The volunteer movement, who is helping, i dont know, in the occupied territories, this is an underground insurgent movement, it continues, so to speak, to broadcast its values to invest in the present and this is actually fantastic because it shows us once again er that the inner struggle , the inner triumph, it is extremely important and if each of us will have this rod then i am sure that our victory will not only be a territorial one, that we will return our territories, but this will also be our internal victory, cleansing from that layering of soviet dust imposed by imperial stamps, and we will still be able to find ourselves, our true selves , our true selves, and our true victory will be this strong ukraine that will already be afraid to attack and here are such examples from history they inspire me today not to be afraid to go forward thank you very much for your story thank you for your service and defense of ukraine take care of yourself, have a good day to your brothers and sisters god is with you and ukraine is with you thank you marina mirzoya was with us and an old woman soldier of the third separate assault brigade of the armed forces of ukraine to investigate the opa un movement and now we talked about Operation West a literally in a few minutes , we will join the guests and we will talk a little about Operation West, but the main thing is that the enemy continues to carry out the same policy of deportation in the occupied territories of ukraine, why and what its main goal be with us lets come back pain can be an obstacle walking stairs not with my knees from knee pain try dolgit cream pain reliever reduces swelling and improves joint mobility you can also walk the only yellow cream for joint pain listen to your fm galicia italyukraine on megogo at the legendary san siro stadium, our gathering in a bright game, watch the super match of the euro 2024 selection on september 12 at 9 45 p. M. On megogo, the head is from overload in the headache, there are various reasons, but there is a solution combispasm and the head normally overcomes skillfully pain and spasm combispasm during sports, the body loses water and electrolytes as a sports doctor i recommend reo , i became dehydrated, i recover from reoreo water for special medical purposes vasyl stus is always relevant for everyone his Akhtem Seytablaev the one who called you the one who chose you forever age to him from an early age you confessed to him the lord himself your year yelyzaveta zharikova compete exhausted life exhausted compete the past babich with the gate and hand over and let Yaryna Chornoguz look at me in the mirror in the dark and without a purpose you are really here you are really here you are definitely not here this is not here where are you and where are you and where are you Taras Kompanichenko god forbid fury god forbid laskin let us break the chain mutations and spread them exclusively on the air programs, vasyl zimis big broadcast, viewers of the espresso tv channel will be the first to learn the name of the 2023 vasyl stus prize laureate , espresso will be on thursday, september 14 at 7 15 p. M. , the war is going on, and not only for territories, it is also a war for minds , russia is throwing millions of naftodors to transform of ukrainians in little Russia Ukraine the state of the highway, analysis and analysis of information about ukraine by russian propagandists, specific facts and methods by which hostile propaganda turns people into obedient zombies , connections, planning to vote , residents of the ldr, lets counter the information attacks of the russians in the project of the chronicle of the information war with olga leni tuesday, thursday, friday at 5 00 p. M. 10 on the espresso tv channel, let s return to the conversation this is a worldview program reminds me my name is vasyl zima today we are talking about operation zahid how was it actually starting in september if to talk about the decision of the ussr government, which has been implemented since october 1947, and how it is now when the russians continue to deport the local population from the temporarily occupied territories of ukraine, starting a new bloody war against our country, times change, the enemy is the same , why does he do it, how to resist it vasyl pavlov with us is the head of the expert group on internal communications of the directorate of information policy in the field of defense and Strategic Communications of the ministry of defense of Ukraine Military historian mr. Vasylyu greetings good afternoon after all, i want to give you the first task of the operation, which was decided to start by the decision of the cabinet of ministers of the ussr on september 10 , 1947, and the main goal, in your opinion , is this practice of deportation, and how much did it change the population of the western part of ukraine or did it achieve the enemy then, what was his goal, please, if we are talking about the main action of the west, then everything is quite simple here, the main goal was to deprive the Ukrainian Insurgent Army of its base of resistance, that is, the local population that was in the territory of western ukraine, which lived there permanently, it mainly supported the struggle of the Ukrainian Insurgent Army, any Resistance Movement is absolutely impossible without the support of the local population, both moral and purely material, therefore, the event was held, it was aimed primarily at that to deprive the Ukrainian Insurgent Army of this support and well, in principle, we can talk about the fact that the main goal of this action was fulfilled , because already after a year, in fact, after a year , the Ukrainian Insurgent Army refuses from the organizational forms of the Resistance Movement and goes directly to the underground struggle, in fact, the main goal is to destroy the whole units, to destroy the organism that acts against the soviet government, it was achieved, we can also say that the population of western ukraine has partially changed we we cannot say that this change somehow radically changed his preferences, his views, his any activity, but this change was quite noticeable, because it was mainly people or from in Eastern Ukraine or in those places where soviet