Transcripts For CSPAN2 Capital News Today 20110811

political advice sometimes and to get. sometimes he didn't. if he didn't he usually heard about it but managed to get through that crisis, so she did the mental health finger but also far more than that, too and was a especially capable as a political strategist. she was in on most of the strategy meetings. she went out on the 1980 campaign more than he did on the rose garden. okay. i think we have time for one more question. maybe we don't have time. okay, here's one. >> you hear a lot of evaluations of presidents in terms of which president is the best president. what about the governors of georgia, modern governors of georgia. how do you think that governor carter ranks compared to the other? >> [inaudible] [laughter] i feel certain you know more about the governors of georgia than i do but i will take a stab at it. at the time he was governor, he was not a popular governor and he wasn't popular with me as a professor but i did vote for him but his reputation i think has gone up when you look at the long-range impact. but he was constantly fighting the lieutenant governor and constantly fighting the race issue which was very much alive at that time and the interesting thing about rosalynn i don't know if you run into this or not, but runs in two women who think that he is wonderful and can't stand her and the ones who can't stand her are going to be stubborn and argue she got out of her place, so such a mitch become mixed bag georgia has a lot more prosperous since he was governor in terms of education and he helped with the groundwork a and i haven't seen a reading of him as governor but i think that he wouldn't be really high on that list. he probably deserves to be higher. okay. thank you very much. [applause] >> for now, a discussion on new media technologies and the courts. we'll hear from retired of maryland fifth circuit judge dennis sweeney. from the conference of court public information officers, this is 45 minutes. >> okay, again i want to say right on schedule and do a quick introductions, sit down and let -- as they would say get rid of the rumble. i've got a really all-star group to my left. let's start with judge dressel. judge william dressel is sort of my daughter of linebaugh. my office is upstairs in his is downstairs of the judicial college on the campus of the university of nevada reno. he's a friend, confidant, he has been for 22 years a judge in colorado. he is a smart, funny, interesting guy and i enjoy his company. judge dennis sweeney is a jurist of some note as well and handled some of the most high-profile cases in and around the area of maryland. he sat on the case in mid-1989. subsequently in 2009 the corruption case involving the the mayor sheila dixon and in those cases in the article in the journal volume one, initio ii to look at the fact that the world has really changed with respect to what a judge has got to do and how you manage jurors something we probably find funny but that went on the pla was settled but those years to the tissues are headed towards a higher court or the highest court. finally, dr. genelle belmas. anyone looking for a reason to justify the trip here needs to read dr. belmas's work and during a break or after, talk to her. she's written what may be the seminal piece on the circumstances under which judges should, must come off to recuse themselves in the current environment based on the social media and similar context. when i talk to judges, and i talked to a lot of them that is what they're most afraid of, they are accidentally triple wire and get themselves in trouble with the malaise so this portion is going to be moderated by. >> i want to make sure he keeps that upstairs and downstairs thing in mind. you realize downstairs is really the upstairs. [laughter] and cathy, it's always good to see you whenever the college brings the judges to washington, d.c., we give her a call and say what can you do and she is amazing for how she accommodates the judges when we come here for the educational programs. i hope that all of you have had an opportunity to have access to and read these journals. i brought a couple of them with me. one contains articles and the two presenters here this morning and i think that you would agree with me that the folks at the center and eric have achieved is a terrific combination. it's both a very sound and intellectual examination of the subject which you would want to find. it's got a great site and is laid out wonderful but also it combines something that is often lacking especially for trial judges and others in the justice system and that is it gets practical use led vice. so you have got a good, sound journal that you can cite but also something that you can take care and apply to the profession no matter what you do in the justice system and that is not an easy balance to achieve. my role this morning here is really just to get out of the way and with the two of the authors in the journal talked about their work, and i went call on them and ask them to give a summary and ask a few questions, but mainly they are here for you to ask questions. the two topics, and i see some of the folks at the conference of the chief justices and the stakeholder administers that occurred just recently in atlanta where they really explored the subject and i went to many of the chief justice's and addressed both of them to the conference is i took the exam and i said, you know, everything you talked about the of presentations. i said it's contained herein. if you act in your state and want an examination as the person you want to call and that is ben mike holden and take a look at this journal because it is going to really help you examine a lot of issues that you are facing especially one issue that is more than timely is the recusal. the adopted a new standard this week. i will tell you that i think the day and age the state's taking the standard adopting it whether it is this are long gone. the states are going to take what they put out and give it a difference but they're going to do in examination and look at what is right for their state especially in the recusal and disqualification. they are going to state what should be the standard in the state and what they put out in what is in this book will i think the the guidance they will look to as they examine these issues but first let's go to judge sweeney. i think what you put your in the title is a good one. you do have a collision howff world's -- of the world's come the change court world in the media that is just going at warp speed. what is it in your article that you would like people to understand? >> let me say wow because there's so many things that are connected to this issue. let me set the stage here if i could. i got into this whole issue because of the dixon trial, and let me if i could take a couple minutes to go over this. in the dixon trial mayor sheila dixon was on trial in baltimore city and i was not a judge in baltimore city but because all the judges in baltimore city recused themselves they asked me to come in and do it, and in that trial she was basically tried for to kind of summarize it inadequately but to summarize it would very succinctly there had been a gift cards donated to the city to give to kids at christmas time to pass out to portage at christmas time and she was accused of using those gift cards that have been given to the city by the poor shall friend to buy christmas gifts for her own family. and so she bought genex box for her nephew and a couple other gifts like that. a hint here if you are doing that as you know gift cards are hard to trace, but what she apparently did according to the evidence is she went to best buy and had a rewards card from best buy that had her identification so she used her gift cards but wanted to get the rewards so at the same time she used the gift card she used her reword card and allow the prosecutor to track the gift cards back to her. so watch out from trying to get that last discount. [laughter] welcome after the jury deliberated and reach a verdict in the case, and she was found guilty of the counts and acquitted of three of them but found guilty of one of the counts, and that was a guilty verdict on any count meant she had to give up her job as the mayor of baltimore. as a judge who does a trial like this, one of the things that you are always interested in is getting a verdict regardless of what it is getting the trial over and done with and hopefully having it with no issues involved that are going to lead to you having to do this trial again. it doesn't usually get a better the second time around. so i was feeling pretty good that we have gotten a verdict in place. but the day after the verdict came, the legal newspaper in baltimore, the daily record, and enterprise reporter brian tierney had gone and got -- to put this in context, withheld from public disclosure the name of the jurors during the trial and i released it the day after the trial and as soon as he got those he went to facebook and found one of those jurors have an open facebook with no privacy protections on that and he found five of the jurors had her friended each other during the course of the trial and i had actually anticipated the social media issues to some degree because i told the jurors that they should not discuss the case with anyone that includes family and friends and they should not engage in any over the internet discussion of the case. they should not engage in any social media and which they discuss the case, and i particularly reference to the case and what had occurred is the reporter saw that they had friended themselves during the deliberations of the case, the deliberations actually went over i think it was nine days the jury deliberated and included of thanksgiving weekend and the -- heat reported the next day they friended themselves and included some of their comments, which we could discuss because this gets into the holding of this was a violation or was this not a violation of the opinion discussing with each other if thanksgiving day dinner, and fighting each other over to the house after the thanksgiving dinner for you know, social get-togethers and things like that, and so this comes up in the newspaper, the defense understandably raises this right away and asks for a chambers commerce with me. we have one very quickly. we get everybody into the chambers conference and the attorneys, very distinguished white collar in baltimore arnold winner and daniel, in my age group which is we will say a mature age group [laughter] and the prosecutor, the same prosecutor, also a mature fellow, we are sitting in my chambers, the five or six of us talking about this and we quickly realized we had no idea what we were talking about, no idea what facebook is, we have no idea what this means. we just know it's a problem. [laughter] so luckily i had a clerk for a shot of the university of maryland law school, 26, 27 years of age. so i kind of called him in and said what's this facebook thing? [laughter] and she quickly said yeah, facebook, you want to see my facebook page? and he puts it up, puts his face the page up with all of his pictures of him, you know, drinking and whatever. [laughter] and we are trying to figure out what does this mean and it's when we begin to realize that there is this whole other world out there and this law does colliding as i say in this article with the world of trials as we understand, and i can talk a little bit more about how the world of the internet and the social media is kind of the antithesis of the trial of the world. everything that is of value in five social media and the internet world, openness, access to everything colin on mediated, anybody's opinion is out there, and nobody's opinion is necessarily worth more than somebody else. you evaluate everything. the court ruled is exactly the opposite. everything is mediated. you get access only have information that has been scrutinized and reacted and gone through various of for the levels, lawyers, judges before you see it. on the internet world if you are not satisfied with what you got, you go into another search term. you consult other people may be around the world about your particular time or issue. in the court will did you don't do anything. you take when you got and you are told even though we all know there's a lot more information out there you can't do that. so this is a real collision of different perspectives. >> thank you. >> i have a powerpoint. >> [inaudible] >> thank you very much for the presentation and the kind introduction. my article is entitled that is what friend is for, social networks and the standards for the refusal. what got me interested in the case is doing research with a colleague on anonymity online. i teach media law week so this is really outside of my comfort zone but he and i were looking at the standard and when can they be forced to reveal anonymity who online and the like and we stumbled across the case of a judge in ohio. surely has a personal e-mail address and that e-mail address was tied to a monitor of wall mess that posted a number of anonymous comments on a variety of cases including a case before the court having to do with an alleged serial murder. there was a slap about did she posted, did her daughter use the e-mail account and should the drought of the judge when they determined that it was she that was posting these anonymous comments as well as very racist once, and again, the allegation was that her daughter had done it. she didn't recuse herself as the request but the supreme court stepped in and the judge said and i think this was quoting the reassignment of the case is necessary to avoid an appearance of bias, prejudice or impropriety and to ensure the parties there council, the public the unquestioned neutrality of an impartial judge. so this is what got me interested in the motion of judicial recusal and how it interacts with the social media. i tend to define social media very broadly. my students are between the ages of 18 to 25, and they have relief use facebook and the often joke to me if it's not on line that never happened and given them ubiquity of cameras and cell phones that have maybe you didn't, i don't know what what got me interested in this was thinking about not just the legal issues with the ethical issues of judges or other judicial personnel engaging in this online commentary anonymously and what fiduciary duty does the journalism profession or to become professor have to out judges to be given this some frankly what standards should there be for the recusal in the age of the social media and i define it for a broadly, the blogs, trevor of course the ubiquitous tweets and like the judge who put in long and it's about online community as the judge sweeney that the interactivity and often eminem -- unanimity. the supreme court case i know i'm preaching to the choir so i'm going to keep those remarks brief. judge benjamin, justice benjamin had received $3 million for his judicial election from the judge who was an executive with a case before the court. there'd been a movement for the recusal but went back and forth and back and forth and the supreme court stepped in and called it an extreme case. justice kennedy said most refusals in the constitution but this is extreme. a huge amount of money. had a big impact on the election and frankly, the public raising eyebrows here. the court asked whether under a realistic appraisal of the psychological tendency of the human weakness the interests pose a risk of sexual violence or prejudgment that dhaka process must be forbidden it's a guarantee of due process adequately implemented. so, you know, this is just beyond the pale. we don't recognize that most of the cases will go to constitutional come implicate constitutional issues. and a likely to the factual why is the first is the usual appearance of impropriety. a little bit stricter and we will see how that plays out. and he raised 40 questions on how the heck are we going to implement this and aren't we going to have a motion? to questions or relevant for me. was the case origins of the ideological issue rather than a financial one and does close personal friendship between a judge and a party or a lawyer gives rise to a probability of bayh as? is not just about the money but of course there can be issues of recusal deutsch to these personal relationships whether they are electronic relationships, face-to-face relationships or any between. as of you know, they have the model of the judicial conduct. it does not directly address the social media and its broadly written that it has to do and some of the elements have to do with personal bias and prejudice in quitting the party lawyers etc. can be adapted to read a number of states have issued a code rulings or have had situations where judges have either voluntarily or have been censured for the use of the social media and the north carolina judge for inappropriate relationship with an