Average daily volume of 150 million individual transactions. Yes. We compared that to amazon. And amazon has only 27 million transactions. That was the case back on cyber monday in 2012. Now, we understand that much of this i. T. Is at its core cobalt based. The computer language developed in 1959 essentially before color television. And many of the i. T. Managers acknowledged that a cobalt based system works, but they also have indicated that its less efficient, and agile, than more modern computer languages. So what can the agency do to update the technology that it has to have to manage this eyepopping amount of data that youre dealing with every day . Well, i think one of the underlying challenges you just mentioned, theres a tremendous volume of data that we process. We recognize that we have to move away from cobalt to some extent, but not fully, because in some instances its the best language. There is a transition to modernize our systems. One of the challenges will be how quickly we can do that. Because there are still other types of i. T. Projects that we must also develop at the same time to make our system useful and efficient, both for our employees and for the public. But there is an i. T. Plan that will gradually move some of that cobalt language, and replace it with other types of language. But not fully replace it. My time is expired. Senator hatch . Thank you, mr. Chairman. Ms. Colvin, Social Security has long been criticized for not formulating longterm plans. Last year, the Nonpartisan Government Accountability Office identified that ssa faces four key areas of management challenge over the next decade. Ssas lack of updated succession plan, even though the agency faces a retirement wave. Disability program issues, including a need to incorporate what gao says is, quote, a more modern concept of disability, end quote. Information technology, including internal weaknesses in Information Security and physical infrastructure. I would note that the lack of funding was not identified as a key area of management challenge. Gao wrote that, quote, ssa has ongoing planning efforts, but they do not address the longterm nature of these management challenges, unquote. Now, ms. Colvin, if you are confirmed, how would you handle the modernization, information technology, and physical infrastructure . Senator hatch, we have recognized that the agency does need to have a longterm vision. We are in the process of doing that right now. We have the National Association of public administrators that were commissioned by congress to help in this process. They have submitted their report. We will use some of that report to inform decisions as finish our own planning process. We expect to have a longterm vision plan around the first of the year. We need to make sure that weve got extensive engagement with our stakeholders, with congress and advocates, and our customers, et cetera, so were looking at making sure that all of that has been done. But we do expect to have a longterm vision document completed by the beginning of the new fiscal year. The last vision document was in fact done in 2000 when i was here, which was for the years up to 2010. So we recognize the need there. We are in the process of also developing a Human Capital plan that will look at the gaps that we have to fill. We have probably half of our employees eligible for retirement. The fact that our program is very complex means that this will be a major problem for us. So we are in fact doing a skill gap training. We are modernizing our system. Those three areas identified were currently addressing. Well, thank you. In our hearing last week about the disability program, it was expressed that the d. I. Ex hawks has been foreseen for 20 years. And the increase in the disability roles have been expected for some time. It means ssa has had ample time to update the program to adapt the changes. However, as i understand it, Decision Makers in the d. I. Program utilize tens of thousands of pages of instructions to decide who should get benefits, including 37yearold medical criteria, 35yearold vocational criteria, and 23yearold guidelines to determine what jobs exist for individuals with disabilities. Now, according to the gaos highrisk list in 2013, disability programs, quote, rely on outofdate criteria to a great extent in making disability decisions, unquote. So i have two questions about this. The first is whether 2013 was the first time the gao identified high risks in ssas disability programs, and the second is why it has taken so long for ssa to update its criteria and guidelines, especially since youve had so much time and foresight about troubles with disability finances . If you could address those, id appreciate it. Senator hatch, it is my understanding that there have been other earlier recommendations relative to the need to update some of the medical or the vehicles, the tools that we use to determine disability. This program is a very complex program, as you know. Any change is going to have significant discussion, both here, in congress, and in the community. So any change that is made has to be evidence based, has to be based on research. And medical advancements. We are in the process right now of working with the department of labor to update the occupational list that we use. And that has been happening for some time. Its not something that in fact, the occupational standards that we currently use are not going to be updated, but we are working with the department of labor to develop a tool that will be helpful for us in determining our disability decisions, and we are in the process of that. We dont have a time line for that, but weve been working aggressively on that. Medical listings, we are updated on an ongoing basis. These are the criteria used in making the disability determination. Most of those have been updated and on a cycle to be reviewed every three years. With ssa, we dont really make medical decisions, we follow the medicine. And so if in fact there are new developments in science that make disability decisions different, then we use that information. But this is something thats ongoing, and is always going to be in need of review. But there is tremendous progress going on within the agency. So i dont want to leave the impression were not making advances there. The changes that were making, though, will not have a Significant Impact on the trust funds. It is our hope that congress will find a bipartisan way to address the need to have additional funding there. You are aware that Congress Many times in the past has reallocated between the two trust funds. The president has indicated, though, that he hopes they will do this again, so we will have adequate time to make longterm decisions. And whatever is decided will have to be a bipartisan decision. So we know that that will take a lot of discussion. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you, senator hatch. Senator brown . Thank you, mr. Chairman. Good to see you, ms. Colvin. Thank you for joining us. And first, i just wanted to exhort you to work hard in terms of improving and expanding ssas communication with the general public. I do, as many of us do, ive done literally hundreds of roundtables and calls with senior groups, and various kinds of town halls, and i hear so many of the same myths about Social Security, about disability, about that, you know, its not always going to be there, and all the things that people say. I urge you to do what you can to help answer those myths. We talked about that. You agree with that. But let me talk about a couple more serious things. A couple other more administrative things, if i could. My office got a copy of a memo from an Administrative Law judge in the office of disability adjudication review in new york. I ask unanimous consent that be entered into the record. Without objection, its so ordered. And from the chief Administrative Law judge that mandates the quota. So ordered. It contains fairly mundane details, but it also says two important assertions. Administrative law judge will be issuing 500 to 700 legally sufficient timely decisions a year. If you fail to efficiently manage your work load, the agency may initiate disciplinary action against you. Can you, commissioner colvin, please elaborate the ssa policy on the quota for ssa law judges . The agency has targets, or goals toward which they want to see the aljs work. Those targets were developed by chief judges who in fact have held cases. They have the agency has about seven Years Experience now. The majority of our alj courts do in fact reach that target. Somewhere between 500 and 700. The reason i say its not a quota, no one gets disciplined because of their failure to reach that number. Its just a goal we work toward. We are a production agency. Our First Priority is accuracy, quality, to make sure that the decision is policy compliant and legally defensible. We know its a high volume business when we train aljs, we mention that to them. We have as in any other organization some who meet that, and some who go above it, and some who dont meet it. It is not a quota. Thank you for that. It seems, talking to them, that it feels to them, to many of them it feels like a quota. I just hope you will sit down and find a way to open up communications with them. And again, reinforce what you said to this committee right now that its not a quota, that its a recommendation and theres no discipline. I think they just need to hear that, as much of those conversations directly with you. Let me shift briefly to the labor and management relations. Even with the president ial executive order calling for Labor Management partnerships throughout the federal government, it seems from our reports that its only gotten worse, to the point some labor organizations tell us its as bad as it gets in the entire federal government. What explains this . Why is this . And can i have a commitment from you to provide my office and this committee with a detailed update on progress youre making towards fully implementing your office plans to improve Labor Relations in executive order 13522 . Senator brown, i share your concern about the Labor Management relationships in the agency. In every organization ive worked in, weve had very strong and effective relationshipsstff relationships with the union, i think its important when they Work Together. I believe that the unions have the same goals we have, which is to do the best we can for our employees and the american public. Theres always a very acrimonious