very pleased to introduce our next speaker jeffry wert. for some reason, jeffrey, i have never met before. we've we've have common. we have we've been to common. but this is my first meeting with him and we have something common. we were both high school teachers and the other thing we have in common is he's a very famous author and read a lot of his books. so jeffry wert is retires pennsylvania high school history teacher and the author of several books on the civil war, including from winchester to cedar creek and his most recent book, the heart of hell, which we just sold out by way. so we don't have any more copies of that, but we've got another copy of one of your other books out there, among other awards for his books jeffrey's gettysburg day three. it was nominated for a pulitzer prize and a national book award. his articles and essays on the civil war have appeared in many publications, including civil war. times illustrated, american history illustrated and the and gray. please welcome jeffry wert. from oh, good afternoon. i don't know what football game you're watching, but it's important. let me know. score anyhow. i live in the shadow of penn state university. we bad trip last week to michigan. but anyhow a couple of things i begin i don't have a powerpoint presentation there's various reasons for that. i think the best word to cover it is old. secondly, to show our biases. if i thought about this a good bit, if i had to spend an evening with jubal early or phil sheridan, i would choose that irascible old. and the theory is very i think the whiskey would have been better. so. you've probably heard this expression and it's true that history is what historians tell us. it is. so that means the histories, the history you and i read is artificial. it's crafted, it's made up. it's originally made up by the participle. and then people down the road who follow will write about historians or students will write about it. so it's what they tell you. now, if you deal with civil war history, we always what lingers there. appomattox, right, because we all know how it ends. so therefore in history, the other thing is, is always looking backwards. so you think of appomattox and, you're in a story or series tune. you want to look at threads if you want to use that. how do we get there? what are the threads that come together to lead us to appomattox the most important threads? of course, the ones that we recall turning points. now, there are some that are famous, don't have to go through one. i would like to note to you was seven days, seven days campaign one of the most critical turning points of the war, the war in the east changed after seven days because was the ascension of robert e lee. so at the same time, you know, you look at these other elements that come with it and with that said, and i'm talking cedar creek in october the 19, 1864, where's the begin? and, and to me, oh, by the way, while on that, i want to caution all of us historians like me or any of us what we forget about appomattox is. they never knew about blacks. if you went to the camps of the army or the army, nor the virginia divided by the robert dan and rappahannock rivers in the winter, early spring of 64. and you said appomattox them which we all know what it means does who would have no idea what you really would have seen and you would have read is they knew that a reckoning was coming when the weather broke. there's going there. we're going to go at it again. and each army thought, they would win. it's quite a confederate there was very little doubt about the fact that they were going to win and their cause is to prevail. and it was the same for the yankees in the army. but tommy, so if you're looking at the thread, that would come cedar creek. i would argue that it began in may the 1864, when the army of potomac crossed elis and germano forged in the rapidan river, the beginning of the overland campaign. if you ever speak now? of course. gordon wray is going to be here tomorrow. and if you haven't read any of his magisterial volumes on the overland campaign, you should. but anyhow, we're adding about eight different cases. to put it in perspective, it's like an extended nightmare and i mean that by the what they say about it. put in the army potomac in those six weeks, lost more men than, antietam, chancellorsville and gettysburg combined. gained 60,000 men. you read a newspaper in northern new york of the four pages in the newspaper, all it was was a column of casualties from the local regiments in area. so anyhow but what what's important us is in a larger degree because well ulysses us grant would say later that when they crossed the rapidan river, he grabbed a northern army, northern virginia by the throat. that's what he did. but what he did, he achieved strategic initiative in, the theater. he going to dictate the in the east for the next months. robert e lee is going to be forced to react to ulysses s grant the importance of that lee is that when he wrote out nine mao road on sunday, june 1st, 1862 to soon command temporary command of what would be christian, the army, northern virginia. he had certain beliefs. what he understood and he believed we talking about lee and you know people argue how bloody it is he understood that the south could not fight a prolonged war all the natural manmade resources and manpower in the north if you think