Transcripts For CSPAN2 Senate Committee Considers FEMA And White House Budget Office Nominations 20170608

Will call this hearing to order. Will be waiting for senator hatch and will make an introduction. I want to welcome the nominees, i want to thank you for your willingness to serve thisssector country. Coming from the private sector myself and this is absolutely true, ive been very impressedhe with the quality of individuals that work for the federal government. This is nomination process is not easy, as youre well aware, but the fact that you have so many people who will step up to this plate and subject themselves to this process you can make a lot more in the private sector so this shows your dedication. In your Opening Statements, will introduce your families, i want to welcome all of them and ill leave it to you, just dont forget to introduce your family members. For my Opening Statement all i want to do is read the description of the jobs that youll be filling. And out. Ill turn it over to my Ranking Member, senator mccaskill and then senator hatch will be here to make an attention, i hope. Id we are considering two nominations, one for the federal Emergency Management and Deputy Director for Office Management and omp and the third is the often regulatory affairs. The Fema Administration serves as the principal advisor to the president and the secretary of Homeland Security and emergencye management. The duties include the operation of the correspondent center, support of emergency functions and more generally preparation for and protection againstin response to an recovery from all hazardous incidences. Were also responsible for management of the core grant a program and for providing an annual estimate of the resources needed for Development Capabilities of the federal state and governments to respond to catastrophic incidences. Fema is 22 of dhs budget. Its a Pretty Simple job. Not much to it. We appreciate your willing to take it on. The Deputy Director of Office Management budget, the role of that individual varies from administration but is viewed as a Deputy Director assisting the director and carrying out the president s budget and management across the executive branch. The Deputy Directors primarily responsible for Budget Development and execution. In addition they oversee offices, general counsel, legislative affairs, Strategic Planning and traditions, economic policy, legislative reference, Budget Review and perform personnel management. The remainder is to be overseen by the Deputy Director of management. For my own point, the reason i came here, we literally are looking at our childrens future. These figures are in principal. You have some real challenges ahead of you as well. Finally, the office of information regulatory affairs, ira, was created as the 1980 paperwork reduction act to curb the amount of the duplication of in paperwork requirements proposed by Regulatory Industries on the public. The initiator overseas requests from agencies for any new ag information collections and paper requirements. The administrator also oversees and correlates. Ira also conducts a regulatory review of socalled significant roles. To ensuring the analysis of legal basis used to justify proposed rules sound inconsistent with criteria established in relevant executive orders going back to 1993. This being put ensuring the costbenefit analysis used to establish methods, to the agency consider nonregulatory alternatives like Market Mechanisms and that the agency clearly identified a problem which justifies regulatory actions. Agency the administrator ultimately may decide to prove the rule or return it to the agency with recommended changes. An for my sampling, i think the number one component of a solution of whatever problem we are talking about within this nation is Economic Growth. The number one impediment to growth is overregulation. 2 trillion regular reporting almost 15000. Year. Household so you have your challenges ahead of you as well. We want to only issue regulations in the private sector and hopefully we can start rolling back overregulation that harms Economic Growth. With that, icrc college senator hatch will come and respect for your senators time, you like to make an introduction and will let you do so. Thank you, so much mr. Chairman. I would like to introduce neomi and to fully commend her copper patient to the hearing. Ive known her for some time since she worked as a council to Senate Judiciary committee. Since then, she has distinguished herself in private practice, Government Service anr academia. Her experiences have prepared her well for what will be an important and challenging task ahead of position of administrator of ira may not receive as much fanfare as other nominations but plays a Critical Role in modern policymaking this administration has said that it will get serious about Regulatory Reform and republican ira congress and said the same. Professor neomi rao will be an important step forward ira filling that promise. Neomi rao qualifications speak for themselves. She graduated from yale, she attended the Chicago Law School and then perk for charge Harvey Wilkinson the third on the Fourth Circuit of justin and Clara Johnson on the spring quarter after spending a few years ira private practice she served as an associate counsel and special assistant to the president and then began a career ira academia. She currently teaches at the solea law school at George Mason University where she is also the founder and director of the center for studies of Administrative State of the Administrative State. Do mr. Chairman, there is little doubt, at this point, that formulating and implementing regulatory policies is simply unacceptable. Naccepta for years, citizens and businesses have complained about administrative process that is opaque and on responsible. For years this process is thensu produced results that harm Economic Growth while rarely involving Public Health and welfare. Accordingly, over the span of several past administrations the consensus has formed that an important step ira streamlining and improving the admission process with an ira administrator. Neomi rao is supremely and uniquely qualified to step into this role and under her watch we can expense our ira to carefully scrutinize rules. But of course as she gets to work we can take our eye off the ball here ira congress. We will need more than just exceptional candidates like professor neomi rao. The legislative branch must do its part and this is why im pleased to cosponsor the regulatory accountability act along the senators portland, langford ira high camp. The committee reported the legislative of the full senate last night and i hope that both kyle example sides of the aisles will join us ira making it into law, making it law. The ira is a careful bipartisan relationship to codify existinge policy. Further, ill be introducing legislation later this month the separation of power of restoration act that will begin a conversation about the growth of federal regulations enabled by the chevron doctrine and embedded by broad legislations just like the confirmation of neomi rao. These efforts and Regulatory Reform are not about politics, regardless of which Party Controls the presidency, regardless of which controls congress, artemis ira the process is broken. The time to fix it is now. Ira conclusion, mr. President , ill say one more time and i am very pleased to be here today and to introduce and recommend professor neomi rao for this important post. We will stand to benefit from her leadership. I want to thank you very much for this opportunity to testify ira your kindness and allowingwi me to go forward. I wish you the best. Youll do great. Thank you, senator hatch. We appreciate that. I do want to recognize the fact that senator had a complex and that he was unable to attend but he wanted to use mr. Wong and will ask consent to look at his written statement and enter ito into the record. Representative was also going to introduce mr. Will enter his written statement and recommendation into the record as well. We also have the mother letterss as well, and ill ask for some cannot consent to enter into the record. With that, senator mccaskill. Thank you to the three of you. It is a pleasure to meet your families. I am painfully aware that Public Service is a Family Affair. I want to thank you. We are holding this one week into a working system and weve already had several floods ira missouri and the surrounding states as well as devastating tornadoes across the country. Id we have seen an uptick ira the number of serious disasters ira our state especially flooding and i do not think the pace of response is at disasters ira this country will slow down. I think that peace will increase because of what is going on with our environments. You had a career ira Emergency Management seen the process froh all sides at fema, state emergency and consulting for cities, counties and private entities. I thank you bring a wealth of experience to this responsibility if you are confirmed, i will look forward to working with you as a missouri continues to recover from flood damage and heading very recently had the declaration submitted to the federal government for the many counties that were devastated by the recent floods. Mr. Volk, youre been. Of om you have been at omb since january as a member of the Beachhead Team and as a Senior Advisor working at the development of the budget proposals. Without knowing as much about you as i may ira the future, that alone raises concern for me. The budget released by the president two weeks ago is highly problematic. The core assumptions under our financial fantasy. Representative sanford, a conservative republican succulent, put it kindly at the first hearing following the release of the budget stating that it presumes a goldilocks economy and is based on an assumption that the stars perfectly aligned with regard to economic drivers. Since the budget was released, key members of the administration have been unable to agree on exactly how it accomplishes the growth and revenue that it projects. The very underpinnings of that budget. On top of that, the budget cut key programs that dramatically impact Rural Missouri and rural america. It flashes medicaid which will hit rural hospitals and limit access to nursing care for the elderly poor, it targets cuts to programs that are paid for Infrastructure Development ira small cities and towns across missouri. It cuts the budgets of inspectors general, the front line for identifying and eliminating waste, fraud and abuse ira government spending. The essential role of the budgee officers to get the numbers right. This budget simply does not do that and i speak as a former auditor. It isnt honest for the American People about the impact that will help. Ha id like to hear that you will bring a new level of openness t the budget process but knowing that you are closely involved ira the