Transcripts For DW Conflict Zone 20190629

Administration my guest this week here in the capital q c now is bloodied me a chair but tyree Vice President of the Outgoing Democratic Party and a former Justice Minister with moldova now a by word for corruption you see ashamed of these parties record in the government. Which i will tell you welcome to conflict zone. And place to me here its question your party lost the battle to hold on to power but you deserved to lose in the way didnt you because democracy was increasingly undermined under your watch and there was massive corruption which you did very little about so you deserved to go didnt you really depends how to look at that and i would disagree with something related to the corruption spot yes indeed i can say that we have lots of critics relay. Into democracy it insincere republic of moldova the Democratic Partys undertook while undertaking the mandate in the governance in 2016 a lot in social and economical performances being for example the seller is increased in the public area by 70 percent there are a salary still in the pensions of the other year last year you were sure in the world that the Democratic Party was implementing european standards at home thats what you said in september yes here europe was telling a completely different story about you the European Parliament condemned what it called an increasing backsliding on core values related to democratic standards so much for your european standards and also added that moldova was trapped by oligarchic interests with economic and political power in the hands of a small group of people exerting their influence on parliament the government Political Parties state of ministration police and judiciary in other words your assurances about european standards were worthless well there i would disagree with that because in my opinion this was a political statement and we can have different opinions leaders political statement because it has been done by a Political Group it was based on findings that they discovered when they came here many of the talks that theyve been having a list again did you see did he show any on evaluation or some as some reports regarding to that because they havent seen and everything that could be measured has been measured with the significant progresses bads thats that they want the view of the e. U. The council of europe Freedom House the un the Us State Department Amnesty International oh i see Bertelsmann Foundation there was remarkable unanimity about the state of democracy and corruption in this country from there wasnt but let me please explain otherwise if you want to hear me because while i would. Vi those to me shes i would divide the corruption and i would divide the democracy right because while talking about corruption since 2016 they were the most progress is that ever have been done in republic of all the way in fighting corruption was the 1st cases where ministers the Prime Ministers and other very high officials have been prosecuted the u. S. Court is elektra of justice you know if selective just while one were talking about the ministers that were in our government i wouldnt say that it was selective because selective means then when you are prosecuting all everyone except your wants but it wasnt the case and it also said you undermined the processes the judicial processes thats also the view of the United States well it was some new shoes well but this is not related more than some issues is it still with no i again there are difficulties in judicial system of course there are but while talking to corruption this was the most fighting period in republic of moldova thats why according to the Public Perception corruption was the 1st one ranked problem in 2016 and it became the 5th one in 2019 due to the efforts that have been put fighting that in march washingtons human rights report effectively highlight it with all the other International Organizations have been saying they highlighted torture in your prisons arrest and detention by the authorities restrictions on freedom of the media and serious attacks on people who stood in the way of your party especially lawyers as one un special rapporteur reported lawyers faced politically motivated criminal charges or were threatened each time they defended people with opinions dissenting from the author or it is you were just dismissed and you signed off on this you were quite happy that it happened that these lawyers should be 3. Well you know is very fashionable to start victimizing yourself under start doing politics while you have some criminal cases from yourself. Because our example to do with the charges that well you have this exactly this exactly cases youre referring to 2 cases one of them is related to one attorney a woman that has been committed a crime murder in 191999 the other one is another lawyer they were just referring to 2 cases that your case is referring to as you have a pattern the banana i know exactly the case is that there refereeing 2 and the other cases is case of lawyer reading co who has committed bribes and traffic of influence before starting being the lawyer of one of the people that pretending to be politician so basically were talking about 2 cases all of them committed crimes before starting coming into the public area we have a lot of Different Cases to go through mr why was the International Community so keen on seeing you go on june the 14th the United States basically said it was pleased to see you go the state Department Spokesman said the u. S. Welcomes the Democratic Partys announcement that its withdrawing from government in favor of Prime Minister prime Prime Minister maya soundly and the coalition formed by the democratically elected parliament the fact is washington couldnt wait to get rid of you could and more importantly it wasnt going to lift a finger to save you was it well no one should leave anything has to save any politicians or the us it was a Coalition Created that we accepted at the final stage and we transfer the powers of the governments it is good the people to