Transcripts For CSPAN3 Policy 20240705

This is just under two and half hours. This meeting of the Senate Judiciary committee will come to order. A hearing on gun violence epidemic Public Health crisis is todays topic. Well hear from Public Health experts who have been on the front lines of gun violence epidemic. We understand the pain of a lump on his fellow member has been taken away too soon by the pull of a trigger was in the aftermath tearing through bone like it is tissue paper. In cities like chicago to a constant drumbeat of a gun gunviolence has turned Public Health professionals into battlefield experts. Chicago faces the same challenges as many other cities and towns. Many rural areas need higher rates of gun violence than the urban areas. Across the country gun violence is a Public Health epidemic more than 2022 firearm related deaths in the United States. That is 132 americans every day dying from gun violence. Than half theg firearm related vents or suicides four out of 10. Children and teenagers. Not auto accident not cancer, and guns. Im going to share a video that shows the devastation left in the wake of the gun violence provides a glimpse into heroic efforts to heal communities and prevent future violence. Im going to warn the audience the video is disturbing and may be upsetting to some if they wish to avert their eyes. Please play the video. The foundation, Community Organization and corporations have all stepped up to support initiatives that holistically address the root causes of this cycle of violence. I think reframe this is a Public Health crisis. Im as abuse specialist met in my field have turned to gun violence recognizing gun violence is like an infectiousti disease. It is contagious. Violence is passed on from person to person. Collecting data, identifying trends, establishing, sharing these practices this is how youi can bet and epidemic. It has worked in the past. We use the same Public Health approach to dramatically cut automobile fatalities. We still drive where we need to go but we have seatbelts and the speed limits that help us get there alive. Public Health Experts are already working to address gun violence in realtime. Last Year Congress passed bipartisan Safer Communities acts at braidwood to salute my colleagues unrecorded who is here with us today representing the minority. It took real courage. We disagree on a lot of issues to bed at a time when we needed to back to you did your best to me thank you for that. You included two or 50 million in funding for Community Violence intervention. Edit two and 50 million for states to provide comprehensive community mentaliv health services. Let me give one example of the successful innovative programs underway. In chicago i heard from doctors personally who are sick of treating gunshot victims on the operatingic table. They wanted to prevent the gruesome injuries from happening in the firstgr place. So in 2018 and brought the other ceos of the 10 largest hospitals serving chicago and understand doing in the neighborhood surrounding their hospitals. And how we can do more. We perform the Heal Initiative which is a national of how h hospitals can collaborate and reach outside theirt walls to prevent gun violence. These hospitals have increased local hiring by 84 in the last four years. They have open 24 schoolbased Health Clinics to serve 11000 students and traded nearly 4000 local students for career in healthcare. Most importantly these hospitals are not just stitching up physical injuries. They are addressing emotional scars. They are counseling and Case Management to preventou retaliation and promote successful recovery just 2 over 8000 participation patients at the university of chicago have returned to the hospital. Without these programs and this initiative, 45 of patients with a gunshot wound are likely to return within five years with another. That is a stunning statistic. 48 will return shot a second time. Similar steps are underway across the country to use the strategy which is Community Violence intervention. Trusted committee figures to engage with individuals at high perpetrating or being victims of violence. They worked to interrupt acts of violence before they happen and connect people with treatment and tools that decrease the risk of future violence. Its time for us to build on the bipartisan Safer Communities act and ongoing efforts are working red and blue states joined together surely we can find some Common Ground before the parties to create real change for the American People what comes the Public Health crisis of gun violence. An amount turned to senator cornyn. Think youha mr. Chairman. Just a few months ago democrat governor of mexico issued a quote Public Health emergency order to suspend the right to bear arms in albuquerque and other county. I think i pronounce it correctly. She was warned repeatedly by officials in her states that such a suspension violated the constitution. A group of our college syrians including senator tellis, graham, and cotton and i wrote to the department of justice to intervene and protect the Constitutional Rights of new mexicans to carry a firearm outside of their home. Her request was consistent with the Second Amendment and that jurisprudence and i suspect the court of last resort will find the same. But unfortunately that does not mark the end of the road for this latest attack on what is a constitutional right. That is something some of our colleagues consistently overlooked. But lawabiding citizen is not a threat to Public Safety. Indeed there is a story think its in the Washington Post today by philip a bump who points out 52 of american households have a firearm in that household. 52 . Washington and democrats haveer chosen to follow governor grishamss lead and are now usig Public Health as a guys to address their concerns. I wish they had the same concerns about the number one cause of death for americans between the age of 18 and 45 which is fentanyl poisoning. Fentanyl made from chemical precursors from china going to mexico made it to look like relatively innocuous pharmaceuticals which are then smuggled into the United States. And the young people end up consuming what they think is an innocuous drug. And die as a result of fentanyl poisoning. We do not have the look far to see examples of executive overreach that have relied on socalled Public Health emergencies during the covid19 pandemic to many politicians were quick to shut down houses of worship and Church Services while allowing other businesses and other organizations to operate. Here in washington d. C. Mayor Muriel Bowser refused to allow the Capitol Hill Baptist Church to hold outdoor Church Services because of a Public Health emergency. The judge in that case found the mayor had exceeded her authority and burden the free exercise of religion. Its important to note thehe application of the socalled Public Health precautions was not evenhanded. Many politicians deemed it unsafe for businesses to operate for churchgoers to attend Worship Services they seem to have no problem with impact blm riots as in black lives matter riots in the summer of 2020 that because of millions of dollars worth ofof damages. We have a trust issue in a constitutional issue will use the Public Health approach attempt to strip away court Constitutional Rights. Other problem with homicide and assault is effective criminal while enforcement that means effective police, prosecutors, courts ands, prisons. We note these tools actually work. We know they work because we have Historical Data in order to prove it. Law enforcement efforts were stepped up in the early and mid 1990s was all dramatic declines in criminal violence of alll kinds. One of the reasons for this is the concentration of gunun violence is among small numbers of the population it is not the general population it is a small percentage of the population where this phenomenon exists. In washington d. C. In 2021 a study found only 500 people were responsible for up to 70 of the gun violence in the districts. In boston a 28yearold study found half the citys homicides committed by 1 of the population. Involved with gangs it primarily. 2014 study showed a similar situation in chicago. But all of this means, if i believe, if you empower law enforce them to selectively investigate and prosecute repeat offenders, you can dramatically reduce the gun violence in a community where it is a problem by removing the worst criminal elements of the Community Everyone is safer. That is the original purpose of the project Safe Neighborhoods Program which passed out of the senate this year. That focuses onat investigating and prosecuting the most dangerous and violent criminals in our communities to ensure they do noty continue to harm other people. We have seen it has an overwhelming success rate at reducing Violent Crime. UlSuccessful Programs like projt safe neighborhoods require resources and political will. You cannot simply achieve Safer Communities defining police are violent offenders out on bail like unfortunately too many prosecutors have been willing to do in communities across our country. Today, Violent Crime is a ravaging many of ourd communits and the public is of course taking notes as they must. Here in the district of columbia carjackings rub dramaticallyy. I have to believe this has to do with the perception there will not be consequences with committing such crimes against innocent citizens. Including members of the United Stateses congress. A recent gallup poll shows 63 of americans describe the crime problem in the u. S. Is either extremely serious or very serious. That is the highest level since this particular poll began in 2000. 77 of americans believe more crime in the eye since a there s just a year ago. But we talk about the gun violence epidemic, it seems as though a substantial part of the debate is a current crime problem. Ue in the d fund the police movement. Of course we know the other side of the gun violence issue is Mental Health. This is especially important we have firearm related suicides like the chairman said about 60 of gun deaths in america are the result of a suicide. Someone taking their own life. And of course we know the bipartisan Safer Communities act which we did pass made the single largest investment in Communitybased Mental Health care in american history. A good start. In 2023 a survey from mental s Health America down 21 of American Adults have claimed symptoms of a Mental Illness. Thats 50 millions americans. 2015 study by the epidemiology strongly associated with decreased risk of suicide which counts for more than half of the government related deaths in this country. Suicide is a Mental Health problem. Were not going to fix by denying the constitutional right to keep and bear arms police among the general population. Companies like belgium, japan, south korea it would have a higher suicide rate than the United States but do not have a Second Amendments. Mental Health Problems are involved in Mass Shootings as you know. We look at the profile of the mass shooters and found many had serious underlying Mental Health problems. Mental Health Issues that were unaddressed and untreated. Many of our colleagues including senator tillis, graham, durbin, koons, Work Together as you heard to pass the bipartisan Safer Communities act. I think that bill has already saved lives. I get regular updates on the success of the law as it deals with the Mental Health and violence in our communities there other parts of the bill working asg well. Since allows enacted in june of 2022, new criminal penalties and firearm trafficking led to more than 100 new charges against dangerous Cartel Members enhance juvenile records check, alone has stopped 400 transactions of people who would ordinarily flunk a background check criminal history. But now because we have an enhanced check includes juvenile records 400 transactions have been stopped. While 98. 