attorney and client where they were facebooking each other and coding each other, not so good. situations where they used to hook up with defendants and pay their rent and get their hair cut with them clearly problematic under the appearance of the likelihood. and the advisory committee was problematic and i read a member of the discussions of that and one attorney called that nonsense and said that was taking it we too far and that is not likely have a ruling and the ohio ruling, an advisory committee of opinion that was a thoughtful and a detailed list of guidelines so that is why i took it as a jumping off point. information sure, the social network and to foster the social not working interaction of individuals or organizations of communications will erode confidence in the independent judicial decision making and the nuts and bolts kind of stuff so if a high you can do it, so can all right. i treated a continuum and its kind to say that credit where credit is due droll's from ohio model. on a continuum based on the ethics codes and based on close readings in caperton i think facebook speed friended will be okay. given the ubiquity, who knows, i am a friend of judge sweeney after this and if i came before his court -- >> i have to get a facebook page. [laughter] >> there you go. does that raise the by yes? probably not. we appear on a panel together. is that sufficient? i don't know but certainly facebook friending given the casual notion that it probably does not raise it. again, this comes a best whole idea of lawness. if i am a judge and by tweet how happy i am at my football team has had a good season and then the contractor of the coach goes into litigation and is before the court, does that give rise? well, i don't know. it's a good question. my sense is that it is less clear-cut than friending or a theater and is a that would be further inappropriate. campaign communication. most judges would be interviewed on the topic say the first stumbled into facebook because the situation before the courts or because the state's elective and it's a great way to extend your reach for a pretty cheap. .. >> there's a lot of situations that ideally -- i think the opening remarks were right. i think the days of wholesale caption -- adoption is out the store. the fundamental parts. they should have the prompt and should it react on races? that relayed on k-10. and the now infamous case. i welcome your comments. that's my findings. >> we have a few minutes if you want to ask any questions. i would start off with judge weeny. -- sweeney. i looked at it as a former judge and lawyer, this is probably not only timely, to get courts to look at how jurors are treated and the role in the trial. it almost requires the court to make them more involved. >> well, i think the courts are going to have to figure out what to do with what i call in the article, digital native. person that's used to doing everything off of their cell phone or their tablet that is used to getting information from all over the place who when anything comes up, gets the, you know, goes to their smartphone or tablet and put it is in and seeing what comes up. we can't let jurors do that. we have to be sensitive to the lead for information. i have become a whole lot more sensitive in trials where things are mentioned in the trials but are not explained in the trial. where technical terms are used. but nobody explains what that technical term is is. what are doing when you leave that there? you almost begging somebody to pick up their smartphone or their tablet, and find out what that term means. one the things that you realize when you look at these facebook, social media mistrials where they called them google mistrials now. one the things that you see about jurors is it's not the rogue juror that does this. by rogue, i mean somebody trying to do misconduct to under mine the trial. it's usually the most conscious juror is the one who commits the error. the one who was trying to ask questions during the trial, the judge said, i'm sorry, we don't allow questions during the trial. the one who said what does this term mean? and the judge says in response, well, you know, you'll have to use -- you'll have to use whatever information is provided here. that type of response is almost begging jurors to go off the reservation by being that opaque about it. and so i -- at least i'm very conscious now. i sort of see my role as a judge. you can't get in -- you can't be an advocate for one side or the other. but i almost see it like being the moderator of a radio talk program, you know, like diane rehm or something like that. where something comes up that a technical term or something that needs explanation. she comes in right away and say what does that mean? what is this acronym what you used? could you explain what that technical thing? i see of the role of the judge being much more activist that that very narrow sense of trying not to leave things hanging out there that could be explained. now the criticism on the other side of that is, well, wait a minute, even explaining things like in a criminal case. the prosecution has the burden of proving the defendants guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. any time anybody is clearing things up, you are taking away the argument on the other side is you are taking away some parts of arguments being there being reasonable doubt. so are you now putting your thumb on the scale there by doing that? it's a difficult issue. but i think if we are going to continue to have trials, some people say let's just take everything away from the jurors. take away all of their, you know, cell phones and their ipads and their tablets and whatever. well, that doesn't take care of what happens at night. or when they go out to their car at the lunch time and they got their -- all of that stuff out there. and beside that, think it's kind of an impractical solution in today's world. many people can serve on juries today because they can keep in touch with their jobs, their families, they may have an elderly mother at home, they may have to keep track of their kids when they come home from school. the way people do this is by using the electronic devices. as soon as you start doing what i think are rather draconian things, take away all of their devices, don't let them have them or whatever. you are already creating potentially a much more unrepresentative jury pool by eliminating people out of the jury group. so it's a very difficult issue. >> i see that -- back there. [inaudible question] >> the surgeon not the disclosed relationship or the disclosed -- the jurors don't read the newspaper or look at tv. the issue for the courts is, and it calls to mind the mayor dixon getting caught by using her best back hard. to if what extent are the courts going to use electronic surveillance to monitor whether jurors, it's very easy. you could do it quite easily. to see whether the jurors are, in fact, going on the internet at night, or facebooking each other. how will the courts doing to deal with that. they have that capability now. are we going to intrude into the jurors lives? >> is that a court function or something the lawyers should do, judge? >> i think that is the most compelling issue right now. is what can -- what should courts do, what should lawyers do. there's recently within the last two weeks, i believe, maybe it was in the may, an opinion by the new york ethics body for lawyers saying that it is permissible for lawyers to check out jurors social media postings. and it's an ethical -- it's ethically okay to do. it also says interestingly enough, if you find something that could lead to disqualification, you are obligated as a lawyer to disclose that to the court. i think it's a real difficult issue that i think we're going to see a whole lot on in the next year or so. because i think -- i think it's kind of offensive. we ask the people to come in for jury duty. we pay them next to nothing. some places now are virtually paying them nothing because of economic mandates. we are telling them please, you know, come in, we are going to treat you with respect. then we have everybody combing their social media sites. how the courts control that, how -- whether the courts can exercise authority over the lawyers about that, we certainly i don't think can exercise authority over the media that tries to do it. that's one reason why i don't disclose -- if i have a high profile trial, i won't disclose the names of the jurors during the trial. it is only -- during the trial that i had that sheila dixon trial, the lawyers had their laptops. very good lawyers. they had about six associates in the courtroom. there was wi-fi in the courtroom and they were doing this. they were checking each juror as they came up. they would do a quick run through, check it, and they found that one of the jurors who we interviewed was actually tweeting from the courtroom. and saying, i forget what you said, it's in the article. said something about how, you know, she didn't want to be on the jury, whatever. what she -- when she was -- i asked her about it. and she denied that she had done it. and then we kind of pressed her on it. and she finally admitted that she had been tweeting from the courtroom. it's some really serious, serious issues here. i don't pretend to know how they are going to get resolved. >> can i actually add to that? one quick thing. there is actually interestingly, and i found this will be fascinating given the disparity. there are actually codes for judicial employees that include staff attorneys and -- but there are none that are there for judges. there has been some attempt to guide judicial employees with guidelines from judicial codes and the like. there has been no such thing for judges. >> one last question. >> i was lizzie from the reporter committee in virginia. yesterday governor jerry brown in california signed a statute, signed a bill that made outside research by jurors illegal using particularly wireless or electronic communications. jurors can be punished for up to six months in jail. previously when the bill passed, governor schwarzenegger refused to sign it. he said judicial admonition is enough. >> probably thinking about his own up and coming trial. >> absolutely. jerry brown signed it. do you think such a thing -- the reason it came about, there was one case where a juror did research, they were talking about a 16 inch saw tooth knife and went out, looked it up, got a picture of it, showed it to the other jurors. obviously, this was a problem. do you think such such such -- e of approach would be effective? >> what i say in the article is i'm very much against as at least out of the box thing of punishing jurors. particularly if we're talking about the consciencous juror who is too consciencous. but there comes a point at which you need to take action and take firm action. i don't know if you saw this, but in england recently, there was a juror, the juror actually contacted the defendant, i think i have the facts right. contacted the defendant on their defendants facebook page during the trial. it was a drug trial and it was a multidefendant drug trial. i think in the british press they were saying -- can't trust anything you read in the british press anymore apparently. in the british press, they said it took $5 million to do this trial. something like that. something incredible number. and they had to -- this juror was kicked off of the jury and after the trial was over, the judge sentenced that juror to eight months of incarceration for doing that. because it disrupted the entire trial. i've not seen anything -- i think i've seen, you know, you know, fines that have been imposed in these type of cases. general reaming out of jurors, embarrassing them, and everything. i'm of the school -- i was a judge, i've been a judge now for both active and retired for about 20 years. i've never, ever sent a juror to jail. and but i can think -- i can see how being very serious with a juror about such things, and particularly where it is flagrant and the -- where the juror is acting with ill will, particularly, where that would be an appropriate sanction. one of the things that just -- you have to be careful here. when -- and in the facebook five jurors that we're talking about before, and we never got into a full hearing on this. because the case resolved with the mayor resigning and accepting the one count. and not going to jail. and so that all got resolved. but when you talk to the facebook five jurors, they make it case, and i think apparently convincing case that they really didn't violate my order. they became facebook friends. in their frame of mind, they never discussed the case. they discussed things other than the case. you know, like what are you wearing tomorrow? will i see, you know, things like that. they never discussed the case. from what i could see of the facebook postings, that was arguably true. >> okay. >> yeah, i'm sorry. >> we've gone over our time. i think these are great resources for you. you are going to be asked by judges and others to give guidance on what they can do when they are running for election. you are going to have requests for guidance of what they can do when they run into the problems. we don't want to react to the streams. that's what we have many times the extreme cases. it's going to be the 90 some percent in between where you as the court can do something about. i'm going to turn it back to ben. he's going to turn you over to the next session. >> we have about 47 seconds to switch rooms. postto be a joke. again, metro east, ccpi, the hub, journalist, metro west lawyers, i see probably 15-20 lawyers, we only have xiii of -- we only have 1/3 of those folks signed up. either if you are licensed or reciprocity credit in another state. we are adjourned for now. we'll see you in a moment. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] hud [inaudible conversations] nod [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] nod >> as a journalist, i'm setting aside money to deal with the money i will make. >> if our journalist. >> the reason that people like fox news, it's love and it's hate. >> from the washington media, aspiring high school journalist on ethics, role of opinion and commentary and where they get their news and information in today's multimedia environment. sunday on c-span's q and a. >> british prime minister david cameron has recalled parliament because of the london riots. hundreds have been arrested since the riots began on saturday. we'll have live coverage at the british office of commons tomorrow at 6:30 a.m. eastern. and following that, british chancellor will talk about the state of the economy and debt challenges. that's expected to start at 8 a.m. eastern. >> everyone weekend, american history c-span 3. this week the new york city draft riots of 1863. >> this was for the lincoln opponents who fused the two things. look, you are going to go to war. you can't afford the $300. you are going to go to the battle front and die. and a black emancipated spade is going to take your job. and your family is going to starve while the rich stay home. >> the new york historical society will host a panelist discussion how it led to three days of riding and the lasts effects it had on the city. the civil war, every weekend on american history tv on c-span3. >> coming up next, a look at transportation security since the 9/11 attacks nearly ten years ago. we'll here from the head of the tsa john pistole. from the newseum in washington this was 30 minutes. >> i'm susan, one the vice president at the new new new --. we're looking at how life has changed in america since the attacks on 9/11/20001. we will never forget that day. two planes were crashed into the world trade center in new york city, another into the pentagon in virginia, just across the river from where we sit now, and the 4th plane into shanksville, pennsylvania, a field nearby. more than 3,000 people died that day. and our lives changed forever. today we want to focus on just one aspect of the changes. that is the way that we travel. by car, rail, boat, and most importantly by air. today we'll talk about the security we've development to live with, what is worked and not worked. and look ahead to the future of what transportation security will be like over the next ten years. for the answers, you don't have to worry about me. our guest is john pistole from the transportation security administration, better known as tsa. there he oversees a work force of more than 60,000 people that manage the security operations of more than 450 federalized airports around the country, as well as the federal air marshal service, security for highways, railroads, ports, pipelines, mass transit. john came to the tsa with a wealth of experience in counterterrorism and terrorism. he spent more than 15-26 years at the fbi where he started as a special agent, working his way up through the ranks and following september 11, 2001, he was head of the terrorism