Transcripts For CSPAN2 Gun Safety Advocates Testify On Gun Violence 20240707

[background noises] >> the meeting will resume it. we are now ready for our second panel. i would like to introduce our witnesses. the first witness is the honorable eric adams who is the mayor of the city of new york. then we will hear from greg zack jackson who is executive director of the cumulate justice action fund. next we will hear from becky pringle who is the president of the national education association. next will hear from joseph who is the police commissioner of buffalo, new york. then we will hear from nick who is the senior vice president for law and policy at every town for gun safety. finally we will hear from amy who is the legal fellow at the edwin neese center for legal and judicial studies and the heritage foundation. the witnesses will be un- muted so we may swear them in. please raise your right hand, do you swear to affirm the testimony you are about to give is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you god? >> yes, i do. >> let the record show the witnesses answered in the affirmative. thank you. that objection your written statements were made part of the record. that mayor adams you are now recognize testimony thank you for coming. >> turn on your mic. >> thank you, thank you very much. again i want to thank you madam chairwoman. for the invitation to testify today. i also want to thank all the members of the house committee on oversight and reform. members are from york congressional delegation and everyone who has testified today. especially those who have so bravely shared their stories of losing a loved ones to gun violence. i was particularly touched by hearing the husband and wife who lost their baby girl, as a father with the one son it was extremely impactful to all of us. : : it is high noon in america, a country i love, the clock is ticking everyday, admitted toward another hour of death. i'm here today to ask every one of you and everyone in congress to stand with all of us to end gun violence and protect lives of americans here facing a crisis killing more americans than war, a crisis that now the number one cause of death for our young people, a crisis flooding our cities with illegal guns and we can take them off the street. the new york city police department has taken over 300011 guns off the streets, but the guns keep coming. it's a crisis that transcends party lines and affects both rural and urban communities. i know this firsthand as cochair of every towns nonpartisan coalition on mayors against illegal guns no matter our party affiliation we are united in our omission to stop crime, save lives and bring an end to gun violence because this isn't about blue versus red, it's about right versus wrong. whether it's on the street wearing a badge or in these chambers taking a vote we must stand for what is right. first we need congress to take the handcuffs off the bureau of alcohol, tobacco, firearms and explosives known as atf and let them do their jobs. that means confirming president biden's nominee as soon as possible. we must work together to damn all the rivers that lead to the sea of violence. common sense gun reform must become the law of the land. i'm pleased today the house will vote on hr 79 protecting our kids act and merge with passage of the gun violence prevention package for consideration in the city. i urge senate to pass hr eight, bipartisan background checks active 2021 and hr 1446, enhanced background checks act of 2021. these are bipartisan gun safety bills that will make our cities and people safer, i stand with president joe biden calling on congress to act now to regulate or ban assault weapons in this country even if we only raise the age required to buy one of these weapons, lives will be saved. we need congress to direct federal aid to localities and support not just law enforcement and violence prevention but also access to high-quality healthcare, childcare, education and housing. we must build a society while you only pass to fulfillment, not a road to ruin. my greatest responsibly is protecting the lives and safety of the people of new york city. this is my calling, my duty and my life's work. i did as a police officer in a uniform and wearing a badge and i do it now as elected leader of our american city but i need your help to further protect our people and save lives, the time is now, high noon in america. >> thank you. mr. jackson, will recognize for your testimony, mr. jackson. >> thank you the committee for inviting me on this important topic. my name is greg, executive director for the community justice action fund, the only national nonviolent advocacy organization led by survivor of color but i'm not here by choice, i'm hereby circumstance. in 2013, miles from the chamber, i was shot as an innocent bystander while i was simply walking home. when i arrived, i wasn't welcomed with nurses and surgeons, i was met with investigators who questioned me as a suspect first and patient second. i spent 21 days in the hospital, six months learning how to walk again what was most terrifying and tragic was when i turned on the tv, i was watching members of congress have the same debate we are having right now. that was nine years ago. every year over 110,000 people are shot or killed by gun violence. that means nearly a million lives have been directly stated i laid in the hospital, but that television and watched members of this chamber debate this topic. most of the stories of those impacted by gun violence like mine will never make the headlines. 2 miles from here the kyle wilson was shot, ten years old going to get ice cream. perrone brown, he hosted his own stop the violence event in this neighborhood was shot down the same summer and killed in front of a mcdonald's. pamela thomas here in d.c. so afraid of gun violence in the community she wrote her own eulogy to be shot by a stray bullet in front of her son. these are not stats, these are stories of real people, real people dying in our street every single day. every day 110 americans are killed with guns and 200 are shot or wounded and we've talked about this being the number one cause of death for all you, car accidents, drug overdoses and covid-19 but amid the pandemic we seen a 35% increase in homicide and still remains the number one cause of death of black men, number two cause of death latino men and number two cause of death of black women. we are here because we cannot and must not hide from the harsh truth, gun violence destroying communities around the country and every day families experience firsthand the devastation gunfire brings, to eliminate nonviolence we must swiftly recognize this is a public health crisis that deserves public health response. community justice we address gun violence focusing on those most impacted by the crisis and we urge congress to invest in community-based solutions we know can address those risk factors, that can reduce factors of those impacted by gun violence but also address root causes but we strongly also urge any supply-side approach not only focus on the shooter but the supplier and source of firearms flooding into our communities. moment of crisis congress has proven to be as resilient of the american people to take action. when coronavirus struck our country, congress authorized bipartisan legislation to provide resources and regulations to save lives. when ukraine was in crisis, congress frank to action and mobilized bipartisan authorization to authorize immediate aid, economic investment, mental health resources and other services to support those communities but i'm here to say we are in crisis in america today. each time we did the hard thing because it was the right thing to do and this crisis is no different. this crisis has taken away grandparents in buffalo, elementary kids in uvalde, fathers in chicago, mothers in atlanta, nephews in chicago, even pastors in charleston. we are here still asking for action. there are three direct things we know can be done. first we must acknowledge as a public health crisis in combat it as such. second we must advanced common sense legislation that not only addresses the hardware but promote community-based solutions to end gun violence sent as the break act and lastly i urge you to create a select committee on the gun violence crisis to investigate health impacts of gun violence and disproportionate impact on black and brown communities across the country. now is the time to take action before another person loses their life, and before another child opens his last textbook, before another parent hugs their child for the last time and also before someone like me isn't alive to ask you to do so. thank you. >> thank you. your recognize for your testimony. >> good morning chairwoman maloney, making member comber and committee members. i appreciate the opportunity to offer testimony on behalf of the 3 million members of the national education association and all devoted educators who nurture and protect our students. ask the teacher with three decades of experience, i am frustrated, heartbroken, angry that this is where we are, 23 years after columbine. april 20, 1999, a middle school science teacher in pennsylvania for 23 years. no experience or training prepared me for the questions my middle level learners asked me as i join my fellow teachers and shock and disbelief of the carnage that ended the lives of 12 students and one teacher, the only thing that comforted us was the belief that this society would never let it happen again but the list continues to grow. virginia tech, sandy hook, marjory stoneman douglas now robb elementary. kids were celebrating the end of a successful school year. nineteen children and two teachers, it would be the last day of their life. these massacres occurring in suburban, urban and rural schools are not isolated incidents. tallying up the number of killed or wounded children does not begin to tell the full horrific story. camille, a student who survived sandy hook experienced severe panic attacks for years, she's one of the more than 311,000 students exposed to gun violence columbine. there, will likely endure for the rest of their lives. students across our country are writing goodbye notes. unfortunately there fear is rational. here in america we are 25 times more likely to die by guns and people in other developed nations so the question we must ask, is this who we are? is it? our country has experienced nearly 240 mass shootings in 2022 alone but that does not begin to capture the spoke of this. every day gun violence kills 111 people. that means we can expect 22,021,505 more deaths by guns this year. in action equals acceptance of the unacceptable. this is worse than black and latino communities, 70% of adults or their loved ones are victims of gun violence. the evidence is clear, where there are more guns, more people are killed by guns every single day. they failed to take action, ignore the majority of americans who want stricter gun laws, you till our children, protecting them matters last then protecting the status quo. high school teacher in arlington texas survived a workplace shooting in a corporate setting only to experience a school shooting himself and countless lockdowns. he's now leaving with these words. as much as i loved teaching, i can fully represent and protect my students. i'm not going to be the educator they need. enough with so-called solutions that do not address the problem. we cannot place enough armed guards at every school building in america to protect our babies, we cannot ask educators to carry weapons and wear body armor while teaching and nurturing our students because by the time someone has a military weapon, it's already too late. we need for our students more resources, not more revolvers. you can help to not only deal but to hope. past common sense gun control legislation so that not one more community is scattered and not one more angry parent like we heard today laser precious child to death. our children deserve to grow and thrive, to live into their brilliance. thank you for what i know you will do. >> thank you, commissioner. >> distinguished members of the committee, thank you for the opportunity for participating in today's hearing. i appear before you today in buffalo new york, it is my privilege to testify and we have of the mayor city chiefs association. we are here to discuss gun violence epidemic plaguing our nation. this hearing comes in the aftermath of multiple mass shootings of devastated communities throughout the country including my home city and buffalo. our communities are hurting and we must continue to support them. loved ones of the victims and our brave first responders, may 14, 2022 and 18-year-old white supremacist invaded our city and inflicted terror in a way never seen in buffalo's history illegally purchased military style weapon and body armor and spent months practicing his shooting skills. he entered the top supermarket and opened fire on civilians striking 13 and killing ten. he live streamed it with the go pro he had fixed to his helmet. repowered buffalo police officer aaron junior why promoted to lieutenant in the department highest honor, medal of honor was working top security that day. he was helping an elderly shopper with her groceries when the shooting began. he did his best to warn customers while in a completely defensive position, he engaged the shooter as he entered, hitting him with at least one shot. it's often said a good guy with a gun. a bad guy with a gun. aaron was a good guy and was no match for what he went up against, illegal ar-15, multiple high-capacity magazines. he had no chance. assault weapons like the ar group who are known for three things, how many rounds a fire, the speed at which they fire the amounts and body counts. this 18-year-old adult should never have been able to have access to the weapons he used to perpetrate this attack and loss need to be enacted to ensure it never happens again. buffalo police officers responded to tops and were able to take the shooter into custody within minutes. i have no doubt in my mind their swift response time handling the situation save lives. i'd like to publicly thank them and the rest of the buffalo police department for the heroism they showed that day. buffalo is known as a city of good neighbors, we are a resilient and culturally diverse community, we came together after this horrific tragedy and will continue to heal together. no city should have to go through this. it is time to make changes to assist this bleeding on the sidewalks every day. in 2018, and cca adopted a firearms policy that would help mitigate the threat of gun violence without infringing on the constitutional rights or weakening due process. these reforms include requiring universal background checks, strengthening mixed definitions and improving access to records supporting the use of extreme risk protection orders, aggressively prosecuting strong