Culture in scotland, it sent too contested. Which is good. And everyone who lives in scotland, permanent residency in scotland, qualified commonwealth citizen gets a vote. I am german, the accent never goes away. I am german. I have residency in scotland. I lived there for five years, once you get permanent residency you get to vote. If you are a scott that moved to england, you dont get a vote it. Is the same for the Scottish Parliament. Some dont like that, obviously it is not majorly contested because, this is the Scottish Parliament franchise. Some didnt like that it is an agreed franchise. The idea, who lives in scotland, votes, that includes, i think 10 now of people who were born in england. For example, who have residency in scotland. That is the voting franchise, the only change was the lowering of the voting age to 16. That is a cross party consensus. Geographically splits within scotland, we do see splits, there was a pole in glasscow, the crucial thing is. For example. The people who live more socially deprived circumstances. Those have all narrowed a bit. If you have an area with high deprivation, you have more yes voters. Therefore, if you have a city or council with more socially deprived residences, most of the graphically variances that we see are the populations in those region. One or the other feel they are pulled down. People born outside and in england, immigration in scotland has increased tremendously. Eastern europe, with the new there werent enough people in scotland. And in several other sectors, the other thing is, scotland needs migration, more so than england. Scotland is more rapidly aging over the next few decades, demographic problem, smp clearly states, they want more open immigration as the rest of the uk that started to restrict immigration heavily. Scotland, based on Scottish Nationalists, wants more open immigration policy. Higher than in the rest of the uk. A lot of people in scotland, show that scotlands contribution to the assets of the United Kingdom is greater as the population as well though. Longstanding debate. Generally speaking, most by the institute of physical studies. Other western European Countries are facing as well. If scotland becomes independent, there are loads of scenarios, they depend on variables, it is difficult to say how it pans out. The middle of those scenarios effectively say, scotland would be able to function as an independent country, it wouldnt be the land of milk and honey. In terms of increasing welfare, reducing taxes, that is probably is not possible. It is probably somewhere in the middle between the stories, it depends on the price, it depends on, for example, scotland has a Strong Financial sector. The most important financial place. The largest Financial Center in the uk, larger than westminster or birmingham ham. Some said they may consider moving to england f they do this, what does it mean. More Companies Say they would invest in scotland if it becomes independent it is hard to access. There are risks and opportunities t depends on external influences, oil price, how much oil is in the north sea. How much is taken out. Which you have conflicting view, some put it at the top. If you take the advantage on all of these, you get the image, it is basically, probably a country that would have the same sort of problems that a lot of others have. Increase welfare, you have to increase taxes, or cut Something Else. I sound vague, i know that if you read all the economic evaluations, you have to be vague there, are substantial risks and opportunity that come into it. Does the north sea oil belong to scotland . The oil contributing to the uk, the oil revenues are going to the uk, 90 would be in scottish waters. Gerald chandler. Could you tell us if you have data on things you havent talked about. How many scotts live in england, are they in favor of independence. And how much mixed couples are there, british, english, married scotts, what are they thinking . Research group naweals did a survey of the english, i am sure they have a variable in there, i only lookad the headline. I havent looked at the data yet. Sorry about this. I can tell you that the english who live in scotland, 10 of the population, you wont be surprised the majority intends to vote no. A large group of undecided in that group as well. Interesting. Yes. I am sorry, i cant talk about the english in more detail. I can give you, later, i can give you the reference to the team that has done the research on that group. Perhaps, an unfair question. Identify yourself. I am ethan marrin. Sir, you mentioned unsurprisingly, what happens in scotland is unlikely to have great influence in russia what of the reverse . Do recent events in russia, syria and iraq, the recent, for the want of a better term, very bad things, likely to induce conserveatism, or we dont have good enough data to say . It is a good question. I think it is genuinely a good question. What you might say, what i showed early yearl, a a majority of scotts are over 60 , like the option. Most of the ones who say, independence the first option, second favorite option, go for it. Surprisingly. The majority of scotts if you ask them now, say, Foreign Affairs best done by the uk. That is a valid question. Imperically though, what we have seen over the last few weeks, the polls, if anything, have shown a shift to yes. We have seen intenseification of conflicts in the ukraine, conflicts, that britain has a stake n with iraq for example. So, sorry, one more jump, the people who say undecided, must have accepted the degree of uncertainty. Everyone who is undecided will go to no. If you are undecided, you go with the status quo. It might be true if it is a quick decision. I think most people who for whom any uncertainty is a frb, they will have already decided to go to no. I think a large group of them will be a no. A lot of people who will say, you know, under no circumstances, do i think i want scotland to defend itself. I want, you know, the powerful uk as my defense. I think the most of them are already a no. They may see the views reaffirmed. The currency issue was a similar thing. This may be more likely to vote no or yes, the majority of people who said that were indicating they were yes or no. What it might do is force people to solidify their views on this. It doesnt seem to be shifting more people into this. As far as i would go with what we can see at the moment. I think. Sgm with the camera here in the back. I am a journalist with the army and television. The reason we follow more closely scotland, is because there is a similar situation in the calk cuss, enclave succeeded. The conclayton county is not resolved yet. If people vote yes. September 18, do you think that skolt land becomes a member of international, independent member of International Community and un member. This determination movement. I think that i will do an exception for ukraine, western conflicts seemed to be uniteded against russian regarding ukraine. My question will be about eddinburg agreement. Independent from the result that is we will have on september 18th. Agreement. I dont have enough know on specific cases, talking about, i think it would be very difficult situation. Potentially, if any independent Scottish Government afterwards. On the one hand, they will they wont want to look hypocritical. They will want to say, Self Determination of people is a positive thing. That certain voices in some parts of the Scottish Nationals, at the same time, they will want to join nato. And then, as i said on several occasions, people are pragmatic. Politicians, fairly pragmatic. That might be conflicts there. I have a distinct feeling in general rhett rick, uncontentious circumstances, they may be supportive. In things where it would basically hinder their ability to integrate. Then, that would partially depend on who the government of an independent scotland would be. The Political Landscape in scotland will change. You will see a stronger conservative you have in scotland, it wouldnt be associated with westminster english conserveatism. The potential there is there. There are view that is align with conservative policies. If you get a different government, it is hard to predict. I think they used it as an argument. The key thing, they say, if everything works out as it looks in the moment in the case that scotland became independent, it would look like a peaceful transition, hopefully, if that is the case. So, there is a difference in the term, it sent scene as conflict. Many few scotts say, our will is suppressed and the uk agreement to that referendum that is one of the key things, i think that will be an argument in terms where they may want to differential themselves. It would depend on which parties form the Scottish Government. That is a difficult one. Joanne thornton, policy connections international. I wanted to go back to your issue about the economy being number one. You mentioned that the yes vote is increasing, and the most dispositive issue for people is the thought that economy would do better after independence. Is there anything in particular that has convinced more people to think that way . I noticed that businesses have weighed in on both sides of the debate. There seems to be more companies on the yes list than the no letter, was that a factor, or Something Else persuading people. Yes, in fact, the economy could do better under it. This is an interesting one, two letters, first, a group of company that is supported Better Together on the no side. So, the yes list has more companies, but Smaller Companies on average. That is you not, not surprising. What is interesting, compared to 2013, overall, in the social attitude survey, fewer people that thought that scotlands economy would be better. Remember what i showed, there was a much clearly crystallize situation. I have to come up the word crystallization to those who think the economy would do better, nearly all vote yes, it is within that group, nearly everyone is on the yes side. The group has become smaller compared to 2013. However, in august, it has, in the polls at least, it seems to have increased. Saw an increase of people who thought the economy would do