program. in 2004, he was named the bureau's deputy director. john has led imnumeral investigations that are high profile. most recent were the attempted time square bombing in new york city in 2010, it attempted christmas day on northwest flight 253 in 2009, and the unsuccessful plot against the new york city new york city subway system the same year. we have a lot of territory to cover today in limited time. we wanted to assure the audience, we're going to leave time to ask your questions as well. when that time comes, we'll ask you to come down to the mike and give us your name and hometown and name or affiliation and we'll let you have your turn at that point. i hope you will all join me right now in welcoming john pistole to the program. [applause] >> thank you. [applause] [applause] . >> john, i know you said that your parents were married in 1941. their memories certainly of the day that was described as that day in infamy, franklin delenore roosevelt, ours was september 11th. where were you? how did you learn about the attacks? >> first, and thank you for the invitation here. good to be with the audience here. i was in syracuse, new york, as an fbi inspector doing inspection of the office there. i'd been at a tv station early that morning to do what an outside contact, to see how it was doing. then i was actually in federal judges office when the first plane hit. and obviously, concerns about that. i went back to the fbi and watched as the second plane hit. >> and what was your role from that point on? >> i had been serving in our boston fbi office. and after that, i went back because several hijackers had come out of boston, portland, maine, and boston, logan airport. i went to help the efforts there and was transferred full time into the counterterrorism as the fbi changed the paradigm for how fbi investigations were conducted with the focus on prevention, rather than solving the crime after the fact. >> well, we're going to have to leap forward to tsa. i know you spent a lot of your fbi career trying to catch the bad guys, trying to foil the plots. where you moved to tsa, where it's much more preventive. you are hoping to not ever have an incident. can you talk about that transition in terms of your life? >> the fbi really changed after 9/11. to become one of prevention, to make sure that another 9/11 did not happen. and working aboard or across the broad interagency both national security, intelligence committee, law enforcement community, and when our international partners. that had changed in the fbi, post 9/11. the mission is very similar. focusing on prevention. but also the idea that the department of homeland security and the whole of the government focuses is the resilience. but any type of attack. are we resilient, the same with natural disasters or anything else? >> the criticism was not having a big enough work force that was trained enough, the money to put into the resources that you needed to safely say that everybody was secure. do you think that's the case now? >> i think there are a lot of ways that tsa and department of homeland security and the fbi and other agencies can go about doing their work and to provide the most effective security in the most efficient way. i've been a tsa a little over a year now. and what i have found are there are multiple layers of security in place. what people see at check point is just one of those multiple layers as we try to focus on more of a risk-based intelligence driven approach. it's to use information that people are willing to share with us, about themselves were their travel, whatever it maybe. so we can make better judgments that maybe to facilitate the physical screening part because we know more about them. >> obviously in the career years you have been here, tsa has been in the headline. one the issues has been the use of the more intrusive patdown and the use of the body scanners. there's been a lot of talk back and forth about whether it was unnecessary violation of privacy, or was this something that was needed to guarantee air security? have you changed things? how have you changed things? and have you learned from the dialogue that went on over the controversy? >> yeah, i think the context where all of this is important, because we know that terrorists are -- keep adapting and evolving to defeat the security. we've gone from the 9/11 type of attack to a shoe bombers to liquids plot involving liquids. and this has been to be the five year where they arrested people. then we saw toner cartilages being used last fall as bombs in cargo packageses. of course, the under wear bomber. we have information now that put out about even terrorists going to the extreme of having surgical implanted bombs that they would then carry as a suicide bomber. so that's the context for everything that we do. so all of these multiple layers of security are designed to provide the best possibly security while respecting the privacy and civil liberties of everyone who travels. and it is a balance there that we need to and try to strike every day. so as related to the patdowns and the advance in technology, those give us the best opportunities. for example, of detecting such as what was used on christmas day. a device about this big, that thick in the, you know, the man's underwear. that's a very difficult to detect. he goes through a metal detector. it doesn't alarm. because there's no metal in the device. our focus and our awareness there maybe other people that terrorists are trying to use in that same scenario. so we have to make sure we are doing everything that we can, using the best training and techniques and technology to provide the best security. >> it's a real judgment call for the individual tsa agents in many cases. particularly there was criticism, for example, patting down children. it could be a threat. >> terrorists don't follow the norms. we don't see terrorists -- or children as being terrorists. we know that parents and others use children to do bad things. that happens not only around the world, but here in the u.s. and in certain context. we know that two 10-year-olds had been used. not obviously they were used. unfortunately, last month in afghanistan, an 8-year-old girl was used by the taliban to deliver a package which they blew up when she delivered the package. bad people use children for bad things. that being said, we are exploring ways in our trying some different ways of screening children who are with their parents in a way that facilitates that, recognizing that in the great likelihood that that child is not being used to carry a bomb, for example. >> we're trying to do everything that we can technically and on a security bases at the airports, ports, train stations. but what assurance do you have that other foreign security agencies go to the same length that we do. and obviously, of course, a lot of those ships, planes, land here. >> the first thing i think i'd say, susan, there's no guarantee in the business. that's become apparent given all of the channels -- challenges that we have. we are in the risk mitigation or risk management. we will never have 100% guarantee that everything is safe and secure. we'd have to shut down the two or three hour check point and cargo would come to a substantial slowdown. what we do with the international partners is set baseline standards that they have to follow. if somebody wants to fly to the u.s. or if they want to ship cargo or packages to the u.s., they have to meet these baseline standards. and then we work with them to increase their efficiency and their effectiveness in how they go about doing that. >> talking about slowdowns and compliance. i recall back in the 1990s, before september 11th, obviously, when there was resistance among the airlines for things just as basic as positive id match. the airlines made the argument back then, it would slow air traffic. americans would never agree to the invasion of privacy. obviously that changed immediately. it was changed even before. and as a matter of record, the airlines actually made money on it. because people could no longer use third party tickets. but what level of cooperation do you get from airlines now when things such as reinforcing dooring or anything else that costs them money. >> we have excellent cooperation with not only the airlines themselves, but the airport authorities and executives and the associations that represent them in terms of finding collaborative solutions to challenging problems. for example, we're working with the airlines now on the new form of known or trusted traveler that's part of the risk based initiative. they have been very forward leaning and i've spoken with the ceoed of five of the major carriers in the last few weeks to thank them for their support. they are spending the money to make some changes that help us in terms of our security functions, and allows the possibility for more screen at the check points. it's a win/win we look at it. >> talking about the airports. they do have the adoption with your approval to opt out of tsa security. they can have competitive bidding and have a private security company come in. i know you have over sight, but you don't have day to day management as such. this is something that is a concern in terms of ensuring there's a security place at every single airport in or do you think there is a trend that more airports will go for? >> there are 16 airports currently out of the nearly 450 have privatized airport. we still have tsa management on scene. they have to follow the exact same protocols and standards that we have. we find them to do an excellent job. so the security is not an issue. as much as the cost. because it does cost the taxpayers a little bit more to have those work forces. so other than that, i am interested in any best practices they develop, or other thing that is we perhaps could learn from that we could deploy nationwide. that being said, i see tsa has being a u.s. government counterterrorism agency. that's why we were created. so i think it's an important for the flexibility, in terms of new information comes in, new threats, and get that out quickly and modify the procedures quickly, and doesn't require negotiations or contract changes or things like that. >> tsa is constantly trying new thing. some things work and some don't. i remember the puffer machines. they are history now. what about things such as air marshals. is it really cost effective? does it provide the deterrence that you want it to? >> i'm honestly a strong supporter of the federal air marshals, because of the deterrent effect impact. we don't know how many tariffs said i would try. there might be federal air marshals on board. we don't have that information. it's similar to the secret service. and protecting the president. so every day that goes by, we don't know what people didn't try because with the great job secret service does day in and day out. so what we try to do is make sure that we are random and unpredictable in how do go about doing things. especially in the mass transit area where we have what we call viper teams, visible, protection response teams which are interagency, law enforcement, agency, uniformed officers, perhaps k-9, behavior officers who are there at union station up the road here. and they maybe there tuesday at 10 a.m. so if a possible terrorists is there to do reoccupational surveillance if you will and they see that. okay. let's not true tuesday at 10:00. well, it maybe thursday at 3p.m. that another team would be there. the idea that terrorists can't go to school, if you will, on what we do to try to beat us. >> much of the focus obviously is on air travel. there's so many people who do it. but there are some who are concerned about the vulnerability of the particularly train travel, but also cruise ship travel. on the trains, for example, you don't have positive id all the time. you have people getting on with knapsacks that have not been searched. do you see this as something that is an area of attention? >> we try to work closely with amtrak with their own police force and the metro transit chiefs around the country, subways and buses and things. we recognize tsa can't be all things, all people, all places at all times. how can we work to enforce what they do. they know the threats and they know their local population better than we do. our job is really an enabler of what they do, whether it's through grant funding or training of officers or k-9s or things like that. those are some of the challenges that we recognize and trains and buses, subways, it's a much more open architecture than aviation. and there having a number of attacks around the world. hundreds of atax since 9/11. that'sing that that we recognize. that's why the viper teams are important. and working with state and local authorities. >> what about the cruise ship? a number of people go on that. not everyone is aware of the changes there. but what? >> every cruise ship line has their own security force and we work with them to make sure that they do proper screening before people get on board. and including all of the crew. so there's background checks and all of those things are done. unfortunately, we haven't seen a tax planned on cruise ships and, of course, none carried out. there have been some successful tax on ferries overseas carries lots of people. that's something given in the more open nature than airlines, it presents an opportunity for us to leverage the resources. >> the technology is evolving. for example. in the body images machine, those are getting better. what do you see in the next ten years as the things we will be experiencing at airports in rail stations? >> i think at airports, there's been talk about a check point of a future, that's there an international air travel association, iada, which is promoting that. i strongly endorse. the technology is not there. the idea is to differentiate people between known travelers, low risk, and high risk, frankly. and you walk through that check point which is basically a tunnel if you will filled with censors that will be able to pick up explosive things. you will be able to keep all of your jacket and your carry on bag and things, perhaps, and shoe on, things like that and detect that. that's a great concept. it's not there from the technology perspective. my perspective and strong belief is that the best tool that we have in this fight against terrorism is intelligence. so it's information on the front end, whether it's from the intelligence community, or, for example in the human cargo within the information which was the tracking number from two packages from yemen to chicago. that was provided by a foreign intelligence service. they provided those tracks numbers, we were able to track them one in the middle east and uk. actually find the packageses andean the first inspection, they didn't look like bombs. they looked like computer printers. but on careful inspections, we found how well they had been designed and able to disrupt those so they didn't cause catastrophic damage. we have multiple layers, both overseas and here. >> i have a lot more questions. i've been told i have to share from the audience. we'd be happy to entertain from the audience. raise your hand if you have a question. give us your name, hometown, or your affiliation if you are media. >> valerie, i live across the river in arlington. i used to say i traveled for pleasure. that's an oxymoron now. going to various airports, there's a difference in how they treat what i like to think of as consumers of airport travel. for instance, charlotte is wonderful. i think everybody will agree with that. orlando, which is private, is just terrific. they've got screaming children and tired travelers and long lines. they are always nice to you. atlanta is terrible. national good days, bad days. i find if i give somebody or pass through security, if i distribute heresy's kisses they are nicer. they probably should not take candy from strangers. right? what kind of training do you have or do you do any kind of training to say let's be a little bit nicer to the passengers? >> thank you for that question. one the things that i learned when i came to tsa last year, out of the 450 airports around the country, if you've seen one airport, you've seen one airport. meaning that each airport is laid out differently, check point is different, i want authorities use their space in different ways. tsa is a tenant depending on the check point. what we do is provide training for the security offices in how to provide the most effective security. and there's been a customer service aspect of that. but that's been secondary to the security. focus on everybody wants to make sure they arrive alive at their destination. how do we do that? what we are working on how is how to do that in a more collaborative fashion, getting a lot of feedback. we have a tsa web site and blog where people can share their experiences and those airports that you mentioned, i would venture to say if we have 100 