Coverage before we wrap up this years festival. And joining us here on our set is radio talk show host and author of seven books, Dennis Prager. His most recent book is called the Ten Commandments still the best moral code. Dennis prager, whats on your mind . Guest oh, thats a very good opening question. And ill answer you completely honestly. Whats on my mind and its not totally germane, but quite germane to the Ten Commandments, is what i believe is the undoing of the american revolution. And the decline of my beloved country, the greatest experiment in liberty and decency in human history. And i do believe that a big part of the reason is the radical secularization of our society. Host where did that come from . How did it come about . Guest it came about, its origins really emanate from europe. After world war i and even somewhat before but especially after world war i, europe decided that everything it believed in was nonsense because of the massacres of world war i. The atrocious loss of life for no apparently good reason. Thats a very important point. Everybody understands world war ii was morally necessary. Not everybody believes world war i was, and they certainly didnt believe it afterwards. Despite the versailles treaty and blaming germany and so on. Nevertheless, there was a feeling everything we believed in lead us awry, so we will drop religion, and we will drop national identity, we will just become secular citizens of the world. America took its ph. D. S from european universities starting in the late 19th century before world war i, but nevertheless continuing, and i think thats where it developed where, if youre intelligent, you can go back to darwin, you can go back to marx. But the operative element was if youre bright, youre not religious. Its at a university in the western world, not just the United States, if you believe that god created heaven and earth, that god is the source of thou shalt not murder, not just reason, you are considered a dummy. And that foolishness and that truly is foolish, because the deepest people i have ever met have overwhelmingly had a godcentered understanding of the world. But that is now taken as a given, that if you believe Something Like that, you are intellectually suspect. So thats whats happened. Host when you hear somebody say im spiritual but not religious [laughter] guest how do you know me such good questions . I have done hours of radio just on that subject. It is with all respect to people who say it, it is meaningless. It means i contemplate my navel in a sophisticated manner. It doesnt mean anything, im spiritual but not religious. What does it mean . If you have no religion, what do you have . Spirituality . What does spirituality mean . That you believe that flowers are beautiful . That you believe that animals are loving . What does it mean . It doesnt mean anything. I know to the individual making it it means something, but without Religion Without a code, religion gives you a code. Religion gives you a set of beliefs. I dont care if you reject them, but at least you have to grapple with them. Remember, israel which is the Founding Group of the Old Testament means struggle with god. And i take that seriously as a believer. I do struggle with god. When i see all the suffering in this world, the unjust suffering, when just thinking for a moment forgetting the obvious of your neighbor had pancreatic cancer at 32, but a whole country called north korea which is a human concentration camp . The way people live there . And the hundred million of world war ii . I mean, you know, these things bother me. So i understand struggling with god as a believer. But i want the atheist to understand you have to struggle with god too. Its not enough. I was invited, to the great credit, the american atheists, Biggest Group in the u. S. As far as i know, they invited me to their annual convention which was to their credit. And, to debate their head on gods existence. At one point i looked at the audience who were completely, by the way, decent to me and i cant complain at all, they were just fine. But i said to them at one moment, would you raise your hand be you have ever seen if you have ever seen a child born or listened to a bach partita or a mozart symphony or seen a van gogh painting or seen a sunset and said, you know, its hard to believe that just happened on its own. Maybe theres a god. Not one hand went up. And then i looked at them and i said, you know, if i were to ask any religious audience have you ever seen a deformed baby and doubted godded, raise your hand god, raise your hand, everyone would have raised their hand. We believers struggle more than you atheists do. And you think youre the questioning ones. Were the questioning ones. Host where did this book, the Ten Commandments, come from . Guest it is exactly what the subtitle says. It is still the best moral code. This changed human history. And in the briefest book i ever wrote following the longest book i ever wrote, which i had the honor of being on your show then, this is a transcription of the 11 lectures, the Ten Commandments plus one introductory lecture which is on prageruniversity. Com. It continues to be widely viewed all over the world. And i have taught this my whole life from the hebrew. And this is the distillation of every idea ive had in teaching this for 40 years. So this is a, its a very important book to me because its very simple. If everybody lived by the Ten Commandments, you would not need one early, you would not need one missile, you would not need any policemen, you would not have to put locks on your doors. This is all humans need. Its amazing. Host Dennis Prager and were going to put the phone numbers up, because this is your chance to talk with radio talk show host and author Dennis Prager. 