better. Overall, not substantially more people than 2013 at best think the economy would do better, that group has been convinced to the yes vote. Which is, you know, makes it all even more complicationed complicated. It is a twoyear long process with a lot of civic debate. So, peoples attitude formation, on this issue is complex. As you know, the American Government weighed in somewhat diplomatically on the no side. I wondered if that has had any impact one way or the other, what attitude about that is . Also, how has there been any discussion of what the special relationship with the u. S. Would be in the event of a yes outcome . It is really interesting, i remember the individual, it the day where we presented our new research results, gosh, we will be out of all the media today. We were still in. When the statement was made by president obam ait didnt move the polls either way, neither did it in january, when boroso made his statements, the substantial answer, i think, the issues about what happens in scotland dominate the decision making. We have seen interventions, i think, and slightly aneck do theal here, if you live in scotland, if you ever have been to scotland, it is never fruitful to try to tell scotts from the outside what to do. There is relatively little response to that. It is not they dont care, that it dwnt matter, people discussed it. It was not what people were basing their issues on. The core issues for people is what happens in scotland in the future. Those issues were discussed. They are not the ones that people really grabbed on to make their decision. I am joan bates, i would vote note on the issue if i had the chance. My question s if the no vote succeeds, is it end of the campaign for independence for scotland or will it happen again . That is a very good question. Some people have said it will be the end of the Scottish National party as well. It is clear, there may be internal reorg, the role they would take is to campaign for the greatest level of evolution, if you remember, before the campaign started, the government advocated was, one about independence and evolution, the uk insistod a yes or no vote. They didnt want to, you know, i think the key thing s people vote for maximum, it wouldnt have worked. Some of the parties would is have advocated for that as well. Now, there would be negotiations in the event of a no vote. Some agreement would be reached in the next few years, evolution of power to scotland, i think it depends on the satisfaction. If people become more satisfied with the settlement, and the governments they get, the way people evaluate the relationship between scotland and the uk, depends on the performance of their Scottish Governments, off the people that represents them. Which makes some sense. If they would be confident about that, and like it another run for independence may not be successful. Strong dissatisfaction, feeting of people shortchanged. Then, of course, there could be another attempt. Not within the next few years, probably. The only thing that could be in the medium term, an influencing factor, would be the context, i could imagine, at an earlier point, in the future, that issue would be brought back up. In the context of what i discussed before. It would take a while. How long that quite s i dont know. Question down at the end. Final question. I am robert. I am a doctoral stupidity at georgetown. In the future predictions more in the historical reasoning behind this. You mentioned a lot of younger generations are feeling perhaps more british, equally british and scottish, less fully scottish. Has there been policy changes from the english that influenced that . What is going on in scotland that you think, you mentioned a generational thing between the internet. Other factors that lead people to feel that way . We look the at what we have seen an increase amongst the adults n being more likely to say scottish and british, we have seen it increase in 2012, 2013 other the london olympics, must have been. If it was Something Like this, we didnt see a drop. It started before. It doesnt seem to be Something Like the olympic games. There hasnt been much policy on recent years on the Scottish Government emphasize scottishness per se. Scoots are very, very careful we have been involved with a lot of schools here, events for scoot students, and schools are very, very cautious discussing political issues. Based on our research, that is what we are doing too casually, young people see schools as a play to discuss politics. They said they would prefer schools would not discuss is it the rev rundem. If they discuss it in school or not, if anything, they are stub born and dont like to be told what to do. The political confidence grows when they discuss it. The scottish schools, any time there is anything about curricula for example that seems to be trying to emphasize scottishness, there is a lot of critical commentary on this. There is notice a bit more talk about the emphasizing of previous education policies, what does it mean to be seen, and again, education is a matter to scotland. Little influence. I think those shifts are not i would think they are not strongly based on political things but experience. I would say, more recent needs to be done. It is nice to be at the and a stimulating place to discuss that issue. Our website will have the slides, after we make a couple of corrections to get in likely votes, they will be up in a day or so. You can consult them there. Join me in thanking our speaker for a simulating presentation. More from the washington journ series on Higher Education, and the schools of the big 10. On tuesday, we heard from the head of the university of wisconsin. This is half an hour. This this mornings cspan bus on the campus of the university of wisconsin at madison, ray cross, the president of the university of wisconsin system. Thank you for being here. Lets begin with this distinction of being the president of the university of wisconsin system. What does that mean . Within the university of wisconsin system, greta, there are 13 fouryear institutions, 13 twoyear feeder institutions. Extension is in all 72 counties. In addition to that, there are 180,000 students, throughout the system. 40,000 employees. It is roughly the sixth largest system in the United States with about a 6 billion budget. Sizable, Public Higher Education operation. What does it mean that you are the president of the system . Opposed to a president of just, lets say the university of wisconsin madison, one site . The theory behind the system is, they are meant to coordinate and to develop state in terms of sharing the resources and helping them more effectively, cost effectively deal with the issues that are common to all of them. We represent each of the them in the capital. They partner with us, on issues related to state legislation or federal legislation. You referenced the 6 billion annual budget for the university of wisconsin systems, state funding makes up 1. 2 pillion, gifts, grants and contracts, and Economic Impact, what does that mean . Most Economic Analysis that impact, in terms of what it does to the economy, throughout the state, it has an impact of what we purchase, how other, who we hire, how that money stays in the economy that say direct and indirect impact of those expenses on the economy in the region. We want to hear from wisconsin residents this morning, we have a fourth line set aside for them. We divided, the lines, students, parents and educators, residents, the students. We divided the lineups this morning, we are talking to the system madison today. How big is the university of wisconsin, madison . It is probably six thsd or seventh in that category in the middle of the big ten. Madison is the Third Largest recipient of Research Dollars in the United States. It is a Major Research institution, ranked in the top five for as long as i can recall remember. It puts a tremendous emphasis on research. We have seen the outcome of that in terms of vitamin d addition to milk, Stem Cell Research, translating skin cells to stem cells, changes those into different heart cells, retina cells, research in the biosciences, it is a phenomenal institution, when it comes to research, and energy, and areas like that it has been active in weather station activity. It i think we have 18 noble prize winners, engineering, and chemistry. Medicine, physics, it is a Major Research institution. The university of wisconsin madison, the tuition fees for undergraduate, for instate, a little over 10,410, out of state, 26,660. The room and board costs, 8,600. Who decides how much tuition costs . Im sorry, i didnt hear all of that greta . Who decides who decides the price tag for in state and out of state . The board of regents has authority to establish the tuition. That is generally negotiated with the legislature, that is the University Puts forward the budget and develops the budget, it does so in collaboration with the board of regents, that process of determine determining tuig s what state will do, for revenue in state aide and what we need to terms of tuition. Who sits on the regent board . Who sits on it . There are 18 members on the board. They are appointed, some of them, most are appointed by the sgnch, confirmed by the senate. Several of those are occupying positions as a result of their position, so, there are two student appointees from it Governors Office. The superintendent sitos that one of the represents from the Technical College board sits on the board there. Are positions like that part of the 18member board of regents. Have they voted to increase tuition every. No, currently, there is a tuition freeze. We are in the second year of that tuition freeze. We are proposing that in the next two years, that we also freeze tuition, we think we can do it for two years t does put strain on us, no question about that. We believe affordability is really an important issue, given those issues, we have been working with legislators, and the Governors Office to balance it off. So the state, the state picks up a little bit larger portion of that budget. That is a challenge. Given the states revenue situation. And the demands on the state budget, as you