Transcripts For CSPAN2 Book Discussion On More Than A Score 20150208

Obviously it is a distract your question. Just eliminate that of the bad but the first two are plausible. Either make sense if you are confused just google them and they will make more sense charlie. In all seriousness everybody in this room has taken a standardized test at one point or another in your life. They have been around a long time but it seems were living in a moment where the stakes attached to them have never been higher. Not only the standardized tests determine a childs future but also the future of the teacher determine the future of principals and administrators and the guidance counselor the gym and music and art teacher. Though whole school could be bound up with the results of a test for a whole district. That trends to raising the stakes higher and higher, a kid you hear me . And has finally been confronted by a movement figure refers, 1964 College Students sat in us as a result of direct action to spark a whole new era of the Civilrights Movement of mass civil disobedience era that had not been up until that point. In here we talk about civil disobedience of people refusing to take that test. Id parents refusing for their child to take a test. And then risking jobs to refuse to and administer standardized test all of those risky behaviors to stop that standardized testing in this captures stories many stories the students and parents and teachers trying to figure out where to go from here. So we have a fantastic panel. First up we hear from a parent of an Elementary School child here in the innercity new york city. She is one of them and working on the World History teacher project right now and is on the pta. Then we have to a man who is a historian. I am still working. [laughter] scratch that a professor at New York University former assistant secretary of education in the danger to america and lastly we will hear from Jesse Hagopian a teacher of history at Garfield High School in the codirector or call adviser to the black students you did at that high school. In 2013 the winner of secondary teacher of the year by the Education Association of arts and sciences and was one of the leading figures in the 2013 boycott that made National News that your. [applause] we would be remiss if we did not acknowledge there are others in the audience said contributors to the book someone who just testified that the u. S. Senate is over in here. [applause] and indeed upper deck heavily and rosie are here who led the boycott last year. And racial asia and who else . And the other bulldogs . Tell us your story. My daughter if you want to send your child to a Public School you have to start thinking about us they are three. Is started to look for a school for her from the south bronx and was committed to a Public School and wanted to send to the Neighborhood School which is a beautiful idea right down the street but when i put her in the school i was to say the least super disappointed because surfer School Experience was of massive amounts of homework, is sitting at a desk listening to a teacher talk 58 minute blocks of time, and a recess, if they were good at the end of the day they could have a choice time which to be is what most of the school day should have been which is our young kids learn is through play. It was not a great experience for her she was super sad every morning to save her stomach hurts or she felt sick and there was something going on that i needed to redress. And what i came to understand it wasnt just her classroom or her teacher her teacher was super sweet but felt like she was doing what parents to prepare our children to take a standardized test. So therefore they structure the day in a way that was completely inappropriate for any type of joy or solid basis of wanting to go to school or learning anything. No handson learning instead of cutting it with buttons it is stars on the page which is a completely different experience and is ineffective because then you get frustrated that they are not smart or doing what they are expecting to do. And then to do try Something Different we can find an amazing a school that is not in our neighborhood located in washington heists of a dual Language School completely based on the idea of hands on hearts infused music based learning. It was her second year we were told she has to take a standardized test not to measure what they know but to score and drink and evaluate teachers. And we had never been told by the state School Administration that they would have to do the test. I tried to find out what was going on. There was no information. With an article from the New York Times that said they may be coming. I figured out it is complicated because the state had to figure out a way to use the scores of their young children. But the word got out there are 30 some schools in the city that theyre taking the state test they could not use those scores so they would test of the little ones some could not even hold a pencil so the idea they would take the test to bubble and something made no sense at all. I will read a little section from the of balked of the book. We play and learn how to take care of ourselves and our friends from one day the teachers its down to put a test booklet in front of us with the 27 multiple choice that he will read aloud to fill in the bubble for the right answer nevermind we have not had much experience holding a pencil or have not learned how to read or we may not recognize numbers to help us locate which ones we are to answer the teacher pro prompt us. This is something the test makers put on the test because they recognized the littlest ones can i read. Because we are encouraged to do. If we do understand english too bad. To get more time to