5 of the background check system is unaffected. This builds on a bill we call fix nicks criminal background check which signed into law in 2018. That law has led to the uploading of millions of new recordsds into the fbi criminal background check database. To prevent those who are legally prohibited from professing an irr firearm under existing law from obtaining one. All of this was done in the Bipartisan Safer Community act in a bipartisan i way without infringing the rights of lawabiding citizens. The point is we can find ways to come together to get things done using Public Health authorities as a blanket accused to strip away Constitutional Rights which is an epidemic divides us more than it unites us. Theyre not autonomously fired weapons. They involve human agencies. We focus on the humans we can have a very positive impact. So i hope we look at the entire picture. Focus on repetitive acts of violence for most small percentage of our communities focusing on Mental Health diagnosis and treatment. Finally ways we can address gun violence like we did the safer act all without of lawabiding citizens. You raise some very important issues. Like defense or not we have had hearings in this committee about the issue of narcotics and whats happened to america. President biden recently raised this issue with the leader of china i hope at least something positive raise the issues of freedom of religion talk about funding the police i believe funding the police is critical i never said otherwise. I hope some thee spending bills our republican friends will start voting for them that should be a bipartisanti effort. One thing you dont acknowledge and we disagree on is the fact the United States of america is unique among nations. Unique among nations there is no other country developed economy in this world where the number one cause of death among children and teenager is guns. We are a unique nation in many ways this is something which not take pride in. Our men and women who have given life to medicine. The product of these violent actions. And try to keep these poor people alive for another day. And yet we know doing nothing is 45 of them that of the gunshot wound what is wrong with this picture . Its a limited number of people engaged in it are going to turn her back 122 americans die every single day by gun wounds . That is a fact in our country and no other country. But it comes to Mental Illness other countries face Mental Illness every day as well but they do not turn to guns or wanton violence as an alternative is the way they do in the United States pray that its entirely unique to our country. Before we return to the witnesses only briefly left the chmechanics place where the witnesses and they will r have five minutes each to provide an Opening Statementvi and then he round of questions for each senator will have five minutes to ask. We welcome five witnesses i will introduce the majority witnesses the first witness doctor megan is the dean of yale school ofhe Public Health Board Certified emergency physician of violence prevention researcher. She has been a leading National Voice for dressing firearmea injuries as Public Health problem for wells, over 10 year. Thank you for rejoinders well by doctor franklins director of Violence Recovery Program at the university of chicago medicine. Which helps trauma patients and their families with crisis intervention and social service. In five years the program has grown eight 100 serving over 8000 participants. It employs more than 20 specialists who are themselves gun violence survivors or Family Members with gun violence victims. Our final majority witnesses ivanka obrians. Xe executive director of metropolitan Peace Initiative which is based in chicago. Focuses on community bounds intervention by providingng traa Behavior Health service City Wide Network of outreach workers enhancing capacity to reduce violence. , senior legal fellow at the Heritage Foundation her areas of scholarship senior legal fellow at the Heritage Foundation her areas of scholarship include the Second Amendment over criminalization. School safety and intersection of Mental Health and gun violence. She run heritage defensive gun use database and is the primary author of recent ebook essential Second Amendment. Jd and undergraduate degrees from the university of nebraska. Mr. Steven cook is a frequent witness here before the committee serve at the department of justice for 33 years. Including 30 years as a federal prosecutor in Eastern District of tennessee. Between 2017 and 2019 served as associate Deputy Attorney general director of Law Enforcement affairs. In that capacity he led to d. O. J. Priority programs in Violent Crime reduction and strengthening d. O. J. Relationship with state and local Law Enforcement. Before joining the d. O. J. Worked as a Police Officer for seven years. Presley mr. Cook serves as general counsel for both the major cities achieve association and that major county sheriffs of america. Also serves as outside counsel for federal Law Enforcement officers association. Thank you. Think a center asked the witnesses to please santa be sworn. Reeser right hand to affirm the testimony about too go before this committee obey the truth,il the whole truth, nothing but the truth so help you god . By the record reflect that witnesses have answered in the affirmative. Doctor franklin is first. Chairman derman, senator cornyn and respected Committee Members i am deeply grateful to have the opportunity today to share a personal story that underscores a vital Violence Recovery Program. Mymy name of the director of ths hospitalbased Violence Intervention Program is highlighted today at gun violence is an agonizing crisis plaguing our nation causing immeasurable payment andus suffering. Their proactive ways we canve respond for that coordinated approach and intervention approach be part of the solution and hospitalbased programs the solvings complex puzzle. Browns Recovery Program many are impacted themselves as survivors of violence who often comen from the community for their house in the hospital 24 7 three and 65 days a year for they provide crisis intervention support while the patient is they are and that continues through coordinated approach with our spiritual care team, social work, child life specialist, Mental Health specialist, our clinicians in the hospital as well assp healig people chicago. Our specials use intensive longterm Case Management partnering with community wbrowns interventionist in tht community that has special relationships that are core to our approach for companies of recovery and preventing reentry today want to bring the human side of our efforts through a story that is touched my heart and captured our c collaborate d coordinate approach of why that approach is so critical. I want to share a story of a 12yearold patient her regular Trauma Center with a gunshot wound to the left thigh at that moment our team moved in swiftly not just as Healthcare Provider that is compassionate individuals eager to make a difference we provided practical assistance providing a phone charger, blanket, water we also consult with her child life specialist to provide a comforting presence. As we delve deeper into interpersonal Risk Assessment it became painfully clear this young child was exceptionally high risk for reinjury. After being discharged. His Family Safety was also in jeopardy. Through this juncture it demanded more than just medical attention we connect to a shelters, securing temporary emergency Funding Resources to meet the familys immediate needs. Our support continued understanding committed to provide Wraparound Services to address the holistic needs around n resiliency and recovery from trauma for our collaboration extended with our internal recoveryy empowerment f the Community Trauma Mental Health clinicians provided therapeuticic sessions are our survivors and their family. We contacted our program partnered healing her people connected with patients within the trauma intervention specialist to provide this longterm Case Management. Regular calls, regular home visits were conducted with the patient and his mothert providg emotional psychological support and with a practical help such as emergency transportation, counseling and Community Based activities. I regret to share that families home wasnt rattled with gunshots. Their home was destroyed in a retaliation event. However it we secured transitional shelter in indiana our neighboring state for 10 days and after that our team continued until we are able to establishrm a permanent home ina neighboring states collaborated with our street outreach partners that will be represented here by mr. Bryants. We made sure those leaders that have existing relationships of the individuals causing harm would agree to create a nonaggression agreement to prevent further violence from happening that agreement has been heldn up for this entire time. This example is underscored regarding the complexity of the work we are doing. One thing i want to highlight is the role our Chicago Police department has with our Community Violence interventionist. One of my proudest moments of joy in this work is hearing our Chicago Policeli officers commed his cvi committee violence interventionist for doing work for establishing peace in the community and establishing a nonaggression agreement. Im equally proud when i hear our community browns interventionalists commended the Police Officers for treating a residence in those causing harm with respect and dignity. Since it may 2018 abounds Recovery Program is engaged over 9000 patients. 85 of them have been africanamerican 70 of been victims of gunshot wounds. 81 mail, 86 involved in Community Violence. 60 between the ages of 22 and 40. Impressively our program has accepted 89 of patients have accepted services through this work resulting in reentry rate of 2. 1 while this outcome speaks to their terrific work reinjury rate is only at the Program Level thanks to senatora durbin keel initiative are working to establish data sharing agreements with all the 10 hospitals that are part of the initiative as we continue to experience the impact of gun violence it is clear this is a persistent Public Health crisis. However our response to be proactive these two have been through a collaborative and coordinated approach hospitalbased programs are very important like our Violence Recovery Program to play a perfect role, a Critical Role in establishing solutions toward the complex puzzle. Thank you very much. Good morning. Ranking member cornet members of the committee thank you very much for the opportunity to appear before you today. Thank you, senator cornyn for thatth introduction. I am serving in the capacity you described im here representing the views im going to express to the views of my own. I would like to begin with one single observation and it is this. What this committee does or does not do will have a profound o impact on Violent Crime in our country. I am convinced of this because as a federal prosecutor when our nation faced similar problems in the midar 1980s. Crime was skyrocketing. Congress responded and responded with legislative programs and statutes that allowed federal prosecutors to team up with thestate and local law enforcemt partners and to go after they after themost violent criminalsr country. The program worked. A Violent Crime began to turn around by 1991 as we continue to fill our prisons with violent offenders from across the country over the next two decades and by 2014 Violent Crime had been cut in half. Then in 2015 we began to see a rise and an increase in Violent Crime. To those of us who were participants in the system this wase no surprise because we had watches a federal criminal Justice System was incrementally weakened by events. This morning i like to focus on four of those events. First d. O. J. Policy handcuffing federal prosecutors beginningtt with the attorney general holders memo in 2010 theyve they havehave been ordered not e wither offenders especially drug traffickers with the most serious crimes they commit. As a result the front end of our criminal Justice System has been weekends. Second in a series of opinions by Supreme Court significant makes the Supreme Court has significantly narrowed the reach of key provisions designed to take violent offenders off the street. Among the statutes and there has been the armed