drafting of this, it causes me great concern. Ental if anything else, i would hope, that there would be a reconsideration, fundamental assumptions ira the budget word numbers seem to be counted twice, where assumptions are made have no evidentiary packing and where, if you actually believe what is being put on paper, it still has devastating impact to the rural areas ira m. State. If you are confirmed, i will continue to watch omb closely, i particularly, i know my colleague will talk about this we are particularly frustrated that we worked hard ira a bipartisan basis to get a permitting bill passed that will ease permitting regulations for projects across the country and the obama initiation failed toer stand up. Theres been no inclination of the Top Administration to stand up and the irony is the president called a press conference for friday talking about how the ease permitting and public projects. Hello . We passed the law. Extended up. Make it happen. I know along with my colleague and this committee. E bill passed will be watching closely to make sure that law is implemented partly and efficiently. Uind neomi rao, ira is an extremely powerful office. It tends to stay out of thee public eye. It hasnt significant intermittent role ira the process for most enteral agencies. Coordinate agency work and ensures that most regulations are properly developed, is responsible for reviewing so they dont put an undue burden on the public and Insurance Agency rules reflect the policies of the president. We discussed history, i am the first to say that i am supportive of her forms of regulatory process. To make it work better for both consumers and businesses. Im proud of the effort that i have made along with my colleague to clean out some of t the silly regulations because its only problems to stop other regulations coming to pass. I will not argue that the process ira place today is not anywhere near perfect. I know that many americans, especially Small Business owners and farmers ira my state, feel that regulations keep getting piled on them and make it harder every year to make a living. Community banks fall ira thatha same category. That being said, i have deep concerns about this administration concerns to dismantle regulation and weight that dont have underlining policy considerations and to disregard the importance of Consumer Protections ira public safety. Your academic writing display of a healthy distrust of regulatory agencies and disregard for the complex reasons regulations cant be necessary ira a marketbased economy. I hope that it is confirmed that you will keep an understanding that Consumer Protection is very important as you examine and scrutinize things to come across your desk. I look forward to questioning the nominees perfect thank you, senator mccaskill. We swear oria witnesses if you arrive and wearing razor at hand. These were the testimony that you will get before the committee will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so hope you got back. Our first money is rock long. He has more than 16 years of local say and let off of her. He is currently the Vice President of haggerty consulting an emergency Consulting Firm oria illinois. The direct from 2008 to 2011 he was the director of alabamas Emergency Management agency. He also gain experience servingo as region for hurricane planner and Response Team leader and georges statewide Hurricane Program manager and School Safety courtier. Mr. Long. Chairman johnson, general mccaskill, it is truly an honor to be here. For this job. First, i would like to recognize my wife, mandy of 14 years and my boys jonah and isaac, 11 and seven. I dont know if sleeping is allowed. t it happens up here sometimes. Thank you. I have almost two decades for the experience oria Emergency Management oria its unique. Its not just oria the public sector. I started with georgia Emergency Management and i proudly served previously i saw the agency and is best time and at its worst. I also served as the director of alabama emergency which allowedt me to actually visualize and see how federal resources can beev maximized at the state level and passed down through to our state. I also hold my private sector experience very valuable. Ience so for the last six years i feel like this experience has truly helped me to put my finger on the post of Emergency Management oria the community and not just Emergency Management but the First Responders oria which we serve. Not only have i been a part ofns teams to help communities design Emergency Operation plans, testd train and evaluate this plan, ive also interpret fema guidance or helping them to to navigate natural recovery. This agency is one of the most important federal government and i believe the staff is the most important asset. I look forward to working with them. I think they are Service Oriented individuals regardless of the criticism they mayick thm receive. They take it, dust themselves off and try to protect america and a life and help people oria times of their greatest need. If confirmed, i look forward to working with them very closely, leading them into helping theel nation to achieve resilience to a much higher standard. With that, ill stand by for your questions. Our next nominee is russell. He is prior to joining to omb he was Vice President of Heritage Action for america and prior to that work to the policy director for the house conference oria the executive director for the staffer for some of members ofre congress, including most easily, represented jeff hensley and chuck hagel. Thank you mr. Chairman. I want to thank you, Ranking Members and committees of the honor for appearing. Wanted to raise my family who has entered this process with me oria the long hours that come with serving your country oria the public roles. My wife, mary, my daughter, ella and two sisters and many friends are here oria support. It is a joy to come home to United States senate, i worked my first four years oria this distinguished body, mostly for senator phil gramm and his hours on the senate floor oria committee and at my desk learning how the senate works as well, how an institution protects the rights of the minority to be heard and how statesmen ought to debate their colleagues to move the vote and shape public opinion. It was here that i developed a lug for Public Policy, seeing how it could be used to help this country live free or and more prosperous lives. It is an honor to be nominated and serve as the director of of management budget. It is a job that comes with great responsibility and i am humbled that President Trump and director mulvaney asked me to serve. I know the quality of the men and women who had previously served oria this particular role and i want to contribute to that long line of distinguished Public Service. My career has readied for me for this moment. I spent over 12 years working oria the house and senate with a specific emphasis on budget policy. I was a publican study committei budget writing is budget resolutions and advising on budget policy. I went on to be the executive director of the rsc and then the policy director of the House Republican conference under then mike pence. All of these roles afforded me an opportunity to handle a wide range of policy issues and to manage policy Development Processes that ensured a wide variety of viewpoints were hurt. That is very much the job, the draft to build and further a policy process that ensures that the president and his advisers of sees the best analysis of the best decision can be made out of experience managing large organization. I spent the last seven years managing many aspects of Heritage Action for america including staff, 17000 volunteers across this country. P volunteers are, oria fact, volunteers. They had their own viewpoints and ideas and you dont get very far working with them if youou dont have an appreciation for them as leaders oria their own right. That experience has prepared mer well for managing the men and women at omb who are career experts oria their field and have years of Institutional Knowledge for this new administration to drop on. As for the job to be done, it is immense. My country faces a 20 trilliondollar debt and that that will wreck our country if it is not tackled. That burden will fall on my children and grandchildren of todays policymakers do not change the current path. E it will mean a lower standard of living for them and less time for the truly important things oria life such as, family and community. That is not the american way. I spent my entire career hearina about taxpayers and families. I fought to save the money and ensure their tax dollars are well spent. I come from a bluecollarblic s family. Im the son of electrician and Public School teacher. I know what they went through to balance their budget and save for the future. E my parents worked really long hours to put me through schoolol but they also worked long hours to pay for the high levels ofte government oria their own life. My old boss called them the wagon pullers oria our country. Others have referred to them as the forgotten men and women. They have always been my test for federal spending. Did a particular program or spending increase help the nameless wagon pullers across our country working hard at their jobs trying to provide for their family oria future without the luxury of watching cspan at that particular moment to know that we might increase their burden at that minute. How would they vote . Yay or nay. My i believe, as a country, we are too often feel that simple test and it is the reason we are facing a 20 trilliondollar debt. If the Senate Confirms me, i am ready to take up that work again. Thank you for considering my nomination and i look forward to answering your questions. Thank you, mr. In 2005 neomi rao was an associate pastor of law at George Mason University. S she founded the Schools Center for the study of the Administrative State and serves as the senators director. From 20052006, neomi rao soldld to president bush and prior to that was an associate oria london. Lo she worked as a council for nominations oria constitutional law on the Senate Committee on judiciary clerking for the honorable Justice Clarence thomas on the United States supreme court. Professor tend to. Chairman johnson and make it members of the committee, it is an honor to appear before you present nominee to be demonstrator of the office of information and regulatory affairs. Im grateful for the president and director mulvaney for their trust and confidence. I first like to thank senator hatch for taking the time to be here and for his generous introduction. Working on the Judiciary Committee for then, german hat i learned about lawmaking and musicmaking and living a good life. F it means a lot to me to have the support of such a distinguished and respected member of this body. Id also like to thank the members of the committee and their staff for taking the time to meet with me. R