sit in front of the test to know what we do with mass . No to make sure we have needed services . Support . No. If the purpose was to help children learn that i think most of us would be down with that. So to read and work with members the test were not about the childrens learning at all. So they helped to understand there is a good way to understand whos spent the majority of there days to observe and idle think again have much insight so a couple of their other parents decided not only is it important for us for children to take the test but the whole school and couldnt concerned about the other schools the best dance druggist is to organize together to take a public stand but in the end we could organize that they did not want the children to take the test. [applause] is a good lesson if you do something illegal to do with a lot of people. [laughter] because our principal said i could hardly give a test that would be statistically invalid. How could use gore on one or two kids test scores . And they dip they acknowledged it is not sensible to have kindergartners take tested they scrapped that idea. [applause] unfortunately not many schools know that. But many schools did it anyway. Parents have such as of caretakers of the childrens education and they cannot fire us. [laughter] [applause] i am thrilled to be here to celebrate the book that would be remiss if i did not a college i cannot help but say one year before the election started one of the newspapers said what you think the next mayor should do before education and i said a threeyear moratorium on standardized testing. [cheers and applause] it is important to a understand it is an unprecedented time with no child left behind to have it take control when and how they are tested then to punish the schools and what they thought was appropriate 100 percent would be proficient in reading and math it is 2015. We did not make it. But to say we dont have to be subject to that rule but it is from the test scores and opened more Charter Schools and adopt a common core a and this and that. And pay checks the way for a way from the state of washington because the legislature refused to go where it show refuse to go with that said every school is a Failing School so we live in the unprecedented time because we have of crazy law that should have been thrown away but instead field bob met administration added race to the top which is like no child left behind because it focused on punishing schools and raced to the top focuses on labeling and punishing teachers. And i just read the statistics and leos said 4,000 Public Schools have been closed since 2008. From emanuel close 50 in one day. That has never happened before. Were not talking continuity of the past but a radical break a and a direct attack on Public Education. Sith it is coordinated making test scores the most important thing that contributes as the narrative as Public Education is failing were falling behind all other nations in the world because all others have higher test scores. But japan who has had higher test scores has been in a deep recession four years. Coming with the narrative of the publicschool because the tests are even harder. So where we previously had a 80 now we have 70 percent. So 90 percent of children disabilities failing, children of color are failing. This is the board of regents making a decision in advance they wanted 70 percent of the kids to fail but it was a validation of their civil rights. Excuse me i dont understand the logic. But wait you look at what is happening in washington there is a Bipartisan Coalition that if kids are not able to jump over the bar at 4 feet we should raise it at 60 to watch more fail. And led is essential to the future survival is ridiculous. Aikido one with explanations but to think of itself to take risk and what were doing to children is it and 3k. I think about districts where kids in prek undertaking tests. They dont know how to keyboard at three years old and then in florida there was a child and hospice dying who was forced to take a test. What is this says overtaken society about standardized testing. I am possibly the oldest person in the room and there were no standardized test. The only one i ever took was the s. A. T. There was no prep that is just your score. Now it determines who pays the most the s. A. T. And act and every test is the measure of Family Income there is a new book called the tyranny of american bureaucracy that she makes is clearly that if youre looking at any of those scores you can correlate to family in, without fail the wealthiest are at the top supporters at the bottom so it redistributes privilege. So we are in a place where we have all the powers windup in favor of a terrible regime and those that are in trouble dont think much about it. As you listen to the senators you realize they dont know much about schools that havent been in school since they were students period they make these policies that strangle our children and a crop grandchildren. What can we do . Disobey. [cheers and applause] there is something much older they uncivil disobedience when the grownups are as creative as the young people said things will begin to change. We have an example of these teachers because their job is of the line but parents can opt out even when it is not legal because it is their children. If you were the only one that offers out to do something to threaded you or your child but they cant do anything. So what was needed today is the movement that jesses book reflects that the powers that be will not listen and things will change as people take action. Thank you. [applause] of politicians and the principal gave an amazing speech about what this new school that and Different School Board Members than the governors