people, you might get 1,000 opinions about how they work and how they don't work based on the own experiences. the idea is how can we provide the most effective security in the most efficient way? facilitating the passenger, customers travel, recognizes the vast, very vast majority of travelers do not pose a threat in terms of catastrophic fatality to an aircraft. >> any more questions? got a couple down here and one down there. >> i'm jane from new york city. and i was in the city with my husband and son when the planes hits twin towers. and now post 9/11 we are all aware that a lot of information had been circulating about possible planes being thrown in the world trade center. richard clark being one of the people who was in the administration and in his book against all enemies states that he was trying to get that information to the bush administration. and basically said to par aphrase his book, he wasn't being heard. can you share information that you had or know now of post 9/11 of how things could have been handled differently? >> i think i would recommend the 9/11 commission report that the 9/11 commission did, they did an outstanding job of tracking down information, and piecing together information that frankly, some of which i didn't know. i was not working in counterterrorism before 9/11. i was brought in afterwards. i didn't have the insight of what richard clark was or was not saying before 9/11. but the 9/11 commission report is an outstanding historical monogram if you will of what did happen and some of the background. there's been a number of other good books written other than richard clark. i don't have personal knowledge prior to 9/11 on that. >> another question. there? >> bob spindel, spindel media replaces in new york. should one travel to the airport out of country, there's a screening that takes place that is distinctly different than that we experience in the country. have you investigated any of those particular best practices and have you any comment in that regard? >> we r yes, we have had a number of discussions with the israeli authorities. and they have a lot of things to be commended. there's obviously things they do that go beyond what we are allows to do here, in terms of profiling and focusing on certain groups of people based on ethnicity or religion. but there's a lot of things in terms of engagement with passengers that we -- that i believe are good tools and we are actually doing something at boston logan right now that is based not only on israeli model, but other aviation practices around the world that involve more passenger engagement. it's more information of intelligence screening than the leaving everything to the physical screening. what i don't want to happen is have the physical screening be a single point of failure. what i want to do is mable make sure we are informed by the latest intelligence and techniques and things like that. so that somebody, possible terrorist, is identified well before they get to the airport. that's the best defense that we have. also we don't get that type of intelligence very often. and so it becomes a question of how can we use the tools available to us within our u.s. constitutional framework, respecting privacy and civil liberties to make sure we are doing the best possible job. >> i believe there's a question down here. >> thank you. adam nixon with middle east broadcasting. i wanted to ask specifically about an interesting contradiction. if we look at polls of arab americans, they are integrated, very happy. they seem to be well off in this country, and that they in large majority don't support the al qaeda ideology. but then we have in contradiction, the problem with domestic homegrown terrorism. i wonder if you could comment about how significant of a problem that is. do you think that there is a large percentage of the population that supports homegrown terrorism, that could potentially be affective in it, or just a small fringe element? >> i would stay broad on that and refer and defer to both the fbi, and the national counterterrorism center cause lot of in that. i don't think there's a broad support network for either al qaeda or other terrorists groups. there are the one off if you will, lone wolfs or individuals that want to make a name for themselves or something. or they have been ratified on the internet or something like that. there are individuals out there across the country. it's a big country. given the freedom that is we have here, fortunately, those individuals are almost always identified prior to them trying to do something. >> rob, congressional quarterly. you mention cooperation with airlines. i'm wondering as far as checked baggage fees go, tsa has said the baggage fees have driven up carry on baggage rate that is clogs up the check points and also possibly makes screening more difficult. have the airlines expressed any desire to cooperate on that? is there any sort of dialogue between tsa and the airlines on that issue? >> we are not discussing that directly in terms of a security issue. that's taking place, i believe, at other levels of the government. the fact is the number of check bags has gone down in the last few years. and the number of carry on. i'm sure nobody in the audience that traveled packed a lot of things in their carry on so they wouldn't have to check the bag. but the fact is that each one of those carry on bags that is packed makes it more difficult for the security officers to detect what maybe fairly innocuous appearing item on the x-ray, that maybe a component or maybe some organic material explosive that when combined can bring down the aircraft. that is a challenge that we face and that we work closely with all of our partners to try to address. but as to your first part of your question, that's being done at different levels. >> it's a question way up there. go ahead. >> i don't have a question, per se. i wanted to thank you for helping make our country a safer place. and i wanted to say hi to my mom who is watching live on c-span. [laughter] >> and what is your name? >> evan, i'm miami, florida/cape elizabeth, maine. >> excellent. does someone have a real question there? >> yeah, i'm charlie clark with government executive magazine. with the coming unionization and the bargaining with the american federation of governmental employees, do you expect any major changes in workplace behavior or effectiveness? >> i think some of the changes will not be apparent to passengers. i think it will deal with how we evaluate our security officers, things that are much more administrative in nature if you will of how they bid on a shift, for example, or the uniforms which there maybe some changes that they may want to make. so that process. but as far as the damage experience, i don't think that people will notice anything other than whatever it may come about as a result of some of those changes. i think it's more an internal issue to tsa, rather than a public perspective. >> thanks, administrator. my name is joe straw. i'm from the new york daily news. my question is about trusted traveler, security experts of big fanned of tiered screening. as you know, the pilot focusing on frequent fliers. and it stands to reason that most of the enrollees will be frequent or professional travelers. the security experts also note that certain travelers, let's say, for example, children and the elderly run the risk of having a high risk score because we -- you don't know a lot about them. because they might not travel as much. is there a practical solution that the perception problem that tsa has about heightened screening from the apparently lower risk groups and how can tsa manage perceptions of that in the media? >> you've identified good points and challenges that we face to try to move from the one size fits all construct that the more information that people would share with us, just basic information if they are in a frequent travel program, that can help us make some informed ups and decisions about whether there's a possibility of expediting the screening from the physical stand point. as it relates to children, i think we have some good initiatives under way to try to recognize that in all likelihood, they are not terrorists and hopefully their parents or guardians are not using them as such. and the same with the elderly, again recognizing that the likelihood is that very senior citizen is not a terrorists. we know there have been two 64-year-olds who were suicide bombers. and there's a number of people on the terrorist watch list who are older than that. so it's any time you do a blanket exemption if you will, then you run the risk. so that's why i always wanted to maintain the random and unpredictable. even if somebody is in a known traveler program, they reserve the right. i say the global entry or center with the mexican entry is a gad opportunity for somebody that wants to sign up for a known or trusted traveler. that gives people an opportunity if they are trusted travelers, especially overseas, which global entry is for, gives them something to sign up for. as the likelihood as we roll the risk about. is if they would receive the physical screening at both of the airports. i do want to manage expectations this is going to take a while. this is not something that changes over night. any change that we make, we have to recognize that it -- it is enhancement to security. because we are using our limited resources and focusing those on the unknowns and trying to make some good judgments and decisions about those that we do know more about. >> one final question, because our times running out sadly, here at the newseum, we like to talk about government and the news. how harmful or helpful as the media been to the tsa's mission? [laughter] >> obviously, the media can do a lot to help inform the traveling public as to what is going on. and so that's a positive side of it. i think when we get focused on the individual situations that are taken out of context frankly. we have nearly 1.8 million people, if you think of how many times, let's say the last six months or a year that you've heard something, and found something every day. seems like there's something once every few weeks or something. the context of that is we have screened going on nearly $6 billion people here in the u.s. since 9/11. any time you take that anything where people are engaged with the public six billion times, there's bound to be some things where we could have done a better job. it's not media fault for reporting. my only issue is to keep things in context of what we're trying to do. it's all for the benefit of the traveling public to keep them safe. >> we want to thank you for your time. i want to remind the audience that we have another program coming up on saturday august 20th at 2:30 p.m. the guest will be chris rose. he's going to be talking about coverage of hurricane katrina. visit the exhibit here through mid september. thank you all for coming. i thank you. >> thank you. [applause] [applause] why >> -- >> a number of candidates campaigning in iowa. live coverage of the straw poll. and also on c-span radio and c-span.org. >> every weekend, american history on c-span3 highlights the civil war. this week, the new york city draft riots of 1863. >> this was lincoln's opponents who fused the two thing. of they said look you are going to go to war. you can't afford the $300. you are going to go to the battle front and die. and an emancipated black slave is going to come and take your job for less money and your family is going to starve while the rich stay home. >> they host a panel discussion how it led to three days rioting. on american history tv every weekend on c-span3. >> now a look at how robotic vehicles can be used during natural disasters. the attention of unmanned vehicles holding it's conference in washington. this is an hour. okay. all right. thank you for coming. that's from the national press club. another news maker. my name is peter hickman, i'm a former foreign service officer, now a freelance writer, editor, and media consultant, and member and former vice chairman. before introducing the newing makers, let me make the announcement. this new maker is being recorded as they all are, members can access the audio file through the web site putting in their club membership number and things like that. others can purchase a copy of the audio file and cd rom, or whatever it is from the clubs broadcast operation center and the phone number there is 202-662-5710. and the e-mail is boc@press.org. second, please turn off any of these things that you might have. : duncan hines vice president of the maritime division on the right. i got this right here. retired airforce charlie been immediate left corporation airforce ricky thomas is not retired, and global whole functional manager and the director of the national security operations center gentlemen, welcome to you all. i also want to welcome back to the person who originally suggested this and did most of the work in arranging. melanie, where are you? she is out working somewhere. a senior communications manager for unmanned vehicle systems international or auv. there you are. thank you. there she is. [applause] i'm sure everybody knows and though room the news makers are here and live in the areas but others don't are attending the 2011 show at the convention center august 16th and 19th. the organizations are used and will be on display there in some cases not just for military purposes, but also for civil and first response applications. one example of this as northrop grumman which is being used not only in afghanistan but also to assess the aftermath of the nuclear reactor situation in japan. the newsmaker topic today again as you know is beyond drones, we didn't know about unmanned vehicle systems. melanie referred to this as drones 101. to me, that would be in the task force. after the news makers speech we will take questions coming and please your name and affiliation and to whom your question is addressed. if you have a question if you give me a signal i will try to call on you in term as time permits. finally, again, to repeat if you haven't already done so, please, out when you leave. thank you very much. general, we set your the first speaker? you can call on the rest. >> first of all, thank you for this opportunity. i am a retired major general in the marine corps. i have fond memories of this location and hope that some of the dialogue will be just as interesting as it was during my jsf days. i now the vice president for the maritime systems and so i robot specializes in ground and underwater robots, not exactly the jerome category we are going to talk about today but i do not to talk about what we are doing in the experiences we have had. how do you go down? did that. okay. all right. i.t.. >> looks like we are going to need a class on how to advance. the down arrow doesn't seem to be doing it. okay, good. let me first talk about the role of experience we have had at irobot. for almost ten years now we've been reacting to different national responses. we had a pack a lot going to the ground zero after 9/11. we have had a number of different agencies that use our robots for different defense and law enforcement. more recently in the gulf of mexico we deployed an underwater robot that was actually providing a means to track the oil plume's beneath the surface and then finally we had robots that actually went out to japan for the nuclear reactors. i'd like to talk about the last two incidents for just a minute. first let's talk about the gulf. everybody remembers the deepwater horizon spill and the amount of oil. part of the problem is most of the surface vehicles and satellites couldn't see the water plumes created underneath. so we have an autonomous vehicle. we can go into the water and operate for up to nine months. it can maneuver around, albeit slowly, but still good of the deaths of 3300 feet and be able to provide you all kinds of information relative to the water column it happens to be traveling to in this case, we didn't have at that time developed the barometer, i mean the carvin sensor to detect oil so we used an instrument typically used for biomasses and we used a chemical signature directly to a wheel detection. it was very successful and the doctor who had overseen the project frequently cited not only the utility vehicle -- we stayed in the water for 90 days -- but also the new science we advanced in being able to use different sensors to use carvin detection. most recently was the deployment that went into folkie [inaudible] into a 300-pound class robots into the devastation site within a week after the disaster. we also said six employees that were actually there to provide assistance to assemble the robots and more importantly to provide the training that was required for the technical operators to be able to do it. our robots were the first ones into the reactor. they actually performed important operations, the outer door for the unit had to be opened