Just miles from sanford, florida,here zimmerman was acquitted of seconddegree murder and manslaughter saturday night. Separate and apart from the its time to talk about laws that senselessly talk about selfdefense and dangerous conflict in our neighborhoods. These laws tried to fix something that was never broken. There has always been a Legal Defense for using deadly force if and the if is important. If no safe retreat is available. But we must examine laws that take this further by eliminating the common sense and age old requirement that people who feel threatened have a duty to retreat outside their home if they can do so safely. We must confront the underlying attitudes, the mistaken beliefs and the unfortunate stereotypes that serve too often as the basis for Police Action and private judgments. Stereotypes. Would the attorney general include stereotypes such as a jury should be deemed racist because they are simply white or a police department, can it be considered racist because they dont bring charges when their investigation determines theres insufficient evidence to do so . Stereotypes, mr. Attorney general, selfanointed civil rights leader al sharpton again toud vowed to hold a 100city protest tour. The state of florida will become a battleground of a new we stopped at the department of justice to see wheer they would be funding and assisting mr. Sharpton again as they did last year in funding and organizing demonstrations. The Justice Department still has not answered our questions. Sharpton, for his part, has been surely disappointed by the low turnout for the demonstrations he caed for. Cities nationwide reporting gatherings and protests that number in the hundreds, not the thousands or tens of thousands. With small pockets of break away groups in places like los angeles and baltimore, unfortunately resorting to vandalism and in some few cases assault. The attney general behaving rather badly, theJustice Department inciting demonstrations and protests while decrying the zimmerman ial result. Mr. Holder ignored throughout that four children were gunned down and murdered in the president s hometown of chicago during the course of the 20day zimmerman tri. President obama and his attorney general offered no comment on those also unnecessary deaths. Deaths that are every bit as tragic and painful as the death of Trayvon Martin. In fact, perhaps more so because the president of the United States and his attorney general chose not to speak of those victims and their families. For more on the Obama Administration reaction to the zimmerman acquittal, im joined now by columnist for the hill and fox news political analyst Juan Williams and Senior Writer for the weekly standard, fox news contributor, steven hayes. Gentlemen, the attorney general has moved from accusing a jury an the judicial system of racism without reservation yesterday to today focusing on tan your ground laws which may mean hede longer applicable under the constitution. Juan, your thoughts . I think stand your groundis really not at issue here, l. Because it was not used by the defense in the zimmerman case. They said it was simply a matter of selfdefense. And i can tell you that, i spoke to governor jeb bush who was the governor of florida at thtime that stand your ground was put in pce. He said it did not apply to this case. He thought the law was being maligned in in regard. Obviously, you have a sense here that he, eric holder now is looking for something that will give him some traction that he can offer up to people who are so upset as evidence that he is taking action in the aftermath of the Zimmerman Martin verdict. Is that really the job of the attorneyeneral to touch the wounds and emotions, no matter how traumatized of a select group of people within our society. Is he not the attorney general of all people . Should he not in should he not be instead of holding the integrity of the judicial system and the integrity of that verdict . Well, i think go ahead, steve, sorry. No. I hate to say it. But i actually agree with juan. Think what hpened here in the speech today was eric holder trying to chan the subject. He was trying to take this from a debate that was larly about race. Something that he, fueled with his recent comments and make it a bate about stand your ground. He wants to talk about that. The administration is much more comfortable having that debate than they are trying to bring additional charges against George Zimmerman, which i think virtually everybody agrees would be almost impossible to win on. To win a case on. I think what hes doing is changing the subject, trying to get people to debate Something Else and avoiding the difficult decisionbout whether to bring those charges to push it down the road. Let me the National Rifle association has just handed us well, actually one of my producers has just handed me the nra statement. Theyve just put it out. The attorney general says the nra fail to understand that selfdefense is not a concept. Its a fundamental human right. To send a message that legitimateselfdefense is to blame is uncon shanable and demonstrates that this administration will exploit tragedies to push their political agenda. Chris cox, the executiv