about it now he didn't put it in those terms. but if abraham lincoln could never find a man who could achieve sword of might, the confederacy was doomed. so they can't fight a prolonged they're fighting against these long odds. so therefore you have to take chances you have to try to change. and within days of taking command, he had decided he was going to attack jordan mcclellan in the army buttermilk outside of richmond. and that would be the beginning so after the end of the seventh seven days campaign. robert de lee held a strategic initiative in the eastern theater until may 4th, 1864. it is now frank pointed it out. you can look at joe coker and the four days or so his union opponent might have had step on in the army. norfolk, virginia. but as a rule, does not lee dictate the contours of a campaign and he really does. but this changes when grant crosses a river with the army of potomac. so by june 12th, 1864, the overland campaign is over. lee is there cold harbor? he doesn't know. but the initial step is being taken in the crossing the james river. he had said to one subordinate before that. if it ever becomes a siege, we're doomed. and then he received word david horner with another federal army is moving in lynchburg and. lynchburg, in turn could not be seized by the federals because it is a vital crossroads. surprisingly i guess, if you think about it, how was surprise? what was braxton bragg, who i never thought had a good thought his mind anyhow, he comes up with he writes to he's now davis, his military advisor, and he writes to davis, you know, we have to address this issue around. but if we drive the federal out of the valley, maybe there's an opportunity. go to washington. will davis on to leeland lee thinks about and so he calls in to his headquarters, jubal early, who's now in of the second corps. and he is going to send jubal early to confront david hunter. that's one fourth of the mobile infantry of the army in northern virginia. they're already outnumbered two artillery battalions, and they're going to go west. and whatever the conversations or whatever they talk to, obviously about, if a possibility arises, why don't you turn north and go down to valley and see what happens. the important to that is for what i was talking about. the this is lee's last chance, if you will he doesn't know how it's going to come out and we're going to try to change initiative to re group and start to dictate he can do ulysses as what is transpiring in virginia in the eastern theater of the war. well of course know early does he. well hunter was not much of an anyhow chases men into mountain turns north heads down the valley crosses the potomac and ends up in the outskirts of washington, d.c.. c and dubois raid. and then they come back into virginia union force under george cook falls. he gets whipped at second kerns town on july the 24th. a week later. a calvary regiments go into chambersburg and burn james, pennsylvania 400 plus residences and buildings and gary pointed out so well earlier, everything in 64 was hung over. was the election of abraham lee also understood and this is important for the confederacy could never win a military very victory in the civil war. you're not to see the army in northern marched down broad street in philadelphia or broadway in new york city. what they have to do and lee understood that the enemy is always was the population of the north you must break the will of the northern people to no longer sustain the war effort and force the lincoln administration, which would have been extremely reluctant to do it, because if you want to personalize it, the greatest enemy of the army of the confederacy was the man who sat in the white house. he is going to see this through. as we know anyhow. so you have to break their will and you do that by achieving battlefield victories. so here you are confronted with this situation. so how do you effect the election well to lincoln? well, there was an editorial in new york times that said once again, the back door to the shenandoah valley's been left open. well, the back door of the shenandoah valley had been left open. and here they are, lincoln administrations and buyers. and he'd had enough. and he wants to know what grant's going plan to do. about 2 hours. and when stanton. and henry halleck. because actually, to be honest about it, granted, ignored the valley. i mean, when you put frank siegel in charge of anything, you ignored, you know, and of course, ron siegel was in charge of the early part, the valley. right. and then hunter goes back and starts burning lexington and chambersburg was in retaliation. so grant, there was some talk about george meade assuming command of this new army, the valley, there's going to be created. they had lincoln didn't want anything to do with it. and he's a victor of gettysburg you know and meade had been you know we forget about our meeting we wrote to his wife you know once the spring take part you're not to hear much about your husband because he realized with grant going the army it's going to be all grant but if you want to talk about a good soldier george meade's going to be a good soldier for the last year of the war. he's got to basically because the top chief of staff, the head of the army, but he's all grant and takes direction and by the their staffs hated each other which would be understandable in that