have the comparison of how the car country can be governed by ones and by the others its good for us you will give up willingly you gave up the rules of National Pressure you even got the Constitutional Court to strip the president of his powers so that new elections could be called for. If were talking about that is going to have to see how the. Uncivil since the 7th of june and youll see that we caved to power in a peaceful manner and we give it willingly and we made these announcements for they said before transferring the power after trying to get the Constitutional Court to step in and call elections thats what you tried to do we didnt try to step in any Constitutional Court or stuff like that because on monday already which was the 3rd day of that announcement of the Constitutional Court will ready to the decision to transfer the power and then on tuesday which was the 4th day or we already announced that we are willing to stay to discuss how to transfer power peacefully who trustingly rulings from your Constitutional Court these days after you stuffed it with your own people who trusts the Constitutional Court here most of the people just because initial court doesnt trust only the ones who doesnt dont like the decisions of that you know report last year the bottles when foundations at the current Justice System including the general Prosecutors Office the Supreme Court the Supreme Judicial Council and the National Corruption center were largely subordinated to the oligarch vladimir look who just happens to be chairman of your Democratic Party although you tell me hes just a down hes Just Announced that hes really he Just Announced the hurt but thats not so great record you want Justice Minister and you are loud that kind of state calculation a play i think i think you i took the management of the minister of justice in 2015 and the end of the year and at that time already they were the statements that the state is captured by the way 2nd at that time already all the support of European Union in that area has been refused or suspended. I had the conditionalities to approve lots of the reforms in a very short time and id managed to do that in 2 years or even less and it was accepted and recognized now we we have a legislation in the judiciary which is like a piece of the art we have a class of a lot of things to implement to work on training the new judges which have been renewed we have almost 5045 percent of the judge the new ones which came into the system but still we need to train them we need to create uniform practices in that respect and it cannot be done through the night it will take time down was to stop this to coordinate shouldnt do the chairman of your party it was without burning has been foundation i would deserve a National Attention i would disagree to you to make the assessments and the conclusions based on only on the statements of the parties that were on their position at the time its not because theyre treating their own findings and its because today i International Organizations today saying the same thing today at 2 weeks time since the government has been transferred to the other parties i can say the judiciary is subordinated to the new government why very simple because it was sufficient the new Prime Minister to make some statements and of course have been changing their decisions immediately through the night if this is subordination then you have to accept that there subordinated to the new government as well they want to know you have heard that it depends how do you sense that the leaders are demanding a bt and of the judiciary it will be your thora to his lovely syria has been inforced by your policy of using corrupt practices business clan ties and intimidation this was reported because those movies are not set in stone the for what they got it rolling lets lets turn back the law to religious and discuss that and we think the stood lets lets discuss that i just stated that the new government. And the 2 decontrol of the judicial reign said its not so if they just made a statement but if they make the statement that you have to revise your decision and to decide like that and the court immediately is doing that what does it means if not subordination in your understanding in in more than 0 although you also watch and you watch mr chipper to politicize ation of the judiciary was an instrument which was often used against mr knox rivals that was the conclusion of the Bertelsmann Foundation i went from 271822800 thanks to your well the Economic Forum ranked moldova 100 and 32nd the other 137 countries as regards the independence of the judiciary are you proud of that record of course i mind no im not but i what they can say your standard what they can tell you is that when we took the judiciary i took the judiciary the trust of the people in the jury sure was 7 percent and when i left my position of the ministry of justice was 25 percent yes this is not sufficient but in 2 years time to increase is 3 times its something but it will turn the seat on little nancy hearty chairman knows who they gave their only stronger thats what they said and thats wrong they misunderstood they just got it wrong they made up the story is that right is this what youre saying no im not saying that im just saying that i think its somewhere saying that we had a very poor situation which is not very fantastic today but it has registered a very good improvements in that respect you you deny any wrongdoing by the merits and im not im not saying that its not correct just to state the wrong doings but it is correct to see how the developments and evolution of all of that what about mr clarke look you are probably gantry and you can do certain 360 in that he was made the most hated man in the country because people need to find somebody to blame thats it hes blameless now we know one is angel in the liver. Iran the new governments in even the World Governments even democratic parties the members were not the angels as no one is angel well i mean i seriously think we are committing mistake was he a crook is he a