director of the nra institute for legislativeaction. Your reaction, juan . Well, i dont know. Sometimes we get into these political debates, this mudsliing and you just have to laugh, lou. Come on, the nra says somebody else has a political agenda. Stand your ground is an extension of selfdefense. I think everybody will acknowledge it. It is not the case that anybody is attacking selfdefense. In the zimmerman case, there are logical steps thatmmerman could have taken to avoid that confrontati confrontation. Everybody acknowledged that. It becomes a matter did he feel threatened and the jury said he did. The prosecution failed to make the case that he was acting with any malice. Thats the verdict. And you accept it. R the nra, which is dead set on pursuing its guns in every corner concealed weapons everywhere agenda, to say somebody else has an agenda, laughable. Steve, your reaction to the nra statement . In a sense, eric holder seems to preempt it in his speech today when he talked about stand your ground and said it was a law that didnt need to passed basically. We didnt need to have this anyway because you already have the rit to selfdefense. I think that would be his response to the nras statement. Im more sympathetic to the stand your ground laws because i think theyve proven effective over the years. The idea that the attorney general would stand up and say he wants americans to retreat in the face of threat is bizarre. It is, to me, i cant even begin to understand why this attorney general d this president did not do the gracious, smart and dutiful thing and that is support our judicial system and this verdict. There is also theres a scalding hypocrisy about all this administration has done in the past 48 hours it seems to me. They have they know full well that they cannot bring a civil Rights Action against this young man. They know full well that, as they sought a petition, they and the naacp seeking a petition on bringing civil rights, and is the cynicism of reverend al sharpton to talk about 100city demonstration. This is the stuff of i mean, to me, it is reprehensible conduct. I said that the attorney general is behaving badly. I think its worse thannthat on the part of this administration. Your thoughts, juan . Im saying a men. Me, theres so many of these race hustlersi out there. I think they lead peop down the garden path. They ignore the constant carnage in the black community. The constant shootings you referred to the number of children killed in chicago during the course of this trial. I think that you look at someone like sharpton. I think hes pumping those numbers for his ratings or whatever. Yes, there is legitimate concern about injustice. Why is i the case that theres a dead child and no acknowledgment of that in terms of the jurys action. Fine, i agree. But theres a larger issue here. When you see the hustlers out there, you havto stop and just if you say, i think you used the word just a burning scorn that you have, lou, for this kind of behavior. I share it. Thank you, juan. Stephen, youre going to get the last wor in this. I want to point out one thing. Those four murder victims during the course of that zimmerman trial, 20day period, children, they didnt have a gun in eir hand. They werent standing their ground. And they were defenseless against violence and evil and i hope that the attorney general at least and perhaps the president will acknowledge that reality for the sake of the people of chicago and those families who lost loved ones. Stepn, you get the last word here. I wouldnt hold your breath for that. Mean, its an interesting discussion why i agree with juan much more than i disagree with juan. Its a nice moment here tonight to watch. It is a nice moment. This is what al sharpton does. Hes done this in the past. Hes doing it now. Hell do it in the future. He wants attention. Hell get some attention. But ultimately, i dont think what hes doing is not only is it not helpful, but its harmful. Thank you very much, stephen hayes. Juan williams, we appreciate you being with us. Much more on the aftermath of the zimmerman not guilty verdict coming up in dobbs law. Leading attorneys ashley merchant and arthur adelle a join us. Edward snowden is still stranded but he holds what he thinks is an insurance policy. Fox News National security fox News National security expeeverybody has differents investment objectives, ideas, goals, appetite for risk. You cant say one size fits all. It doesnt. Thats crazy. Were all totally different. Ishares core. Find out why 9 out of 10your large professional investors choose ishares for their etfs. Ishares by blackrock. Cainvestment objectives, prrisks, charges and expenses. Read and consider it carefully before investing. Risk includes possible loss of principal. Inairo tonight, Security Forces firing gas into crowds following clashes between pro and antimorsi forces. This is deputy secretary williams burns. He met with egypts interim government earlier. He emphasized at that meeting that the United States will not be taking sides in egypt. Joing us fox News National security analyst, kt mcfarland. Kt, great to have you with us. The egyptian the Muslim Brotherhood, no part of the egyptian