career criminal acts. Attempts have been made to pass legislation by congress to correct these narrowing effects the statutory visions have not passed third, the steady drumbeat of anti Police Rhetoric premised on baseless allegations that Law Enforcement officers across the country are racist. These are the men and women who are the backbone of our criminal Justice System. Several studies have determined anti Police Rhetoric has cut d policing which in turn has reduced arrests and undermine both federal and state criminal Justice Systems. The fourth item i would like to address is the finality of the federal criminal Justice System and the fact it has been completely gutted. The sentencing reform act of 1984 allowed through a provision called most commonly known as the compassionate release program. It authorized the bureau of prisons to file a motion with the Sentencing Court for a prisoners Early Release for, this language is important, extraordinary compelling reasons. Typically those motions were limited to acts or incidents such as where a prisoner had a fatal disease in the bureau of prisons file for Early Release under those provisions about 24 times a year. In 2018 Congress Change the procedure but not the applicable standard by permitting defendants to file motions for compassionate release. Although the common meaning of extraordinary and compelling reasons the statutory definition or the statutory language suggests a very narrow limited circumstances the courts have taken a much broader approach and a much more expansive view of their authority. By 2019 between 2019 until today they have granted thousands of Early Release emotions. Recently released statistics have shown some inmates have filed numerous motions and collectively and one month alone filed 2000 motions. And in some months 20 of the motions were granted and it gets worse. In april the Sentencing Commission four three vote promulgated a further definition or reading of extraordinary compelling grounds for Early Release. That broader definition included among other things allowing courts to consider changes in theng law not made retroactive y congress. Collectively the actions by the Sentencing Commission the expansive court readings have resulted in a systemic structural change sure criminal Justice System without congressional authorization or directive edit has removed any finality in sentencing by allowingin prisoners i welcome your questions for. Thank you mr. Cook. Members of the Senate Judiciary committee id come to this work growing up in detroit, michigan. I am the son of a detroit Police Officer and a growing up all the sports i played were coached by Police Officers. I went on to become a fourth round draft pick by the Detroit Lions in 1994 i spent half of my professional career serving the community. Mpi coordinate support and sustains a cross agency committees take the infrastructure made up of local committee based organizations rooted in neighborhoods hardest hit by gun violence in the city of chicago. Fo for the first time chicagos history organizations with proven outcomes across the citys geography have come together to build civilian infrastructure liver and copperheads a set of services to help communities in 2015760 an individual shot 50 and 47 respectively. That led to a group of local leaders establishing Community Partner for peace or. Convened at by mpi we began to partner with eight organizations working in nine communities across the city of chicago. Today the coalition includes 13 Partner Agencies active in 27 inchicago communities for the Program Targets individuals most at risk for perpetrating gun violence are becoming the victim. Key Services Include street outreach, engaging individuals in the high likelihood of shooting or being shot. Case Management Services to address determinants of health. Victim services to provide support and safety planning events aimed at safety solidarity. We administered the metropolitan Police Academy multidisciplinary platform that trains, professional isis and strengthens the field of street outreach and committee violence intervention. The mpa features a curriculum that is 18 weeks, 140 hours, four to 44 hours of intensive curriculum shaped and taught by street outreach workers. Subject Matter Experts and is guided by 14 professional standards. Mpi model also includes Behavioral Health, workforce development, civil legal aid, and organizational capacity building. In addition it partners with Resilience Initiative to strengthen and empower. Also known. A collaborative of the university of Chicago Medical Center and advocate christ advocate christmedical center fn response to chicago initiative. It urges to bolster the effort to reduce gun violence offense or government. As strengthen and collaboration with hospital outreach organizations with the goal of improved care and support for gun violence survivors in the film is in the chicagos south h side and South Suburban mpi developed a two day to fourday trainings crosstraining set began together brought together perspectives knowledge of street outreach and hospital frontline staff we complete our first in june began our next one in february 2022. Since starting in 2014 organizations have provided 200,00025500 participants most acutely at risk of gun violence. Northwest and center for Neighborhood Engaged Research communities where it was operating saw statistically significant changes of rates of homicide and nonviolent shooting compared to areas without this. Its works resulted in three to 83 fewer homicides and nonfatal shootings than it would have been expected. I want to go now to the importance of federalor funding for this work for it has a National Impact gun violence is a national epidemic. We can address root causes for s for systemic issues like poverty and equity and equality and lack of educational and employment opportunities. Giving resource allocation can create standards of practice across the country that are important. Thank you. X thank you very much. I am a senior the chosen one is a Public Health. The slightly different title its effectively the same hearing is less of a gun healings as we have testified. Not much to say does not change the discussion. Put aside the end goal of those pushing the Public Health framing is use crisis language as an end run around the constitution not magically useful for understanding addressing a problem thatnd stes as from a lack of adequately enforcing criminal laws andg utilizing existing Mental Health remarks for is not change the fact most gun crimes aree perpetrated not by ordinary lawful gun owners but by a small subset of repeat offenders who are already prohibited from owningre guns. Back into the Community Without pursuing criminal prosecution punishment they will predictably keep committing Violent Crimes. Cap the suicides are carried out with something other than firearm pathology eyeing writingspecific weapons is far s useful than all lethal means during a personal crisis and doing with heart underlying l truth about theyi nations Mental Healthal crisis. Certainly does not change the fact criminal violence are not even remotely designed to meaningfully address Public Health does not fix the constitutional or practical implementing these policies the national right off selfdefense. My proposal for how congress should move forward may sound pretty familiar. Among other things First Congress can start right here under which the district on princes code for thena district the authority all crimes give that the d. C. Attorneys office. It should federalize the crime lab and get back to the fbi. Kitten should rated federal agencies like atf when they shiptheir time and attention to overt reagan citizens instead of targeting violent criminals to better share danger to themselves and their Community Last month mentally ill Army Reservist it was not the first time that military failure to share such information resulted in preventable tragedy. Congress can ensure it is the last. Fourth instead of spending so much time pathology rising and demonizing specific mechanisms of violence, congress can turn its attention toward promoting Economic Growth but weapons ban but reducing economic poverty and family lowers of overall risk of suicide if today is an average day in about three hours unless others would violently victimize. Much of the violence will involve firearms. This is antithetical to the rule of law and civil society. It is a problem worth understanding accurately and addressing meaningfully. And so i am happy to come back and repeat my same testimonies s many times as you asked me too. I will explain the same potential courses of action as often as it takes foron congress to do not just something but the right things. I once again look for it your questions. Thank you for conducting the hearing and recognizing gun violence is a Health Crisis. Spent 20 years during our training we learn to identify muscle right to an operating room how to crack the chest of someone was bleeding out and how to notify failing members of a death. While in training them we rarely if ever learn to ask what could be done to prevent a gunshot wound in the first place . That changed for me about 15ar years ago after i cared for a young man the son of a First Responder would shotsp himself with his parents firearm. It was the first patient i cared for who had intentionally shot himself. I could not save him. But he changed my perspective on gun violence. First is that death drove me too learn more about firearm suicide to realize in the Emergency Department we rarely saw Suicide Attempts from asu gun not becaue question why we did not think about gunshot wound the same what we think about drunk driving and how my colleagues responded to the suicide compared to the everyday toll of Community Gun violence. Since that case ive treated people for every type of firearm injury from domesticle violence, the victims of drivebys i have saved some lives but not all. And informed countless times the loss of the loved ones. It is because i have had a front row seats were nations growing eafirearm injury epidemic i have worked to define and implement a Public Health approach to this crisis. To clarify this is howy Public Health approach works first we gather data on the problem. How common is it and who is effectively what increases being hurt or dying. Change the pattern to overt injury, hospitalization or death and finally we scale what works. We have example after example of how the approach applied systematically can improve human Health Without rights. For example we decrease car crash death is german german for the last few decades. Multifaceted solutions rangingdr from reducing drunk driving to airbags in cars and vice scaling. Unfortunately not yet consistently applied this approach to firearm injury. As a result were facing a growing epidemic. Americas total number of gun deaths is the highest on record in the rate nears its peak. Firearm deaths have surpassed Breast Cancer deaths in america firearms are now the leading cause of death for american erchildren ages one through 19. Although Mass Shootings get the most media attention, like the young man i cared for 15 years ago. The remainder are mostly Community Violence and truly a lesser extent Domestic Violence. The effects all of its more than half american dolt said they or Family Member has beenn involved in the shooting. More than three quarters said the fear of gun violence had led them to change something in their lives. The effects of this epidemic estimate by the Government Accountability office that a billion dollars a year to longterm Mental Health economic and impacts. As well as first responses most statistics aside have confidence we can turn the tide. Help us apply this Public Health approach improve training of Healthcare Professionals and Community Members to help us recognize and act on a risk and most of all improve collaboration with most affected communities whether rural or urban this is where we need your help. Can predict the Health Crisis. You can make this happen whether by funding data to the cdc or removing barriers to data sharing among state territorial