anyhow so he was out so grant recommends his calvary commander, phil sheridan which you're going to hear about from jim here after me. he's 31. physically, he's not big always. if you want to look at phil sheridan body wise, you'd take out an oak stump and you sit it on a small small tripod square know stool that's phil sheridan's size big upper body, short legs. the joke in the army quickly became that he had to shinny up a saber to get his horse. okay. and then he how. and that's who he was. well, what's interesting about it is neither halleck or stanton wanted him. i don't know, he was irish or what he was. they just didn't want him. well, so he asked to go to harpers ferry. so he heads out from city point, goes up to d.c. well, he's passing through the capital. we don't know whether it was stand and or how whatever, you know, both. they said him, you got it. we cannot afford another defeat in shenandoah valley. you have to be careful with i know this, but the shenandoah valley, it had that aura about it when did the confederacy been whipped in the valley as such? you know and you know there's stonewall jackson's memory on every hollow and would light in the valley you know this is area where the confederacy had achieved things and we can't allow the back door of the valley to be open again. but you need not you cannot be defeated. so he comes in early august and of course he's opposing jubal early sheridan will have an advantage, maybe about two and a half to one, as things are going to start to shake. but for six weeks it's a matter of maneuver. one union officer called it mimi guo. we're not doing much short initially up the valley to fisher's hill, which called the bugbear the valley or the gibraltar or the valley. and he was halted and the reason was halted is robert e lee to think about he already committed these troops to it. and he added breckinridge his command is going to now be in it. he sends joseph kershaw division of fine division of troops and the calvary division under fitts lee to the u.s.a. because lee see this is, his opportunity to change the way are going by now. of course, you know, they're all his armies trapped petersburg. that's they are now. and that siege, it is so greatly feared, is coming to pass. well, that occurs. so finally they go back and forth. sheridan very cautiously, early ends up in the neighborhood of winchester and grant had to do something about this. so he leaves the city point, goes to washington, goes to the valley, meets sheridan in charlestown, west virginia, west virginia today by way, the places was still there. i've been there in a while. they set in the front yard. it's near the casino. i don't i regret how close it was the casino, but the house was there. they set in the front yard and. grant had these orders. he wanted to sheridan to do when he arrived. tells him what he wants to do and grant listens. and they always said to him as go in, it's probably the shortest order to grant wish during the entire war early. meanwhile, that they're winchester and one of the bugaboos about early of course was that he didn't know how to handle calvary he never calvary officer any in he would not exploit him at all and by the way in the meanwhile i should imagine this sheridan's army, the shenandoah, was reinforced by calvary divisions from the army. tommy, because they couldn't do much. and one thing you must realize that and we're talking to james wilson initially and wesley merritt wilson's going to be sheridan. never liked wilson. well, they never liked wilson in the army. he came with grant from the west and, you know, it was given a calvary at the end of september. it's going to be given to george custer. these are arguably the best troops in the army of shenandoah because the six corps was in the rear overland campaign. they're all shot up and all that and. they're the best equipped, best officer, veterans, all there, the confederacy could not match. but the point was early, is he receives word that the federals are back in martinsburg. you know, they west virginia. and so he instead of sending to see whether it's true he marches to of his division robert rhodes's and john gordon's to martinsburg to find out whether the yankees are in martinsburg. well guess what not but and i love irony or whatever in the war are always in telegraph office and the intercepted they find out that grant had visited now this in september the 18th and sheridan making plans to move the next morning and what becomes the third battle winchester two so early hustles to war they don't make it gordon and rhodes don't make it and so by the morning of september 19th, earl these armies strung out and i'm going to riverside. that's not point. the point is, as they would say later shadow whirling through winchester he rallied to the. can you imagine though always thought you know you northern end it an inverted l and north of winchester on the pike you're confederate infantry with breckinridge and others and all of a sudden you see him in 10,000. you hear them because horsemen and they're coming at you. i mean, that must have been you have to steal your nerves because. they're going to run over you and. they're going to run over him. and the army is going to and they're going to flee south. the fissures. three days later, sheridan's going to rally at fisher's hill. the weak flank was in the left, and george cooke