Education Aid came and here she is addressing my a kindergartner and the of their students in the school i want to congratulate you all to make the choice to come to this school because you are now getting ready to compete in the Global Economy. [laughter] cheers did not erupt. Yes. My son will be ready to be down that kid in mexico. Thank goodness. [laughter] with this is their version for the purpose of Public Education. Want to read for you in my research i came across this from the common cold or website dont take our word for it but the proponents to find out why they say this new standardized standards and assessments are so needed. This came up from the chairman and ceo of State Farm Insurance and says statebystate adoption of the standards is important to maintain our countrys Competitive Edge in the Business Community will be better prepared to face the challenges of the international marketplace. It is in about collaboration or critical thinking. It is about the International Global corporations to compete with one another. That is the fundamental problem that is happening with the standardization in movement and the struggle erupted when it did. The testing was so overbearing. My brave colleagues with reading and math and special education winning wage lerners voted unanimously to refuse to minister a deeply flawed example. I got a phone call from one of the teachers to said she wanted to meet with me about an issue. When she said she would refuse my eyes lit up. I have been organizing against the tests in here she was going to refuse to give it. We announced it with flowers coming in from across the country and chocolates being sent and every day of book from an author or a letter of support caveman from a different region of the country. When the teachers were threatened with a 10 day suspension without pay from the superintendent, the most beautiful thing i have ever seen have been but that only emboldened the faculty more to say you will end up on the wrong side of history and we have a bigger vision of the purpose of Public Education. [applause] i just want to share a couple of parts from the book because what erupted lead to a walkout just one week later students refuse to take the test in to that led to what commentators called until largest travolta gets high stakes testing with 60,000 parents opting out that it is the largest walkout did u. S. History it is an incredible struggle and i just want to share stories that came up in the collection of the book. This is from Providence Student Union passersby startled as they turned the corner to Kennedy Plaza the eyes stared with blood spattered clothes as they shuffled down the street these men and women gathered at the entrance of the department of education instead of battering down the doors they show they had plenty when demonstrators stepped forward we are here to protest the high stakes testing is having on the young people. [applause] theyre way onto organize in said this is to his career and college ready. Get the politicians to take the test then they held the press conference. 60 of these professionals failed the test. But this is the arbiter of who will be successful in society . It is asinine. [laughter] in chicago of parent in preschool teacher wrote this. Parents children enter the child educators arrived at the chicago Public School headquarters to enter the main lobby on the linoleum tile floor. I propped up a few of the handmade picket signs made by a preschool teacher. Who had to work and could not join as the ones the invoice to be heard we were approached by security personnel who inquired about what we were doing. We are playing is our reply. Who told you you could do that here . More and more began to trickle in in the Security Guard had questions and they had permission to play . The rest of us will come to the riding families as we began to stake out more space. [applause] there is so many more stories i wish i could share with you with creative forms of resistance to show what it could be about i had the honor to participate in one of the most important parts of testing people are applauding because the schools have a waiver and dont give test it instead they have a Performance Space to set this assessment that is the alternative for this movement. With your ph. D. At this level they want you to think. Instead of filling in bubbles coming you develop a dissertation you collect evidence the fed does not support your thesis you have to revise it and said you present your thesis and defend your dissertation and middle School Students to this through every subject to make it developmentally appropriate and find out when you put educators in charge, you can come up with incredible alternatives and did your consortiums goals have higher Graduation Rates Public Schools with more special beads but have higher Graduation Rates for students of color Better College attendance rate and this is the incredible vision they are building. We face incredible challenges it in our world today that education has to have something we have to be purpose and reclaim the purpose of education because right now there are more black men behind bars or is that were slaves one played plantations will have a rampant culture of rape where one of four women will report to face Sexual Assault at some time. , the worst economic inequality with 85 people who has much wealth as the bottom of 3. 