i appreciate your graciousness and the chance to connect and discuss issues about regulatory policy. For those of you i did not have a chance to me, i hope that we may have an opportunity after the hearing. If confirmed, i look forward to working closely with the members of the committee on issues related to regulatory and information policy. It if youll indulge me id take a moment to think my family. Im here today with my husband, alan and my two children, isabella and ezra. There unwavering support has made it possible me to even consider the demands of publicha service. My father a doctor is here and is believed to me at every stage of my life. I remember also my mother doctoo and she died of cancer and i wish you be here to share the state. Oria 1972, my parents arrived oria detroit oria the middle of a snowstorm without winterde jackets both their medical degrees, 16 and the option that they were recently married. They worked hard as an example and shared perseverance and kindness exhibits service. Id also like to share information about my back on. For the past ten years ive been a law professor at the scalia law School George mason law school right eye statutoryal laa interpretation. My scholarship is focused on the framework of constitutional accountability for administrative agencies. About two years ago i found it a center for the study of the Administrative State. The center commissions Academic Research and host Public Policy conferences to bring together scholars, practitioners and government officials to analyze and debate difficult questions of administrative law. Prior to my academic career, i worked at the white House Counsel where i saw the number agencies and help court oria a interagency discussion of foreign policy. Ive also served on the Senate Judiciary committee as a council for nominations oria constitutional law. My other experience includes several and clerking for Justice Clarence thomas and seeing. Nt h my academic background of practical experience oria all three branches of the government has help me see the regulatory process and respective roles of congress, the president and administration. Since congress established ira has operated with a consistent mission to them proof the administering of agencies and the coordination of the polici policies. Ira plays an invite of role to ensure the initiative agencies follow the law, base their decisions on the best possible economic and Technical Analysis and fulfill president ial priorities. Within the requirements set bycg congress, i wrote works with the overriding goal of creating the greatest benefits for the American People while minimizing Regulatory Burdens. Reading through the statutory as well as the consecutive orders of omb guidance ive been struck by the consistency of the principles guiding the work of the office across the ministration. Perhaps is one reason why so many talented work and stay for many years serving president of different parties. Tor i woul im humbled to be nominated for this role. If confirmed, as a mr. I worked to ensure the continuity of their principles updating and refining necessary but maintaining the integrity of the process that has developed. I would also look forward toti working with other members of the committee and other members of congress on legislation relating to regulatory forms and other issues within their purview. Thank you for their consideration. And i i look forward to answering your questions. Thank you, professor neomi rao. E there are three questions we all ask for the use nominee. I read each question and asked for your verbal response from each of you. First question, is there anything you are aware of in your back on the might present a conflict of interest for the duties of the office to which been nominated. Mr. Long press mark mr. Vote, press mark do you know of anything that is personal that would honorably discharged the responsibilities which been nominated president mr. Long . Mr. Vote . Do you agree without reservatiot or summons to appear and testify between any duly constituted committee of congress, if you are confirmed . I do. I do. I do. I appreciate. I appreciate your anxiousness tl answer the question. Let me start with you, mr. Long. Last Congress Passed the integrated public alert and Warning System. It would authorize and enhance i the public alert Warning System and the key parts of the law had not been implemented and deadlines have been missed. S this includes requirement to create mandatory Training Program on how to use the system and form a subcommittee by the federal state and local agencies to consume improvements to the system. This responsibly falls under fema. You commit that you will ensure these provisions are admitted . Im very familiar with the ipod program and i think that making sure that we had the headlines of communication in multiple ways and redundancy is the key to the response and disasters. Ive also with my previous experiences work through a couple programs with the i pause program. At this point, respecting the nomination process, if confirmed, i would be happy to evaluate where we are but im not at where we are at this timp of the deadlines that were missing. One of the reasons why im bringing it up is because german pie in wisconsin with the broadcasters and they brought it up. We are highly supportive of ipods and we want to make sure its implemented. I realize youre the nominee but i wanted that commitment that you follow the law and implement these procedures professor ralph in president stroms executive order regarding this committee has held to meetings in connection with the Budget Committee assuming what i have seen coming from the private sector and talking about that a Regulatory Burden. You have regulators, they regulate pretty of legislators, they legislate. Everything is additive and the problem we have is layer upon layer of rules, regulation, we spent billions with procurement so that we dont waste a box. It doesnt work. Can you speak a little bit in terms of how you would you though how it would be implemented . Thank you, senator. The one is in an important step in allowing to reduce the Regulatory Burden they are speaking of. I think it can work weve issued guidance on that matter and i think the work it will work in practice is agencies will identify regulation to eliminate in those regulationsth might be an effective ones or excessively burdensome. Those regulations will be up to be costbenefit regulate before they go to employs any spec. I dont know how manykn regulations you see in the books that are basically gathering dust but doing harm to ourmy. Economy. I would think every senator on the dais here in almost every meeting we take with constituents the number one concern on their minds is one regulation after the other. Is putting them out of business. Pw madison, the chancellor, testified, 42 of Research Time and Research Universities is spent complying with federal regulations, paperwork, which is an unbelievable burden. Again, im really encourage that you take a look at that seriously and utilize that executive authority to remove regulations for every new one and hopefully the new one will overwrite the bad ones as well. Mr. Vought, i appreciate your testimony how you concentrated on the debt. As i mentioned in my Opening Statements, the projected debt is 129 trillion and you spoke of your responsibility primarily providing the analysis for good policymaking. Ive been here six years, going into number seven and it is depressing how very few people are focusing on and talking to debt burden and projected deficit. We budget for now less than 30 of what the federal government spends, 70 is completely out of control. Y on can you speak to how you intend to convey that to the white house, to the administration so we get serious not mortgaging our childrens future . I think this budget is a great example of this administrations commitment to dealing with deficits and debt over the next ten years and into the future. This question budget has more reductions in entitlementngs whc savings which is the type of savings that you mentioned in your question then any budget that has ever been proposed by president from a nominal standpoint. It has more reductions in rate of growth in entitlement o spending that the percentage of base than any president since president reagan. I think, it shows, this administration is very serious about tackling the debt in dealing with the deficits that are projected to rise greatly over the next ten years, if nothing is done. As administration the fact that it balances we have begun to get back to having a conversation as a country about what it takes to balance our books and thats another aspect of this as well. Ive noticed that being a participant in compiling some of the options to the director to decide upon that the will focus on this leads to finding and saving savings when we can and finding to justify them and think through what are the tradeoffs with the given policy proposal. I think thats healthy and thats one of the ways that we g tackle the debt. My closing but to all of you, what we are trying to do with this committee is through a hearing process layout realiti realities. The first step in this problemsolving process. It starts with gathering information to find the problem, and root cause analysis, things like swot analysis and things like that. They out that reality, based on that reality set achievable goals and once youve done all that work, then you start working on the regulation, rules, legislation. If confirmed, in your roles, i really want you to utilize this committee to help lay out those realities that you are seen within your agencies. I want to be a partner with you and all of us to. We have enormous challenges but it starts with the information laying out those realities. And ill turn it over to senator mccaskill. L. Mr. Chairman, my background as a prosecutor and auditor and so when i came to the senate i began doing what has been the meat and potatoes of my work here which is oversight. I was moved, frankly, mr. Vought that you expressed such affection to the senate. It was appreciated that you talk about what makes the senate so important in our constitutional framework which is the weight the senate protects the rights of the minority to be heard. So, you can imagine, if ive been oversight from day one and talk about saving money, billions and billions of dollars in wartime contracting that we worked on and accomplished in terms of changing the way we do procurement within a Contingency Operation and military. I can give you lists and lists of examples from where we have ferreted out billions of dollars in weve poured down that holes in the federal government. You can imagine, my concern, when i hear that the white house is telling executive agencies to not respond to Ranking Members request for information so, we asked the question of all of you. We ask if you agree without reservation