Transcripts For CSPAN3 Secrets Of The Underground Railroad 20160321

Next on American History tv, don papson discusses his book secret lives of the underground railroad in new york city Sydney Howard gay, Louis Napoleon and the record of fugitives. The record of fugitives was a previously unpublished text from the 1850s. Gay revealed his close collaboration with Louis Napoleon, a free black man who helped many slaves returned to freedom. The Greenwich Village Historic Society posted this hourlong program. I am director of programs at the Greenwich Village Historic Society, which is a Nonprofit Foundation founded in 1980 to preserve and protect this cultural history that we have and what i think is the best neighborhood and the whole world, but im slightly prejudiced. What can i do . Said something about midtown, but i did not really hear him. Anyway, i look around and i see some people who are members, even trustees, thank you. I just want to say thank you and publicly salute you for all of your support, because as a nonprofit we cannot do it without you. For those of you who are not members, i dont know what youre waiting for. Enjoyn go online and at any time. Ght isogram to guar celebrating black history. Theid a Previous Program on area known as little africa, and tonight we are going to present an author whose book is about the underground railroad. Did you know there were stops in Greenwich Village . What does it not have . Let me take him a little cheat sheet and i want to introduce you all to our speaker tonight, don papson. Of secretuthor lives of the underground in new york city. He is founder of the underground railroad museum. If you have never been there, it is beautiful. He is an independent scholar and member of the american historian society. Will his talk tonight, he take a few questions and his book will be available for purchase in signing at the back of the room. We have a special guest with us tonight, and i want to bring them up to the stage right now. [applause] otis, you are stronger than you look. You are something else. Come over here and lets make sure the microphone is good for you. We may have to move dons noted that. Are we testing, 1, 2, 3 . Can you hear me . Ok. Island,rn on staten right next door to the gay house. And about 50 years ago, my mother sold my grandfathers papers to the butler library, where two people eventually found them. Who publishedoner a book and the other was, don papson. I have been reading his book passionately. Audience, is my great, great granddaughter who was named after my greatgrandmother, elizabeth who was married to Sydney Howard gay. I heard all a lot about him when i was young, and i was so happy to have don write this book. Please, don come up and tell people more about all of this. [applause] [laughter] mr. Papson thank you. One of the best things that is happened over the last years otis and her cousin. I only wish i had known them while i was working on the book. Fors so engrossed looking her greatgrandfathers papers i colombia, that i did not get out of the library. What happened was, when eric foner came out with his book a month before hours, there was an article in the New York Times and never some comments posted online, and her cousin made one of those comments, and i said, i not going to hesitate, im going to contact these ladies, so we have become best friends, and it is a wonderful experience because things that i have found in letters contain the stories that otis heard when she was growing up. We have had a wonderful time comparing, and im still in the research process, so some of the things i am going to share with you tonight are not in the book. I am going to give you an idea of the significance of the book. I cannot tell you everything that is in it. Today, every time i come to new york city, i do a little bit more research, and today i found something really wonderful, which will give you an idea of what herficance of greatgrandfather was doing with the underground railroad. That was sentter to the national antislavery standards, sydney was the editor of the newspaper for 14 years. 1845,an working there in in march 22, 1846, a man in dayton, alabama wrote a note to says, sirs your antislavery mandate has reached us. We have looked into it enough to know you are working very visibly about that which you know nothing about. Your zeal for humanity is misdirected. We say to you that other peoples rights rest, or if you would do right, do not steal our , and then he goes on to refer to a case that sydney wrote about, and now we have to go and research the standard to find which story the man is referring to. I found another item that i wished i had found when i was doing the research for the book, and this is really wonderful because it tells us of the significance of Louis Napoleon, who was Sydney Howard gays associate in the underground railroad. This is quite interesting, otisgreatgrandmother, a lisbeth was very involved with wasr women elizabeth very involved with other women and creating an antislavery fair. She and the other ladies insisted that some of the money that came in was going to go to sydneys Fugitive Fund. But the women who were in boston were not happy with this. They thought all of the money should go to boston, so there was quite a big issue over this women of new york city and the women of boston. Today, however, i found this in consequence of the new york city fair association, you will receive a check of the net proceeds of the held ofde at the fair december