In afternoon, i am tom putnam director of the library and museum, on behalf of heather, ceo of the Kennedy Library foundation and all of my library and Library Foundation collects, i think you for coming. Welcome those watching on cspan and acknowledge the generous underwriters of the Kennedy Library the lead sponsor bank of america, the vole institute, the Boston Foundation and art media sponsors, the boston globe, infinity and w dr. In reading the new book, rosemary, the hidden kennedy daughter. I was struck by an observation from sr. Margaret and, one of ann, one of the caregivers in the later years in wisconsin, that rosemary had a magnetic personality. As others before us we too are drawn to the story, perhaps like greeks attending a theatrical tragedy, tragedy, we know in advance the tragic ending to come and we watch the actions of two protagonists. First, roads kennedy and her retailers effort to protect her eldest daughter and later joe, the patriarch, in his unending search for a cure that would not come. Then, for that placement where his beloved rosemary could grow and feel productive. She was born born in an age when intellectually challenged and learning disabled children have few options. Bleak, Educational Opportunities and limited prospects to lead independent lives. Just kennedy was protective of his children. So fearful fearful that one of his sons might die should the u. S. Go to war in europe, he did everything in his power, including disobeying the very president who once pointed him ambassador to prevent the epic of world war ii. His greatest fears would come true of course, losing his firstborn son joe junior, and a few months later, his poor widow daughter, kathleen. Rosemary might also be considered a victim of that war, in the one setting where she most flourished was under the care of mother isabel of the assumption care of mother isabel of the assumption sisters of the belmont house, outside of london, which joe described in the letter to his wife as providing quote, the ideal life for rosemary. The school use the montessori method and since rosemary was older than the other student shes served as mother isabels assistant. About this time, kay larson notes, rosemarys favorite story to read two younger story was winnie the pooh. One of the few books she could read with confidence. As a storm clouds of world war grew, rosemary pleaded with her father not to move her from the belmont house, yet thinking he was protecting her safety, he chose to send her back to rejoin the rest of the family in the United States. Much in a few years he would make a similarly fatal medical decision. If we know the contours of the saga, kate larsen unveils them to us in a refreshing manner, trained as a historian and the author of her three books, including a biography of harriet timing, she is the first biographer to have access to many of rosemarys letters as well as newly released family material here at the Kennedy Library. The New York Times described as quote a valuable account of a Mental Health tragedy and an influential family related effort to make amends. The book is on sale at our bookstore and there will be a book signing fining the form. Our moderator this afternoon, Eileen Mcnamara is a professor of journalism, a former boston globe column issue in the 1997 Pulitzer Prize for commentary. She became a columnist after more than 20 years as a reporter covering everything from the police beat to the United States congress. The sign of the times in which she lives, and the challenges she overcame, it should be noted that she began her career at the globe as a newsroom secretary. She is currently working on a biography of Eunice Kennedy shriver. Speaking of mrs. Schreiber, the last time she spoke here rosemary was very much on her mind. I thought it might be appropriate to share a brief excerpt of her remark as part of this introduction. You not be surprised to know that i believe those same qualities were also the experience that shaped president kennedy. Truthfully i believe rosemary rejection had far more to go with the brilliance of the presidency than anyone can understand. Yes, he was our crest on tran countries champion on what we all call mental retardation. To this day, his legacy of innovation and creating university affiliated centers, the council remains today one of the great histories of our country. Beyond the work he did for people with intellectual disability, i believe it was rosemary, influence that centralized him and all of us to take care of vulnerable and weak people. I think i can say that not one among 1000 who have written about him has understood what it was really like to be a brother of a person with mental retardation. Tonight i want to say, that i have never said before, more than any single individual, rosemary had the greatest influence. [applause]. The new book concludes by discovering the work of various members of the shriver family to whom she passed her chart. The ceo Special Olympics echoes his mothers concern because her siblings were touched by witnessing resumes early early struggles in the tragic turn in her life trajectory. One can still picture rosemary in those years in england, when the world was most kind to her, reading Christopher Robbins words to her friend pooh, quote quote promise me you always remember, your braided then you believe, stronger than he seemed, and smarter than you think. Due to circumstances be on her control, Rosemary Kennedy lived a diminished life. Yet we live in an age that is more fully sensitized to the bravery and strength of the vulnerable among us, and for that may Rosemary Kennedy always be remembered. Please join me now and welcome me kate tour stage. [applause]. Thank you all. So kate, could you have picked a more challenging topic . You have a woman who disappeared from