5 billion people on the planet. We have social catastrophes perhaps none are as serious as this Climate Change because of the plan there rises 3 degrees it could be run away Climate Change we cannot reverse and human life will not be supported in and of those could be solved with a pc day thinking. We have to empower our students to develop courage to collaborate if we survive as human beings on this planet those are the real stakes we are up against and i am proud to be in this fight with you. Thank you. [applause] that was fantastic. We have time for discussion we will get your books kind and there is a sign of sheets and digest stick around after words to help build a the movement. But for now one of the big arguments in favor of standardized testing is it is the measure of transparency. How we counter that argument . The teachers are just trying to avoid a accountability. Beta one their feet held to the fire. What do you say to that . First, where is the accountability for the ceo who sabotages the Global Economy . We are for accountability but first it should be applied evenly throughout society. And receive a much better accountability system to have Better Outcomes for students of color and students in general. I think that is a smokescreen and the accountability argument is about to vilify teachers to hide the fact theyre systematically underfunding schools to deny those that needed the most resources. [applause] there is nothing less transparent than standardized testing. The accountability attached is usually wrong. Address standardized test teachers are not allowed to save the questions and after words this course come when a student is no longer in the same classroom and the new teacher doesnt know the children and they dont see the test either so they learn nothing. The purpose should be diagnostic. You want the doctor to tell you your temperature and not say i will let you know, six months from now. But i will just compare you to other people but not you in particular. But if they say if it is just a number there is no accountability or transparency because they dont want to release the questions because if they did people would pick them apart to say this is ridiculous. The question is misleading and recently weve read test makers said that the instructions say they will have answers that our possible but incorrect so the thoughtful child may ponder to choose a plausible answer that the test maker considers incorrect but to have a discussion much is the right to answer . There really is only one purpose right now. To say we dont trust teachers. That their judgment is not worth the. But the idea was you could trust teachers judgment. So the teacher knows if the child could read. Why would you expect the test to tell you more . We have lots of accountability actually that means punishment. To do the simple test for every state every other year if you want to compare it is there perpetuity to the individual testing. To go by race or gender or english language murders. We dont need these additional test to know what we already know and those who come from a Vantage Homes come from higher scores. This is nothing new. One of the things that people will say to disparage the movement against standardized testing is it is predominantly white middleclass parents not parents of color. The first thing i will say to remind our need dunkin those against common core testing is white suburban moms managing to disparage everybody in the movement will get the panel looked at who wrote for the book and write up here are three people of color better helping to lead to this movement. And there are many other leaders of color that we need to recognize like cheri lewis from chicago. [applause] so what that is helping to lead the movement and it is true for communities of color as well and it is important for the opt dash out movement to understand the of role to maintain those institutional grazes if you know, the history of standardized testing you know, these first enter the Public Schools open the proud white supremacist who wanted to show black people were beyond civilization so one of the most famous eugenicist given the nation there when you understand that what cess since does it make to achieve pradesh closed virginia chief medigap . Though a our movement these do take up expose alleviative racist struggle in that means joining the black lives matter movement. Not just to be shot down with impunity but we also want an education for our kids that are antiracist. [applause] is important to recognize speaking to parents of color , half of the school is half latino and africanamerican and if not more. A good number of those dont speak english. Is in some ways it is about breaking through the mythology that says here is your ticket to a fair playing field. That is how it is put out there but in fact, it is the complete opposite. Exposing that when they say here is a standard for your child but we will not support you or your teachers to help your child get there. Vacate your not speaking english, eight months later there expected to take a test reading in english with full paragraphs and comprehension that is not just unfair but abusive. What you saying to the kids you cannot comprehend . Imagine if you had to take a test in vietnamese . Except in the eye of sure we would all fail. [laughter] so how the test makers have been able to steal the language of our Civil Rights Movement to say that will help . No. It is the opposite that is why we have to take a sting and to expose it for what it is. [applause] one of the themes throughout the book that garfield or a castle bridge to know that they transformed. I know that you speak every rare and have a feel for the movement nationally. What about people who take the leap . This must be incredibly empowering and i am not the person into its ear because i never boycotted but i do encourage people to opt out. But in terms of the last discussion part of the challenge of this model with of the power is 19 civilrights groups signed a statement endorsing highstakes testing that it be retained in the new version of new child left