probably know. Medicaid, and other nondiscretionary portions of the budget are growing rapidly. I think medicaid will go 17, 18 of the states budget to over 30 in the next decade. That leaves legislators with less discretionary money, with which the higher ed portion comes from. Governor walker wants a tuition freeze. The opponent, the democrat, concurs. How many students are eligible for final aid at the university of wisconsin . The madison has dramatically helped n a few moments, i will meet with the fund for wisconsin scholars, a Financial Aid effort that has been helpful. They have increased Financial Aid efforts to help offset costs for students, about 73 as i recall, gret aof the students throughout the system, receive final aid. Do you think college is worth it . Students in terms of Economic Analysis, College Graduates earn more, considerably more than their noncollege counterparts, in addition to that, the Unemployment Rate for College Graduates is roughly hamp of what it is for nonCollege Graduates. There is a definite distinguishing characteristic, economically. I dont think it should be measured only on economic scale. The value of a university of education goes beyond that it is important to understand what it means to have an educated citizenry. That is the fundamental, i think the fundamental piece of what a Higher Education experience is all about. Earnings, and Economic Impact on the family, the state, is important. I think it is also important in the state of wisconsin, where we have about 150 to 170,000 vacant job positions right now it is important for the university to help to create high impact talent to address those needs. 40 of those positions require a bacheloriet degree. Good writing, good Critical Thinking skills, et cetera. To phone calls, pam, go ahead. Caller good morning, thank you for taking my call. Good morning president cross, i am calling in regard to your statement and reference to our university as a premier and Progressive Research institution. I was surprised to learn that myat mamatder they take pride is is performing archaic experiments on baby monkeys. A petition started, 200,000 have signed that, it appears i am not alone. I am calling to see how you reconcile this in the testing that so many researchers are calling unnecessary, cruel and outdate wide our image and reputation as a progressive school. Thank you, pam. That process that one goes through, on a University Campus to secure approval to do research of that type is very extensive. As i recall there, are four different levels, and the faculty that review that come from all different disciplines, it is a rigorous process. The need for this has to be warranted through that process. That is handled here at the madison campus what i consider to be very diligent people. So, that process has been underway, the Research Program has been through that process. So, i think we have to let that process guide us. Secondly, i am aware of these concerns, and i have received those. We are taking those very seriously. We are sharing those with the board. We are reevaluating this. We are concerned about this. Thank you, pam. President cross, is there federal oversight. Does the federal government has a have a say in that . There is a serious oversight process, that is a part of this, too. Gret a. How does that process work . If you are doing lab work, or animals are involved, Human Research involved. How, there are protocols they audit that on a regular basis and establish the processes that help to guide that. Thank you for cspan, i fairly simple question. My son is going to a college, a State College here in minnesota, we have heard of a collaboration between north carolina. A reciprocity agreement negotiatad the state level, we currently have that. The big ten bus tour started out at the university of minnesota last week. If you missed that, go to the website, cspan. Org, we are doing a monthlong series of interviews with president s from different big ten universities and todays cspan bus is at the university of wisconsin madison. We are taking your questions and comments about Higher Education, the wisconsin system president my biggest concerns was that it seem thad this did not pass full commitment, and only went to a subcommittee without full approval, is that your recollection of what transpired . It is my understanding that it did go through the entire process. At this point, at least, i am not sure it has started, i am sure it has gone through. I think it has gone through the entire process. What are the challenges of reaching students in the rural yashs of wisconsin . There are a number of challenges facing those students, i was reading about florrence, county in wisconsin, a high school with 25,000 25 students. Students. 2t institutions limits their a littles to do a lot of things i am sure they would like to be able to do. A number of problems facing rural wisconsin skuls are facing urban institutions. They are approaching them differently. Both ends of the spectum. The challenges facing them are similar. How we deal with that, what we do to help serve those foeblgs, is, i think very important. We are attempting to do more course openings, students taking High School Credit courses, with College Courses to help them get started. Rural and urban students. We need, we badly need to make sure that students get into the educational pipeline, that they succeed and letain that educational pipeline, and connect them to businesses, and opportunities, both for their career and for life. Here in wisconsin. That is a challenge in the rural setting and in an urban setting. With the cost of instate tuition, being over 10,000. Room and board, add on 8600. What about online education. A new approach, based on what you know, what you can do. Rather than, how much time you spend in the classroom. That kind of activity i believe has a great future. It faces a number of challenges. In wisconsin, and i am sure elsewhere, in wisconsin there, are so somewhere between 750,000 to a million working age adults with some damage, without a degree. That number nationally is around 31 million. Now, if we can deal with that, effectively, i think 31,000 eye think if we can deal with that effective, it is important that we educate more working age adults, not just 18yearolds, so that they can participate in this economy, the future economy, that require this kind of education. Do you see the future of education be it online or other technology, reducing the price tag of tuition as well as room and board . I am not sure. There are some examples where it has. I think that it has tremendous potential. It also has, it creates several concerns, ideally, it would be a blend, a hybrid, if you will, between online and traditional models, i think they compliment each other nicely it. Takes the right type of student to engage and leverage to the maximum ability. Some students are just not suited for that type of learning. Remember, we are focussing this type of education on adult learners, who cannot simply put their children in daycare and return to adorm and live on a campus. Trying to serve them effective. Ly. It is a different experience, it sent the same. What you gain in a residence experience is valuable, and very important. But, we want to be able to serve them with a kind of experience that they need at that point in their lives. I think that will ultimately have a huge impact on both them and the people throughout the state. Jean on twitter asks this, of those students enrolled as freshman, what percentage go on to graduate . I am trying to remember that number. I would say that we probably retain 60 . Graduate in time, in another thing. I think at madison, sixyear Graduation Rate is closer to 80 . Its in the 70s, as i recall. Systemwide, i believe its in the 60 graduation range. Were working very hard to increase that. I believe the madison campus alone has about a 4 1 2year time frame for most graduates. That kind of degree not only pays a student and their family money, it also gets them into the workplace quicker, and its something that we want to do, not only to make it affordable, but also to help our economy grow. What percentage of students are taking more than four years to graduate . More than four years. Throughout the system, thats probably going to be about 40 , in that range. I dont remember the number. Where we are above the were better than the National Average. Were considerably better than the National Average throughout the system. So, however, we dont think thats good enough. We want to do better. And i think its interesting that in my era, most students graduated between four and five years, at least. However, today, many more students are dual majoring. Theyre doing a study abroad. Its a highimpact learning practice. Theyre doing internships that delay graduation. So the learning experience they are getting is much more enhanced and complete than it was 40 years ago in my case. Virginia arthur is watching us there. Caller i wo the professor about the Stem Cell Research, if theyre doing anything for stem cell. Arthur, turn that television down when youre talking with the guest. President cross, hes asking about Stem Cell Research at the university of wisconsin madison. Im not familiar with everything were doing, but i am familiar with something theyre doing with what ive called nondifferentiated stem cells. Theyre trying to take skin cells and convert them into stem cells, which then can be converted into specific cells, heart, i know of one project on creating retina cells from those stem cells. So those are some of the Broader Research projects that im aware of involving stem cells. Susy is next in springfield. Hi, susy. Caller hi. I have two questions. Sometimes universities have issuesnn related to those adv senior faculty, having contact with undergraduates. Im wondering how many adjunct or precourse professors teach undergraduates. And the second question is, im also understanding that the number of majors an institution has impacts the cost. How many majors in each discipline, or whats the most popular majors, and have you had to eliminate majors for costs . Thanks. I think if i understand ite correctly, the