agency. We have what we call a partnership, i was the one that signed that contract at the time. I feel that relationships had improved. I was amazed to see the deterioration. I meet with him on a regular basis, i have lunch with them without management staff. So we can begin to get to know one another, ive had relationship training to have managers and the union come together to look at how we can build trusts, how we can communicate better, et cetera, you will have my commitment that i will continue to do that. When you have a huge organization with 62,000 employees, it takes a long time to change the culture and the relationships. You have my commitment to try to move that gap a little bit closer so that we can work better together. And also a commitment to report to my office and to recommend this committee thank you very much. First, let me say how pleased i was to meet with you earlier this month. Thank you for your service and leadership for these many months as our acting lead er. I was invited back there from time to time. Back last year, had an opportunity to speak to him. Some young men from ohio state, some from other states in the midwest, i talked to them about leadership, values, i talked to them about some of the challenges we face. Among the questions that they asked me were questions related to our future as a country, the economy, their ability to get jobs and so forth. I asked them a question too. I asked them a couple questions. How many of you think that some day youll receive a Social Security check . Raise your hand. Not one person. Out of 500 guys, not one. And they said, how many of you think youll ever benefit from Social Security rather from medicare . Not one. Not one. And i said, our job here is to make sure if you ever need a Social Security check when youre 65 or 75, it will be there, and if you need health care, that will be there for you as well. I chair a committee, we have a subcommittee led by carl levin until a year or so ago, they did an indepth analysis as you know, Disability Insurance fraud in one place, in huntington, west virginia, what they found was and i mentioned this to you in our meeting, one judge was thinking about all these cases from one attorney, one law firm, and approving about 99 of them. Almost magically a cash payment was deposited into the account of the judge year after year after year. Weve got to be smart enough to do something about it. In the private sector, they have the ability to use a technique called Predictive Analytics. And this is just an area thats right for this. I think the average approval rate for Disability Insurance application. Its about 40 . When somebody 99 people should pick this stuff up. We should be able to pick this stuff up. And to do it in a private sector all the time. I want you to talk to us about how we use the same tools and techniques, for in order to defend a fund that i think is going to run out of money in 2016 or so the Disability Insurance fund, i believe so, i think the Social Security fund will have to chop down the benefits in the early mid30s, talk to us, how are we going to use it. How are we using Predictive Analytics to get at this problem . Thank you, senator. We are all enhancing our antifraud activities. We are in fact using data anna littics, we are working internally, we are also going to be using external groups so we can maximize this. Weve become much more sophisticated, were seeing third party fraud, that is why the Data Analytics is going to be so important. Because it will show us the trends that are happening and well be able to identify thinks we would not be able to identify without that. We are working on that, let me just mention that we have a zero tolerance for fraud in the agency even though we have less than 1 , we have a case, we look at what we learned so we can learn from that. They tend to be the best defense against fraud. We also have dont know if youre familiar with our investigative units. These are the units that are partnered with the local Inspector General and local Law Enforcement. I initiated the first one in 1998 when i was here, we now have 25. As a result of the increased funding, im opening up another seven, what these units do is identify fraud before we pay out the first check. And this is important, because its so much easier to then get the money than it is get it once weve made the benefit. We are aggressive in that area. Out front we probably referred 27, 28,000 referrals a year to the office of Inspector General. We have been working with the department of justice to try to get them to be more aggressive in prosecuting the cases, and in some instances, we have to defer any administrative action we take until such time the criminal action is taken. If criminal action is taken, we can get restitution. Where if we do administrative action, we dont know how much of the money well get back. Thank you. I want to thank you and your staff staffs. Some of the payments can be fixed. We have a situation where Social Security has pretty much keeping track of whos alive and whos dead, so we dont pay benefits to people that have passed. Senator widen, mr. Chairman and to senator hatch, thank you very much for working in concert with dr. Coburn and me to make sure we can address this issue. 106 in improper payments. This bill will help us. So thank you. Thank you, senator coburn. And excuse me, senator carper. Ive been called worse, even this week. Thank you. I want you to know as ive indicated, because we had a hearing on Disability Insurance, where there is fraud we are going to find it and fight it. This program is so important for people. She did everything right, she just got clobbered by one disease after another. And she was sitting there at the end of the table where chairman mccull ski was with medications piled one box after another that she takes every day. We owe it to her, to taxpayers, i also have this document about service about improper payments. It would indicate in in the overwhelming number of instances, the agency gets it right. Your point is, when they dont and when theres particularly fraud, we have to find it, we have to fight it, we have to root it out in a bipartisan way. Let me recognize senator hatch. I think would you like to say anything else . Just welcome and happy to have you testify here today and enjoyed our meeting in our office together, look forward to working with you. The only thing i would say in closing. You could see this from the remarks of the senators, that sometimes government is kind of an distraction. Theres some agency and the office of acoustics and ventilation and the citizen tries to figure out what is that exactly have to do with me. I know there have been changes in the policy as well. People hold on to, because it talks about what theyve earned, what theyve paid in, what theyve got coming to them. So i support your nomination, and i think youve addressed the concerns of the senators here, and im doing it because i think you have the experience. You really had several stints at the agency, so youve seen the changes over time. And i think youll work with us particularly in an area im very interested, make sure were using modern technology. Because i think with 21st century challenges. And then we got things that were in place before, color tv, sort of 20th century technologies, thats why we have to play some catchup. We have to Work Together and we have to move quickly, and we have to do it given the challenge with constrained resources, and i feel youre going to work closely with us, and i intend to support your nomination. With that, with the finance committee, were adjourned. Let me know the committee record will be open for questions until 5 00 p. M. Monday august 4th, and now we are officially adjourned. This weekend on cspan, the Kentucky Senate race, Mitch Mcconnell is seeking reelection against alison grimes, theyll both speak from fancy farm kentucky. Can you see that live on our companion network cspan starting at 2 30 p. M. Eastern on saturday. This weekend our visit to the National Security archives reveals declassified documents about the golf of tonkin vietnam. American artifacts sunday at 6 00 and 10 00 p. M. Eastern, watch more American History tv next week while congress is in recess, featuring events from watergate on its 40th anniversary on cspan 3. The head of u. S. Citizenship testified before the House Judiciary Committee earlier this week, about unaccompanied immigrant children. He was asked about the administrations policy of not deporting some undocumented immigrants who came to the u. S. As children. Virginia congressman chaired the two and a half hour long hearing. Good morning. The Judiciary Committee will come to order, without objection, the chair is authorized to declare recess of the committee until any time. We welcome anyone to this hearing on citizenship and Immigration Services. Ill begin by recognizing myself for opening statement. Welcome to the House Judiciary Committee. This is your first time testifying in front of congress. As the director of uscis. Your appearance comes at a time when americans are feeling the repercussions of the illegal Immigration Crisis on the southwest u. S. Border. Of course, if president obama took seriously his duty to secure the u. S. Border there would be no such crisis. U. S. Customs and Border Protection is the dhs Agency Getting most of the attention during this southwest border crisis. There is no doubt that policies implemented by uscis is a major source of the problem. Policies such as deferred action for childhood arrivals or daca, a rubber stamping of credible fear of persecution claims and even high asylum higher asylum grant rates by uscis officers. Daca is a major reason for the influx of Illegal Immigrants to the United States. And discussion of the program is pertinent since uscis recently announced the method by which the renewal of initial twoyear grants will be processed, and along with that procedure uscis made changes to the original daca guidelines and requirements, including gutting the education requirements. I have previously expressed concern about the lack of any Constitutional Authority to implement daca. The cost of the program, increased wait times for fraud in the program. Fraud is of paramount concern, since a system with rampant fraud is a National Security risk. I was astounded in may when the uscis added question 21 to the guidance. It is an absolute reputation for fraud. They admit they will not verify the validity of documents submitted by