purchasers and prohibited protesters and banning assault weapons and high-capacity magazines. polling shows a majority of americans support these commonsense reforms in congress must act immediately to close loopholes in our current system and cap still allow easy access to military style weapons. the buffalo massacre, shooting in uvalde that took 21 lives including 19 children and mass shootings in laguna woods in tulsa of the situations that capture headlines. however, we must remember gun violence epidemic extends well beyond these events. in reality is shootings have become a daily occurrence in america city. emerging trends like those guns and guns modified with switches continued to pose a challenge for law enforcement. congress must update our loss to account for these new threats and carnage that accompanied them. it will be nearly impossible to address gun violence epidemic without first addressing underlying violent crime column. unfortunately proactive policing to strike down violent crime has become a luxury for many departments. law enforcement needs additional resources to bolster responsive violent crime. overall lack of accountability for violent offenders contributes to rise and guide violence. some major cities the azar not prosecuting serial firearm offenders and judges continue to release offenders on low or no bond. to address these challenges, congress must provide resources for u.s. attorneys offices to support additional federal prosecutions is appropriate. police chiefs seeing the horror of gun violence every day, members of congress share our solemn duty to protect the public, and cca will continue to call on elected representatives for politics and take necessary steps to address gun violence epidemic. your leadership is needed now more than ever. thank you. >> will recognize for your testimony. turn on your mike, please. >> good morning distinguished members of the subcommittee. i'm senior vice president for law and policy gun safety with the largest gun violence prevention organization in the country. i'm honored to be here today and grateful for the spotlight you are shining on america's gun violence crisis. once again we are reading. frequent public mass shootings terrorize the country and are uniquely un-american problem. mass shootings often focus the public's attention and grief and with good reason but they represent a small fraction of all gun deaths in this country which include homicide, suicide and unintentional shootings. every single day 110 americans are killed with a gun and 200 more are physically wounded. we estimate one half of all americans have been touched by gun violence either directly or someone they care for. in other words, we are a nation of gun violence survivors. to be clear, this burden is not born equally. we talk about children, guns are the leading cause of death for children and teens, people of color, black americans experienced ten times homicide of their white counterparts. we are in the middle of a serious public health crisis, one crying out for sensible gun policy solutions especially at the federal level. while gun deaths hit all-time highs, the current industry is breaking profit record year after year. gun industry fear to sell guns and believes mass shootings are great for gun sales. they are making money on these tragedies right now. when we talk about the shootings in uvalde and buffalo and the toll of gun violence on our children, when we talk about disproportionate impact of black americans and how gun violence caused taxpayers survivors families, employers and communities to $80 billion a year, we need to also talk about how $9 billion civilian firearms industry is shielded from scrutiny and accountability has led other industries to better safer practices. the gun industry for its part innovated not to make guns or us safer but make them more dangerous. more likely to evade regulation, more profitable. instead of designing firearms that can't be fired if stolen or make it easy for law enforcement to trade, gun makers traded modifications to mimic automatic fire. they created impossible to trace ghost guns that help circumvent background checks and designed ar-15 second be modified in minutes to bypass assault weapons law as we saw in buffalo. now in a crowded field gun manufacturers are trying to market increasingly brazen ways often touting deadliness of products glorifying, and attempting to appeal to younger and younger audience. finally let's not forget the industry has done almost nothing to take steps to prevent diversion of gun into the criminal market and gun traffickers. between 2015 -- 2020, over 1 million of the industries firearms recovered by law enforcement in connection to crime. more and more of these guns carry the signs that they were purchased with the intent to traffic or illegally use them yet the industries rarely held accountable. this committee investigation found a dealer in georgia where 10% of the guns sold ended up a crime scene, 10%. we wonder why it is so easy for criminals to get guns. why is no one holding the gun industry accountable for dangerous practices? in 2005, congress passed protection of lawful commerce in arms act which insulates the industry the most legal threat. again, the nra congress passed the minute, budget writer that supports limit sharing of data about guns used in crime which keeps the industry out of the conversation how criminals get armed. these laws have to go. in spite of these barriers, i am heartened looking private actors and legislatures, city halls, courts across the country are taking action to reveal the gun industry's role in gun violence in this committee's investigation into gun trafficking and recent letters to gun manufacturers. i hope you have the ceos appear here for testimony because america hears every day from the families who have lost loved ones to gun violence in our country deserves to hear from ceos profiting off their loss and pain thank you. >> thank you. your mike -- >> that of chairwoman -- >> we still can't hear you, turn your mike on, hold it closer -- >> is that better? >> it is not on. >> i will try to speak a little bit louder. adam chairwoman and it does the worst members of congress, my name is amy, i most legal fellow at the heritage foundation were my scholarship focuses on second amendment gun violence prevention. i've testified before various legislatures after several mass shootings, parkland, virginia beach, el paso and unfortunately, too many others. i hope to god this is the last time i ever have to testify before legislative body after mass shooting. i fear it won't be. i fear it won't be because the conversation has become predictable. unspeakably horrific event like uvalde or buffalo happened reflectively almost compulsively calls for congress to pass a host of gun control measures, law-abiding citizens. should anyone dare question the constitutionality, practicality or effectiveness of any of these policies, their opposition is immediately framed as callous obstructionism and legitimate concerns are brushed aside as and i quote, expulsion. any viable alternative or frivolous without so much as a passing thought to their usefulness. i will once again run through the problems, serious problems with proposed gun control measures, i hope you read my submission. semi automatic are the type of firearms least often used for gun violence, barrel shots don't make them more or less deadly in the context of mass shootings while these features can and do make a difference in the context of lawful self-defense or civilians which is why millions of americans own them. standard capacity magazines are commonly possessed by law-abiding citizens for law purposes, few rigorous studies on prohibitions have found evidence for their success lowering rates of gun violence are inconclusive at best. the context in which mass public shootings occur, hunter's magazine limits effectively useless at saving lives. eighteen to 20 -year-olds are legal adults otherwise the rights and duties of citizenship including the right to keep and bear arms. even if it were constitutionally appropriately to punish responsible young adults because of a handful of them commit atrocities, the vast majority of mass public shooters are 21 or older. i'll repeat the same viable alternatives far more effective in a far more immediate way, it details in written submission i hope you read. take violent crime seriously under existing federal laws and encourage state and local counterparts to do the same. authorized schools to shift over $100 billion in unused covered relief fund, physical security improvement, hiring of armed trained staff and licensed mental health professionals. promote responsible gun ownership without simultaneously imposing financial burdens on gun owners or hindering their ability to immediately respond to violent threats. invest in the nation's mental health infrastructure to combat the two thirds of gun deaths that are suicides and the list goes on. i am fully aware when you bear your child, you must policy discussions are irrelevant. it doesn't matter, it shouldn't matter to a fourth-grader hiding under her desk covering herself and her dead classmates blood whether the real problem here is a barrel shot or missed opportunities intervene along the way. what each should matter to you because you are the ones making the policy decisions. many of you are the ones implying a lot of victims would be alive today if it weren't for his pistol grip or background check pass. many of you are the same ones marking anybody for talking about doors when a single locked door in uvalde would likely have saved 21 lives in all of us walking here today into this building with limited public access points, one way locking security doors and a plethora of armed officers. what happened in uvalde and buffalo is horrific, horrifying, no one should ever have to experience that unfathomable trauma and i cannot begin to imagine what the families are going through right now. everybody with a soul has it shattered over acts like this and we've seen it shattered every time from columbine to parkland to uvalde, we did not somehow, it didn't get easier for us, we did not grow numb along the way to the reality of this. it's not as though our family members, we don't send our kids to school, it's not as though we don't shop in grocery stores or go to country music festivals or work in hospitals, as though we don't also feel the tremendous horrible tragedy somewhere deep inside our souls because we do. we've opposed the policies precisely because the lives of these victims matter, because the grief of their loved one is real, we want thriving communities with families flourishing, burying their children. the opposition has always been and is still a genuine concern these policies suffer from serious constitutional and practical defects that they will not have the impact to promise the people they will. we always propose alternatives that would be more effective and less constitutionally suspect but we have rarely been met with open ears and i hope for the nation's psaki that today is different because i would love to never testify after a mass shooting again. thank you. >> i think all of you for your important testimony. i recognize myself now for questions. as a mother, it's fine to hard to find words to express grief and outrage i feel and others feel listening to the stories from witnesses today. no child should be cut down by a gun. lexi rubio should have been able to grow up, live her dreams, become a lawyer, major in math, visit australia. 11-year-old mia should not have been forced to cower in fear as she watched her teachers and friends be massacred. the close-knit vibrant jefferson avenue immunity and buffalo, many of whom came today to stand with us should not be forced to reckon with violent deaths of friends and loved ones gunned down by a racist with an assault weapon. we are in a crisis but not powerless. congress just needs to find the courage to act and i hope you find it today when we pass on sensible and vote on sensible reform bills. let's start with assault weapons. the shooters in uvalde and buffalo were too young to buy alcohol but they were both purchased assault weapons legally. ms. pringle, as an educator, your organization represents millions of teachers, some of the room witnessed horrific gun violence, some have been murdered and its aftermath. would banning assault weapons save the lives of teachers and students? >> it absolutely would. >> there are many other common sense steps we can take, we can strengthen background checks, raise minimum wage, age to buy a gun, require waiting periods, commissioner, you are on the front lines of gun violence every day and buffalo, would these commonsense measures save the lives of police officers and others in your community? >> absolutely would. >> they are adams, new york city has adopted many gun safety measures and you have moved quickly to take further action but guns from other states with lax gun laws keep flowing into new york's, why is it so important we passed federal gun safety law? >> as we indicated, we moved 3000 guns off our streets. in addition to that, we witnessed over to 40% increase in what's called ghost guns. if we don't have combined effort with the intervention, items put in place and stop the flow, the guns we are witnessing are purchased or stolen from outside our state. one gun in particular, a suspect was found with a gun stolen in july 27, 2020 used in six acts of violence, individual cases, individuals shoot into a random crowd, the gun found its way on the streets of new york so it's more than what we do locally, we need assistance with the department of federal government to stop the flow of guns in our cities. >> other countries have taken common sense steps to keep guns from criminals and they have succeeded saving countless lives. we stand alone in the world with the number of mass shootings and deaths from guns. as you can see in this chart, the american people overwhelmingly support gun safety reform. in your view, why has congress failed to adopt commonsense measures most americans and most countries in the world have adopted? >> to put it bluntly, the gun lobby has an obstacle in this country, oftentimes, you've heard it already today, the second minute is used as a reason not to advance common sense gun reforms even while the court has not said the forms you are proposing would violate the opposite, courts have upheld over and over again so the lobby, what it sees as his job to make one's grandma one step closer to confiscation which is a lie. conspiracies abound about government coming to take your guns and it gets into the head of well-meaning lawmakers who are afraid that people will believe the myths are true. they are not true, we can do it an awful lot to save american lives by passing these laws. >> we have lost too many lives to gun violence, it is long past time for congress to