military units were stationed. Families of servicemen appeared there directly and began to create such closed communities, if we would now say closed communities that lived their own lives and did not cooperate in any way with the local population. Well, if we talk about before that, there was also the vistula operation. Well, and also participation in the resettlement of ukrainians from the territory of the holmshchyna by the podlyaschyka of the other others. The poles and the czechs also took part. Well, of course, the soviet army. And please tell me, in general, the idea was to change the character of the people , to cleanse them. What is the point . Does this indicate that the russians did not have other influences to work with the population or that they and the ukrainians could not do otherwise to work with the understanding that their ideas, their ideology, it will not be accepted , lets say it is at least in this part of ukraine and leaves in this well, and then the second question is the fate of the ukrainians who were resettled. Did russia manage to digest them even then . Well, i wouldnt would single out the ukrainians as some kind of community, against which the soviet repressive machine was powerless, such situations existed at that time, in fact, in all the newly annexed territories, such a situation existed in the current baltic countries, in lithuania, in estonia, in latvia , the simple question was the number of the population ee involved in the Resistance Movement in the number of the population that was ready to offer active resistance to the soviet occupation authorities and but if we talk about the fate of ukrainians who were expelled from this territory , they were actually scattered throughout territories of ukraine, they i know that there are whole enclaves of immigrants there in the kherson region, there were enclaves of immigrants from luhansk in the Donetsk Region, and in fact, to some extent, it worked on the contrary, uh, ukrainian consciousness , ukrainian culture was brought to those regions, the territorial units of the ukrainian ssr at that moment, lets say so the soviet authorities considered themselves to be some kind of Authority Without any objections and believed that the soviet authority was established here forever and from the beginning but these people started to um lets say so bring political consciousness as much as Ukrainian National identity and now we can talk about the fact that in many areas of the east of ukraine, in many areas of the south of ukraine, ukrainian culture has been preserved just as possible thanks to those immigrants who appeared in these regions as a result of the lets event event we will now move on to todays time, the enemy continues to deport the local population, abduct children, and send whole families to different regions of the Russian Federation, well, in fact , starting from the coast of the Pacific Ocean there of the sea of japan and ending with the territories of the northern north and also there siberia well, here it is closer to the european part of the part of the Russian Federation, what is the goal of the enemy now, is he trying to fill in some or fill some gaps in his population in those or other territories, that this is some kind of mechanical action, because we have always done it, and now we have to do it, or is it aimed at weakening the Resistance Movement in the territories temporarily, what is the purpose of carrying out, well, in fact, a largescale, largescale deportation the population, please, you know. I wouldnt like to speak for the enemy. What does he think, what is he planning . Ill try to analyze it. Well, as a historian, as a person who, lets say, was interested in similar processes, processes of changing consciousness in the occupied territories, here we can talk. About the fact that the russians are solving several problems at the same time, firstly, they want to deprive the occupied territories of a population that is capable of resisting it, and secondly, having a population that, in their opinion, is very close to, lets say, native russians, whom they subconsciously continue there to be considered brothers or a brotherly population aa they are trying to use them to populate the territory that they have the most from the demographic crisis of the 90s zero and now this demographic crisis is being repeated in them again, i think that it is precisely the combination of these factors that, on the one hand, free the occupied territories territories from the population that lived there for a very long time and are replacing it with another population this is one side, and the other situation is that empty territories that were once mastered during soviet times now they are trying to reassimilate them again at the expense of ukrainians or former ukrainian citizens whom they resettle on this territory, you know, it is important to understand thats how well , not to win, how to break this uh, hostile, hostile character well, russia has been our enemy for centuries, ill be back soon there will be a millennium there in 1169, im not mistaken. The first time bogolyubsky came to kyiv, thats already. Well, soon it will be a thousand years since they rushed here, and it must be said that their ee actions, as empires, they were successful in a certain period of time already. They resettled already today i spoke with the previous guests not only about ukrainians and crimean tatars, and again you talked about the baltic countries, uh, chechens, there are different peoples of the caucasus, this is constantly happening, this is resettlement here and there. And what is there to oppose to this, again, well, besides that as long as russia exists, you are so afraid anyway, i dont know now whether it will be completely destroyed or not. But as long as it exists, it will still be engaged in this. What is the most important countermeasure to this . Power of russia to break and return the ukrainians home is the first and the second of which we will now return the ukrainians home, how much work will be done on them and on their change of their thinking, worldview, ideology, it is possible , how much will the Russian Federation work with them now, or just resettled them and