question correctly, theres two parts. One is how many senior faculty teach freshmen courses. Thats a mixture. I think were very similar to most institutions. That process is focused on making sure students do well, balancing that with their ability to interact with prominent quality faculty. The second part of that has to do with popular majors, et cetera. In the last five or six years, those majors related to the stem field science technology, engineering and math, including some areas of art, the demand for those disciplines has gone up somewhere around 15 . Unfortunately, the number of faculty serving those fields has remained about the same. So one of our challenges is to increase the number of faculty in those critically important fields that the state badly needs to better serve those students, and to serve employers in some sense, and an indirect sense in the economy of the state. Thats a challenge for us. I think its a big challenge for most universities. Were working very hard to do that. Thats part of our Budget Initiative in the coming biennium. Jody wants to know, are corporations letting schools know what they need so universities can produce them . And why not, if theyre not . I didnt understand the question, greta. Could you say it again, please . Are corporations letting schools like yours know what they want . What they need from workers . Yes. Its also important, particularly in wisconsin, that wisconsin that we reach out to them. Too often, were too passive in in not seeking the input on what they happen to need. In wisconsin, we have aggregate data for the state and we look macrosense. But there are regional differences throughout the seven terms ofn the state in what employers need. And while that is i wants important to do that. Agree with that. Were working on this. One of my initiatives to more connect the university to what the corporations in the state need. Serve those needs. We have a broader purpose in educating the complete adult. Thats the complete person. A pup thats part of our challenge. Charlotte is watching us in chicago. A parent there. Host go ahead, charlotte. , caller good morning. Thanks for taking my call. As a parent, i can tell you that debt. We hcosigned for a lot of his s loans. Unfortunately we were caught up in the perfect storm, because ie started ao;[csw real estate it company about two or three yeara before the Real Estate Market e crashed. So we lost all our money, real e because of that. So we lo and my son was in college at ths time. And so we he had some money initially to start to pay for his college, but then we were i unable toto once the real estath market crashed. O so heon had to take out loans a we had to cosign for the loans, for some reason he wasnt able to get loans in his name. To so we have really been paying for college in a sense since he started in 2005. So were its just been unbelievable. And weying reached out to the senator, and he and senator out warren are very focused on the suffering. I call it suffering, but thats really what it feels like, that families are going through, trying to pay off these bills. Os and one of the issues i have is the interest thats being charged on the college debt. Its about 8 . And my husband cosigned for about 58,000 in loans for my son. By the time he was out of usband college, because the Interest Rates accruing, as soon as the a parent signs for those, guess we were so overwhelmed by pe Real Estate Market situation, we werent even focusing on that. Overw so by the time my son got out of college, some of the loans, and there were more than this, it was we were at about 66,000. Charlotte, w dn did your son go to school . So he started off his first d semester was at purdue. Irst there, he was almost afraid to tell me that he wasnt happy there. And i couldnt tell him how ll e happy i was to hear that. Because of the cost of it. That was about 20,000 that us firste of semester. Of it. And then he went to two and a half years 2 of community colle. Charlotte, im going to leave it there and have the university of wisconsin system ray cross charlotte, i understand and sympathize with that challenge youre facing. My sympathy, my heart goes out to you in terms of the market crash. Things that are circulating in the capital that are important w72c looking into. Re think its important that when the clock starts impacts that Interest Rate and your payments. Situation, it would have been some accommodation with respect to your employment. And the earnings that youre making. And then thirdly, i think its also important to note that the Financial Aid process, which is based entirely on what you thatt earned in the last year, not entirely, but heavily on that, when it changes quickly, that te can be calculated differently. A challenge,thats and i think there are several folks working on it. So i appreciate your the lks challenges youre facing, and u also want you to know that y several folks areou working on that. Well go to sue next in illinois. A parent at. There. Hi, sue. Caller hi, how are you sue e doing . Good morning. Caller one of my questions would be, are you going to attempt to do affirmative action like the university of michigan . I do believe that youre going to hurt your own kind in the unv longer run, because the asians d people from india are going to skyrocket in those grades. Already in this local area theyve already hired more people from india and asia, in their engineering departments, because theyre cheaper. And what is your stance on that . The university of wisconsin believes strongly in having a diverse population on the campus. A ha population that allows us engage in different ways of thinking and doing things. Pulati so its not just diversity in terms of what one traditionally thinks of, it also is much e broader than that. One of the mottos here at the university of wisconsin, which b is actually on a black around the campus, and its using gricl issues to find the truth. I think that occurs most an effectively when youre civilly engaged in discussions, and iviy interaction with people who are who are different, who tt thiniok differently, who explor, things together in a way thats to pursue the truth. That process is constantly being reviewed and how we do that. Academic prowess is of the greatest importance for those of those students seeking admission to madison. T and several other of our. Campuses. But we look atat broader thingss well. We also want tongs know, whats their potential for leadership, how engaged are they with the community, whats their commitment to serving others. Those issues impact admissions heavily. So then we do also look at diversity, in terms of the broad category that i would call incluesivity. Up next, the head of the university of iowa, another part of our series on higher tweet education, and the schools of the big ten. This is a half hour. And this week we have kicked off a monthlong series, lookin. At the big ten universities, and interviewing their president , giving you a chance to talk with some of these University President s. Ity this is a cspan bus tour. Pr and this month this morning, the cspan bus is in iowa city, iowa, at the university of iowan and joining us from the bus is the president of the universitys of iowa, sally mason. Dent she has been president of that University Since 2007. President mason, begin by un telling us, whats the budget iy for the university of iowa . S thu your annual budget . And where do those revenues whe rrive from . The budget for the university of iowa, the total budget for the university of iowa is aboutt 3. 4 otbillion. Largely because we have a very Large Academic Medical Center thats part of our operation, including a very big hospital. Lg its a big budget. It is absolutely one that has continued to grow, despite some of the challenges that weve had, including a very large Natural Disaster in 2008. A major flood that impacted us n rather significantly and that t were still recovering from. Recovering in very, re very fine fashion with nearly 1 billion worth of construction going on in iowa city right now. The education budget, which is probably the thing that people are most interested in, is about 680 million. And about 220 million of that comes from the state of iowa, 0 and the rest comes from tuition. And so an iowa resident is o going to pay about 8,000 a year to attend the university of to iowa, and outofstate residente will pay about 27,000. An why that discrepancy between instate and outofstate . Obviously the instate est students areob subsidized by appropriations from the state of iowasi. Were pleased and proud of thatn that continues to be the case. D for outofstate students, we e know as a state university, knos outofstate students need to t pay the full cost of their education. Hence the difference between the instate and outofstate rates. Sally mason, you have proposed a threeyear degree, baccalaureate degree, havent you, instead of a fouryear bachelor . I have, yes. Lor . Let me say a few words about that. One of the things that weve been focused on for the last bo seven years that ive been here at least, Student Success and affordability. And clearly this is somethingee thats a very high priority foro me. I was a prist Generation College student. First student in myr family eve to attend college. It was a stretch for us to pay for college. So i have a great deal of sympathy for students who are e. Struggling. And looking for ways to attend college that dont cost them everything they have. Llege so in terms of trying to make college haaffordable, we know tt theres a number of ways we can do things. Are a certainly, a threeyear degree. For students its not going to be for every student, but itr will be for highly motivated students. It will be for students who are able to go to student year round, because well include Summer School, and we have what we call a summer hawk tuition ro Grant Program thatol essentiall will allow students in this threeyear program to attend Summer School for free. In this will hasten their progressn towards their degree. Wards we hope, obviously, to completer in three years and join the work force after that time, or go ono to professional and graduate oo. School. We have awe h lot of great grad and professional programs here d that we would like students to consider. What is the response so far,s from thee students, parents, faculty . Well, weve Just Announced it this week. Were getting a lot of positive response at this point in time. I were still in thet process of developing the degree programs s that this will likely apply to. We want to make sure that it applies to degree programs that are quite sought after by our e students. Some of the more popular degreee programs wil sl likely be inclu. In this opportunity. T for students in the future. Ded were going to put the nts in numbers back up. And if you would like to talk with sally mason, university of iowa president , weve divided the numbers by students, parents and educators. Gain you can see themst there. Ucator. Theres the university of iowa on your screen. 