behind triad and exchange with the Legal Defense fund people and i totally dont understand why they did this. I could make guesses but they are not informed. It just shows the importance to build the of movement from below because even those who run the organizations are so far removed that the power has to be in the hands of parents and teachers and students because that is rare the change comes from. One of the things we found out organizing with the parents when i started to ask what do you want for your child . Have you think theyll learn best . There was a little bit of debate because i think parents came from a fear of a traditional or industrial model themselves. So maybe we are not sure if freeform play is the best but we had discussions about it. One thing that became clear is looking at the models of the best education we have in this country that you have to pay for it and who since their kids and why . They dont take a test they dont worry about it. I get it and i did it to work i did speefifteen and they say we dont do the standardized test so if is good enough for arne duncan o or president obama and maybe it is good enough for our kids to it is what we deserved. [applause] i want to speak to the question of which is affirmative nature of the struggle because Garfield High School is an exciting place to teach because of the courage of the teachers there that transformed the culture to embolden entire staff. This year the superintendent announced we would lose a teacher that they would cut the head teacher nine weeks into this school year after they put all this work into a class leaving 150 students without a class and some needed that class to graduate. So that puts it in jeopardy so we held a staff meeting and i said we have to do something about this we should rally at the school board to tell them how we cannot lose this teacher and a teacher said that will not do anything lets just walk out. [laughter] okay. [laughter] that is a good idea. The entire building emptied of all students and teachers who said this is outrageous. Then they said just kidding. [laughter] we were not planning on doing that. [laughter] we saved the teacher and the black Student Union just one of the citys human rights award for beating a march to the precinct demanding that black lives matter then the being a walkout the day there was no indictment theyre becoming leaders for the entire city and i think it is all part of the growing struggle. In one last fling of the struggles i want to end by reading a quick passage. A chapter that you should not this is by a young woman who went to a school here in new york state and was the valedictorian and because she had the best grades she was told she had to give a graduation speech for the school and she said absolutely not i dont have anything to say i am not a public speaker and the principal said it is not that you dont have to but you were bringing shame to family and the whole school to break our tradition. He basically forces her to give a speech at graduation so i printed her speech in the of booking and she titled it, it is in the program that is handed out to everyone in the audience audience, the phone number of the representative pushing highstakes testing. [laughter] and then heres a quick excerpt. As for the argument that these assessments are challenging students that is true it is a challenge to fit this in another of material into one year with more exams it is a challenge to memorize loads of facts in time for the next test is also a challenge even teaspoons cinnamon in one bite without choking the water you accomplishing . [laughter] will i will throw a quotation to make my speech legitimate son Albert Einstein once said everyone is a genius but if you judge a fish by its ability how to climb a tree with its allies have believing it is stupid we cannot judge intelligence by how well he does in a small group of faisal the classs. Educationist on something that can be successfully standardize. This is why i tried so hard to get out of this speech not because they dont respect of the view of the valedictorian is a label and i dont respect what it stands for. I am not the smartest person in the class. I could learn something new from everyone the view i am good of rising but that is not useful outside of the standardized world of high school and i am pretty sure a lot of you have been more successful than iowas unless your standard is the scandal and sheet. [applause] so to be those words were meaningful after i was humiliated by these tests but i knew that i was not intelligent for most of my life to see someone who knew that this was a scam mental lot to me and you can see how they are transforming people all over the country and it is time to get on the right side of history to help build this movement. [applause] lets give one more round of applause. [applause] into all of our sponsors to night please pick up the copy on your way out. [inaudible conversations] barack obama is the first but not the last africanamerican but his grade in your book as bill clinton . Rabil beyonce in action but there are two different barack obama his first term in secondtier we see a more africanamerican president he is comfortable in his skin now. And he is not ashamed of it. He had to be very strategic there was a fight within the white house. He was the president after 80 years of waiting for that money. But it wasnt that i will do that spinnaker you surprised he didnt make a stronger case his first term . No. He had to be who he was. Thats not the same as military service, combat, infection, disease etc. Its ubiquitous so that question is really lies at the heart of the study. If americans do as i say embrace the automobile culturally how do they respond when by the 1920s