202 is the area cold, 7488200 in the east and central time zones, 7488201 for those of you in the mountain and out here in the pacific time zone. Were here at the Los Angeles Times festival of books on the campus of the university of Southern California. Our guest is Dennis Prager. First of all, where did Prager University get its start, and are you, are you a jewish scholar . Guest well, its a little pompous for me to say im a scholar, but i did teach jewish history and religion at Brooklyn College in the beginning of my career. I have written two books on judaism and about 200 articles. I got an award from the American Jewish press association for my columns on jewish matters. I know the torah, the first five books of the bible, in the hebrew better than i know it in english, and ive taught it much of my life. So i dont i certainly use the work of scholars to explain to people of every background, thats what i this is very important. I believe that the whole book, those five books, is for everyone in the world. Its the greatest book ever written. And certainly the Ten Commandments, its for humanity. Of course, it was given to the jews as it were, but its for humanity. If everybody lived by it, as i said, thats all you would need. The rest is commentary. This is it. Anyway, Prager University, we started it because were very worried about what is happening at the universities where theres more indoctrination than there is education. And it saddens me, because i love the mind. I love books. Youre my favorite show, i just want you to know. My wife is here, we told you this before, so im going to say it you didnt ask me to. Im not even sure you believe me. Its the only show i really watch, booktv. Im crazy about booktv. And my wife introduced me to it, so you owe her a debt of gratitude to her. And this is years ago. Its phenomenal. I love books. In high school i started reading and collecting bookings. I have about 7,000 books. I am crazy about books. I love the life of the mind. But the university is shattering it. Because its not the life of the mind, it is now the life of dogma, of ideology. So we have gotten some of the greatest thinkers on earth to give five minute courses on the most important subjects in the world. From economics to sociology to history, and we had last year 70 million views. I mean, thats its an unbelievable number. In the englishspeaking world with, there is very little that has more views in terms of video content. So the Ten Commandments is one of them. That alone had about 12 million views. And this is the product, this book. But Prager University, we hope we got a letter from ill just tell you one more thing about it. We got a letter from a graduate said i just graduated stanford a couple of years ago. I wanted you to know, ive learned more at Prager University than i did at stanford university. We got in from bill bennetts son. He allowed me to quote9 him. He went to princeton. He said i learned more at Prager University than at princeton. Thats our intent. You will get, because youll get something you dont get at universities; wisdom. Host were in the middle of a president ial campaign. How do the Ten Commandments fit into a president ial campaign . Guest well, it depends on how you believe the United States was structured. I believe, and this, of course, i went over with you with my last book, still the best hope about america. And i believe there is an american trinity just as there is a christian trinity. And the american trinity is found i didnt make it up. Its found on every coin. E pluribus unum, in god we trust, liberty. America stands on those three. The if you remove one of them, the other two cannot stand. Liberty is dependent upon the other two, the other two are dependent upon liberty. God is essential, and every founder, every founder said that. Without god, this country will not endure. They all said it. This notion that they were all deists, i hate to say this word, its like a dirty word to me because i so rarely use it, but its a lie. They werent deists. Deist means someone who believes god created the world and then became disinterested in it. Benjamin franklin who was not, admittedly, who was not an orthodox christian, he did not believe in the christian trinity, okay. But he did believe in the god of the bible. And he believed in a judging god. Thats what the secular world hates. I am convinced at its core people dont want to be judged. And the hebrew bible and the hen commandments Ten Commandments introduced the idea that you and i and everybody here and everyone alive is going to be judged on their moral behavior. Thats big. And people dont like that. Thats why the word judgmental is a dirty word. Host Dennis Prager, if people want to hear your radio show guest im on all over the country. Not every single city, but the vast majority of medium and big cities. And you can hear it on the internet effortlessly, and theres an app you can hear me on. I get calls from brazil, i get calls from i think i got a call from uzbekistan once. It is amazing whats possible now. Just look up on google, the Dennis Prager show. Host and youre syndicated by salem. Guest thats right, yep. Host whats been the main topic that youve talked about for the last two, three weeks . Guest well, its inevitable that there is a hot about, obviously a lot about, obviously, what is happening with regard to especially the republican side. And remember, my show