takes his men up and comes down and collapses it there's the soldiers sitting along the valley pike, confederate soldier, and he's there. he said, emboldens in, emboldens embolden, who's out there? he said embolden is going up the spout an old you burley's about played out and and there's nothing left for the army of the valley early command and oh by the way kershaw had been ordered back to petersburg while when this happens lee turns around and orders to come back to the army, the valley earlier retreat all the way to brown's gap, the blue ridge, sheridan fall as far as stanton and harrisonburg. and now to look at sheridan a little on briefly, the difference between sheridan and grant becomes, apparent almost immediately as the federals are there, grant sees it there you can cross the blue and come in to the back door of richmond. you got to brush aside earl his army. but you just achieve to signal victories. and grant sees this almost immediately. sheridan writes back, no, no, i can't that. and he makes up series of excuses of why he can't do that. the i cites john mosby mosby's in his rear all these other things how to supply themselves so it goes sheridan not do that he'll do that in february march of 65 but he won't do it. what would grant saw right away? so they begin a retrograde movement back down the valley and for three days from august the. sixth seventh and eighth, they have what's called the burning in the whole valley from mountain a mountain and on october the ninth, there's a battle brook where the union calvary right routes the confederate calvary. and they finally cross cedar creek and they hold north of cedar creek outside of middletown, virginia, because sheridan and this is where unusual he's willing to give up his army. he you know he grant have been in correspondence through the halleck. of course that and so he said you know i can i can send the six corps initially back to grant and petersburg the as far as sheridan's concern, the campaign is. or early try follows has kershaw now with them just to put in numbers about on october the 19th there was 32,000 federals in the army of the shenandoah and about 21,000 members confederates, the army of the valley. on october the 39th, early makes his presence known. and it's a fight. it hubs. hubs, if you've ever been there north of strasburg and they have this battle and, you know, there's some casualty incurred in that. but most important lee sheridan was thinking about sending in the six corps. well, he said, wait minute here is old early coming here looking for i can't believe it and cedar creek is just folks is the way station the in the march towards winchester and possibly even the the whole army went across the potomac but that's the way they look at this campaign's over so he is now i don't know we should do that well then he gets information from halleck and we want to talk to you about what do you want to do with the army so sheridan decides to go to washington and it'll take wisdom. wesley calvary division. well then and you know irony in history here they're the confederates are massive whig wagon message and already they know what the message was they could decipher it. yankees could say that longstreet, and the troops would all be arriving. well, that information forward. sheridan wait a minute. he believe it. but said i better leave wesley marriage calvary division behind. so he leaves marriage division. now, custer's divisions here. william powell, the third calvary division. they're out to the east to protect that flank front, royal. on october the 18th, john gordon, you know, jedediah hotchkiss hotchkiss, clement, john pilgrim, staff they go up madison, norton, they climb the mountain and them they look north. and there it is, all they got was outside lunch are if you look up in the sky right is crystal clear it's you know it's beautiful today hear and it was beautiful then and the whole camp side of the army shadow laid out them. it's one of those --. in fact, in the the army, shenandoah there's some regiments are actually voting in the election. lincoln sure. that people sent there. it's like mail in ballots. they're there, they're going to get there, you know. and so i think it was the ohio regiment that day there were all getting lined up to vote. you know and i know mcclellan was important and that and if you vote if you look at the army so they went for lincoln for you know why. because they they knew he would see it through. if you want to make a point. i'm sorry being a high school teacher, you're afflicted with tangents. one of the i think one of the most telling moments, the war in the east is may the seventh, 64. it's night. the woods in the wilderness are a not real bad but there's a glow to us grant staff and meeting the staff they're coming out the orange turnpike and they go to the rock road intersection. now the wilderness was a tactical confederate victory, right. but it wasn't anyhow clear cut or anything like that. and so consequently everybody in the fifth corps troops and all the way which way is going before we always went that way because that was back across the river he turns south and they cheer him. because they found somebody to take him. that road they've been waiting for that road because that road meant the end of the war. and more importantly, it meant home. but anyhow, there him. so gordon comes tells early