Transcripts For CSPAN3 Governors 20240705

Again. Is that right . It, folks, how cool is that . One more time for joe biden. Two housekeeping points. First Lady Jill Biden just finishing speaking with governors about workforce Training Programs during the National Governors Association Annual conference. Next im really the warmup bent phil scott. Hes really on the front line of where the disasters are, of what governors have to do. I mean a lot of people can determine what battles they want to take on. Governors, the battles come to us. I think we have learned that the hard way as governors over the last four years, and i think phil is really on the frontlines as well. When phil and i first got elected, one of the first things we did was a tabletop exercise when it came to a cyberattack. We thought it was going to take down a power plant in massachusetts if memory serves, and how the rest of us were going to respond. Then it was just six months later that we got hit by covid. We had to learn how to Work Together not just across disciplines within our own state, but throughout the entire region and country as a whole. That is what weve got to learn going forward. Its amazing, weve got Juliette Kayyem here. Shes got a very happy book, its called the devil never sleeps. Learning to live in an age of disasters. Tells us a bit how we ought to be thinking about what happens next. Phil, i just want to say our hearts go out to you and the people of vermont. I have heard from my friends in ludlow what happened there. Its sort of interesting, i know weve got people up there in terms of a maritime rescue support. I sort of ask, how does that work and what the mutual aid. There was an online request put forward by vermont in states throughout the region responded. We were able to make our proposal of, get people up there in 24 hours. That is what mutual aid means and thats how we look out for each other. Phil, over to you, my friend. Yes. Thank you very much, ned. Right now im in a separate office. Our offices are impacted as well. The department of motor vehicle, attorney general, treasury, taxes, all of our offices are closed at this point in time. They are flooded. Ive spent many hours over the last three years with a daily Pandemic Press briefings. We had a fever happening in the offices that we are in, that we gave those, and that is filled with like 20 feet of water right now. So again, we are living this day in and day out. I really want to thank the other governors who are here today, and those who are not, for helping us in many different ways. You mentioned the swift water rescue. Weve had teams from six states. We made 200 rescues to date. This was different as you mentioned. Many incredibly impacted by this event, and we have seen before during irene. That was like 11 years ago, but this is different. With irene, we had that storm on a sunday afternoon, and by the next morning it was over. Then we went right into recovery. The sun was shining on a lot of damage, and we just closed out the last bridge a year ago. So that was different. This one has been raining, you know, raining for days. It hasnt stopped and we are impacted again. It slowed down yesterday. We had sunshine. Now, today we are expecting another two inches of rain. This afternoon, hail and lightning a possibility, possibility of a tornado in vermont if you can imagine that. So i manges real and we are dealing with it as we speak. Again, six states set those swift water rescue teams, and we are grateful for that. That is what makes us all work, and that is what makes this discussion worth it. That my home itself was impacted, our roads also. Ned, i thank you for your service and why we are doing what we are doing. We tried to bring you Something Interesting and relevant. It really doesnt matter matter whether youve been in office for seven months or seven years. We hope this session is thoughtprovoking. It tells you a little bit about how our State Governments have to be ready for everything and anything. We have to react to increasing numbers of unpredictable challenges. Again, like the one we are facing in vermont right now. Now, every governor comes face to face with multiple crises. I know that you know that. I know that. Its good, but today the base of these incidents, and therefore, the number of responses, is increasing. So we are going to talk a bit about why that is. So we can better understand it and continue to get the job done and move our states and nation forward. We also need to level set this when we are talking about crises. We are not just talking about responding to a Natural Disaster for global pandemic. We are also talking about a growing number of cybersecurity attacks and breaches at our hospitals, our schools, to thei. Even the threat of it, like, what we are seeing through schools around the country. We have experienced it in vermont as well, those mass swapping events. It could also be the introduction of a. I. , deep fakes, and other digitally driven criminal activity or espionage. It could be a transportation incident like a collapsed branch. I know the governor of pennsylvania experience that as well. We never know when we will be called upon to assess the we all