well, not remember, ill just say my show, everybodys show is unique because everybody is unique. But mine is a drop more unique than others because i dont only talk about politics. I broadcast 15 hours a week, 3 hours a day, noon to three eastern time, nine to twelve western time. And an hour of those, of that 15 a week is on male female relations. And i believe its the most honest talk about men and women in the media today. An hour is on happiness, i wrote a book on happiness, and i believe that happiness is a moral obligation, not merely an emotional state. Well talk about that at greater depth one day, because thats when people understand that, it is life changing. So one is on male female, and one is called the ultimate issues hour where i just talk about the great issues of life. Are people basically good, for example. And so at least three of my hours are not on politics. But, obviously, given especially the donald trump phenomenon theres been a lot of talk about that. Host you wrote on town hall i believe it was that you could support donald trump if he were the nominee. Guest yeah, well, right. But that was a preface to a big attack on him. Host right. Guest i think hes awful. But i would vote for him if he were the nominee because i believe that, unfortunately and i never judge intentions, but i believe that what the left has done to the country in undoing e e pluribus e pluribusd we trust and liberty has to be stopped. And, therefore, im doing anything i can to have anyone else be nominated. But if he is nominated, i feel i have no choice but to vote for him. Host who is, whos your favorite . Guest well, i said at the very beginning and i still stand by this that i thought that marco rubio would have been the most effective of the republican candidates. Im sorry to see what happened. At the same time, if ted cruz could be appointed, because i know that he has obstacles to winning i think he can win, incidentally. In fact, im more of belief of that as time goes on. But ted cruz has a lot of, i have a lot of admiration for him. He means what he says. Hell be portrayed as a rightwing kook whereas, you know, whereas, you know, Bernie Sanders is not a leftwing kook . For a man to believe in socialism when the only thing that has ever lifted humanity out of poverty has been capitalism . And thats not considered kooky . This is nothing ted cruz says that comes close to the kookiness of Bernie Sanders. I mean, its just, its lunacy. The only thing that has ever lifted humans from poverty has been capitalism x. The man is for socialism. Its as orwell said, it is so stupid, only an intellectual could believe it. Host you and Bernie Sanders, both jewish, both new yorkers. Guest yeah. Thats about it. I would say even on the both jewish we dont even he is jewish ethnicically, im jewish religiously. And being jewish doesnt mean anything to him. And i dont hold that against him. Youre not obligated, in my opinion, to affirm what you were born into. Not at all. Its america, its a free country. But i do affirm jude dayism judaism very deeply whereas for him its a nonissue. And thats fine. That doesnt affect me one way or the other. I would say that his views disturb me tremendously. But not the fact that he is what a famous leftwing jewish historian called, hes a nonjewish jew. And thats not an insult. There is a book called the nonjewish jew by this man, and hes describing himself. Its not an insult, but thats what he is. Im a jewish jew, hes a nonjewish jew with. So we dont have much in common. Host are you a conservative, and if so, are you a, are you a purist when it comes to being a conservative . Guest well, im never a purist because i always believe that something is better than nothing. I am not a purist at all. But i am a conservative. Ironically, the deepest of deepest truths is that i am the same liberal i was when i grew up in brooklyn as a jew and went to columbia which is, you know, almost definitionally liberal. I cant think of almost anything i differed with john f. Kennedy on. In fact, i have a test. See, liberalism has been taken over by conservatives. The name has been taken over by the left. The content has been taken over by the right. Every liberal i know is a conservative. Leftists are not liberals. Liberals were Daniel Patrick moynihan, the senator from new york state, senator henry jackson, scoop jackson, of washington state, john f. Kennedy. Here is a test. All your listeners, all your viewers should take john f. Kennedys inaugural address and hand it to a College Student that they know. Not with the title of the president. Say this was an inaugural address given by an american president. Was it a republican or a democrat . And i am willing to bet that 90 would say, oh, this is a republican. Because every theme in it, much of the themes he believed deeply in lowering taxes to stimulate the economy. He believed america had a moral obligation to fight anywhere at any cost for liberty on earth. Those arent ideas that are held by the left. Those are ideas that were held by liberals. Host Dennis Prager is our guest. Nationallysyndicated talk show host, author of about seven books, cofounder of Prager University. Gaye in upland, california, you are the first call for mr. Prager. Go ahead, gaye. Caller hi, thank you very much. Wow, where to begin, mr. Prager. I am mostly troubled by his infantile and simplistic viewpoint that if all humans would merely live by the Ten Commandments, we would be hunky dory. Thats just the childlike view that you get from the religious and the conservatives these days, because its intellectually dishonest. Humans