public view in 1941 when she was only 23 years old. Where does a biographer even begin . More portly, why . Those are two great questions. Why is easier to answer, back in 2005 i saw rosemarys obituary in the newspaper and it was like a three paragraph obituary in the boston globe. For some reason, it just hit me. I have been vaguely aware of rosemary and of course i was very aware of the Kennedy Family having grown up in new england. I just thought oh, this life, what happened to her . As a womans historian, my antenna went up right away like, why dont we know more about her. So i checked it in the back of my mind and i was working on another book project. I just had the sense that i should investigate her life and that might be my next project. So when i did start researching her life, it may have been so in a bit of naivety on my part thinking i would be able to unearth all of this information and it would not be any problem, i could write this most beautiful young woman and about what happened to her. The process took longer than i thought because the record was a little spotty, over the years more and more papers became available so it made it easier. It is is a challenge to write about someone who disappears and who leaves few papers behind. But it is possible. Tell us what you think about rosemarys life before the lobotomy, wish you a happy child . Was she integrated into the life of the family . Rosemary was an adorable child, happy, but also she struggled and suffered in trying to compete with her much more capable siblings. She was integrated into the family when she was home and her family did a great job to accommodate her disability. They would play sports with her, they would go sailing with her, they would take the helm but help her be part of that sailing. Tennis, all of the sports that they are all capable of doing themselves, she needed help, but they accommodated her. That of course influence eunice as an adult to start the Special Olympics. She knew that sports was an important aspect for every human being, but also for people with disabilities. So she was happy on the one hand, on the other hand she was very unhappy because of the struggle she faced and her parents also center off to many different schools over a period of ten years. That was very hard on a young child, a teenager, young, young adult woman who is constantly separated from her family who she loved very much and wanted to be with. So her life had Bright Moments but also a lot of struggle. Was she was only 11 right i think when she went to the first boarding school that they sent her to pennsylvania. So she never did adjust very well when she had these big transitions in her life. She she never stayed at the schools very long, it seemed. Did it not occur to her parents at some point that maybe this approach was not working for her . It is not clear whether they understood that bouncing her from one school to the next was actually harming her. I think they tried really hard to find a place where she could learn and be safe and achieve things that they expected her to achieve. When those schools did not seem to perform for them they did not wait, they just put her in another school. That is unfortunate. She suffered tremendously from the transition of school to school. In some ways to me they treated her a lot like they treated the other children. All the children moved, when rosewood moved down to florida for the winter, the kids would go to school down there. It must have been standard operating procedure. It was partly standard operating procedure, but also with rosemary she needed more time to make adjustments and that was very unfair to her. That was clear after the first transition to a few different schools. So it is unfortunate that rose and choate did not take a step back and say, maybe we should pause here before we center to a different school. They school. They also had Unrealistic Expectations of her and they expected that you perform better in the schools, she just couldnt. She was not capable. At the time, most schools cannot provide appropriate Educational Programming for people with educational difficulties like rosemary have. So they were determined they would cure her of her disabilities when you know in fact, that is is not possible. In fact, maybe that illusion and that approach explains the approach, she was was fairly high functioning young woman, was that she . She was presented to the king and queen of england as a debutante. She achieved about a fourthgrade education level. Her maturity level was probably about the same, it is hard to say because i never met her in person, but given what she writes in the letters that are here at the Kennedy Library you can see that her emotional level is quite immature. But she could function, today she would certainly be mainstreamed in classrooms and as an adult, perhaps even live independently with resources and a support system. In those days, none of that was available. Available. Ms stigma, does that stigma explain some of the complicity of what you describe in the book where rose and joe did not exactly reveal everything about rosemarys abilities when they put her in one school or another school. They sort of suggested she was higher functioning that when she was. The first school they sent her away to when she was 11 years old was the Devereaux School and pennsylvania. That was a school created for children with intellectual disabilities. The woman who ran the school was very successful with other students. Because the kennedys believe rosemary could be cured, they really were not able to accept that label that she had disabilities. They were not pleased with her progress there so they moved her to other schools, traditional schools. She cannot keep up with classmates even though she may be put in a class room with other