see the volume of these increasing, it gives us a pause. With that in mind, lets talk about it. To kick us off, i would like to introduce ourucd guests. Juliette kayyem. Juliet is an International Leader in Crisis Management and security. Shes the faculty chair at Homeland Security and Global Health projects at Harvards Kennedy school of government. And prior to her time at howard, she served as assistant secretary to the department of Homeland Security for president obama. And as Homeland Security adviser you may also recognize her, as i have, as a nationa have, as a National Security analyst at cnn. If that wasnt enough, shes also a Pulitzer Prize finalist, and author of that pleasant book that was mentioned. Learning to live in an age of disaster, the devil never sleeps. I cant wait to get that on my bed stand. So thank you very much for joining us this morning, julia. Thank you. The floor is all yours. Thank you so much. And thank you, governor, im sorry you couldnt be here, but you know your role. Thank you governor lamont and the team at angie a. So, i have had considerable experience in government, and now in academia, thinking about disasters and Homeland Security from different perches. States and territories where you are, of course, and the federal government. So, take this as someone with a lot of opinions and no authority speaking to people with both. Where we are and where we need to be, and since i do have a captive audience, there are six ideas i want to throw out you all about where i think, in particular, governors play a significant role in the age that we find ourselves in. Okay. So you are going to hear words like poly crisis. Some people use permacrisis. What does it mean . It just means a lot of bad things are happening simultaneously. And they are not defined by the particular threat. You know, weve had the pandemic and School Shootings and Cyber Attacks and climate disasters. The way we think about that is just sort of you are having multiple overlapping shocks. That is what poly crisis means. And it means that the whole is more dangerous than the parts. Right . Its not like you are just bouncing back. These things keep coming. So we are sort of setting a floor each time that it comes our norm even though more disasters and crisis are coming. I tend to call it the boom moment, because i dont like to define it based on risk. I think the moment that you find yourself in, in terms of Crisis Management, its everything. Its the devil, so to speak. You are going to be facing different kinds of booms both expected and unexpected. The framework that you all have inherited, this state Emergency Management Disaster Management framework, was built in the 1970s. It has not had tremendous reform despite the fact all the things that keep changing. That framework was based on the notion that disasters were random and rare. Right . Theres an acute crisis, everyone runs to it, you set up a command structure. The locals respond. Then the states manage it. Then you turn to the feds for additional support. In my world, and thinking about Disaster Management, we call that sort of thinking as sort of left and right of boom. The boom could be anything. Left is all the prevention and preparedness things that you do, rights response, recovery, and resiliency. We thought about it as binary. Right . Theres a moment before and a moment after. Now its circular. You are feeling that, right . The doctrine has not changed. The way we think about it has not changed. Your teams are ill equipped and understaffed. Thats not their fault. They are working hard for this circle. Right . This circle of mayhem, call it whatever you want. We defined, and supported to remember we define crises is very different than i think the Public Policy issues that you are addressing. Lots of things are crises. Theres a Mental Health crisis. The difference that you encounter at this moment of boom has three elements thinking about how you are preparing yourself. Its a disruption to your core capabilities as a governor, as a state, as a community leader. It comes at a time that is unexpected. Im looking at governorship ural. Like, that truck caught on fire. Good morning. And third, and this is the most important piece, your runway is short. I teach at a school of Public Policy and we do think of Public Policy challenges, which maybe crises like Mental Health, housing, poverty, as very different than the kind you have experienced. So hopefully, as you think about how you are preparing yourselves and your teams, think about that short runway. At that moment of boom. That is all youve got. So you only have two options, be ready because the runways coming, or try to extend the runway. Those are your only two options at that moment. So im going to hopefully provide some ways to think about that runway. And i describe in the book, and in my work, just sort of think about learning to fail safer. Its not a happy place to be. I recognize that. We sort of dont get to good, we are just getting to less bad, but its important to your communities and to the people you represent. Because you represent how are we going to get to less bad, because at that moment of boom its bad, and its bad for people