are much more complicated. No, we dont like to be judged. Of course, who does . You dont, im quite sure. Guest i do, actually. I pray that god judges me. Because then god will judge hitler, and then god host okay. Guest so i want god to judge you and me. So dont speak for me. Caller well, thats what i believe. And that increasing belief is becoming more prevalent in this country, fortunately. But a small religious minority has continued to force its ideology, to force its us to live by your religion, your values. Thats just deeply, deeply wrong host gaye caller and i could make a huge list. Host gaye, before we let you go, before we let you go, here are the Ten Commandments very quickly, and which of these do you think you live by . I am the lord, your god, you will have no other gods before me, do not take the lords name in vain, remember the sabbath, honor thy mother and father, conot murder, no adultery, steal, do not bear false witness and do not covet. Caller im familiar with them. Host im sorry, youre not familiar with them . Caller i am familiar with them. I went to sunday school. [laughter] as a child. Guest why is it childish and simplistic to think if everybody lived by these, the world would be a good place . Caller its not reasonable to live by these things that were written down in the bronze age. People didnt know anything then. We know so much guest you didnt answer my question. Forgive me, its irrelevant when it was written. Beethoven caller it is not. It is not irrelevant. Guest no, its totally irrelevant host gaye, were going to let mr. Prager answer. Guest i dont understand the objection. Either theyre valid or theyre not valid. The fact that they are old doesnt make them any more something new makes something invalid. What is problematic about do not murder, do not steal, do not covet, do not lie . Why is that bad, because its old . Is there a better code to live by . Host lets go to gayes first point which was a religious minority is making her live under these values . Guest nobody well, first of all, the secular majority is making her live under do not murder, do not bear false witness, do not steal. Those have been, those have been accepted. I dont want the government to enforce all of these. I dont want you to be arrested if you commit adultery. But i would like people to live by it. I suspect gaye would like people to live by it too. What is irrelevant in the group . You name them. What would she like dropped . What would you like dropped, gaye . Host gaye is gone, and were going to go to michael in galesburg, illinois. Youre on booktv with author Dennis Prager. Caller how you doing, mr. Lamb . Mr. Prager . Firsttime caller, longtime listener. Id like to run three things by mr. Prager, and then ill take my answer off the phone. When you read something, youre taking away the oral history. There was a lot of religion before the bible was written. What do you think about america having food shows where they go around eating the biggest hamburger . And the other thing is whats the difference between consumerism and free thought . Thank you, bye. Guest hmm. Did you get that . Did you take down those notes . What was the last one, whats the difference between consumerism and host consumerism, and i missed her second part. Guest okay, so we missed that one. Well let you riff on consumerism in general. But religions before the Ten Commandments. Guest right. Religions before the Ten Commandments, none of them had a universal god. Therefore, they were only applicable to the tribe. And no religion, for example, prior to the hebrew bible had said that you should love the foreigner. It is one of the most ubiquitous statements in the first five books of the bible, love the stranger, because you were strangers in the land of egypt. The idea that you love the foreigner, the idea that all people are created in gods image, these are brand new ideas. Of course there was religion prior. There was also child this is the first book in the history of the world to ban child sacrifice, to ban human sacrifice. People dont understand the spectacular revolutions wrought in this book. They dont, because theres a tremendous ignorance and a willful ignorance. But thats a good example. Human sacrifice. It was accepted universally, and along comes this book and said it is an abomination in gods eyes to sacrifice human beings. Host he went on to talk about consumerism. He went on to talk about food shows with the biggest hamburger. I mean, maybe hes talking about society in general. Guest yeah. I dont have a problem with consumerism. The American Consumer supports the worlds economy. If americans started living only on what they need and not what they would like, then the unemployed around the world would starve to death. Thank god for the American Consumer. See, he makes the world go round. I would add another thing. While, obviously, i am not a big fan of ostentatious consumption, i am not. In fact, im against it. Nevertheless, i think people should know because ive studied good and evil my whole life. Lenin, who was the father of evil of the 20th century, he is the father. He created the terror state that then later was adopted by hitler and mao and stalin, obviously, following hitler. Lenin was an ascetic. Lenin was the last he was not, he was not a consumerist. He didnt buy much. He denied himself pleasure. I, im scared of people generally not all. A Catholic Priest that takes a vow of poverty, i respect that tremendously. But when people say, you know, oh, i dont want anything, im a little worried. I want my children to want to make a home and take care of a