meetings with the secretary. No. S that it for the Muslim Brotherhood and barack oba . Well, the Muslim Brotherhood has waited 80 years for their moment to ta charge i a middle east country. They have a year ago and ty totally blew it. They got greedy, started grabbing all aspects of power. They started snuffing out the opposition. Most importantly, they ran the onomy into the ditch. Which, by the way x e should point out was already weak. Was already ak. But now it is in complete free fall to the point where half the people in egypt dont have food. Are you surprised that arab states, saudi arabia, kuwait, the United Arab Emirates moved money into egypt to support them . Heres whats fascinating about the interim government. Morsi, the Muslim Brotherhood y, the first thing he did in office is he went to tehran, he went to see president ahmadinejad. Mortal enemy of them. At that time, were not sending you more relief aid. The two top guys were close to saudi arabia. General al si si spent time there as a defense attache. I was fascinated to say the first country that recognized the new interim government was the saudis and the first on to really show up with big money were the saudis. United arab emirates and kuwait. Theyre trying to get them enough time, buy time for them to get their acttogether. I dont know that egypt ever can. But at lst they now have chance. Sky news arabia affilted with fox reporting that theres an emergency session of the leadin Muslim Brotherhood figures from acrs the region, including europe. Right. Hamas as well. To find out what they can do to reverse the egyptian political direction. What do you make of it, whats the likelihood . I think its an act of desperation. Youre always somebody who talks about is the economy stupid, look at the economic statistics. I have a vested interest in that viewpoint, i have to admit. Too bad youre not running things in the middle east. Because the Muslim Brotherhood failed every time theyve taken power. Whether in ga, in egypt. Theyve driven those economies into theitch. So their opportunity costs are gog to be very high. Nobody is going to trust them. Its not to say that the Muslim Brotherhood, some factions of them will break off and i think could marry up with al qaeda in the sinai peninsula. Thats the place im watching. Whether they the violence it could have happen. The news just keeps getting better. Lets turn to russia and Edward Snowden and whatever point that he may be headed toward. Putin is saying that he is not hes ready for mr. Snowden to just move on. It sound like they picked the chicken clean and now have Better Things to do. What do you make of it . Absolutely. When snowden went to china, they got everything he ha they didnt want him they said you can leave. Then he gets to russia. They picked him clean as you said. They got everything off the laptop, the thumb drives and probably in his head. Its not just the intelligence information that he was snowden was able to give these countries. Its the mhod by which we gather intelligence. Thats often more important. They now know how we go and do our intelligence. Finally, what does snowden give putin the opportunity to do, thoroughly humiliate the United States. You have obama saying there are going to be strong repercussions and a few days later, when i was clear we werent getting him back, oh, well, hes a 28yearold hacker, he doesnt count. He does count. The facts that the russians have him, theyve gotten what they want, hes like used kleenex at this point. We just dont know where hes going. But we also dont understand quite what his state is. The u. S. Intelligence agencies havent been able to bring him to ground. The government itself, the state department, the power of the executive has not been able to bring him through negotiation or any other own acon back to the United States. The United States, do you have a sense that were actually doing something vigorousl to bring this person back to capture an to bring this person back . I think what were doing one calls to countries saying dont you take him and i seems to be having a little effect. I would ke a step back and talk about the things you talked about. Whats happening in the middle east, russia. We look like a helpless giant and thats the bigger problem. Kt mcfarland. Thank you very much. Nothing helpless about kt. Up next, more i had ossie. The chalk talk, well highlight some of the most, well, annoying, i thinkwell be gentle. Most annoying. Here next. Here next. The pursuit of a better tomorrow is something we all share. But who can help you find your own path . Who can build you a plan, not just a pie chart . Who can help keep your investments on course, whatever lies ahead . That someone is a Morgan Stanley financial advisor. And were ready to work for you. Ebony and ivory, live together in perfecect harmony stevie wonders 1982 hit ebony and ivory, a great song, a great message, a great entertainer. But now hes issuing threats regardg the zimmerman verdict and stand your ground. Stevie wonder performing in canada on sunday when he said he would never again perform in the state of florida or any state where he finds that a standyourground law exists. I dont get it, stevie. What