act. i now recognize the gentleman from georgia, mr. clyde. >> thank you, chairwoman maloney. we can highlight the need for additional suit school security to protect our children. i joined the nation in mourning for the 19 children and two adults who senselessly lost their lives due to an evil act committed about two weeks ago. every loss of life is a tragedy, no one should weaponize or politicize a.asked to punish law-abiding citizens. almost 250 years since the founding of our nation, countless hundreds of thousands of men and women have sacrificed their lives to provide the freedoms we enjoy today. those freedoms were bought at a very high price and must be guarded continuously to be passed on to future generations. if we allow emotion to drive our action, actions that have constitutional, constitution altering consequences, we will destroy the very foundation of our country and break faith those who gave everything that we would be free. you will need to do not constitute an constitutional rights, is the other way around. constitutional rights of the ones that transcend evil deeds but occurred in uvalde and others like sandy hook and parkland, nothing short of heartbreaking tragedies and evil deeds heartbreaking evil the loss of innocent lives but also because from what i've seen in the news about uvalde, i believe it was mostly preventable. we don't know the facts yet because the investigation is still ongoing but i hope this hearing is truly looking for legitimate fentanyl and effective answers and not just left-wing talking points to fill, to do anything mentality i've heard from the biden administration. white house press secretary said tuesday may 31 president biden is an interested pursuing tighter security in schools in the aftermath of the uvalde tragedy and i know there's been conversation about parking schools, that is not something he believes in. one of the things i've learned during my three overseas tours of military combat was the harder the target you are, the less likely you will be engaged by the enemy. it's a proven fact and common sense that applies across multiple aspects of life. for that to not be a part of the administration's focus shows how seriously out of touch democrat readership is with the reality. i want to echo the remarks from the previous panel, schools should be hard targets. violent criminals should never ever have been able to gain access to the inside of the schools schools across the nation should in the sensible security measures like keeping doors locked, single entry, better security technology and a volunteer force of well-trained army staff in addition to school resource officer. where school staff person has additional responsibly they should receive additional competition. retired military officer from my district, army colonel sent an e-mail a few days ago and i want to read a short section, i am convinced the single most effective method to illuminate school shootings is to take away all the signs that the clear schools are gun free zones and do away with laws that require such postings. replace them with signs using these words or similar -- we love our children and will do anything to protect them. accordingly select the teachers and staff are armed and trained to protect our children. proceed at your own peril, he will be stopped. the rationale for this change in policy is quite simple -- gun free signs, gun free zone signs don't protect anyone, they take away law-abiding citizens capability to be a force helping protect the children and they protect the would be shooter because they believe they will be unopposed. june 1950 through 2019, 94% of mass shootings occurred in gun free zones. if would be school shooters doesn't know who's armed or who's not, they likely move to a more vulnerable target. most potential school shooters are cowards at heart, they do not want to face a challenge to what they're trying to do, they want to be controlled with no opposition, they do not like to be confronted by someone would face off against them because the confrontation would preclude school shooter want to be from being able to take unopposed action. those who say teachers or staff will likely not take up arms to protect their students, i say they will. there have been too many documented cases were teachers heroically have given their lives to protect the students, it's time to give them the tools and help them protect those children so they have a fighting chance to survive an encounter with someone who's bent on harming them. for the record, if someone is intent on harming someone else they will use whatever is available to do the job at a hammer, knife or whatever. there's a lot of insight in the work of his army little and he knows the difference between a hard target and soft easy target and he knows the advantage of the difference. you were involved in heritage foundation school safety initiative which is developed of the the 2018 parkland shooting, correct? >> yes or. >> in your opinion, what you believe should be done to secure our schools from violent criminals to ensure our students have a safe place to learn? >> as i mentioned in my testimony and my written commission, there are several avenues that can be taken including physical security improvements. it's become popular to mock people for talking about doors and those things but these are basic security components of the rest of our everyday lives. loosing apartment complexes in the building we walked in today and corporate buildings we walk into any given day. in terms of having a quicker on response, i think schools should have the flexibility to decide how that happens. if you look in my written commitment, from the last couple of years there are a good number of examples, i didn't want the footnote to be 12 pages, armed responses saving lives from resource officers including one case from an armed staff member who stopped a kidnapping and prevented an armed individual from entering the school where other children were and i think the key component is not to put security but also plenty of witnesses mentioned having adequate mental health resources and we are not talking about leaving mental illness but when you look at one, what -- >> judgments time has expired. >> i and by saying looking at all professionals in schools. >> thank you, i yield back. >> the gentleman from massachusetts is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you for holding this hearing, i want to think this panel and distinguished witnesses, thank you for coming to help us with our work and i want to thank the previous panel, families of the victims who had the courage and selfishness despite their pain, to come here with the sole purpose preventing other families from suffering a similar loss so i think them. madam chair, i would like to ask unanimous consent to submit to the record report and analysis conducted by alicia -- over at the new york times, and analysis of 106 mass shootings since columbine in this country and i want to read an excerpt that describes best with a pound. to quote, if the key gun control proposals considered in congress have been lost since 1999, four gunmen younger than 21 would have been blocked from legally buying the rifles they used in the mass shooting. at least four other assailants would have been subject to required background check instead of slipping through a loophole. ten others might have been unable to steal weapons because of efforts required to encourage safer gun storage. twenty individuals may not have been allowed to legally purchase large capacity magazines they used to upgrade their guns, helping them to kill on average 16 people each. taken together, those four measures might have changed the course of at least 35 of those 106 mass shootings, a third of such episodes in the u.s. from the columbine high school in colorado. that new york times analysis has found. those 35 shootings killed 446 americans. there's been referrals made, references made to the fact that someone could cause damage with a hammer or a knife. i would wonder if you could talk about ar-15 firearms and ammunition and how different they are and greater vulnerability it creates in society. i've know you've written on this in the past. just to educate people not familiar with that type of weapon. >> this type of weapon that arrived from military style -- military weapon presenting increased risk as i believe the commissioner said earlier because of their speed a bullet, handling, their ability to accept high capacity magazines and they are designed and advertised to be able to inflict mass amount of damage in a short period of time. they are also unique in the damage done to the human body when you use one of these. a handgun even at a larger caliber want to damage to human to search tissue, i'm not a physician but you heard from one who described in great detail what a semi automatic rifle with multiple rounds can do so these are unique threats, there's a reason they are used in mass shootings because the shooters want to inflict maximum damage. >> i do want to add a quote from a trauma surgeon at the university of arizona who agrees with your assessment, he says the damage for the ar-15 on the body what looks like a grenade went off in their. i am so sorrowful for the loss of lexi rubio and so many others and so many we've heard in previous mass shootings. i will support the package of restrictions we will consider in the next couple of days here in congress to restrict the use of assault weapons and high-capacity magazines and i'll vote for background checks that i think are necessary. i respect my colleagues rights to defend the second amendment but i will note when defending the second amendment you have to go to military experts battlefield commanders for advice on how to protect our kids while in school, we've got a problem. we've got a problem. think about that, you're going to military battlefield commanders, combat veterans for advice on how to protect our kids sitting in school trying to learn. i urge my colleagues to think hard on this and consider supporting the package of bills before congress this week, thank you and i yield back. >> the gentleman from texas is now recognized. >> thank you very much and i want to thank the gentleman from took kentucky, ranking member for what i think is an opportunity for us to handle what is a difficult circumstance. i am a texan and i was about some 100 miles from uvalde, i know uvalde very well, i spent a good bit of time in san antonio growing up. as soon as i heard about what happened, i went about convening ten counties worth of superintendents, mayors, county judges, law enforcement, sheriffs, deputy sheriffs, school resource officers, i did not sit back and wait to find out what the hearing might develop, i didn't wait to find out what someone else thinks is a good idea. i tend to think back home people have the best answers. i say it different, i think texans have answers, protective problems. i do not want to chastise anybody today, i want to thank each of our people who have showed up not only from buffalo but new york city and others who have taken time to be here today. i do not wish to challenge anybody that i would like to enter into the record an article from the christian science monitor weekly june 11 and also an article that i provided to you from 538, a website they present information. for the panel, 538 article said we've known how to perfect, event a school shooting for more than 20 years. >> without objection. >> thank you, madam chairman. in fact as i went about looking at this which i had not previously, i did a good bit of review myself and found out there is the national center for school safety at the university of michigan in the school of public health. they state this before and still, the information we do have access to, these studies seem to say that by developing a positive school climate by educating students on how to say something and speak up or find a trusted adult is having a positive effect not just on attitudes but also self efficiency, something we need to approach as we talk about behavior. we learned that my meeting i had in waco texas that this is not a decision shooters by and large make judgment. they go about this planning effort and plan their school shootings out. they happen to people who have become isolated in school, picked on and made fun of, bullied and these people go into by and large, polls were they are not able to effectively balance their lives. this is a public issue problem in our schools of mental health issues. i go to schools probably every two weeks. my observations of publicly stated that i've seen our schools there are a lot of children, young adults who are tested in ways where i think they are reaching out for help. i think one of the things we should go to is looking at the studies out here and i would hope schools and experts on these panels today including you, chief and you, mayor what include studies and go back to the schools and let's identify the schools where there is something they can make better, the article says they work and projects in progress and it talks about how talking to students everyday when i grew up, we would recite the pledge of allegiance to the flag taking a few minutes and i know we've heard testimony everything about america is racist but i think in our classrooms we need to talk about our nations, our rights and responsibly's but take time every day to be nice to each other leaving notes, knowing each other and listening to people to emanate and identify and people who have problems. it is my hope madame chairwoman and ranking member, instead of taking to for immediate action we would listen to you and other experts. i would like to see if we would call justin hines, director of national center for school safety assistant professor of the university michigan school public health, i believe we need professionals who have studied these things, i say this is an opportunity, i want to thank you, we want to listen to and i hope you will hear us back. she may god bless the people of uvalde texas struggling for this in our nation. i yield back my time. >> the gentleman yields back. the gentleman from illinois is recognized. >> thank you madam chair. i was born in india and immigrated first to buffalo, new york so the fact you said it's the city of good neighbors poignant for any. i am sorry for the loss of all those lives in buffalo. the shooter in uvalde use what's called daniel defense these seven rifle, a style of ar-15 rifle. it markets the rifle as a perfect rifle for everybody. this particular picture comes from their twitter account may 16, 2022. commissioner, consult the leading cause of death among young people 24 and under. guns kill far more kids than cigarettes but we don't let cigarette companies market to children. he don't think it's appropriate for daniel defense or any manufacturer to market ar-15 style rifles or handguns or any other