last, with three months interest thereon, also 16 of sales made most recently. It has been agreed that Louis Napoleon should receive 100 for his services and eight of fugitives during the present year, 1857. Of this some he has received 16. I has received wanted to share those things with you because i could possibly not remember. Set ofve a prepared remarks, but we are limited on time so i will do the best i can to include everything of significance that i want to share. D kind of put a little bit of panic and me on the phone, because he said i want you to put a Greenwich Village twist on your presentation, and i thought, oh my goodness, how will my going to do that because our book is about the city, new york city, not about Greenwich Village, and then i remembered that there was a letter that sydney wrote to his friend edmond quincy in boston after he and elizabeth were married, and he told him that they had rented and hems on 12 street, said they were living with the crack family, and that they were craig family, and that they were favorable to antislavery. Otis did a Little Research and she found out where the craigs lives was near the university, the problem with that is the woman who lives there was a widow, so i had to do a little more research to find her family, and then i found the 1846, there was a man named thomas craig who lived on 122 twelve st with his son william, and i suspected that was probably the family elizabeth and sydney had the rooms from. That does not really tell us about the underground railroad, because we do not have any werence that the gays involved with underground railroad on 12 street or if the craigs were. In secret lives, we have a little bit of a story that we did not fully research. If we had researched everything, we would have never published the book. At some point you have to say, ok, we are going to stop and get the book out. Whos a story of a woman escaped from richmond, virginia in 1855 in april. The story was in the newspaper post,through the evening and they said that the woman had been owned by someone who had hired her out and that the woman said, i want you to come see me, and the woman was on the way to someer, but there were free black people on the jamestown steamer and one of them induced or to stay on the steamship and to come all the way to new york city. Coloredtaken to a family on sullivan street. Sydney howard gay repeated the story that was in the evening post and the standard, but he added a few corrections. A man and named mr. Drum who was a second steward on the jamestown, visited gay in his office, and he said that the womans name was. And that she had a child with her, and he also said that when the captain, captain parish discovered. Have escaped, that he hired the same driver who had taken her to sullivan street, but he also went to see a deputy marshal, and so he took police with them. When with him. When they got to the house and a pair he tried to persuade her to go back to the ship and pay for her passage, the people in the building surrounded her and would not let her go. In order to get away, she leaped out of a window into the yard. Interesting very but who were the people that lived in the house . I did some research, with census records and city directories, and i found the number of People Living on 78 sullivan street. The man who owned the house was worth 4000 and his name was moses shepherd. He was a black man and he was a steward. There was a man living in the building whose name was john napoleon. I have seen the name many times, and i do not know his uis, if thereto lo were a relationship. I suspected a were related. He couldve been his son, i do not know. Say aw, i am going to Little Something about the jamestown because it was built in new york city in 1853. I found an article in a richmond newspaper, which gave the name, the last name of the man who escorted harriet off of the jamestown. Article in the daily dispatch in richmond, virginia, it says, the captain saw her go ashore, and the steamer came on to new york, and shortly after she was off, and they grow named negro named johnson was her. Gallantly escorting a pursuit was made, and the parties traced to a house on sullivan street. Ok, that is not give us his first name but i did find it was a man named Henry Johnson who lived on sullivan street at another address, so it could have been him. That is a little underground railroad twist. It of you havef heard that story before, but it is a wonderful story and it is yours. , i am going to talk now about the Unlikely Alliance of Sydney Howard gay and Louis Napoleon. Theirunlikely because backgrounds were totally different. This is the cover of our book. You see we have the subtitle, secret lives of Sydney Howard gay, Louis Napoleon and the record of fugitives, because Sydney Howard gay wrote the accounts of people who came through his office in 1855 and 1856. There are accounts of over 200 people. The last time a record was published of this significance was 140 years ago. Nobody had ever written about Sydney Howard gay or Louis Napoleon. We do not know what Louis Napoleon looks like. There are different accounts of him, so i have a fair skinned man and i have the silhouette of a dark skinned man, because he was described both ways. Hopper. Isaac he was an underground Railroad Agent in philadelphia, and he moved to new york city, and he was Sydney Howard gays underground railroad mentor, and in 1846, isaac hopper assisted Louis Napoleon in a case. It was a very important