this morning, the washington post, biden planned to halt gas tax has few believers. >> we are, it's not a very popular idea even in his own party. you know, what he wants to do is suspending gas bag tax versus 18 cents, federal casper for gasoline, and 24 cents for diesel. a lot of economists, a lot of democrats just way, and republicans, of course, that this really won't help drivers budget will just give more profits to the refineries at a time that supply is so tight. >> so i mean what and then why do it then he? >> has few options. so obviously drivers are frustrated, gas prices are $5 a gallon, they may go even high this summer. and people want to see action. they want to be watching to do something. the president's approval numbers are terrible and you know the high gas prices are one reason for that. obviously he has very few tours and he has very few levers to pull to actually slow down the rise in gas prices. and so, this is one of the few things he can try to do to show at least he's doing something. the problem is it's not that effective and idea. >> can consumers do it? >> can consumers do it in terms of bringing down gas prices? yeah. i mean that's the only way gas prices are going to come down. we need to reach what's called this demand destruction where prices become so either people stop driving and a buy lace. the problem we have right now is that because of the pandemic, pent-up demand, people have been serving there mainly they, have been traveling, and this is a summer where a lot of people just want to get out, they haven't traveled in a while, and we're still seeing people hit the road in record numbers. and that keeps driving gas prices up. >> okay, so the president, we understand, there's going to be at the white house with oil and gas executives whose. attending this meeting? is that the president, his energy is the secretary, what are they going to say? >> my understanding is that energy secretary granholm will be there. they really want the refineries to, they want them to refine more, but that's not going to happen. because if you like the numbers, as refineries are already working at capacity. and we've seen the amount of refining capacity in this country go down by, i think, 1 million barrels per day, which is quite a bit over the last couple of years. refineries have closed, companies haven't wanted to invest, and so it's really frustrating to the administration. they are seeing these all companies and other owners of refineries making a lot of money at the time cast prices are going up they want to do something about it. the problem is there isn't much they can do about it. you know, we are seeing this happen in all kinds of countries. the price of gas is, you know, it goes along with world markets, right and? so unless you are going to nationalize the energy companies you, know, which they do in venezuela and saudi arabia, where they can bring the prices down, you don't have a lot of other options they don't you -- were just talking about refining -- and they don't have the capacity refinement? >> yeah. right now -- >> because they went off line? >> yeah. i mean right now, you're seeing refining capacity at record highs. i mean they're refining almost everything they can. and -- >> refineries in u.s. and other countries did go off line. these are big, expensive facilities. this is infrastructure. it can take ten years to get the premise and get one of these things built. it can take several years to get, you know, one of the white has been brought expanded. it's billions of dollars. oil companies are looking at this and saying, okay if there is things go to operate for 20, 30, 40, more years this is going to invest. if we're just looking at ten years, five years, and we're looking at electric cars being, you know, taking up a piece of the market during that time and this refinery is going to become a police, and then an abandoned asset, is not an investment. so you're just seeing that refining capacity that went off line during the pandemic when demand went down, -- interest from investors in bringing more refineries of light. >> you said they're just not investing in it because of what you're saying. is it also because of the up and down nature of the industry itself? >> yeah, that definitely plays a role. i mean, before even, you know, the war came into play, we were looking at the situation where demand has dropped so much during the pandemic and the beginning of the pandemic where oil was down to zero dollars a barrel at one point. and so, oil companies were looking at this and saying, okay, demented so far down we've got some of these refineries that need major, you know, improvements or investments, and it doesn't look that good for the future. so we are not going to invest in them. and you know, these are investments that just don't turn on a diamond you can suddenly start refining, you know, an extra 3 million barrels per day because something where prices are high and we want to see more gas on the market. and so that all played into this situation where in. >> we heard the president yesterday when he called for a suspension of the federal gas tax holiday. he also talked about the price at the pump. he talked about who controls it. what did he say? >> well, you know, the president likes to lay blame on oil companies if. you look at the polls, washington post did one, and people feel like oil companies