202 is the area code. We have set aside our fourth line this morning for iowa residents, especially if youve graduated from the university of iowa, wed like to get your perspective as well, 2025853883. Sally mason, how i read an article that youve secured, or come to an agreement with the State Government to put a a tuition freeze on for a couple of years. How much work how much influence does the state of iowa, and that government have on how you budget, how you function . How the state board of regents, which governs all three stat universities in iowa. They have a great deal of authority when it comes to help with tuition and setting policy and so forth. Theyre an important governing board in this state, obviously. I theyre appointed by the governor, and theyre individual citizens of the state of iowa in generally that have a great deaw of interest in Higher Education, and a passion for helping us ghe maintain a very strong Education System here in the state. Its always something theres always something going on. I have to say, theyve been very, very supportive of our moves towards threeyear s degrees, of our continued efforts to make colleges fforts affordable as we can. Affor especially for iowa residents. F is it worth a College Education to come out of four ge years of college and have 50,000 in student debt . Well, you know, thats a lot of student debt. I have to say that our studentsi let me begin with 40 of our le studentst graduate with zero rt debt. Which ise something that im ve pleased and proud about. And then of the remaining g do graduate with debt, on average their debt aver might be in the ag 26,000, 27,0 a year range. This is something that we watch veryis carefully. And we can actually monitor that amount of cmoney, and know how much of that debt is what we call true need based debt, versus how much of that debt might be related to perhaps ps lifestyle. And about half of that 26,000 is need based debt. Ased deb thats actually what the s act students and theirua families nt to borrow to be able to attain e that College Education, that college degree. Now, is it worth it . T . At that price its absolutely s worth it. Olutel i can remember graduating from a college in 1972 with about 3,000 in student debt, which at that time was about the price or a iccar. You know, an average car. And again, our students are graduating with a debt level, for the most part, that is very manageable. I worry a great deal about the cases that we hear about in the news a lot, of students who are graduating with significantly more debt than that. We have great Financial Counselors here. We encourage every student and every family, even before they enroll, to sit down with our financial advisers, and our w Financial Aidit officers, and wa out a plan that will allow them to go to college. Not incur debt, that honestly, will be impossible for them to deal with once they graduate. Thats just not the way we should be doing Higher Education today. Sally mason, whats the career track for a College President . You majored in zoology at the university of kentucky. Had a masters at purdue. Then a ph. D. In cellular, molecular and environmental biology at the university of ar arizona. Whats a career track for a ari College President . Well, im not sure there is a career track for a college ther president. I certainly came up through the ranks as a professor. I think once i got to college, the joke in my family, who, of course, no one had ever been to college before, that once she got there, she never left. T as far as my familys concernedc imol still there. Sh still there. E. Its a joke, in fact, that im l still in college. A jo only it doesnt cost anybody any money anymore. I guess thats probably a good thing. Ore. But my career track probably wao what would have once been considered typical for a College President. Came up through the ranks, starting as an assistant professor. Went through the ranks to full professor. Took on some administrative jobs along the way, serving as a department head, dean of a very large college, and provost at purdue university, and now with the privilege to serve for the last sevenplus years as the president of the university of y iowa. My big ten roots are strong. Perhaps that comes from my mothers roots from going back to indiana. Sally mason, your job, how s much time is spent fundraising, how much time is spent being thu administrator, et cetera, et cetera . Yeah. Well, being College President today is very, very different from what it was probably 50 yearli years ago. Were in the midstif of a largee capital campaign. The largest in the history of ci the state of iowa. Of certainly the largest in the history of the university of iowa. Were in the process of raising 1. 7 billion in the iowa foreveo campaign. Were about 1. 3 billion on the way to that goal of 1. 7 billion. A lot of that money is being thm raised to provide scholarships for students, to provide professorships, to provide infrastructure, that will allow the excellence of the university of iowa to continue well on into the future. Sity o its a joy for me to be able to connect with so many alumni, jy literally thousands of to alumo all across the country and around the world who have a passion for the university of iowa. And whont have been so generousn giving back to us. Ry have i spend probably half of my time fundraising. And the other half of my time in administrative activities, in a nationaldm activities. I try to remain active in a number of National Organizations that are important to Higher Education. Thats certainly important to the university of iowa. Its important for us to be connected to the rest of our country. And to the rest of the world. 57 of College Students today are women, 26 of college any response . They have room for improvement there. Yeah, i think you know, i nt often tell thear story to young pim that iro have the opportuni to interact with today that when i was coming up through college, and i was a sophomore in was organic aking chemistry, i was one of three women in a very large chemistry class. There were w over 200 students this class. We were verynw obvious, as you might imagine. Wo we had to sit in the front row all the time, because the instructor would know if we weri there or werent there. He knew us by name. Not surprisingly. Today, you wouldnt see that. Rig today the organic chemistry ee t class wouldha be much more heteroagainous, both in terms of gender and diversity. Diversity is really something that a lot of us focus a lot of our attention on. It wha the number of women, College President s today, theres room n for growth there. Theres still room for growth in the professoiat. And Higher Education is no different. Eshm its great to see the number of young women pursuing Higher Education today. G wome that excites me a great deal. We actually have some wonderfulg engineering programs here at thv university of iowa, and im very proud of those engineering o programs. Having spent a number of use asr provost at purdue university, which is known for its engineering, our engineering programs here, almost a quarter f our students are women. Actually unusual in engineering programs today. When i look at the activities oh these young women, our retention rates and our completion rates as well as our placement rate for those young women attaining those engineering degrees are mn very, very high. Upwards of 92 to 98 . I think thats tremendous. I think that bodes well for the future. And i think our country will be well served once we continue to grow these numbers, whether it o be minorities or women in these underserved areas. This is your chance to talk r with these Major University itha president. Weve divided our lines a little bit differently. Students, parents and educators. The first call for sally t cl mason, president of the university of iowa, comes from an iowan and a parent. Paul in west liberty, iowa. Lib hi, paul. Caller hi. Miss mason, its good speaking with you this morning. I have a question regarding, my son is going to be enrolling at iowa next year in engineering. So fall of 2015. Ering. And i was wondering if engineering is going to be included in that threeyear program. And ill i take my call from yo. Thank you. Th great. Good question. Were going to work on that. Because i firmly believe that there are some portions of our engineering degrees that we cana do in three years. Tion. If hes highly motivated, and ill bet he is, because hes e already thinking about this and knows what he wants to do, and y hes going to be a hawkeye, i ui think s. Hes probably on a good track to be able to complete in that threeyear period. Were going to do everything we can to help him. In including allowing him opportunities to attend Summer School for free. Ing dee dee tweets in to you, dr. Mason, does iowa project out a decade or more what jobs will be accordingly . We bes what we think the future might be. None of usk at has that crystal ball, i can tell you that. But one of the things that we rg have learned with our students a is thatt. Having that opportunia to earn that degree in a chosen major is great. Hasen majo but lets go a little bit further. T lets offer and one of the things thats very, very popula with our students is entrepreneurship. The lets offer every student the n opportunity to couple an entrepreneurship certificate