who are looking to government to work. Right . Whatever their ideology is, this is the moment they want it to work. So, what are six ways that i think about in terms of the commonalities across disasters . My work, i dont look at particular ones and say these are the ones. Centuries of disasters provide us with these commonalities. Right now, when you go back, the most important thing i think that makes leadership significant is what is your Situational Awareness at the moment of the boom. By . Are you happy with it . Right . It is amazing at that moment, people in your leadership positions are either not getting the information they want in a timely fashion, or they are getting it in such a sort of limited way that you are not hearing what else is going on there. I often say the, its easy, people will criticize you a lot [inaudible] they are noisy because often they dont have a seat at the table. So if you can capture that, you are going to be able to deploy resources and have your teams deploy resources, in ways where there might be wisdom and that noise. Its not just criticism. People have not traditionally had seats at this at tables. Our system of management is not always equitable. I want to give you examples from your peers so you can talk about it. Community Emergency Support functions. You are familiar with Emergency Support functions because thats how your Emergency Management teams work. They are about logistics and transportation and everything else. Actually, why dont you build one for Community Engagement . Right . Its as important at the time of disaster as logistics and planning. Second, communications. Obviously, that is your big role, and you can take classes and classes on crisis communication. I want to make it easy for you. If you look at some of your predecessors, bobby gentle in particular, you cannot delegate knowledge of what is going on to others. And governor, i wasr. And governor, i was just simply watching you. What is happening. What are the numbers telling you . Just basic facts people want. Then your role is hope. What are you doing to make a government at that time . People will give you all sorts of advice on Crisis Management. I just made it easier. You can capture those two things. People will then feel and be invested in your success, and of course, their success. I have to add a little caveat here. And dont be afraid of top love in the sense that we need communities to move that we need communities to move. We need them not to drive into things, into puddles that are not bottles. We need them to evacuate. So former governor kristi was quite good at this. But you need to be tough. The resources people are expecting will not come to them unless they listen. You are not going to put your Emergency Management teams at risk because someone fails to evacuate. Third, think about what the haitians call stupid deaths. The victims are not stupid of course, these are the deaths that did not need to happen. Death or destruction that did not need to happen. The haitians think about this when an earthquake happens, but then another hundred thousand people die because they simply cannot get resources. Resources to them. We dont have numbers like this, fortunately, but there are people who will suffer consequences not at the immediate boom. In some ways, you not being tactically oriented, but being strategically oriented, can help guide communities to protect them from that time period between Immediate Response and when things calm down. Fourth, if i could have every governor have a recovery office, i would, or a recovery czar, i dont worry about response as much. Theres challenges to you, you know, Emergency Contacts dont work if 50 states are activated to fight covid. We know that, right . We know that you are being stretched, but there is sort of ingenuity at that moment of the boom. Everyone leads at recovery. And states can help communities think long term, not just about what resources we are going to get you at the moment of the mayhem, but obviously when the cameras leave, when the focus leaves. I think that is a particularly unique and Important Role for governors offices. Communities cant do it on their own. The resources sort of disappear. And helping communities do that, so you are just seeing a lot more focus on, you know, between response and long term resiliency. There are those months and years. Think about new orleans. Recovery that no one owns. I really think its an Important Role for governors who can capture all of the aspects of State Government and drive them to communities that are harmed fifth, another area that is important its communities will get defensive about the response. Its just inevitable. Every disaster has, you know, give me a disaster that does not have politics and i will show you north korea. Politics are the bloodstream of our democracy. But we need to learn as well outside of all the screaming and yelling and the root causes and if its Climate Change or gun control. That stuff is just put aside. An important part of what states can do, and governors, and territories and governors, is learned, as we say in our vernacular, not that they died but how they died. Those are different questions, right . You can say, you know, four dozen people died in this hurricane. A community will sort of recognize that, but only a state i think can take a serious after action review on what happened, because we learn Different Things when we study what happened. And how people die is different. One example is in the United States and puerto rico, you know, is still suffering the consequences, but in the continental United States, when we say people die from a hurricane, they are not dying from water right . Most of them are now dying from Carbon Monoxide poisoning because people put makeshift generators up and then those makeshift generators dont work, and theres all sorts of doityourself stuff. Knowing that will help you drive your resources in terms of how you are educating communities and other aspects like that. So your role as a sort of reviewer or after action, like a military general, is really important because then you can drive your resources to the how people are dying. Right . What is going on . And then finally, incentivizing resilience. This is the hardest thing. If disasters are a circle, our framework, you know this, you work with the stafford act, is not working for our communities. If something happens in your state and you are begging for dollars to get at the community back, not able statutorily to think long term. We cannot invest in resiliency. The stafford act is not working for us as a nation i think. Given the recurring nature of the disasters now. And for all the criticisms that we hear about Insurance Companies, honestly, Insurance Companies are just filling the gap of what the Public Policy is unwilling to do. Right . They are just trying to price risk and we are not doing it. So i want to give you some good news on this. Across the states and territories there has been some really interesting work on mitigation studies. They were trying to drive Disaster Relief money to mitigating the harm that the community will face again, because its facing it again. In louisiana, alabama, alabama has actually partnered with its state universities to have mitigation planning, which they are then working with the Insurance Industry to lower premiums. Its a really sort of unique and helpful way to think about partnering with your stakeholders to try to temper communities. Louisiana similarly has a grant Mitigation Fund that they are driving to communities to get them to after the disaster. The disaster happened, now we are going to use the plants because we know another disasters coming. On the federal side, this is jobs, right . This is not a bad thing when you think about rebuilding, you know its horrible, like when you think about whats positive can come out of it. I just want to point you to some areas and get your economics teams to think about it. A lot of this mitigation and resiliency stuff is being hidden. Not bad, i think, just to get out of the politics of is it Climate Change. Is it a Climate Change statute . In the farm bill, obviously, farmers are suffering. Theres a tremendous amount of funding for mitigation. Theres the inflation act, of course. Theres efforts to support states in their mitigation planning. But there are changes at fema, and honestly i cant ask you to lobby, but honestly express your support. These are going to help your states. Two minor changes to the stafford act that gets us out of that cycle of, that thing happens, lets throw money at the problem to get you back to normal and, oh, surprise, another bad thing happens. So think about two areas where there have been changes. One is called the Community Disaster resilience zone. That is steering money to communities that or more in need than others. Because they are already not resilient. Right . Then the thing happens. The other is good for you all. Its that there is now a way to think about disaster belief that goes to mitigation. Remember, you 75 25 split with the stafford act. It communities use it to try to mitigate for the next disaster, the federal government will take on 85 instead of 75 , only leaving 15 of the communities and you. Its a small program. It needs to get better, but there are ways we are testing the system so that we are not just, you know, disaster, throw the funds at it, and then move on and hope, keep your fingers crossed. So those are some efforts on state level, private sector level of course, and the federal level. It goes without saying, insurance and Insurance Companies have a huge role. States, as you know, you own insurance, you know, there is no National Insurance standard. The Supreme Court has spoken to that. So working with your Insurance Companies about what they may need in terms of reducing risk for communities. The stuff you are seeing in california and florida is a lot of posturing, but its also real. You know . It is in the sense that these risks are not being mitigated sufficiently. That is plenty, but i leave you with that. I think the new playbook is being written and i think it is being written by states and the territories. You recognize that these disasters are not random and rare. That the devil never sleeps and you are faced with some of these challenges. Im happy to open it up now, but i was given 15 minutes and