about it and gordon says what we should do is hit there and you can see in your map you'll see it with evans pilgrim ramsar but you'll see kitchen and hayes that's the, by the way, george crook command is not the eighth corps in this campaign. it's the army of west virginia. they're elements of the eighth corps. but they changed. you'll see that. oh, no, you see you have the six corps, the 19th corps who came out of louisiana and got to washington that summer. and what are we going to do with these two divisions? so they put them in this army, shenandoah, and then you have the army west. so it's an amalgam of command. so anyhow, where he's coming at and you can see it what gordon proposes is we march at night and cross, you know, the north branch of the shenandoah twice i during the night and we get in position to launch an attack at dawn. this has never been done and early. listen to it. john pilgrim, by the way. no, that's we shouldn't do that. he opposed he wanted to hit the other flank and gordon. so early does make that decision to do it so credit to early gordon he even said look i'll take responsibility for this so they they undertake it the crossover gordon they leave about dark they fall what's called soldiers call a pig's path. they had staff officers stationed all along the way. make sure you do the right turn. of course, you know, write it. make sure you don't turn when you're supposed to turn right. and they get across. you can see where they cross at and they go up and they get in position on time. which is of itself a rarity in a civil annals. you see where kershaw's that gabriel war and artillery. we're going to follow valley turnpike. so you see that in your map. the first map, and you can see the position. grover and dwight are 19th corps that stream not simple just west of milltown that's meadow brook the six corps except forgetti basically is west of meadowbrook key wheaton in getty. horatio right is commander now temporary commander of the army. was sheridan in. there is evidence of it as a morning goes on by the way, i don't know. i'm central day like today and all this and cold at night we're going to have fog in next it this time of year. well they had fall gray was so thick you couldn't see barely 100 yards if you could see that so this is going to hang over the battlefield for hours. it's not going to leave up until about three or 4 hours into the confederate attack. and once daylight came and again it's daylight in the sense of you could see it. it was after 5:00, more like 540 or so. they're going to step out. kershaw probably steps out first only, but gordon will go forward almost about the same time. you can see thorburn there, he's part of george cook, army of west virginia. his his men going to be routed kershaw is georgians, mississippi and south they're all old corps under james longstreet you've seen their at gettysburg in july the second you know when they're under lafayette mcgraw's these are these are good boys kershaw is solid and are going to sweep thorburn back through they're going to hit the end of it. they're going to hit a gap there and they're going to drive them back towards. the valley turnpike guard, meanwhile, evans and ramshaw going to go forward and they are going to hit hayes and kitty nugget, who's as jay howard, who didn't want to be there. he rode to his father and said, i don't want to be here. he commands a provisional division and they're made of members of the eighth corps, which is part of the baltimore. what to be now army west virginia but elements stragglers of that six corps 19th corps they put them together and they had 6000 men and they arrived a few days earlier. so they're stuck in this ridge. you know, you go there, you can see it clearly. you take the old u.s. 11, you can see it clearly. it's there anyway. they're hit and they're routed. and so it becomes a factor of the confederacy are driving them all towards meadowbrook the 19th corps grover been initially what they're going to you have to stem this flood and the flood is coming it's through their camps all these fugitives are running and that and they're not nobody knows sure but it sure you know with the sounds and the muscogee is getting closer and so one of the brigades and it's the thomas brigade eighth vermont 12th kinetic command 16 new york they're standing there they change front towards the pike and they're ordered to cross the pike by time for your comrades, there are three monuments on the battlefield at creek that were for a lot of ad. i don't think so. one of them is to the eighth vermont. in fact, it's the first one put there. then one month earlier, the eighth, vermont and the 12th connecticut are sent into what we know is a middle field at third winchester between the first and second woods and they're sent to hold that ground to, buy time and they get shot peace is there. so i use phrase but anyhow again today there you go buy time and so they by time they cross the road, go into a ravine and up a hill. about that time, evans boys are going to smash and part of kershaw's are going to hit them. they bought time, but not much other ones of the and that they they reached changed the entrenchment. now i don't know if you can get there you all know who had bars is was okay out their numbers that time was ed the old words were earthworm marks of them are still there in the woods and ed it