to apply to any reasonable request for information from a Ranking Member of a duly constituted committee of congress. Mr. Long, you said yes unequivocally. Thank you for the answer. Mr. Vought you said subject to the discretion of the effector and advice of Legal Counsel. Do you agree, as a lawyer, do you agree with Legal Counsel and decision that just because im t democrat im not entitled to information that allows me to do oversight is a member of the United State Senate was marked and is the Ranking Member of a Government Oversight Committee . Thank you, senator. I have not read the opinion on that but as administration is controlling right now in terms of the guidance and has been given out as to how the agency should respond to oversight requests and having them go through the chairman and to have the oversight process flow in that direction. Are you ever aware and history of the senate that there has been an administration that has said, we will not provide information to the Ranking Member of the committee on government oversight . Are you aware of that evernm occurring before . I did work first and you think that center would have taken it down to mark if the administration said, im sorry, you cant request information from the government to find waste, fraud and abuse if youre in the minority . I look forward to working with you in a transparent manner, looking forward to working with you and ferreting out ways fraud and abuse in terms of formal communications that are sent to the administration, im merely reflecting the administrations policy in regard to the opinion. Well, weve had one nominee say yes unequivocally and that the secretary of Homeland Security say yes on the record, on it probably in the hearing and to me personally and his rank, is higher than yours. Iv if you cant give me a straight answer, do you think its the right that an administration would say that the Ranking Member of the Oversight Committee in the United States senate is not entitled to oversight is that a correct decision . The rule of law is important that you think its the rule of law . They have an opinion that they put forth a position for this administration as it pertains to responding to t oversight requests and that is merely what im responding to. Okay. We have a huge problem if you cant even say out loud, even though the secretary of Homeland Security is unequivocally said absolutely, will get you information and do so on regular basis. We have a huge problem if you cant even say whether you think is right or wrong. You cant say whether its right or wrong . Confirm senator, again, i have said that if im confirmed, i will work with this committee in an open and transparent way. N, again, im also reflecting the fact that this administration is under olc opinion that is instructed the agencies on how best to engage with formal oversight requests from the various committees that the people elected me to not send me here to take that answer lying down. I have to tell you, i will pusht my weight on this. S. At this Administration Thanks they will withhold important government information from the Ranking Member of the Oversight Committee of government because they want to make sure we never find outme anything by the w, i did oversight in the bushd administration and i think the chairman will back me up, i know that senator i did aggressivereo oversight of the obama and menstruation. The notion that we are going to our partisan corners on oversight is disgusting. So, im disappointed with your answer and let me ask you to dow how do you feel about providing information to the Ranking Member of the Oversight Committee of the press mark. If confirmed, i would do my best to provide information the Office Speaks to whether there is a requirement to do that but at least discretion within agencies and im committed to working with this committee on the request. Well, i would love your analysis as someone who spent a great deal of time with the law as to the underlying legal basis for that opinion. I think its hogwash. Ive looked at it and its just trying to shut off information to people who want to find problems. Welcome, to the big leagues. The administration, this is what happens and you get oversight. It is the function of the congress to do oversight. Im hopeful that, you know, so far weve got a few problems but not to the extent many of my colleagues have anothercomm committees. It would be really bold for this administration to cut off information to this committee, no matter whether its republican or democrat. So, hopefully, i know im out of time, i didnt expect that to take as long as it did but i will come back and ask you about fema and the budget cuts into more questions for you to be about the budget. Thank you, mr. Chairman. I proceed them nomineesll willingness to serve anything with background. Brief comment, i have not looked at the legal opinion i probably should speak to but i will as associate counsel in the bush and menstruation. Of it was often frustrating dealinh with congress but i felt it was my responsibility to provide information and the branch that you are now before as the opportunity to confirm you or deny your confirmation and thats because thats the way the founders set it up. They also set it up so we have the opportunity to do oversight and elect representatives each representing in my case, over 11 million people. I hope the information will be forthcoming to this committee and chairman feels the same way. This is our responsibility. I got silly questions but let me start if i could, with you, mr. Vought. Youre stepping up to take a very tough job. We relied heavily on the deputy. You have information with ira should he be confirmed and its good that youre sitting close together. Let me focus on one thing that was mentioned earlier and thats we talk about Infrastructure Dams and rivers and i hope to talk about broader infrastructure questions on friday, so as we talk about permitting. I know you are not there yet and when you are at Heritage Action you actually opposed the highway bill that had the senate, i hopr you didnt oppose the permitting reform, i dont you did, i thank you wouldve and supported of that. Title 41 of the best act has a permanent reform that was talked about earlier and it is absolutely needed. We have projects on the ohio river including some of our dams that have taken sixseven, nine and ten years and the capital is not that patient anymore. They go somewhere else. That goes to another country. Idi our reform effort and senator mccaskill and i did this together on a bipartisan basisom five years worked on it, with the chamber of commerce, theuf manufacturers you said that trade counsel with us because they all wanted jobs. They saw what was happening without the statute of limitations, from six years dowo to two years. Our original bill was shorter than that but thats a huge change right there. We have this for now where citizens are able to get transparency to see what the status is important because the righthanders and often know what the right hand is doing. We have 35 permits required sequentially and so the effortit just to make it more efficient. We set up this federal i fought hard to get it and not to seek you or were other people wanted it because he believed omb had some leverage and senator mccaskill will tell you we went back and forth on this quite a bit and she took some heat on it but we wanted to put it somewhere where you had part of the government, omb, has leverage over the other agencies partly because of the budget function youll be involved with. Are you one, aware of this issue of the permitting reform and need for it in the legislation that weve already passed and are you aware the fact that its not been stood up, we dont have an executive director and theres an acting person there now that you have thoughts on why that is and why we cant get this going . Thank you, senator. I am aware of the permitting counsel and aware of its priority for the Administration Funding was included in the president s budget for itll specifically in regard to the impact that it has in order to leverage the types of reform and spending that we need is an administration to get 1 trillion of investment into infrastructure spending. I cant speak to why theres been a delay in setting up the council but from a funding aspect its been a priority of the administration. Your s im glad to hear you say that and i hope you personally will roll up your sleeves and get involved in this because i do think its incredibly important as were trying to figure out how to spend tax dollars more efficiency that that it will bee much more valuable if its in the permitting of the are you looking for any additional authorities on this . Is there anything we need to do in congress . Ive not inquired yet. I havent been confirmed, but if confirmed it would be something that i want to inquire upon and to seek advice within the omb is how we can improve the statutes. I appreciate that and what im asking for today is your personal commitment that should you be confirm that you will be supportive of getting it set up and using on a bipartisan basis which is new around here to actually make a difference and not just to talk about it but actually implemented. Mp you have that senator. I appreciate it. U professor rao, thank you for your willingness to serve. You have a wonderful backup. Senator hi kevin i haveen legislation called the regulatory accountability act and im a shoot sure youre aware yes, i have. There is a lot of interest in trying to find some way to get the independent agency and do a more systematic costbenefit analysis and you support what s were doing their as they go through the costbenefit analysis. Thank you, senator. The question about the independent agencies is a very important one and has been considered over the years is pretty much since the inception of oira should we be including e the independent agencies. In principle, it makes sense to have independent agencies follow the same costbenefit analysis as other agencies. That position reflected in the Obama Administration and its position that in the regulatory accountability act as well with regard, senator hi camp improve the legislation putting a retrospective review how you feel about that . Center, retrospective reviews are really important issue. Because of the outset when the red propose the best analysis is a prediction about cost and benefit. Being able to look back to see how regulation is works and what is actual facts costbenefit is very important especially to reducing the Regulatory Burden effective or out of date. My time is up and ive already stolen the senators question. My question to you is would you commit to work with us on a bipartisan basis to try to get this regulatory accountability act to the process. It was marked up by this committee, two weeks ago and with your support and help we thank you. Its common sense stuff and we need help from the initiation to help ensure we get this done. Would you make this commitment today. Id be happy to make thisco commitment. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Today i will give you a Second Chance here. I think we all kind of sat is done because we certainly expected a different answer to the question that senator mccaskill asked you. I thank you heard professor raos response saying in her opinion that legal opinion gave her discussion and that she was going to use that discretion to be cooperative with this committee. Do you want to restate your position, is your position is that youll never deal with the minority and its that legal opinion prevents you from dealing with the minority . Of course not, senator, that from a position at all. Look forward to working with this committee, in an open and transfer away with this committee. Senator mccaskill was after me specifically with regard to response to formal oversightet letters and as it pertained to the olc memorandum and thats what i was referring to. Great. Lets get to that. So, you are saying that as it relates to formal requests from the Minority Party, from this committee, that you have no intention of responding to those requests. Center, look to the direction of our legal team and the director and how we respond to various oversight levels and one of the things will be looking to is the olc opinion. My question is that do you think yesterday when secretary kelly gave an unequivocal answer that he intends to cooperate with the Minority Party respond to any requests that he is violating that legal opinion and doing something illegal in making that commitment to us . , i dont know what he said but he is running his department and agency. Under the same legal guidelines from the office of Legal Counsel, correct . That opinion applies to you and secretary kelly. So why is your distinct c different than secretary kelly kellys . We have given directions from olc in terms of how we should deal with formal oversight request the opinion itself, as outlined by professor rao gives uticas discretion. Were asking you to make a commitment today that in your discretion, you will deal equally with the minority and majority parties of this committ committee. Senator, i would be willing to commit equally and dealing with you to operate in oversight as it pertains to certain formal oversight letters and im going to seek, if confirmed, responsibility of Deputy Director i will seek our legal teams advice and the advice from our director. Anyone, on either side of the aisle, because ive been both in a situation where i served where the president was of myf political party, now im serving for the president im think what youre saying is outrageous. I just have to tell you that it is very, very troubling and it should be troubling not just foa the Minority Party at that party could be minority in two years or four years or six years. I am very troubled by your response to this line of questioning and i find it almost disqualifying in supporting your nomination, quite honestly. I was going to ask you a series of questions on costbenefit analysis but ill save those for the office of management and budget. I dont think that you can come here and say that you respect the senate and take the position that you just taken as a mattero of law when other people as senator mccaskill said to outrank you have taken a different position. I will turn to professor route we had a very enjoyable meeting and i have to tell you, im cant see your families but i certainly could see your family on the side. The pride and love they have for you is so overwhelming and as somebody who lost her father at a young age, i want you to know that im pretty sure your mom knows what Great Success and with great pride she has in you also. , i will run through a series of questions because they dont have a lot of time. On costbenefit analysis as senator portman has said, we want to continue to work on this efforts. As i told you in my office, i believe that the gimmicks of to win and one out are not particularly successful. We need to be more surgical. I also told you that im very concerned about ongoing regulation that has to exist as a result of outdated law, that we really expect you to come to us with a list of statutory changes that need to be changed to eliminate burdensome and unnecessary regulation. We have to be in this together. So, in your personal opinion to believe that costbenefit analysis is appropriate for deregulation actions . Ons . Yes. To believe that costbenefit analysis for deregulation actions deserve the same level of scrutiny as if you were enacting a major legislation . Nsr yes, that is when the position that omb has taken on its guidance on the new executive orders. To believe the indirect caus and benefit should be taken into consideration when conducting costbenefit analysis was marked. Again, yes, i do, thats longstanding process. Do you believe theres a role for qualitative and nonmonetary benefits and costbenefitb analysis perspective. Yes, i do believe effectively with the principal set forth by executive order 12866 to be reaffirmed by the initiation. Yes, i think those principles are very solid and have been in fact reaffirmed by this administration. And the same thing with circular a4 given the circular is only guidance and not technically the law of the land but your enacting a new guidance to instruct agencies on how to conduct costbenefit analysis, would you be from the same principles that are in circular a4. Those pencils are solid and may require updating with basict core of that is solid. Co one more question. This goes to the very important work. There is no one on this dais you really stepping into ato critically important position and i have long maintained that youre understaffed. Can you tell me what youre going to do to try and either manage this important job with the staff that you have or advocate for a few more folks who could save you money in the long run . This is the principle of investment. I think the president s budget does call for an increase in resources. Duty is adequate . Im not certain the precise resource needs and i understand that former administrators say the office lisa moore supports and i commit to looking into that we commit to helping you. Senator langford is not here but we certainly commit to helping you in the future. Just so that you know, we expect that well see you a lot in our subcommittee. Were very excited about the expertise that you bring to thid job and excited for getting to work with you going forward. Thank you for agreeing to accept this position. I a lot of questions for fema and ill reserve those for a second round. Thank you, mr. Chair and thank you to all the nominees for being here. S and also a special thank you to those mice were here. It is a Family Affair and we are grateful. A just at the outset, mr. Vought, i will add my concern about your answer on their guidance. We were elected to represent republicans and democrats. Its my view that the administration serves members of both parties and their oversight rule and i am hoping that you will rethink your response. I wanted to spend some time on issues concerning fema and mr. I long, it was nice to meet with you yesterday. I just want to talk about predisaster mitigation. Something we talked on yesterd yesterday. We can all agree that the frequency and intensity of natural disasters are on the rise. If are going to blunt the effects of these disasters will have to make effective sustained investments in our infrastructure prior to the disasters happening. As governor, i found myselfhe feeling the same flooded areas of New Hampshire year after ye year. We clean up and then would flood again. Federal support came only in the aftermath of these crisist end n leaving it up to our state to address the front and investment in infrastructure that wouldve helped mitigate the crisis in the first place. So, consequently we took steps to lunch and in that would help us inventory are most at risk locations during National Disasters help us to develop a way to target our limited resources more effectively. From my experience, are federale programs may not be properly incentivizing our state to make the necessary investments in our in the structure that will help to mitigate the longterm consequences of these disasters and i should know, one of the key fema programs that does encourage this type of investment the Predisaster Mitigation Program was cut in half in the president s fiscal year 2018 budget. Mr. Long, can you talk to me about your approach to whether you support the federal friends advising these kinds of investments. Thank you, senator. R. I believe that medication is the founders of emergencyasters, management. If we ultimately want to reducei costs in the future for disasters we have to do more mitigation. I believe the mitigation is a community effort. It cant just be upon the federal government to supply funding to our state and local partners, travel partners, we have to all take action as a whole community. From my own experience, as former director of alabama emergency manager, instructor of a state that continuously seem to be hit with disasters in we had several defects or declarations. For us, men ration untrained mitigation came post 406 funding, as we call it in the field, we had much more mitigation funding which seems regressive to me then we really wanted in the predisaster side of the house. It we focus mostly on the post disaster funding to put that to work according to the mitigation plan that we had design. It confirmed i would like to work with the committee to evaluate all of the mitigation funding, not just predisaster mitigation funding but how do we possibly budget ties all of it upfront to do more work to reduce disaster cost rather than basically having to get hit to be accessing the mitigation funding is there. Great. Thank you. We talked a little bit yesterday, as well, about them ploy morale at fema. In 2016 the partnership for Public Service released the results of its annual best places to work in the Government Survey and fema came in 284th c out of 305 federal agencies. So, we talked a little bit about it but could you briefly touch on what your thoughts on how to improve the morale there. Im busy, the employees at fema do such critical work for our country and we want them to have high morale. Yes, they do. First of all, with my own experience within fema, previously working for region four, and reflecting back on that experience, i believe, weve have to be able to immediately upon hiring with staff to make sure they fully understand the mission of the agency but where their jobs specifically fits in. They also need to be able to see career ladders and i also believe that the agency over the past eight years has done a great job of, not only providing a blue sky day job, when theyre not responding but the response job. I believe that the response