partners as utah has done. Help us with federal funding for research to develop and evaluate solutions. At a minimum continue current levels for the training on things and to work help our country have hope. By having collaborative action. We are turning into a nation of traumatized survivors. Join gun owners and non gun owners with faith leaders and survivors with me for the pickup with a gun to harm for your bipartisan commitment to the Public Health approach our country can reduce firearm injury and death for all, thank you. Thank you im going to start with five minutes of questions and then turn it over to my colleagues to each of the same opportunity. I listen to those who are critical of us having thisri hearing and talking about this. There are so many more important things we could talk about. And yets, i just wonder if this and think more important than life and death in your averager neighborhood. Has anything more important than knowing that little boy or a little girl that you sent to school this morning a safe in the classroom quest or mark does not have to hide under his desk with active shooter drills and exercises . That really gets down to the basics. If you want to know about the safety of your family it starts with the knowledge that when oothat child goes to school is going to come home safe at the end of the day if you cannot answer that question affirmatively or of the rest of the questionson worth . This it to me as a fundamental issue it is a Public Health issue. It involves not hairstyles it involves death, death by gunshot. Whats going on in america every single day. We have a responsibility to do something up. Not just to say we need to fund the police more i will sign up for that. We need to deal with counseling will do basic things like safety locks on gun so the kids can play with them . Are we going to do anything basic like people should not be considered owners of guns guns to our loophole. Which is just common sense. Some states have taken a lead on it and some surprising. Yes, it turns out there still debating this public sit like wyoming that makes common sense i agree with him. Childrens moral hospital we got a gun shot victims together i met with him in private inset okay close the door this is off the record. What is at this old white guy ought to know about whats happening in the streets of chicago . They loosened up and started giving response it was a great day in my life. I learned a lot i will never forget to we talkor about the homes they grew up in one young man said senator, i grew up in a house with no rules. When i woke up this morning and opened my eyes i decide what and get out of bed whether i go to school i decide whatgo they stand on the streets all day and all night, i decided dewhether i buy drugs or guns tt was my decision there were no rules in my house. I contrasted that with my ownco life for the minute i open my eyes in the morning until i close them at night it up and make your bed brush her teeth. Take care of your little sister should take your dog out for a walk and when you go to school theres an unwitting there with 100 more rules and the penalty issue would burn if you did not follow. What a contrast in formative years. Second thing was a young woman she was a mother probably in her 20s she said i was a mother at the age of 14. It is the best thing that ever happened to me. I said why . She said my mother was a junkie. She brought boyfriends home, took advantage of her and then turned to me finally with that baby i got out of that house and i had a chance for he made something of my life as a result those are contrasting Life Experiences which i do not know personally. Only ask that you review both of these traumatic experiences andn turn their lives around from violence, doctor . Thank you, senator durbin. First of all thank you for sharing the story. There is a phrase i like to use that is connected to individuals who have lived similar lives is no one person should be judged with their lives. Who have caused harm themselves there individuals they understand the impact the trauma has the mom that was a junkie there is a reason why that mom is in junkie. The role trauma has on the household impacts parental practices monitoring how parents and families monitor their children. We need to uplift the role trauma plays in our society. I believe and we both agreed the impact trauma has in terms of suicide rates we take that same frame we humanize but understand the individuals should be trusted to intervene are individuals who have a lead that life themselves are asking individuals to walk on the same path they have walked on because they understand that path when it comes to addressing issues connected with trauma you have to really understand the role of trust. A lot of our systems over time a trust is been eroded so having it individual that understands that life is an important first step. Thank you. Mr. Brent you have 30 seconds. Yes thank you. I would add not only peoples lived experience but trained experts in Mental Health paired with those folks to work to heal our community the average age of the forecast beat work with is about 31 imagine a 31yearold black mail who hasnt finished high school. Never had a formal job. A lot of times theyve grown up similarly with no rules if we can get to those people and help heal those people they are going to be not only better for their communities but better for their families because technically theyre going to have kids as well and a lot of times when we see use getting shot it is related to an adult in their life that is living a life that is not necessarily dignified and all of our work is around engaging, healing and putting people on the path to live a dignified life. Thank you. Senator cornyn . The longer ive been a washington d. C. And worked in the United States congress the more i have come to believe what divides us is not our goals so much as the memes to achieve our goals. And here obviously we do we want to diminish and reduce violence in our communities. Mr. Cook, heres ago there was a project exile in richmond, virginia i guess was the first place a concentrated effort between federal, state, local Law Enforcement efforts to focus on essentially repeat criminals felons possessing firearms, usingnf a firearms to commit otr offenses to target that aspect of violence in our communities. That has now become a project saved in neighborhood which i mentioned pass the Senate Earlier this year. Given your experience as a federal prosecutor, can you describe the importance of focusing work time and resources on the small microcosm of our rcommunities that are committing most of the violent acts using firearms in our communities . Si. First off, let me thank you for championing the project safe neighborhoods bill, a spinoff of the wildly successful exile project in richmond, and the members that supported it here. That project itself has continued with the cornerstone being exactly what you said, and that is to take partnerships with federal prosecutors, state and local Law Enforcement, take those partnerships and identify the worst of the worst and put them into federal prison but project a safe neighborhood is more comprehensive than that. We had a 23 reduction but it was more than just putting people in prison. That was the cornerstone but we also had an educational component and a Community Interface component so project a safe neighborhood has continued to produce Great Results across the country as high as 41 reductions. In addition to reauthorizing project safe neighborhoods, what else should congress be focusing on to make sure we are dealing with this recalcitrant criminal element responsible for most of the Violent Crimes . Prosecutors need the tools back mentioned that. Its been gutted because the courts have taken the authority that congress has given it through 3582 and theyve run with it. And i think they far outstripped the Authority Congress intended, so first i would suggest congress put guardrails on the 3582, serious guardrails. A second i think that Congress Needs to look at the criminal act and related statutes and make amendments that correct then narrowing the Supreme Court has taken over the years because those tools are fundamental to the ability to put those violent criminals who are the key tore reducing Violent Crime and those are the tools we need to put them in prison and keep them there. I applaud the efforts that your undertaking. I have someard questions and this is as Public Health crisis but we will leave that for discussion at another time. Let me ask you in 2022 you did an interview with the American Medical Association that Mental Illness is not a predictor of hurting others. Hatred is. Would you apply that to violent street gangs that are competing for territory and profits in communities across the country . Do you think it is hatred or Something Else . Thank you for your leadership with senator murphy on the Safe Community act. As i outlined the studies have shown people with serious Mental Illness are more likely to be victims of violence to and perpetrators of violence. Substance use and a substance personality disorder are risk factors for being perpetrators and of course as you outlined, Mental Illness is deeplyll connected to firearm suicide if that is a leading type of suicide, excuse me, firearm death in the country. In your experience to people suffering Mental Health crises tend to frequently self medicate which exacerbates the dangerousness to themselves and others . That can happen if there is inadequate access to treatment. I think it is worth noting when you look at mass shooters, the vast majority of them were in an identifiable crisis prior to the mass shooting but only slightly more than the average American Population have been identified as having serious Mental Illness. An awful lot of them are suicidal so theres an element to getting folks treatment and access to care and its also about limiting access to legal l means at that moment inli the crisis. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Senator blumenthal. Thank you mr. Chairman and thank you to the Ranking Member for havingha this hearing. It may seem repetitive, but we need to continue this work because we face a Public Health crisis that is only expanding as you have demonstrated and we all know simply measures the debt and injuries. Ive been working on it since the 1990s when i became the attorney general in the state of connecticut and we advocated for the assault weapons bann that s passed. I defended it and weve expanded in connecticut on the types of gun violence prevention laws that we had showing that they actually work. They reduce death and injury, assault weapons bans, even providing for safe storage. And other kinds of measures. If we take the Public Health imposed that was advocated and we arean datadriven as the medical professionals in this room wearing the white coat use every day, respecting facts, makingec decisions based on science, i think that we will continue to build on the bipartisan savor communities act which we pass and show that we can defeat the gun lobby, that the nra and its lobbies are not vulnerable. In your testimony you mentioned the importance of and the potential additional gun violence and i am struck by the statistic that 41 of patients treated for violent injury are reinjured within five years in other words there is a cycle. I think we can and should ensure that more victims of Violent Crime do not become repeat victims. The new haven Violence Intervention Program has been very effective in a number of ways preventing the kinds of repeat injuries after trauma. In your firsthand experience can you describe how these programs work in practice and how maybe we can have some Common Ground and supporting Violence Intervention Programs like the one that new haven has in practice right now . We are tremendously grateful to the interventiony program tht was started in 2020. I also sit on the board of the nonviolent rhode island into support closely with folks in chicago and elsewhere and Community Violence intervention programs. These are some of the programs with growing data behind them particularly the secretary of education in chicago as well as decreased likelihood. Statistics are available from programs in missouri. Because of the limitations on the approach which i outlined at the beginning, we do still have limited data on how effective they are. Mental Health Support and treatment when needed and helping to get folks into state housing, help them get an education is a demonstrated effect on the future injuries and also longterm success. I was very moved by the description and testimony of the victims that you tried to save in one of your first cases involving suicide by the use of firearms. There are loaded and unlocked guns, 4. 