and really it was not until the 1920s where there was a National Human cry over unavoidable Automobile Accidents that are killing individuals particularly pedestrians who have nothing to do with the freedoms of driving. Others were paying for the liberties of the stripers. When the car was first introduced the rules were very different and the reaction to those rules were very different. The study looks at 1900 to 1940 period of time when there werent uniform rules for training and for driving in universal signs for speed limits and train crossings and what have you. That created in a sense a National Dialogue over the difference between our love for imad bills and the social responsibility we have as drivers of automobiles. The first internal Combustion Engine automobile dates back to the 1870s in germany and as a result most of the import to the internal combustion automobile are luxury Items Available for only the richest of americans. What really defines american automobile is the rival of the Ford Motor Company and to be fair there were other cheaper automobiles available that henry fords model t and mass production through Ford Motor Company make around 1808, 1809 massproduced inexpensive automobiles for every man. One of the aspects of the model t which is really telling for the issue of safety is that vehicle was capable of driving on the worst roads in the worst conditions. It could be modified by most anyone who has basic mechanical skills which in the 19th was a lot of people and could be modified as well to do a lot of different tasks not simply driving but also as a threshing machine and a source of power in rural environment so his versatility was the calling card of these massproduced inexpensive automobiles. Reforms often try to limit the very function of what an automobile does and what i mean by that is its ability to access all parts of ones life, its ability to be driven in urban locations so they were all kinds of restrictions and terms of driving within the city limits. Those efforts really were once geared initially at the way in which americans drove and who have the right to drive. But it wasnt an easy question. Again one of the elements i tried to pick up on in the study is theres an indeterminate. Theres an unanswered question between the freedom and the safety that is exposed by massachusetts auto mobility. I begin the book with an epigraph from Sinclair Lewis who is the First American to win the nobel prize for literature. Most americans if they know lewis will know him from babbitt. Who is babbitt . He sort of the middle class of pompous individual who sees the car is a privilege, who sees the car is something that is due him and mechanics or individuals that are serving him and pedestrians are in the way of this champion driving throughout the city. Ironically enough three years before he writes babbitt Sinclair Lewis goes on automatic automatic automotive trip across the country. He writes three long essays. He adores the card. He adores the freedom. He is ironically enough standing in for babbitt and making an argument that heres a device that is going to fulfill all of the modern expectations for personal freedom. His wife loves it. Women are quick adapters to these automobiles. You can go out into the countryside and see a country that is yet to be developed for the first time. Certainly the railroads would allow that freedom within the structure of a fixed rail system system. But the alamo bill did was to allow people like Sinclair Lewis and others to take that device take that tool. In the 1920s as the Automobile Accident crisis appears and again it has existed for some time and becomes a National Issue the states become active. Here in texas they are quite active in finding ways in which to respond to the motor menace. In the 1920s during the administration of president coolidge Herbert Hoover the secretary of interior tried to pull together the state initiatives and mandates. In the mid1920s the Hoover Commission does a remarkable job of standardizing and really thats the key component with automobile safety, standardizing expectations for manufacturing standardizing expectations for road design standardizing expectations for the grade crossings where row roads and roads intersected in how those transitions were going to be governed. The government plays an Important Role at the federal state and local level began in the 1920s. Before that the federal government is going to be much more important for funding the development and road improvement and what you see is not a growth in the mileage of roads but improvement of the miles that existed. What they do is quite honestly borrow from industry and industry has been concerned with safety for 20 years by the 1920s if not longer. Industrial Safety Experts are going to focus on the three e. s of reform, education engineering and enforcement. Education is preparing drivers for the complexities of the roadway. Not only weather conditions but also rules of the road, the ability to drive the much more complex piece of equipment than what we consider today in an automobile. In an automobile today we turn on the key and drive put some gas in it and drive. So much more complex device so education was seen as a way in which to limit particularly young people who desire to drive limit their access to the road into an essence essence force those who are habitual violators or who have repeat accidents for drunk driving and whatnot to be held accountable through state apparatus through Education Programs etc. Engineering by contrast focuses on affecting the device itself safety components. There was an intense debate about seatbelts. A debate in terms of how fast the car should be allowed to go. Even today you get into the passenger