piece is very important to making people feel a part of the overall mission. If confirmed, my type of leadership is very diplomatic. I like to get out, the out with the staff that is they are to understand how we can open up lines of publication from all parts of the agency to make sure that if confirmed my team would be able to understand how to improve the agency from all parts. Thank you very much. Professor rao, i enjoyed our conversation yesterday very much and i appreciate you taking the time to meet with me. I appreciate your answers toi senator my camp in the line of questioning and particularly after executive order 12866 as good president for iraq. I want to turn in the little bit of time i have left to something we talked about yesterday which was we spoke about the importance of allowing agencies to be agile and move quickly if needs arrive. Its one of the great challenges as we talk about regulation and when we look at bills, in somell ways, but had increased transparency but slow things down. An example i think of is the m ongoing Opioid Epidemic that we need to be sure that Public Health and safety roles can keea up with the entry of new synthetic drugs into the illicit marketplace and ensure that all the rules are holding us backch when it comes to responding effectively to other public challenges. If confirmed, how will you ensure that agencies are able to move quickly to change or implement rules as the needhe nd arises . One of the ways that iraq can do that is to provide its review process in an expeditious manner so when theyre bringing them we can move them through quickly and properly based on the need for the regulation. Thank you very much. Thank you, mr. Chairman and Ranking Member mccaskill forll bringing us together and to each of you its good to have an opportunity to ask you questions. Im happy to say that if you are confirmed by the senate, i look forward to working with allrso three of you on some very important issues. I serve as the Ranking Member on the subcommittee for federal spending oversight Emergency Management and ill start with you mr. Long. Well probably interacting more than the other two. Im sure that youre well aware of the ongoing crisis that we are experiencing in my state in the city of flint, water crisis. Its unimaginable proportions, as a result of some very bad decisions made by the state of michigan that led to contamination throughout the city which children will be suffering from for the rest of their lives. While i was pleased that michigan received an Emergency Declaration i was very disappointed that they did notiv receive a major disaster declaration from the president because the disaster was quote not a result of a natural catastrophe or caused by fire, flood or explosion. But certainly by any other definition this was a major disaster looking into the eyes of a child who is suffering from lead poisoning and will be dealing that their whole life, that child doesnt care whether or not it was manmade or natural, its a disaster. The parents and grandparents of those children dont care what caused it, its still a disaster. I know you know it in your written statement that fema is charged with helping communities cover in the time of their greatest need and major and it couldve been critical in getting more timely help for the people of flint. I am just curious what is your view on allowing the president to issue a major disaster for a manmade disaster is not caused by fire, flood or explosion. I bring this up because weve actually proposed legislationso that ive cosponsored in the past dealing with lead and drinking water. That is an extraordinary situation and we may find other communities across the country that will be faced with this type of crisis as well going forward. This will have unimaginable impacts just as it did in flint. I did youre concerned about opening the floodgates to all sorts of assistance which is an issue that we have to be concerned about but if we set some strong parameters, we caner craft it in a way to help folks like future plans or in cities like flint where we may be able to make sure that the American People stand behind otherat americans who are suffering their greatest need. What are your thoughts . I have a lot of thoughts about this. Ht first of all, i believe the stafford act is a very general document that is designed to be to help communities overcome many different types of disasters. Regarding the specific situation with flint, i was not pretty, obviously to why the decisions why hhs was put in charge is a Public Health emergency. Regarding that i would be happy to sit down, if confirmed and to understand your concerns more deeply but also to work with the staff and fema to understand the decisions that were made t ultimately that you received that declaration. Ra personally, i have been through several non stafford disaster acts or events. One of them being deepwater horizon, one of those being in h1 and one Public Health emergency and i have grown to realize that one at the state level that Emergency Managers and First Responders can afford to set one out. Just because we delineate but whether the stafford act or not, non disaster stafford act. If confirmed, i do have direct experience to similar events that were not caused by nature and i would be happy to evaluate the situation and meet with you i appreciate that. It sounds as if you do have concerns with the way the act may be written now to respond to some extreme emergencies. Senator, yes. I would be willing to sit down with you to understand your concerns. My i appreciate that. Today, i will concur with my colleagues who are concerned about your comments in terms of responding to requests and senator mccaskills questioning that if we are doing our job as oversight and my job is Ranking Member federal oversight is to make sure the taxpayer money is being spent properly and the appropriations made by congress is done in a way that makes sense and in order to do that we need information. Im externally troubled by comments that if you are in the Minority Party that questions related to specific documents that i may need in order to do my job and my colleagues need to do their job in federal spending oversight or technical comments, briefings, for some reason, would not be made available to us. G i represent the entire state of michigan, my colleagues represent the whole country and the people of this country expect us, and rightly so, to work in a nonpartisan way when it comes to overseeing the federal government and asking the tough questions, making sure that money is being spent appropriately. So, im extremely troubled that you believe that if a minority member asks those kind of questions you are not under any obligation to give that information. Is that accurate . Believe in i dont think its accurate, senator. I believe strongly in the oversight process. I believe strongly in working a bipartisan basis and transparently to reform programs and find ways for abuse where we find them and to participate in as many of these processes that the Congress Sees fit to initiate, what i was responding to was the question of olcs memorandum as it pertains to certain forms of oversight request in which i would seek Legal Counsel within our agency about how to respond to those. Well, i hope, if confirmed, that you fully appreciate the need for us to work in a cooperative way. The only way to do this job properly is that we work in that manner. Im concerned about the statement made by director mulvaney suggesting that one of the agencies that we have always worked at in congress is being a nonpartisan policy analysis and i believe the director mulvaney suggested that quote the day of the cbo has come and gone. And that he may not be looking to analysis done by the cbo. In your role would you consider ththis quercetin and troubled pt of the toolkit in making policy decisions and what is your view . In the legislative process, the omb works closely and relies on its information the directors comments go to the legislative packages the big legislative packages in which the cbos, nonpartisan analysis ends up causing political ramifications based on some of the conclusions that come in this case we disagree with, with an administration. Tu that is not to suggest that the cbo does not have a valuableno role in the process as a staffer i relied on them heavily to assess a bills cost and what the impact the bill would do if it was inactive. If im hearing you correctly, the cbo is a valuable, nonpartisan policy analysis organization, unless you disagree with their conclusions and therefore it is illegitimate. No, sir. That i dont think that is what he said. The cbo, like any other organization an Institution Needs to be able to defend its methodology and analysis. What this administration has been engaged in is a conversation with the American People about what cbos conclusions are with regard to the hca. The administration feels those conclusions are wrong and have put forward an analysis as to why that is the case with regard to various coverage numbers and some of the other impacts i said the hca would have on our healthcare system. If confirmed, i hope you treat faxes facts and not be be nearly inconvenient. Thank you mr. Chairman. Esther long, i want to commend you on your service in alabama in your work with people there. I look forward to working with you, your family zero, they look pretty awesome. A north dakota we have a number of flood projects. We flood pretty regular. Although the sure we have a drought, unfortunately. In the fargo, morehead area with the red river to the north, we have had roy right up there who directs the female operations, he is very good. The court needed the flood mapping and the fema insurance with building the flood project. When we had a flood in 2011, 4000 homes were flooded. Thats a lot more people. We are building flood protection and faces. We need you to work with us on the remapping so that people dont really get hammered with increasing framin fema premiums. I understand you have a job to do you have to do it by law and regulation. We need a Problem Solver need your help now to do the same thing we have done in the red river valley to help those people. So i am asking for your commitment to that, to do that. Yes, i can commit to working with you to understand. Good, then you are going to[l get off easy. Miss row, we are now doing publicprivate partnerships, the president wanted to do this and we have passed into law p3 projects. P for the red River Project this is a 2. 2 billion flood protection project in minnesota. It is underway. The federal share was originally 900 million, now it is . 4,450,000,000, so now the cost has been cut in half, just as i like a good thing . Particularly when they have a backlog in half like that. That would be a good thing when do . Yes. Right now, that 2. 