6 million American Children like the sign of the Law Enforcement officer you described, ive been an advocate of thehe laws passed in the Connecticut Legislature and introduced a hearing in congress along with the representative that would prohibit him secure storage of firearms. Could you speak to how secure storage helps reduce suicide or other accidental . The majority perpetrated by the use including an article that just came out today are committed with a Family Member firearm. Obviously we cant legally purchase and so they find a parent firearm which many of us think is stored safely but when you ask kids they know where its stored, the same way they know where their birthday present or stored at the studies show they can access it quite quickly. Eshe states that have put thesen place, the 20 to 25 decrease in child firearm fatalities but i will emphasize the legislation alone is not enough. It needs to be matched with community engagement, enforcement, education. Many of the groups i work with our tremendous advocates for saver storage of firearms and there are ways to do this without taking gun owners rights. Thank you very much, senator blumenthal. Senator grassley. In february i reintroduced a bill that i called the eagles act focusing on using behavioral threat assessment model to identify individuals showing the behavior and managed the threat of violence. How does the behavioral threat assessment model prevent gun violence if you think it does, gand is this something worth expanding . Thank you, senator, for that question. When we are talking about behavioral threat assessment, most often the aspect is targeted access and specifically Mass Violence that can be incredibly useful in that capacity as mentioned a lot of these perpetrators of Mass Violence while they may not be diagnosed mentally ill a lot ofn them are in some sort of crisis and most often its noticeable in the weeks and months leading up to that incident and its fairly rare a perpetrator of Mass Violence when all is said and done people dont say we saw that coming. Most of the time it is fairly identifiable before hand and so that training in the professional threat assessment helping people identify thosekn factors and knowing what to do about them and how to assess them and what proper steps to take it is important when we are talking specifically about the targeted violence and also theres a lot we can do in terms of suicide as well because a lot of people who are suicidal again that is noticeable, but the lead up to crisis is noticeable and so it allows us to intervene before we reach that point before the crisis point becomes violent or fatal. Again for you, going to the oiproblems weve talked about he in washington, d. C. The average homicide suspect has been arrested 11 times prior to their committing a homicide. What role do progressive prosecutors who refuse to charge offenses and other Violent Crimes committed by criminals play in the gun violence epidemic . I would note that my colleagues have written extensively on this issue as well. Again when we are talking about the small subset that are overwhelmingly responsible either directly or indirectly, when you just released them back into the communities without prosecution or any sort of detaining of them you are releasing them to committing the same crimes over and over and in some cases it emboldens them because they realize i can probably get away with it even if i am arrested im not going to be prosecuted and if i am, the only threat that is not deterrence at all. Theres no deterrence factor. We are centrally eliminating any perceived reason for criminals to stop the criminal action. Again, in august the Justice Department issued a proposed rule that wouldic increase the number of folks that would have to register for federal firearm license in order to do business that way. The rule says, quote, even a single firearm transaction or offer to engage in a transaction whenen combined with other evidence may be sufficient to require a license. In april, the director told the house Judiciary Committee that when atf writes its proposed rule, it looks at the loft Congress Passes into the Public Safety threat to america. In your opinion, does this new ruleio apply to the wall as written by congress and if not, explain why you feel that way. Anytime you have a slight wording change its essentially 108 pages explaining how its way more significant. That should bebe a red flag immediately that it is not consistent with the change in the law. I think most concerning are the presumptions that they want to now right because it includes things like selling with the original packaging that is essential for gun safety including the users manual and of the original box that had to have been sold with it. To say about selling those items now means that you are suddenly there was an dis incentivize to private unlicensed individuals from including that important safety so when we are looking at that sort of absurdity we have a problem above and beyond does it reflect the federal statute i dont think it does. Thank you, senator grassley. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Iy think i heard my colleagues say we have a shared goal and our goal is to decrease gun violence in the country. The number one killer of young people in our country. How do we do that and one of the ways is to lock up the violent criminals although i am not so sure that is what we are doing that our prisons are populated and have been populated for a long time with maybe nonviolent drug cases. To be that as it may, youve worked in this area. Are there other Things Congress can do to decrease the easy access to guns that results insu the death of our young people . One of the biggest things that i know is partly addressed in the bipartisan savor communities act as around Domestic Violence and restraining orders. If a perpetrator of Domestic Violence has access to a gun museum 500 increase in the victims being killed by that gun. We know most murder suicides are partnered by violence and Domestic Violence is a leading cause of pregnancy death. We also know the states have limits on firearm accessed by people under the Domestic Violence restraining order have a significant Partner Violence so thats a significant thing that congress can do. Risk for the red flag law is also a data suggests tremendously effective and increasing suicide and there is anecdotal evidence that may heln in reducing the mass shooting deaths. And then lastly of course the data and assessments of whether or not these things matter, the public deserves us to spend money and legislation on programs that work and funding both data and Research Helps with that. Thank you for noting that Domestic Violencele situations e among the worst things leading and im sure youre familiar with the fifth circuit case based on a Domestic Violence situation the circuit tossed out the use of a gun because of a person who was under Domestic Violence order i think. This case is before the Supreme Court. What are you concerned about that the court sustains the fifth circuit in terms of the ability of the federal government or anybody else to limit gun accessibility for frompeople that have Domestic Violence orders . Theres two sides to this. One is the multiple victims of Domestic Violencee shootings, ad they are like those firearm suicides, just horrifying. They almost never come out of the blue. Folks know before they happen that they are at risk. I lost a colleague a fellow in 2018 who was shot and killed as she walked out of a shift at a chicago hospital by her ex fiance. This is someone that has tremendous personal residence with me. The other side of it is the Domestic Violence is one of those very well established risk factors for violence against and others. Again not just the partner but also against children, Family Members and society at large, so there is tremendous concern on the part of the Public Health community that should be decided to overturn with a history of conviction of Domestic Violence that it would have tremendous negative downstream impacts on americans in general in terms of thef number and the severity. You are referring to the cases before the Supreme Court. Thank you for making the connection between domestic violent situations and gun violence. But the decision is leading to unexpected consequences i went to say and many criminal proceedings. The criminals or the people that are being tried are using the omdecision that they cannot be prevented from owning a gun. So it is going to continue to create a load of questions. In fact in hawaii for example, we have some of the strictest gun laws and many are beinghe challenged under this decision. So i think that this is one that congress should look at and i realize that its based on a constitutional right to bear arms, but its not an unfettered right and i think there is probably more that we can do to limit the impact. Thank you mr. Chairman. Thank you, senator hirono. Senator kennedy. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Welcome. You are in the er doctor is that right . Correct. And i understand youve been onu television a lot. A fair amount. And i understand you build a Home Television studio is that right . Thats a bit of an exaggeration. I had a laptop on a stool. Your husband didnt build you a home studio . No. Let me ask you this. Why do you think that chicago has become americas largest outdoor shooting range . Do you think its because chicagos citizens who have no criminal record but a gun in their home for protection or perhaps for hunting, or do you think its because of a finite group of criminals who have rap sheets as long as king kong . Mississippi, louisiana haverm higher death rates. What about chicago . I dont live in chicago. Its not my primary area of research. You dont have an opinion on that . Combined with environmental conditions and lack of great education, theres been studies showing vacantio lots and buildings and neighborhoods and decreases in gunshots and violence as well as depression inec the neighborhoods around them. No disrespect, but that sounds a lot like worms valid to me. Let me askk you this. In september of this year, our new mexico governor issued a Public Health emergency order, and she suspended the right to bear arms inbe albuquerque and e surrounding county. Do you support that . I do not apply to support the work of new mexico do you support that . No. Okay. Lets see. During his first two years as the da in philadelphia, he lost or dropped 47 of all thef illegal firearms cases in the city. Do you agree with that . I am not a lawyer. I can say that new mexico has done amazing work and asking im asking about philadelphia. I dont have 47 of all the illegal firearms cases, did he do the right thing . Ira dont have an opinion however i would say im going to have to cut you off. The lane District Attorney said that he wouldnt prosecute any enhancements for guns or gangit related activity. Do you think that he did the right thing . Im not a lawyer nor a prosecutor. You dontth have an opinion n that . I dont know enough about it to have anra opinion. You dont think that that they should be prosecuted for having illegal guns . Im not a lawyer or prosecutor and that isnt my area of research. I think you are saying something that ive not said in my written or oral testimony. You equated gun deaths for the Opening Statement which is a greater Public Health problem, gun deaths or Heart Disease . It does kill more folks across the United States largely about 15,000 . Correct. Do you support outlawing [inaudible] im sorry . How does that relate . Fried food contributes to Heart Disease. Ive not written or said have i said i support outlawing anything in my testimony today . Okay. Let me ask one more question. Im sorry. I cannot see that far on the very end. You said, and i wrote it down, you said no one should be judged by the worst thing theyve done their lives. If one of these doctors sitting behind you, god forbid, walks outee on the streets of washington, d. C. And is raped or sodomized you dont think thatld the rapist should be judged . I dont think it should be terminal, it shouldnt be for the rest of their lives. You think we should forgive them and not give them any punishment . You think nobody is responsible for their actions . I believe in responsibility and forgiveness. Thank you wow. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you, mr. Kennedy. Senator butler. Thank you, chair durbin, Ranking Member for being in the kennedy on such an incredibly important topic. I want to also appreciate the witnesses for joining us today. I would like to appreciate in helping us to protect members of our community and also for your dedication in helping our country combat this important crisis. I agree with of the words that you offered this is a conversation that is about our children and that in my opinion is very much about the future of our democracy. I would like to direct my first question to you. For decades, congress has refused to allow the cdc to use federal dollars to Research Gun Violence prevention. Finally in december, 2019, Congress Passed the Gun Violence Prevention Research act which granted a 25 million per year to the cdc and the National Institute on a study and gun violence prevention from 20222022. For those who feel they know everything and we keep having the same conversation, doctor, can you tell us what this money has done to help us learn and what do we still have to understand relative to gun violence prevention . So the money is currently being used to study things such as projects working with the National Guard to decrease suicide and working with families to improve safe storage of firearms when someone has dementia to reduce the chance of intentional or Unintentional Injury or death. Its being used for projects to describe risk factors and evaluate programs like the one that i mentioned around putting gardens in vacant lots that is shown to decrease to see if we can expand that work. There are projects that i could go on them. Its a whole bunch of things like that where we try to identify where are the patterns of injury and how do we identify thee factors and then intervene again in the same way that we intervenee for Heart Disease. Maybe there are medications. Maybe there are counseling efforts like teaching people about obesity or smoking and then potentially there may be legislation but legislation alone is never a decision. Thank you. Mr. Vaughn, i would love to now turn my next question to you. In a related topic brought by unsenator hirono, gun violence really does sit at the intersection of another Public Health crisis that being intimate Partner Violence. In the United States approximately one and five women and one in seven men have experienced a severe physical violence by an intimate partner. On average three women in this country are k killed each day ba current or former intimate partner. When abusive intimate partnerspa have access to a firearm that victim is five times more likely to be killed as has been noted. My question to you, have you seen what has been the impact of your particular approach that your organization offers as it relates to intimate Partner Violence . So, we would say interpersonal conflict in general is often times either intimate Partner Violence or conflict between intimate partners and general often leads to a larger conflict that leads to death, so for us we have partnered with local Domestic Violence organizations to learn more about intimate Partner Violence and all of our clinicians are trained in as well soolence they are understanding that as they work with the people they were trying to seek and on an ongoing basis we continue to strengthen that relationship so we are aware but also teaching the Domestic Violence partners about our worken so we can continue to strengthen. Thank you. Thank you very much. Senator blackburn. Thank you mr. Chairman and i want to say thank s you to eachf you for being here today for your thoughtful answers and i thinkn we can all say we want o make certain that children are safe when they go to school and i want to start with that. Let me come to you. I am a grandmother and i have spent so much of my work making sure we protect children and that they have and an an an envt where they can learn whether they are at school or in community activities. Ik think we all know that there are violent criminals that are in our communities and we know our schools need training and they need to security tools to keep children safe. Thats why i introduced the safe school act. This is a concept ive worked on for years that would be a 900 milliondollar Grant Program that would allow schools to have the technology that they needed to keep children safe and to increase their physical security and also allow schools to work with local Law Enforcement and train and hire former Police Officers to work as School Security officers. I would like for you to talk for just a moment about the immediate need that we have to make certain that children are safe at school. Thank you for your question. Its important to acknowledge that statistically speaking, our schools are actually pretty safe places for children. Its not statistically speaking where they are likely to be shot. Theres still a lot of work we can do. No child should have to go to school and no parent should send their child to school asking the question is my child going to come home today and that is a fear. By securing our schools essentially what we are trying to do this is what we walked into with measures of security we know that in terms of the mass public shooting the time it takes for the good guy with a thegun to get there is the difference between life and deaths. For people. 5 of the mass shooters have been diagnosed with a Mental Health disorder and we know 55 of American Adults with Mental Illness have never sought treatment and never received any treatment. We also know that 42 of mass shooters experience physical abuse, sexual abuse, parental suicide were severe bullying as children. Tennessee has a phenomenally Successful Program to address and alleviate childhood trauma that serves as a model for the nation and senator shaheen and i have introduced a bill that would make those Services Available nationwide and at the dollars to fund that speaks a little bit to your work. Talk for a moment about the importance of addressing Mental Illness. I would appreciate that. Im going to come to you after i wrap up with her comments. Addressing untreated Mental Illness in particular including early intervention, getting people to admit before it becomes a crisis, this is important not just for suicide were public shootings. Its important for human flourishing. Its important far beyond the scope of firearms. Again talking about half of suicides being something other than a firearm so to the extent that we can get people in crisis help especially lethal means counseling, that saves lives and leads to healthier families and thativ is important. Welcome. Glad to see my fellow tennesseans here today. Pleased to be here. Thank youo for having us. I would like your response on the intervention and Mental Health component of Mass Shootings into suicide. If i could also touch on this issue that you raised because part of the project safe neighborhood that was so successful included interfacing with as you may know we had School Resource officers and that was attacked nationally as part of the defined the police and incredibly Important Program as part of our comprehensive approach to reduce violent gun crime because those individuals brought a very positive influence into the schools and made a good impression on the children of all ages and proved to be a critical component in educating them on the need to avoid gun violence and the Resources Available to them in the community to avoid getting drawn into gang violence. I appreciate that. Thank you mr. Chairman. Im going to take a moment here in light of testimony and questions earlier to note three of the majority witnesses are from chicago which im honored to represent and i think them for being here and to also note it is not unusual for my colleagues on the other side of the table to talk in terms about that. Im honored to represent as many challenges as most American Cities do but the question was asked what she answered and then proceeded from the senator from louisiana to talk about other areas of basic challenges to show they are struggling. I would like to give you an opportunity to complete that answer. Thank you. I think i was talking about louisiana and mexico, utah and other states and talking about the beautiful collaboration between Community Members, Law Enforcement and the legislature in the states on the great Data Tracking and to work with groups to put in place programs to decrease those in the cities and rural areas. I would say any member of the panel that is naive to believe that his or her state will never be touched by gun violence should consider whats happened recently in the state of maine where the whole population of the state was asked to stand down. No one wouldve chosen maine as the next target but the fact is with the 400 million in this country every state, city, locality has that threat facing them. Senator booker. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Its difficult for me because im in new york new jersey. Ive had experience with gun violence that is for the rest of my life but also the racial tinge that this has that we often talked about this as an urban problem it infuriates me because i think it makes it harder from 2016 to 2020, 13 of the 20 counties with the most gun homicides per capita were rural communities. Its very frustrating that they will talk about chicago that ive heard so demonizes a city that doesnt have the highest murders per capita of American Cities or even american counties and it obscures the strategy to do something about this. With the urban communities like mine have that frustrates me and i think this was said by others is theres a whole bunch of other problems that are correlated with violence. High lead poisoning levels. High poverty levels. I could go on and on of issues thatsu ive heard people on the conservative side of the aisle to the conservative side of the country to understand we are not often getting at n the root problems that create environments where violence proliferates. Im so happy to have this conversation but ive had decades of frustration in my community and to seeing evidencebased examples of things that lowered violence. Isi wish that we got together wn i was the mayor. I think we would have done a lot of good in all sincerity because what frustrates the hell out of me as cities have too much of the policing we dont need where i watch kids getting arrested for doing things kids at yale and stanford did when i was there. Now theyve got records and cant get jobs because they were arrested on marijuana charges in indicate that presidency and prs bragging and what that is economically to a city is stunning whenn you have mass incarceration for lowlevel nonviolent drug crimes. But i do know when we target thl small percentage of people in my city who have records of violence weve been able to have incredible results. Thats why i think thatyo if i s the mayor and you are my u. S. Attorney we could do some good by targeting with the problem butom then you said something ee which stunned me when i became a carousel we are able to drive down the recidivism rates by having substantive programs that help people come home. First getting identification or housing dropped the