was one there's still remain one of the finest set of earthworks in the in the war and they're down here you you down there you go near the 128. that's another monument 128. new york is right along the pike. and you go in through there and you can walk. i don't know right now. bell grove, which is on there, which was sheridan's headquarters. if you've never you've been there. you know what a beautiful valley home is there. they're moving away from civil war. i think the reenact men occurred last week and i think it may be the last one they want to do non civil war. okay. so i don't know how many people are going to get there but you know, anyhow, this never mind that. and so they drive kershaw evans and they're heading the 19th cause routed the army west virginia's routed they're fleeing across battle brook or north and here the confederates are moving. it's going to to about 9:00 of juba early rides to the battlefield and by this time kershaw has already crossed are moving and crossing meadow brook to go against keefer and wheaton getty as you can see he will would pull back as a pressure mount getty will back and he will go into the town cemetery which the soldiers took notice of as soon as they got there you know and he's going to fortify that. he's going to get on that hill there early comes on and he will ride forward. he encounters gordon for a brief conversation and then a time pass. and so what happens pilgrim's division finally really gets in toward more and begins is going to be sent against getty. evans and kershaw. they're to they're going to over they're going to drive back keefer and wheaton and they're going to head up north. and so later on, as this action is transpiring early on the valley turnpike, wardens divisions with them and artillery, the key to see creek, the key to cedar creek is the turnpike. well, because if you can get north of middletown and out, get north of middletown, you can outflank any possible union position that may reform and as their retire irene gordon in early meet again it's a very famous encounter gordon writes in his memoirs i want to preface this by saying i have great respect for john gordon, a soldier. he wrote his memoirs as a united states senator and it reflects his current because there was not one confederate soldier in his whole army who'd been up all had walked on a pig's path, crossed the river twice, got wet, cold and miserable. and they go into a camp of yankees which, is brimming with food, coffee all sorts of quit and a never stopped. they just said no, i just got to go ahead. there's one guy walked out of the yankee camp. he put he had eight hats on top of his head, stacked. i mean, they did i would you're you haven't eaten anything. but in this book which is the early was jealous of gordon he's a rising star which we well know is a rising star in the army. remember, john gordon is going to be the last one to initiate the attack at appomattox. lee handed that job to john anyhow, and he. but here they meet and it becomes a fatal heart the fatal heart of. cedar creek douglas south of freeman will make great deal about this. if you write about the war in the east and you write about the army northern virginia. one thing is true you either agree or disagree with douglas south on freeman. and i say that with all due respect for douglas freeman, he shaped it how you look at the history of the army of northern virginia today if you ask me what are my favorite book i think they're called lee's lieutenant's you know, when i read them as an undergraduate, i transforming anyhow i just didn't happen because what happened is gordon says early says we we want, you know, and it just and gordon says, no, no. he said, and this has to be about 11:00. he said, look, that's the six score retreat and they're not going to give up the all early said they will. well they they weren't but the point is it was already decided because the best thing that horatio wright did that day and he did all right he had ordered the division of wesley merritt and part of custer's division to the east north of middletown and covered the valley turnpike. these guys are behind stone walls. they have repeaters and all that and no confederate troops at that time is the only thing available. as part of pogroms and warden, are you going to push those boys out there and or not? and that line and this is all right this is about 10:00 so gordon gargan really didn't happen but the truth is the other hero in the sense of the morning was george washington get his troops because early loud and p to draw them into that fight from the cemetery. all he had to do and he could have done it earlier is march warden division through pick up wolfers division. we don't really know what happened him where he was all this time. you know, gather him up. they will and if very would have marched down the valley pike and seized that ground beyond the rallying point to become the rallying point for the army shenandoah never would have happened. so the corps retreats broken of the army. west virginia and that they're going to form in a ridge about a mile and a half north of the town earl. he's going to follow kershaw in all of them. you can see in the back map. you can see it there where they're going to drive them back and they're going to form up. about 9:00. that more nose close. i'm sorry, about 815. phil sheridan had come back from