eighthgraders, she could could still only perform at a fourth grade level. The kennedys, joe joe and rose did not inform most of the teachers that this was actually what was going on with rosemary. They had expectations, the teachers had expectations of rosemary, her parents did, and parents did, and rosemary cannot meet those expectations. So, i dont know how they thought these teachers were going to perform some miracle on rosemary particularly after they go through the two, three or more schools and things are not changing. It seemed like they just wanted rosemary sent away somewhere rather than really trying to find an appropriate educational setting. Was the progress, located two by the family, they are theyre not recognizing her not wanting to acknowledge that this is not simply a case of intellectual disability. You make wonderful use of the primary source here at the library, we quote teachers who talk about her belligerence, her acting out, it seems like there was Mental Illness combined with intellectual disabilities. As rosemary aged into her teen years and young adulthood, it became apparent that there is more going on than just simply a young person frustrations of having expectations they cannot meet. Many people have asked difficulties do lash out, but things going on with rosemary indicate that perhaps there is some Mental Health issues emerging when she was in her teen years. Certainly as a young adult woman, Mental Illness began to appear in rosemary and her parents clearly were not sure what they should do about that, other than quiet her. She never really receive Mental Health treatment. All of these efforts were designed to improve her academic performance, it doesnt sound like there was much of an effort made to deal with her emotional problems. Know, of course he brought up the issue of stigma. First of all there was a stigma attached to having a child with intellectual disabilities. There were horrific phrases that they used in the time. Like, more on an imbecile, and rose and joe, here they have a beautiful daughter and they certainly dont want those labels placed on their daughter. So, they thought they could ship her away and hide those disabilities. When it came to Mental Illness, they were not equipped to deal with it, and frankly neither was the medical establishment as well. People were warehoused in horrific institutions, people who had Mental Illness. For rosemary, there were not medications except maybe a barbiturate that would have put her to sleep or conjured down. So, there are very few resources rose and joe were smart enough to know that there might be Mental Health issues going on with rosemary because they did investigate placing her in a psychiatric institution, and the fall 1941. Those one. Those records are here in the library. They ended up not doing that, i am not clear why but they were aware that she had some Mental Health issues. It is interesting because they say the options were not many of the 40s. It was not until the late 50s when we start getting psychotropic drugs that can help people. So lobotomys perhaps in like a logical choice . Although it may sound horrific to us today. It is horrific. I feel pretty strongly that it did not necessarily look like the best option. At the time joe kennedy started investigated lobotomy they are being done by a pair of doctors in washington dc, Walter Freeman and james watt. Theyre basically experimenting. It was very. It was a very rarely done across the world. They had operated on fewer than 100 patients by the time they performed a lobotomy on rosemary. The American Medical Association was clear, that spring and summer they reported they felt it was too experimental, the side effects were too dramatic, and that lobotomies needed to be research more before they continued performing them on my patients. Joe was a really smart man. He would have known that. He would have had that resource. He wouldve known that the medical association was not recommending it. But he went ahead and had her lobotomized anyway. Why . I think he felt he needed to silence her in a way. To make her more as the doctors would have told him, more compliant, more pliable, less emotional. What were the consequences of that lobotomy for rosemary . So the best Case Scenario wouldve been that she wouldve been devoid of compliance. For rosemary she she began completely disabled, physically and intellectually disabled. She left that operation not being able to walk or talk. She had a permanent physical disability as a result of the lobotomy. She regained the ability to speak a few words, a few phrases, and she could never take care of herself again for the rest of her life. This leads to the question that has bothered everybody who has heard the story since they read a book in 1988, when rose told her that she did not see her daughter for 20 years. After this lobotomy. How could that be . And why . I wish i had an answer. As a mother i i cannot imagine not seeing my child for 20 years. I think perhaps rose always looked forward, her whole life she had many disappointments but she was committed to looking forward and she looked to her faith to guide her move forward. I think she did with this instance as well, rosemary was going to be institutionalized and so she did not need to see her daughter anymore and she will concentrate on concentrate on the rest of her children. However, it is all well and good to say but really how do you not see your child for 20 years . I cant get my head around that, i really cant. Joe of course, maybe saw her for a few years and then stopped visiting her as well. That is remarkable to me, because rosemary was still cognizant. She knew her family, she knew her family, she knew her parents, but she did not see them. She comes back into their lives in the early 70s. You start seeing