no one especially works with them in i think there are several planes here. I will start with the second question. There are several planes of this phenomenon. It is possible, indeed, there are regions where ukrainians simply transplant with them, no one will work, no one will Pay Attention to anonymous people, there will simply be an extra labor or demographic resource and they will use it in the same way, but the russians can see it, not only will we say so in military affairs, but in the field of science, they are studying, they will change the policy, and i i think that the work with resettled ukrainians will gradually intensify, we can see this on the example of ukrainian children who are abducted or ukrainian children who are in full territories , it is on them that all the power of the russian of the Propaganda Machine from one side, from the other side, all the power of russia is directed. Well, lets call it an educational or ideological machine, and they are trying to reformat these very people. I think that they will work in the same way with the population that, er, will be taken out of ukrainian lands, which er, will appear in, lets say, empty russian territories, they will gradually be instilled with a new identity or will try to awaken, lets say , the old identity in some of them, on what putin always relies on, and he also relies on him there approach of a person to a lost identity, a unified historical society, a New Historical society, a united soviet nation, i think that this appeal to nostalgic factors, an appeal to the former residence in a unified state , will be directed, lets say, to that part of the population, well, categories, lets say, 45 plus aa with they will work with it using some nostalgic feelings, and they will work with the youth already using those ideological mechanisms that operate there in russia , well, relatively speaking, since 2010, this is the movement there the young army and various patriotic events there are the activities of the Russian Military historical society. That is, there is a lot of forum of influence on the consciousness, what to do with it, well, in fact, we are entering what is now so fashionable to call cognitive deoccupation or, er, work with mentality, that is, when these people will return to ukraine or when we liberate the occupied territories with these people, it will also be necessary to conduct military stabilization measures in the liberated territories. I think that should be the same carried out stabilization measures in the field of consciousness, in information policy, in cultural policy, and all this will have to be paid a lot of attention, because the russians work with their propaganda, it must be recognized that it is very powerful, yes, it may look somehow terrible, it looks unpleasant for us, but it works and the russians do it will be used constantly, you know this prokhanov, there is a man who wanted to burn himself in a tank on khreshchatyk well, but he did not get into the tank, in principle, the russian tanks on khreshchatyk were only burned prokhanov was not there this just now i will quote him so that we can roughly understand the level of their propaganda , this is the level of myth making that certain ideologues of this russian world resort to , so i am quoting. Under his patronage were deer and moose, river trout and pike and sky swallows and cranes. There would be no such thing as putin, there could be another god, and where are they . Where are they dragging ukrainians . We know by now that this ongoing war has seen how dangerous they can be for ukraine. Even living in ukraine and not understanding this, they unwittingly became traitors, they, after receiving signals from enemy agents, actually continued with him , well, they began to cooperate with them, many accepted the approach of the russian guys normally so that the population points thinking that it is normal , they have a pimple, that is, it worked even at a distance through television, which , unfortunately, was also infected by russian standards through show business through bloggers of various kinds, well, that is, it is not even intrusive, i am not talking about how it is it works. If it is imposed. And you know, i have an interesting question now. Now the Ukrainian Army is already vacating the territory that was captured 10 years ago. Well, in particular, if we are talking about the experimental and there are still a number of settlements, we are either there or near them. And now im talking about it the population that we will be about this territory that we are freeing together with people who have actually been under russia for 10 years, so i also believe that the Ukrainian Army will reach the crimea here , how serious a problem will it be, what part of the people may be ideologically aa ideologically loyal to the russian russian world yes to the socalled because i think that part of the people well, i have such acquaintances in the crimea there, even if the government changes , they will return their passports and live as they have been living. The main thing is that their pensions are paid there or salary, absolutely, but these people who are devoted to this russian world , how hard is it to change their worldview, their mentality . People who really consciously support this position are consciously in the paradigm of the russian world. Approximately 50 , maybe 60 this will be a population that really is, well , lets say so simple in quotes, a peaceful population that really doesnt care about which power to live, but this just say so and it will be perhaps the biggest challenge is that from this population it is necessary to extract as many people as possible who can be swayed to the side of ukraine. That will support that part of the population, it will also be approximately within the limits of 1020 , who will consciously support ukraine, who simply stayed in the occupied territory because they could not leave just as the population will have to make a bet because these people have lived in these territories for 10 years or more. They know their neighbors. They know the people with whom they have been close so that they know what, lets say, points you can influence, something, what you