by a human that afterwards the radiation levels were so high a human to operate in that so the robot was the one that opened the inner door and provided the first access to the unit one. we provided several -- and going to show some video that walks through that in just a second. i will briefly tried to marry some of that video for you. i believe it is running. yeah. all right, this is total provided by tepco. and it doesn't look like it is going to run. here we go. now you see the devastation site but was actually there right now. you can see the access was a significant problem just in terms of the amount of debris spread around the reactor. april 17th was the first arrival. this was the two packbot opening up the door to the reactor providing the first glimpse provided into this particular unit, unit three for the radiation levels. there was no power, so the robots were operating in tandem to provide both of the light sources to be able to see the reactor sell as well as perform initial readings. what you're seeing is an actual view of the operator looking at the outer consul. these are operators who learned how to operate the robot within a day so that they could actually get a first look. and they are actually scanning the to go and seeing for the first time the amount of debris that has occurred inside the reactor sell. here's additional operations of the 26th of april. you can see now we've not only provide capability, but they actually use the strap on mediation since your you see in the corner to measure the radiation levels and simply use the video camera for the robot to be able to see what the radiation levels were. >> on june 6th the first indications coming into unit one at the radiations that were seen due to the steam uprisings. in these levels we saw the radiation levels of over 4,000. to put that into true perspective, 2000 for a human means a death in 90 minutes. this was the highest level of radiation detected to date. we have since seen radiation levels of 6,000 or 10,000 micros, some of its external to the act will radiation cell three is a very significant radiation levels, and part of the lesson out of that is many designs are not appropriate for those level of radiation. but our robots still function today. finally, we are showing you what we call the rumba warrior. so part of the problems they had was actually debris collection comes to you get a lot of radiation so the japanese destroyer on modification using the warrior manipulator arm with a made up vacuum cleaner to actually go into it and operate this one robot providing individual picture and the other robot actually performing the sweep up operation. since that time that they've actually done this, they've had 23 koza 30% reduction in radiation levels within the container, allowing humans to get further and further into the containment cell. okay. back to play. so, will allow operations for robots and disasters and others to overarching promises and the overarching promises are simply that robots are better at places harder to get access to and the other is they are better for people when you don't want to put them at risk. so basically the too hard problems that are dangerous but what would submit to you is there less obvious reasons. robots can actually be more economical and many disastrous situations and they are better suited to the missions, particularly with human assistance. and the example i would give that a 300-pound class robot with a human being can provide a lot of the mechanical function, the mechanical lifting capability the human me be incapable of doing in an operation that the robot can provide assistance for some you have a great union of the robots in these disaster scenarios. with those, number of challenges and not just a challenge to the robot but to this a disaster itself. almost immediately the language to people to communicate with the folks that the area access issues as well as training issues. overcoming those issues are very important. additionally, it is just simply understanding the definition of what they want the robot to do. and that definition is paramount to being able to pick the right kind of equipment that can survive in the environment that it needs to do and the right communications protocols and the right training. so it is a suitability of the systems to that environment but it's not just the robot. if you are trying to operate in these environments, very harsh, the sensors that you want to adopt to have to be in an environment and survive in a strap on customization c performance levels communications protocols and so that seeks to is the need for a very flexible and robust robot design and that also includes different options for the communications protocols. finally is the basic premise that you have to go with what you have to read a number of organizations will dream up on the fly new solutions to try to solve current problems. and there was our very time critical. so it's very important that there be a premises that you go with what you have and resist the notion that you can create something on the fly as a new solution. the key points that we have had over new opportunities to perform is one, understanding the mission. it is that time we stand up front to understand what's the requirement in local area and sending the right people with the right equipment. the second one is the robust design, having a family of vehicles that operate on the same kind of chassis with the same kind of control as with the same kind of communications protocols allows you to have a more robust solution across different solution requirements. many of those things are also are able to get out to mission changes and the one thing that you learn in these environments is change will happen. and new mission needs will certainly crop of and the ability to adapt new sensors on to the mission requirements or allow for the strap on customization is critical. finally, training and rehearsal is essentials. you cannot go into these kind of situations without having rehearsed it with the folks that need to perform that mission on end. the business relationships and this bearings are also critical and the ability to reach back to engineering staff and the experts in the subject matter. believe me, our robot didn't know a lot about radiation before we started this, but we learned a lot on the way. so, the conclusions are a robust flexible design and the robot is easily the considerable at the disaster site is key. ease of use and, and software, architecture, across all platforms allow for the more efficient user training. again, the communications challenges are key. having a platform that has a variety of communications protocol including the cold play year is essential to the operations. so, having the experience, having robots that operate in years and in very harsh environments was really one of the building foundations to understand what are the mission critical needs and to have these kind of list wiltz. once you have that is publishing the relationship is critical to support that on giving and remembering again you go with what you have. so the message of this is picking the right partner with the right equipment really matters. and i guess we will save the questions for the end. all right. charlie, i think that your op. [applause] >> i didn't get your full name. >> i'm charlie dena, the director and i served a career in the army which i am very proud of. we work on many different places of technologies providing solutions to our customers and one of those we want to talk about today is what we do in robotics. as a revolution going on today, the revolution of unmanned systems whether air assets or ground assets robots can provide a lot to different customers surface assets and underwater assets as well. the revolution has been percolating the last couple decades but really in the last decade, and we all know the reasons for the advancement in the last decade. the use of robots and saving people's lives has increased dramatically. today over 12, 13,000 have been defeated in combat by robots. and, for this purpose today, first responders around the world are using robots to increase the distance it from their operators and the dangerous environments in which they have to operate we provide world-class technology for many different types of customers and the world of unmanned ground vehicles our platforms range in scale from several pounds of to 8,000 to 10,000 pounds. we will also talk about our role in fukushima and the size of the platforms in the role they play as well this cannot face what team earlier this summer where a woman had barricaded herself and her house and was using a high-powered rifle to engage with the swat team. the team deployed the qinetiq dragon number 20 through a window into the house. the robot was able to put cameras on the woman and the team could see what she was doing tall times. she locked herself in a room luckily with the robot in the room. [laughter] then she locked herself in a closet and the robot was still able to provide camera feed back to the team of her activity by looking underneath the door. the team was unable to safely get into the house and safely get the woman out of the house without any people being injured during the process. so that's the key to using unmanned systems is to add distance and safety to current operations. we have over 3700 robots deployed around the world today, serving domestic, international first responder customers as well as military customers. you can see the type of customer that we service. our companies police departments, the departments of the fbi, the atf, homeland security, mining companies for rescue type operations, all u.s. military branches and many foreign militaries. one example i like to highlight as the general just did was our collective role in on mant system support for the people of japan. in march of this year as we all remember the was a terrible earthquake that occurred in japan. the earthquake and a series of earthquakes after that led to a horrendous tsunami that smashed into the east coast of japan creating a devastating result due to not only the actions of the earth shaking but the waves pictured here building up to 100 feet in the air. thousands and thousands of people lost their lives and terrible damage to the infrastructure of the coastal areas of japan. and the earthquake continued. so it wasn't just one earthquake as we remember. it was many. it is that just shows you the size of the earthquakes that were occurring and the volume that were occurring on that date and shortly thereafter. if you've studied this, you can see on this picture here we are showing only really 6.0 and higher earthquakes. there were even smaller earthquakes. it was a terrible time. the day after the earthquake qinetiq north america asked what can we do support the people of japan? we reached out to the prime minister's office in tokyo and offered our support. they quickly took us on our offer different types of platforms, again, we have platforms that go across a wide variety of shapes, sizes and missions able to carry sensors. and they selected three different types of robots. primarily for use as with the irobot product set fukushima. in the days that followed, we all watched the meltdown at fukushima in horror as we saw the place basically fall to its knees with a terrible outcome of the reactors. very brave workers went in and immediately started to provide on hand support. without the initial help of robots. robots look away from our company or on their way. you can see here that the workers dressed up in under eight minutes the radiation levels would be getting -- it's terrible. this is what fukushima looked like before the earthquake. and of course i'm not sure of the ocean waters, what it looked like a couple of days later. robots were sent and as the generals explained i will show examples for the mapping for cleanup, radiation detection, for general reconnaissance and awareness of what was going on in the area. the three types of reports that the japanese selected from us in particular to the lecture power company went from the dragon runner 20 which is basically a 20-pound robot to the pound robots which we have many thousands of around the world today up to our bobcats swedes a close partnership with bobcats. bobcat do need it for free the bobcats to the people of japan qinetiq north america donated the robotic assets we had to the people of japan. this was not about a contract, this was all about helping fellow mankind. we immediately moved people into japan. we brought in the equipment shortly thereafter. of course the bobcats took a couple more days to plan the shipment of 8,000-pound platforms. they don't fit into the suitcase hold on airplanes that you and i ride. those in the country immediately started the japanese and here is a photograph of us working with the tokyo electric power company operators. it's interesting because as the new groups of operators came after to train, the operators out yonder. it was interesting. as the employees of the company learned how to operate robots which are simple to operate, they realized that perhaps this is a young person's sport. we use the xbox 360 controller to drive the bobcats and the dragon leonard and that is kind of a -- congenital talked about translation -- that's a translation device right there. a complete the xbox 360 hand controller in any language. here you see workers practicing the driving of the irobot and they can't see the robot, so in this case developed a training facility behind a concrete wall preparing to drive the bobcats in a location out of view of the operator. as a practicing using the cameras and using of the monitors on the controllers in eight remote manner. we also learned 18 of robots and in this case the bobcats operator and the town operator in the bottom right picture are working together, training together to use their cameras and to show the imagery coming back from the platforms and to help one another as they were opening doors, lifting debris and removing debris. as you can see from the calamity of the site, the bobcat in lots of ways became the most useful of the robots we sent over because of size. all of the robots. radiation detectors and different species, but the size of the bobcat and the chaos of the site made the bobcat able to move a lot of the debris that was there and allowed the smaller robots to them gain access to the complex terrain beyond the pleyel's of tiberi -- piles of debri. the translator here is that xbox 360 controller. photographs of the last sighting that we have of the robot and as they went in to the hot zone. we ordered up on to the tepco trailers and took the dragon runners and separate vehicles and headed off into the site. they were working on the site since the latter part of march and continue to do so today. for pictures came out from tepco back to us not long ago showing us the robots working at fukushima. the key message here is not only how can one respond after an event takes place but how can one prepare before an event takes place. and it's easy to talk about preparation. of course the harder part is to act and actually do the preparation. so we spent a lot of time teaming up with our customers, getting to know their needs, listening to what they do in their working environment to what they need from unmanned systems to the companies like ours provide. and we work with them to prepare in advance. if you look at the ring of fire around the pacific and all of the volcanoes that make up the ring of fire it's not hard to imagine what happened in tokyo and the whole area shakes quite often it could possibly happen somewhere else. hopefully not but this could possibly happen somewhere else. there are other nuclear power plants are around the ring of fire, many of them in the united states or other types of facilities around. so mother nature is troublesome and gives me in the opportunity unfortunately from time to time to react. the preparation peace is key. we learned at fukushima that the destruction of such events -- one then has to deal with the situation as you find it, go in with assets as you have them. as mentioned it's hard to invent new capabilities on the fly as you are going into the different operations so you go with what you have. we have robots that already have sensors on them that tashi into the sincerity data to the radio and pass back to the controllers so the operators can be remote from those robots. we learned we had to deal with that massive nature of the outcome of those events. to really prepare oftentimes organizations that have the need don't have the budget so we have to work with them to try to find the money so they can be ready in advance. the robots are key and we have seen this for what the military and first responders to the last decade in particular. there's a distance between operators for which they have to offer. and fukushima was a great example of that. yet another lesson