recidivism rates not to mention the other things begin to but weth cant find funding for those programs to expand them to scale. We know they work. Its not even a more like more s no debate here. Can you tell me that the funding issue that we were able to take programs like this to scale what kind of results do you think that we could see . Thank you for the question. I think we could see major results. We do something in chicago where we identify our population in each, vanity. We are looking at who are the identified people andpl what doe have currently. We are doing everything putting subsidizing getting a ged, transitional jobs, supporting them, paying for them to get to and from School Without having to pay for it. So we all agree on the things that matter most and i think that the other, some people would say that families are important. Weve got to have families that are healthy mentally, financially and are housed. This is something i dont think most americans know, rural and urban areas that the cost of a shooting i went to my hospital in new arcana said how much is a nonfatal gunshot wound cost taxpayers, hundreds of thousands of dollars not to mention what the trauma does to a family or a community. Businesses close because they had shootings. We cant come up with of the investments and evidencebased programs that are actually working to lower violence we are being penny wise and theres foolishness innd this country ad theres enough bipartisann opportunity here in this room to show that we can do bipartisanst things on actual stuff that works to lower violence but communities that are so suffering from the trauma is incredible. If i can pass one last degree of indulgence on a personal level. This is about senator lee. Its very personal because as much as he is my friend, he doubts me. So mr. Bryant, you are under oath here. Am i a former tight end or the greatest youve ever played with . I guess at stanford, on our particular team he would have been the greatest. That is on the record forever. I stand corrected now. I am never going to doubt you again after that one. Weve been arguing about this for years so thank you for putting that to rest. I would like to start with you. Tell us a little bit about how manyny people in the united stas every year are using, how many times each year does an american use a firearm in selfdefense . We dont have an exact number, but when you look at the conglomerate of studies, mostly they find that within a couple of very limited exceptions for outliers i would note the 2021 national20 firearm survey furthr validated of those studies and came to a conclusion of 1. 6 million and again that was the most expensive ever conducted. Putting legal restrictions on the books to the extent they might impair things normally lawabiding people to comply with the new law what would that do to those new people . It shows generally that its all about understandingde where the risk is for the ordinary citizens who mentally stable and not experiencing extreme stressors most american gun owners at any given point the biggest benefit as they can protect themselves against theis biggest most substantial threat which is external crime. But i think most people on the panel would agree there are cases where if you are experiencing a crisis you statistically might be a bigger threat to your self or if you are the one perpetuating crime, now you are statistically theti threat that needs to be solved so its understanding where that is through ordinary lawabiding on gun owners and the ability to possess the firearm is a benefit to them. Assuming that they are not using them in the couch cushion for their 6yearold to find. Ro that would be problematic. Its helpful to the. 1 of my colleagues made earlier in the hearing that we want to get to a similar place in so far as wanting to protect human life. We want fewer deaths. Dangerous things can happen if we assume that when we pass a law it is going to affect and its going to be a lifesaving when its not necessarily always the case. When you have the government of mexico issue a Public Health Emergency Declaration restricting lawabiding persons to certain places thats significant. When you look at the new mexico case in particular, you research that and found some fascinating information. 0. 002 of concealed carry permit holders inne new mexico have thr permits r revoked for any reaso . I dont remember the number off the top and its the case when you look at the permit revocation in any state they are minuscule for any violation that doesnt necessarily mean that it was revokedme because they use their web and violently. Sometimes they had a dui or any sort of nonweapon related offense but on the whole when you look at those numbers, they are amongst if not the most lawabiding segment of the population. And yet the executive order would have affected themsp disproportionately. Meanwhile, youve got new research thats been done and a lot of experts on the field from across the political spectrum that have weighed in on this and earlier this year the chief of the Police Department said if we want to see homicides go down, but i think we have established here we want to save lives and keep bad guys with guns in jail and right now the average hassp been arrested 11 times prior to them committing a homicide. In 2021 there was a study commissioned by the institute for criminal Justice Reform that found a gun violence in dc to tightly concentrated on a very small number of highrisk individuals in fact they estimate that within a year 500 identifiable people considered to be very high risk comprising 60 to 70 of all gun violence in the district. So there again if what we focus on is rules that are going to be new rules separate and apart from god dozens of laws that have normally been broken the minute someone commits a gun crime and kills another human being with a gun. If it is the rights of the lawabiding and enhance their ability to defend themselves well but necessarily save lives . That is one of the things im talking about in my testimony that i referenced this idea of a lot of our commonly proposed are not designed to get at any of the underlying factors. If you tag on the universal background check the people that the firearms to commit illegal crimes are not going to suddenly say what is illegal so now i wont do it. Yoyou are expanding the likelihd that an otherwise is going to get caught up in the offense or even worse it could undermine their ability to defend themselves in the most acute scenarios. And those surveyed only 1 of them thought they were from a retail source and the other was through some illegal avenue on the street or Something Like that . So weve got to be very careful lets not punish and restrict their ability to protect themselves that will cost lives save them . I told the senator he could have my slot because i would be here a while. I will recognize the senator and takese the next democratic spot that lines up. I along with senator cornyn and a senator murphy to negotiate the bipartisan savor communities act standby i think its policy thats going to age well for you and update. Thereve been 168,971 purchase transactions for under 21. 1200 were denied. Not to based on the savor communities act but based on a prior policy. 428 were denied based on the savor communities act. To the Second Amendment advocate who said this is going to lead to a mass confiscation them if they see the basis for the 400 or so that were respected. I would encourage people to take a look at this bill and not just look at the gun safety for the next process. Take a look at the school hardening, take a look at investment and Mental Health and a generational opportunity to address what i believe is the root cause behind many of these Mass Shootings and quite honestly many of the deaths related to guns. Take aat look at the number of suicides that are committed that was legally purchased. Its a Behavioral Health challenge that we need to look at. I supported the bipartisan effort because i thought of the policy was going to be good policy. But i dont like are people that are making it harder to get people back to the table to get something a done. One of the reasons i didnt go to the signing as i expected he would talk about more than he dneeds to get done and he knows damn well it doesnt have bipartisan support. That is an area we can Work Together. A similar, you want to push us further back from coming up with reasonable policy cost of the executive order thats unconstitutional. That takes people away from the table. Now lets talk about violence in our communities. Help us help your communities. Get right with providing information to the next processor so that they have the best available information about the background if youre a Second Amendment advocate you should be providing information to the next Processing Center for those under 21 to get their guns sooner. If you are a gun control advocate, you should and incidentally senator booker is one of the worst offenders providing Background Information ovthat we need to process and identify people at risk has to do with Behavioral Health at adjudication and criminal arrest records. Weve got to get this implementation right and look at other proponents among the bill. I promised i wasnt going to take the rest of the time on it but people need to understand instead of looking past to the next thing we should do here which is often times dividing every single senator should understand that a bill and dooho what i do. It has meaning after remaining in our state to make North Carolina the best implementation in the savor communities act and other states hopefully will follow. Now ive got to get to the broken window theory. I believe i am living in an eastern mark. Hti bought a condo about five years ago and promised my wife when we get out of here i will not walk home. Its a 15 minute walk and thats because local mayors and town councilsve have lost sight of te fact that i believe the broken window theory is real. And i believe that someone that is up for the nomination in baltimore, former Baltimore Mayor elected a white mayor in the form of Martin Omalley because they were fed up with what they werere experiencing in baltimore and by stepping up he reduced crime and you can debate the number by about 30 as much as 42 . And it wasnt because people were getting a pass ondi jaywalking or anything else. He was Holding People responsible for about what was acceptable behavior. The resurgence of crime we arese two washington d. C. Has more to do with people mixing up, i believe people deserve forgiveness. You are a lot further along your faith journey than i am in forgiving and mass murderers and a number of other people but good on you for being there. Hopefully we can both agree these mass murderers need to redeem themselves with the spend the rest of their life in prison when we are talking about those sorts of offenses. But until we start recognizing our communities are less safe, governors orders taken with guns like new mexico are forcing more people to buy guns. Gun ownership is at an alltime high and it is going to get higher if you keep doing this kind of crab. We need people to sit around the table and act like adults. Go back and have unpleasant conversations with people who are in our parties but get to the table and solve problems we are not going to do it talk about take all the guns away or give them all guns. We are not going to do it by making any of the increase in Crime Reduction safety in these communities excusable. Whether it is chicago, charlotte, new york, portland, does not matter. We all know it feels like you cant tell me you can walk the streets of San Francisco at night now and feel safe at local election state elections every what needs to recognize they have a responsibility to the people of those communities to make them safer and they are going in the wrong direction. Gun violence is on one piece of the puzzle. Thank you, senator tillis. Senator cruz . Thank you, mr. Chairman. We are at yet another hearing called by democrats on gun control. Understand that todays the democrats in the senate, these are not your fathers