can talk to them about well, if you dont make them loyal to ukraine, then make them loyal , because the main issue in the liberated territories will not be a question of loyalty, it will be a question of loyalty. The loyalty of the territory is not interesting, there is an interesting loyalty that will be manifested in any form, whether it will be nonparticipation in the resistance in russia or it will be a formal vote in the elections , the main thing is that there should not be an active phase of resistance. Will come to liberate the territory no well, it is necessary to have, shall we say, a more or less balanced policy on these territories, the policy of deoccupation, because at the same time it will be necessary to act in the field of education, in the field of culture , in the world of economics and in the world of ecology, even that is, in all these elements, there must be e is it is necessary to have a clear position, it is necessary to understand who we are using. And who will be, lets say, conditionally rejected outside the ukrainian world, and we need to understand what to do with them, and then actually the body and the algorithm with which we need to work will be clear. Vision, we will have a rather serious control from our western partners regarding the observance of democratic norms , regarding the observance of cultural norms, regarding the observance of tolerant norms, and you cannot back down, although you know when it is mentioned in history how did they work with the population of germany after the second world war, well, nazism was burnt out, i have fewer people, someone is sure of course not, but quite harshly i think that the idea of the russian world is no less, if not more toxic and murderous than the idea of german nazism , which is actually embodied by hitler , so here of course, it must be culturally and loyally. But i think that this infection must be killed harshly. I am not talking about the destruction of people, of course, but it is necessary to kill something in us, literally. I will ask you very briefly, did the ukrainians really understand and see in this war that language is important, literature is important, or russians are burning books everywhere here in ukrainian libraries, which bring in their culture, perhaps, and perhaps because some attention was not paid to this earlier in the 30s of our independence well, it is possible that somewhere the enemy was successful, he showed that everything is important , history, culture, literature in our country, by the way , even history was not necessarily a subject. Unfortunately, it is possible. This will change our understanding and attitude to this, please in short, i think that, in fact, we can see that a Critical Mass of ukrainians have understood that cultural and historical factors are extremely important in the modern war, and in fact we use them as well as our enemy. I think that simply over time they will all occupy the appropriate a place in state policy i thank you very much, mr. Vasyl , for taking part. Thank you for your comments , experts vasyl pavlov, head of the expert group on internal communications , directorate of information policy in the field of of defense and Strategic Communications of the ministry of defense of ukraine was in touch with us. Military historian, you know that before this war, before the fullscale war, i mean not before the one that started back in 14th year, but before this fullscale war. I have always discussed with friends and acquaintances, and this was some kind of indorussian assessment of russia. If there is such a poor, stupid person, well, there is such a thing , we will not be, as they say, a sin, and i always said, you know this empire. Well, there was vlad , a kingdom from the first principality, then a kingdom then the empire, then the soviet union and so on, but well, in principle, it was from the first conquests of the moscow kingdom there, novgorod , tver, and then there and kazan, then siberia, it was always an empire in its own way until the 18th century, when it officially became an empire under peter the great romanov, but by its very nature it was always an empire that lived at the expense of new territories, i always said, you know , you are so frivolous, no one asked why, in fact, during the time of ivan the terrible, even vasili the third was still there and russia as an empire, in fact, it exists, it has experienced many upheavals, the troubled times, the capture of the french by the poles, it has survived all of them and continues to live. The empire and now continues to live. The empire is fighting with us, they say they have never thought about why it is like that, and because it always destroys what it has to destroy. It always i am planting my history , my language, my religion, although it is conventionally a religion for them, and in order to defeat this empire, which will always crawl into all cracks and destroy. And you have to be stronger than them, and language, literature, culture history is all important without this monster. Well, of course, weapons and our army that fights with him cannot defeat this uh, this poison must be destroyed, but you must have in yourself this antidote to the ukrainian spirit that manifests itself even now on the battlefield and has always manifested in our history. Thank you for being with us, glorify this spirit in yourself, the ukrainian spirit , strengthen it, that it was possible to drive out what came to us from the northeast. I wish you a good day. We will meet at 18 10 on the great air. Now continue watching espresso and to be with us greetings dear tv viewers, it is time to learn about the most important thing at the moment, and i will start with such an alarming situation in the temporarily occupied crimea, local residents on social networks report powerful explosions in the krasnoperekop district, as well as in sevastopol, users claim that immediately after this, the russian occupiers lifted into the sky military helicopters. The authorities there do not comment on the situation. The training was not reported in advance. The armed forces of ukraine struck the russian base. Drones in Donetsk Region targeted affected, reported in the center of strategic