weapons to children, correct? >> i think the picture behind you is very disturbing is what it is and i don't believe that should be the case. >> why do you find it disturbing? >> how many children in our country because of lack of safe storage on weapons have either accidentally taken their own lives or somebody else in the household or another friend within the house there visiting? is disturbing. >> shortly after the daniel defense rifle was used in the uvalde shooting, this picture was taken down from their twitter account and their twitter account was made private. i think they had second thoughts about advertising this manner as well. in 2019 while testifying before the house judiciary committee you went viral in a viral video talking about the lethality of ar-15's. you said your mother struggled to hit a stationary target from 6 yards out under ideal conditions and pick up an ar-15 and i watched my mother put a fist size grouping of lead in the center target 20 yards out. when accuracy and stopping power matter, they are simply better. you said that, correct? >> i did. >> this is a picture of the 19 children and two teachers who died in uvalde. he mentioned ar-15 stopping power but i've got to believe these little children were not the ones you are talking about stopping, correct? >> no, i was talking talking about sparking stopping the individual -- a bunch of law enforcement officers with an ar-15. >> your mike is not on -- [inaudible] >> i can hear you, it is good. [inaudible] ... it wasn't these children that you were talking about stopping obviously. >> no, preferring to individuals like the one who went into that building and spent 78 minutes shooting them. i hope as was the case and uvalde the people that show up to stop shooters like that have the ar-15 precisely for stopping power for that's exactly what happened in uvalde. in the copley routinely against. [inaudible] >> he legally purchases air 15 rifle correct? in this particular case the shooter had legally purchases ar-15 rifle was able to stop and obviously in these lives forever. >> i want to address you again commissioner. guns are often billed as essential to maintain the freedoms we enjoy in america. they are an iconic part of america to a lot of people. but cars have long been central to american life's as well and what we have seen interestingly is that here is a picture of traffic deaths versus deaths from firearms but at one time traffic deaths far exceeded firearms in 1950. but over time traffic deaths have gone down while firearm deaths have remained relatively constant. now of course with the rights to bear arms that is in the constitution. it is not an absolute right. does but we outlawed machine guns and we regulate firearms in other ways. with regards to traffic deaths and cars the imposition of rules and regulation and laws along with private industry adopting safer ways to drive and devices to make them safer have led to a reduction in traffic deaths. the same cannot be said for firearms isn't that right? >> i believe you are correct. looking at the traffic deaths going down vehicle safety, airbags, speed enforcement have led to safer roads. >> what would that lead you to believe in regards to firearms? >> insensible regulations to limit the carnage that is happening on our streets request thank you commissioner. >> thank you. gentle lady from north carolina is recognized for her for five minutes of questioning per. >> thank you, mr. chairman. the horrific and heartbreaking tragedies that occurred in uvalde has shaken the nation. we are all made in god's image and i continue to pray for our society, for the families and the men and women and children who were senselessly murdered. we must be thoughtful in how we discuss and address this issue. when the federal government acts and haste the room for error is exponentially compounded by this problem should be diagnosed in its entirety before we endeavor to place proposals on the table. the simple truth is top-down legislative actions from washington do not provide the states the due deference they deserve. the latitude of the states to make decisions that best suit their constituencies must be respected. the second amendment was intended to empower individuals and to shield them from the federal government exerting undue influence. unfortunately over time the underlying principle has been distorted and misconstrued by washington bureaucrats who simply want it stripped away from law-abiding citizens. this cannot be allowed to happen. i now yield the balance of my time to the gentleman from georgia mr. clyde who has a tremendous amount of experience with these issues. >> thank you very much virginia. i would like to ask, in your sworn testimony you say retired buffalo police officer aaron salter june his service weapon was no match for the military weapons and armor the perpetrator was equipped with. yet your buffalo police officers responded to top the minute after receiving the 911 call and were able to take the shooter into custody within one minute of arriving at the scene. that is impressive. that is very impressive your officers were able to do that. this a gentleman armed with an ar-15 style rifle is the buffalo officers standard service weapon? >> a glock 40 caliber per. >> a glock 40 caliber pistol so they respond with a glock 40 caliber pistol were able to abstain subdued this gentleman one minute? >> they were able to do it because as he exited the store he had the ar-15.up underneath his chin and then through what i thought was very calm de-escalation language he surrendered his weapon and put it down had he pointed at the officers we think we would've had a different scenario there. >> okay that 40 caliber weapon is completely capable of stopping somebody with an ar-15, correct? military cell body armor tactical helmet on per he was shot at least one time that we had uncovered through our evidence and that had no effect on him. i also watch the video about the store surveillance video that is not been released in the go pro video that was downloaded which showed the confrontation. >> but the 40 caliber pistol the officers carry is plenty enough to stop an armed shooter, correct? it's all about shot placement isn't a question i get is and isn't. >> right thank you i appreciate that. >> actually have mass shootings or school shootings been carried out with other weapons other than ar-15's? >> yes congressman they have a. >> okay, what other weapons what is the primary weapon if you will? >> the primary weapon is actually handguns alone. another sort of a larger segment are several variations of firearms combinations of rifles and shotguns. and then a smaller percentage of rifles alone. what's okay thank you very much. so handguns are still very, very potent firearms. madame chairwoman, i would like to introduce this article into the record and i request unanimous consent it is a fox news article may the 28 , 22% at a west virginia pistol sheets kills medic graduation party, save several lives. >> without objection. >> are right thank you. you know, what happened in uvalde was an incredible tragedy. and it had a very terrible ending. but something very similar happened the very next day, that wednesday in charleston, west virginia. in a particular woman it west virginia fatally shot a man who had begun firing an ar-15 rifle into a crowd of thousands. the woman was attending a west virginia party for cheap drew her pistol and fired on the convicted felon pernod at the party was injured. and the gentleman obtained his weapon illegally. criminals will obtain their weapons however they want. they will get them illegally. more gun laws are not going to stop that. not in any way, shape, form because criminals simply do not obey the law. >> the woman's child has a chip time has expire because i like to ask permission to insert into the record in article y do something will not work for the wall street journal thursday june 2, 2022 thank you per. >> without objection. oxygen went from virginia mr. conley's now recognize her. >> i think the chair and i think being here today. i was a chairman of fairfax county when the virginia tech massacre occurred. at that point in american history that was the worst gun massacre in our history. i buried six young children, students that week, six. i am still in touch with many of the families years later. and the emptiness in their hearts and souls cannot be filled. it is a tragedy that lives with them forever. those children were killed by a mentally ill person who should not have had access to weapons but did. he was not a criminal, he was mentally ill. we hear excuse after excuse that gun laws don't work. the restaurant experience would suggest otherwise. after a series of massacres in backcountry australia adopted some strict gun laws. they did not have that massacres weekly that we do. it changed behavior. because it changed access to weapons and ammunition. we have heard the answer is arm our teachers that would be the solution. ms. pringle you deal with teachers with that be a good solution from your point of view? x absolutely not. the majority of our teachers and parents do not believe arming teachers prevent the carnage we have seen for over 23 years. i just want you to imagine, i was a middle school teacher. my responsibility was to ensure every student was nurtured and they could learn and come to school ready to learn every day. now the suggestion that i at the teacher would be responsible for carrying a weapon and making a split decision, a split moment decision whether i was going to shoot someone or not. whether that responsibility would be mine it to bear. that is a distraction from what we know we need to do in this country which is to pass comprehensive gun control laws. something we have never done in the short time we did ban assault weapons we sought that carnage go down didn't we? yes we did. but we never pass comprehensive gun legislation in his country would need to do it now. >> thank you, mayor adams welcome. mayor adams you are the mayor of i think the largest city in the united states. >> yes. >> a big good idea as mayor of that city producing crime in that city to our mart teachers and all your schools in new york city would that be a solution from your point of view? >> no i think the facts show that between 1996 in 2101 study found that police officers were three times more likely to die with a heavy flow of guns in their city. it is harmful to the law enforcement community. police commissioner, would arming teachers help your force? would it have made a difference in your community in buffalo? >> i think we have to be careful on is not militarize our schools and make students feel they are in a system where they are surrounded an institution where they are supposed to be learning. our safer buildings having a strong school resource program or school resource officer engaging with their students. we are building trust within our students. we have to caution against over weapon icing grow quickly ms. pringle's point could be a split sent judgment and absolute split section decision that are second-guessed for years on, thank you. it's recognized for five minutes, mr. heise. >> thank you madam chair. just for the record from what i can research and understand there are some 300,000 or so crimes committed every year of violent crimes in which guns are a part of the situation for there are between 500,003,000,000 incidences violent crimes from taking place. issues not gun violence weakness use guns and other means whenever they intend to harm individuals. and the answer to this situation when you have violent people the answer is not defunding the police. the answer is not pitting one group of americans against another which we see far too often these days. the answer is not ignoring the rule of law. the answer is not releasing criminals into our streets or allowing them into our country. i'm sending soft on crime those who commit violent crimes we've got to look at the problem which is violent people. at some point in this country we've got to recognize there is great value in upholding the rule of law. we have got to recognize and teach there is such a thing is moral absolutes. not the least of which is respecting one another. respecting life. embrace religious beliefs. there are risks. we all understand that. we have a moral and spiritual crisis in this country right now. that is reflected in violent people that we see more and more. it is impossible for us to have a system of government which we have in this country where we have a limited government and maximum freedom if we do not have a citizenry that is capable of self governing their own lives with an authentic understanding of right and wrong. and so for us to take out of the equation any mention of moral absolutes for the role described indispensable religion and morality we believe will have a mistake and all discussion. these things cannot be ignored. mayor adams, let me real quickly begin with you and if we can go quickly new york city is certainly of gun restrictions and gun restrictive measures in the united states yes or no? your mike was off too. >> yes. >> and we all note new york is continued in recent years to see a rise in crime yes or no? >> yes very. >> in january this year of a press statement regarding blueprint and gun violence from new york city. you had and that a quote that says the support is illegal to carry a gun in our city. at police officers take them off the streets every day in record numbers. you made that statement, correct? >> many come from georgia. in a city that has the greatest among the greatest gun restriction laws rise and crime and guns being carried off the streets in record numbers every day. it does not appear the attempts that are produced by the gun restrictions are having any effective keeping bad people from getting guns. and taking the constitutional rights away from american citizens only helps criminals is what i am getting too. and let me come to you, if we continue down this path of restricting gun rights for american citizens making it easier for targets knowing there will not be guns by illegal citizens they are there to defend themselves. what kind of impact will that have in the long run? can we put a pause? >> use your neighbors mike. >> maybe that will work better. >> my apologies until the issue have been taken care of. congressman cheer answer your conversation. we look at the and the slate criminals operate. obviously did not to cry confront similar within firearm anymore then we would want to we were rational actors. you mentioned statistic on gun usage. i would also note how much lower it is considering there are a number of states do not allow ordinary law-abiding citizens to protect themselves with firearms in public and make it far more difficult for individuals to keep and bear arms even inside their own homes. that could be considerably higher under different circumstances. appreciate