automobile and this pedometer exceeds any posted speed limits, that focuses going to really standardize the automobile. By all accounts in both instances although one could quibble about education they are successful. The challenge became enforcement. Going back to this pedometer why is it that a personal piece of property is built to break the law . Why is it possible to buy legally radar detectors . Back when i started driving in the 70s it was possible to engage the seatbelt monitors and to take it even further why today do we have mandatory seatbelt laws, zero tolerance for drug and alcohol use . The answer to that is the enforcement question has not been effectively brought into american culture. It really does play against the idea of the automobile as a symbol of freedom so they struggled with that. Trying to get people to recognize that speeding and drunk driving are not a right or privilege but rather an eminent menace. In the 20s and 30s you see an effort on the part of states to beef up their motorized traffic reports. In texas the department of safety is founded. Theres interesting dynamic in place because the state to that point had generally been the Texas Rangers. The Texas Rangers to a very different thing other than traffic stops and speed violations so there is an internal tension in terms of how to enforce it. What you generally seen the cities is a Police Department that is tasked with a herculean job because you have more and more drivers in a denser environment. There are numerous campaigns where you see these images of Police Officers going car to car and literally inspecting the automobiles, talking to drivers, gathering information about what kind of menace they are dealing with. So i think the original question typically was and how did they respond to this . They saw the problem and reacted. The irony was the Sticking Point was enforcement. Generally the automobile response was positive. They did want to kill their customers may certainly did want to see themselves as feeding an addiction to speed or recklessness. Having said that what sold cars . What sold cars were the businesses. What sold cars was a promise of freedom, i promise of speed, a notion of excitement. You still see it in the automobile advertisements today. Sitting there watching these commercials with my family i always have to point out notice how all the streets are empty. When we see these cars driving bear driving and having a wonderful time whereas the reality today is much more complex. We dont usually have wideopen wide open roads when we are driving in a commute time but manufacturers to their credit saw this as particular in the 1920s and 30s as a major impediment to expanding their marketplace. They were concerned about government regulation. It was possible for a state or municipality to demand steve to create enough speed from an automobile and to keep the wealth of 440 miles an hour. There were devices. They were curious devices that like lightbulbs when an automobile surpassed 30 miles an hour the speed limits and fastforward to today the technology of our automobiles is smart enough that it can measure like the black box in an aircraft how fast we are going when they are driving and it opens up similar but different questions about our own willingness to give away personal freedom at the expense of social safety. Really that is at the heart of this book, this question between independence and individualism versus the social responsibility that comes with that. Once you are talking about commuting and the density of automobiles on our roadways the idea and the nature of the car itself. Although the support structures and what i define as this progressive pride have no pride in my ability to turn the start key of my automobile. It just takes me from point a 2. B. By the 1950s if not sooner and certainly by the 1950s and 60s that postmodern reality started to seep in. A lot of study and work has gone into what does that mean culturally for instances of Technology Like the automobile which is so it carries risk it with it. Anthony giddens and beck have written on the risks and to boil it down throughout most of history most human beings were concerned with food clothing and shelter. For the most part most in western societies dont have those needs anymore. We have an ability to take care of those material needs. As a result more esoteric concerns factor in including passive secondhand cigarette smoke, including post9 11 terrorist attacks, including automobiles and drunk drivers. Back to automobiles is no consequence or no coincidence that beginning in the 1970s and 1980s you see american starting to focus on not those material needs but saying we are going to have zero tolerance for those who are drinking and driving. Mothers against drunk driving passive restraints. Theres increasingly a lot of technology in the automobile. Its not there by accident. Its there to provide some evidence and arguably the ability to predict and to prevent Automobile Accidents in the future. The premise of the book is based on this question of choice and consumer choice. What role what influence or what power do consumers have in a Consumer Society . What choice do we have and how is that choice manifest in American Society and culture . Dave and i at least we begin on to further polar opposites in terms of that. As a cultural historian at the piers agency. I think there are ways in which consumers influence the market influence products, change the way in which products are interpreted and the meaning that is described in American Society. Day by contrast is a little bit more of a materialist and a little bit more of the argument being that capitalism consumerism is driven by what sells and that paradigm, that distinction