2 billion project is 450 million for the federal government. The state local financing is in place because it is a publicprivate partnership. The omb still scores projects when they come up from thehe c court, they still use the benefit cost ratio withoutco taking its effect or count the p3 benefit. So, when they score our project, their scoring it as if it the federal government has come up with 900 million when theyll never come up with 450 million. To think that make sense . Thats an interesting issue. Im not familiar with that particular form is going. It is something i would be happy to look into they committed toce me that they would have workedyp on it. Im happy to work with omb. I commend you on your outstanding experience in rank you for coming by. I just want to ask you about the cfpb. I have serious concerns about the cfpb. I m on the appropriations, that makes no sense to me. I cannot fathom why we would not have authority when it comes to appropriating over the cfpb. Can you give me your thoughts on that . Thank you senator. I agree that the cfpb should be subject to the appropriations process. One of the reasons why it has the perception of being onof the accountable is that is not accountable to the annual preparations process. That is one of the reasons why the president s budget calls for that specific reform. Its a very important issue that you race. I think you all three for being here and i look forward to working with you. Thank you. Ith yo thank you mr. Chairman. Thank you teach nominee for your testimony overseeing their budget. Omb is a cornerstone of theto dn trump administrations drain the swamp initiatives. I hope you are all investing in very large pumps, there are a lot of swamps i need to be drained. Whether its the government reorg or rolling back the obama era regulations that are inhibiting Economic Growth, it is a boot on the Small Businesses across the country. No less important, the Beam Administration will be responsible for assisting those in times of crisis. To help get our communities back on the be when disaster strikes. We saw that happen in southeast montana last summer, june 2016 when a tornado came through fallon county. We are not know far tornadoes in montana like oklahoma might be, but it devastated our community and we are grateful for the support of fema. It is my hope that each of you will receive. Information. I want to talk about the budget process reform. I spent 28 years the private sector before coming to washington. The last election i won prior to this was the student high scho school. Im the only chemical engineer i spent 20 businesses in fact, the private sector you have to take it more than he spent because that is called profit. We are a long way from that here in washington, d. C. There is a growing sense of in congress that the budget process is broken from start to finish. I think using the word broken is a kind word. According to a january 2017 cbo report, by this september about half of our spending, six and 48 billion will be appropriated to unauthorized programs. Congress hasnt passed all 12 Appropriations Bills since 1996. For those playing at home, that is 21 years. In addition, the process leads to brinkmanship, with do or die passage. At doe that is of an annual, if were lucky, omnibus bill that does not allow for targeted congressional oversight. Thirteen oh my 28 years i spent in the private sector was with a Company Called boxer and gable. I was part of the shampoo operation for a number of years. On the back of a bottle of shampoo that oftentimes will say lather rinse repeat. It sure feels a lot that way here in washington d. C. I guarantee that i will put a lot of money on the table that we are back to a cr kind ofth discussion coming soon as we approach the end of our fiscal year and we go through this repeated cycle of insanity in this country. The people of our great country deserve better. You have seen the shortcomings of our budget process, firsthand in congress. You agree that the congressional budget process is in need of an overhaul . Yes, senator, i do. Wearable budget process reform fall in your priorities at omb . Can we count on omb to actively participate in the Reform Efforts . You can, senator. Its an important issue for omb to think through. Typically the omb analytical perspectives has an entire chapter about budget process reforms that it intends to propose. This year, our budget process reform was smaller because the administration was so new and the priority was centered around getting the budget done. Next year the Senate Confirms me i really do want to have a broader conversation, internally and with this committee about ways we can reform the budget process, ways to remove brinkmanship from the process, ways to get at onofre spinning which is banned in the house but they waived the rule on almost every appropriations bill. It is a major problem and we need to have new and creative ways to address it. I was struck by the continuing ineptitude in this institutions failure just this last cycle, i am on then appropriations committee. We were seven months into this current fiscal year before and omnibus was passed. Ma i cannot imagine in my days and working for fortune 20 company and then a family Construction Business and then part of a startup and i grew a lot of jobs. I cannot imagine, imagine the cfo showing up at the Board Meeting as a, well first we dont have a budget and were seven months into the fiscal year before even authorize the funds. Its ludicrous. This broken process as produced 20 trillion worth of debt. The projections are franklyy ominous as we go forward because of the inability of this institution to let alone balance a budget, but to even pass one in a timely fashion. I want to shift gears and talk about the debt ceiling reforms. Recently the treasury secretary indicated the congress may need to lift the debt ceiling by the end of july. Im a strong believer that we need to continue to consider budget reforms with any debt ceiling increase to get to the crux of the issue. The next administration will play an Important Role in making that happen. Do you believe we should pursue budget reforms in the context of lifting the debt ceiling . I do believe that. I believe that also tracks with history in terms of many of the times we have raised the debt limit in history. We have included budget process reforms, other spending reductions over time, my oldttad boss was authored which was attached to the debt limit increase. We certainly do not want brinksmanship in the legislative process. In terms of using the debt limit increases and to take into account where we are physically is a country where were 20 trillion in debt and asked to raise the debt limit, the debt limit needs to be raised but it does not seem smart at the same time to not take into account and fix the problem. And you are going to spearhead the efforts were rolling back to these obama era rakes, get the gdp growth under 1. 5 . Of would you support legislative efforts to streamline the retractions of regulations . That is an interesting proposal. When i would be interested in working with you on. Want to take a moment to mention, i want to go back in time if we could, harry truman used to say we actually had balance budget 16 or 17 yearsets ago. We have not had a balance budget since 1968 weve had for the role. Im a recovering governor. I governed dollar from 93 until 2001. We had eight years of balance budget so we cut taxes. I know little bit about balancing budgets. The last four years of the Current Administration we balance the budget, we match revenues and expenditures. We grow the economy, more jobs created in those eight years then and in the history of this country. We did exciting things on environments reforms and we do things in terms of Regulatory Reforms. The guy who helped drive the deal, the budget deal during the sears was president clinton asked him to do a deal and negotiate with president s and he did. One of the key republicans washn the chair of the House Committee named john kasich. You had democrats and republicans working together who are determined to balance the budget. They succeeded because a bipartisan support. This administration, this is the worst responsiveness ive ever seen. If we had a Democratic Administration and republicans were trying to get information into oversight over the Democratic Administration and got the responses we have been getting,ge non responses, you would shut the place down. You would shut the place down. We probably ought to do that as well. Talk about draining the swamp, give me a break. Ed they are creating the swamp. That is not to look at the people before sir today. I cannot sit here and listen to what ive heard and say nothing a response. The only people who dont make mistakes of people who do not to anything. The less president , whether you like him or not, did a lot. One thing im proudest of you can look at eight years without any set of scandal. He is a very moral person to try to make sure the people around him understood that and behaved accordingly. One of the big mistakes he made was he did not embrace he ma simpson. I think the rest of us wouldve fallen in line. When they negotiate basically a deal. Restraint on spending reform, and revenues those are the Three Corners of the agreement. The speaker took the deal back to the house. You were probably there. He cannot sell it. Try to renegotiate and could noc sell it. Ation i give john boehner and president obama credit. If we had been able to do this deal we have not been in the situation now. I want to say again, i dont. Know who to direct this to, this lack of responsiveness continuei i hesitate to think what we will do in response. It is unacceptable. Im a big believer in the golden rule to treat others the way you want to be treated. If we had a republican or Democratic House and senate in h the democratic president and republicans were trying to do oversight from the house and senate on a Democratic Administration and you have no responses to their inquiries or lack of responses, and youe we o should. Dont me to take out anything on you but my friend from montana has me excited this morning. Mark said it than i usually in. I am grateful for governors who serve in the United States senate. I am grateful for business leaders. How about auditors . I think our path forwardt heres in this one. Has been created over years and years and you cannot point anyone administration. We are at where we are at. But governors who come to the senate bring a pragmatic approach. I think our solution forward is to get our democratic and Republican Former governors inin the senate to work on some budget reforms. You had to produce a balance budget, truly. I appreciate the comments. I want to stop the clock so we dont take any away from senators time. The truth is, weve done about 80 of simpson bowles. It barely made a dent. With due respect,. We got about 80 . About 700 billion in tax increase, some symbols one and 900 billion. 2. 