democrats. They are no moderate democrats left. In congress. Todays a democrats when it comes to guns their objective is to disarm lawabiding citizens. They simultaneously embrace policies that release of violent criminals from jail. They are not interested and locking up murderers they are not interested in a locking up gang bangers did not interested in locking up violent criminals and said they systematic support policies that relieve violent criminals. By the way if you are hesitant to believe me when i say this perhaps you will believe the mayor of dallas zach johnson is a friend increase a lifelong democrat is elected in dells been a democrat his whole life until just recently. Kate left the Democrat Party became a republican but let me read you why he became a republican quote apportionment adversities are in disarray they failed to make Public Safety a priority or physical restraint but mostly local leaders are proud democrats who viewed cities as laboratories for liberalism rather than as havens for opportunity and free enterprise. Too often at local tax dollars are spent on policies that exacerbate homelessness coddle criminals and make it harder for ordinary people to make a living too many local democrats insist on virtue signaling proposing halfbaked Government Programs that aim to solve every single societal ill finding new ways to thumb their noses at republicans of the state and federal level. I have to say to an ordinary person the political ideology of todays democrats make no sense. Why you are priority disarming lawabiding citizen but not going after the violent criminal . And to be clear it is the radical left that defendant the police. Why so theres no moderate democrats left the invited administrations nominated not one not two but three of the leading advocates of abolishing of the u. S. Department of justice. Every single democrat in this committee voted to confirm every single one of them. But not just on this Committee Everything will democrat in the night state senate voted to confirm. The u. S. Attorney and attorney andmassachusetts one og advocates of abolishing as a local prosecutor. Put out a list of Violent Crime she would not prosecute. You know what . We are not having a hearing. We are not having a hearing on the impact of source prosecuted losing violent criminals from jail. Were not having hearing on carjacking washington d. C. Because the Democrat City Council lowered the penalty for carjacking. Lowered the penalty for murder we are not having a hearing on congressman a democrat from texas who is carjacked in washington d. C. And 9 30 p. M. At night. We are also not having a hearing in the nt fan black lives matter riots across the country because the democrats when stores are being polluted when police cars are being firebombed from Police Officers are being murdered that is not a crisis. If they agree with the ideology of the criminals. Instead their objective is they want to take away the fire arm from the single mom is taking the subway home at night. Who will, that is only prevention she has against the violent criminals. The democrats are unleashing and by the way to give you an underscoring of its, look we have a mental Health Crisis in this country. I have repeatedly introduced legislation to improve school safety. To invest in double the number of Police Officers in schools democrats objected to invest 15 billion in Mental Health counselors in schools democrats objected. Their priority is not stopping the criminals. Their priority is disarming lawabiding citizens. And that by the way they call the Public Health crisis they want to put suppose it experts in charge of disarming you. The Second Amendment and the bill of rights is not a Public Health crisis. What is a Public Health crisis is the crime at rates that are skyrocketing because democrats keep letting murderers and violent criminals out of jail. But let me ask you a question in terms of Public Health. Right now today what is the leading cause of death for americans aged 18 45 . Next i believe its opioids for. It is, in his drug overdoses. Last year more than 100,000 americans died of drug overdoses. 70 of that came from chinese fentanyl that is flooding across our southern border because this administration is open up our southern boards 8. 6 million Illegal Immigrants has enriched the drug traffickers. Do you think that no flooding crust the south that it killed collectively one 30,000 overdoses last or do you think thats a Public Health crisis . s absolute synthetic pencils a major Crisis Center read from my home state of rhode island is been a leader in trying to stop the supply pigments except he hasnt because senator reid logs every of the democrats a poster of items open of orders when we try to secure the border they block it over and over and over again and the criminals to come across who are taking peoples lives that is because the democrats refused to enforce a lot of et cetera proves equally important is Harm Reduction to ensure those who use opioids have access to things to help so they dont use illicit substances up the street thank you. Quick senator whitehouse. Thank you very much. Let me welcome her and all of her good work and rhode island. Did you have occasion in the Emergency Rooms of rhode island to treat gunshot patients . I did. And did you have occasion to observe the difference between gunshot injuries from what you might call regular ammunition versus gunshot injuries from essentially weapons of war where the project out, the bullet travels a particularly high speed as it hits the human body . It is difficult to know in the Emergency Department what type of ammunition is used. We have seen an increasing number of patients with multiple gunshot wounds which is obviously much more difficult to save. What is the experience like of the ambulance pulling up into the bay and somebody coming into your hands with a gun shot wounds particularly multiple gunshot wounds. If you can identify a high speed of projectile ar15 type gunshot wounds. Quick so we get an alert from ems theyre coming of the gunshot wound which we often but not always do we mobilize not just emergency physician but also trauma surgeons, social workers, medical students, respiratory therapist and so theres radiology texas hunting 15 and 20 forks go into a room we mobilize blood supply in order to have that at the ready. We bring a lot of different equipment ranging from chest tubes to the tools we used to crack a chest if needed. And have standard algorithms we follow as we take care of a patient. Sometimes those are successful. Often they are not. The likelihood of saving someones life depends on where they are shot and how many times they are shot. I have seen although i cannot did bike types of ammunition or firearms in the Emergency Department thats not my training and we do not know that at the time i have seen organs shredded, a orders dissected i have seen folks with gunshots to the brain as well. Quick suffice it to say knife wounds and beating injuries are customarily easier to treat that gunshot woods particulate multiple gunshot wounds . That is correct. I will also say another senator made a point about suicide. Most Suicide Attempts we can also save a Suicide Attempt by a firearm are almost universally lethal. Ask not to belabor the point too much, but have you ever witnessed multiple injuries by muskets which was the firearm of choice at the time the Second Amendment was drafted per carat dont know that ive ever seen a musket wound. Cooks i think the founders may well have had enough common sense to understand and the time it takes to reload a musket, if someone were going berserk in a tavern or at a musical performance there would be plenty of time to intervene and that something categorically different takes place when an individual has access to weapons that either are or can be configured to rapidfire and to fire ammunition of an entirely different and more destructive nature because of the speed to which the projectile flies. So thank you for being here. So sorry we lost you to our connecticut neighbors. But thank you for your service in rhode island and im glad you still tell everyone you are a rhode island avenue reflects ev. Tilt my home thank you. Thank you, senator whitehouse. I would like to say a word to those of the witness table especially those with white coats. Now you have seen it. Youve seen the debate of the american political scene over something from your perspective that seems so obvious. I would imagine if your yourprofessional responsibilitis take you into surgery or treatment room for a gunshot victim after its over you finally get a chance to relax for a moment with a colleague you think what are those politicians thinking . Why dont they take a look at what we are seeing every single day and virtually every hospital across america and why dont they do something . There are two or three different approaches as you probably noted listen to the senators who asked her questions. I can recall one approach i was a member of the house almost 30 years ago, thats a long time. Thirty years ago along came a new narcotic called crack cocaine. It scared us of. It was a form of cocaine but it was a form that was dirt cheap, highly addictive and devastating to pregnant women carrying babies. We decided to do something. We passed the drug bill. What we did was this, we got tough and i mean really tough. We increase the penalty for crack cocaine over powder cocaine by 100 one. One hundred one. Which could hold in your hand and put you in prison for the rest of your life. That was our answer to it from import into it for what happened exactly the opposite of what we expected. The price of crack cocaine on the street went down instead of up in the use of crack cocaine in our country went up instead of down. Then we filled the federal prisons for almost 20 years primarily with africanamerican defendants who were sentenced to long sentences sometimes over 20 years for the handful of crack cocaine. Ultimately we came to her senses and reduce her from 100 one to 18 one. Let me add there is literally no difference of the impact crack cocaine on your system over powdered cocaine but we were getting tough, really tough. Finally under President Donald Trump and i mean that under President Donald Trump he signed a bipartisan bill that senator grass and i cosponsor called the First Step Act which basically said we take away the mandatory minimum aspects this debate has been going on as long as i have been in congress. We learned and we have forgotten and learned again and forgotten again that as we face today. To think people dont recognize what guns are doing to america its amazing to me they got up on the roof of the business in highland park, illinois 60 seconds he fired off 83 rounds. Eightythree rounds for military assault weapons tell me the average american needs a military assault weapon to protect themselves and their family. I dont buy it i just dont buy it whatever my view of the Second Amendment did not include anything envisioned by Founding Fathers look like an assault weapon. Will we do anything as a result of the hearings . Some of you as witnesses have expressed a weariness we keep returning to this topic. It is intentional its not accidental. Coming back to this topic as long as it is a threat to america and it is certainly a threat. Special guests from chicago, thank you for coming for you thanks for what you do with your lives you do not give up on people and that really makes a difference. Theyre turning lives around wet to do more of it. So at this point weve learned n hospital and communitybased programs violence prevention programs partnerships with lawabiding governors and more all steps that can prevent firearm injuries and death it bears repeating we are going to continue to tackle this topic because that is why we were sent here for thats the providence of responsibility in the Senate Judiciary committee. The hearing of record front to remain open for one week for submission materials for the record with that the Senate Judiciary committee stands adjourned, thank you. 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