case, even though Louis Napoleon was not an educated man, he cannot read or write, had to sign his name with an x on legal documents, he knew the people to go to for help. So in 1846, stowed away on a oat, he went to isaac hopper and asked for help. Isaac opper said, i want you to smith, who was working the antislavery office with Sydney Howard gay. His name was george. He did not take the name kirk until after the case was over. Someone asked him why he took the name, and he said it was his fathers. Smith said they were going to see hopper, and hopper said you need to go see judge edmunds. Judge edmunds, you see what happens is, in those days, you could find a writ of habeas corpus legal procedure, and then the person would be hopefully declared a free person. That is what happened with george kirk. The judge declared he was free, but the captain of the b oat did not like that, so he went to the mayor of the city, and he had them rearrested. There was a chase, in Lower Manhattan to try to rearrest george kirk. Smith and an architect, william johnson, pretended like they were part of the mob, and they steered george into the antislavery building while gay was really in charge of this operation. By the time it was over, she was totally exhausted. There were a number of people involved, but he was in charge of the operation. How in the world are they going to get out of the building . They came up with the idea of putting them in a box. There was a Sugar Refinery on owned by dennis harrison. He sent over a box, and they had it george climb into the box, nail it shut and put a tag on it ley. Everend man that is thrilling to me, because that is in the champagne valley champlain valley. The police have been watching the building this whole time, suspicious,hem were and one of them said, open that box. They opened the box and found the georgian side, so george was put back in the Detention Center that was located where the civic center is today in the five points area. It was an ominous building. Anyway, edmonds declared he was free again, and he was in the Detention Center, and the abolitionist were concerned about how to get him out, so they went together and they had him go out the side door, because there was a mob waiting for him to come out of the main entrance. They got them out of sight during a side insurance and they took him off to boston where he learned to be a shoemaker. This is Oliver Johnson. I have him here because he was a congregationalist minister. Reverend manley was a minister. Was a congregationalist as well as in underground railroad engineer. This is a suspicion, we do not iow this for sure, but am suggesting it is possible Oliver Johnson suggested sending george kirk to the champlain valley. This is an image of the Detention Center. Ok, now i am going to talk a little bit about napoleon, because napoleon became well known to isaac hopper into his daughter Abigail Gibbons and her husband james gibbons. Abigail and james were both involved with underground Railroad Work. In our book we have records that moneyapoleon was given which they were involved with. What i want to share with you right now is the story of a woman and a man who were married in the gibbonshome in 1845. Her name was sarah and she was a fugitive from the slavery, and abigail wrote a wonderful letter which we have part of it in our book about how excited she was to be a free woman. ,ow wonderful the wedding was well, 10 years later, james received word that jacob, sarahs husband had the traitor and the slave catchers were after her had betrayed her, and the slave catchers were after her. She had the children taken to , new york. , i do not knowft if you a thing on this or not, yeah, this is lucy, im getting it everywhere except where i wanted to go, her brother william, he died at every young age. Abigail and her other two gibbons. And james the reason i am showing you this image is because lucy wrote a rachel, avel called story of the middle 19 century. Married name. Rachel stanwood is a thinly disguised bureaucracy of the underground Railroad Work of her parents, isaac hopper and Louis Napoleon, and this is where the confusion comes in about what he looks like, because in the book, skinned he was a light man employed by the antislavery office, and then later she says, he was a middleaged dark skinned man. We do not know. We do not have an image of him. We have not found one yet. It is hard to believe there is him because he lived until 1881. If we find an image, it will solve the mystery, but he had in underground railroad friend and they used to work with each other, and i think this is the most accurate description because he said he was cold, black african. He says he was as great a genius of the emperor as the emperor. In rachel stanwood, it is suggested that his name was hadleon louis, and he reversed words. If that is aw doe fabrication. I am going to talk about Sydney Howard gay. He onetime said that, my ancestry is the best part of me. He and his descendents are very proud of their new england ancestry. On his fathers side, he was descended from a plymouth colony. Was a mothers side, it massachusetts settler. Gay grew up in very different worlds. You see napoleon was born to a woman who was in slaved. He was born in 1800, and the year before that, new york passed a law saying that children born to in slaved women would have to become indentured servants. If it was a female child, until she was 25, and a male until he was 28. Napoleon was indentured to mrs. Miller