have some blame in this and. you know, i mean obviously they're making another one in the making windfall profits right now at the time everyone else is peeing these huge prices. and it's very frustrating that you know there's seems to be very little that can be done to at least move some of those profits towards lowering the price of gas or doing something to help consumers. and so, a lot of the rhetoric from the white house has just been about all companies are gouging you and they need to play a role in fixing this. on the flip side of that, of course, is all covered it was a, even, you know and some liberal commenters will say, if you look at companies and the profits they're making and rates of return, you know, oil companies are sort of nowhere near the top. i mean the tech companies make a lot more than those. over the years, there years where during the pandemic that we were just talking about where they companies weren't making any profits. they were losing money. and so, you know, we're over five, ten-year period, they're making a lot of money right now at this one but, it's not like they rank a mom, they don't compare to, like, apple, for example. and so it's been pointed out to be, okay, you're going to have a windfall profits tax, why doesn't that affect apple or some of these are the companies that are actually making a lot more money than oil companies are? >> so what is the future for this oil and gas companies? but are they talking about well, they're taking different approaches. you know, like bp, which has more ties to europe, they're trying to make 40% of their portfolio be renewables. delicate like, okay, there's not going to be enough of a market. there's going to be some market for fossil fuels going forward but not the kind of market we have now and. we need to diversify this business you. no, the american oil companies, chevron, exxonmobil, they're taking a different approach. they are sort of investing in new technologies but they tend to be things like carbon capture, unit, where you would sort of try to capture the carbon from the atmosphere and continue with fossil fuel production or try to produce, kind of, a hydrogen, using a lot of fossil fuels. but you pair it with this carbon capture to sort of neutralize the greenhouse gas emissions. so they are taking all different kinds of approaches, but they are wary of investing too much in traditional exploitation of oil fields and refining. >> even how upper is here to take your questions and comments about the gas industry what biden called for the suspension of the federal gas tax if you are republican true to a 4701. independents two 027488002. you can text us as well. first name, city, and state to 2 to 4 away 8002. we will try to read some of those as well ahead of today's meeting with the oil and gas companies at the white house the president sent them a letter how is it received? the letter was more like a clinical act more than a real letter intended to move policy forward. he basically said you are making record profits. this is kind of unconscionable at this time. we are at war. americans are suffering. the economy is in tough shape. he was imploring them to boost refining, also to mitigate their profits to help bring down the price of gas. industry executives that received this letter were unmoved. they basically said this is a political stunt. this ignores the realities of their industry. again the point that over the last several years they have made investments where they were losing money. because they are making money in this moment, it is really not a fair picture. they are also saying look we have boosted refining as much as we possibly can. we can't do anymore. we don't know what you are asking of us? >> let's hear from james in myrtle beach, south carolina. republican. >> hi good morning. this whole thing just seems to me like, i don't know why in this country we cannot get a handle on anything. by four year old granddaughter would've had better sense than to do with joe biden has done to our industry. why doesn't the united states we are always giving away where we have? we had the opportunity, right now, the government is the biggest thing that have gotten in the way of our oil companies producing -- we are not ready for this transition yet. we do not have the renewable fuels. i tell you, the american people need to wake up and start changing the way they vote before this whole country is destroyed. >> james, let's take your point about this country not being ready for renewables. >> that is a fair point. we have an incoherent national energy policy. we are trying to move towards this transition. if you look at our climate goals, what the climate scientists are telling us, you look at the international community with the paris accord, we are behind on that so on one sense we are looking at these high gas prices that people are suffering from and at the same time we are also losing ground on the climate site. so, it has been this kind of halting energy policy where we try to meet these climate goals. it has been something of an incoherent policy. we lurch forward, we realize where we're not ready in certain parts of the country. it is really adding to the challenge. it is adding to the challenge of why there is-limited refining capacity right now. otherwise we would be moving into electric cars. we'll be further along in this transition. the oil