learned from the operations in japan that continues to this day are those 20-year-olds. they are the rock stars. they get this technology, and they can learn how to use a robot in hours whereas someone my age or so might take a better part of a day or so. but in general, it's quite fast. the alternative to using unmanned systems as we have been describing is human exposure. it's not a good alternative, so we continue to emphasize the use of unmanned robots to safeguard. a wide variety of sensors qinetiq used by fire departments around the world and u.s. military. that concludes my presentation. [applause] >> i can't speak without a briefing. come on. sorry. go to the rabbit. here it is. okay. all right. bear with me just for a second. everybody needed a break anyway, right? all right. i'm lieutenant colonel licht thomas from the headquarters division also known as the global hawken so i'm going to present to you today what we did in the japanese earthquake. i want to start off by saying that the global hawk covetousness in the first time it's ever operated in humanitarian assistance or relief type of environment. the first one was actually in the southern california fire of 2007. that happened to be advantageous for the air force base in california located in the northern part could support the fires in southern california. the next year it just so happened we had five years in northern california area, so we supported that, and also as recently with the haiti earthquake we supported that. .. so within 21 hours of the earthquake, the global hawk was asked to support the government government of japan to find out how are those airports looking? we looked in the decode and also how to the cities look? the roadways en route raise, what kind of live communication and also what kind of services are available? of course we can't look them in there but we can see definitely if services are responding and this was as poor by the government of japan so that they would have inside on those facilities in order to provide relief. this is being persichette today. there we go. when we looked around the pacific theater understand the global hawk is a high altitude long endurance assets otis unmanned system what in in the air force recall in rpa because it is piloted and it was the best one to satisfy this persistent dynamic imagery requirements. what does that mean? we could park the global hawk over japan flying from guam or several hours up to 20 hours staying there and then we could dynamically caskets so as new kind of requirements became evident to aid workers we could read casket, so like i said within 21 hours the global hawk was airborne en route to japan. an interesting story is that was one month earlier than we even intended for the opal hot slippery because it'd just arrived in guam and they were doing standups and so forth so the story behind it is really an incredible effort because they had to do four things. first of all they do fix communications because we were preparing to go to japan to read a figure out how the satellite medications and fix some things that weren't ready. the second thing is that somebody has to look at all of that so what we call the exportation of that imagery. there wasn't a lot of that laying around. most of it devoted to send common operations in afghanistan to where to find somebody who is going to do that. the third thing we figure out how to casket because i counted the other day, there were 31 different major government agencies including the president's office and was asking for imagery so that needed to be prioritized and finally we just need to schedule it. the conflict with other things and make sure the eagle hawk was available. during that time the global hawk flew 20 missions as you can see here over 500 hours and thousands of images were cast. i bet you are hungry for some imagery. unfortunately at to admit global hawk is a spy plane similar to the u2 so the government of japan has asked the u.s. government not release any of that imagery so i have to kind of talk you through some of the things we saw. or stivale parts are quite a bit over the top of the nuclear reactors. one of the first as i said the president's office asked for imagery and status update. one of the things they want to know is what the status of the reactors but what we were able to do is use the ember red camera on global hawk to actually image and see with the temperatures were of those. because if we take an image of the temperature of the reactor and then we come back the next day and image that again and find it is hotter we know we have a problem. we did that for quite a few days, actually for 20 different missions and found that they were stable meaning that they were very very hot issue so that they but they weren't getting any hotter and the nuclear actors would take a long time to cool off. the imagery was used also in a maritime mode because all of that debris that washed wash out into the sea we needed to kind of find those plumes because the ronald reagan carrier group was also asked to respond. they don't want to sail all that into a nuclear active bloom, so we had to really find where that is to help their operations as well. so, they only gave me 10 minutes to brief so i'm really short here and i asked them, do you know who i am? essentially support a lot of government. the fact that the global hawk is often the first on station because of his persistence in range so once we got all of those four that i talked about fixed, we were able to get the global hawk on station and collect repeatedly over and over because the global hawk carries all of its sensors and carried a mullet rain so we are able to stay there and support and also be dynamically recast as new things came up because as the first level of awareness that the government wanted was infrastructure and then the reactors. then other pieces and parts which is finding that plume of debris that was out in the ocean. so mostly the global hawk focus on infrastructure damage and supporting real-time updates as the government also these ngos asked for. so that is pretty much my briefing in a nutshell and i will turn it over to our final speaker. [applause] >> good afternoon. gene is going to square me away with our i.t. stuff. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] >> my name is john priddy and i'm with u.s. customs and border protection. i happen to live in north dakota and i'm the director of the national security operation center there. we operate two and 29 predators but more specifically, we have seven m. t. nine's operating at u.s. customs and border protection and surely we should have nine. while we have had the aircraft primarily for law enforcement purposes obviously are residing we have had occasion to apply these technologies towards disaster relief and civil support operations. most notably, we have imagery, some video from fires. the colonel's initial speech about the global hawk is a very nice lead-in to what i'm going to talk to you a little bit about which is how bad is it? it is kind of the big question when they are talking about civil support in disaster relief. how bad is it, the world for real live in where we have limited resources and resourcing them intelligently and speeding aid to those who need it becomes very critical as decision-makers. especially when we are resource limited. we can call it the economic scarcity. an example is here, where is the fire? has anybody been to a forest fire? it is mostly smoke. not a lot of fire. you don't see the fire. using thermal imagery to look for the smoke is how we are able to management and the forestry service apply their firefighting skills toward the critical needs of where the fires are and not where they are not. very important message here is again, resource management. how bad is it? real quick vignette, 2005 i went to katrina. i flew a helicopter and i was part of the group became out of tucson and we went to katrina working with partners of fema. for five days we didn't lift a jug of water. we didn't save a person. instead what we did was we flew fema fast teams around with triage and trying to determine what critical infrastructure existed and how we were going to rush aid and supplies and trucks and vehicles and people with repaired electrical lines and robbery cars and things like that into where the damage was and how bad was it. we would come back to the end of every day and be with sticky tape notes about where the damage was and how bad it was. what would be the main supply routes and what would be the battle plan? and that on a conference table was considered a common operating picture of 2005. let me change may change a little bit from -- to show you. using radar, we were able to capture data, send it electronically over system that was developed by the marine corps called big pipe to a variety of emergency responders and emergency responders are just the first level responders. they are the planters. they are the people to that run the water department, the people that run the electrical department, department of transportation at handle the roads and the police department. formulating the common operating picture becomes important because the information strangely enough applies to all. jean, by close this will it close at all? i am sorry. there we go. i got it. i am smarter than this. will it open? so, here is an image of minot north dakota during the floods. this is actually previous to the floods. you see it is a very broad scope of a city. it is a common are pretty picture. you can see the rows and you can see the infrastructure. this happens to be one millimeter resolution on the radar. the fact that the radar gives you a black-and-white image essentially is that you can look at a photo and it is very important because it is common. you can see it and you can understand it. the other nice part about it is quantifiable. it is measurable. if you can see changes in trends and that becomes important when there is flooding. a flood in this example is a slow-moving disaster. if i'm a resource manager i may need to move resources and i only have so many dump trucks. i don't want to put it someplace where they're not needed. using this information with trigger points point.points in g in three days the water may reach this area is very critical to these emergency managers. it is a very rare occurring theme but it becomes very important in our world where money, the cost of a flood becomes very extensive. knowing plan it is going to impact in to what extent is going to impact becomes very important. we could look at the fact that when it comes to floods, there is overland flooding, not particularly important initially to roads and schools and infrastructure but when the cost of the corn goes up by 4 cents, that is an economic impact to all of us. so that is how we are using a lot of this. we have flown for the department of your os land management with the fires and that was kind of an example of using those resources and the optical infrared imagery to determine the fires and tacitly move those assets around in real time. i will tell you what, this thing is -- big pipe is a unique device so when we paired up with the nt nine it provides us with a couple of things that we couldn't ordinarily do. want it allows us to dynamically task a chat and that becomes very important when we have people, when we have people that want to retest the aircraft because they need to see something immediately so we have two types of imagery, stuff that we collect and use time and things that we want to see immediately and that goes back to that how bad is it? [inaudible conversations] just go back to the main points. being able to use its aircraft in a variety of means to give that information, to get that aerial perspective is really the key to success to a lot of these civil support missions because given that clarity, removing the fog of war, or moving the fog battle for research and ambiguity so we know exactly how bad the situation is and knowing what assets we need to bring to the side. has anybody had kids who have wrecked your car and they say hey that it is really not that bad? you find out your card isn't about four pieces. if you'd known it was in four pieces, you would have been a lot angrier before you got home and he would have changed the dynamic of the situation before you think of back to the house. it is very similar if we know that this flooding is that bad. we can rush those critical needs to them and to obey moving assets to areas that are not as important. i think the biggest thing that we have drawn from this is, this has been an evolving thing for customs and border protection. initially it was something we did as an aside and then it became an ever evolving mission and something we became very good at and developed this technology with big pipe of getting that information to all users on an unclassified level in the emergency into the local governments where they could get the information, action and an resource to properly. so it is really been a phenomenal event for all of us at dhs, in particular organization because each year we have gotten better at this. as general cousteau nick says the big one comes someday, a lot of these are a reversal for the big one, whatever it is, and i think the marines will be ready for that by being able to apply this technology in a smart manner bring everybody together so that you get a good common operating picture so they are able to apply resources rapidly, quickly and efficiently. are there any questions? >> you my name is lydia and i'm with the group qinetiq. we know johnson a traditional way in savings lives and not -- lives. drones from pakistan have killed hundreds and hundreds of innocent people. in fact what some of our figures show is that 50 innocent people are killed for every militants that is killed and this was also something --. >> if you have a question, ask it to the speaker please, not to the audience. >> i've just want to pass out a flyer. >> no, not a flyer. >> is just information and you can go to qinetiq.org and see how we are protesting. >> ask your question please. >> i wonder what you have to say about the drones that have killed hundreds and hundreds of civilians. >> is your question to any particular speaker? >> to anybody was willing to answer. >> anybody want to answer that question? you don't have to. >> i would really like an answer. >> you will get one if they will give you one. >> why don't you give them a little time. >> we have no weaponized programs. >> global hawk is not weaponized. >> i was wondering that was unique mission for global hawk. [inaudible] i was wondering if through that mission you learned of any areas where there is room for improvement with local hawk or if you've identified any capabilities? be the isr platforms we are always learning what they are capable of doing and one of the things is can you take temperatures from the global hawk camera? i said no you can tell if it is hot or cold but actually we found out by taking relative temperature in the area, we could tell with the heat of those reactors are plus or minus 10 degrees celsius so pretty close and especially when we are talking about huge temperatures that were pretty significant. the other key thing is always trying to find out that has to task it because in any kind of disaster and a humanitarian, everyone is rushing and tried to figure out how to prioritize and so forth in the same thing goes for the global hawk. who has priority? where should it go and what are the things that needs to do? >> the one good thing about the cameras of global hawk would take a wide swath and see a lot of areas. out of the smaller systems are going to be in a more isolated area. you will see kind of not really a soda straw but that area versus global hawk can take up to two kilometers in area and see what is going on. >> anybody else wanting to respond to that question? next question? yes, sir. >> jim wolf with reuters. following up on global hawk, i wonder if you can bring us up to date on any discussions with friends and allies on using the global hawk and a kind of as a shared asset in the region but the cost afraid by the countries that would. >> the's is a little different. there is nothing -- about sharing but we do have -- we need to have regional cooperation and engagement. for example of something happens in the malaga straits tomorrow which is a major shipping lightly to be able share that information with the host nation countries to get support, to get airspace, to be able to fly over and find out what is going on. those discussions have been occurring piecemeal. now that the global hawk has deployed earlier this spring they are starting to pick up more. >> are there any steps underway to actually create a formal organization that would oversee a corporate agreement for the shared uses of assets? >> no, not a shared use and we have discussed different countries have different needs. the global hawk is part of an