >> everywhere. a lot of the very good reporting has been done by local newspapers at a time when local newspapers, smaller papers don't get a lot of credit. they're doing really good work on this kind of thing, demonstrating their value, but what's interesting to me is that all of the mistakes seem to be going in one direction. we're not reading stories about how there were ten jobs created and then, oh, accidentally we reported only ten but really 100 were created or 500 were created so what this gets to is the credibility of the reporting and credibility of the obama administration. i think it was farcical at the outset to say jobs would be saved or created and you could count that in a meaningful way, but this will make people question going forward, including democrats in congress, what do these numbers mean and why should we ever believe what they're saying? bret: nina, with unemployment at 10.2% and number of jobs physically lost since the stimulus was signed at about 3 million, how big of a problem is this for the administration? >> well, the problem, with you know, openness and government is that it also undermines faith in government, because you're e soog all of these examples. we have more seats in congress than we used to, but they bought a lawnmower to do the fayetteville national cemetery and claimed 50 jobs were saved. bret: by the lawnmower. >> by the lawnmower t makes them ridiculous. i agree with mark can kirk that you need a third-party audit looking at these numbers. the thing that strikes me the most is not just -- ok, let's say the overall numbers are generally somewhere in the ballpark which is what the white house is claiming. the white house also said that 90% of those jobs will be in the public sector. if you take their them numbers at least 50% are in the public sector -- bret: you mean in the private sector. >> yeah, in the private sector. it is not boosting private sector jobs. half of the jobs being saved are educators, and you know, when you go to talk to some somf these school districts they said we would have laid them off anyway. so it goes back to whether the numbers were accurate in the first place but this is really expanding government. these not boosting private sector lasting jobs. bret: charles, we saw "saturday night live" with the joe biden skit where he said the stimulus is working and waves his hand. they continue, the administration does, to say that it is working, but these numbers coming out today with the congressional districts seem to be having an effect. >> the effect ultimately is to be an object of ridicule. look, this whole discussion has had an alice in wonderland quality from the very beginning. you can't measure saved jobs, arguing over the precision or inprecision of the numbers which are frictional at the beginning is like there are 12 angels angels and now there is ten and one is a leprechaun and one flew away wednesday. this whole thing has a bizarre quality about it. when you hear these reports, as we're hearing now with the fictional congressional districts, what the risk for the administration is, it becomes an object of ridicule. and once that happens, it's hard to actually stop, and the issue will become competence. there have been ideological objections against this administration, it's radical and all, that but now it is starting a new kind of mean, that it is an administration that really can't get things done, and when you have the president announcing as he did in his address to the congress, you know, don't worry about the tracking in the stimulus, it will be done by the vice president and nobody messes with joe biden. remember he said that in his address, which got a chuckle at the beginning. well, it looks as if he is in the 99th district of the mariana islands which doesn't have a representative in congress, are pling with joe biden. once the mean starts, it becomes the subject of late-night comedy and you don't stop t bret: steve, the administration says if they didn't have the stimulus, the economy would be far worse than it is right now and they say that these postings on recovery.gov are filers who are just sloppy in the way that they're filing, but the jobs actually are materializing. that's what they say in response. >> it's just not a lot of backup on that. charles is right. how do you count it? that was the question from the beginning. remember, are they started touting saved jobs within a week or two. it was almost immediate they were saying look, the stimulus is working, look at all of the things that we have done. it was farcical at the beginning. it's farcical now. i think the reason they keep touting the stimulus, and keep saying it is working is because at some point, unemployment will start to decrease, and they want to be able to take credit for it. i think the trick is exactly what charles says, you know, do you in the meantime become an object of ridicule and i think they're close already. >> i think it did provide us temporary safety net, expansion of unemployment benefits providing some assistance to the states and hoe cal ties, so i think as a temporary safety net, you can give it some credit but to say it is creating lasting jobs, that's where i think the downfall is. bret: when this whole thing bubbled up, there was an associated press story that started all of this, and the economic advisors came out and said wait for the recovery.gov report. we are going through this and scouring it to make sure it is right and now this. >> when when they speak seriously about this and how precise all of this is, 640,329 jobs saved, a comical precision, and then it turns out a lot of these are fictional jobs and fictional districts, what happens is the administration has already been satirized on "saturday night live" as do