pointing that out. again there rational actors to pretend otherwise is borderline silly. >> the gentleman's time has expired. >> thank you madam chair. >> the gentleman from maryland mr. raskin is now recognized very. >> sandy hook, tree of life, mother emmanuel church, el paso, walmart, pulsed like a club, las vegas, columbine the bloodbath. the history of our species human sacrifice include the sacrifice of children. the incas, the aztecs on such a society that accepts the sacrifice of innocence? gun violence is the number one cause of death of children in the united states of america today. which makes us globally unique. of other industrialized nations like franks, the united kingdom, israel, norway, sweden, japan. no other nation comes close to what we see here. even though we have comparable levels of mental health problems and mental illness. but we continue to accept the slaughtered innocence including innocent children as acceptable collateral damage for loyalty to a completely bogus and distorted misreading of the second amendment and what the supreme court has said about it? justice scalia was emphatic that reasonable gun safety regulation is perfectly consistent with the second amendment right. justice scalia said specifically rejected be advanced by number of colleagues today. saying the right of gun ownership is not unlimited. scalia stated the second amendment right is quote not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose. he enumerated a partial list of other regulations the possession of firearms by felons, the mentally ill and other dangerous people. laws forbidding the carrying of firearms into schools and government buildings and other public places. laws imposing the conditions and qualifications on the sale of firearms. such as background checks. all are perfectly consistent with the second amendment rights. demonstrate the loud speaker system for the white house at 2:00 a.m. in the morning and keep the presidents family up we expect reasonable time with respect to alright. now, our colleagues invite us to believe the second amendment is some kind of policy straitjacket. they will not read or quote the decision by justice scalia himself who wrote the most elaborate defense of the majority's view of the second amendment and d.c. versus heller in 2008. in 2005, congress gave the gun industry on precedented and unique immunity for civil lawsuits for crimes committed with their product. no other industry has gotten anything like that but could you understand what that immunity protection means for the gun industry and how it has blocked commonsense laws to end gun violence in our country? >> yes congressman thank you. the law which you cite has given their blanket immunity to the gun industry. the result has a profound impact on what we know but the gun industry role in gun violence as well as any capability for the industry. axa lead to litigation that would have exposed truths like what happened with the tobacco industry or the only automobile industry, safety practices would have improved at these manufacturers because there was a risk of doing nothing simply does not exist for the gun industry. but what reckless marketing and sales practices is the gun industry engaged in because of this blanket of immunity that has been bestowed upon them? >> there are several. the marketing is getting increasingly reckless, increasingly desperate as a field gets more crowded. but also in terms of distribution practices. i heard several times today about how easy it is for criminals to get guns as if that is some active magic. these are all started with gun manufacturers and gun sellers. they are fueling gun shops selling disproportionally into illegal markets. we are following the law by the numbers speak for themselves. >> okay what do you make of this claim which none of got laws governing background check because criminals don't follow the law present an argument against having any law against murder, rape, cell because criminals by definition don't follow the law? >> the gentleman's time is expired but the gentleman answer. >> universal background check is a simple process of those who want to legally obtain guns with the constitutional rights to obtain those guns are not going to follow that the more guns we keep flooding and without background checks, without proper adherence to get those guns are flooding the market so criminals can obtain those guns by. >> justice scalia rex the jonas time is expired the general from texas is now recognized. >> thank you madam chair. all sorts of topics for all sorts of reasons but sometimes for political reasons or even worse sometimes her political theater aimed at obtaining local currency that will then be spent in winning upcoming election. other times hearings are held to actually solve a problem. you're here because the treasures in buffalo the horrific loss of life my home state of texas and you've all day. it is a beautiful american community ripped apart by a troubled and evil coward. children of the victims it's natural to want to assess and focus blame. i'm heartbroken and i am furious. those innocent children are gone and the indescribable suffering of the families is beyond words. her presence has continually he must do something we must do something and democrats will keep our children safer senseless a tragedy like this happens we were not the constitution. some people want to blame an entire political party is the only one to blame. when the president many democrats supply is the culprit, the more guns in america up the argument the more dangerous america becomes. 1915 about 50 years is 180 million firearms in this country today is about double got up murder rate back then was 9.6 per 100,000 the murder rate right now is five in 201,980 way it was five per 100,000 twice a number of guns and yet the murder it was cut happy the truth is guns have always been readily available in this country. nonexistent or extremely rare and grisly phenomenon. so what has changed in the last 50 years? there's been a noticeable breakdown of the families been erosion of faith and a seismic drop in social interactions in large measure due to the overuse of the smart phone and the proliferation of social media are better described as antisocial media. senseless monsoons are not committed by well-adjusted socially polished people they are committed by disturbed on stable. [inaudible] >> madame check i get my time back? thank you. thank you. senseless mass shootings are committed by unstable disturbed loners with mental disease refusing to address better mental health services, especially for young people is to do a disservice at best and it is a dereliction of duty at were spirits focus sadly by the democrats is to restrict guns or prohibit their legal possession entirely. democratic member of congress and the committee hearing just regionally said and i quote we will not rest until we have taken weapons of war out of circulation and our communities. so, do restrictive gun laws and prohibition work? the most dangerous nations on the planet according to the world back in the unr el salvador, jamaica, venezuela and honduras. what else do they have in common question look at some still impossible for an average citizen to own a firearm and that they are terribly perilous places to be. believe it or not some democratic-controlled cities in a country with restrictive gun laws are even more dangerous than the aforementioned countries. st. louis is a higher murder rate than el salvador. ultimo does as well and detroit is a more lethal place to go and visit or live then venezuela. so just passing prohibition it simply doesn't work doing something doesn't work doing something effective as a path we should and must taper in history has shown us and you disarm law-abiding citizens you create that not more safety but more peril. the inconvenient truth for some on this committee and in this chamber is that more firearms in the hands of law-abiding citizens make us all safer. let's talk some real solutions but we must harden our schools with controlled access single point of entry with a tiered entry procedures for the main office should look at directly by the front door which is single access enter. classroom doors should automatic was shut and lock like hotel room doors do. support and foster a robust school marshal program qualified and volunteer teachers and staff go through proper training to be armed on campus but let's increase the number of sros in our schools. let's leverage technology for putting cameras in schools much like frisco, texas did 15 years ago when i was on the city council. and that a command center in a mobile command center. any threat could be immediately detected, tracked and eliminated forth with probity to rapid response plan rapid response plans to be trained world-class standards. and also law enforcement doctrine must a change so when there is a threat the schools are not besieged but rather our heroes and blue advance, use home techniques and teamwork and technology eliminate the threat as soon as possible. our goal should be to protect our children. no parent, educator, citizen, legislature or nation has a higher calling let's look at real and effective solutions and shelve the divisive rhetoric because american children deserve nothing less, thinking that ensure the yield back. >> thank you, the gentleman from california is now recognized. x thank you madam chair. like so many on this committee and i was deeply moved not as a politician but a father by the testimony this morning of the families of victims. kimberly rubio lost her precious daughter lexi, cut through all the talking points, all the debate and asked the central question before our congress and our country. as she put it, what do we value more? children are our guns? it is really that simple. we want to talk about the common sense reforms on guns of silicon valley i also have a duty to talk about some of the role of social media in this massacre. where the uvalde shooter on instagram having a group chat where there is conversation of school shootings where there is conversation of threats of violence he's bragging about getting assault weapons, why is there no action? these are minors he was a minor when he did this. it's not free speech rights. you think companies like instagram should have some responsibility in group chats when minors are involved in you have explicit discussion of school shootings to do something. >> the role of social media companies is an important one and you are right to point out congressman. instagram, facebook these are often where we see the earliest warning signs of a potential mass shooter as well as other social media platforms or instances are discussed. their multiple people in the chat i do want to mention respect to the buffalo shooter for instance he cited youtube for the videos that allowed him to modify detachable magazines to deadly effect social media companies do have a role to play here. >> just like my colleague mr. raskin said the right of the second amendment is not absolute it's important to recognize the right of first member is not absolute per under brandenburg you cannot have things that incite violence. there are greater protections for minors. it is crazy to me that you can have people under 18 talking about shootings and mass shootings and these companies are taking no action. you need to have a regulation they get to the heart of this. >> i am trying to understand your position and i just want to ask you simple yes or no questions to understand where you are coming from. is it your view that someone who has committed a violent felony should be able to purchase a gun? yes or no. >> is that your view someone who is a serial rapist should be able to purchase a gun yes or no question rick works very clearly no pay. >> is that your view of someone who was a drug traffickers should be able to purchase a gun? yes or no question. >> no these are becoming insulting. so you support any laws that make sure violent felons, serial rapist or people who are drug traffickers will not get access to guns question. >> if they are written and narrowly tailored to approach that issue without burdening the rights of law-abiding citizens or criminalizing low risk transfers which are responsible citizens, yes i'm more than willing to look at that wall. >> that is exactly what the background check spread right now which you have a case is that the background checks do not cover a lot of the sales to violent felons to serial rapist and i just want to be clear, when the republican party their position right now by opposing hr eight is they are for violent felons, serial rapist still being able to purchase these guns were. >> no they are not. >> yes they are big. >> no they're not. >> yes they are. then awad precooked and reclaiming my time. >> point of order madam chair. the position of a public its violent criminals be in jail. >> the position is. >> madam chair the gentleman is not state a valid point of order. >> the position hr eight at its core set is that violent felons are still getting these gun serial rapists are still getting this done. the law and order party that is demagogue the issue of law enforcement and policing that party is saying we are okay with the violent felon so getting these guns but we are okay with serial rapist still getting these guns. all of the congress the democratic side is trying to do is close those loopholes. >> i respectfully referring to my testimony on this very bill before the senate commission last year. [inaudible] [inaudible] >> i am saying. >> the gentleman's time is expired but. >> he kept interrupting me. >> the gentleman from pennsylvania is now recognized. >> i would first like to take a moment to thank all of our panel is for this panel in the previous panel for your testimony. we have seen some horrific acts in the commonwealth of pennsylvania. we saw devastating shooting in philadelphia on saturday. and i continued and we should all offer prayer for the families across the commonwealth of pennsylvania across the nation that have been affected by these acts committed by violent criminals. skyrocketing crime in our cities. that is what we need to focus on. new york city saw a 16-point to percent increase in violent criminals shooting others in march of 2022. that is up from a year before. san francisco saw 31% rise in homicides. in chicago violent criminals are responsible for shooting 47 people on memorial day weekend alone. there is a trend here. crime is rising in cities that have the most restrictive laws on firearms and have the least severe criminal enforcement penalties on the books. in fact cities that don't enforce that in the book sprayed cities in san francisco has dismissed over 40% of felony convictions since 2020. and in philadelphia homicides have increased 58% during district attorney larry krasner's tenure. however 20% of crimes shot another person since 2015 have led to criminal