isr enterprise. there are other things in that enterprises will such is in q1 and him q. nine, but nothing formal. >> anybody else want to respond to that one? next question. this gentleman right here in the blue shirt and then you, sir. >> david -- with the global hawk being operational how far said air force gone and correcting some of the operational issues and the sensors? >> we have made great strides. understand that this was appointed time so we tested that also define it really what are the things that we missed and developing the platform and since then we have corrected them and probably the best one is the 25 -- generator which was causing some of the reliability. that has since been fixed and operating over 6000 hours without incident. before we could barely get through 170 hours without having some kind of incident, having to replace the generator so great strides and we are finding the program has been very reliable and a lot of demand for the global hawk. >> yes, sir. >> recently it has become. >> name and affiliation please. >> i'm with voices of los angeles. recently has been news that they are using these drones in their attacks on gaza strip and using it as surveillance and i'm wondering, rather countries going to be using these drones on their own civilians and is this going to be used on other civilians like it is in gaza and maybe even here? >> let me talk about here. back to the 2007 flyers. we had huge, trying to set the stage for you. their member the whole southern california area from san diego to l.a. was on fire. they were going to shut down the southern california faa trade con because the fires were shutting down the whole airspace. we need to know the riverside command center needed to know where the fires were and how to put those limited resources and most laces. we need global hawk. unfortunately as i said the global hawk is a spy plane so we were actually delayed because people said you are going to go to jail due to the church committee if you send that thing on u.s. soil. we had to go through northern command to get presidential approval to go okay, we are not spying. we are doing a humanitarian relief mission and you can use the global hawk in this case. cigarette that up what i'm trying to say is if we don't willy-nilly throw collection on the united states soil, there is lots of laws and so forth that we are bound to and we are reticent in doing that. >> anyone else? yes, sir. [inaudible] what was the major challenge to japan? >> the major challenge as challenges they stated was the fact it was brand-new and we had only been doing training missions up to that point. one of the communication terminals was broken. way to very quickly fixed that and then find all those resources that are in support of the real world mission. as i mentioned the present of the united states united states said i need information now. this was the only assets to provide that rod view. there was no resistance from the government of japan and of course they were willing to get any help that they could to try to assess the damage and so forth. [inaudible] >> i don't have the exact day. it was 11 of march when it happened and we were flying within 21 hours after the request was sent so i don't know the exact number. >> yes, sir. >> there has been a lot of talk lately. >> name and affiliation? >> scott fontaine. there is but a lot of talk of using isr assets and the potential for mass atrocity response and prevention response operations. i was wondering is there any kind of doctrine from the industry guys? has there have been interest out there in that aspect? >> not real familiar. can he repeat that turned? >> asked atrocity prevention and response operation. is essentially using american assets for u.n. peacekeeping type of stuff. i was wondering if there is anything going on with that? >> i am not sure. that were probably above global hawk in specifics. i don't know about any doctrine on it. anybody else? >> i am not aware of doctrine. however many of our u.n. brethren use our assets and whatever type of operations whether they are peacekeeping operations, combat operations, disaster relief operations they have unmanned assets. >> john bennett from "the hill" newspaper. the armed services committee has expressed their concerns about the operating and procurement costs of global hawk and i'm just curious, and especially now with this new budget environment what are you all doing to get both your procurement and the operating costs down and have you sped up those efforts given the recent developments? >> that is a good question. you have to throw these other guys some questions though. the global hawk is brand-new and through the whole development of the program even if you look back at material dated back to the 2002 timeframe, is a complex system and we are not always certain how much it would cost. for example back in those days it was supposed to cost $10 million a copy but no one knows where that number came from. somebody said well i think it should cost 10 million. when it didn't cost a million we went back and try to tried to find out he said that. there was no bigger or data behind that so already the lobo holocausts are coming down as we realize what it takes to operate and what things are more reliable that we have to replace them with things aren't. i often like to say the u2 that the global hawk will transition in that role, they had many years to figure out the platform we are flying now is 30 years in the u2 goes back into the 50s. they have lots of experience in their logistics and their repair cycles and so with. we just received our first brand-new global hawk this year in the latter half of last year so we are still learning some of those things that we are already starting to see costs coming down. >> how much? >> how much in the cost? >> that they are coming down. can you give us a ballpark? >> i would say percentagewise it is in a low digits right now, five to 10%, starting to come down but for the billion-dollar program -- [inaudible] >> we have one more question but before we do that if you haven't signed in, when you leave please sign-up. the next question is this lady over here. >> i have one more question. you did say they are parting qasr coming down but when you look at the numbers between -- the budget shows about $2 billion less and i'm just wondering why that is? >> sure, well what we discovered the estimates, the afghan estimates in the air combat command estimates, that is what they are assessed in a testament do we go back. the cape goes in and tries to do interviews with people to say how much is this going to cost him a lot of his estimates. i don't know how many tires i'm going going to need depending on how much of operations i'm going to do and so forth. just the fact that we started flying this march we are already starting to discover that we are starting to understand what those costs are. >> that will do it. we are out of time. thank you very much. thank two i speakers very much. [applause] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] as an aspiring journalist i am party preparing myself for the very small salary that i will be starting out with. >> to be good journalist to uft be disciplined enough to put aside your bias and report the tax. >> the reason why people love "fox news" and like moving so much is because it is an experience. is emotional come is love and in a. >> from the journalist conference at aspiring high school journalism ethics, the role of opinion and commentary and where they get their news and information in today's multimedia environment. sunday on c-span's q&a. >> now roger di silvestro talks about his book "theodore roosevelt in the badlands." the book chronicles teddy roosevelt's time in the dakota territory in the 1880s before he became president. from the national portrait gallery and washington, this is 45 minutes. >> our author today is previously confessed that he first became acquainted with their 26 president through the classics illustrated centennial publication called theodore roosevelt rough riders. from that early moment in his youth, our author was influenced by the character and philosophy of that vigorous and hearty individual. like theodore roosevelt, roger di silvestro is both a naturalist and a writer. also there exists another commons nominator between them. roosevelt understood the american west from having lived and worked in the american west. the same is true of mr. di silvestro. mr. di silvestro has knowledge of all of america and is the product of a career that is taking them all over our country. is lived in the bronx, in san francisco and in many places in between. if it can be said that the later workings of theodore roosevelt can only truly be understood by understanding his time out west and his hiatus from politics, they can -- you can also be said that one might well understand this critical and understudied period of roosevelt's life through the lens of mr. di silvestro. here to discuss his work, "theordore roosevelt in the badlands" a young politician's quest for recovery in the american west is roger di silvestro. thank you. [applause] >> thank you for that wonderful introduction. it made a somewhat interested in my own life. thank you too for showing up on such a rigidly hot and humid day. is really tropical out there and so i'm doubly happy that you are willing to whether that and come out today. my book about theodore roosevelt tells the story of personal tragedy and recovery and we don't usually associate tragedy with theodore roosevelt. especially as president but i'm not writing about the iconic theodore roosevelt committed to mt. rushmore. i'm writing about a much younger man in his mid-20s who went west to run a cattle ranch in the badlands of dakota territory and what is now north dakota close against the montana border. it is an extreme western north dakota. he didn't just go west as horace greeley might have is a young man. he is compelled to go west. events forced him in that direction and we will get to that. but before we head off into the badlands i want to give aid reef background on theodore roosevelt, the roosevelt aficionados will probably be familiar with this but i heard there were high points in his life we need to touch him. started life as a city kid in new york city and he was a member of the abbey social elite, the knickerbockers here where people who could trace their ancestry american back to the dutch that arrived in the mid-1660s. he was a fairly old new york family. his grandfather was one of the five richest men in manhattan. the family made their money on glass. they produce a lot of the wind of glass that york city needed as they grew. there were also into banking and a lot of wise investments in new york real estate. young roosevelt was an avid outdoors person almost from childhood and also an avid hunter, but he wasn't very healthy. he was very sick he is a child. he suffered from asthma and from a stomach ailment that seemed to be related to stress in some sort of enteritis that would leave him second for days at a time. and this would pop up you know as i said during times of stress but even during happy times. if he had too good a time he would sometimes get sick to his stomach and have to go to bed sometimes for days. in his autobiography, which i quote in my book roosevelt wrote, this is sickly delicate void, suffered much from asthma and frequently had to be taken away on trips to find a place where i could read. one of my memories is of my father walking up and down the room with me and in his arms at night when i was a very small person and sitting up in bed gasping with my father and mother trying to help me. i'm sure that in all these years of sickness as a child ship a lot of his attitudes later in life. when he was about 12 we started strenuous physical fitness regimen designed to build up his chest and help them with his breathing and his asthma. and it didn't really relieve him of asthma or enteritis, but he did become much sturdier and must heartier so that in his teens he actually won a boxing championship at the gym where he worked out. and he also took, when he went to harvard, he took trips to maine, hunting trips to maine and they would hike around and deep snows and mountainsides and so on. he was very rugged. but he was still not a robust person. he was about five feet eight inches and weighed maybe 135, 140 pounds. in his senior year at harvard the doctor told them he had a weak heart and should avoid vigorous activity and roosevelt pledged he would do the exact opposite of that. now if we can go back to mid-september 1883, we find 24-year-old "theordore roosevelt in the badlands" of dakota territory. we see him ride around on horseback oftentimes in the pouring rain hunting for buffalo or american bison if you prefer that term. the bison were nearly extinct in north america at that time and roosevelt wanted to kill one before they wrote on which was a fairly typical attitude among sport hunters of that time. they oftentimes were almost in a race to kill the last of the species. so in 18831 of the few places where bison still from south of canada was in in the badlands dakota territory which is why roosevelt went there. he hired a guy who spent three weeks writing around tracking down bison. during those weeks roosevelt developed a kind of an infatuation with the badlands, this kind of weird land formations they have their, the remoteness of the area appealed to him. it was a rich grassland so that he knew he could raise cattle in this area and also there was the hunting. the dakotas were one of the last places where you could still find most of america's big game animals and shoot them. so before returning home roosevelt wrote a check for $14,000 in turn it over to two men that he met up there, and told them to buy some cattle for him and put them on the land of a claimed as their own. they would manage these cattle for him and take a share of his profits. he was pretty trusting in this. he told the minute i didn't trust you i wouldn't give this money. they said to them -- him, how do you know i can be trusted? at that time a lot of wealthy easterners and europeans were investing in cattle because cattle in the 1880s were like tech stocks in the 1990s with much the same results for investors by the way. was about but he found a way to make money quickly and without any risks, so now his uncle james roosevelt who was his financial buys are visor told in a cattle were really a shaky deal and he should avoid it but roosevelt forged ahead anyway. consummately when he turned -- return home he was a rental or a cattlemen. cattleman. he was in a good point in his life at this moment. in late 1883 his career was going well. it got himself elected to the new york state assembly at the age of 23 making the youngest person who had ever held never held an office there he became one of the leading political lives of his time. is a household word across the state of new york. he is a reform politician. he was part of a group of young must -- mostly on politicians were trying to root out the corruption that plagued people in both the state and local levels. he was an anticorruption candidate because he was wealthy and there was a sense he could not be corrupted so he quit it became kind of a hero. is a matter of fact one of his colleagues that of roosevelt he hailed him as the dawn of the new air. he was our ideal. the political success was the only thing it going for him. in december 1882 when he was barely 24 his first book was published, the naval -- history of the naval war of 1812. it was the first of about 40 books he would write in his lifetime and is sold three editions within two years and became a college textbook at several schools and it could be found at every vessel in the us navy because it was required to be there by regulation. the book itself is pretty -- and then there was alice, his wife. this is really the heart of the story here. she was a cousin of one of his harvard classmates and he first met her at her home outside austin october of 1878 when he was a junior in college. alice hathaway lee was a member of a wealthy banking family in the boston area. she was quite a beauty. relatives described her as having golden hair and of grey eyes. she stood about five feet seven inches which made her an only an inch shorter than theodore roosevelt. she was so bright and energetic or family called her sunshine. she was quite athletic. she won tennis tournaments and she liked long cross-country tag's -- treks. was literate. they like the same post especially henry wadsworth longfellow who wrote one of his favorite homes the side of a love which is predictably about a warrior king. so emad alice and he pursued her for well over a year. she kept encouraging him and discouraging him and encouraging him and discouraging him and at times he got so overwrought that in the autumn of 1879 into the winter that year there were many nights when he didn't go to bed. he