family and, yes, and have a picket fence and two dogs. What is mocked by the left, i dont mock. I think its a beautiful aspiration to want to make a beautiful home for yourself, your spouse and your children. Frankly the gods that i see especially the abraham religions are cartoons. I understand an affable cant disappoint the sky. But god is an affable by definition. Hes infinite. He is not mortal. He or she or it is not limited, but we have turn to god into this cartoon. We can see how that has really unfortunately thats why people who think, liberals, reject that very cartoonish god, that god that justifies very unchristian politics of yes consume, consume, consume. I could go on and on but im going to stop because he has some interesting ideas. Its just that to me for anyone to call themselves a christian cannot see that love is at the core of christianity and not see that jesus christ himself rejected the capitalism a type of consumption that mr. Prager seems to elevate above all other good news to me kind of blind. I will stop. Host june in guest just for the record im a jew, not a christian. Nevertheless, i dont believe that george washington, john adams, James Madison and almost every great figure in history believe in a cartoon. That dismissal is very common today. People have a dismissive attitude towards those of us who believe in the god of the bible, and you are certainly free to have that belief but it is not cartoonish. It is indispensable that there is a god who demands that we be good people and to who we will have to enter, as the best idea ever developed for the creation of decent people. I would like everyone walking along here to field that their behavior to feel toward other human beings is just like god. I dont know why that is objectionable. I really dont. I cant think of a better idea. To think that i want through life having to be a good person and that god expects me to be good, why does that make people like the last caller angry so much so that he calls what we believe in a cartoon . Its a puzzle to me, frankly. I deal with them on the radio show, i deal with it in email. I can only say that this is what it has presented a cartoonish caricature of what we believe in. And then say we believe in the cartoon that they have caricatured. Host next call is jacob in fayetteville, georgia. Jacob, youre on booktv. Hello. Caller thank you so very much. I have one quick concern or question. In the books we talked about, there is so much murder of the folks who are not jewish. I cant understand why is there, i mean, there is more killing in those books than any of the books that are written about a god tight. Would you please, you know, just sure why that is . Entire villages host are you referring to the five books of the torah we spoke of earlier . Caller right. Host thank you, sir. Tragically very fair question and i dont want to interrupt the caller. Guest if there were a law in those five books that said jews, you must kill those who dont believe like you, i would cease to be a believer. It there were just one such verse in the entire hebrew bible i would cease to be a believer for i would not have written in this book. I would opt out of my religion. There isnt a hint of the notion that a should kill a nonjew. That jews conquering canaan, conquered it in a warlike manner, yes, that is a every place on earth was ever conquered. That is what happened but there was no suggestion that you kill people who dont believe as you do. There is no such a suggestion to contact the bible goes out of its way to say you cannot go into canaan until they have become so evil that they deserve to be taken over. When the amount and the evil was child sacrifice. Thats how bad they were. Host whats the secret to being a successful radio talk show host . Isnt a wide variety of interest . Guest ive given up a lot of thought. Ive been on for three for your site just, i earned the right to answer your question. This is not necessarily reflect on me but it reflects on really all of my colleagues coming to the people i dont agree with. The first thing, interestingly enough, the first thing is you must constantly be interesting. To be totally honest in giving you an answer. You can be brilliant, you can be anything wonderful, but if your not interesting, people will tune you out. They have thousands of other options in different radio stations, and listen to books, listening to music, talking to a friend on the phone. Its endless. So the first rule when young people say to me id like to be a talk show host, how would i know i can do it . I say very easy. Go into a room, sit alone for three hours and the interesting. If you can do that, talking to the wall for three hours, you have a chance. Host center is calling in from olympia, washington. Please go ahead with your question or comment for dennis rader. Caller you and i, we have to be twins. I spend every weekend on booktv. Im a book called. Guest thats right. We have good company with each other. Caller i agree. Im astonished. I am. Im not able to reach you on the radio here, although i listen to rush on occasion but i urge in the past. Ive been, oh, golly, ive been interested since i was three years old, okay . Growing guest you have been what . Caller i have been missing person since i was three years old and growing at it. It was the nature of her family. I grew up learning. I got a good education. My education was in high school. I went to college and i was pretty disappointed and it was a pretty fair college, but theyre just beginning to turn at that point. My religious history, my philosophical, political