charges but less than one tenth of those incidents resulted in convictions. >> philadelphia police are making arrests of crimes and guns. has dismissed or withdrawn more violent cases every year he has been in office. the bottom line is when you fail to enforce the law and hold criminals accountable, you get criminal behavior. so how does failure to prosecute past or current crime affect crime rates in the future? >> certainly emboldens criminals and reasonably allows them to believe there's very little chance they will be punished or in any way held accountable for their crimes. >> many of the proposals we are discussing today is widely implemented across municipalities were crime spikes are happening. would limiting law-abiding citizens right to own a firearm curb these disturbing trends? >> no it would not. i would also point out the reality of that gun violence is not being treated by people who lawfully purchase and possess a firearm. this largely perpetrated by individuals with long histories of violence. who obtained their firearms already through illegal and illegitimate channels that are not addressed by universal background checks for their arty circumventing the law regarding this background checks. it's a very endeavor which 100% enforceable. >> what measures should be taken to ensure victims and their families are not legally ignored in favor of defendants? >> i would again refer to some my previous testimony nor term a short period previous testimony have given before the senate judiciary committee on gun violence in chicago but i think a lot of that is still applicable to your question. from a federal perspective as i said i continue to enforce federal laws and hold criminals accountable at eight federal level when accountable. in state and local counterparts. i assume they've done a terrific job of this. >> the folks i just have a question there's they called the nix system when you purchase a firearm i don't how may people in this room have gone through a background check, but does ask questions and it was brought up earlier about criminals to build a purchase guns but is it not already illegal for rapist and murderer's and people have done domestic violence and convicted of these things, isn't it already illegal for the to purchase firearms? >> to purchase and possess assuming they are felons that had their rights restored to them under existing state or federal process is no process under federal law. facts we are not sin criminal should have lazarus in criminal should be put in jail? and law-abiding citizens should be allowed to lawfully possess firearms? understanding what every member who is opposed hr eight is saying as well. >> the judgment yields back the gentleman from maryland is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you very much. there is a bold saying let's go back to where we started almost three hours ago at the beginning of this hearing. and talk a second about the pain i felt given firsthand the accounts of witnesses and victims from uvalde and from buffalo. listening to them i am still stunned and heartbroken. the gun carnage that continues in schools and supermarkets and movie theaters, and churches, on the streets of baltimore the streets all over this country, is a cost, ladies and gentlemen, that we all bear. whether we want to or not. the gun laws we hope will be passed today, i hope are seen as a beginning, not the end. only as a beginning. otherwise i really believe we are doomed in our fight against murderers and their guns and the evil and the pain that they spread. i want to acknowledge and thank the gentleman from louisiana from buffalo and the mayor of new york all of whom served and law enforcement and saw firsthand how difficult it is with the violence perpetrated by guns and particularly assault weapons. i would associate the remarks finally confirm a nominee. madame >> speaker, madam chair you remember 1994 we were members of this body we worked for a whole year, a whole year to put together and pass an assault weapons ban. the only reason it wasn't permanent is because they were not able to get enough people on the other side of the aisle and fortunately should go along with that. the compromise was a ten year ban on assault weapons which expired in 2004. i am just shocked 18 years has gone by in this body has not moved to reestablish. in 1999 as a president of the naacp i filed the suit against the gun industry. it took us three years to get to court. the nra did everything they could to keep her for not happening. and finally in 2003 i went to court and testified in brooklyn, new york for over a week. we did not have the weight we needed and the nra is a bigger force and we could deal with. the judge to his credit said there were certainly will be other lawsuits like this. the nra heard those words and took them to heart. spent the next 18 months putting in place an absolute immunity it's unbelievable will get absolute immunity to any industry in this country paid particularly when there is harm and personal injury. so i think more than anything else i was stunned a little while ago in hearing my colic on the other side of the aisle saying he had sought out advice from a military commander about how to protect schools and the advice was hardened the target. when you are asked to comment on that you said absently harden the target. while that is fine. except how do you harden a supermarket? how do you harden a church? how do you find a way to harden movie theaters? the only answer is hardening the target we already capitulated. and i tell you i'm so glad we found people focused on this hearing around the country they can see firsthand what is going on here. we have a problem that is not going to go away. every year it gets worse. and so until we are prepared to do what we are sworn constitutionally to do, to protect this country from enemies both foreign and domestic we would have failed. madam chair i yield back. >> the gentleman yields back in the gentleman from louisiana mrd mr. higgins by. >> thank you madam chair. get your presented statements are, you support confiscating guns from individuals determined to be a threat to themselves or others. determined to be my colleagues are putting forth my understanding of the letter of the law which i 1000% oppose as were our founding fathers the writer of that law says an anonymous tip from a citizen would shoot confiscate, it would go to your neighbors home and confiscate is a legally owned weapons a man that was not under a criminal investigation nor under arrest? would you do it? >> the red flag laws. >> that is a yes or no brothers got five minutes to make i don't have stable quick it's more than a yes or no answer. if you cannot say yes, it would confiscate weapons from an american citizen that was subject to this law that my colleagues intend to push through this congress and you said in your statement america was determined to be determined to be as defined by an anonymous tip at american citizen. you are a police commissioner thin blue line brothers sworn to uphold the constitution you are saying you'd seize those weapons? i said that is a problem going to bring us back in time to world war ii. america's population 140 million, 15 million american men came home from world war ii. they had deep scars and significant skills they board the invisible wounds of war. there were weapons everywhere. you want to talk about mental challenge. my father was one of those men those at navy flyer world war ii but he came back from the war and built this family. i'm the seventh of his eight children i was born in 1961. there were guns everywhere. there is virtually no regulation. we can meet any seller we did not have mass shootings. it wasn't until 1968 in america that serial numbers were even required on weapons sold. he ordered weapons to the sears catalog in the mail. seventys i attended school at virtually every vehicle in the park that was a pickup truck at almost everyone had a rifle or shotgun on the back glass of the pistol under the seat. we did not have school shootings. 1979 i began college. one of the jobs i had to work my way through college was as a carpenter. we stored historical buildings we had to determine and the process of that work what was the original cuts of these homes is residential homes built 75, 85, 100 years ago pretty detailed by the sawcut if it was a mechanical cut an electric cut or handcuffed. such observations we knew exactly how that house was originally built in to my amazement as a young man beginning college in louisiana, working to my amazement to know what i discovered madam chair question or action these houses did not have? they were built 100 years ago in cities in america, do know they did not have commissioner? locks. locks. now i ask you all what happened to that country? a country where homes were built in cities with no locks. a country where guns were everywhere and virtually not regulated at all. for millions of america's 14 million americans came back 11% of the population at the time with incredible skills of war and a weapons of war as you called them everywhere but we did not have mass shootings. and here we sit today there's an entire once proud democratic party is presenting unbelievable unconstitutional laws on behalf of a police commissioner who says he would go home madam chair i yield my speech but i will not yield my opposition to these unconstitutional laws. >> a gentlemen's time has expired the gentle lady from new york is recognized by. >> thank you madam chairwoman thank you to all of our witnesses here today. i apologize if i got quickly of got five minutes and a lot of work to do. let's talk facts here there's a lot of discussion about new york city. there's no discussion about new york gun violence without discussing the iron pipeline that is florida, georgia, south carolina north carolina 70% of illegal guns found in new york city come from. it is no discussion of gunboats in chicago without talking about indiana. because the violence mothers we have to convert are losing children, due to the guns and the carnage of the lawlessness unleased by those states. i move on every week on recent memory we have at least one mass shooting. mr. pringle you are the president of the national education association. you protect teachers. which in 2000 eyes in 2018, how many school shootings did the united states have? >> 288 too. >> 288. let's look globally our g-7 partner combined how many did those countries coming school shootings those countries have? >> five. an almost ten years. 288 versus five. this is not normal. not only is that not normal it is internationally embarrassing and de- legitimizing to the united states. for all of the billions and trillions this body authorizes the name of national security let's talk about why let's talk about one thing more important to lobbyists and the gun industry than children, and human beings is talk about process. in 202,022.8 guns were sold a 64% increase from 2018 correct? >> and one year across-the-board gun manufacturers is that right? >> that is correct. let's put that into context. 202020 again more than 45000 americans died by gunfire reflecting almost threefold increase from 2015 are the statistics correct? >> that is accurate by. >> in your view erasing a correlation between gun profits and gun deaths in the united states? >> yes by. >> this is blood but a pair 2019 and 20212 years leading gun manufacturers sought growth profits double to almost $280 million. factoring in earnings for the co called the historic ferocious and the future was bright. an air pistol ordered ten people a supermarket in boulder, colorado. those of profit margins $280 million. they go to lobbing is that correct? much that goes to lobbying is that correct? >> significant amounts go correct brickwork to nearby so the gun's lobby again so it deploys these resources? >> they aren't lobbying against every law that would regulate firearms. >> can you briefly tell us how gun companies have poured extra profits directly to lobbying against gun reform? as an advocate what have you seen? just rattle off some of the measures they have had just a few that brought lobbied against questioner. >> they've lobbied against background checks as mentioned earlier allowed for the would-be criminal to obtain a firearm from a law-abiding citizen without a background check the criminal will be breaking the law. but we could stop that they've lobbied against a red flag which would temporarily deprive after due process firearm from somebody who poses a threat to themselves or others as a court adjudication everything brickwork thank you, thank you very much. and for context, the nra spent about $250 million in 2020 alone. that is more than twice the entire salary of congress combined. in one year, lobbying against gun safety laws. there is also this discussion about anything but a gun with a violent people yet we aren't doing anything about addressing the actual root causes of misogyny were two thirds of mass shootings are connected to domestic violence. or the emergence of white supremacy and poverty the connections between that and mass shootings in our communities i yield my time thank you madam trevor. >> that gently times expire the gentleman from wisconsin is recognized for five minutes per. >> thank you very much for the last couple weeks i had a chance to get him to mexico and brought up an issue i was not really expecting to hear. a couple border patrol guys pointed out to me that firearms were very, very regulated in mexico. if you do a google search to find out recent article in the wall street journal came in the first six or nine months 2019 mexico had some wildly difficult laws and a murder rate of six times that of the united states, not 6% more not 60% more, but assuming he got it right maybe his cherry picking the year, six times as many murders as in the united states. i assume the mexican officials who put these laws in effect thought they were going to save lives at the time that they made it so difficult for law-abiding mexicans to get a hole of a firearm. but obviously the results of their laws was not to make mexico safer. there are thousands probably tens of thousands of people who have died now in mexico under the current rules connected to ownership of guns. we have also in this country had a dramatic increase in the number of deaths from guns. the last two years since kind of the beginning or at least expansion of the eye hate police movement which i blame for all of the young people and not so young people who have died in the last two years and this massive increase of murders that we have seen almost unprecedented. first of all i would like comment on a little bit on the statistic and comment on the dramatic increase in the number of homicides in this country in the last two years. not because it's easier to own guns but kind of because her rhetoric a lot of the rhetoric coming out of this building the anti- police