nothing, and now it will be seen as an administration that cannot even do not competently. bret: did you know you were paying china $50 billion, tax dollars a year just in interest on your debt to that country? we'll talk about that situation when we return.eeee >> so far, china's partnership has proved critical in our effort to pull ourselves out of the worst recession in generations. given that interconnection, i do not believe that one country he's success must come at the expense of another. >> we believe that now the world economy has shown some signs of stabilizing and recovery, but the foundation for this recovery is not firmly established. bret: there is concern in china that the u.s. economic situation, why, because some analysts put the u.s. debt to china at about $1.3 trillion u.s. dollars. most of that in u.s. treasuries. what about all of this? we're back with our panel. nina. >> well, the biggest critic of the obama level of spend something not john boehner, believe it or not. it is the chinese. they have been expressing this concern going way back this summer when they met with top officials. the difference between john boehner and the chinese is that they have real power over us. a lot of investors talk about overseas investors talk about the possibility of a debt event, as it being a real national security possibility. what if the chinese suddenly led a stampede of investors out of u.s. treasuries, the value of the treasuries fell and our country e essentially went bank bankrupt? there is that possibility. it is remote, but it is unlikely the chinese will do that at this point because it affects their own holdings, but they have tremendous power over us. bret: explain the $1.3 trillion. you have $800 billion in u.s. treasuries what is the rest? ought rest is agency debt, like fannie mae, freddie mac, those sort of agency holdings. bret: that's a big hole. >> it is a big hole to fill. the other thing is the lectures, we have heard a lot on this, on "special report" tonight about the lectures that the u.s. is giving china about their economy. well, the chinese view us as this economy where, first of all, the private sector and households are living way beyond their means and now the government is living way beyond their means so they think they have the upper hand on this moral argument. bret: charles? >> look, the reason you have this odd alliance between republicans and chinese on healthcare reform is that the chinese holding all this debt, that they know that eventually the united states will take care of it in one way. it's not going to be default. we are not argentina. it is not going to be a repudiation of debt the way that cuba did. it is going to be in inflation. we will inflate our way out t takes only four and a half years of 10% inflation to actually cut the value of the dollar in half. the chinese are worried about this. now, the existing amount of debt, over a trillion or so, is large but it's not out of control. it is about 1/10 of our g.n.p. and what the chinese are worried about the ambitious social agenda of this administration is going to add hugely on to our debt starting with a new entitlement in healthcare reform which could add trillions to national debt, even our projections today. in the absence of health reform are going to to be $9 trillion added in debt over a decade. they are holding all of that stuff and that could ultimately wipe out all their holdings. that's why the chinese are worried and that's why republicans are worried and that's why americans are worried about this incredible spend that the obama administration has on its agenda. bret: steve? >> you know you're in trouble when you're being lectured by communists about the size and scope of government. that's never a good day. i think that actually having 1/10 of your g.d.p. as a deficit in 2010, which is a projection, is quite large, and i think deeply troubling. i think that's one of the main reasons that you're seeing this kind of talk from the chinese and concerns about the valuations. what is interesting is going into this week, the obama administration had clearly set out to message on deficits. there was a big piece in politico talking about his commitment to reducing deficits. he said it in his remarks the other day. this goes back to what we talked to about on the first panel. there is a credibility problem here. the things you are proposing are flu heights. i mean, reports today of $12 trillion debt for the first time. you are talking about deficits into this political reality that makes people think does he even understand what he is talking about? bret: nina, last word, does the president come out of had trip with anything in regards to the chinese? >> well, he didn't come out with a climate change agreement. he's not coming out with anything on currency or trade, but in fairness, you know, the previous administration didn't get much on currency or trade out of the chinese either, so they're tough partners. bret: we'll see what happens with iran. >> yes. bret: that's it for the panel but stay tuned for how the chinese viewed one of president obama's appearances this week. . bret: finally tonight, as we told you monday, president obama spoke to university students in shanghai and also answered questions there. one had to do with the firewall. it had been set up by the chinese government to monitor and screen internet usage in that country. here is a live look at how that session came across in china. >> i am a believer in technology and a big believer in openness when it comes to the flow of information. [laughter] >> citizens can hold their own governments accountable. >> [chinese translation] [laughter] >> they can begin to think for themselves. >> [chinese translation] [laughter] [laughter]