companies do not want to invest in this infrastructure, knowing that the policy will be to phase adele. but you feel me -- and we do not have enough of the alternative resources available. people are still stuck in their cars that run on internal combustion engines. gas prices are high right now. >> in brooklyn, new york, john democratic collar. >> good morning, question or comment here for evan halper. >> good morning, thank you for taking my call. i understand that the united states is producing $20 million up he barrels of oil per day. we are producing $18 million while per day. with that surplus -- from anywhere around the country or around the world. saudi arabia, argentina, and we opening up more drilling. my question for you is, what is an acceptable profit level for our oil companies to make? in order to make up this extra difference of 2 million barrels a day that we need in order to meet our demands right now. what is unacceptable profit level for our oil companies? >> i guess that is sort of a tough question to answer. we did not set limits on what profits the or companies can make. it currently is a lot of people are paying for these high prices for gas, oil companies are gonna continue to make these high profits there's not much the government can do about it. other countries, they have naturalized their energy companies. that is one way to control what profits the oil companies make. it obviously brings with it all kinds of other issues. you know, there is also the president mentioning the possibility of limiting exports of our refined gasoline in our oil to other countries. that, again, creates all kinds of market backlash. so doing that could push oil companies to move their operations offshore. all of this conversation around windfall profit tax or limiting exports, every x has a reaction. a lot of economists, even liberal economists, do worry about if you start imposing these things on oil companies consumers and make the supply even shorter? these are things that policy makers have to balance. >> president biden repeatedly takes on republican criticism that he is not allowing enough drilling in this country. what does he say, what is actually happening? >> that is a complicated thing. first of all the amount of drilling that happens on public land is less than it would seem than the media narrative that have been out there. drilling is a number thing, these are big investments kind of like the refineries. if you are going to ramp these up, we have to bring people in to do the drilling. you have to invest in the equipment. there is also issues to the extent which oil companies can even drill now because of supply chain issues. you need huge amounts of steel to drill new wells. you need to bring employees in who have expertise. you know, like in every another industry getting the man power, the equipment, it is a challenge and something that doesn't turn on a dime. >> republicans say that these companies made that decision based on what president biden was saying before he was elected. i guess they took a bet that he would win and started making these decisions not to drill as much. >> you are looking for signals for washington. wet market signals are being sent. the market signal of, you know, climate forwarded ministration we want to lower the cost of solar power in half. we want this many electric cars to be out. california is banning the internal combustion engine in new cars sold by 2035. these are all signals to the or company that there is not going to be as much demand in a product five or ten years down the line. it is certainly fair to say there is less drilling than there would be if the signal was being sent from washington night, we are not doing the transition. electric cars are wasting your time! gas cars as far as we can see into the future. that is not been the policy senior from washington. >> is it true the when president biden says there is more drilling in his administration than the previous one? >> yes. if you look at the output of -- there is more people. more people driving. more cars on the road. we are growing country. yes, there has been plenty of drilling going on in this administration. helped by the trump administration doing everything it could to promote more drilling. there is a lag from one policy goes into place and when the things happen. you do see some of that. certainly there is a lot of drilling happening right now. again, it gets back to the point that it isn't so much drilling at the moment. the bigger problem is actually this refinery capacity shortage. >> richard, west virginia joe democratic collar. >> think you for c-span. i guess it got a couple of points. we have numerous oil companies that made a 300% increase in profits this quarter. 