politic cants. I understand that when uscis leadership was asked about question 21, Congressional Staff members were assured that generally the majority of documents received are valid. But forgive me if such an assurance is not comforting, especially now that uscis is broadcasting its lack of intention to even attempt validation. The uscis process is over 6 million applications and petitions per year. I understand the magnitude of that responsibility and the enormous volume of work should make antifraud measures all the more important. What weve been hearing for years from sources at uscis and even the uscis union is the existence of a culture of getting to guess unrelenting pressure on adjudicators to rubber stamp applications, and also of a culture where adjudicators are routinely overridden where they deny applications or petitions. There are documented instances of employees in leadership at uscis, taking control that have been brought to their attentions. I understand that there are ongoing investigations of such illegitimate interference in the adjudication process. The notion that around application can be approved despite fraud on the part of the politic an the and that uscis leadership will intervene if they get a call or email from an outside Party Interested in a certain visa application is disturbing to say the least. We know that the president has promised more administrative action to allow unlawful immigrants to remain in the United States and receive quasi legal status and the right to work. In fact some of the different tactics he may try to take were even outlined in a set of 2010 leaked memos regarding administrative alternatives to comprehensive Immigration Reform, and relief options. However, lets be clear. Such policies of this administration including many implemented at uscis as well as promises about future administrative legalizations continue to encourage unlawful immigrant parents to smuggle their children into the United States. These policies and promises are putting money directly into the pockets of human smuggling and drug cartels and theyre undermining the fundamental constitutional principles that congress creates the laws and the president is bound to enforce them. Im interested in hearing how the uscis will no longer contribute to this state of affairs and i look forward to this directors testimony. Thank you. In a net shell, the United States citizenship and Immigration Services are vital in examining the young people that are coming across our southern border. And i want to suggest that before we leave for five weeks, that we try to ease the deportation of children and appropriate emergency funds because we have too few judges. Too few asylum offices. We have 243 Immigration Judges for 357,000 cases. Were talking about more than a fouryear background, my colleagues. Youngsters with valid claims should have a speedier way to have that determined. Now, more those without valid claims, im sorry to say should be sent back. But the determination is what democracy is all about. And its our responsibility to be careful at how we do this. I know the strong feelings about these youngsters pouring over here. But the question is, how do we dispose of it consistent with democratic principles that guide us . Nowhere should this be more keenly felt than the House Judiciary Committee itself. We must determine even though there may be violence, persecution, trafficking, were at a recess, and we still dont know. Throughout this session of congress there have been too many of us that have had but one theme. The president isnt enforcing immigration law. And this is a myth. A myth that has been debunked in hearing after hearing where we have heard about record breaking detentions, removals and prosecution prosecutions. Still, the majority has not been persuaded by facts and continues to blame the president for their inactions on Immigration Reform. Many of them argue that the president s use of prosecutorial discretion is unconstitution al and we should be removing young people they seek to qualify that live, work and study in the United States. They said our laws protecting torture in our home countries should be rolled back, and more of them should be detained for longer periods of time. And most recently some have used a humanitarian crisis affecting women and Young Children in Central America to say that we cant fix our broken immigration system and provide relief to millions of undocumented americans living within our borders. And that begins right in this important committee. So today lets listen. Over a year ago, the United StatesSenate Passed a comprehensive Immigration Reform bill, urging millions to apply for legal status. The House Majority refused to bring the bill or its bureau, hr15 for a vote. The Congressional Budget Office tells us that we would reduce our deficit by 900 billion over 20 years through these proposals. This refusal to bring a bill to the floor, is something that i feel very badly about. If such a bill were brought to the floor im confident it would pass, even the house of representatives unfortunately, im beginning to think that the only immigration bill that we might ever see in this congress would be a bill to strip protections that all of us unanimously agree to extend to child victims of trafficking persecution and torture and abuse. And i dont feel or believe that nearly i feel that we can do better than this. We were sent here to solve problems that demand action on comprehensive Immigration Reform i urge my colleagues majority and minority in the house to end the delay and to start acting. And i join the chairman in welcoming our distinguished witness and i yield back the balance of my time. Thank you. Its my understanding that the Ranking Member would like to make an opening statement. Ordinarily we would ask that members put their statements in the record. However, noting her request, and noting that the chairman of the subcommittee is not present the chair will turn to the gentleman of utah, and then turn to the gentleman woman, and we will put all other Opening Statements in the record. The gentleman from utah is recognized. I think the chairman, and i appreciate you holding this, this is a vital issue, that to the United States and its something thats exploding on our borders. As someone who represents good hard work. Americans are working hard, trying to take care of their kids. Trying to get their feet on the ground. Theres a whole other wave of people that are coming here, i believe theres a proper place for asylum, for those people who are truly in harms way. But were being taken advantage of and in great numbers. The flow coming across our border is unbelievable. People who are coming here and trying to take advantage of the United States of america are overwhelming the system. The consequence is, we have people who are legally and lawfully trying to come to this country. Weve been ignoring those people. The people who are trying to come in the front door, what about those people . The resources weve had to take to those who arent willing to play by the rules have put a great strain upon the system. A huge strain upon the system. Thats why i think is this hearing here today is so vital. Those people that are coming across and claiming asylum, and theyre not just coming from one or two countries. I visited the border and went to the detention facility. There were representatives from 60 Different Countries. You have people knocking on the door every day saying, please arrest me, i want to get in the system. You come in, you make your claim, youre going to get some sort of court date. In phoenix, when i was there, what they told me is, you would get a court date in 2020. In the meantime, what are you going to do . Since my court date is so far in the future, you say, i need to be able to work. We grant them a work permit. Theyre competing against someone who is legally lawfully here. Whether theyre on a green card or United States citizen competing for those jobs. Again, we can be compassionate, but the reality is, this administration has created a magnet. Theyve said, come step foot in the United States and nothing is going to happen to you. The president owns this issue. Theres a reason why the unaccompanied minors are flying across the border. They dont feel like anythings going to happen to them. Well take care of it, pass you off to someone else. Did we do any background checks on who were passing these minors off to . No. This administration doesnt do that. It is fauundamentally wrong. A key part of this system is what this add american station does. Theyre patriotic, working hard, theyre trying to do the right thing for their country. I worry about the direction theyre giving. The direction that theyre being given by their management. I worry what this administration is telling it to do or not to o do. I appreciate you holding this hearing. I yield back. Thank you. The gentle woman from california. Let me begin by welcoming you to the days hearing and the new position as director of the u. S. Citizen have and Immigration Services. I think you dont usually get the kind of attention that dhs departments do. But its very important. Families hoping to immigrate. Persons fleeing persecution and torture. They all go to agencies that are critically important. The uscis is responsible for all these important activities without any taxpayer money. Its entirely fee driven except for a minor amount thats basically used to verify all the applicants pay for the services they receive . I sometimes mention my grandfather who came do the United States in the early 20th century, got on the boat, got off the boat. Im in Congress Today because he had the courage to want the american dream. The directors own story of his family fleeing turkey and poland to escape antiseminism and then to cuba. Ive always admired immigrants who have enough get up and go to get up and go. They have made up our country. Were now in a position to help shape the future for those that come after us. There are many things to discuss today. We mentioned about the children, the unaccompanied children who have been apprehended at the southwest border. As we know these individuals are placed in the safe keeping of the department of health and Human Services. Asylum officers who determine if theres a fear of persecution, and in the directors written testimony, he explains that 65 of the asylum applications that have been adjudicated this fiscal year have been approved. Now, some argue that this somehow means