rhetoric. >> congressman i will respond actually refrain from commenting on the statistics you point out from mexico. i am not overly familiar with the underlying causes. : : : calls to defined the police and loss of trust between communities and police members as i pointed out in my written submission but i think it's a number of things. >> this week i will be reintroducing the student and teacher safety act that will allow schools to use existing grants they have in part for improving school conditions and learning to improve or boost school safety on the uvalde shooting the white house press secretary said to president biden doesn't believe in hardening schools to provide more security resources or law enforcement officers. if these measures can be effective in preventing another shooting why do you think the president is not open to hardening schools this way? >> i cannot read the president's mind about my guess is he would rather focus on other ways of addressing it and i would also like to reference the something said it seems unfair we only care about the one aspect of the greater issue that is focusing on physical security. i don't know if you were not here for my statement or haven't read my submission but i pointed out roughly a dozen other issues as well. my reminder was -- >> the witness addressed me, madam chair. could you give me another few seconds? someone jumped in their. could you give us if president biden is going to stand between us and trying to improve the security of the school district, can you give us other ideas that can be used to prevent these tragedies? >> as they mentioned i think we can focus very clearly on building up the mental health infrastructure in the schools schoolseemed generally across te board. it plays into an aspect of mental health that is problematic and we are talking about mass shootings, individuals that show danger of being a -- danger to themselves or others and cannot be voluntarily committed to looking at targeted intervention with adequate means of due process and also behavioral risk assessment. we've talked about threats on instagram and what is concerning to me so many people solve a science and it appears that nobody reported to them or knew how to report them or didn't think anything would be done about it. >> the time is expired. >> the gentle lady from california is now recognized. >> in 2019 you testified on the bill the assault weapons ban before congress. at the 2019 hearing the representative asked you if law-abiding people will be less safe to protect themselves if the bill was passed. do you remember your response? >> i have a general idea but i would have said under that circumstance but i don't remember my specific work. >> you said and i quote i think worse than that you will see millions of otherwise law-abiding citizens become felons overnight for nothing more than having scary looking features on firearms. i was quite surprised by your answer. you read the bill before you came to congress to testify. >> if we are referring to the ban on assault weapons, yes. >> so you knew that it would allow any gun owner to maintain possession of any semi automatic assault weapon possessed before the bill became law. so that is the case under that bill. the problem is -- >> reclaiming my time. >> the time belongs to me. >> if you don't want to hear the answer -- >> the gentle lady has reclaimed her time. so you said yes in response that you knew the bill would allow the gun owner to maintain possession of any assault weapon possessed before the bill becomes law. i respect that we have different opinions on the representatives assault weapons law but we cannot have different facts. we have a duty to debate the merits of proposal. you falsely testified under oath -- >> would you like an explanation -- >> if she's going to ask questions, shouldn't she let the witness -- >> you falsely testified. >> point of order. >> i've been accused of falsely testifying under oath i would like to address it. >> the gentle lady has accused her of perjury. is she going to hold to that or are you going to allow the witness to respond to that accusation of criminal conduct? >> you've not come forth with a significant point of order. ms. porter will continue. i asked you if the bill was correct. if the bill would allow any gun owner to maintain possession and you said yes. you testify to the bill would allow people to become felons overnight. earlier today you testified that you hoped that this was the last time you testified before congress. for the sake of the nation and integrity of the congress -- >> after a mass shooting trying to figure out how to solve a problem we are heavily invested in solving -- >> point of order. reclaiming my time. how dare you misstate the law. >> you do not even want an answer. >> i am a lifelong consumer protection advocate. from 2015 to 2020 there were 2,000 to 70 unintentional shootings by children 765 of those children died. a consumer product that causes this much harm to the public would normally be subject to a recall that federal law prohibits the consumer product safety commission, the agency responsible for protecting the public from dangerous products from regulating guns. this is absurd. after one child died using a palatine treadmill last year the consumer product safety commission intervened and recalled the product but when hundreds of children die using guns, there is no federal response. there is no federal safety standard for guns. even though 40,000 americans hurt or kill themselves or other people and hundreds of accidents every year. instead of regulating like any other consumer product federal law protects gun manufacturers. a teenager can watch a video online and learn how to modify a rifle to make it more deadly and of the industry avoids any liability if that teenager uses that modified rifle to fire repeatedly and fire out innocent people even though the products could be designed to prevent unsafe modifications. i want to give you an example. in 2001 a 13-year-old boy accidentally shot his father's handgun and killed his friend. billy mistakenly thought the gun was unloaded because he had removed the gun's magazine. the family sued the gun manufacturers for failing to warn him and other consumers that the product could be fired without a magazine. a simple case should have been decided by a jury as is provided under the constitution. instead, because of the gun industry's immunity of the gun manufacturer was able to do dismissed the case without a trial. if a pharmaceutical company failed to warn customers about the no risks of one of the drugs they could face thousands of lawsuits but we allow the gun industry to sell weapons without taking any precautions to protect children and families from fatal accidents. do you think the gun industry would do more to protect children if congress ended their immunity? >> absolutely. >> would ending the immunity but the manufacturers out of business? >> know it would not. >> in the '90s, lawsuits forced big tobacco. last year big pharma agreed to pay 26 billion for communities devastated by opioids. gun violence also deserve their day in court and justice. i will yield back. >> madam chair, point of order. again, ms. porter accused a witness of perjury. that is a very serious accusation. >> the gentleman hasn't stated a proper -- it isn't a proper point of order. >> we just had -- accuse a witness of perjury. >> the gentleman isn't stating a point of order. the gentleman from texas is recognized. >> thank you all for being here and thank you, madam chair. obviously this is a tragedy that's heartbreaking for all of us and naturally coming out of this as we look for solutions it's the fact we see this in the nation there's going to be a thousand reasons why we are asking in the investigation is ongoing obviously some answers of course will never even the conclusions we could come up with will of course never answer the cry of a parent that has lost a child. i don't think any of us who have children can understand that. our hearts break for what we've seen. as we move forward we have to continue to figure out how we propose solutions that actually create solutions. very often in this commerce, we do things out of the best of intent and have the worst results. a lot of data. there is a lot of data that points at the fact that gun control leads not to safer communities but more dangerous communities. for example, one of the proposals out there right now is to raise the age of being able to own a rifle and in our federal society we have many states we were able to kind of test these things out and the only peer-reviewed article that's been done on that was in the journal of law and economics talked about it and looked at it and said if anything there was a 6% increase for states to begin to implement age requirements or raise the age requirements, so we have to tread passionately and carefully as we continue to put addressing this from a policy perspective. i would like to bring up a topic that i think needs to be added to the conversation and the representatives touched on this quite a bit because a lot of times here in congress, we will measure it is on the spending bill so we will measure our personal compassion by how much money we spend. generally it's the more we spend the more compassion we have. i've always found that absurd in the same way as we do this it would be wrong out of the sake of doing something to measure our personal compassion by how much of other people's constitutional rights. any time a federal government takes of already it is always for altruistic reasons. the danger comes when the next person in charge or what happens after that and many times it is taken under good intentions and accused him of variously much later. so we have to be very careful about that and keep history and context in mind and the other thing is we should not think that any of this there's not one thing that caused this. but one thing i would like to throw into the mix of this if there is a common denominator as we look across this it isn't age so much or the firearm used were orthe type or how it was requird as much as it is we see when we look at crime in the communities and the societal decline we are in decline as a nation when it comes to the moral and societal decline as a nation there's no doubt about it. and one of the biggest factors that is a common denominator across much of this is simply broken. the study from the journal of research in the crime and delinquency reports for violent crime in the community is a proportion of fatherless homes. the study in the journal of crime and law found that growing up in single-parent families associated with elevated risk of crime by adolescents. a2019 study from the pew research study found the u.s. as the world's highest rate of children living in single-parent households. the national fatherhood initiative people from the homes are more likely to commit crimes and end up in prisons and more likely to end up in poverty so a long time our government has subsidized and promoted policies that continue to break down the home and we have to do what we can to make sure we come back to this. i would like to give whatever time remains to address the charges that have been made against you. >> the gentleman's time is expired. the gentle lady from florida is now recognized. >> thank you, madam chair. gun manufacturers didn't always marketed weapons to civilians and until recently, tradeshows didn't make military style guns available to the public. gun makers aggressively market ar 15 style weapons to civilians inductively tie them to military and law enforcement. smith and wesson even developed a name for this marketing ploy calling it, quote, the halo effect. i want to draw your attention to the screen. i want to ask you about one advertisement that i find troubling. this is an ad for a high-speed military ar similar to that used at the elementary school shooting in uvalde. it states, quote, use what they use and it features military adopted technology. do you believe the associations made in this advertisement are appropriate for a civilian? >> no but they are very effective at selling military style of weapons to the population. >> reports on this gun indicate it is favored by special forces. i would like to ask why the same style guns eat being used in war zones should be marketed to everyday people. it is clear who the gun makers are marketing to. jamie was lost in my own community and fred filed a complaint alleging the smith & wesson mimicked first-person video games in its advertising to attract adolescents and young adults. smith and wesson 223 caliber rifle was used in the parkland massacre. what level of culpability should manufacturers have when they market human killing machines? >> this is now increasingly the norm of the gun manufacturers to market using video style ads and they referenced popular video games and its advertising, in its advertisements and they should be held accountable for this. >> commissioner, i would like to turn to you next. i want to put another advertisement on the screen. this is for a bushmaster 15. is that the same that was used at the supermarket on may 14th? >> yes it was. it shows a soldier. your officers were on patrol that day with far less to protect themselves into the public from the military grade killing machines every day. it's no problem they had adequate weapons to be able to defend themselves but is that the case? >> against this weapon, no we have active shooter vests we have in our patrol cars. you can't wear them on a regular basis. it's too heavy and something that you have to grab it and put on if you have the time to do it. you worked closely with teachers and students for years on combating gun violence. students are forced to practice mass shooting drills. just this week, and i know that you've heard me talk about the high school students from my children's high school to mark the success of their fundraising drive to put a stop to bleed kids in every classroom on that high school campus. those are kids that are meant to triage a bleeding wound. they prepped for the time that they have in the schools in the event that they are facing an active shooter and that they may bleed to death from gunshot wounds. what kind of traumatic effect does normalizing gun violence have on students? >> we have seen over the years and increase in anxiety and the number of students seeking additional assistance from mental health professionals. we are seeing an increase in the amount of students who are coming to our schools with all kinds of social and emotional learning gaps because they have been suggested to overly aggressive drills and looking at social media and tv and is seeing other students suffer and die at the hands of gun violence. >> marketing to a customer base by using imagery and words that suggest that the purpose of the product is gross and in moral but it's just what the gun