who had a tobacco factory when he was 14 years old. When he was 23 years old, a philanthropist purchased his indenture for two under 50 and immediately sold it to for 50. S first wife he lost 200 on the deal in order to free this man. Napoleon said he immediately started rescuing people from slavery. Knew slaveryleon but Sydney Howard gay did not. He had to, he had to come to an understanding of the evil, which he did. Had a very sensitive constitution. He was ill quite frequently. His father wanted him to become a lawyer and take over his Legal Practice so he sent him to Harvard University when he was 15 years old, but he became very ill and he had to drop out. His father expected him to come back to harvard, but he refused, he wanted to be a businessman, so he borrowed money from his father, and he went to st. Louis missouri where he squandered the money. Who said,t a man lets go to st. Louis and begin a trading business between st. Louis and new orleans. They went down to new orleans. On the way down to new orleans, he observed, i think he was influenced by the slave owners who were on the voyage, because he wrote a letter to his mother which was a letter of apology for slavery. It is not what you would expect abolitionist. This letter is not in our book because i did not know about it until last year after i met otiscousin because she had inherited some letters she had never read. My wife and i went to massachusetts were i spoke at the old ship church, and bess 12 00nd we stayed up till looking at these letters and one of them was very powerful. Ss in the center, and my wife is on the right and the minister of the old ship church. I want to share you something from this letter. Sydni wrote to his mother and said morally and physically that the slaves were a better class of people and happier as free men frome the northeast. D andare better clothe more comfortable, have a less actual labor to perform and are well trusted by their masters. Boil, north asod i am by birth, by education, and by ceiling, to look upon the cause of these mathematics that are pursuing mad fanatics are pursuing, that may result in civil war, anarchy in the downfall of their country. This is pretty powerful, coming from someone who became one of the most significant agents of the underground railroad in the united states. 24 years old,ng, very naive, really does not understand what is going on. Saying these things do not help them get any business. He did not get one client in new orleans, so i guess the southerners did not trust him because he was a northerner, whether he said he was in favor of slavery or not. He had to back his father for his father for money to get back to massachusetts. ,e actually kept the receipt and that is in the collection at Columbia University, 60. It cost him 60 to get back to massachusetts from new orleans in the receipt is in the records. Illiterate, but he knew through his birth that slavery was not an equal system, but sydney had to come to that idea. He had to learn the truth. In 1844, sydney fell in love with elizabeth, and he courted her with some beautiful letters. Collaboratormy told me, you need to cut some of that because it is too much. He loved her so much, and the letters are just wonderful, so at any rate, he had to prove himself to her, because you see, elizabeth came to antislavery as part of her inheritance because her father, daniel neal was very involved in the underground Railroad Work and antislavery work. She had a grandfather who was a and he hadquaker freed some of the first people in the history of the united states, so antislavery was her birthright, and she had gone to london in 1840, her Parents Center there for a world conference on slavery. So what happens is Sydney Howard gay returns home and he is very depressed. He is depressed because he has failed himself, and he has filled his father. He had told the family, im going to make a confession in new orleans and it will benefit the whole family, but he came back upset. School, andeaching he kept notebooks, and the notebooks are at Columbia University of accounts of students he was teaching. He became very depressed, and he wrote to elizabeth and he explained the transformation he went through and wanted to share it with her. Home,ept into my shallow dissatisfied with the world and so nobody and went nowhere. Winter, 1839, a change came over me and i was removed from the temptation of the world, its vanities and i was led to thinking of the severe discipline and cultivation of which my mind was going that a corresponding change in views of my life regarding duty. Among other things, i was led to lead to think about abolition, which i before opposed, and now i announced myself to the astonishment of all of the family and everyone else who had known me for years, but had not known what had been going on within me for the next few months, i am an abolitionist. It is one thing for someone to adopt someone elses way of life, but when somebody looks within themselves and comes to their own realization of what they need to do, that is when it really sticks. Stopped havingr this commitment that he started having in 1839. Now, otis has reminded me, i this issay that i think the most powerful thing in the book for you, this transformation of your great great grandfather. He may have forgotten, but i have the email. At any rate, sydney had a difficult time persuading daniel neal to agree to elizabeth marrying him, but finally daniel neal did agree, and they had a ker wedding, although