people visiting her and bring her back. Joe was dead by then. So is the death of the ambassador a precipitating act that brought her back into the family question. I think that was part of it. I think eunice did a tremendous amount of work bringing out the story of rosemary who had intellectual disabilities after the president had been elected, her brother jack have been elected. During the 1960s the public was become used to having conversation about people with intellectual disabilities. They could talk about rosemary moore. Once the investor died in 1969, i think rose who is becoming quite elderly herself now had more time to reconnect with her daughter and to reintegrate rosemary into the family. I think the strivers have been spending time with rosemary during the late 60s anyway. During the. During the 1970s rosemary started making trips to palm beach and was spending more time with her siblings and her nieces and nephews who she was meeting for the first time. They were getting to know her. Certainly they became inspired by her. You tell appointments that story in the book about rosemarys First Encounter with her mother after those 20 years. Can you recount up for the audience. Sure, so this so this comes from one of the sisters in where in wisconsin where she spent the last years of her life. She recoiled recoiled when she saw her mother for the first time. She knew who her mother was, she she knew she had not seen her mother. Did she blame her mother for the lobotomy . I am not really sure. Did she blame her father . Im not really sure that has not been recorded. But certainly pain, anger, and anguish were part of her experience. That all came flooding back experience. That all came flooding back to her when she saw her mother. Well for the popular imagination when we think of rose kennedy, the narrative has always been of this doting mother who hovers above her children. Was that your experience in your Research Question mark. Will she hovered in a certain way, certainly she viewed herself as a very professional mother, she looked to the catholic faith to guide her in being a mother and she would be at home and she would train her children to be good citizens and good lakes, and good people. That was her mission. I her mission. I think she did do that. They were good people, good catholics. I did not see her as a terribly warm person. Joe, their father was definitely much more demonstrative emotionally with his children than rose was. So she was very cold and in some ways, she loved her children, certainly, but she had a way about her that was not very warm and cuddly. She was dedicated to rosemary, friends of theirs in testimony to other historians who have written about the family talked about the amount of time that rose spent with the rosemary when she was a child. Helping her with her schoolwork, working with her on the tennis court, and spending more time with her than she did with the other children. So there is that side of rose that she had a sort of job that she wanted to do and she wanted to provide the best for her children. So she did that in the best way she could. But she also wanted her own life, she would spend months at a time traveling around europe and leave children with governess and nurses. Just the letters that rosemary writes home, you can see them here in the library, theyre heartbreaking, she misses her mother. She misses her father and siblings, she is like, i am trying so hard, if, if i am good can i come home. This is actually one of the sad parts of the school she was sent to, particularly the one that was up for intellectually disabled, they used behavior and doing well in school as a ticket home. So if rosemary did well and if she behaved well that she could go home for thanksgiving. If she didnt, then she couldnt. Now, for an. Now, for an 11yearold girl i cannot imagine that kind of requirement. She wrote a series of letters home, i am trying to be good, i want to come home for thanksgiving, please will you tell mrs. Devereaux that i can come home for thanksgiving. It is just heartbreaking. Did you ever have a sense in those letters, she writes to her siblings as well, just a desperately lonely little girl who wanted nothing more than to be part of this big family. She may have been overwhelmed by them but clearly she missed them. She also had a sense that she was the older sister, so on the one hand she is immature and not quite as capable as her younger sister kathleen and eunice, so she sort of talks to them as a very childlike way. At the same time she is aware she is the older sister. She says to them now, i want you to write me a letter, you letter, you be a good girl and rights. So she has this conflicting thing going on, but it it is so adorable and so precious. After the surgery, tell us about the woman that emerges. The first ten years are obviously very difficult years. She doesnt have doesnt have the rehabilitation that she gets later on in her life. Overmedicating her probably from the craig house years, but it took the sisters at st. Colettas and some of the physicians they were working with to recognize that maybe rosemary didnt need these sedating medicines anymore or as much, and she kind of blossomed after that. And the kennedys built her her own Little Cottage on the grounds. Thats right. She had a dog. She had a dog and a bird, and so she had a full life. She loved to go shopping. The nuns would take her into town, and they would go shopping. Joe provided a car, and the nuns would drive rosemary in the car into town, and she had friends at st. Colettas. There were a couple of women that were there that she spent time with every single day. So she had friendships, and she had a routine that she was used to and happy with. And, in fact, i think she was so happy in that context that when she started making the