are you thinking . So weve got no choice but to include him in what teams like a parade of fools on this issue. Folks who have come out insisting they know better than the florida jury that spent three weeks listening to the evidence, examining it carefully and deciding in a narrow and reasonable verdict that there was reasonable doubt on the two charges against zimmerman. Second degree murder and manslaughter. They acquitted exonerated him. Stevie wonders free, of course, to boycott anything he wants. But there are a few problems with the singers reasoning. First, zimmermans attorneys didnt mount a stand your Ground Defense in the case. It had nothing to do with it. By the way, hes in good company. The attorney general himself is confused about the standyourground law and decided today to shift his focus to that law rather than rther trying to demonize and vilify the jury and the judicial system that reached a not guilty verdict. Secondly, wonders boycott leaves him with drastically fewer travel choices. We hate to point this out, but florida is only one of 23 states that currently have versions of standyourground laws. So good luck with that. Next up in the parade of fools list is singer wyclef jean who said this to me feels like a new form of modern day lynching if you can shoot a kid and walk ay and nothing happens. What kind of signal are you sending . First of all referring to lynching is abhorrent and disgusting. Its one of the cheapest of the reflexes available to critic of that verdict. Its hard to discern which is more outrageous. Wyclefs latest comments or his failed haiti charity. Which allegedly mishandled and misspent some 16 million that should have gone to the victims in haiti. Lastly, weve got a rapper that you may not be familiar with and you shouldnt get upset. Its not really a bad thing. A rapper akon born in the United States but raised in senegal. He posted online this statement. Every africanamerican in the United States needs to move their money, family, knowledge, back to africa where youll be treated like a royalty you are. You dont deserve this treatment. This is not your country. We know its a lot to expect intellectual capacity and integrity from celebrities and entertainers, but when you use your notoriety to incite racial tension, we have to point out what aool you are. Anyes, it is our country. And so maybe you can tell me, why do we have to put up with fools who make comments like that . Oh, thats right, because its our country and it is america. You get to do that sort of thing. But we also get to point o just how annoyi those fools can be. We continue in just one moment. Big sis calling it quits. Janet napolitano leaving an important cabinet post vacant. Former Homeland Security secretary tom ridge reacts here next. The boys used double miles from their capital one venture card to fly home for the big family reunion. You must be garths father . Hello. Mother. Mother traveling is easy with the venture card because you can fly any airline anytime. Two words. Double miles this guy can act. Wanna play dodge rock . Oh, you guys and with double miles you can actuay use, you never miss the fun. Beard growing contest and go win whats in your wallet . Janet napolitanos decision to step down as Homeland Security secretary exposing a troubling leadership vacuum at that department, there are now 15 empty ots in 45 of the leadership positions at Homeland Security. Senator john micah says now is a good time for congress to consider dismantling the monstrous department of Homeland Security and replacing it with a smaller security focused entity that is realistically capable of connecting the dots of threats posed to our National Security. Joining us now, the former head of Homeland Security, forr secretary and former governor of the great state of pennsylvania. Tom ridge. Thanks for being here. Youre the fellow presiding. Micah referred to it as a monstrous entity was assembled. What are yur reactions first to his statement . While i respect the congressmans Public Service and hes done great deal of very, very good work, i think hes flat wrong when it comes to the department. It was admittedly a bold aggregation of over 20 different departments, but the real challenge with the department, i believe, has more to do with coress than it does with the department. The secretaries continue to report to almost 100 committees pand subcommittees. So at the end the day, lou, there is no Smaller Group of men and women in either the house or the senate that can continue to work with, communicate with and collaborate to make it the most efficient and Effective Organization possible. They got to run here, there and everywhere a frankly, nobody wants to givep jurisdictional responsibility. U ha everybody running to the hill to protect their own interests and not a look at the entire enterprise. Not a good situation. He knows where of he speaks wh talking about congressional motivation. Dhs, as big as it is, a thirdf its leadership positions will be vacant by septemberwhen she leaves. As secretary, how can a department that large, that vast, that important function i dont think it can possibly function with anything close to what you and i and theest