can you rubber stamp the application. I look at that and say, we can help them. They are Vulnerable Children who can come to our country an application for asylum isnt illegal, its part of our laws since world war ii. Children who have been abused, neglected and obtain a state court order can apply for special immigrant status. The director notes that over 3900 applications have been received this fiscal year. These applications require a finding by a state court that these children have been abandoned, a state court makes the determination that only then will the uscis intercede. Victims who have been part of trafficking will receive a t visa. As mr. Conners pointed out, we had a nearly unanimous vote in 2008 that put the congress and america on record saying we will fight Human Trafficking and make sure the victims of Human Trafficking are given safe haven in the United States. Much of this has overlooked the fact that theyre about Human Trafficking, slavery and sex trafficking, if we are to eliminate the proprotections in that act, what we will be saying is that we will once again count the victims of trafficking being returned to their traffickers. I will say this, we did make an exception for the children from contiguous countries and we have learned much to our sorrow, that those exceptions need to be revisited, because the United Nations has found that children from contiguous countries who have been trapped have been returned to their traffickers. I yield back. The chair thanks the gentle woman. Without objection, all other members Opening Statements will be made part of the record. We thank our only witness for joining us today. If you would please rise, ill begin by swearing you in do you swear the testimony you are about to give shall be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you god. Thank you. Director rodrigez answered in the affirmative. He serves as the United States citizen ship and Immigration Services. The Agency Responsible for administering asylum and visa petitions. Prior to joining uscis he was first an assistant u. S. Attorney in pittsburgh. Led the department of labors wage and Hour Division and served as the head of the office of civil rights within the department of health and Human Services he attended Brown University in 1984. Mr. Rodrigez received his jd from Boston College in 1988. Thank you very much for coming, and we look forward to your testimony. Injure written statement will be entered in its entirety into the record. I ask that you summarize your testimony in five minutes, to help you stay within that time, theres a timing light on the table, when it turns yellow, that means you have one minute left to summarize your testimony. Thank you, and thank you for being here today. And you may begin. Thank you. Mr. Chairman and members of the committee. I am extremery grateful to be the new director. And to be before you today. I hope that today is the beginning of a long and fruitful and constructive relationship that i will have with this committee as a whole and with its members in particular. I am also honored to be the leader of more than 18,000 extremely dedicated men and women who are the employees of the United States citizenship and Immigration Services. I have worked in many different government positions, i have worked in the private sector and i can say even after the short time in office, that as a country we really should be pleased to have the extreme level of talent, commitment and work ethic that characterize so many of the people that ive had the opportunity to meet in these last three weeks. I accepted this job, because i am a patriot. I am a patriot who believes that america is indeed unique in its freedom, equality, energy and enterprise. Those qualities are the product of the kind of people who are in this country and who come to this country, there are people who work hard, they are people who take risks, they are people who are dedicated to making a better life for their family. And those kinds of people come from all over and do all kinds of things. They can be tomato pickers, physicists. For me, the challenge and the reason im embracing this challenge is to create a fair and efficient system for those individuals to find a place in our society. I am the son and grandson of immigrants. They fled turkey and poland. Like so many, my parents hoped for a Better Future for me and for my sister as well. I have spent the majority of my career as a Law Enforcement officer. I dont need to have done that to know that there are many people who wish the United States harm. I view it as a solemn and important part of my work to safeguard the security and safety of the United States. Id like to relate two particular experiences ive had during my few days as director of u. S. Citizenship and Immigration Services. Ive had the honor of attendsing a naturalization ceremony, where 53 Different Countries were represented. Showing the remarkable energy and talent that continue to pursue the dream of becoming new americans every day. And i have the opportunity recently to meet with the recently returned refugee Processing Team from our refugee asylum and naturalizations division that came back from iraq. These are incredibly dedicated and talented Public Servants. Who i can say inspired me when i heard the stories of the work they do. We have some challenging issues to talk about today. I have no doubt that well be talking about the deferred action for childhood arrivals program. I can say that as a former prosecutor, i have exercised discretion. That is not anything novel in the various enforcement enterprises in the country. It is my view that daca provides an opportunity to exercise prosecutorial discretion. For example, for an individual who i just met, who was about to receive her degree at harvard or another individual who was in medical school and trying to decide whether to be a dermatologist or an obgyn. I imagine we will also speak about the crisis at the border. As has been noted. The president has recognized this as a serious problem as has my agency and as has secretary johnson. I would like this morning to talk in more detail about how our asylum process works, and the degree to which these asylum claims actually play a role in this crisis. I look forward to our continuing conversation this morning. Thank you. Thank you director rodrigez. With the indulgence of the committee id like to take a few minutes away from this hearing to talk about someone who was a dear friend of mine, my predecessor representing the sixth district of virginia, m. Caldwell butler passed away last night around midnight, served in the house of representatives from a special election in 1972 until his retirement beginning of 1983. He served on this committee i believe, that entire time. And served here with great distinction at a time when this committee went through some very difficult issues including his being involved in the watergate investigation and in the impeachment proceedings related to former president richard nixon. He was a Public Servant in the truest sense of the word. And he has given immeasurably to his country, state and commun y community, roanoke virginia where he lived his entire life, and to which he was extremely dedicated. He attended the roanoke public schools. His law degree from the university of virginia. He was admitted to the virginia bar in 1950 and commenced practice in roanoke. He served in the Virginia House of delegates from roanoke. Served as the minority leader from 1966 to 1971. He was a friend to everyone who knew him. He will be badly miss ed. It is a great loss for the roan Oak Community and our country. I thank the committee for allowing me to remember him for a few moments here. The gentleman served in the house of representatives and on this committee with congressman butler, and i would love to recognize him for a few words. Thank you very much. And so did i serve with him. There are very few conservatives i remember going back that far as clearly as i remember him. He was an impressive member of congress and on almost a regular basis our friendship was never impaired by the different perspectives on how government should run. I join you, mr. Chairman in observing and remembering a distinguished member of the house judicioary committee. And i would like to yield to the gentle lady of california for comments. I was a young law student and i remember mr. Butler very well. He was a person we all admired if we didnt agree on everything. He was totally honest and brave in standing up for what he thought was right and the constitution, and he will be greatly missed. I count myself as one of his many admirers and i remember him quite fondly from my days as a young staffer, and i thank the gentleman for yielding. I thank the gentleman from michigan. We all offer our sincere condolences to the butler family. They are in our thoughts and prayers in this difficult time. It was a great honor to know and have the privilege of working for caldwell butler, i learned a great deal from him over the year years. I thank you all for allowing me to say a few words. Well now turn to the questioning of director rodrigez. Director, i know you are new to the job, i would like to get your perspective on some things that have concerned us greatly, and see whether there is an opportunity to correct some things or to clarify what the uscis is doing in certain areas. Question 21 of the revised deferred action for childhood arrivals states will uscis verify documents or statements that i provide in support of a request for daca . And uscis answer is, uscis has the authority to verify documents, facts and statements that are provided in support of requests for daca. Uscia may contact education institutions, employers or other agencies for verification. In most cases, daca will not verify documents. And, thus, the frequently asked questions invites fraud. If uscis takes seriously its antifraud commitment, why is it a good step to notify potential applicants that documents will not be verified. You may want to pull that microphone closer to you i dont think its turned on either opinion. There we go. I really appreciate the opportunity to work with you and this committee on various concerns that they may have. As i understand the concern here is the suggestion that there will not be a systematic verification of the authenticity of documents presented at the time of daca renewals. It is my understanding that there is scrutiny of these documents, and certainly at the time of initial