with the degree that theyre earning, whether its an art degree, whether its an engineering degree, whatever it might be. And what wereit seeing is students with that entrepreneurial spirit, as well as the training that we can help provide them with, are often enp deciding that they can make their own careers. H ing they there are often great jobs out there. We know thear health care indusy will continue to boom. Alth c we have great strengths in tinu health cartoe here at the university of iowa, training a r lot of students foe r the healt Care Industry of theiowa future. But for the students who really. Have that little extra Creative Edge and want to go on and do something, perhaps a little a l different, and perhaps a driver. For future technology, or futurf kinds of Job Opportunities that might be out there, we think that experienceial earning, the top 25 entrepreneurship programs in the country exist right here at the university of iowa, and weve grown that program so that every and any student here that wants that opportunity can have it. Watching our students start their own companies is a pretty exciting opportunity for us as t administrators, too. Sally mason, you mentioned ds the flood that hit iowa city. m out of that grew the iowa flood center, which is what . Yes, thank you for mentioning yesflood center. Were an educational he flood institution. I have to c say that in 2008, i only been president for nine id months when the flood hit. S it was certainly one of the as worst Natural Disasters to happen to eastern iowa at that n time. Our campus sustained nearly 1 billion worth of damage, including 2 million square feet of space impacted by that. Three major buildings destroyed. But during that particular ace a event, i have to say that our rl worldar famous Hydrology Group decided that this was the best s dportunity they could think of to begin to study Natural Disasters like floods. And create the flood center. Terk the iowa flood center, not only is known now throughout iowa, bt across the nation. And even around the world for its research on floods and flooding. Theyrere doingse some they groundbreaking things with technology to help us better tc understand how and when and whyn floods occur. And obviously, helping us understand how we can try to mitigate, and keep these things from being the kinds of Natural Disasters that do to us what happened in 2008. If you come to iowa city right now, we look like a city of d tower iscranes, because were a active and full flood recovery. One of my highest priorities is that we make absolutely certain we fully recover from that flooo so we can begin to grow. Sally mason is the president of the university of iowa. Allen is an educator in tacoma, washington. Rs allen, youritey on the air. Caller hi, dr. Mason. Good to talk to you. Washin im actually a student advocate with the student loan up justice. Org. And you might imagine my question is regarding student iy loan debt. Now, the presence of the college also at large have been very to unwilling to discuss the issue at any length. So im glad to have you here so i can put you on the spot a little bit, so i apologize in advance. But im not sure if youre sure aware, but almost half of people out of college are unable to pay their loans. And by my best estimates, the lifetime default rate across all students, all colleges for federal Student Loans is well in excess of 30 . And you know the other big numbers, the aggregate of the debt and so on and so forth. N ao what i found after looking at this question for quite a long r time now, is the systemically, it really comes down to the fact that the Student Loans are the cly type of loan in this country toom be specifically exempted of standard bankruptcye protections, statutes of limitations, and other critical Consumer Protections that we just assume are there. And candidly, i have to say that the schools almost never provide adequate warning to the students, in other words, the students never know these thingw before they sign for the debt. Allen, weve got a lot theree lets get a response from dr. G mason. Thank you for the question. Because i do think its an important issue. T were fortunate at iowa that ou student loan default rate is about 2 . Its quite low. Udent lo but theres certainly great examples out there of abuses of Student Loans. And by abuses, i mean, really, people not knowing exactly whatl the student loan business isy al about. There are also predatory lendere out there. We try very hard here on the front end, when students are enrolling here for the very we first time, to sit down with them and their families to make absolutely certain that they know what theyre getting into,m if they decide to go the route of a student loan. Yre and in fact, we try to steer ie some cases folks away from certain types of loans that we dont think are really good fort them in the short or the long n term, to make certain that theyre not getting into get situations that would ultimately lead to a default, and ultimately affect their lives negatively for a good long time. So its absolutely an issue we should be paying attention to. We should be looking very hard at the default rates at schoolsg out there. Ttention and making certain that the institutions themselves are doing everything that they can to help the consumers, in this case, our students and their d families, making certain that they know exactly what theyre getting into when they do the student loan that they need for college. Jenny in rainbow city, alabama. Parents line. Go n raahead, jenny. Caller yes. Call this is dr. Gregston. I wanted to comment i have a son who graduated from the n university of iowa. He got a degree in internationat relations. He was one of their best model u. N. Students, won Outstanding Award from harvard. And he went to china for three years, because the economy was e better there, and there were no jobs for people his age in this country. I was fine, i didnt mind him going to communist china. We told him china was not what he thought. The idea that cultures are full of great people. Ople, th all people are the handiwork ofe god but not all governments area equal. The socialistll government,t in china is very, very a lot like hitler, stalin jenny, what would you like president mason to respond to . T . Caller what i would like hee to respond to is the college taught them that all the l governments are equal. He was over there three years, there started his own business, and was out taking pictures at a tourist area. Ictures there was a battleship in the background. And a citizen turned him in for taking pictures there. Even though it didnt say there. Are no pictures. He s he sent seven hours in the f a basement of a Chinese Police co station with police interrogating him. Jenny, is there a specific question there . Or do you wantht herer to respoo your story . Caller the education there was not accurate as to reality. We got it. Sally mason . You, im sorry, im trying to understand her story. It sounds to me like her son had an experience, perhaps overseas that might not have been the best. One of the things that we try tv do at the university is to help our students have that First International experience with some supervision. Ents h with some folks who areav very,t very skilledh at helping them understand the different killedi cultures, the different parts of the world that they might be going to. Ts of anthd i think studying abroad tr today, especially at most of our universities in the country today, are just amazing. Universi theyre wonderful. I did not have that experience as a student myself. But i would encourage every exr student who can, to try and take advantage of a study abroad, to immerse themselves in another culture, to learn what its likn to be in a very, very differentn situation with a different government, with different with people around them. And perhaps a very different eri language being spoken, and maybe one that they s not fully understand. That First Experience is one that allows our students to grot up in very, very interesting ways, and quickly. The experience is always lifechanging. And its onenc that i think wita little help, that First Experience they have will help t them navigate the world after they graduate, and in many cases lead them to jobs that take them around the world and to different cultures. Is tenure a good system, and should it be kept as is . You know, tenure is an opportunity for faculty to really show what they can do, as well as an opportunity to make certain that they have the ability to do the kinds of things that really are necessart for all of us. Freedom of speech, freedom of ft ideas, freedom to do work that perhaps isnt necessarily going to be appreciated by everyone. Kt and in a particular case of you know, i earned tenure a long time ago in biology. I worked very hard to do so. Tig i worked very hard to prove that i could do everything that was expected of a faculty member, co and to me, it was a real honor and a privilege to be able to say that i had accomplished that goal at a point in my career when i was still quite young. And it is really all about hard work. As much as anything. And the rewards for hard work is to know that you have a sense of job security, that you have a sense that if you were to do some research that turned out to be controversial, thatme in fac that research would still be n t disseminated out into the public and valued obviously by groups that wanted to look at this research, and not have to worry so much about that, and i can appreciate that. Ry i can understand it. Th i can see the pluses and sometimes the minuses as well. Milo is calling from jefferson, iowa. Hi, milo. Caller hi. Thank you for having me on. Id just like to say theres been some serious questions, and really good ones. But ive been an iowa fan my entire life, as long as i can a remember. And im 63 years old. But iowa city is awesome. All of all the facilities, theyre just a great place. But i have a very serious question. And id like to know if you have any inside information on how many not if, but how many points iowa will beat themc2 c cyclones tomorrow . And you can ask the coach please let Mark Weissman