of america expect from really a necessary organization. I disage with dismantling it. Athe end of the day, that does not fall on the seretarys responsibility. That is exclusively the white house. They know that there are have been many vacancies for months. To my knowledge, in talking to people on the hill and elsewhere, very little effort to fill those vacancies. So is kind of its not even the nonneglect. Its an unconscionable neglect in an agency of government which needs leadership in aal levels. Youre spot on. I think its 14 or 15 you referred to. They should be filled immediately. I dont think it has to be being tied up with the Nuclear Option over in the senate. Governor tom ridge. We thank you or being with us. We appreciate your time and perspective. Always a pleasure, lou. Were shifting our focus to Cyber Security. What america is doing to protect our critical assets in cyberspa cyberspace. Nina easton joins us. George zimmererman, will the Obama Administration really go after him with civil rights charges . Joining us next in dons law, attorneys Arthur Aidala and attorneys Arthur Aidala and ashlee merchant. This man is about to be the millionth customer. Attorneys Arthur Aidala and ashlee merchant. Would you mind if i go ahead of you . Instead we had someone go ahead of him and win fiy ousand dollars. Congratulations you are our one millionth customer. Nobody likes to miss out. Thats why ally treats all their customers the same. Whether youre the first or the millionth. If your bank doesnt think youre special anymore, you need an ally. Ally bank. Your money needs an ally. For their family. Thats why i created the Honest Company. I was just a concerned mom, with a crazy dream. A wish that there was a company that i could rely on, that did all of the hard work for me. Im jessica alba, and the Honest Company was my dream. [ male announcer ] legalzoom has helped a million businesses successfully get started, including jessicas. Launch your dream at legalzoom today. Call us. Were here to help. Returning to the zimmerman case is attorney general holder wades deeper into the controversy, our next guests are here to sort it out from their perspective. For example, is there a foundation for civil rights charges against an individual, in this case, George Zimmerman, a wrongful death suit that can prevail . The criticism of the standyourground laws which had nothing to do with the case. Joining us is criminal defense attorney, fox news legal analyst, Arthur Aidala. Ashleigh merchant, a criminal defense attorney. Good to have you both here. Ashleigh good to be here. Civil rights, a civil Rights Action against an individual. Have you ever heard of a proceeding ever happened . Oh, ive definitely heard of it happening. Its a new law. Obama essentially sied into law back in 2009 a change to the civil rights statute,o the federal civil rights statue, pretty much creating his own class of crimes called hate crimes where it used to be the onlyay you could file a civil Rights Action when it was a law official, a Law Enforcement official violating the persons civil rights. But the laws changed in 2009 and now the actions can be brought against any individual essentially. But there is a very famous case here in new yor excuse me, lou, you know well, the Crown Heights case. The Crown Heights riots in brooklyn, new york, when all the jewish man hit and killed the young black black boy. Only because he was jewish, a black man killed a jewish man and for retaliation. There was evidence that there were words at the scene. Kill the jew, kil the jew. That individual who committed homicide, lem rick nelson was found not guilty in the local court and the feds prosecuted him d he did gto jail. That is not the case with George Zimmerman. I told geraldo riva, ill shave his mustache if the feds bring a charge. Tell me geraldo took the bet. You have to wrestle him to get his mustache off. Ashleigh, the fbi over the course of the past year conducted interviews, 36 people. There are incidences as you look at the results of the intervws. It looks like the fbi is actually trying to get a diffent kind of answer than they got. But the answer they got was theres no hatred, the was no racial bias whatsoever on the part of George Zimmerman. Why is the attorney general act beg like this hes referred to it as an Ongoing Investigation because its been going on since last year. What is he even talking like that . Why isnt he talking about the evidence that his people have accumulated and is now the record . Well, i think its political pressure. The unfortunate thing is hes not following thr own guidelines. The federal government has guidelines that the u. S. Attorneys office is supposed to follow when deciding whether or not to prosecutean individual under this state. Hes not following those. Because they specifically say, you cannot prosecute someone if the decision is based on their race. And i cant help but thinkhat this has something to do with the fact that zimmermans race is different from Trayvon Martins race. Shes right on. I mean, you hit the nail on the head. There should be personal responsibility. Excuse me. This 99degree weather is in my throat. There should be. The attorney