application we have a robust fraud detection and National Security director at that includes a number of former Law Enforcement and military officials among its ranks that engages in a variety of systematic checks of any individual that seeks any sort of benefit from uscis, criminal history, terrorist behavior, possibly other threats to the United States. Our adjudicators also receive training so they can flag applications for benefits that appear to present fraud it is for that arent agency felt comfortable in saying that the ordinary course of business while there would not be a specific attempt to authenticate particular documents, there is an ability to look at documents and if they do present concerns at the time of the review during the adjudication process, to flag those for further review. The great many applications contain fraud u lentz documents, it would seem to me that a better policy would be to say that the documents are going to be reviewed and leave applicants with the impression they should not submit fraudulent documents they will be checked and if they are found to be fraudulent they will befall someone submitting fraudulent documents to your organizati organization. Chairman, i appreciate the concern you have raised. I am in the process right now of reviewing all of the agencies processes. And certainly one of the things i will be dedicated special attention to are any issues related to National Security or fraud. Thank you, let me go on to another question. The president has announced his intention to change immigration policy, when and if congress does not do so in a manner to the president s liking. Hes previously acted on daca, expanding parole, prosecutorial discretion of removal and deportation of unlawful aliens. You must have received a briefing on the status of the next administrative action, will you please tell us what is next on the president s agenda . Let me be clear, and i think the administration has been clear about this, no decisions have been made. The directive that we have received is to examine possibilities for different avenues to exercise that prosecutorial discretion. I know that our secretary is in a process of engaging with front line employees. Members of congress from both sides of the aisle and stakeholders from the Broad Spectrum of american society. That process is ongoing and no decisions have been made in that process. The speakers border crisis working group, during that meeting, i asked the secretary what would be needed in order to address the surge in those claiming credible fear. A change in law to strengthen the credible fear standard would be necessary to fix the current situation. Do you agree that such a fix is needed . While a fix is needed now is not the appropriate time to fix the credible peer standard. Claims have gone from 5,000 to an estimated 50,000 in a short number of years and your testimony indicates those claiming fear are part of the surge, why is this not the time to fix this weak standard . Id like to put this issue in a little bit of perspective, at this point roughly 15 of individuals being apprehended at the border are presenting credible fear claims. We have searched our own capacity to address these claims. We have moved personnel to the various border processing areas to process those claims. We have accelerated our review time. Its a period of eight days so as to ensure well, thank you no, go ahead. So as to ensure that we add jude indicate those claims as efficiently as possible. I think because weve been able to surge in that manner, i think that is the basis for which the secretary may not have been the time to address this particular issue. Point in fact the hearing is now resulting in 92 of those cases being approved to move on to the next status in the process. Which involves the detention of people or releasing those people into the United States and as we know, a great percentage of those do not return for their subsequent hearing. So it would seem to me that increasing that standard and doing it now would send word to people, if they are seeking political asylum in the United States, they should state that when they come to this country and be prepared to show that it at least is more likely than not that they have a case that deserves to go on to that final hearing, rather than being rubber stamped through as i would argue theyre being now. I would not necessarily adopt the view that these claims are being rubber stamped through. In my third day in office i sat in on a credible fear interview. Im a former prosecutor, i was very favorably impressed by the quality of the interrogation i saw by the probing nature of the interrogation that i saw, so i do think these interviews are being conducted in an effective manner. That said, the Legal Standard to establish credible fear is obviously a this remember hold standard that only qualifies the individual for later adjudication. The later adjudications are arising to approval rates that approach 70 , which is to my knowledge much higher than it has been in previous years. And acknowledges that concern, i look forward to a continuing conversation about this issue. My time has expired. And the chair recognizes the gentleman from michigan for his questioning. Thank you mr. Chairman. Would you discuss director rodrigez the sheer numbers that were talking about . How many young people have come across our southwest border so far this year and last year and the year before . Congressman, i apologize that as i sit before you, i cant tell you the specific numbers. Certainly those numbers have grown over time. They remain essentially in the tens of thousands. But it is the fact that those numbers continue to grow. Well, i have 50,000 for 2013, 25,000 for number for 2011. Does that figure in agreeably with your thoughts on this . My general understanding is that the trend until very recently was an upward trend. I think that trend has begun to level off. One thing i would notice i actually started reading latin american newspapers in honduras, guatemala and el salvador. Spanish is actually my first language. There are increasingly stories in the media, one about individuals being returned, two about the fact daca offers no benefit to these individuals. And i think that and the marshalling of efforts by the government, specifically by my agency, appears possibly to have started to take some effect with individuals in Central America. Now, what about personnel . I mentioned just a handful of judges and so forth here. I dont think we can realistically on your 15th day in office ask you why we arent doing more when i have some pretty low figures of personnel that you have. Well, this is actually my fifth transition, congressman, into a new agency. And one of the key aspects of doing that is you need to be ready to drink from a fire hose, jump on 100 mileanhour train, chew gum and rub your head all at the same time. So ive been busy trying to do exactly that. What i do know is the agency has recognized this additional burden. It has added 150 asylum officers or is in the process of adding 150 asylum officers, noting the additional demands being placed on it, at least in part by the situation at the border. You were the lead attorney in United States versus flores, which involved enslavement of mexican and guatemalan nationals who had been smuggled from border areas in arizona to farms in South Carolina and florida. What, if you can recall, did you get out of that experience and working with vulnerable populations, and how do you think it may positively affect your work as the director of this very Important Office that you hold now . United states citizenship and Immigration Services . Thank you, congressman conyers for that question. Customs was a career highlight for me. On many levels i have to tell you i was inspired by the stories of the victims that i met in that case. These were individuals very often from indigenous areas of guatemala. For many of them, spanish was a second language. Their first language were indigenous dialects in those countries. These were strong, hardworking, really amazing individuals. The opportunity to vindicate their rights and to fight the victimization that had occurred to them was really an important Career Opportunity for me. It sensitized me to the fact Human Trafficking and labor exploitation are Serious Problems that particularly befall individuals who work in our shadow economy, as these individuals did. That certainly will influence, it will sensitize me to certain issues that uscis faces. I think your experiences have prepared you well for your responsibility. We want to work as closely as we can. This committee has a great concern about this challenge at our southwest border, and wed like to stay in touch with you for your past two weeks and one day on the job. I look forward to a very fruitful relationship, congressman. Thank you. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you, mr. Conyers. The gentleman from North Carolina is recognized for his questions. Pleasure, mr. Chairman. Director rodriguez, good to have you with us this morning. Mr. Rodriguez, the Bush Administration required that certain employers such as federal contraries, those employing foreign students in the Optical Practical Training Program and others use everify. What plans do you have to expand mandatory everify use . Right now there are obviously very limited segment of employers subject to mandatory everify. I have been pleased to say that the accuracy rate for everify is at a high level. And our ability to adjudicate temporary nonconfirmations appears to be very effective. Employers who utilize everify report high Level Satisfaction with that system. Our agency has prepared a report to this body which was delivered some time ago that talked about what would be required to move to universal mandatory everify as a capability that we could achieve. I look forward to a continuing conversation with how we get there. I thank you for that. How do you ensure that employers strike that. How do you ensure those employers required to use everify such as federal contractors and employers of students in the Optical Practical Training Program are, in fact, using the system . Congressman, i will acknowledge that as part of the many things im trying to learn as i come on to the agency, i have not yet had the opportunity to brief on that specific issue. I certainly would look forward to following up with your office about the steps that we take to verify utilization by that particular portion of