visits to hyannis port and palm beach, they were very disruptive for her, and it was a very difficult time. Not only was she resentful towards her mother, but that transition to an unfamiliar place was very hard on her. So it probably wouldnt always the best rosemary who appeared in those instances. And those visits continued. Eunice continued to bring her out, right, until the end of her life. Yes, exactly. She would attend Special Olympics events, you know . There are pictures of her, you know, in hyannis and palm beach going to church, things like that. So part of this story resonates with you. Yeah, it does. You were attracted to her story because of some of your own personal experiences. Are you comfortable sharing those with us . Sure. When i started researching this in 2008, i was researching it because im a womens historian, and i was fascinated with the story. But a couple of years into the research, my son was diagnosed with schizophrenia, and all of a sudden my husband and i were thrown into this world of having to take care of a child with a very serious disability, a very serious Mental Illness. And what parents go through and what you need to do and what you want to do for your child. So i got a slightly different perspective on rose and joe. So im, i became a little bit more harsh in my opinion of them. On the other hand, i became also more sympathetic. Its a lot of hard work to have a child with disabilities. The kennedys had a tremendous amount of money. They could have used those resources even more so to take care of rosemary. And be even today and even today if this happened to a young woman with a family like that with those resources, there are ways to take care of someone with severe Mental Illness. For the average family who doesnt have the money, the resources are not there, and it is a weve done a lot more people with intellectual disabilities and physical disabilities. Our nation has not done enough for people with Mental Illness and the families that love them. And i think its true, isnt it, that that weve come so far in dealing with intellectual disabilities, but the stigma isnt as great as it once was. Thats right. And even when mrs. Shriver wrote the saturday evening post piece which basically revealed to the world that rosemary had intellectual disabilities, that piece does not talk about the Mental Illness piece. Yeah. Theres no mention of it. Right. And i dont think the family ever really looks at it that way, except Patrick Kennedy who recently came out with his own personal story and that of the family. And he does say in his book that, clearly, rosemary had Mental Illness. But the family would never talk about that, and he wants his family to talk about that. I want the whole country to Start Talking about it, because we need to have that conversation. We need to get rid of that stigma. And i think the Kennedy Family is still living with the fears of that stigma, but we should not. We should all be talking about this and find ways to provide more resources. So you began this journey as a professional historian. Right, right. One, to tell a womans story, and you wound up with a cause. Yeah, exactly. Thanks to rosemary. Who, obviously, has thats her legacy that she has given many of the kennedys today a cause, and for me shes giving me this platform as well. And i had an interview the other day on wbrn, and lisa mullens said rosemary was a muse. Well, what a beautiful way to describe rosemary. She was a muse for her family, her siblings who went on to really affect a tremendous amount of change for people with disabilities. And so, hopefully, shell continue to be a muse. Should we open it up to our audience . [applause] kate would be happy to take your questions if you have some, so dont be shy. Yes, sir. Hi, how are you . I was curious what happened to the two physicians. Did joe ever go after them, or did he just ignore the fact that they had butchered his daughter . We have no idea. The records are not available because theyre medical records, so those are closed. And even records that arent completely medical records are, have disappeared. Theyre, you know, George Washington university, theyre just not there, so we have no idea. I didnt find a lawsuit or anything like that, so he did not at least publicly or even through the courts, he didnt do anything. So they continued to do lobotomies . James watts and Walter Freeman continued working together for several more years, and then freeman went off, and he became the famous lobotomies. And he developed the ice pick lobotomy procedure. And he lobotomized thousands of people. Thousands of them. Thank you. And just give us some historical context. Lobotomies were performed routinely, right, through the 50s . And the man who originated the lobotomy won a nobel prize in 1949. Yeah. So we look back in horror at what happened to rosemary, but people thought it was going to be the miracle cure in the 40s. Right. When i did my research on lobotomies, there were a couple of interesting things about it. One is that there were some successes. But when i looked at the research of freeman and watts and they also had another doctor they worked with, dr. Hunt they were touting the success of this operation that the great majority of the patients were much better off. But, actually, when you looked at their research, the great majority were far worse off. Many had died or were completely crippled like rosemary. So they werent truthful in their work. They lied. And then as lobotomies became more popular, i discovered that between 60 and 80 of the patients were women when only when women were only 40 of psychiatric admissions. So more women were or subjected to this operation were subjected to this operation than men. And, of course, in those days there were no patient protections, and a