crook of course its not a crook well of course its not a crook its a person that has ensured a good and efficient governance from the point of view of the social infrastructure problems yes maybe the party didnt focus too much on democracy and maybe the party didnt focus too much on implementing some reforms in like judiciary for example but what hes done improving the life of the people its done a lot and even more than many other governments putting together for the last previous 20 years when the new government came in your party chief that was the plan if lead the country along with a Business Partner illand saw he was looking perhaps for friends outside but. He didnt find any duty to find any friends again i would disagree with his statement but because he left the country only after transferring peacefully the governance studio to the opposition ordered out of the settlement i dont know lets ask him im not together said that neither the interior ministry nor the border have a record of him leaving the main is the the new minister of internal affairs made 3 different statements in just one week and all of them conflict in between each other so i would i wouldnt pay too much price to the statements that he made i understand that hes a new minister but hes committing too much mistaken and is misleading the Public Opinion in that respect probably isnt coming back you see its over everyones had enough of your part lets ask him lets ask him because he is your understanding hes coming around my understanding is that hes coming back as long or when the security arrangements will be done including kurian although you refused for a week to give up your offices didnt you say we officials you appointed refused to obey the new Prime Ministers we on the 3rd day we already announced 30 accounting seems 8 of june were already announced that we are willing to have discussions to transfer the governess so i would disagree for a runner you put your supporters into the square and there could have been massive violence has the chance for should be peaceful and not should be should be peaceful but it might not be and it was peaceful and try to get into the offices you wouldnt i mean we know they didnt try even to get into the office some of them did now none of them he said none of them didnt try to get into the offices they just made some declarations yes different dates could probably tip a one week staying here in those very hard times to turn to stand the situation no one tried and we made all the announcements and invitations to them to Start Talking and they said. Its almost over your time is over what means the governess is over it was over on 8 of june this year its over the new government has promised theyll be no revenge im sure you really are already there they already know youre relieved to hear that men n o because this is helping them with their inquiries im sorry previous corruption is because they harassments public pressure and revenge already is there many of the people already are dismissed the professional people which has no links with the parties have been already dismissed from their positions but if you are there already are others as europe say in the usa it was the only served to use of people that file sharing on different reforms and different projects to manage and funding by our Development Partners their professional snell dr nyce like that very thing you did dont theyre going to put a spotlight is everything to me lets put on the spotlight its going to be rather uncomfortable for us and no its not at all uncomfortable because i see many of the critics that have been done there already coming to an out opinion because they they criticize not knowing or not going into the details of different projects or and reforms but well see what they will do and its better to judge about them and us in comparison and we will see when how the salaries will rise well see how the Infrastructure Projects will go on how the collections of the budget will be done and then we will see who is less corrupted and who is better managing and governing the country the challenge for this government is to dismantle your system of control over the courts and the criminal investigation body he says and which you controlled basically and which were loyal to your Party Chairman from 26 dean. Transparency International Reported your main aim was to concentrate your partys power within the executive criminal investigation bodies and courts it said are used by this party as instruments to intimidate and make loyal political rivals both at central and local level. So this practice is obvious particularly in relation to local councillors and mayors its said that up blackmailed and compelled to join the ruling party that was you im very happy that you are making reference to this specific report because usually takes time to to prepare a report and then to make it public and so as it is dated 2016 it means exactly that there are all the data is collected in the previous periods so i will in that case i just will restate that we took the governance in 2016 only and of course we recognize it was a loss of the problem and this is 27 serious report says that only 17 report not 20 years you mentioned 16 i said from 2016 they said your main aim was this was a report 2 years ago when you were already in the Justice Department and here lets come to the flash mailing in compelling mayors and local councils to join the ruling party again your plan no no fishel claims in that respect have been done or or submitted by anyone is just its oppositions segment and speculations nothing has been confirmed in time do you think do you think the rest of the world is really that stupid no not a coworker whats going on dont know what was happened just you were in just one thing just in war the turn the stand the situations better to have a more indepth look at the everything and having at least while writing this reports at least 2 opinions at least well we have already quoted from the Us State Department from the European Parliament from trance. Transparency international