employers. If you would keep us current on that, i would appreciate. You can count on it, congressman. When will the uscis implement its programs to allow individuals to lock their Social Security numbers for Work Authorization purposes in an effort to prevent the number being used fraudulently to obtain employment or a job . I understand we have the capacity to lock Social Security numbers in those instances where we believe a Social Security number is being used fraudulently. I am not familiar with the ability of specific individuals to lock their own Social Security numbers. I imagine they can ask us to do it. Again, that is an area i look forward to working with your office to get you the answers you need. Thank you, sir. Mr. Chairman, i yield back. The gentleman from virginia, mr. Scott, is recognized. Thank you, mr. Chairman. And thank you, mr. Rodriguez. About the present process. If we are going to shorten the wait period for determining status, obviously we have to hire more personnel. Who do we need to hire and how much would it cost to significantly reduce the time for hearings . I am in the process right now of reviewing various issues related to wait time. I do know that there was a time when, for example, the family petition where the wait times for those had been unacceptably long. The agency has been able to restore the wait times to five months, a more acceptable time frame. I am going to continue as part of my transition into the agency to look at this issue of wait times to ensure that we are moving as efficiently as possible. Its important to note that we are a feefunded agency. There are pressures on us from all sides to do all kinds of things with our fees. We need to live within our budget is the bottom line. We are going to continue to look at how we operate most efficiently, deliver the highest level of Customer Service within the Fee Structure that we have. You mentioned five months. What is your goal . Is there any way you can get down to a couple of days . The goal for those is about five months. Im not sure we would ever be in a position to get it down to a couple of days for those family petition. There are other categories we are able to process far more quickly. In some cases we are required by law, actually, to process benefits more quickly. That is, that goal really represents over time what has been seen as the target time for adjudication of those particular benefits. The people are entitled to attorneys at their own expense, i understand in many cases there are pro bono attorneys available, is that true . I have no doubt that there are pro bono attorneys who are available to assist people with various aspects, various immigration issues. What do lawyers typically charge for these cases when they are paid . I dont know, congressman. I imagine actually that there is probably just having been a former private practice lawyer myself, i imagine there is a wide variety of what lawyers may cost in this particular field. If someone is deported, where do they go . Im sorry . Where do they go . [ no audio ] your mic is not on. Director rodriguez, your mic is not on. You might want to repeat that last sentence. Sorry. My agency, of course, congressman, does not handle deportations and an enforcement and removal. I did have some bit of experience as a private practice lawyer with the removal process. This can vary a lot. My understanding generally is people are in detention in some cases, and at some point they are sent back generally flown back to their country of origin. Honestly, because its not what my agency does, im not fully familiar with that process. We had an influx of Young Children coming to our borders. Have other countries experienced similar influxes . I am at least aware that mexico has had its own influx driven by many of the same factors as the individuals coming to our country. I am not fully familiar where else those individuals might be going. Mr. Chairman, i yield the balance of my time to the gentle lady of california. Thank you, mr. Scott. I have just a couple of i have many questions, but i wanted to address the issue of in absentia rates. Oftentimes we hear compliance that the unaccompanied children dont show up for the immigration hearings. In fact, i heard some of my colleagues across the aisle say 90 of the kids do not show up. Politifact ruled that claim false. Most recently the department of justice testified before the senate that a little bit of half the kids show up, but we now have a complete picture because the American Immigration council analyzed the raw Immigration Court data made public by the transactional records access clearinghouse. They looked at every single case of juveniles appearing in Immigration Court beginning in 2005 through june of this year. Looking at only closed cases of children not detained, over 60 of the children appeared in Immigration Court. Here is an important data point. When the child has a lawyer, 92. 5 of those children appeared in court. It never dipped below 89 in any fiscal year. I would like to ask unanimous consent to put into the record the analysis prepared by the Immigration Policy Center indicating this very high appearance rate. Without objection, the analysis will be made a part of the record. The gentleman from virginias time is expired. I recognize myself for questions. Director rodriguez, last thursday the New York Times reported on a leaked dhs memo laying out a program to allow individuals in honduras who are not eligible for Refugee Status to be paroled in the United States. As you know, historically parole has been used in very rare instances on a case by case basis for temporary admittance for urgent humanitarian reasons or significant public benefit. Your own website notices that parole, is used sparingly to bring someone who is otherwise inadmissible into the United States for a temporary period of time due to a compelling emergency. Since the uscis grants parole, would you tell the committee how such a program intended for a large group of individuals would not be an illegitimate expansion of authority. We use parole for individuals not being persecuted. Why isnt that a violation of current law . First of all, i think its important to underscore in this area, as well, no decisions have been made. Secretary johnson, my colleagues throughout dhs recognize the significance, the importance of dealing would you agree that if such were to occur it would be unprecedented . I would not be able to say. Give me an example where there is a precedent for such type of action. Again, i think the main thing is any Parole Program or any other sort of program would need to be of certain criteria. Assuming the leaked memo is accurate, we never had a program where individuals in another country have been able to take advantage of the system as the president presumably or you have proposed. I cant think of any precedent. Again, can you think of any precedent . I could not specifically tell you whether there is or is not a precedent at this point. I underscore no decisions have been made. I will say we are working very hard throughout dhs to find solutions to what we all agree is a significant issue being presented at our border. If there is a precedent, we would like to know it. I assume since you cant think of one there is not. Even the uscis union has stated that uscis adjudicators are being pressured to, quote, get to yes, on petition and applications for immigration benefits. Dont you agree that any uscis emphasis on adjudicators having to meet quotas, numbers of applications adjudicated in a day undermine the integrity about the issues you seem concerned in your opening testimony . Interestingly enough, as many individuals told me there is a culture of getting to yes, i heard other individuals saying there is a culture getting to no. Let me suggest that the culture we need to have and the culture i have observed is a culture of getting to the right answer. Are you aware of any pressure on the adjudicators to try to get to an affirmative answer . I am aware those allegations have been made. I know, but are you aware of any incidents where that occurred . I am not aware of any specific incidents where that occurred. Let me go to the program already mentioned several times today that was unilaterally instituted by the president two years ago, that has allowed almost 600,000 individuals to stay in this country who were previously in an illegal status. Among the documents that could be proffered by these individuals to show they were eligible for the program or educational records, employment records and military records. What i would like to ask you is how often does uscis actually verify whether the educational records or military records or employment records submitted are actually valid and are not an indication of fraud . Congressman, i would not be able to give you a specific percentage as to when that occurs. What i would be able to tell you is that it is my understand based on my initial review of how our agency operates that extensive training is given to our adjudicators. I understand that. If you are not going to verify the record and just take them at face value, thats an open invitation to a lot of individuals to apply for the legalization program, and have pretty good confidence they are going to be approved whether eligible or not. Well, our people are trained to look for indicators of fraud. Right. Why wouldnt you be able to give us an estimate as to how many out of 100 applications would be verified . Im not able to. Im not sure we studied that in that way. It is the sense that i get from the staff that does this work that their judgment is that most of these documents are, in fact, valid and authentic. Thank you, director rodriguez. That cone includes my questions. The gentleman from california, miss lofgren is recognized for hers. Thank you. I want to ask a little bit about how we are doing the credible fear interviews for families detained . It is my understanding the Committee Staff requested data involving the positive and negative and we dont have that yet. You dont have it either, but we are looking forward to receiving that. Here are some of the concerns that have been relayed to me. Recent news reports indicate there was a 9yearold boy from guatemala who threatened to commit suicide while he was there if he was deported, but that he was sent back any how. That there are other instances where families were put on a plane and actually then were taken off when staff were able to provide information they would be