1 billion with budget control act, simpson wanted 1. 9 trillion for discretionary. W we do not do the quarter trillion on reform. I want to challenge that. Some symbols barely made a debt. We made 80 of it. We have kind of done it and did not call it that. T but we have the revenue, discretionary spending. Let me reclaim my time. The four years when we had balance budget it was about 22 . Those four years we had balance bala budgets revenue was a percent of gdp was 22 . Today, revenues are 17 or 18 of spending that 22. That is part of the problem. Somewhere down the line will have a president in congress who want to work together. I hope that is sooner rather than later. One of the things that we to do around here i know how familiar you are with it,. I am familiar with it. I have read previous reports. Ive not take a look at the latest report. One of the problems with the high risk series. Im just asking if youre familiar with it. Hold your fire. They gives these ways and ideas to save money but i will say i spent 23 years and i love the military in the navy. But we spend more money on defense in the next six or seven or eight nations combined. And theyre asking for an enormous increase for defense spending. Meanwhile, one of the recommendations is the department of defense after all of these years still have not gotten a clean bill of health on 70 years. We need to do work there. But i hope this a ministration will say that youve given defense extra money and maybe we should go to that high risk and see how we can save some money while we do this kind of thing. I want to mention the high risk and i think theres a lot of interest to work that lists and save money. One of the recommendations they made from gal and mr. Chairman you can cut me off when youre ready. We had done and for the committee we tried to impeach him in the house. I think is one of the most decent people ive met in government is honorable, smart, business person spent a career taken businesses and making something of them. Do hes doing a thankless job. One of the recommendations of gal was that we can raise revenues if we give them the tools they need, people, thetheh budget the technology they need and every dollar we spend get back 5 7 and provide customer service. I called the offices and say i cannot get anybody to help me. E. What are yourthoughts . In the grand scheme of the budget the irs received and was protected in terms of the amount of reductions it was asked to live under for fiscal year 18. About 95 of the filers are doing it online. This budget increases operation support by 6 . Or there are reductions elsewhere but we felt trying to modernize and make efficiencies to move people towards filing their taxes online can help. We agree that the irs is crucial in being able to collect the necessary amount of revenue the people on paying taxes. We are very careful to allocate reductions where summit the most sense. It was very nice meeting you this morning. Is that your daughter i met . No, my wife. She would appreciate that, and i met your two sons, their handsome guys. My fatherinlaw taught there for four years. Good luck and were anxious to get to work with you. I dont know you well i appreciate getting to know you. Know you well i appreciate getting to know you. I hope you dont think that you, i just wanted to set the clock to give you extra time. What i would love to do is hold a hearing and go through the budgetary history of what has happened, where spending was in revenue was and why we are able to balance budget for a brief moment. Well land the facts and reality. I know we have more questions. Before i get to my fema question, i was struck on your comment when he said we are being asked to raise the debt limit. Who is asking you that . I know the administration hah asked congress to raise the debt limit. So you are asking us to raise the debt limit . So it is you asking ask to raise the debt limit, correct . Ve the debt limit does need to be race. O there seems to be some disconnect around here and that for years the debt limit was something nobody wanted to race and was being used as a political two by four now that you are in charge its painful, but you have to face the reality that this is an inappropriate political two by four. The debt limit has to be race, the president is asking us to raise the debt limit. The Republican Leadership is asking us to raise the debt limit. Want to make sure thats on the record clearly. Is note if anybody else is asking you need to let us know. The only one i know of is your administration and congress. The only one i know of is your administration and congress. Mr. Long, given the fact that on friday President Trump issued a major disaster declaration site gives you a massive amount of flooding is way beyond the capability of state local governments we had a number of bridges washed out and homes washed away by the way 2016 was a major year for flooding there were six times greater than in 2015. It has tripled compared to the 20 years prior. Your business is going to be going up, not down. 2018 given that statistics and given that reality, are you concerned about the 600 million in budget cuts that have been proposed for fema in 2018 . Thank you for the question. I fully support the president si budget, if confirmed i realize that as a ministration i have to make sure the agency commitment demands when it comes to saving and sustaining lives after to be disasters. I need to be able to work with my staff to evaluate where we are a measure of the increasing demands placed upon the agency. Supp if i perceive a problem i look forward out to working with this committee to address the issues. I think youll get support on a bipartisan basis. Ill never forget whether it was katrina, sandy flooding, everyone theres actual examples of people who voted against funding for those disastersrs until their state had a disaster. D more fed then i was like okay, we needm more federal money. I dont think that budget is realistic in light of the uptick we see in data. I dont mean to be, i know i am coming out strongly with you this morning but i am frustrated as you can tell. Im upset about a lawyer in the Justice Department telling the entire executive branch that i have no authority to do oversight. I think that is outrageous. But im also upset about the fact that we have two people in the government same opposite things about the budget. It neutr director mulvane said that we assume a deficit neutral tax plan that does not rely on Economic Growth to achieve the deficit neutrality. Secretary the nation again when the budget came out it was the plan for growth and that is what is shown here. Same day so we now have on the same day stating unequivocally that thecy tax cuts in the budget were not offset but instead by Economic Growth. In the same day the director of omb said we went through a list of exclusions and loopholes thau were closed i calculated that those would offset the tax cuts and the proposedbudget. I have the secretary under asu saying this is Economic Growth and i the head of omb same ass the tax policy changes that are in fact neutralizing the revenue losses. So, what is going on . Are they not talking to each other . Clearly there same opposite and hearings about the same budget. I do not think that is the case. We have been very clear as a ministration that this budget does not double count the revenue increase from Economic Growth, twice. You can either use it once for deficit reduction or use it to pay for the tax cut. This budget uses the revenue from Economic Growth and contributed toward deficit reduction. The tax cut is assumed to be deficit neutral. What we did and the assumption we make with regard to the tax repose was to take the guidelines put forward by secretary mnuchin which included in those guidelines, paying for the tax increase with getting o rid of special deductions and credits and loopholes. Broadening the base. That is what is meant pay for the tax cuts. So the secretary of the treasury is wrong. This is not Revenue Growth that will pay for the tax cuts. It will reduce the deficit. What i need from you is, wheres the money coming from in the reduction of loopholes. What are they . We get to the very class proposal has not then developed it. So use are saying is going to pay for yourself that you have no idea how . The tax proposal based on a number of guidelines put forwarr by secretary the nation. Give me one example of how youll pay for this tax cut with closing loopholes. What are they . The policy Development Process is not at that point where we are ready to say specifically which deductions and credits are proposed so you have no idea of how to pay for. You cannot give me one example of a loophole that you put in the budget and thats what makes it balance . And you are willing to stand by that . Youll tell the American People youre balancing the budget and you can give me one example of how youre paying for the tax code . The budget is a set of assumptions. The assumption we had when wess wrote the budget was based on policy Development Process that was where it was at that point which is a set of guidelines and specifics as it was reflected in those guidelines. The only thing nonspecific is how you pay for in your timing i have no idea. I dont have specifics on the tax plan. Not even what category it might be. At this point. How do you expect us to take this seriously . Is a set of policy assumptions based on what we know currently. You cant Say Something balances on policy proposal when you can say out loud with policy is. How can you have a straight face with the American People weou balance the budget when you cant step up to the microphone and give me some idea of how that happens . The process is underway. I understand your desire to havo clarity on that point. We hope it materializes soon. Thank you. I would ask and give you sheets that ask consent for this in the record. Ty close we have about 81 of simpson bowles. 0 i was close to the 700 billion from the revenue was simpson u bowles had less than that but they had about 795 billion in savings and some Social Security reforms. The total differences 3. 4 trillion lived at about 2. 8. The rest is savings on interesti i will and without in the record. Again, my point being weve done 81 it was still have a massive debt problem in a massive projective deficit. It. The nominees have made this for prehearing questions submitted by the committee. This will be made part of the hearing record with the exception of Financial Data which is on file. How to think the nominees for your willingness to serve. We have enormous challenges, some divisions, we want to workk through those and i wanted thank families. I know youll see less of your loved ones here. This is a sacrifice for the entire family as well. Thank you for your willingness to serve. The record will remain open until tomorrow. This hearing is adjourned. [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] [iib