from the west sea. One of the things that came into your area of control was the prisons. Why did you allow a system of prison hierarchy of convict hierarchy why did you why did the guards collude with the prisoners to control the system inside the prison why well actually this is a legacy which we are trying to fight and to fix and if you do much when you are the way to do a lot of things to change early yes we did a lot to improve the conditions in imprisonments and now we have only 2 prisons that are in the very worst conditions the other ones are placed we succeeded to repair and not to be the you know in the poorest conditions that could be 1st the 2nd we succeeded to create a system that cares the people in the terms of the health the medicine treatments and which is absolutely different that it really is a council of europe reported last year that one jail soroka prison no doctor had visited in over a year this was last year no doctor had been there in over a year they had 4 medical orders orderless for 800 people you think thats satisfactory no of course its not so subtle you know you watch that nair fortunate already not on my watch unless this is a report last year 28 my law student you know and stuff i wasnt a minister of justice not in 2017 yes we were but they already admitted that time has been transferred to a non political person and a technocrat since 201717 generally in the position of the minister of justice have been appointed only technocrats the people with very reliable and very trustful in a Public Society an International Community one of them is an expert to nothing than a transition and one of the International Community you read the reports you see i dont trust anything thats been there i mean she is a leader in your party its been more than issue lets talk lets. Talking about state corrections lets talk about economical performance and social performances and lets talk about those reports because we focused on those area and there are huge progresses in that respect of course the most criticized areas for initially was a serious economists in jail who were living in conditions which were said to be bordering on the luck shuras they had the van beds kitchenettes fridges aquariums carpets on the floor widescreen television so somebody in your economy was doing well it wasnt necessarily the poorest section but these people in jail you think that providing a sort of club for senior convicts and criminals theyre not going to as part of a military Justice System and as you said earlier last year european up to european standards when you think in europe you high in prisons like this net not at all and lets go to the prisons to see him to understand that i as a told you it is a poor situation in the prisons but it is much better than it was 3 years ago and while talking about the people staying there is a report last year by the council yes but lets see the report 3 years ago and you will see a more poor situation than the last year report and year by year the reports are became better and better nothing can be change on the reports was a good number of the rig none of them of time when you were incumbent now is why the point i made at the beginning is you deserve to be a good report that includes reports are in the economical area in the social area. And none of the questions have been received so far from the area i understand it more pleasant things to discuss everything that could be criticised and we agree with you that those are the areas that have been performed poorly and could be better could be done better and theyre doing better but not in there with the speed that we would like it to do because its not easy to do it is very complicated to do a lot of fear for have been put in that respect lots of the investments have been public investments have been put into that area as well but still we have a lot of things to do until everything probably not perfect that acceptable and youre going to work with this new government even though youve already said its illegal you consider the coalition to be illegal we said that it was illegal even at the moment when we transferred the governess but we said we work with it but were going to work whether we said yes because we said at that time you have to fix one deadlock constitutional one. And it has been fixed and immediately as they goes to Chanelle Court has reversed some of his decisions we said ok now we can enter into the parliament now we can manage position real opposition and constructive all right thank you michel akari thanks very much for being here thank you. Thank. You. I go to robotics to. Keep learning merged reality wait a 2nd we want the whole picture out facts instead of make ideas shift deliver us. From a measured reality to cryptocurrency to your top picks for live in an ever changing Digital World lets talk they do that as a simple. Shift. On t. W. You. Need to know that 77 percent obama are younger than thanks a lot. And you know what on this 77 percent we talk about the issues. In this edition South African historian phenomenon guy mickey said she compost a comic style history book to help children understand and identify with their african roots the 77 percent in 30 minutes on t w. What secrets lie behind these movements. Find out in an immersive experience and explore a fascinating Cultural Heritage sites. D. W. World heritage 31615 s mount. I am. Diabetic. Its been 50 years since the moon landing. She was the 1st man to walk on the moon. Or wherever. As a small boy she dreamed of the stars. As a pilot she flew anything no matter how dangerous me church or go to the polls. As an astronaut he took part in the greatest adventure in history. A legend was simply a human being. Was Neil Armstrong starts july 20th on t. W. This is news live from berlin deals instead of tariffs at the g. 20 summit u. S. President donald trump in his chinese counterpart xi jinping agree on a truce in their countrys trade which will wrap up the summit for you in osaka japan and the. Italian authorities arrest the skipper of a ship carrying my dog