run the ball a little bit more. And maam, i want to say, weret proud of you very much in iowa here. And itsve just been a pleasure. Thank you. Ry sally mason, i was waiting for him6 hao ask go ahead. Well, youve just experienced something that i love about my job. And thats hawkeye fans. Guest theyre great people. G i theyre great people here in iowa, and all around the fans. Country. And we have agr rivalry game llo tomorrow withun our instate rive iowa state. I was with the football coach earlier this morning, in fact, l at a breakfast. We didnt try to predict the score, but i did ask him, my fans will appreciate this, i did ask him not to make this one ap quite so dramatic. A little less drama for our football games, would be a lot better. Ll i will certainly pass the word on about allowing Mark Weissman to run the ball some more. Thanks. Im surprised milo didnt as for tickets. But how important are sports im sure he has tickets. How important are sports to fundraising . To revenues for the university . I mean, if you were at the breakfast, my guess is maybe you were looking for potential donors . Well, you know, at the university of iowa, were one ot the fortunate schools where est athletics pays for itself. And again, a testament to the fan base that we have, the loyai fan base that we have, the support that they give to our t athletics department. Our athletic students on who ar scholarship here, and theres 500 or more of these, they pay the full tuition back to us. Ese. For every one of those student l athlete scholars that we have. That contributes obviously to we the bottom line of the university when it comes to our academic mission. To the we dont pay any taxpayer dollars. No taxpayer dollars go to no athletics of the university of t iowa. Were fortunate to be part of aw great conference, the big ten conference. And the revenues that were ablh to get from ticket sales, from m tv contracts, all of that, were able to pay for everything that we do in athletics. On the fundraising side, obviously its a big plus. On the fundraising side, our s loyal hawkeye fans, many of them are not only loyal to our athletic teams, but theyre ma loyal to ourny academic teams a well. Have some ed to amazing, amazing donors who have really stepped up in a big way. Id love to mention two especially that are quite unusual for us that support our medical operations. We have a great Diabetes Center here, thanks to the fraternal order of eagles, who made an hr incredible gift, a 25 million gift. We were ableer to name this cenr after them, and hire worldclass director for this center, who is assembling a team around him with the ultimate goal of curind diabetes. And similarly, in our vision ula research group, the win Vision Institute fo r Vision Institute, led by dr. Ed stone was funded again by the generosity of the steven winn. We are so blessed, because mr. Winn who himself has an eye problem is committed to helpingb us, our researchers, cure blindness here. Were got great support on the fund rising side, and it makes my job a lot of fun. Y si de theres been movement at o of your fellow universities, northwestern, about unionizing r student athletes. Northw whats your take on that . You know, i would hate to see that. I really view our student athletes as students first. Our student athletes here perform well above, not only the school average, when it comes to graduation, and gpa, but also gr well abovead the national avera. They take their studies, and their academic piece here very, very seriously. Amateur athletics i think needs to stay amateur. We need to be able to provide ad great environment fos r our am student athletes and make sure they have all the support they e need, whether its support for d academics, or support to keep p them healthy. Im all for making certain that we continue to add to benefits for them, that we provide the highest quality opportunities e for them. Ide th but i really would hate to see them think of themselves as em employees, rather than as student athletes. I think that really, its not i what i look to College Sports for. Robert is calling in from tampa. Robert, youre on the air. Caller good morning, dr. Mason. Thank you for the roopportunity. My question to you is, could you speak as to why universities are intentionally gouging nonresident students . And incurs higher student loan debts, the reason for higher s student debt. Sally mason. Uden yeah. You know, im sorry to hear thao you think that were gouging outofstate students. What were doing is charging them the full cost of education, because the taxpayers of the g m state of iowa, who have made huge investments in theta infrastructure here, and theyva done so because they want iowa students to have opportunities n in iowa, were able to provide them with lesser obviously lesser tuition needs than we are for the outofstate students. We have to really, in good conscience, charge the full rata for the outofstate students. We believe weve provided an outstanding education at any price. Our outofstate tuition, ucatio although it may seem high, is actually still quite reasonableh we provide a lot of Financial Aid, over half a billion dollars worth of Financial Aid a year. So we try and make even all of our you know, if youre an iowa student and you meet the minimum requirements, the basic requirements that the board of regents has set for the admission to the iowa public universities, you are admis automatically admitted. Lic un we take those who meet those requirements. And then we can select from outofstate students, we select obviously from outofstate students and we try to help theb as well with Financial Aid. We have scholarships for all m w kinds of students. Fro our donors are willing to fr have been willing to provide. Scholarship dollars for iowa students as well as nonresidentr students. We think we can put together good Financial Aid packages to make this doable. Not only for our instate ma students, especially for ourke instate students, but also our nonresident students as well. I hope people understand that. I want to ask you something about our viewers across the taa nation have probably heard of, which is the iowa biters workshop. What is that and how did it get its start . Yeah. Thank you for asking. You know, the iowa writers workshop is world famous, as it should be. We have had the best creative writing programs here for a long, long time. Writin we live in the only unesco we school of literature in north america. Iowa city, iowa, was elected in 2008. Were proud of that designation. We are embedded within what is r known asou the creative corridot here in eastern iowa. And were proud of that as welln and again, the writers drive a lot of that. Weve had tennessee williams, weve had writers that everyones heard of come to our writers workshops. Write we have writers on staff right now that people would know the names. Were also very well known for International Writing programs,n which was an offshootte of the writers workshop with paul offso engel, oneot of the original directors of the iowa writers workshop, retired from his job as directing that workshop. He and his wife decided to start the International Writing program, which every year brings International Writers to iowa city. Weve had several of the writers from around the world who have w participated in the unesco program have gone on to win nobel prizes in literature. Were very proud of the roots and traditions of the arts, the humanities, literature, here in iowa. In fact, were so proud of that, because we were the First Institution to ever grant an mfa degree. In essence, it was invented here. And it was in part a response not only to our creative writers, but also to our artists. Some of yoiau may be familiar w the painting known as american gothic. That was painting was painted b grant wood. He was on our faculty many, manc years ago. He was part of the source of this idea of giving academic credit for creative workwh. So whether its writers, artists, musicians, we have g very, very long and proud traditions of supporting the arts and humanities here in iowa. Sally u mason, we very much appreciate your joining us on our cspan bus big ten tour, maam. This weekend on the cspan networks, our campaign 2014 debate coverage continues friday night at 8 00 eastern on cspan. Live coverage of the arkansas governors debate with former u. S. House member democrat mike ross, debating former administrator of the dea and former u. S. Congressman republican asa hutchinson. Saturday nifght at 8 00, republican govern for Kerry Branstad and state senator jack hatch. And sunday evening, jenny beth martin, president and cofounder of tea party patriots, is on q a at 8 00. On cspan2, saturday night at 10 00, on book tvs afterwards. The director of astro biology, caleb scharf, life on earth and how it began. And author morton storm on his experiences as a member of al qaeda. And his later life as a double agent. On American History tv on cspan3, it will mark the 50th anniversary of the Warren Commission. On saturday at noon, counsel and Staff Members to the Warren Commission describe their investigation. And sunday afternoon, at 4 00, on real america. The 1964 twohour cbs special report detailing the Warren Commissions findings. With anchors Walter Cronkite and find our Television Schedule at cspan. Org, and let us know what you think of the programs youre watching. Call us at 2026263400. Email us, or send us a tweet. Join the cspan conversation. Like us on facebook. Follow us on twitter. Q now, a forum on the israelipalestinian conflict hosted by the middle east institute. This is a little less than an hour and a half. Thank you owl for joining us. For this discussion. My name is matt duss. After 50 days of war, israel and hamas reached a ceasefire on august 26th. In the most recent count, its reported 2,104 palestinians were killed in gaza, including civilians, 495 children. And 253 women. These numbers would mean 69 of the total killed were civilians. Israel challenges these numbers. But the tabulation is ongoing. 