killed if they were returned. Here is my question. It is my understanding from attorneys who have represented some of the older children that the credible fear interviews are being held in groups. For example, a mother would be interviewed with her children present. I think thats problematic because if that mother has been the victim of rape or other kinds of serious matters, she may be reluctant to discuss that in front of her children. Similarly, older children who might have been subject to sexual abuse might be reluctant to say that in front of a parent. So im looking to you to see, is it possible to have these credible fear interviews done with the necessary privacy to elicit actual truth from some of these individuals . If they dont have a fear matter, they will be removed, but if they are, in fact, a victim of trafficking, we want to find that out. Thank you, congresswoman for that question. It is my understanding that our staff is trained first to interview children specifically in techniques required for interviewing children. Im a former sex crimes special victims prosecutor, and i know full well that is a different process than interviewing adults. Generally for interviewing people who have endured some sort of trauma. I am aware of the concern that you raise. As part of my transition, i will look into these particular concerns as soon as i can and to determine whether there is anything we need to do differently. I appreciate that. Well look forward to receiving further information from you. I wanted to address the issue just briefly of the data that was recently transmitted by the department about the number of unaccompanied children applying for asylum. I would ask unanimous consent to put my analysis in the record, but i think it is flawed data because it does not include the children who receive special immigrant juvenile status because a state court has found them to be abandoned and certain Trafficking Victim visas and the like. So i would ask that you review that analysis, mr. Director, and see if you concur in the analysis. I also want to talk about the need for efficiency in the agency. Its tough to do, but coming from silicon valley, its important we do it once, do it right and not come back. For example, i recently had a situation that came to my attention from a Business Case where there was request for evidence and notice of intent to deny that dont make any sense. For example, one case where there was an allegation that the business person had departed the country but he hadnt. He had been able to disapprove that, but he had to prove it over and over and over again the same point. Im looking for you prospectively, how do we get technology deployed so that these matters arent relitigated, wasting the time not only of the government but the businesses and families that rely on quick resolution . Then a final question on the fivemonth delay. On the business side, we allow individuals to pay an additional fee for rapid adjudication of a matter. We havent really gotten into that on the family side, but im wondering if we could look at that. For example, if you are an american citizen and you marry someone from another country, the five months might be fine. You have no plans to leave the United States, whatever. But if the spouse is a Technology Business guy in the valley, hes got to travel all over. It might be worth a substantial fee to get it resolved because of the need to travel. So could you take a look at that opportunity to see if the different family circumstances could be accommodated in that way . Thank you for both those questions. I would like to share that for me one of my top challenges and Top Priorities is tackling the, our agencys information system. In many cases the systems we have are paper systems or legacy Electronic Systems that really are not enabling us to operate we are operating very well as much as anything else because the ingenuity and work ethic of our people, but we could be operating better modern systems. We have to make sure at a minimum before i conclude my tenure that we can see the light at the end of the tunnel for those challenges will be a top priority. I think your second question was whether we can look at the possibility of Premium Processing for other benefits for the business fees Premium Processing is utilized. I will certainly look into that and communicate with this committee about those possibilities. Thank you, mr. Chairman. I yield back. Thanks. The chair recognizes the gentleman from ohio for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you for your service, mr. Director. My first question would be this. My district is basically most of the city of cincinnati, most of the Greater Cincinnati area. We are down in the southwestern portion of ohio. They oftentimes refer to our area as the tristate area because we have kentucky across the ohio river and indiana is right next to my district, as well. They call it the tristate area. There was an article recently printed in the cincinnati inquirer that indicated there have been 842 of these unaccompanied children that were let me ask you a question about that, first of all. Should we keep referring to them as children . Ive seen an article recently that pointed out actually Something Like 91 of them are teenagers. To your knowledge, is that accurate . I understand there is a big difference between a teenage their was 12 and just 13 and one that is 19 and just turned 20. Your understanding would 90 or so of these folks be teenager rather than little 5 or 6yearold kids . I spent a lot of time in your district. I had a case as a federal prosecutor in cincinnati and really enjoyed my time there. The question really for us is a legal question. Under the law these are children in terms of what their rights are under the law. I understand. We call them infants even if they are under 21 years of age, age of majority which in ohio has come down to 18. We call them infants. When people think of infants they are talking about a baby. My only question really thus far is, do you know, is it accurate to say 90 , the article said 91 , 90 are teenagers, meaning they are from 13 to 19 . I dont know specifically. Thats fine. Thank you. So getting on to the question that i put the question within. So 842 are apparently going to the tristate area. I think 360 of those are to ohio, the state i happen to have one of the districts. In exactly how many are in the Greater Cincinnati area, didnt point out. But my question is this. It says that theyre going to families, for example, going to individuals, trying to farm them out to different people. They are going to watch them until their hearings are ultimately held or whatever happens happens. How much of an effort is determined, to determine the legal status of the people that theyre going to . So congressman, what i have to share is im a little bit outside my lane here in the sense that the actual placement of these young people, these children is conducted by the administration with children of family age. I dont know what they do to deal with it. It would seem to me that would be i dont want to put you on the spot it would seem to me that would be an important thing to be determined by the executive branch of the government and probably legislative branch ought to know that, as well. If we are taking folks that are here and i hesitate to say illegally because the way the law was written, which was supposed to deal with trafficking issues, where people were criminally trafficked and so legislation was passed back in 2008, as we know, and so there are some questions whether they are here legally or illegally. If people dont really have legal status and a lot of americans are concerned about are here, and we are putting them with people that are also here illegally, maybe under different circumstances, that doesnt seem like a very good idea to me. Would you agree with that . Again, im outside my lane. I dont want to substitute my judgment. I legally refer policy matter to the individuals responsible for that placement. I have one other question i wanted to get to. As you are probably aware, carnivals and Fair Industries rely on laborers, seasonal guest workers to substitute their work force. These fairs are important to american agriculture and fundraising which supports youth and civic programs, beginning in early december 2013, a significant portion of mobile amusement industry paid Premium Processing fees for handling of their h2b petition. Apparently there is a long delay to getting approval of these and setting back a bunch of businesses across america. Because im running out of time here, if i could have my staff follow up with you to see if we cant determine why that delay is happening and expedite that matter so we can get folks hired here who we do want to come legally. Could we Work Together on that . Yes. I see a thumbs up. I appreciate that. Your staffer in the background also nodding in the affirmative. Thank you very much. Thank you, congressman. Chair recognizes. Gentlewoman from texas ms. Jackson lee for five minutes. I thank the chair very much. Mr. Rodriguez, congratulations on your Prior Service to this nation. Now a new start in your service to this nation. President befitted himself well as he always does in your appointment. I think it is important to take note of what i heard as i came in, as you were explaining to mr. Conyers an extensive background where you understand your responsibilities of enforcing the law, but you also understand the plight of people. So let me start, first of all, by asking about the plight of people and the ability of this government to balance, particularly under Immigration Services following the law, those surges that may come for reasons of fleeing. I know that there is an office of Refugee Resettlement that has dual hats in state and homeland security, as well. Why dont you give me a brief philosophy. I have more pointed questions, but just how do we balance that . Youve been a prosecutor. We are on a Judiciary Committee. We are not calling for the violation of laws, but we are trying to find a balance. How do you see that balance . Congresswoman, i appreciate you pointing to my experience as a prosecutor. Every chief prosecutor i ever worked for has exercised prosecutorial discretion in some way. They have determined priorities. When i was a street prosecutor, we knew that we needed to dedicate more prosecutorial resources to murderers than to individuals who are trying to get on the subway for free. So similar principles apply