history goes way back. I am still nominally a republican, but im looking around. Am also looking at the libertarians. I think theyre coming along. But as far as yes. Guest let me write it for me to the point, let me react to the point you made about college. Because this was a very important part of my own realizations here, religious and otherwise. When i was in graduate school at columbia, i realized i had so many bright professors, but i hate to say this, i was taught a lot of johnson. For example, i was at the school of international the shares at the russian institute. I studied the cold war, and i was taught that the clinic was as responsible for the cold war as stalin and khrushchev and brezhnev. And i thought, youve got to be kidding. How could you teach something, a totalitarian empire is as responsible as a Democratic Society for the cold war . And then i was taught that men and women are basically the same to the boys are just as happy to play with dolls and religious is happy to play with trucks if you would only give them those specific items to play with. And i realized this is ridiculous. Im being taught nonsense. And its gotten worse since i was there. Its gotten worse. And then one day i was Walking Around my campus in columbia and i was puzzled, why am i learning so much nonsense by so many intelligent people . And then a verse that i learned in Jewish School as a child came, just came out of nowhere into me, and that is wisdom begins with fear of god. And i realize all, my god, theres a wisdom in columbia because theres no god in columbia. And theres brightness. Theres intelligence. Theres a facts at columbia. Theres knowledge but there was no wisdom. And there is no wisdom i enlarge. There were exceptions, some wise professors but as the universities have left their original god bases, which is what all of them had, they have become less and less wise, and more and more, imbecilic or idiotic. Thats the truth. I say with the sadness. I did realize that its very hard come if you believe everything is relative, there is ultimate truth, no ultimate utica it is the ultimate mobile become everything you see individual, the look of the arts. Look at what happened to the arts when god died. We went from michelangelo and we went from mozart, and a look at what they have come here in Southern California. There is a gigantic sculpture in the front of the museum of art in orange county, and the sculpture is of a dog lifting his leg and he. It is symbolic in the extreme of what has happened to the arts. Ththe ugly, eschatological the ugly, the scatological, deborah means related to excretory functions, to one of the biggest awards jiminy for sculpture for art was given to an artist who sculpted a policewoman crouching and urinating, even the puddle is a sculpted. And backup one of the biggest awards in germany. This is what happens when god dies. So does humanity. Host we are at the l. A. Times book festival on the campus of the university of Southern California talking with author and radio talk show host Dennis Prager. They are our drums going off. There are dogs barking. There are people shouting, people walking by. I hope you here a little bit of that, but hopefully you were hearing our conversation more importantly. Paul in spokane, washington, go ahead. Caller hi, dennis. I appreciate you coming on. Its a pleasure to talk with you. I was, i heard about you through several other sources. I identify as kind of a Vincent Pirro conservative you might say, i am an evangelical ben shapiro. Westminster confession to i believe that the 10 commandments apply though image of the way. I wasnt aware you were jewish though until just now. So by a regional question was so my original question was do you tend to lean towards or side with evangelical dominion us . I dont agree but i just wanted your take on it. Hosting before we hear from mr. Prager, what is a ben shapiro conservative . [laughter] caller i listen to a lot of ben shapiro and i agree quite a bit with this statement. I like that new young conservative movement, its a real shot in your. And a lot of what he says makes sense. Teaches very logical, very brave and very forthright. Postbank thank you very much thank you very much. Of course, ben shapiro was on this program last year. But go ahead, mr. Prager. Guest and he does a lot of good work. The dominionism, and i worked for evangelicals and i personally with evangelicals and evangelical theology. The dominionists as i understand them is that the group would like to see america become a theocratic, or is not just a charge that antievangelicals make a . Im not familiar. Host he is gone. Com is kind of. Guest to bed. In general, i would say he, i have a tremendous amount of sympathy for evangelical christians. We dont see theologically completely eye to eye, obviously. But i use of the term judeochristian values, not Judeo Christian theology. There is no judeochristian there are judeochristian values. This country was founded on them. The christians who founded america were deeply judeobased. Margaret thatcher was deeply such. She said western culture is judeochristian. Host a couple of state laws have gone into effect, or not come into effect in north carolina, mississippi, georgia vetoed it. Its about bathrooms. Its about gender equality. Its about, whats it about him in your view . Guest it is first and foremost about religious liberty. So, for example, if i am a photographer and youre going to have a samesex wedding or a gay wedding as it is often called, and you want me to be the photographer and take part in the wedding and i say, look, i