father, brother, mother, could have a somebody wanting to silence women, i just cant imagine. [laughter] talking. Yes. My name is carolyn clark, im a docent here at the Kennedy Library. Patrick recently publicly said that his family was very disturbed about appearance of his book. I was wondering what the response was in the family to your book. I have heard nothing. Simple. Nothing. Nothing. Yes, sir. You speak to can you speak to the circumstances of rosemarys birth . Absolutely. I open the book with the circumstances of rosemarys birth. It was september of 1918, and the spanish influenza had already made a sweep around the globe and killed millions of people, and it was making a second path around the globe, and it was hitting boston in september of 1918, and thousands of people had died, and thousands more were in the hospitals. Roses obstetrician, or doctor at the time, was busy at a hospital when she went into labor. She had a nurse with her to help monitor and keep her calm and get her ready, but rose, roses labor became fast and furious, and she wanted to deliver that baby, but the obstetrician wasnt there. And the nurse, who had been trained how to deliver a baby, requested that rose hold that baby back, because the priority even though the nurse had been trained was to wait for the doctor to come and deliver that child. Well, of course, rose couldnt hold the baby back, you just cant do that. So the nurse held baby rosemary back in the birth canal. So, clearly and it was for, apparently, a couple of hours. So baby rosemary was deprived of oxygen. That certainly would have contributed to her intellectual disabilities. Women, more women. [laughter] yeah, i think youve left them breathless. That raises a question for me, is, you know, we as historians you can look back, and perhaps thats what happened. But how do we know . We dont know for sure, but we know that did happen. So and it, you know, right. The familys had no reaction that youre aware of to the book . Could you share any members of the family you may have spoke with, ambassador smith who may have lived alongside her sister and as the only surviving sibling or any other family members . I did speak to the shrivers. Timothy and anthony were very gracious and, actually, i had several conversations with Anthony Shriver who provided a couple of the photographs for the book of rosemary as a december abled adult. Disabled adult. He was incredibly gracious. I spoke to a couple of distant cousins, Charlie Burke on the cape, and i reached out to the ambassador but no response. From what i understand from the shrivers and others, the younger generations know nothing about what happened to rosemary, and, in fact, anthony had said to me that they didnt know what happened to rosemary, and perhaps i could find out and let them know. So i certainly was able to find out some things that happened to rosemary. Actually, its a rich story that i was able to uncover. And Patrick Kennedy recently came out and said his family never talked about any of these, quoteunquote, secrets. He grew up not knowing anything about not only rosemary, but his own father and other people. So its not surprising that the younger generations have no knowledge. And jean, of course, was she was a teenager, maybe 13, 14 years old when rosemary disappeared from the family. So, and [inaudible] oh, yes, absolutely. Rosemary [inaudible] absolutely. The whole family was transformed because of rosemary, theres no question about that. Jack and eunice and senator kennedy and bobby, all of them and their wives. Its very clear. So thats rosemarys legacy. If there is a tragedy, theres also this incredible outcome, the way that they were able to affect change for millions of people around this country. And around the world. Yes. Yes. Do they still perform that procedure, and have they replaced it with Something Else similar . Lobotomies are very, very rarely performed today. I think they use lasers, in fact, today. Dont quote me on that, but i think they do. And there are several states where its illegal. I think most across the country. So if there are certain cases where it is recommended, and according to laws and medical boards there has to be a specific patient board, and the medical board has to review the case. The hospital has to donate the time and the services, the equipment. The doctor has to donate his time. And no one gets paid for it. Its only used in extreme cases. And i spoke to a friend whos a neurosurgeon, and he has done it twice. I think he said twice in his career, and it was for people who had been institutionalized, basically in straitjackets for their whole lives in psychiatric hospitals. And this particular surgery is incredibly effective for a particular type of Mental Illness. And so the two patients he told me about were able to leave the psychiatric hospital, get a high school, college, masters degrees and live independent lives. So it does happen, but its with great, great care, and its not very often. [inaudible] special needs because of rosemary, because he knew that she and the family were, that was like presented when she became [inaudible] and eileen would probably know more about this than me, but i think eunice be got president kennedy to i think we got that a little backwards. I think eunice got the president to Pay Attention to this issue. [laughter] absolutely. Kate, id like to salute your beautiful, fantastic book. Thank you. And what decides the problem with rosemary, the awareness of this book to many other problems in the United States with disability. So i respect and thank you so much, kate. Thank you very much. [applause] well, if there isnt anything else, no other questions . Then we are thrilled that you came, delighted that you participated, and our author will be outside signing books for you. Thank you, eileen. [applause]