according to traditions, she had to leave the faith after marrying outside of the religion. Was sent by the Antislavery Society to new york. He had started writing antislavery articles for the newspaper and had joined the Antislavery Society, and he was proving himself so they invited him to new york city. He did not really like new york city, and so they were able to buy a house in staten island, and they really wanted to be more in the country. Earlier, otis and i have had wonderful conversations, and one story that we both have heard, that she heard and i found in my research, is the story about a time when elizabeth came to the national antislavery office and is sydney, who smoked a pipe, motion with his pipe and said, look under the table. Well, there was a table with a green cover over it, and elizabeth lifted up the cloth, and she saw two men and a woman huddled underneath the table, hiding. Years later, their daughter, and shered a servant asked the woman to tell her something about herself, and she said she had escaped from slavery, had been hidden under a table, and mary said, didnt have a green cloth on a . She said, yes. Mary hired the woman that her father had hidden years before. Those kinds of things, you cannot make up, you know . It is just so thrilling when you come across Something Like that. Heard, a story that otis that was given to the descendents and is at Columbia University as well. Mary wilcox also wrote something, and she said sydney something about his proslavery letters. New orleans brought face to face, existing conditions and doubt entered his mind. He was invited to make a visit to a plantation and was a little startled on giving being oaded pistol. He asked, if they were content, why was it necessary to arm themselves . An error, because this is from a short story sydney worked on. The incident really occurred in charleston, south carolina. I look at that again today, and yes, it was charleston, south carolina. Carolina,t to south but when he was ill, when very young to stay with relatives to recover, and it is possible where the germ of this idea of the story came from. Fromy was often exhausted putting out the standard on a weekly basis. He operated on a shoestring budget, never enough money. He never knew and what time of night or day more fugitives would arrive and how he would come up with the money to take care of them. His health was a constant worry for his wife. Unfortunately, there were other fortunately, there were other abolitionist in new york city. I want to say a little anecdote about otis. She recently celebrated her 92nd birthday. [laughter] [applause] came allmazed that i the way from new york to the party, and i said, it is not often i am invited to someones 92nd birthday party, and she said, it is not often that i have one. [laughter] ewish tappan, who operated another underground depot in new york city. We dont really know how he worked with him, but there are records of the people that he worked with, and they worked with a significant number of people. The problem is, gay had nothing good to say about tappan. He and his brother were founders of the american Antislavery Society. Tappans left that organization and started a rival organization. They did not like garrisons dislike of politics. He wasd not like how raising women in the movement so they could speak in public, and they did not like his anticlericalism. That means that garrison was very sensitive to the fact that many, many churches and clergymen supported slavery, so he wanted nothing to do with wereion, but the tappans very religious, presbyterians. I dont want to say at this point is Louis Napoleon was a free agent. What i want to say at this ouis napoleon was a free agent. He was able to work with both men. 1853 was a case in 19 when a prostitute was arrested for allegedly kidnapping a nineyearold black child. Tappan succeeded in having the girl returned to her father. Image sydneyn howard gay published in the is aard and it celebration of the return of james hamlet. He was a black man who had escaped from the south. He was working as a porter in new york city, and he was taken back to maryland. His wife and children knew nothing about this. After the first person the fugitive slave law was passed who was arrested under that law. Well, there was a rumor that his wife had died of a stroke, of shock, and the black folks in new york city had a big meeting, and they started to say, well, is it really true . Is she really dead . Fromere anybody here williamsburg who could tell us . It turns out she really had not died. Sydney haded printed something from another newspaper that said she had died, but she really not. 800 in order to purchase james hamlet and he was brought back to new york city. Gay publicized this triumph in the standard, and lewis tappan published a little template about it and he listed Louis Napoleon as one of the organizers. This was when napoleon started getting a little bit more recognition. Ok, im going to talk about the emmon case in 1852. This is a case Louis Napoleon was a part of. It was against a new york law, for slaveowners to bring people they owned into the state. Initially, there had been a law that people could bring their slaves into new york for up to nine months, but then that law was abandoned. Lemmons knew that the were not supposed to bring people into new york that they owned, and the judge ruled that the slaves were freed. Napoleon placed liberated slaves and coaches, and waved handkerchiefs and