66 isd soldiers were killed as well as six civilians inside israel. Palestinian sources put the cost of gazas reconstruction at nearly 8 billion. The key question for us today in this Panel Discussion is what will it take to translate the current truce into an enduring agreement. What is the likelihood that the demands of the respective parties, israel, hamas, palestinians will be addressed in future talks including an end to israels blockade to gaza and the disarmament of ha mavs. Basically the question, if i can put it in one sentence, is how did we get here, and how can we avoid getting here again. We have an excellent panel of experts here with us. Khaled elgindy, founding board member of the egyptian rule of law association. Khaled previously served on the board of israel in the negotiations held through 2008. Michael koplow is a Program Director of the Young America among palestinians and among israelis that . Jij have been dri weeks, theqcoz73nm ÷i reconcili agreement between the palestinians, obviously some of the challenges that the Prime Minister netanyahu was dealing i think on the surface it seems pretty clear that the main at least superficially, the main impact weve seen is that hamas has become stronger domestically. If obviously militarily weakened. But politically it has been strengthened. And that has happened at the expense of the palestinian authority, and president Mahmoud Abbas in particular. Who has played a very minimal role in the events in gaza, and was quite was seen, i think was marginalized through the process and seen as ineffective. Some of you may have seen a recent poll by the palestinian you never know the full name Palestinian Center for research and surveys operation, which essentially verified this new picture on the ground. Hamas went from being very, very weak, probably the weakest it has ever been before the war, to being quite strong, at least having a very strong show of support, particularly by palestinians in the west bank. But also within gaza, it also holds true. The reality is, that hamas resistance, whatever we may think of it, has been more effective than Mahmoud Abbas approach, which has been essentially focused on diplomatic process. And hes been ineffective not just in gaza, but you have to look at it in the context of the broader middle east Peace Process, which is his bread and butter. He is all about his credibility, his legitimacy rests on his ability to negotiate a twostate solution. And obviously, that hasnt gone all that well. The reality also is that neither side, neither hamas nor fatah, has delivered all that much on the ground in terms of services or governance, or even the broader goal of National Liberation. But to a certain extent, hamas at least momentarily has been able to restore some sense of palestinian pride, and i think its important not to underestimate the importance of these intangibles. For both hamas and fatah. The symbolism is very important for a National Liberation movement. We have to think of palestinians in that sense, as opposed to a government or a state, which, of course, they are not. At the end of the day, hamas newfound popularity might be fleeting, but currently i think its at least more than what Mahmoud Abbas has going for him. Since his credibility, as i said, rests almost entirely on the negotiations process, and bringing about a twostate solution, which is dependent on the u. S. Beneath the surface, i think the picture is a little bit more complicated. If you look at both within hamas and within the p. A. , plo fatah, the lines between them have been blurred over the years, if you look inside, you see internal cleavages within both camps, really. And those, i think, have been exacerbated by this conflict. On the hamas side, you have this division between the leadership inside gaza, this leadership inside gaza. And you have a distinction between the territory of palestine. That i think was exacerbated during the war we saw at various moments, it wasnt clear who was calling the shots. There are other ways also to think of it in terms of radicals and prak matists, all these internal cleavages, i think, have been intensified by the conflict and need to be worked out. The same is true on the side the other side of the kplit political equation and palestine the pa and plo are notoriously dysfuncti dysfunctional. Feta itself is in disarray. That has been true for a long time. But also i think more specifically to the gaza conflict, we have seen i wouldnt call it isolation, but we have seen hes becoming a little bit more alone, i thin think that is dependent on the United States where others in the inner circle of the pa leadership are beginning to realize that that is a dead end. And so he is sort of the last remaining oldout in terms of the americanled so on the one hand hamas have grown. Stronger or weaker visavis each other, but at the same time both have been weakened in absolute terms in terms of the broader palestinian political arena. Thats problematic because we dont currently have viable alternatives to hamas and we have not yet seen a credible or viable third way or however we want to determine. In that sense, we have to look at palestinian politics in the context of broader air politics and i think the trend within palestinian politics reflect the trend in the broader world. Specifically political dysfunction. The same sorts of contradictions and tensions that it led to the what we used to call the arab spring or what was the arab spring also exists in palestinian society. There are legitimacy crises. This is true across the region. There are dysfunctional or nonfunctioning Political Institutions or state institutions and in the case of the palestinians both the pa and plo you have this generational divide where a new generation of leaders or a new generation has very different set of demands and expectations than their elders have allowed for. So all of this, i think, does not necessarily bode well for palestinian politics. Its one reason why i think we havent seen a third because we do need Political Forces to make that to be able to sustain. We do need a credible structure on the ground and for one reason or another, the two main groups are not necessarily interested and interested in much more narrow ways than would be needed for mass mobilization. I would say that the priority now needs to be on not on negotiations and not on resistance, but on fixing the palestinian house, putting the palestinian house back in order. First and foremost because i think gaza depends on it. I think its impossible to envision any sort of reconstruction much less an improvement in gaza without genuine and practical hamas pa cooperation on the ground. And we see that reflected in the terms of the ceasefire where its clear now, it was clear even before the war, that there needs to be a return of the pa to gaza in order to allow the borders to be opened and that requires consent in one form or another if not their active participation and support. So reconciliation and reconnecting gaza is essential for gaza to be able to survive much less grow. In the longer term sense, the movement is in crisis and depends on it, depends on fixing these were not just talking about reforms and elections for institutions like the pa and the plo and i wouldnt expect given the poll results i wouldnt expect to see elections any time soon. Im not sure thats a bad thing. I think throwing elections into the mix might complicate things. But whats actually needed is sort of a new Palestinian National consensus. If youre focused on palestinian politics, palestinians need to rethink their, i think, basic assumptions of their National Aspirations going forward. Ill end on this note. The reawakening of two important old new palestinian constituencies first exacerbated, i think, or intensified y eied by the gaza conflict. The cradle of the Palestinian National movement, but also palestinian citizens of israel. We have seen the new role. We have seen this resurgence of palestinian identity. Among them a new sense of palestinian solidarity that was reaw reawakened by the gaza conflict pop both of those constituencies will be need to be akccommodate in one form or another. They have to be included in the rethinking of internal palestinian politics. Baring in mind that gaza is, in many ways a Cross Section of the palestinian of the global Palestinian Community in that it is made up 60 to 70 are descendents of refugees from 19 1948. You have political trends, so if many guyways, it is a microcosm of the national movement. Thank you. Michael, just to set things up a bit, you mentioned the recent poll we saw showing hamas benefitting by the war. I think we saw some similar things without drawing equivalents, we saw overwhelming public support for the war amongst the israeli public as it was ongoing, but having stopped the war short of what was once this dated goal of diminishing if not crushing hamas, which some were using. Benjamin netanyahu shows himself in trouble o with competitors to his right. Could you address that . Sure. Thanks for putting this panel together. I think its useful when thinking about israeli politics and the context of the aftermath of gaza to talk about politics before operation protective age and before the gaza war and to talk about where things are now. So before the war if gaza, the political dynamic was relatively stable. There were no real challenges to the coalition and no real challenges of a serious nature to netanyahu personally. The head of the labor party has, in many ways, been the invisible man. Nobody sees him or hears from him. More vocal opponents are actually in the cabinet. So he was firmly in control. And the collapse of peace talks did not create any type of political crisis for a couple reasons. First, there were low expectations across the political spectrum about the peace talks. Not many people expected them to be concluded successfully and the base, in fact, many people did not want them to be concluded successfully. So the collapse of the peace talks really did not present much of a challenge to bb domestically. Another factor was the sense that the situation for israel despite many warning signs on the horizon from the u. S. And from europe was not quite dire just yet and that israel could afford to wait on the Peace Process until they were forced to make