washington. he arrived winchester night before staying the lloyd logan house. the building still standing at least the last i was in winchester was still standing in piccadilly and braddock streets on braddock street, but at the corner of piccadilly, braddock, which is one street west from the old valley. okay, it's there. it's been commercially rises is big white. that's where his upstairs bedroom. they come and he comes. a general shooting to the south at cedar creek. he said that's okay. they were going to do a reconnaissance and they were the 19th corps was going to go out and a brigade and do a reconnaissance work continued. so sharon breakfast he had breakfast gotten his rienzi and started south towards the battlefield very quickly became apparent that was going on because valley is filled up with a combination of teamsters in their wagons and fleeing him. he met a chaplain. the chaplain asked him what going on. he says it's terrible. general. and the chaplain kept going north anyway. sheridan will arrive, pull off the road there. go where? they're lining up north of town. they meet them and emory upton says to him, well, general prepared to retreat. and sheridan said, retreat. hell, we're going to be back to where we were. so anyhow he the troops are being formed this is early afternoon late morning there and woods confederacy can't see many of them so they send them up and. well, i think one of the curious incidents of the war, sheridan had an odd head. he had a free now just wrote about his bumps on it. and you know that was where his aggressiveness came from. these bumps i liken to does somewhat flatten many ball, you know who knows i me but anyways william mckinley. major william mckinley up to them these these well they said general you should along the line and let them know that you're back. now why is that important? i tell you why it's important. there's a lot about sheridan that he butchered tactics. george crook thought of the flank attack and third winchester. george crook side of the flank attack at fisher's hill. now, when the sheridan comes his report and he and crook had been roommates at the academy their close friends of course to fill sheridan say oh of course not it was all phil sheridan's but anyhow they said general, he told you it was amalgam commands and he takes his commands. he makes them in the army, he does. they went to signal victory you throw in tom's brook, he went three. they do terrible damage to the shenandoah valley. and so they said why you ride along the line and let them know you're back. and william mckinley's is a staff officer. said, general, i think you should take off your hat. so they make sure they know you are. so he jumped back at horse and he takes off his hat and. he rides along the line, his cheer, and you know that. and so he waits and. meanwhile, what early does his conduct, if you will recall, it's in force. he sends out evans kershaw, ramshaw to gordon and they advance northward. you'll see where they are right. the problem with it, it and you know your story you look at the accounts of it the confederates accounts are we go forward well know we don't get far we exchanged some mustard you fire in that and that's it you accounts they put it in a full full blown engagement so i don't know really what was i think it's obviously a combination of both the problem it an early at this point they're gathering up all their cannons about 20 of them they captured all these prisoners the captured two jubal early the battles over in a sense of he's not going to renew the offensive so if you're not going to renew the why do you allow them to dangle there see they are on the bottom map they're out there they're out in front where pegram and warden and other ones are back further. they're they're hanging their energies and you can see they show the gap in evans brigade by the way this my book here these maps are 35 years old and maps are a lot better today than they were in my book so you know i hope you can get them anyhow and finally about four clock the. one account says there were 200 of them 200 bugles in the union of the shenandoah blue attack and federals came out of the woods and towards ramshaw evans and kershaw and they held now the 19th corps hit through that gap, but they rallied enough kershaw in raptures men they didn't budge. and then all of a sudden from the west came the third calvary division or most of the third calvary division. i haven't you talk about tom rosser because he's not worth about really but anyhow he didn't do much of anything and he was close occupied the calvary not flank out their mind bank wrote ford. here comes george custer, the third calvary division and are going to slam into evans evans's flank. and as count says like clods of dirt, the confederate line just simply broke from left to right and they start to retreat. and one of the finest officers in army, the youngest major west pointer in the army in northern virginia, stephen dodson rides into the fury, his men in the retreat and tries to rally him. he is going to be shot the groin, we think somewhere, as we can tell, near the deal. i think it's del miller place. i just want to tell you the shenandoah battlefields foundation. i've just informed last week that they just secured that property are in the process of securing it. they're doing yeoman work. the administration in virginia is