300%! we also, at is 9000 improved permits on federal lands that allows them to drill. we are exporting gasoline every day out of the united states of america. it just go on and on. you've got, i am a democrat but i do vote republican occasionally for some offices based on the person. you have got a block on the senate, especially by our senator, joe manchin, that is not going to approve anything that joe biden wants. if we had already had implemented the build back better plan, we would've already made this conversion to solar. we would already have had money in the system ready to replace the internal combustion engine. we would've been helped absorbing the shock of this russian oil embargo. >> all right jen, let's take your points. >> i will start with the last one. in terms of the build back better plan there is no question that the lack of investment it slowly go true to shoot. if the package were to have passed when biden hoped it would have, long ago, it still takes a long time to ramp up these investments. i'm not sure there would be a single more electric vehicle on the road today than it had and passed and there is now. to your point, these are policy signals that we have been halting the standing for the last however many years. the country lurches towards one direction, all in on the paris accord, withdraws on the paris accord, the mileage standards are scrapped in the trump administration. it is this sort of whiplash that is creating a drag on the energy transition. definitely has left us unprepared for this moment. you know, as far as prices of oil and gas go right now, you're certainly right. they are making these very high profits at the moment. as i said earlier, part of the challenge here is that there are few tools that biden has or congress has to actually rein that in. they can slap a windfall tax on them, they can start to curb exports, all of those things could have some kind of reaction. you put a windfall tax on oil companies, they will start to look in other markets they can operate on and they can move some of their operations offshore where they don't have to pay that windfall tax. same thing with curving exports. if they're going to be constrained with what they can do with a product by government mandates in this country, these are international companies. they can start moving more their operations offshore. it is a challenge for lawmakers. >> raleigh, north carolina. donald is an independent watching their. good morning, welcome to the conversation. >> good morning. i just want to say that -- >>. >>,, i like most americans, i'm concerned with inflation in the high cost of gas. the price of gas in the united kingdom is five 79. in germany it's five 67. in portugal it's 5:35 a gallon. so the united states is not isolated in this instance. the price of gas is a worldwide phenomenon at this point. so there is a lot. of demand in america, being tied down with the pandemic. the pandemic was much worse than it had to be because donald trump divide there is such a thing is coronavirus for the first 3 to 6 months of its existence. causing the u.s. to lose more than 1 million people. rather than perhaps the 200,000 it could've been. >> donald, you're going down a different direction here. he touched them points you made. what about the role of opec? to find opec for our viewers, remind them and what role other playing in the price? >> so opec has now become opec plus. obviously it is this consortium of oil producing companies in the middle east. it has expanded to include russia, countries other countries in africa. i think it has got 17 countries and it right now. opec we can remember from last time we had a major shortage of energy in the 70s. there were these oil embargo's and oh pack acting in concert to limit how much production was happening which really hurt the u.s. and actually triggered the oil industry in this country. >> we will leave this reported program here. you can finish watching it by going to our website c-span dot org. or with a free video app c-span i. live in capitol hill, the scene inside the cannon house office building where today's january six committee hearing is set to begin this is the fifth in the series yesterday the committee announced they will postpone further hearings until sometime in july today's focus will be on the pressure campaign former president trump and his -- this afternoon we will hear testimony from three trump era justice department employees. questioning today will be led by retired republican congressman adam kinzinger, he is representing the 16th district one of ten house republicans who voted to impeach donald trump following the january 6th attack. and addition to this committee he also serves on the energy and commerce, foreign fared committee. he is an active member of the air national guard with the rank of lieutenant colonel. today's coverage of the january six committee is brought to you by a public service of the cable industry and these television companies including comcast, verizon, charter, and -- and again we are live this afternoon from the cannon house office building for the fifth hearing of the january 6th committee today session will focus on a pressure campaign mounted by former president trump and his allies against the justice department after the november 2020 presidential election. members today we'll hear from three former department of justice officials. jeffrey rosen, the former acting attorney general. richard donahue former acting deputy attorney general, and stephen angle, former assistant attorney general for the office of legal counsel. those three should be arriving to the room shortly. i want to let you know that today's coverage of the january six committee analyses hands program is brought to you by a public service by the cable company. including wow, spark, light and u-verse. a reminder that if you need to step away from your tv you can follow all of today's hearings on the go with c-span now. congressional sessions of c-span all on your phone with c-span now, our free radio app.