would happily have you sit down and take your photo for your wedding. I would happily take your photo for anything you wanted, but to participate in an event that violates some of my core values, one of which is that marriage has been said definitionally by god to mean the union of one man and one woman to ask you to understand, i can participate in that event. Theres been a lot of i think underreporting. The people that i followed, the cases i have followed, i think louisiana and i washington and oregon and elsewhere, it was always opposition to anything, not a person. The baker in one case always baked cakes for gay customers. That was never an issue. And by the way, i would be opposed. You cannot bake a cake because you dont like someones sexual orientation. That to me is a given. But asking me to bake a cake for an event, i dont, i dont, forget religion giunta we should have the liberty to say, look, i will bake a cake for you but i am morally, im morally opposed to your event. I can say prochoice baker said i cant bake a cake, or i cant be involved in your prolife rally. Please dont ask me to do that. And i would say, you should have the liberty to say i cant be forced by the state to participate. I keep emphasizing an event that a fundamentally oppose. America is based on the attention. It is a tension between liberty and religious liberty, and certain act of decency and equally. It is a tension. But to dismiss everybody as a hater who thinks that i need to preserve my right to live by by religious scruples, thats a very Dangerous Movement in american life. Host next call comes from Fountain Hills arizona. Go ahead. Caller Dennis Prager, im the biggest talk radio had across all the am dial and you were so be the best. May i borrow a phrase endeavor to make you think a second time, even better to make you laugh. Being my favorite contemporary because my faith is wrong with catholicism and my philosophy is libertarianism, for i believe in free will and free markets, faith and reason are two sides of the same coin. In god i trust. So mad quickly say i dont worship mans law, but gods law. So speaking of gods commandments and keeping them safely, a quick a twopart question. How is labeling [inaudible] not born amongst us in illegal for migrating to our free country without anybodys permission . And how is it not violating god second greatest commandment, to my fellow republicans to pick and choose who should stay or who should go in our beloved United States, based on aim materialistic worldview judging a migrants worthwhile being in the United States either skills they might present from the here and now . Guest so what is the alternative event for any number, whether its 20 or 30 million who come in illegally, we should all all of them to remain . I just want to understand your position. There is no border then that should be sacrosanct for any country . Host im afraid he is gone. Sorry. Guest let me just say on this and i think it is important, i have said for years and written, summon can certainly search it on the internet, someone came i have emphasized over and over that if i were a latin american, especially central america, and i could not get into the United States legally, i would go into the United States illegally. I, Dennis Prager, if i were mexican and i knew i am in one of the most corrupt societies on earth, and the Greater Society on earth is 100 miles north of me, im going to bring my children to where there is hope, the United States of america, and take them out of the hopeless corruption that pervades mexico. So i would do that. I dont have one moral issue with peopl the people who come n illegally. At the same time, i dont understand i people on the other side dont understand that america has a moral obligation to protect its borders. We cant allow all the humans in the world to live in corrupt places to come here. That would be the end of the United States as we know it. We have to have control immigration. Otherwise, the country doesnt, we have rather unique values. So we have to be careful about taking in unlimited numbers of people who often represent different values. For example, if you come from latin america, and i adore latin america. Some of my best friends are latin america and stuff. I put my rhetoric where my values are. I make the point to all those who knock a latin american immigrants year. We here in Southern California enormous number of Latin Americans. They will often, they will gather at corners, they picked up to date as a day laborers at home. How come weve never heard of one woman raped by any of these men that she takes to her house . Not only that, white women will more readily pick up strangers, latin american young man, put them in her suv and take into her house, then white men. That is how much we trust let lt the mystics i just want to make all of that clear. Having said that, Latin Americans come to america with a latin american view of the state. They should be as big as possible. Thats not the american view. Its not been the view that america was founded on, which is limited government. Host next call for mr. Prager is kerry in connecticut. O. Ahead. We are listening. Caller good afternoon, people. Mr. Prager, i get you in connecticut but if i did get you i would be listening because i agree with everything you ever said, everything. Rush limbaugh, i listen to because i didnt and marc levin, i love you. He is a constitutional genius. I love ted cruz for the same reasons, and i wanted to say as far as god goes, okay, man is an intricate creature, okay . He cannot accept the idea of a transcendental god