general should step up and say, listen, i know emotionally we want an answer. When young people get killed in a car accident, thats an accident. We want an answer. Thats human nature. We want an answer as to why Trayvon Martin we want somebody held responsible. Sometimes nobody is held legally criminally responsible. Were going to continue go ahead, ashleigh and then well take a quick break an come right back with dons law with our attorney tonight to continue the discussion. Go ahead, ashleigh . Sometimesn accident is just an accident is what i was going to say. Yes. It is a shame. As you were shaaying, arthur, people want resolution. That verdict is supposed to be the resolution and the chief Law Enforcement officer in the country is to support the jury trial, judicial system. Its a shame what were witnessing i believe right now. Were going to continue the examination of this case and the politics of it, the legal politics of it talking with ashleigh merchant and Arthur Aidala in just a moment. Fortune magazine, nina easton joins us with a revealing look at the man responsible for exposing chinas hacking of u. S. Companies and our government facilities. 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Were back with attorneys Arthur Aidala and ashleigh merchant. Theres a civil lawsuit that a wrongful death lawsu if it proceeds. What are the odds i think we should point something out. I donthink many people realize that Trayvon Martins family has already received a wrongful death suit settlement believed to be over 1 million, a claim against the Homeowners Association as a result. Where do we go from here, arthur . With a wrongful death . I actually think the likelihood might be higher than zimmerman than the Martin Family suing somebody. Right. Thats if these entities were in control o themselves. Lou, as you can e, this case has taken on a life of its own. And everyone all these advisers, everyone whispering in their ear, everyone giving them advice. Big money at stake. Im sure the jurors have people whispering in their ear. Well get you people magazine. Thats unfortunate. The bottom line is Trayvon Martin is not here and nobody should be making mon off of that in my opinion. One question, ashleigh. Does a wrongful death suit brought by the Martin Family against zimmerman, does it cceed . It doesnt make sense. Whether or not it succeeds, it seems pointless. Zimmerman doesnt have any money pr assets. To keep this litigation ongoing doesnt make a whole lot of sense when theyve received a settlement from the hoa. Its a much lower standard of proof in civil court than in criminal court. Just because there wasnt enough evidence to overcome r reasonab doubt in criminal court doesnt mean they wont overcome the standard in civil right. Which is essentially more likely than not. They have to show that it was more likely than not that he did actually the o. J. Simpson case. Hes acquitted, found liable. Youre not guilty in civil court. Youre liable in civil court. Right exactly. Whether or not you can collect go ahead, ashleigh. Whether or not you can collect on that judgment is a whe another story. Aside from that, theres a far more powerful, at least to me, inference from this verdict than George Zimmerman is exonerated. That hes not guilty. In the o. J. Simpson trial, there was it seemed to me not to be a i dont know. It didnt have the same kind of inflnce or power as this one d. The o. J. Simpson trial, again, i was was i in law school . It was a lo time ago. There was some overwhelming evidence i was in the d. A. s office. There was some overwhelming evidence. I remember where i was. Youve had such a long care. We all went into the chief Assistants Office to watch that verdict. It was pretty heavv. There was a lot about finding him gaeltd and e fact this is what annoys me most abo the o. J. Simpson case. How fast that jury came back. Like four hours. That much responsibility, take your time. Take a nap. Think about it. Say a prayer before you reach a verdt. Right. Which was what was nice about this jury. They really did take their time. So its unfortunate theyre getting such backlash now. The backlash is almost it is predictable. It is expected. And each one ofhose the jurors have, it seems to me as one juror in particular has revealed their thinking, their approach. I mean, shes a very bright woman, a conscientious person. Its clear. I think that the state of florida was wellserved by the intelligence, the diligence of this jury. Their concentration from the jury experts, from the producers of fox who were in the courtroom who observed them, they were taking notes, they were at the edge of their seats. There was no nodding off. They asked for the exhibit list. They did ask for some legal charges. Even though they never got them, they reached a verdict beforehand. Lou, if you sit down, the facts you put them together with the law, this is a not guilty verdict. Let me ask you thiss they did the right thing. The stand your ground approach by the attorney general, how far does that go . The attorney general cant do anything about state laws. He can sue, i guess. Is he simply pandering to a se . Is that all its about, ashleigh . Its really political pressure. I