would wander around the snowy woods in cambridge massachusetts all night inking about her. one of his fellow students was so alarmed that he actually called up, contacted roosevelt family and said you had better come down here and talk to him. he is flipping. roosevelt himself would later say he was nearly crazy during the year he is pursuing her. in january of 1880 after much pleading on his part she agreed to marry him. he wrote in his diary, and i focus on this period in my book and i cole from his letters to her and her to him. they are quite emotional but he wrote in his diary that his loving alice makes her happy she shall be happy. so there we have roosevelt in the late 1883 as a rancher, and political power, not there and marry two married to a woman he deeply loves. and she is pregnant with their first child. everything is good for theodore roosevelt at this time but as people have been saying for thousands of years, fortune is fickle. in on the morning of the 313, 1884 roosevelt was an alpine a devastated simply and he received a message saying he was now the father of her little girl. later that afternoon he received another message saying that his wife wasn't doing very well and he should come home. so we got on the train and headed back generic city on a foggy night and didn't get home until midnight. he went to his mother's house which was where his wife was staying during the final weeks of her pregnancy. he knocked on the door in and his younger brother elliott who would one day be the father of eleanor roosevelt, answered the door and said immediately, there is a curse on this house. it not only was roosevelt's wife gravely ill but so was his mother. within the next 14 hours both his mother and his wife died. his wife while he held her in his arms. his mother died of typhoid at the age of 48 and his 22-year-old wife of kidney failure, bright's disease. during the days leading up to the funeral roosevelt was in a daze. around this time he wrote in his diary for joy or sorrow by wife -- life is now been lived out. he was never going to love again and probably never be happy again. he concluded that the only way to escape from this grinding grief was activities and a lot of hard work so we went back to albany and he threw himself into a lot of political work. he produced documents, something like a million pages long, and he just kept a horrendous pace and he also got involved in national politics. he was head of the new york delegation to the republican national convention that year and he led the fight to keep james g. playing a former u.s. senator from maine. he tried to keep wayne from winning the nomination because he symbolize corruption. my book details that campaign a little. i tried not to go into too much detail on the things that were covered in most other books, but i do talk about that if you want more details on the. at any rate blaine did when they domination and roosevelt was somewhat dismayed. but nevertheless this brings us to a major turning point in roosevelt's life, period for which he emerge much more is the theodore roosevelt that the world knows today. practically the moment the gop convention and he got on the train and headed back to the badlands and the hope that he could settle down in the west running his ranch, become a writer and forget his sorrows and mend his health. why he chose the badlands is another question. the badlands was in the area of the last frontier which would be closed or declared closed six years later. the badlands gave roosevelt a chance to actually live on the frontier and be a pioneer like his heroes daniel boone and davy crockett and so on. and, it would give him a chance to hunt because of all the big game which i suspect was a wonderful distraction from the depression haunting him at this time. gave him a right good life with a lot of fresh air so there was a hope that he could recover his health and on the aside writes books. did in fact write simple books. he established himself as an author. before we go on with roosevelt let's take a look at the badlands environment at that time. that time was june 8 come 1884 and that is when he arrived there. he got off the train them adore dakota territory which is brand-new town. there were 100 buildings there and it only been established for five months earlier. there about 300 residents in this town permanent and transient residents. this included minors and lumberjacks, former buffalo hunters and ranchers and cowboys. ranting in the dakota badlands was unlike any cattle operation in america today. it was -- which you may be familiar with. just as roosevelt did ranchers would just buy a bunch of cattle and turn them loose along the little missouri river in this case and the cattle would roam around like wild animals. there were no fences. the rancher would build a house along the river in his headquarters with corrals and outbuildings and that was the ranch. the ranchers didn't own the land. they were spotters in the land actually belonged to the federal government or the american people into the railroads. in fact a rancher who apply for title to his plan which seems kind of -- because they wonder by what he do that? putting up offense was a fence was absolutely to buzo this was the wide-open west. twice a year of course they ranchers would have to round up all their cattle and brand them so they could tell -- it was the only way of knowing who's cattle were where they would ship off some of the cattle to market. the roundup was almost a festival one of the few times the folks got together in a numbers because usually they were scattered across these ranches. them and to work the cattle range could be divided into two classes. there were cattlemen and ranchers like roosevelt and there were the cowboys who worked for the ranchers. they were employees. contemporary to the 1880s took a dim view of cowboys. the cheyenne daily leader in 1882 called cowboys foul mouth drunken and lecherous and utterly -- utterly corrupt. roosevelt though thought cowboys were terrific. this book rants life on on a hunting show roosevelt broke the cowboys quote were is hearty and self-reliant as any man whoever briefed with bronze faces and keen eyes that looked all the world straight in the face without flinching as they would flush out from under their broad brim hats. he said he thought they were much better fellows in the small farmers are agricultural laborers and mechanics and workmen workman of the great cities. he thought they should even be mentioned in the same breath. there was a british fellow who came out to colorado in the 1860s and he claimed that he came from when the sleep is towns in new england. the one-day side cowboy riding through town shooting up his gun at night, probably drunken alongside him on another horse was a young woman wearing only a chemise. this british fellow look at him and he thought this is life with a capital l. some people really like this whole thing. with the exception of some of the bosses in the ranchers in the cattle owners, the average age of the cowboys in the 1880s was 23 or 24. there was little in the way of local law-enforcement there and many of the men carried guns and knives and looked for entertainment insulins. they were mixing weapons, boozing young men which was the perfect combination for a civil society i am sure. it may come as no surprise that if you live in a cow town you were 10 to 40 times more likely to be murdered than if you lived in new york city or boston at that time. part of the process was these people had an exaggerated sense of honor and if you insulted somebody he would blow you away or try to. roosevelt himself and this is a little aside. i don't want to run over but this is a good story. roosevelt was discouraged from carrying a gun when he was them adore. he was told them ring -- i don't bring your guns to town. the newspaper editor of the local newspaper told him if you bring a gun to town somebody is liable to try and push their luck with you and they will probably kill you because they will be better with a gun in your. the editor had one of the local gunmen came out and they threw two cans near. the gunman both drew a gun and five holes hit each can before they hit the ground. roosevelt said, he would check the man with the editor of the newspaper when he was in town. so, you have this pretty violent region going on here. life is pretty raw but it wasn't necessarily broad enough for theatre roosevelt. the ranch that he set out outside them adore during this time was seven miles out of town on one of the main trails. he got sick of people stopping in and he established another ranch 30 miles north way on the middle of nowhere. that is where it is still today. the ranch is gone but that site is still very remote. it is all their roads and it takes about an hour to get there. it is a long drive out there. and so at that ranch he called the -- ranch. he put cattle out there and then both ranches he had managers to take care of his cattle for him. he didn't really -- he was a rancher and he did work on the roundups and he would occasionally do work around the ranch. but mostly he was interested in writing and hunting and he could interpret hunting as a way of ranch work because he would shoot deer to provide meat for his men. they almost every cattle in the ranch country. they mostly wild game. roosevelt spent a lot of his time hunting and he also took long trips out to montana and wyoming to hunt grizzly bears and elk and so one. and mountain goats and then he would write books about this. he made quite a bit of money. he also made frequent trips home to visit his family no -- so he whenever statement that lands more than four months at a time. during the three years or so that he was ranting a spent a total of 360 days out there coming and going, coming and going. if ever man was unlike the cowboy in material it was theodore roosevelt and 1884. is new york accident was grating to a lot of new yorkers. is considered a snob accent. and also as the the i said he wasn't a man of much stature weighing under 140 pounds. he also had some eccentricities that the cowboys could not quite understand. he shaved every day and it rushed his teeth every day, and this was sort of beyond them. he also slept with his head on an inflatable rubber pillow which is not exactly my image of theodore roosevelt, this tough guy. in fact he had an inflatable pillow that he took with him when he went hunting and get a rubber bathtub shipped out to him so he could take baths. but that was neat in the end of it. he also had special soap that he liked likes and he would send -- ask his sisters to send in large them large quantities of the special soap that he wanted because he didn't want to have to use castilian so. to top it all off he wore glasses which cows boys did not wear glasses. that was considered a real sign of weakness. as if all that weren't enough to buy himself a french suede suit, you know which is what he is wearing on the cover of the book here. that was a course for him a major symbol because that is what daniel boone war. so he was on the front tyranny have this fringed outfit and he also had a knife made from a tiffany sandy had guns with ivory handles with initials carved into them and so on. you can imagine him going into tiffany's to order a knife but this was roosevelt. one cowboy when he met them at this time said roosevelt was a slam anemic looking young young fellow just an exaggerated style which newcomers on the frontier affected and considered indisputable of a tenderfoot. you probably don't want to be ranked a tenderfoot to roosevelt had to establish himself as a man of man and these were lawless armed men. chances to prove himself popped up again and again as you might imagine in that environment improves himself very well. are deadly the most important events of the sword, talk about several of his interactions with people but the most famous one to place in montana, today known as lamont montana were roosevelt stopped in one night after he had spent the day riding around looking for some lost horses. a check down to a hotel and went into the saloon and was immediately confronted by a man with the gunny chand who was who was drunk and had been shooting holes in the saloon clock. he also was intimidating everyone in the bar and forcing people to buy drinks own roosevelt came in he called roosevelt for eisen told him it is time to buy a round of drinks for everyone in the place. roosevelt tried to avoid the kind he took it table behind the stove where he hoped he wouldn't be seen but the fellow followed called him and said hey, by a round of drinks. roosevelt stood up and said well if i have got to i've got to. roosevelt was trained boxer so what he felt he had to do was punch the lights out of the sky come which he did. he socked him three times in the job. the man fell backwards and his guns went off in the fellow hit his head on the bar and not himself senseless. roosevelt took his guns in the patrons of the bar who are probably much happier now than they were before roosevelt showed up to his fellow and dumped them in a shed behind the saloon. the next day he jumped afraid and left town. the story immediately spread all over the area and roosevelt, people began thinking he may be a pretty cool guy after all even though he wears glasses and his kind has kind of a weird suit. and, so that started to help his reputation a lot. i found interviews with folks who knew him back then that were route west and they said that was the stepping off point for him in the west. but he also proved himself in tamer ways. a work side-by-side with the cowboys and ranchers and work very hard. this was an area where you don't tell the reputation on your family name or your social connections are your well. it was based on how you performed as an individual. roosevelt performed very well. on his first roundup the cowboys really began to have a good impression of him. on that first round of about 60 cowboy spent five weeks writing for 200 miles time, little was -- missouri river valley scooping up the cattle they could find were 50 miles on each side of the river and they were driving several thousand horses because if you have 60 riders, you needed about 6010 horses per person to do this work. there was a lot of work involved in hurting these animals along. the cowboys notice roosevelt was extremely tough. he could ride all night long in the next day write another 100 miles and on one occasion he wrote for 40 straight hours. he would go around five horses before he himself took a map -- map. the cowboys admired his willingness to pitch in to the extent he could. he wasn't a good roper because that takes a lifetime of practice and then his eyesight wasn't very good but they recognized that he did what he could. one of the tougher ranch foreman said that 48 maverick has sand in his craw of plenty. the effort he put into ranching paid off by -- one newspaper reporter told his readers what a change. last march he was a pale slim young man with a 10 piping voice in the and the general looks of dyspepsia -- dyspepsia. the voices hard and strong enough to drive oxen. another reporter pointed out he was losing its eastern acts in which they thought was a good idea. the badlands was not a complete success because he still suffered emotional over alice's death. he told one of his ranch managers in regard to lsu elsie was beyond any healing and the ranch managers said, who it also lost his wife recently, started to console roosevelt and roosevelt cut them off and said now don't talk to me about time omega difference. time on the up or change that respect. of course we no it is not a good idea to say never. but roosevelt had no intention to remarry. he felt that to remarry within months or even years after his wife's death would be a sign of ethical and moral collapse, real lack of

Related Keywords

Montana ,United States ,Nevada ,California ,San Diego ,Washington ,District Of Columbia ,San Francisco ,Mexico ,Netherlands ,Wyoming ,Massachusetts ,Dhaka ,Bangladesh ,Iowa ,Chicago ,Illinois ,Haiti ,New York ,Canada ,Japan ,Tokyo ,North Carolina ,Afghanistan ,Boston ,Virginia ,Georgia ,Gaza Strip ,Guam ,London ,City Of ,United Kingdom ,Pakistan ,Maine ,Israel ,Cheyenne ,Colorado ,Gaza ,Israel General ,Shanksville ,Pennsylvania ,Sweden ,Maryland ,Ohio ,North Dakota ,France ,Americans ,America ,Mexican ,Swedes ,Afghan ,French ,Dutch ,British ,Israeli ,Japanese ,American ,Licht Thomas ,Scott Fontaine ,Theodore Roosevelt ,John Bennett ,David Cameron ,Daniel Boone ,Ronald Reagan ,Davy Crockett ,John Pistole ,John Priddy ,Ben Mike Holden ,Jerry Brown ,Peter Hickman ,Duncan Hines ,James Roosevelt ,Al Qaeda ,Dennis Sweeney ,Baltimore Arnold ,Horace Greeley ,Ricky Thomas ,Cousteau Nick ,Charlie Dena ,Charlie Clark ,Tiffany Sandy ,Tsa John Pistole ,Alice Hathaway Lee ,Los Angeles ,Richard Clark ,Brian Tierney ,Lsu Elsie ,Adam Nixon ,Eleanor Roosevelt ,Henry Wadsworth Longfellow ,Emad Alice ,Sheila Dixon ,