had a captive audience, so those are my six for you. Beautifully said, juliette. Lets keep going on the Internet Companies if i could. We have Property Casualty in connecticut, hartford travelers, i dont want them on the sidelines. I want them at the table. We have a fair amount of infrastructure money and resilience money. I want them to use their analytics to help on where that could best be deployed. What are other states doing at what can the feds do to help their . Okay, as i said, i think what is happening in california and florida is the Insurance Companies are trying to get a little bit more receptivity. Honestly, california has a role now that does not let the Insurance Companies adapt to changing mapping. You either believe in mapping as a tool to drive resources, or you dont. You might not like what the Insurance Companies are saying, but in the absence of us doing it better, they are going to fill that vacuum and they will decide to exit areas where they cannot get enough flexibility. Climate change, whatever you are going to call it, this is happening. We are either going to price it now or later. The idea that these decisions about where we live, how we live, whether we should live there, are being made you dont want them being made by the private sector. That is what is happening now. Bringing the Insurance Companies to the table and figuring out what they need in terms of mapping, get Consumer Protections in it obviously, but a decision by an Insurance Company to simply, and its being reported incorrectly, they did not abandon california or florida. Californias writing new claims, but the decision by them to do that without any individualized risk assessment, that means the individual homeowners has no ability to mitigate their own risks. And homeowners can do it. There is an independent study about paradise, florida. You can debate whether people should live in the urban interface, but they do. It determined that with personal mid mitigation efforts by home owners, better roofing, getting rid of shrubs, it was a horrible human loss, but you could have protected about 42 of that property. So the Insurance Companies can incentivize this for homeowners and states can work with Insurance Companies. Your premium is going to be lower if you have x, y, or easy. Of course, no one behaves well in the context of all of this and people go to their corners, but i think that is where you come in. This is happening, we cant pretend like its not happening. Our Public Policies are being set by insurance in certain ways, or by Disaster Relief funds that are not doing anything to make us safer for these communities for the future. Any other questions . There you go. Jared. Yeah. I was going to ask, i mean, this is focused more on state appropriately, but lets talk about federal and fema for a moment. Yeah. My frustrations is that very often their solutions are sort of wildly out of touch with what is needed. That costs federal taxpayers more. Is there some new paradigm . Because i think we all agree there is a federal poll in this. We are states, we are on the ground, but we need help in these kind of onetime events at a large scale. Fema generally is not it. I mean they come in with kind of not the right thing. If we had a small amount of funds or more flexible, you know, we would go a lot further. How do we kind of incorporate the one thing we all do is advocate federally, but in your opinion what should we be asking for for a better federal response . That is a great question. Im sure people from fema who are here will have strong opinions. First of all, their hands are legitimately tied. I mean it is the most fru was emma really isnt. Parents transportation. There is, now unfortunately, unified stuff happens. We basically the white house is an access point from your perspective now right before i have a good understanding of resources are available to you from fema. The fema region that you are in. Because they may be unrealistic. Right . Theme is like, what . Like 5000 or 6000 ftes. Its not an army. I mean i love them, but its capacities is they know everyone else in the federal government. Owyou need helicopters . I know people at d. O. D. You need whatever . So have a sense of what those resources are so that your demands can be specific to what they presently have. Thats pretty easy to do. You all have regional fema heads are going were going to have a sense of what is in the other states as well. As i said, get a sense of the numbers and then your expectations will also be set. First of all, i have to commend you about the amount of information and knowledge that you have. You said something about not having experience, but wow. [laughter] so its a little hard to react to everything youve told us, so i will try to be brief. One thing that is very hard for me to handle it dealing with communities that are located where they shouldnt. I know. Meaning in flood areas where they are too close to the coast. What do you do . You cannot start expropriating all over the place, or if they have title, because some of them dont even have title. So its a safety issue. Yeah. So that is hard. Now, fema is doing a couple of things that i think incentivize those