think its pitical pressure to put on the states that still have the standyourground law to amend their law. They cannot force these states, individual states have the riggt to have these laws if they want them. Florida wants this law. It doesnt look like its going anywhere. Hes trying to assert the nra made it clear, theyre going to resist the attorney generals statements d his advocacy on removing stand your ground. It looks like hes picked another loser. Unfortunately, the zimmerman verdict is not the end of this. It may just be the beginning of the ball is just starting to roll. I hope it doesnt roll out of control with this knee jerk reaction all these people making statements who didnt see one minute of one day of the trial and theyre tweeting th nonsense. I think this pool, they will exhaust themselves over the next week or so. Sure. Arthur thank you. Ashleigh, thank you very much. We appreciate you both being here. Thank you. Up next, the story of one of this countrys top cyber sleuths. You better say thank you for this guy. An inside look at the man who exposed chinas systematic hacking of our businesses. What faces in the way of political retaliation. Nina easton with the story, next. Our next guest recently penned an article about the Information Security company mandia, it exposed Cyber Attacks on 141 businesses and organizations by hackers in china. We welcome the Senior Editor of fortune magazine. Nina easton. I have to say the story on mandia and his company was terrific. Great work. And great work on his part. Yeah. You come away realizing how dependent we are still on great minds working in behalf of this great country. Thats right. Small entrepreneurial mind. I mean, this is a great air force, former intel officer turned entrepreneur. Whats been going on. Here sort of laying of groundwork with whats going on with china. Theyve been systematically stealing our trade secrets, particularly in the last five years. Stealing technology blueprints, repes, ingredits, stealing even when theres deals like m and a deals, they go into Computer Systems of Major Companies and law firms and get the memos on those deals so theyve got the upper hand. This has been going on for some time. The administration, like administrations before it, has been trying to dealith this through quiet diplomacy. The chinese deny, deny and take offense. But and say well, wheres the proof. Kevin ndia, the ceo of a company, which is a relatively small, 00 million revenue Cyber Security firm said look, were going to show you some proof. They showed proof that these hackers, theyre not just out of china. They are part of the chinese military. They are part of the Peoples Liberation army. A unit in shanghai that has systematically attacked over 147 fortune 500 companies and stolen trade secrets and are undermining our economy. Undermining our economy. The estimates are and they are i should stress, these are only estimates. Were talking about intellectual property theft by china, princilly by china costing the United States 300 billion a year. 1. 2 million jobs estimated to be lost as a result of those Cyber Attacks on the United States and our intellectual property, whether it be in the Public Sector or private. How can this be toerated i mean, china is basically building their economy. Not solely but largely on copycatting. They take our technology and you dont necessarily see the results of the copycat right away. It takes some time. But thats part of the culture and part of th economic culture. Part of the reay the economic game plan there is toteal technology, to steal trade secrets and to use that to build their industry. By the way, the pentagon since then has come out with a report saying theyre stealing our National Security secrets. Our big weapons designs to build their military. Its not just an economic issue. Its a National Security issue. And why, again first let me ask you this. Mandia, is he okay in this . Have there been repercussions, reprisals by the chinese . What is his status right now . Its inteeesting, the chinese unlike a lot of hackers from other countries, tstify r they have a modus operandi or rules of theroad. They typically dont destroy anything. Its not as obvious as that. They have tried to hack into the Computer System at mandiant. One investor worries about, down the line, not right now but a reputation al attack on this small company. They try to undermine the credibility oo the company. Kevin mandia told me, he knew when he decided to release this report and take on the second biggest economy in the world that wed had a gigantic target on our backs. I knew that. He believed, that because companies are getting so tired of this going on, the chinese wont do anything to stop it, wont engage in serious dialog with the u. S. , he said its time to do this. Ideed it is time. Thank goodness tha he and others and our government are doing something. Obously a great deal me need to be done. Well take up that part of the story, nina, if you come back in the next few days. Id love to. Important nce, ill see you tomorrow, thank you. Why . Political leader grab power that power turnsany into try rants. They raise taxes to pay for war. And increase regulation