giving them a lot of money to do things with, which is really good. hear for civil war preservation and that anyways. steven dodson ramps are is going to be placed in an ambulance by these men and the confederates going to start retreating south towards the bridge over the creek. there's to be a logjam and then what happens is of course comes the confederate union cavalry, which you want to do that they're going to pursue among the wagons and the ambulances, the one carrying steven dodson ramshaw is captured. he's they take them back and they know who he is. custer them. so did henry dupont, who, by the way, commanded artillery here. and would win the medal of honor for what he did. he's brought back to belle grove and placed in a room that morning. if you were to ramsar, he had a flower in his lapel and he asked what he just received word that his wife had given birth to a he did not know whether it was a boy of a girl, but in honor of his new child, he was wearing the flower in his lapel. when i was doing research for this and went to belle grove, i only want put aside in and anyhow, i want to know which room stephen dodson rapture die in. you know there's. there's a wonderful book by an artist who james taylor probably rare to find a book but it's sketches of this whole campaign and he drew a schedule and i just wanted to confirm it you know and the dose in there said who is stephen dot's rapture and i thought, well, he's the one whose volume it's out at the end the road. she said to me what monument is 30 feet high? it's his obelisk, apparently came in the back way every day. that's all i can figure. i mean, seriously. well, anyhow, custer will visit him. so would dupont. he will die the next morning in that room. that night, they have a big bonfire around the bel grove. they're all sellable reading. george custer rides up, sees phil sheridan, goes over, picks old phil up and holds little phil in his arms. you know, they're cheering everything and it's a signal victory and a lot of credit goes to phil sheridan, no question about it. and what is important about it, you and this is and gary mentioned this you do a line of change that's beginning because lincoln was informed gary mentioned mr. like you know lincoln had his tentacles out there all the time. lincoln, you know, he did. and getting reports back. mr. president, got bad news for you. you're not going to win this election. the people cannot. the casualties. it looks like grant's bogged down in petersburg. william sherman has disappeared in georgia. who knows where he's at. you know all this. and then there's the lana. and then suddenly there's this drum roll in the daughter. the. and it's third winchester fishers hill the burning toms brook and culminating in the victory at cedar creek and i'm sure if there was any doubt i'm reasonably sure camera there that settlement. so there's this signal. it's a remarkable battle though, folks. i'll be honest about. it. i devoted three chapters in my book to it. i would hope somebody would take the whole battle and write a modern account of cedar creek. it needs to be written, but it's a it's said to me, why would you write a book? what to me? it's great. i like story. this is a great story. it really is. you know, i mentioned word old before some old folks writing books. yeah, well, anyhow, i just want. but that is it's a remarkable battle. and thank you. i have a note here. i'm sorry. the casualties in the union army was 57, 5007 and 64 confederate calories there's we can figure with 3060. so in other words was almost 9000 casualties in the battle. so any questions. no questions. look if i don't know, i can make it up. i mean, said that i mean, at my age it's not hard. i believe that. yeah. you mentioned that gordon years kind of place the blame on early for the stopping but early placed the blame on gordon. who do you know he placed in his he blamed the troops and that was extremely uncharitable by the way and i apologize for this i have no card here just but a week before this battle, lee wrote to him and said look, i've sacrificed a lot for you. you need to do now if you're jubal early, what are you going do? and i will tell you though early kept telling, you know, there's a lot of yankees out here and couldn't believe that he couldn't accepted sherman there would be that many federal troops in the valley because you have this huge host in his mind a petersburg. but the fact of the matter was early on, you know, early gets a bad rap for it and. i don't want to personalize this, but when i was doing research and stuff and i came across this, i'd originally planned to do a biography, stephen dodson, ramsar, and then kerry gallagher shows at penn state and here has written a biography of stephen rapture. well, that pretty well took care of my. anyway there was the stackpole you all remember the stackpole books and it was like the one in the valley. was it basically sheridan walked down the valley? i'm saying i don't think that's. right. you know, you're talking second core, you're talking to some pretty you're talking to foot calvary jackson and all that. why would he just walk down the valley? and that's why got into and found out he just didn't down the valley but early could afford to make a mistake a critical mistake. sure his numbers covered up for his mistake so any other questions. well, no, i don't want to thank you.