it shouts of thank god, thank god. A black woman was overheard saying, that the judge never had to pay anybody to clean his house again. [laughter] mr. Papson now, there was city,r group in new york the businessman who did business with southerners, and they raised 5,000 in a matter of ns couldthat the lemmomn be reimbursed. The state appealed the decision, and they would have taken their appeal to the Supreme Court if it was not for the beginning of the civil war. Mmons whouliet le owned the slaves but her husband was the agent in the matter. This was a history of the case that was published in 1860, and it is very possible that Sydney Howard gay was involved in this project because he was working for him at the time. The case made napoleon famous, as they collaborated, they were written about, Louis Napoleon had concealed himself en napoleon had sent him route to canada from circus. In a posture visited the office. She claims to be a fugitive, but they suspected or and they found out she was really a destitute woman from vermont. In spite of that, they arranged for her to go to hartford, connecticut, but napoleon had some trouble with her and she was dismissed with. Every once in a while there would be an imposter. Wrote a letter to william still. He was the man sending many of the people to new york city. He advised still to send fugitives directly to his office. He added, and a few days, napoleon will have a room downtown, and at all times they can be sent to their. I am not willing to put any more with the family or have visitors sometimes . He wrote he had been in napoleons home and spoke briefly with you today is but have lost his hopes. That tells us he would take lost his notes. He would sometimes later make a record of the stories from the people. There are 79 boxes of gays materials at Columbia University, and that is an astounding collection. We have nothing that napoleon wrote because he was not able to write. He was not able to read. He had to read people. One of the people that gay and napoleon both trusted was john j, it is send it who tried a descendent who tried to have slavery abolished after the new york revolution. At the antislavery office, napoleon was the conductor and gay kept records. The cost ofd watching people, transporting them to the next stop, and when his Fugitive Fund ran low and had to dip into his own pockets, he was very poorly paid, there is one letter in which he said, 100 cases are going to break me. Whenever he was able to, he repaid himself. In 1855 and 1856, he kept the accounts of the over 200 people that i mentioned earlier. It is an amazing document because he included their enslaved names, their assumed names as free people, the circumstances of their escape, who had owned them, why they had escaped, where they were sent and how much money was spent to assist them. You do not find records like this very often. This is the first page of the record. This is harriet tubman. She came to the antislavery office many times, and the longest passage in the record is of her work. She continued to come to the office after gay resigned his post as the editor of the standard. Johnson,ssor, oliver assisted her. Still, who was sending many of the people to Sydney Howard gay and Louis Napoleon, and my coauthor, tom calarco was able to look at gays recordd and and compare them and annotate sometimestha there is difference in names and location. James johnson is one of the significant faces in the book. Johnson is one of the most significant faces in the book. They were coming through philadelphia, and abolitionist talked with her and she had always wanted to be free, so she took it as an opportunity to declare that she was going to be a free woman. Wheeler did not like that so he went to court, lost the case and johnson settled in boston. This is an image from stills book about thomas jones, one of my favorite stories in the book. Because he escaped at christmas time. Christmas was a good time for people to escape, even though it was cold weather, people were given a little bit of time off. Unhappy he was not that with his condition as an enslaved person until his wife and children were sold, and then he was desperate, desolate. Thehe had of his wife was big area type image of her, a locket of her hair, and lockets of a photograph of her, a locket of her hair and lockets of his children. He wanted to come back, find them and take them to canada, and we have no idea if he was able to do that. When heike the story of passes. Afraid she would be she took herree i threeyearold into a slave cabin. I like this because it tells us that the underground railroad started on the plantation. Throughe it was entered a trap door, covered by a piece of carpet on which stood a bed stand, no window, no means for light. Into this, the mother and child were put, and that has been their home for the last five months. She was fed at the expense of the society among the slaves, organized by persons in her circumstances. When hesomewhat wry wrote these two accounts, which i like very much. John had overheard his master sent, he meant to put some of his corn crop pieces and his pocket, and he took the hand and put himself in his own pocket. Charlotte was well treated except she was allowed to have bow and she pursued happiness. Publishedilliam still some of his records in 1873, in 1872, i am sorry. Articles toleases the public and took no credit for his underground roadwork. Otis inherited this artifact, i would love to talk to mr. Gay and asked him