between agency and the one hand, Consumer Agency and on the one hand and control in the other is as old as the study of American Consumer history. I always think of John Wannemacher was a philadelphia retailer in the 19 century and he spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on advertising. He once famously said i waste half of my advertising dollars in the problem is i dont know which half. It cuts to the heart of this relationship of how and where Consumer Agency is expressed. Advertising and early 20th century was traditionally the primary source that scholars would look at in trying to assess consumerism. Before i answer the question i would like to point out therein lies part of the problem. Who is creating layouts . As historians we have access to records. Most of the records we have our marketers capitalists who are trying to sell something. Theyre trying to guess at what are the desires of the consuming population . They are not the consuming population so what we get from advertisers is a very rich source of primary source material but its only one perspective and it goes back to the wannemacher quote i mentioned earlier. They are guessing at what works. Early in the 20th century what you see is the formation of reason why advertising and previous to this most advertising was announcements, broadcasting here is my right i can hear is the price and heres its availability. Beginning in the 1920s and most famously with listerine and antiseptic that turned into a mouthwash in the Advertising Campaign put the user within the context of a social setting and said whats going to happen to you if you havent taken care of your breath and all of these now humorous settings. These are readily available images. One is a young girl sitting on her bed dreaming what has happened to her boyfriend and why her boyfriend hasnt called and its an advertisement for listerine. A clear answer as well a little mouthwash and you will be out on saturday night. Otherwise youll be sitting at home. Advertising became much more sophisticated ones mass consumer culture pervaded the United States around midcentury and its at that point in time and thats the area that dave spends most of his scholarship at least this anthology on. Are we being manipulated . Who is in charge here . Who is calling the shots and we play with that was the title of the anthology. The destiny of choice. Destiny is preordained. Choice is not. Choice is a variable. When you get to film one of the areas i study this film. The term that is used most often is a term that is morphed into a different meeting but perversity is the unexpected unforeseen. When you talk about this question there a number of examples that come to mind. Most famously in 1905 the Cocacola Company summary announced that they had done taste tests and they were losing the cola wars to pepsi. They summarily announced they were ending the production of what we now know as classic coke and rereleasing cocacola as a knock off on pepsi. The taste was the same period of response by the public was overwhelming. This was at the dawn of cnn and so they were covering these mass runs on Department Stores to get the old classic coke. Within three months cocacola had said we have made a mistake. We are going to go back to the original formula. Now the value of that is an example of real Consumer Agency. Is that a brilliant Marketing Campaign on behalf of cocacola to choose their consumers to say no we really want this. To this day cocacola officials maintain that it was just a mistake and i take them at their word. Contemporary society were running the film the interview. The sony hacking in the interview. Most people intuitively knew the minute that took place in the minute sunny with you that from general withdrawal was going to happen. There would be a sensation. My kids watch it the first night it was available on the internet. We are left with this paradox between who is calling the shots and its the culture of historians because we are comfortable with that indeterminate answer. But its the genesis of the book and it drives the contributions that we have included their throughout the text. I would like to think most people are there is a reason that its in latin. Probably the most infamous hucksters of the early 19th century was pt barnum so the presence and the influence of some unlike barnum was widely understood by the public. The first book that i did was on the consuming behaviors of Rural Farmers in organizing cooperative purchasing and effectively creating little walmarts to get access to urban supplies and using mail or catalogs and whatnot. They were clearly aware that the middleman, the term that was the most pervasive the middleman were taking a chunk. They were taking a part of either their consumer dollar or the profits from and manufactured. That was unacceptable. That was the cost savings available so sam walton is credited with walmart bet that sensibility goes back to the dawn of modern mass consumerism. It ebbs and flows in terms of americas relationship with that and it reaches a peak following the Second World War for a lot of very complex reasons. The United States was notorious in that war. They were proud of the culture and the american lifestyle. Not necessarily the American Dream which is a work dream but the american lifestyle, the consumer lifestyle. Nixon famously has his kitchen debates with Nikita Khrushchev in moscow and almost at the same time with the counterculture you begin to see what are we actually buying here . Again the literature of this period of time is diverse but its also very clearly focused on most types of questions. When you look at the kinds of questions is how much and how often do consumers realize this . Some advertisers are