in our immigration processing, as well. I think your question is how do we deal with surges . One of the things i am pleased to see as the new director of cis is we dealt with surges in our work for Different Reasons at many different times. In one respect, the first surge was actually the birth of our agency. Our agency was created in the early part of the Bush Administration. It was separated away from the former ins. That required a huge lift by leadership and staff in order to make this now an independent, fully functioning agency. When daca came along, we had a surge as well. And we learned a number of very useful lessons from that experience, which we can apply for whatever surges we may face in the future. Let me thank you for that. You made a very valid point. I just want to take a moment of personal privilege to acknowledge the late lionel castillo, who was a neighbor of mine, a constituent of mine, who was on the Immigration Services under jimmy carter. Just came to mind. I only say that because he seemed to have had that same philosophy. That was many, many years ago. As i look at the work that you all have to do, 10 million applications, over 50 different types of petitions applications. A prosecutor always lays out his or her case. To win, i think you have to be orderly. From your perspective, a comprehensive Immigration Reform structure, obviously it is a work of the executive and congress. But an ordering of the responsibility that you have which would then see an enhancement of staffing. It would see more resources because one of the proposals, of course, are the fines that individuals would pay to get in an orderly line. No, not in front of those who have been in line. Whats your assessment on getting order to the immigration system in america . So of course, thank goodness were not charging fines. Were actually charging fees because these are and i stand corrected. They are fees. There will be a multiple of fees. That individuals are paying. I think order is sort of the core business one of our core business objectives. Would you add to that we can deal with the question of dealing with humanitarian crises in your whole answer . Thank you. Yeah, and we have to, of course, address those aggressively when they occur. I think thats the nature of your question. Well, the nature of my question is that if we pass comprehensive Immigration Reform, you sort of put in order all that youre dealing with now. You have the ability through laws to address these questions. Would it be better to have an order that allows you now to get your hands around the Many Disparate aspects of immigration in this country, one of which are individuals here to work that are already here in this country. That is what weve done. Thats what well always do, is balance different lines of business for most the most efficient processing across our lines of business. And the eb5 petitions, are they something you can work with as well that generates jobs and other aspects of Economic Opportunity . Yes, the eb5 petitions are. We are in the process right now of affecting some important changes that were started by now deputy secretary. Among other things, centralizing our eb5 petitions and fully staffing the office to enable us to very efficiently and correctly process those applications. I think let me just say, the chairman and i have looked at this issue. I think we had some legislation that was moving at one point in time. So im looking forward to the ordering of that because i think there is merit to the eb5 in terms of its investment. If it is an orderly process and as well the benefits that come. But i want to make sure the benefits are not overly excessive for the investment in the job creation that is so very important. Ill just finish on this note. Is it important for a nation that has shown itself to have been built on immigration and laws to have a humanitarian element to continuing in this process of immigration even in the 21st century . We know what we did in the 1800s, the 1900s, the 20th century in terms of the flow of immigration. Do we still have that role now in the 21st century . Time of the gentlewoman has expired. Chair recognizes the gentleman from alabama, mr. Backus, for his questions. Thank you. Weve had several words that have been used time and time again here this morning. Ive heard the word discretion. Ive heard the term humanitarian. You use the word freedom and enterprise. You stress the pillars of our democracy. But ive heard discretion, discretion, discretion. Ive heard you say that six times. What i hadnt heard you say is rule of law. Youre a prosecutor. You enforce the law. My parents, your parents are immigrants. They came here legally. You know, they followed a rule of law. What im seeing here is when a rule of law, theres a reason. And you may exercise discretion toward someone that violates that law, but theres also the victim. We also you know, you dealt with a lot of victims. You met with those who survived their death, a lot of times. I want to talk about and someone on the democratic side said plight of the people. Id like to talk about those that are suffering from the president s actions on encouraging and i think its encouraging. He admitted that daca has incentivized unauthorized immigration, particularly with respect for children. He said thats a problem. Thats why people are sending people here. The New York Times im going to talk about a very conservative paper. And thats the Cameron Smith, whos General Council for the alabama policy institute. Very conservative organization. The New York Times, they agreed on one thing. They said the program, talking about daca, is benefitting some immigrants but it extends the visa wait for others. He talks about daca and the lengthy backlogs on visa and citizenship applications where people are following the law. You mentioned all the people that have been transferred to the border from immigration to deal with these children. What the New York Times said and this is an article id like you to read maybe when you get back. February the 8th, 2014. The long waits came when the agency, your agency, shifted attention and resources to a Program President obama started in 2012 to give deportation deferrals to young, undocumented immigrants according to administration officials. Not me. They go on and talk about u. S. Citizens petitions for green cards for immediate relatives are at a high, if not the highest, priority in the way Congress Sets up the immigration system. But theres nightmare story after nightmare story of a man coming back from czechoslovakia, his wife a citizen having to wait eight months and still not hearing. A family in australia, hes american, shes australian. They have children. Hes been back for six months. Theyre still there. I dont think it was intended. In fact, the Congress Also passed a resolution here just july the 8th saying there are now 900 children in congo waiting with their adopted parents in the United States because immigration quit processing these applications and assigned it to the state department. The state department has slowed down on it. I dont know why you did that. But theres a resolution. Im going to submit for the record a letter signed by about 20 democratic senators, elizabeth warren, Mitch Mcconnell, republican, but on both sides, and about 90 of us from the house that said, please process these claims, please Pay Attention to the democratic republic of congo and quit slowing these things up. So the victims, just like the New York Times said, the Program Benefits daca is benefitting some. Youre having children coming here. Youre offering humanitarian thing, but weve got a lot of relatives and families that are being separated because you have taken resources. Even the administration in this letter said because of this plight on the border, some immigrants extending a visa wait for others. These are people that go through the process. Let me close with what Cameron Smith said in the Birmingham Business journal. The governance by rule of law is being challenged as it may be in times crucially important to the american system. By circumventing immigration law, the president has encouraged even more unlawful immigration. In response, america has a choice to either create yet another incentive for unlawful activity by caring for immigrant children and attending to their health needs or processing those who are going through the system. Id just like to submit this to you and say, please, dont sacrifice families in asia, families in europe and deploy all your resources about these children. You know, it tugs at our heart strings, but what youre not seeing is all these examples of people who are suffering. And rule of law, youre a prosecutor. Rule of law is what it country is built on. The gentleman is very eloquent, but his time has expired. Is there a question there to the secretary . If he wants to respond. I dont know if youre aware of the resolution for congress on the children. Yeah, i look forward to reviewing these materials. I am aware of the congo situation. I look forward to discussing that with you. I am committed to the rule of law. Thats why when i mentioned to congressman smith the question about the culture of getting to the right answer. Under the facts and under the law. And absolutely we need we have an obligation of stewardship to the people you describe to run an efficient and fair system. All right. Thank you. Chair recognizes the gentlewoman from california, ms. Chu, for five minutes. Thank you. First i would like to put into the record this document for the humane Immigration Rights of los angeles pertaining to oversight. Without objection, it will be made a part of the record. Thank you. Director rodriguez, i am gratified to hear that you are a prosecutor and that you were in a strong position to challenge false claims to tell truth from fact. And what i want to know is whether the current credible fear system works. I understand the current credible fear asylum system is a robust process that requires an Asylum Seeker to demonstrate a significant possibility of succeeding in demonstrating a past persecution or wellfounded fear of future persecution to an immigration judge. So, mr. Rodriguez, could you please walk us through what an asylum officer does when conducting a credible fear interview and how does the officer test the correct of an applicant, and how does the officer determine whether theres a significant possibility the individual could be eligible for asylum . Sure. Thank you, congresswoman