how he obtained this article. Earlier, twoned books came out, inspired by the record of fugitives. Outeric foners book came one month before ours, a different book, an overview of the antislavery history. She highlights some of the cases for the record, but we have every single word in the record and we have those records annotated, so our books are very doferent, and you can only as well is the information you have, and it is good that both books are out, because dr. There was not very much on Louis Napoleon. Himund there is a lot about , it just took forever to find it, because of the Louis Napoleon. When you do research online, both of the most of the things you will find or about the emperor, but there was one article that said Louis Napoleon, not the emperor. [laughter] i am going to Say Something about the draft rights, because Sydney Howard gay left the antislavery standard. He was very, very sick, exhausted. He actually left because Oliver Johnson was the associate editor and he said they cannot afford an associate editor in boston anymore, and he could not continue helping the fugitives, be in charge of the newspaper, so he resigned. It took him a wild to recover his health, and that he went to work for the tribune. Mobsg the riots of 1863, ransacked and burned houses, attacked innocent people, they also started fires on the first floor of the tribune building. Noeley said, i want arguments in the building and that he went to dinner. Gay and the man he was working with, got guns and ammunition to protect the building, and homehile, elizabeth was at hadtaten island, and she somebody teacher to use a pistol. She was a nonpersistent. Quakers worked nonpersistent, nonviolence, all right . There was a mob outside of her house. She was there with two children. , sohad to protect the home she learned to fire a pistol. Fortunately, there was a tavern keeper on the corner of davis street, and he steered the mop into another direction, so she did not have to use the gun. It was a horrible, horrible time it. We do not think about lynching in the north, but there was lynching in new york city. During the draft right. Ot. I should mention Frederick Douglas because he was a thread throughout her book. Werenally him in gay friends, lecturing together. Themas asked gay to help with a matter of wills he had with someone in boston. The problem was, douglas wanted to be an independent man, and he decided to publish his own newspaper. Harrison did not want that. Douglas went ahead and did it anyway. He also decided that the constitution was not a proslavery document, and garrison believes that it was, so that was another take issue. Interestingly enough, douglas does not mention gays underground Railroad Work, and gay never mentions douglass underground Railroad Work, but in one of his narratives, Cedric Douglas meant Frederick Douglass mentioned Louis Napoleon. When he died at the age of 81, his death certificate had underground Railroad Agent as his occupation. The underground railroad has over for years but that was his badge of honor. In 1888, gay was working on and on biography of his friend, quincy. , they neveravery forgot the days when their differences for them apart. This is Elizabeth Neil gay, otiss greatgrandmother. In 1893, philadelphia abolitionist refers to the conflict when she wrote elizabeth gay her last letter, i will destroy as you wish, yes, it is better to bury if possible some of those experiences of 1840 beyond the power of memory to revive them. And so it is, that some things shalt remain a secret shall remain a secret. Now i will take questions. [applause] mr. Papson of wonderful presentation, thank you so much. And there were others who escaped similarly. Yes. One man and napoleon shipped a lot of people in boxes. Henry box brown was sent to gay. Gave forwarded him to massachusetts, to new bedford. There were also other cases of people being shipped in boxes. Yes, because Louis Napoleon started very early, so it is possible. We do not have his account. The letter to henry gay about Henry Box Brown said, do not publish this. Do not let this out, because other people may try this and then they will be found. But it was an incredible case. Another question . Yes . Thank you. When did the underground railroad start . From the very beginning. As soon as people came, other people as skate. It only got a name in the 1930s escapeds, but people even from the dutch. It is interesting. You had some people escaping from new york into canada. Anada had slavery to and some people escaping from canada into the united states. Underground mean secret, in the railroad because the railroad was becoming very big in the eight 40s. They use the term conduct. Napoleon ands engineer and not a conductor. It is the same thing, the engineer of a train. We see this today in the world. Wherever people are oppressed, some of the people will find a way to get out. Initially people would escape to the American Indian communities. Know someone who was a chief and now lives in the mohawk valley. He told us the british would always insist there would be a passage in the treaties that people escaped from them would have to return. Tribe would agree to it but they would not do it. They said there was one time where a person was returned and they immediately escaped back to the native americans. Another question . It is wonderful that you came out in this weather. Worried, he little said, i do not know if everybody is going to come because of the weather. But you are here. Thank