companies do now in order to profit from the market beyond their older male customer base. the second amendment doesn't absolve gun manufacturers the response ability to market their products responsibly and children shouldn't be doing fundraisers. the bleed kids instead of making sure they can have a fun prom, doing carwashes from having bake sales to make sure that their life on campus as students is improved as opposed to their life on campus doesn't and and they have to use a stop the bleed kit that they've raised money for. >> the time is expired. as was previously stated at the beginning of the hearing, mayor adams has a hard stop at 1:30. thank you so much for joining us here today and for your testimony and for your service. you are excused. >> thank you. >> mr. biggs is now recognized. >> you know, last week i thought i heard it all when one of the democrats threatened to end the filibuster, wanted to pack the supreme court and said that they would confiscate guns. in order to do that they would basically emasculate the senate as an institution and also emasculate the supreme court as well. i thought that was interesting. but then we have here someone actually accusing a witness and taking out of context a witness who testified previously accusing of perjury. following that, i have to tell you the most egregious thing that the democrats did today is they took a person, a young person who was traumatized two weeks ago, still suffering under obvious ptsd as she testified in the video and bringing about a r little girl to relive this. if we are going to hear about how traumatic -- and i'm not saying they are not, though raising money. the bleed kids, but it is pernicious and outrageous to take an 11-year-old child who graphically described how she spread a classmates blot upon her and faked her own death, to make her relive that. if we are talking about ptsd, you just prolonged the agony of that little child for your own political gain and purpose. that is despicable. over the course of more than nine hours my colleagues on the judiciary committee made it clear they don't believe any american should have access to protect their families and an amendment that would allow victims of domestic violence to purchase firearms. they opposed the republican amendment that would allow the spouses of active duty deployed military to purchase firearms. and again, they promoted ending the filibuster, packing the court and confiscating from law-abiding citizens and they gave the game away by making it clear that neither would stand in the way of their radical mission. the proposed solutions to the problem of violent crime in this country is to make felons out of law-abiding citizens under the age of 21 to make those who own firearms in homes with children and felons of law-abiding citizens who own or purchase magazines that hold more than ten rounds of ammunition. the most common firearm in this country. 15 round magazines. the solutions are to force law enforcement officers to ignore the due process and strip the citizens of the means to protect themselves and families from threats and make no mistakes, democratic colleagues intend on total infringement on america's second amendment rights. before you answer the most pertinent question i think that we are going to hear from you in a second i want you to tell me can you define the defensive use? >> i'm assuming you mean lawfully would be the use of a firearm that is to defend one's self against criminal actions by another. >> how often is the use in this country? >> according to the 2013 report by the cdc, almost all with very few exceptions but the most rigorous study almost all of them show somewhere between 500,003,000,000. it's roughly an average of a million. >> do you believe that the defense of others with the protection of property saves lives? by effectively committing a crime and perjury before congress. would you please like to respond to that? >> i appreciate the opportunity but we've wasted enough time on political games and i would like to get back to the merits of talking about the solutions. >> i'm going to go forward now and i'm going to submit the following items for the record. the testimony before the senate judiciary committee on 2021. a good guy with a gun who confronted and stopped a massive shooter in southern springs texas. i also submit a study by john lott of the prevention center. the studies and accidents and schools that allow teachers to carry firearms which found zero cases of someone being wounded or killed in a shooting let alone a public mass shooting that allows teachers to carry firearms and third an article by the washington examiner that the buffalo shooter was an eco- socialist who hated fox news and with that i will yield back. >> the gentle man yields back into the gentleman from georgia is recognized and may have been called for votes so after that, we will recess. >> thank you, madam chair for holding the hearing and i would like to thank the witnesses particularly those on the panel for their testimony. i was moved by what each of them had to say. americans have grown weary, frustrated and frightened by the cascade of gun violence facing the country and they are sick and tired of their leaders continuing to do nothing to address the carnage. the fact of the matter is the gun lobby and the gun manufacturers that funded exert great influence on politicians to support its policy which is the only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. if that holds true it doesn't make sense in a civilized society. every person with a gun makes us unsafe as opposed to more secure. at this every stopping a bad guy with a good guy just doesn't work to allow the floodgates to remain open to flood the streets with weapons that are more powerful than what was available last week. that policy has been a deadly failure, and as we continue the firearms flooding the nation's streets, we will continue to see rising rates of gun violence in america. no other country has a problem like the gun violence problem plaguing our country. as policymakers who stand in the way of doing something to address the problem should be ashamed of themselves and they need to be voted out of office and replaced with leaders that are willing to stand up to the nra and pass common sense gun reform laws. it's common sense to impose a ban on the manufacturer and the sale to the public of military assault weapons meant for use on the battlefield. it's common sense to mandate universal background checks by closing the gun show loophole and it's common sense to raise the age to purchase firearms from 18 to 21 but for some reason my colleagues insist on doing nothing to reverse a failed policy. it allows the greedy firearm manufacturers to maintain their ever-growing profit by flooding the streets with weapons, and they continue to ignore the impact of their inaction, hiding behind the second amendment. they proclaim they attempted to pass legislation infringes on their right to carry. what about the right to live, of the 19 children and the two teachers killed in uvalde. the shoppers killed in buffalo new york emma what about their right to live? what about the right to live with the countless others that died of street gun violence? how much more blood should be shed before we in congress take action? the house and acted the passed laws on the universal background checks but our legislation installed in the senate because of the filibuster and congress today will pass common sense gun legislation, i should say democrats in congress, will pass the common sense gun law today and pass it on to the senate where it will be met with a filibuster. the overwhelming majority of americans that support the kind of common sense gun safety reforms under consideration this week and failure to act as unconscionable. failure is an insult to the countless children in shattered families and communities. it is an insult to the people that we are here to represent and i joined my colleagues in their thoughts and prayers and beg them to match that with equally fervent action. a paper released by the international association of chiefs of police noted when the biden assault weapons ban was in place between 1994 and 2004, the number of assault weapons traced to crimes fell by a dramatic 66%. a sense of assault weapons are often used against police officers and they are supportive of the assault weapons ban, or the assault rifle ban, what message does it ascend when republicans who allow they proclaim the supportive law enforcement to even discuss banning assault weapons? >> you know, my issue here is we need to reduce the amount of bloodshed on the streets and the damage these weapons caused will lead to more bloodshed on the streets. it's more the victims that are being struck, and it's something that needs to be banned. >> thank you and i will yield back. >> the gentle man from florida is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, madam chair handles over the indulgence before we have to go vote. i've heard a lot today and because we do that too often here, this is where it's been referenced a lot today about the need for universal background checks and closing the gun show loophole. can you explain and policies what that means? >> universal background checks start with a what could be at its core legitimate. right now, most gun sales whether it is brick and mortar or bought over the internet, anything that occurs interstate, those require a background check under existing law. the exception is for the intrastate a sales between private sellers and that is largely because they do not have access to the next system, they cannot call up the fbi and say can you run a background check. theoretically could that be a way that that intrastate sale for individuals who are otherwise prohibited to buy firearms, sure. and the problems with all these other bills is that this is a low reward endeavor. it's already not how those criminals are obtaining their firearms. they are obtaining them in the black market and informal channels that are not in any way, shape or form addressed and on top of that, things like this would criminalize the whole host of responsible temporary low risk transfers between the law-abiding citizen like if they want to borrow your hunting rifle or you are going on a month-long trip to europe and want your guns to be secured, you have to go to a background check, transfer the title of the guns to that individual and transfer them back to yourself when you're done. that's the problem. >> real quick, so the policy of the universal background checks, would that have stopped the shooter from acquiring his weapon? >> it would not have stopped the shooter. >> would have stopped the shooter in parkland? >> it wouldn't have stopped because they all either past or they were capable of passing background checks and that's the problem. >> the shooter and sandy hook, the newtown shooting, did the shooter kill his mother and take the guns? >> yes, he did. and i forget his age but he otherwise didn't have a disqualifying history. >> the shooters in uvalde, did he shoot his grandmother before he went to perpetrate the crimes in uvalde? >> to my knowledge, yes. >> here's the deal. 1 of the things we've seen a -- i was a member of the legislature during the parkland shooting, so i was in the legislature in that time period but one thing is crystal clear, that the mass shooters that target the schools oral psychopaths. they are psychotic. in parkland, the red flags were there for everybody to see. the school district did not act. that came out of the parkland report. the site itself is not secure. that came out in the parkland report. in uvalde, the back door was open. it was wide open. the perpetrator shot his grandmother. that is insane. i know in this bill, the proposed bill today or tomorrow that is raising the age to buy rivals from 18 to 21, are we going to say a 19-year-old who is a legal adult in the united states doesn't have the mental capacity to own a shotgun or nar 15 but they have the mental capacity to enlist in the military? they have the mental capacity to sign legal contracts? they have the mental capacity to be treated as an adult by law enforcement and also the mental capacity to vote in the united states? but they don't have the capacity to own a shotgun or a rifle and not inflict harm on their fellow man? i've got three sons. 2 of them are school-age now. when these shootings occur, they hurt me because i can only imagine. i am a parent but i also understand i have a responsibility as a legislator to defend the constitution of the united states. the second amendment is there. it is our responsibility to defend it and if we look at the data from the mass shootings that occurred over the last 20 years, the one constant especially when it comes to schools is that these shooters are young. they are mentally disturbed. and at the vast majority of people who are in their age group would not even think or go down the pathway of committing these atrocities. we don't pass laws because of the quote on quote one or two psychopaths. we passed them in order to maintain the actual legal momentum of freedom in the united states. the second amendment isn't there to stop psychopaths. let's be honest, that isn't its purpose. the purpose of the second amendment is clear it is to prevent the rights of american citizens. these shootings are awful. they are awful. but the data is clear about how to find the people that actually do this. and of the measures put in front of us would not have actually stopped the shootings. i will yield back. >> votes have been called to allow members to vote, the committee will stand in recess until the end of the first vote a series. the committee stands in recess. the gentle lady from michigan is recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, chairwoman. and thank you all of you for being here. sometimes congress often feels like it's own little world separated from the rest of the country. hope this morning hearingg the witnesses strength and courage inspires meaningful action here. the biggest fe i have is as a mother in america that when buffalo and uvalde stops being in the headline, everyone here will go on and do nothing. other violent shootings never reach those national headlines like the four shootings in the span of a week in the city in my district. with that in mind, i want to really talk about ar 15's. a few weeks ago in buffalo, one person armed with an assault rifle carried out a racist act of terrorism and this black community. as you may have heard, my colleague from california, congresswoman porter, talked about how the shooter there, having to re- around or reload the gun actually helped save lives because they have a ban on ar 15's in the state of california. so, the gun man and each ofbe these kind of mass shootings used assault weapons to carry out their attacks,

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